[Ammi]

..ok, obviously inspired by the controvery in BB...



..if you believed a friend to be racist..could you still be friends with them because there are obviously other qualities about them you like..?...let's just say that you've tried to 'educate' them but they're very fixed in their views..could you overlook that..?...

[thesheriff443]

I think you can but it depends on the extent of there racism.

[lostalex]

I had some skinhead friends when i was in high school. Most of the time they never talked about their racist views so it wasn't a problem. When they did say something racist i'd just explain why i disagreed with them, and we had some decent discussions about it. It wasn't a really big deal.

They were never violent towards black people or anything. If they were like attacking black people physically or harassing black people then i wouldn't be friends with them, but they were never like that. they were always respectful to black people from what i saw.

My best friend is black, and she would hang out with them too, they were never rude to her or anything. If they treated her badly then we wouldn't hang out with them any more obviously, but they were always cool with her.

I also hung with people who made homophobic comments and homophobic jokes sometimes, but i never felt like i was being harassed or discriminated against, so i dunno.

Aslong as people are being cool and not hurting other people i'm pretty tolerant. I'll still make my views known, and we can have debates or discussions. I'll hang out with anyone as long as they aren't hurting anyone or being cruel.

[thesheriff443]

Originally Posted by lostalex

I had some skinhead friends when i was in high school. Most of the time they never talked about their racist views so it wasn't a problem. When they did say something racist i'd just explain why i disagreed with them, and we had some decent discussions about it. It wasn't a really big deal.

They were never violent towards black people or anything. If they were like attacking black people physically or harassing black people then i wouldn't be friends with them, but they were never like that. they were always respectful to black people from what i saw.

My best friend is black, and she would hang out with them too, they were never rude to her or anything. If they treated her badly then we wouldn't hang out with them any more obviously, but they were always cool with her.

I also hung with people who made homophobic comments and homophobic jokes sometimes, but i never felt like i was being harassed or discriminated against, so i dunno.

Aslong as people are being cool and not hurting other people i'm pretty tolerant. I'll still make my views known, and we can have debates or discussions. I'll hang out with anyone as long as they aren't hurting anyone or being cruel.

your post sums up the way I feel on this subject

[Ammi]

Originally Posted by lostalex

I had some skinhead friends when i was in high school. Most of the time they never talked about their racist views so it wasn't a problem. When they did say something racist i'd just explain why i disagreed with them, and we had some decent discussions about it. It wasn't a really big deal.

They were never violent towards black people or anything. If they were like attacking black people physically or harassing black people then i wouldn't be friends with them, but they were never like that. they were always respectful to black people from what i saw.

My best friend is black, and she would hang out with them too, they were never rude to her or anything. If they treated her badly then we wouldn't hang out with them any more obviously, but they were always cool with her.

I also hung with people who made homophobic comments and homophobic jokes sometimes, but i never felt like i was being harassed or discriminated against, so i dunno.

Aslong as people are being cool and not hurting other people i'm pretty tolerant. I'll still make my views known, and we can have debates or discussions. I'll hang out with anyone as long as they aren't hurting anyone or being cruel.

..just out of interest and off topic Alex..(and I'll read your reply later because I have to go to work now..)....with the friends that made the homophobic comments..?...did you feel as though knowing you made them rethink what they said/thought at all...just that I think that's a good thing to kind of re-educate people with extreme views rather than attack them etc..I don't mean physically attack lol..you know what I mean....

[Cherie]

My ex neighbour is quite racist, but then she grew up in the East End of London and has seen it change beyond recognition over the years. The thing is when she is in the company of someone black or Asian and she clicks with them on a personal level she is fine, she still holds racist views of ****'s (her words) as a race, and coloureds (her words also). I couldn't not be friends with her though as she has a heart of gold, I just find her views extremely uncomfortable on occasion. Oh and she has no problem at all with people's sexuality that doesn't bother her at all.

[lostalex]

Originally Posted by Ammi

..just out of interest and off topic Alex..(and I'll read your reply later because I have to go to work now..)....with the friends that made the homophobic comments..?...did you feel as though knowing you made them rethink what they said/thought at all...just that I think that's a good thing to kind of re-educate people with extreme views rather than attack them etc..I don't mean physically attack lol..you know what I mean....

Most of the homophobic comments would be things like saying "that's so gay" about something they didn't like, or just telling generic gay jokes. It was never anything directed at me. If i ever felt like someone was disrespecting me personally or being homophobic towards me, obviously i'd never tolerate that.

As far as knowing me and being friends with me, absolutely i think having exposure to gay people is a good thing and reduces homophobia. the same friends that would make homophobic comments or jokes, would also defend me to other people that were making much more homophobic statements, and would also talk about supporting gay marriage and stuff. and they'd try to set me up with other gay guys.

It was really the casual homophobia i was talking about, nothing really malicious.

I think there is a difference between casual homophobia and racism and real HATRED. It's hard to explain it exactly, and the line between them can be very blurry sometimes. But there is a difference between people who really are cruel and hateful, and people who are just a bit ignorant.

[joeysteele]

Originally Posted by lostalex

I had some skinhead friends when i was in high school. Most of the time they never talked about their racist views so it wasn't a problem. When they did say something racist i'd just explain why i disagreed with them, and we had some decent discussions about it. It wasn't a really big deal.

They were never violent towards black people or anything. If they were like attacking black people physically or harassing black people then i wouldn't be friends with them, but they were never like that. they were always respectful to black people from what i saw.

My best friend is black, and she would hang out with them too, they were never rude to her or anything. If they treated her badly then we wouldn't hang out with them any more obviously, but they were always cool with her.

I also hung with people who made homophobic comments and homophobic jokes sometimes, but i never felt like i was being harassed or discriminated against, so i dunno.

Aslong as people are being cool and not hurting other people i'm pretty tolerant. I'll still make my views known, and we can have debates or discussions. I'll hang out with anyone as long as they aren't hurting anyone or being cruel.

Really excellent post Lostalex and one I would agree with the content of in full.

Personally,I don't think I do have any racist friends myself that I know of anyway.
The last paragraph is also the stance I would take on the issue anyway.

Really well said though, it made me think.

[Ammi]

Originally Posted by lostalex

Most of the homophobic comments would be things like saying "that's so gay" about something they didn't like, or just telling generic gay jokes. It was never anything directed at me. If i ever felt like someone was disrespecting me personally or being homophobic towards me, obviously i'd never tolerate that.

As far as knowing me and being friends with me, absolutely i think having exposure to gay people is a good thing and reduces homophobia. the same friends that would make homophobic comments or jokes, would also defend me to other people that were making much more homophobic statements, and would also talk about supporting gay marriage and stuff. and they'd try to set me up with other gay guys.

It was really the casual homophobia i was talking about, nothing really malicious.

I think there is a difference between casual homophobia and racism and real HATRED. It's hard to explain it exactly, and the line between them can be very blurry sometimes. But there is a difference between people who really are cruel and hateful, and people who are just a bit ignorant.

..yeah, I do agree with that, Alex..there is a difference, and you can't 'educate' extremes really...or anyone who refuses anything other than what they consider to be the 'norm'...and religious views come into it quite a bit with some people as well....

[Z]

I agree with you Alex... I think people sometimes use the terms 'racism' or 'homophobia' incorrectly sometimes, they're both defined by a level of hatred... being ignorant about your word choice and actually hating a group of people are in totally different ball parks and a lot of stuff gets blown out of proportion.

I wouldn't be friends with a racist or a homophobe or an anti-Semite or whatever the case may be though. I think it's very backwards and I wouldn't want to put up with that friend ranting about whichever section of society they irrationally hate.

[Vicky.]

Yes I could still be friends with them. However we would have some massive arguments if they started their ****

My mums a bit racist, and my dad is quite homophobic. I just kinda make a joke of the more stupid things they say, or ignore it..as do my sister and brother. I know thats probably the wrong way to go about it, but its worked for us so far. They dont go out of their way to be intolerant though, its just silly little comments every now and again. I have never yet heard them say anything dodgy in pubic though, its always behind closed doors..and nothing totally hate filled either. Just, for example, my dad moaning on about tv being 'full of queers'.

[Nedusa]

I would try and educate them and try to understand why they thought they could discriminate against somebody because they had slightly darker skin or larger nose smaller eyes etc....

If it became obvious the person was beyond help then I would not want to be associated with them in any way and would make my excuses and leave.........!!!!

[Livia]

No, probably not. I've grown up in a multi-cultural part of London, people from other races aren't strange to me. Neither of my parents are at all racist... it's only when I moved to the countryside that I encountered true, blatant racism and racist language used quite openly that I never encountered in east London. If someone was racist I couldn't see how we would be friends at all.

[Brother Leon]

Not a chance.

[GiRTh]

I'd have to end that friendship. A girl I went to school with came out on a night out with her idiot boyfriend who half way thru the night decided to start talking about immigrants - I'm the son of an immigrant BTW. His ignorance was easy to highlight after just a few minutes of conversation. He never bought the subject up again. So as far as I'm concerned he can discuss his bullsh*t with his like minded friends but don't talk your sh*t when others are around. A bit like whats going on in that 'Is it racist to not find blacks attractive' thread.

[Withano]

The human brain is only capable of keeping 150 friends, you'd be a fool if you used one up on a racist

[Redway]

I live in Liverpool, where the majority of people have absolutely no issue with racial diversity and are generally decent people but there's certainly quite an issue with ignorant idiots around here ... so I've come in contact with quite a few racists and they generally tend to be uneducated, ignorant chavs in general, which in itself is enough to put you off someone. Holding irrational views just adds to that. I've obviously never experienced any what with being white and all but I'd hate to associate with those kind of people.

So no...

[Livia]

Of course, you get racists of all colours. For instance, when I left uni I worked briefly with a girl from Antigua who couldn't stand African people, which was awkward as we were in a College admissions office and regularly interviewed African people. We had to complain about her because her attitude really sucked and her contract wasn't renewed.

[Roy Mars III]

Originally Posted by Redway

I live in Liverpool, where the majority of people have absolutely no issue with racial diversity and are generally decent people but there's certainly quite an issue with ignorant idiots around here ... so I've come in contact with quite a few racists and they generally tend to be uneducated, ignorant chavs in general, which in itself is enough to put you off someone. Holding irrational views just adds to that. I've obviously never experienced any what with being white and all but I'd hate to associate with those kind of people.

So no...

white people can experience racism.

[Redway]

That's very true but if you're non-white then you're much more likely to experience it...where I live anyway.

[Ramsay]

i have two friends that say they ''hate *****'' ( since the swear filter is wack, i mean a pakistani or south asian desent)
it's a bit annoying but ah well

[Tom4784]

I'd have few friends if I refused to socialise with anyone that has racist views. The area I live in is very old fashioned although that's beginning to change, I always get the impression with a lot of people I know that they act racist to fit in rather then because they believe in what they are saying. It's more like those views are passed down from generation to generation but fewer people are believing it each time.

I think as long as your prejudices don't define you and you aren't radical about them then yeah, I can be friendly with you.

[GiRTh]

Originally Posted by Dezzy

I'd have few friends if I refused to socialise with anyone that has racist views. The area I live in is very old fashioned although that's beginning to change, I always get the impression with a lot of people I know that they act racist to fit in rather then because they believe in what they are saying. It's more like those views are passed down from generation to generation but fewer people are believing it each time.

I think as long as your prejudices don't define you and you aren't radical about them then yeah, I can be friendly with you.

That is so sad but true.

[Z]

Originally Posted by Dezzy

I'd have few friends if I refused to socialise with anyone that has racist views. The area I live in is very old fashioned although that's beginning to change, I always get the impression with a lot of people I know that they act racist to fit in rather then because they believe in what they are saying. It's more like those views are passed down from generation to generation but fewer people are believing it each time.

I think as long as your prejudices don't define you and you aren't radical about them then yeah, I can be friendly with you.

I think the same thing is happening in the UK with Christianity - younger generations don't care about it as much as previous generations did; where I'm from 43% of people are atheists according to the census and lots of churches have been converted into clubs, pubs, bars and casinos... And it is those same younger generations who are fighting for equality and succeeding where their predecessors did not. I think it's a positive thing and things will only get better as time goes by, I really do believe that. Bad attitudes die with the generations who held them.

[Apple202]

One of my best friends is completely racist and homophobic, I just ignore it though it's by far his worst quality