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Livia · 04-11-2014, 03:54 PM

I believe your spirit goes on after death, I don't know how, I can't explain it... if I could there would be a church of Livia. But I don't think that anyone can contact people "on the other side". Mediums, as far as I am concerned, are charlatans preying on the vulnerable. I can't imagine how anyone who's seen Derren Brown perform, and hear that he says he has no psychic powers at all, can still think mediums are for real.

kirklancaster · 04-11-2014, 04:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Livia

I believe your spirit goes on after death, I don't know how, I can't explain it... if I could there would be a church of Livia. .

Ah.... Then I would start attending church to worship

Ammi · 04-11-2014, 05:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Livia

I believe your spirit goes on after death, I don't know how, I can't explain it... if I could there would be a church of Livia. But I don't think that anyone can contact people "on the other side". Mediums, as far as I am concerned, are charlatans preying on the vulnerable. I can't imagine how anyone who's seen Derren Brown perform, and hear that he says he has no psychic powers at all, can still think mediums are for real.

..I believe this as well..when someone dies it's just an 'empty body' but where does the 'essence' of that person go..what made them laugh/cry/feel emotion...that thing that made them unique and what they were..I don't think that just disappears, it's too strong and I do believe it can be felt as well...

Creggle · 04-11-2014, 05:42 PM

Ghosts etc is a murky topic for me, there could be some truth to some of the bollox you hear/see out there, but it's not related to religion, religion is a complete farce. Hopefully one day it's stamped out, imagine if all that time/effort spent on religion over the past 1-200 years had been devoted to science instead... We'd of colonized the entire solar system by now, ****ing religion... What has religion actually done for the human race? The crusades, the gulf war, Hitlers tyranny, extremists, the inquisition, human sacrifice... It's nothing more than an excuse to control people and commit atrocities.

kirklancaster · 04-11-2014, 06:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Creggle

Ghosts etc is a murky topic for me, there could be some truth to some of the bollox you hear/see out there, but it's not related to religion, religion is a complete farce. Hopefully one day it's stamped out, imagine if all that time/effort spent on religion over the past 1-200 years had been devoted to science instead... We'd of colonized the entire solar system by now, ****ing religion... What has religion actually done for the human race? The crusades, the gulf war, Hitlers tyranny, extremists, the inquisition, human sacrifice... It's nothing more than an excuse to control people and commit atrocities.

And who first brought 'religion' into this topic?

I think that if man had lived by the 10 commandments over the past few thousands of years then we would have maybe conquered the universe at least, but would definitely have conquered disease, famine, drought, and even the ageing process, because - had man abided by the commandments - then there would have been no murders, thefts etc, and therefore, the zillion, sqillion, trillion billions which have been wasted,and are still being wasted, on fighting crime and wars, would have been instead invested in all types of research.

Anyway, all of the things you point out are man's doing and man's alone. Religion is man's invention.

Christmas Dynasnow · 04-11-2014, 07:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kirklancaster

And who first brought 'religion' into this topic?

I think that if man had lived by the 10 commandments over the past few thousands of years then we would have maybe conquered the universe at least, but would definitely have conquered disease, famine, drought, and even the ageing process, because - had man abided by the commandments - then there would have been no murders, thefts etc, and therefore, the zillion, sqillion, trillion billions which have been wasted,and are still being wasted, on fighting crime and wars, would have been instead invested in all types of research.

Anyway, all of the things you point out are man's doing and man's alone. Religion is man's invention.

If man had lived by the 10 commandments we would conquered the universe?

Livia · 04-11-2014, 07:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet

If man had lived by the 10 commandments we would conquered the universe?

Maybe if we'd have put all the energy, money, time and knowhow that we've put into hating and killing each other and used those resources for something more constructive and beautiful the world would have been a very different place now. I'm not saying if everyone was religious that would have happened - we all know that religion doesn't have the monopoly on good, moral people - just that if we'd been the kind of species who didn't steal, murder, lie and covet our neighbour's ox, mankind might have been a greater species than we've turned out to be. Also, maybe science and technology might not have been as destructive as it's been because people could have been more ethical. We've gobbled up resources in our pursuit of technological advancement, almost exclusively driven by war and/or money, and in some cases that's resulted in devastation as great as war itself.

Marsh. · 04-11-2014, 07:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Livia

Maybe if we'd have put all the energy, money, time and knowhow that we've put into hating and killing each other and used those resources for something more constructive and beautiful the world would have been a very different place now. I'm not saying if everyone was religious that would have happened - we all know that religion doesn't have the monopoly on good, moral people - just that if we'd been the kind of species who didn't steal, murder, lie and covet our neighbour's ox, mankind might have been a greater species than we've turned out to be. Also, maybe science and technology might not have been as destructive as it's been because people could have been more ethical. We've gobbled up resources in our pursuit of technological advancement, almost exclusively driven by war and/or money, and in some cases that's resulted in devastation as great as war itself.

Great post.

Dollface · 04-11-2014, 08:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Livia

Maybe if we'd have put all the energy, money, time and knowhow that we've put into hating and killing each other and used those resources for something more constructive and beautiful the world would have been a very different place now. I'm not saying if everyone was religious that would have happened - we all know that religion doesn't have the monopoly on good, moral people - just that if we'd been the kind of species who didn't steal, murder, lie and covet our neighbour's ox, mankind might have been a greater species than we've turned out to be. Also, maybe science and technology might not have been as destructive as it's been because people could have been more ethical. We've gobbled up resources in our pursuit of technological advancement, almost exclusively driven by war and/or money, and in some cases that's resulted in devastation as great as war itself.

Like Marsh said, brilliant post Livia

Christmas Dynasnow · 04-11-2014, 08:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Livia

Maybe if we'd have put all the energy, money, time and knowhow that we've put into hating and killing each other and used those resources for something more constructive and beautiful the world would have been a very different place now. I'm not saying if everyone was religious that would have happened - we all know that religion doesn't have the monopoly on good, moral people - just that if we'd been the kind of species who didn't steal, murder, lie and covet our neighbour's ox, mankind might have been a greater species than we've turned out to be. Also, maybe science and technology might not have been as destructive as it's been because people could have been more ethical. We've gobbled up resources in our pursuit of technological advancement, almost exclusively driven by war and/or money, and in some cases that's resulted in devastation as great as war itself.

Yes but life is not like that and never will be. One of the great problems of religion is this quest for nirvana rather than reality.

Its easy to see the problems but the solutions are hard to find. Education and population control is one of the answers.

Creggle · 04-11-2014, 08:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kirklancaster

And who first brought 'religion' into this topic?

I think that if man had lived by the 10 commandments over the past few thousands of years then we would have maybe conquered the universe at least, but would definitely have conquered disease, famine, drought, and even the ageing process, because - had man abided by the commandments - then there would have been no murders, thefts etc, and therefore, the zillion, sqillion, trillion billions which have been wasted,and are still being wasted, on fighting crime and wars, would have been instead invested in all types of research.

Anyway, all of the things you point out are man's doing and man's alone. Religion is man's invention.

Yeah but people as a whole, are corrupt. Something like Religion would perhaps work if chimps figured out what it was

but people cannot have something like religion without all of the sh!t that's happened over the years due to religious zealotry. If something is corruptable, we will corrupt it. Religion is the most vulnerable thing to corruption going and really shouldn't be allowed.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Livia

Maybe if we'd have put all the energy, money, time and knowhow that we've put into hating and killing each other and used those resources for something more constructive and beautiful the world would have been a very different place now. I'm not saying if everyone was religious that would have happened - we all know that religion doesn't have the monopoly on good, moral people - just that if we'd been the kind of species who didn't steal, murder, lie and covet our neighbour's ox, mankind might have been a greater species than we've turned out to be. Also, maybe science and technology might not have been as destructive as it's been because people could have been more ethical. We've gobbled up resources in our pursuit of technological advancement, almost exclusively driven by war and/or money, and in some cases that's resulted in devastation as great as war itself.

Isn't it strange though that the majority of killing and hating has been because of religion? Don't get me wrong we as a whole will use any excuse to commit atrocities but if it wasn't for religion they'd of been much harder to cover up.

Livia · 04-11-2014, 08:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Creggle

Isn't it strange though that the majority of killing and hating has been because of religion? Don't get me wrong we as a whole will use any excuse to commit atrocities but if it wasn't for religion they'd of been much harder to cover up.

WW1 & 2 didn't have anything to do with religion. Japan massacring its way through south east Asia didn't have anything to do with religion. Vietnam didn't have anything to do with religion. Stalin slaughtered millions, but not in the name of religion. Although a lot of killing has been done in the name of religion, if we didn't have religion we'd still have spend a good part of history killing each other for power and/or money.

kirklancaster · 04-11-2014, 09:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Livia

WW1 & 2 didn't have anything to do with religion. Japan massacring its way through south east Asia didn't have anything to do with religion. Vietnam didn't have anything to do with religion. Stalin slaughtered millions, but not in the name of religion. Although a lot of killing has been done in the name of religion, if we didn't have religion we'd still have spend a good part of history killing each other for power and/or money.

So perfectly put.

Creggle · 05-11-2014, 12:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Livia

WW1 & 2 didn't have anything to do with religion. Japan massacring its way through south east Asia didn't have anything to do with religion. Vietnam didn't have anything to do with religion. Stalin slaughtered millions, but not in the name of religion. Although a lot of killing has been done in the name of religion, if we didn't have religion we'd still have spend a good part of history killing each other for power and/or money.

Are you sure? I'm pretty sure Christianity was Hitler's main motivation for the majority of the things in his regime, he is what happens when a religious extremist so happens to wear a suit and lead a country.

Christmas Dynasnow · 04-11-2014, 09:07 PM

Northern Monkey · 05-11-2014, 12:47 AM

I'm not religious.However i don't blame religion for all the wrongs in the world.It's all down to mankind.However intelligent we are,We are still just animals,Quite highly evolved animals but still animals and we behave as such,It's instinct.We are territorial just like many species and we fight each other mainly for territory.Chimps are'nt saints either btw,They can be incredibly nasty and that has'nt left us.I saw a doc on a group of chimps that went around in a pack and they encountered a lone chimp in the jungle and they set about it and literally ripped it apart,They ripped its genitals off and stamped all over it.I believe that mankind will wipe itself out before we ever get the chance to evolve into a higher species.

Nedusa · 05-11-2014, 11:02 AM

What about the Ghosts...??? What happened to the Ghosts

This thread was about the existance of Ghosts now it's degenerated into the usual for or against Religion.

.

Christmas Dynasnow · 05-11-2014, 11:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nedusa

What about the Ghosts...??? What happened to the Ghosts

This thread was about the existance of Ghosts now it's degenerated into the usual for or against Religion.

.

Dont forget the holy ghost!

kirklancaster · 05-11-2014, 11:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nedusa

What about the Ghosts...??? What happened to the Ghosts

This thread was about the existance of Ghosts now it's degenerated into the usual for or against Religion.

.

Yes Nedusa - and look back through the posts and see just who brought religion into this.

Christmas Dynasnow · 05-11-2014, 11:37 AM

The thread is about the supernatural and so religion will be an integral part

The holy ghost being the original ghost and probably where all fictional ghosts come from