[Liam-]

Originally Posted by kirklancaster

Oh well - Angry is as angry does. Momma always said TIBB is like working on the bin rounds - ya never know what rubbish ya gonna get.

Bye for ever LT.

ps. I already know the (rather confusing) answer to the physics question, I thought you being so fond of quoting physics could perhaps enlighten me.

Oh, and as this is a Forum where intelligent ideas and valid viewpoints are meant to be exchanged, I'd much prefer a diet of 'word salads' which are relevant to the topic under discussion, than 'morsels' of irrational, unnecessary, uncalled for anger which are not.

Well said.

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet

If you watch the documentary Randi did a lot more than that he exposed a wide variety of psychic scams, some government funded and offered 1 million dollars for anyone to provide proof, which of course no one ever did. He was also the first to expose the very lucrative Christian faith healer scams runnng in the USA where, like mediums, the healer worse an earpiece and used prayer requests to pretend to speak the "spirits. And thankfully he exposed Uri Gellar as a total fraud.

I don't doubt that he did... good for him, that doesn't change my view as stated in my post that I still believe in the possibility of a life force that exists after death .

[Liam-]

I'm not a very spiritual person in general, but when it comes to the after life, I'm a very firm believe in it.. If something has enough a mass of energy like the soul is said to have, I can't see how it would just evaporate into nothingness and just stop existing as soon as it's outer body dies.

I love all things paranormal, so stuff like this greatly intrigues me, of course some things have been faked pretty badly and some have been fake exceedingly well, but there is so much out there and so much evidence that i find it hard not to believe.

[kirklancaster]

Originally Posted by LiamPRW

I'm not a very spiritual person in general, but when it comes to the after life, I'm a very firm believe in it.. If something has enough a mass of energy like the soul is said to have, I can't see how it would just evaporate into nothingness and just stop existing as soon as it's outer body dies.

I love all things paranormal, so stuff like this greatly intrigues me, of course some things have been faked pretty badly and some have been fake exceedingly well, but there is so much out there and so much evidence that i find it hard not to believe.

Good for you Liam. This attitude that because the inevitable charlatans and rogues exist then therefore, there is nothing paranormal, is banal.

Imagine if any kind of scientific research had the same narrow attitude?

Imagine any type of Gold mining operation, digging up nothing but thousands of tons of non gold bearing ore then saying; "FK it Gold doesn't exist here lets pack it in".

Imagine the pursuit of anything guided by such ludicrous views? Oil drilling. Coal mining. Cancer research? Anything.

Keep believing and questioning and looking - that's really how science works.

And sincere thanks for the earlier support.

[Crimson Dynamo]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

I don't doubt that he did... good for him, that doesn't change my view as stated in my post that I still believe in the possibility of a life force that exists after death .

Wishful thinking is a very human and evolutionary aspect of our personality

[Crimson Dynamo]

Originally Posted by LiamPRW

I'm not a very spiritual person in general, but when it comes to the after life, I'm a very firm believe in it.. If something has enough a mass of energy like the soul is said to have, I can't see how it would just evaporate into nothingness and just stop existing as soon as it's outer body dies.

I love all things paranormal, so stuff like this greatly intrigues me, of course some things have been faked pretty badly and some have been fake exceedingly well, but there is so much out there and so much evidence that i find it hard not to believe.

Perhaps you could share one example where "there and so much evidence that i find it hard not to believe."

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet

Wishful thinking is a very human and evolutionary aspect of our personality

That it may, thank jesus you're such an expert on every aspect of the human psyche to know these things.

[Josy]

Originally Posted by kirklancaster

Once again LT, you are riding your two favourite high horses: 'Pedantics' and 'Terminology'.

Light is an electromagnetic wave. Starlight, Infra Red light, Light in the visible spectrum, Ultra Violet light, X-Rays, Gamma Rays etc - it's all radiant energy. So, the Starlight which we see in the night sky which has radiated from a 'long-dead star' is technically a 'ghost', and all I am saying; is that, why isn't it possible that some - as yet undiscovered - form of 'radiant energy leaves the human body upon 'death' -- a form of radiant energy which certain people in certain circumstances are able to perceive?

Just as radio and television waves are still there when our radios and TV's are switched 'off', then perhaps these radiant energy waves which have left a deceased person could be still there - silent and invisible, just like radio, TV and other energy waves.

And just as all radios and TV's have the 'potential' to 'receive' these waves but need to be 'switched on' and precisely 'tuned' in order to do so, then perhaps all human brains have the potential to receive 'dead human radiant energy waves' but similarly need the brain to be in a state of precise 'tuning', and the environmental conditions outside of the brain to be in 'harmonious synch' in order to enable such reception. Perhaps when such conditions are 'perfect' then the subject can and will perceive that 'dead human radiant energy' which we have come to term; 'ghosts'.

Just to spoil your day LT and have you scurrying to research 'May–September 1988 Radio Carbon Dating Test' I wholeheartedly believe that this 'emission' of 'dead human radiant energy' - only a trillion times stronger in magnitude - was what occurred when the Christ 'rose from the dead' and caused the image on the burial cloth which we call 'The Shroud of Turin'.

But that's a whole other complex, and long and lengthy thread. (which will no doubt elicit purely intelligent, civil, discussion and relevant responses with no irrational overly-aggressive responses, no inane mocking comments which do not stick to topic and have no purpose other than to ridicule, and no irrelevant remarking. Well? I can dream can't I?)

Anyway, back to the subject matter - though digressing slightly;

Physics - your favourite subject:

If the universe is expanding (Big Bang et al) and as light 'diffracts' - spreads out as it travels - independently of this expansion, and if some of these 'dead stars' which are the source of this light are trillions of light years from our vantage point on Earth, then why do we still see the travelling light from these distant dead stars as starlight? Why hasn't it acted in accordance with the 'Laws of Physics' and spread out and dimmed as a massively wide glow of light? Why hasn't it changed colour even as it has 'cooled'?

I ask from a position of ignorance.

Amazing post Kirk

I have posted a few times on here that I don't believe in 'ghosts' as such but I do definitely believe in residual energies that have been created by both humans, animals and so on and that will eventually fade out over time, I just can't imagine for example someone living until they were 90 years old, carrying out the same routine each and every day for a long time then when they pass on that energy just dies instantly?.

I truly think residual energy from people of the past is what most people are seeing/sensing when they feel as if a building is haunted, I also find it kinda sad in a way.

[Crimson Dynamo]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

That it may, thank jesus you're such an expert on every aspect of the human psyche to know these things.

I am sorry that life is not as mysterious as you think

[Crimson Dynamo]

Originally Posted by Josy

Amazing post Kirk

I have posted a few times on here that I don't believe in 'ghosts' as such but I do definitely believe in residual energies that have been created by both humans, animals and so on and that will eventually fade out over time, I just can't imagine for example someone living until they were 90 years old, carrying out the same routine each and every day for a long time then when they pass on that energy just dies instantly?.

I truly think residual energy from people of the past is what most people are seeing/sensing when they feel as if a building is haunted, I also find it kinda sad in a way.

Are you saying that these "energies" conform to the laws of physics and if so what are they made of?

[Crimson Dynamo]

http://van.physics.illinois.edu/qa/listing.php?id=5597

is an interesting scientific discourse about where does the energy of the body go after death

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet

I am sorry that life is not as mysterious as you think

I'm sorry your life is not as mysterious as it could be...

[Josy]

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet

Are you saying that these "energies" conform to the laws of physics and if so what are they made of?

I was posting my opinion in reply to Kirk, if you are interested you could go read up on the subject with an open mind.

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by Josy

Amazing post Kirk

I have posted a few times on here that I don't believe in 'ghosts' as such but I do definitely believe in residual energies that have been created by both humans, animals and so on and that will eventually fade out over time, I just can't imagine for example someone living until they were 90 years old, carrying out the same routine each and every day for a long time then when they pass on that energy just dies instantly?.

I truly think residual energy from people of the past is what most people are seeing/sensing when they feel as if a building is haunted, I also find it kinda sad in a way.

I agree with this too, we have a conscience self and a subconscience self.. at what point does our subconcience/spirt/essence/energy realise our heart has stopped beating?
It's something to ponder if you can open your mind wide enough isn't it?

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet

Are you saying that these "energies" conform to the laws of physics and if so what are they made of?

Go explain to people who practice a religion that their beliefs have no basis in science, and good luck with that.

[kirklancaster]

Originally Posted by Josy

Amazing post Kirk

I have posted a few times on here that I don't believe in 'ghosts' as such but I do definitely believe in residual energies that have been created by both humans, animals and so on and that will eventually fade out over time, I just can't imagine for example someone living until they were 90 years old, carrying out the same routine each and every day for a long time then when they pass on that energy just dies instantly?.

I truly think residual energy from people of the past is what most people are seeing/sensing when they feel as if a building is haunted, I also find it kinda sad in a way.

Thanks Josy. Residual energy is a brilliant term for what I was trying to say.

[Crimson Dynamo]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

Go explain to people who practice a religion that their beliefs have no basis in science, and good luck with that.

They dont and that is why in every developing and educated country religion eventually dies out

[kirklancaster]

Originally Posted by Kizzy;73http://cdn.thisisbigbrother.com/editor/separator.gif58192

I agree with this too, we have a conscience self and a subconscience self.. at what point does our subconcience/spirt/essence/energy realise our heart has stopped beating?
It's something to ponder if you can open your mind wide enough isn't it?

Well said Kizzy.

[Crimson Dynamo]

open your mind too much and your brain will fall out...

[AnnieK]

Given what's going on in my life at the moment I hope that there is something in a person that carries on

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by AnnieK

Given what's going on in my life at the moment I hope that there is something in a person that carries on

That doesn't sound too good annie hope you're ok.

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet

They dont and that is why in every developing and educated country religion eventually dies out

In what country has that happened in on which to base your hypothesis?

[Kazanne]

Originally Posted by Marsh.

Looks like the ghost is shafting someone over the sofa.

Marsh,lol trust you

[Crimson Dynamo]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

In what country has that happened in on which to base your hypothesis?

Trends

Church attendance in advanced industrial societies is in gradual general decline with people shifting from weekly to monthly or holiday attendance. Sociologists have attributed this trend to a number of reasons, starting from a simple boredom during services and lack of motivation, to generational incompatibility of belief systems and social changes attributed to modernity.Research across 65 different nations showed that out of 20 advanced industrial countries - 16 demonstrated a declining rate of monthly church attendance.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Church_attendance

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet

Trends

Church attendance in advanced industrial societies is in gradual general decline with people shifting from weekly to monthly or holiday attendance. Sociologists have attributed this trend to a number of reasons, starting from a simple boredom during services and lack of motivation, to generational incompatibility of belief systems and social changes attributed to modernity.Research across 65 different nations showed that out of 20 advanced industrial countries - 16 demonstrated a declining rate of monthly church attendance.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Church_attendance

1st world problems, people are becoming less spiritual according to the gospel of St wiki?

There is and always has been a flux in religious observance.