[ttw]

I think religion and god come hand in hand too.

Without Harry Potter and the Philosopher's Stone we would not know of Harry Potter.

Without the bible/qu'ran, whichever you believe we would not know of god.

And if we did it would not be as we know it today.

[bananarama]

Heres perhaps an arrogant thought. Suppose us mankind is god split across the planet into billions of pieces in the form of people and possibly animals too.......After all manking is always trying to creat something........Even if its only chaos.......

[PleasurePrinciple]

Yes, God, Jesus, Spirits, Afterlife. ITS REAL.
EMBRACE IT.
I bet thefinal second of your life you will have some kind of faith "just incase"

[bonnie43uk]

Na, .. download some Richard Dawkins stuff on youtube "The god delusion".. it's all a load of rubbish, but if you want to believe in it, and it enriches your life, I'm very happy for you. .. but dont tell me i'm going to hell if i dont believe in god, thats just wrong.

[Dr43%er]

To all those who say I am a non believer, I say no. I believe there is no god and people who do not agree with this are the non believers.

Just a thought.

[001steven]

i dunno maybe

[Psylocke]

everyone is there own god.

[Dr43%er]

In that case I smite me down with something or other.

[Psylocke]

Originally posted by Dr43%er
In that case I smite me down with something or other.

Smiting yourself with a 13 inch penis might be fun.

[Dr43%er]

Why would I want to go smaller?

[Psylocke]

Originally posted by Dr43%er
Why would I want to go smaller?

[m.r.davies]

Originally posted by bananarama

@ m.r.davies

No I am not looking for an argument. My reference to self delusion being dangerous was general (I would have thought you understood that). Killings/wars are justifiesd by those that think God has spoken to them.

I am in no way suggesting you are dangerous or want to kill. It was not a personal attack in that sense at all. If my message was ambiguous and upset you then I am sorry for that.

Back to the bit that worried me. When someone says they have communicated with god I have to be frank i see that as delusional. It's your right to believe that I know but I find it wishful thinking or delusional. Plus you made the claim without any explanation of how that communication worked.

To say to someone you would not understand is patronising. You can at least try an explanation.......I see your "would not understand" comment as an excuse not to explain because perhaps you can't.......I challenge you to try........Maybe I wont understand but is it not worth a try. How about it.......

Whatever belief gives you comfort in life that's fine. But I have opinions too and as this is a debate forum holding back what I truthfully believe about another persons belief would stifle debate.........

By the way I agree 100% with your last comments about religion and relics etc......You have found Your God and may Your God bless you...

thanks for a kind reply!
no offence taken.

To be honest i used to think people were crazy and a bunch of panseys when they went on about GOD, it was all so cheesey and used to get on my nerves (some cheese miesters still do)
I suppose i'm a rough around the edges christian, haven't been a christian all my life and got quite a shadey past.

when i said you wouldn't understand, i didn't intend to be patronising, i just thought of my old self and thought that i wouldn't believe any of it, thats all.
As i said in a previous post, when i pray, then stuff happens, and when i dont pray, stuff doesn't happen.

One time that sticks in my head was when i did the alpha course, the 12 week course had actually finished, and i was attending a follow up thing.
It was basically a group of people who went around someones house for coffee and tea, and then we would disscuss stuff.
there was a mix of people, some christians and some people like me who had just done the alpha course.

On this particular occasion I was around one of the guys house from church.
I remember REALLY not wanting to be there,
I was having loads of problems with my girlfriend i was living with, she didn't like all this church stuff, and stuff was real bad, it was getting me down and i started drinking quite a heavily after work and on weekends.

Whilst over this guys house, all i could think about was going to the pub and necking a few pints before last orders,

At this meeting, i had convinced myself that this church stuff wasn't for me and it was a load of bull that i didn't want to waste any more of my time with,
This was the last time i was going to see any of these freaks (bit harsh but you do get some odd christians)

Anyway, i nearly got up and left, but felt a bit rude.
Time went on and over schedule, i think it finshed about 10:30pm, i was tamping and was going to explode as all i could think about was my nice cold beer!
I remember thinking i was close to missing last orders by the time i got to the local.

as soon as it finished i was out the door like a shot,
I didn't even look back to say goodbye to the people i was convinced i wouldn't see again.

It was raining outside, so i ran, when i got close to the car, i put my hands in my pockets to get my keys out readyto jump in, but all i felt was a wallet and empty pockets, as i stood in front of the drivers door a sudden realisation dawned on me as i saw a glimpse of silver reflecting off the street light, my keys were peacefully dangling out of the ignition. Somehow (no idea HOW) i'd left them there, and locked the door behind me.

This annoyed me a bit, but due to my shadey past, i knew i could get that door open within 30 seconds,
it was an old car with old worn locks, and had opened it on numerous occasions with other peoples keys.

I ran back to the guys house, quickly explained the situation, and seconds later we were back at my car which a huge bunch of his work keys,
I instantly identified the suitable keys that would do the job,

after 1 min i was a bit puzzled, the black pin on the inside of the door wasn't even slightly moving,
15 mins and 30 keys later I was still locked out but now i was wet and really angry as last orders was fast approaching. (seems trivial now, but at the time it wasn't)

Andy, the guy from church whos house we were at said, Mark, i think its about time we prayed about this .... my instant reaction was to smack him in the face, but i didn't, and let him get on with it, he closed his eyes and said, Lord, please help us open this door, he opened his eyes, glanced at me and slid a key into the lock.
with an effortless turn i saw the black pin rise and stop in the open position

I felt a cold shiver across the back of my neck as i slowly turned to look at andy, who casually said,
Cool, ok Mark i'll see you next week.

You will now think to yourself, thats a coincidence, but as i said previously, coincidences happen when i pray!

I believe this was GOD saying, NO your not walking away that easily, and was using stuff that would get my attention (getting into cars)


If i had left that day the way i intended to, i dont think i would have gone back and would probably not be a christian.

This is just one of LOADS of ways i believe GOD has communicated with me. i used this one as it was the first one and kinda blew me away!


...oh and i still managed to get in 1 beer before the bar closed

[Psylocke]

do you not think the fact you worry about somthing enough that you have to pray for it,then when it happens you over-react because you made such a big deal in the first place.

I mean,the church themselves say when you pray God listens,but dosent act,as he gave humans the gift of free will and whatever happens we have to deal with it ourselves.

No offence of course,its nice to have faith.

[on_mercury]

I disagree with religion. Its amazing how a myth or story book such as the bible can actually delude people into thinking there is a "god" and its sad how many people think there going to go to heaven - a better place when they die! honestly what more do people want other then life itself. Characters like jesus and moses are likely to be fictional i guess i just dont beleive in fairytales...

[m.r.davies]

Originally posted by Psylocke
do you not think the fact you worry about somthing enough that you have to pray for it,then when it happens you over-react because you made such a big deal in the first place.

valid point,
from my experience stuff usually happens that defies all the odds

Originally posted by Psylocke
I mean,the church themselves say when you pray God listens,but dosent act,as he gave humans the gift of free will and whatever happens we have to deal with it ourselves.

Where did you get that information from?
Never heard of that before, what churches say that God doesn't act?
would kinda be pointless praying then

[m.r.davies]

Originally posted by on_mercury
I disagree with religion. Its amazing how a myth or story book such as the bible can actually delude people into thinking there is a "god" and its sad how many people think there going to go to heaven - a better place when they die! honestly what more do people want other then life itself. Characters like jesus and moses are likely to be fictional i guess i just dont beleive in fairytales...

Hi On Mercury, thanks for your comments
sorry to disappoint you, but there is plenty of non church historical evidence around that supports a man called Jesus was real, who appeared to do miraculous things and was cruicified on a cross

I'm sure Sticks will comment on Moses

whether you believe the GOD part or not, this stuff happened!

If you looked into it properly you would be very suprised at the evidence.

[Sticks]

Originally posted by m.r.davies

Hi On Mercury, thanks for your comments
sorry to disappoint you, but there is plenty of non church historical evidence around that supports a man called Jesus was real, who appeared to do miraculous things and was cruicified on a cross

I'm sure Sticks will comment on Moses

whether you believe the GOD part or not, this stuff happened!

If you looked into it properly you would be very suprised at the evidence.

Further material on Jesus

Some article about Moses

[Dr43%er]

I firmly believe there was a chap called jesus who was a great orator and stood up for the downtrodden masses, who in the end was crucified for causing **** for the ruling class. This is no proof off god though.

Arthur Scargill, great orator, stood up for the downtrodden masses (miners) and crucified (politicly) for his stance. = God?

Matin luther King. Great orator, stood up for the downtrodden masses (black people) and crucified (shot) for his stance. = God?

Adolf Hitler. You see where i am going with this.

[Vicky.]

Some really good, thought provoking stuff in here...sorry for bumping old threads but I'm really bored and looking through very old posts...

And god may well exist, but I dont personaly believe he/she/it does.

I believe in evolution. And, crazy as it sounds, the big bang.

[Sticks]

Sometimes though it takes more faith to be an athiest.

[arista]

Originally Posted by Sticks

Further material on Jesus

Some article about Moses

There is No Jesus
There is No God


The bible is a old fable book.

[Crimson Dynamo]

Originally Posted by arista

There is No Jesus
There is No God


The bible is a old fable book.

You could be thinking of the Next Directory?

[arista]

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet

You could be thinking of the Next Directory?

No.

[bananarama]

Originally Posted by Emilee

Well...........
I cannot answer that question, I beleive God wasn;t created by reproduction, be somehow created himself.... I knowthat sounds stupid to most of you, but that is what i think.

God was not created by anyone, he created himself.

Sounds pretty stupid to me. No offence just the conclusion sounds stupid...Heres why........In order to creat you first have to exist.....Therfore no need to creat oneself unless you have a desire to be twins

The idea thet everything comes as a result of one entity to me is far too simplistic and does not do justice to the intelligence of man kind....

What ever the answer is I am sure it is far more complicated than having one majical entity doing the impossible a bit like father xmas clambering through all those chimney pots........

[Stacey.]

No,i dont believe in god,
however i do believe in certian religious things ...