[kirklancaster]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

I'll just copy and paste most of this from the other thread ;

----------------------------

You can love this country and believe it shouldn't have a monarchy. No, more than that, you can believe that the monarchy should be dismantled BECAUSE you love this country. He's not refusing to sing the song because it's the national anthem, he's refusing to sing it for the same reason that I wouldn't sing it: because he doesn't want to sing a song of worship for a bunch of elitist, murderous villains.

It's a political catch 22... A monarchy monopoly. Essentially it's saying that you can't be properly engaged in UK politics if you refuse to acknowledge the monarchy as a valid political system. And so if you believe there shouldn't be one? Tough. Because then you're not a proper politician and so will never be in a position to try to change it. No. It's 2015 and major political factions should be able to (and just SHOULD, in my opinion) openly reject the monarchy.

I mean just look at the national anthem if you want to know why I will never sing it. It's about precisely three things. Elitism, War-mongering, and a fictional man in the sky. Not for me, thanks, not any of it. I get that some people love the cuddly old Queen, are "proud" of our country's history as bloodthirsty conquerors, and believe in said men in the sky... And that's fine... But kindly don't force your prayers upon others with the caveat that they're "treasonous" or "anti-patriotic" if they won't comply.

If all statesmen must fall in line with protocol - legitimising the monarchy - then how does one make a (meaningful) political stand against that monarchy?

I for one have had enough of cardboard cut-out politicians playing along with these outdated charades.

----------------------------

Tadaaaa

And I will copy and paste my response:

By lawfully CHANGING the constitution - in Corbyn's case ONCE he has attained the office of PRIME MINISTER.

Wait: I hear music.... Someone singing. I can see two figures on horseback approaching....

"To dream, the impossible dream..."

[Nedusa]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

I'll just copy and paste most of this from the other thread ;

----------------------------

You can love this country and believe it shouldn't have a monarchy. No, more than that, you can believe that the monarchy should be dismantled BECAUSE you love this country. He's not refusing to sing the song because it's the national anthem, he's refusing to sing it for the same reason that I wouldn't sing it: because he doesn't want to sing a song of worship for a bunch of elitist, murderous villains.

It's a political catch 22... A monarchy monopoly. Essentially it's saying that you can't be properly engaged in UK politics if you refuse to acknowledge the monarchy as a valid political system. And so if you believe there shouldn't be one? Tough. Because then you're not a proper politician and so will never be in a position to try to change it. No. It's 2015 and major political factions should be able to (and just SHOULD, in my opinion) openly reject the monarchy.

I mean just look at the national anthem if you want to know why I will never sing it. It's about precisely three things. Elitism, War-mongering, and a fictional man in the sky. Not for me, thanks, not any of it. I get that some people love the cuddly old Queen, are "proud" of our country's history as bloodthirsty conquerors, and believe in said men in the sky... And that's fine... But kindly don't force your prayers upon others with the caveat that they're "treasonous" or "anti-patriotic" if they won't comply.

If all statesmen must fall in line with protocol - legitimising the monarchy - then how does one make a (meaningful) political stand against that monarchy?

I for one have had enough of cardboard cut-out politicians playing along with these outdated charades.

----------------------------

Tadaaaa

If I'm being honest I cannot disagree with a single word of your post.

[arista]

I am sure he can correct it
next time.

He will be picked on - whatever he does

[Samuel.]

The reaction this has gotten is ridiculous. Why the **** does it matter. Plenty of people don't sing it, I wouldn't myself, and it's full in their right not too. It's infuriated me seeing people supposedly stunned and appalled by this. Get a grip.

[user104658]

Originally Posted by Samuel.

The reaction this has gotten is ridiculous. Why the **** does it matter. Plenty of people don't sing it, I wouldn't myself, and it's full in their right not too. It's infuriated me seeing people supposedly stunned and appalled by this. Get a grip.

Exactly the same people would be sniggering "Oh ho hee hee what a hypocrite!!!" if he HAD sung it

[kirklancaster]

Originally Posted by Samuel.

The reaction this has gotten is ridiculous. Why the **** does it matter. Plenty of people don't sing it, I wouldn't myself, and it's full in their right not too. It's infuriated me seeing people supposedly stunned and appalled by this. Get a grip.

No - It is NOT 'in his rights' not to. As Leader of The Labour Party attending THE memorial honouring our fallen war dead in his OFFICIAL capacity he has no personal rights when such rights are counter to the costitution of this country.

All those with a brain marginally larger than a peanut KNOW that Corbyn was ill-at-ease even HAVING to attend the ceremony, let alone comply with his duties, because it is in his facial expressions and body language.

He'd have been much happier sitting in tent somewhere in the Middle East with his pal Ismail Haniyeh or one of the other terrorist bastards whose cause he so openly embraces.

Personally, I wish he'd hurry up and **** off over there - before his fifth column plans have any chance of accelerating the end of our country.

[user104658]

Originally Posted by kirklancaster

No - It is NOT 'in his rights' not to. As Leader of The Labour Party attending THE memorial honouring our fallen war dead in his OFFICIAL capacity he has no personal rights when such rights are counter to the costitution of this country.

I will wait, with great anticipation, your quote from the UK constitution that states that political officials "have no right" to refuse to sing the national anthem. Well, I'll wait for a little while. I highly doubt it's in there. Therefore, yes, it is his right.

He'd have been much happier sitting in tent somewhere in the Middle East with his pal Ismail Haniyeh or one of the other terrorist bastards whose cause he so openly embraces.

Personally, I wish he'd hurry up and **** off over there - before his fifth column plans have any chance of accelerating the end of our country.

You're starting to become a parody of yourself, Kirk . Seriously - when you pepper your posts with extremist nonsense like this, you completely undermine any half-decent comments you might have made elsewhere .

[kirklancaster]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

I will wait, with great anticipation, your quote from the UK constitution that states that political officials "have no right" to refuse to sing the national anthem. Well, I'll wait for a little while. I highly doubt it's in there. Therefore, yes, it is his right.





You're starting to become a parody of yourself, Kirk . Seriously - when you pepper your posts with extremist nonsense like this, you completely undermine any half-decent comments you might have made elsewhere .

YOU lecturing me on 'extremist nonsense' T.S. LOL & LMFAO. YOUR posts are filled with over-simplistic meaningless, often hysterical comments which have NO actual foundation in reality.

My comments on Corbyn are based on FACTS as are ALL my posts.

[user104658]

Originally Posted by kirklancaster

YOU lecturing me on 'extremist nonsense' T.S. LOL & LMFAO. YOUR posts are filled with over-simplistic meaningless, often hysterical comments which have NO actual foundation in reality.

My comments on Corbyn are based on FACTS as are ALL my posts.

"He'd have been much happier sitting in tent somewhere in the Middle East". It's extremist ****ing nonsense Kirk.

I've also (literally) never gotten "hysterical" about anything at all on here . You're the one foaming at the mouth in 70% of threads...

[Tom4784]

It's a **** anthem tbh. Some people are really desperate for a stick to beat him with.

As long as he gets the Tories out of Downing Street then he can sing whatever the **** he likes.

[lostalex]

This Corbyn guy must be stopped! HE'S TEARING THE COUNTRY APART!

[arista]

Originally Posted by lostalex

This Corbyn guy must be stopped! HE'S TEARING THE COUNTRY APART!

He is not going to be stopped
in 22mins he goes Live in our Parliament

[smudgie]

Originally Posted by arista

He is not going to be stopped
in 22mins he goes Live in our Parliament

Thank you, I forgot it was on.

[Tom4784]

I don't understand what choosing not to sing a song about the Monarchy has to do with disrespecting veterans.

Reaching is a word that springs to mind.

[arista]

Feck Me


BBC2HD Andrew Neil - Shut Up

Stop pushing this.

[user104658]

Originally Posted by bitontheslide

You are trolling now or are you seriously suggesting that its ok for one of our political leaders to be endorsing support of terrorists?

No. I'm saying that if Kirk wants to point these things out, he should do so without the hysterics. It's more interesting to read and less like a Dave C-style propaganda tweet.

I feel that at this point, I should take a moment to clarify that I am neither a Corbynite or a Labour supporter. I still think Corbyn looks like Steptoe. I happen to think that he's potentially a little bit naive in terms of potential outcomes, also. I also today realised that, somewhat farcically, he will quite obviously never be PM even with all other considerations out of the window, because he's 66, and by the time the next election comes he'll be 71... and therefore, probably dead, or at the very least, moderately senile. A bit like Kirk really so I dunno what he's worried about.

I won't comment on whether or not Corbyn is, in fact, a "supporter of terrorism"... separating the truth from the propaganda is difficult at this point because there is so much of it floating around. It's worrying if he is, but in my opinion, no more or less worrying than Tory ties to private entities and, historically, arms dealers selling guns that are now in the hands of the very same terrorists.

I don't like Labour. Their election campaign was a farce, this leadership campaign was even more of a farce. I just dislike them less than I dislike the Tories. There is no ideal for me - my ideal was a "Yes" vote in the referrendum last Summer and then the SNP being overturned by a more competent and progressive government in Scotland - but the chance for that has come and gone so I consider myself to be somewhat impartial. Just a melancholy fellow slowly watching the world inevitably unravel. I would just rather see some compassion going around as it all crumbles, and so Corbyn's socialist policies (if they are true) sit better with me than Cameron relentlessly beating a dead horse with a massive capitalist stick.

[the truth]

Originally Posted by Northern Monkey

Our country was built on monarchy.If he is ashamed of that fact then he really should feck off to somewhere he is not so ashamed of.Imo.

our country was raped and pillaged by monarchy for centuries...almost every war was started by the monarchy too...plus the potato famine that killed a million irish....theyre history is disgusting...this great country is built on the people..the millions who built it up , the millions who created the industrial revolution and the millions who fought and died to defend it too

[arista]

JC has now said he will sing it.


Ref: BBC2HD Live

[lostalex]

Is he gonna act like an asshole?

[Firewire]

Don't know why people are making it such an issue. I don't know a single word to the song (except the title).

[Tom4784]

Originally Posted by Firewire

Don't know why people are making it such an issue. I don't know a single word to the song (except the title).

Nobody does really, some people might know the first verse but other than that most people just murmur to it which makes this whole thing ridiculous, no one cares about the national anthem until they can use it as an excuse to get on their soapbox.

[joeysteele]

Originally Posted by Dezzy

Nobody does really, some people might know the first verse but other than that most people just murmur to it which makes this whole thing ridiculous, no one cares about the national anthem until they can use it as an excuse to get on their soapbox.

I really hate this national anthem of ours, to me it is really awful.

I saw no reason to sing it at this function for the Battle of Britain pilots at all, why was it even part of the proceedings.
It was a King we had when the war was on not this Queen anyway.

Why should we not have an anthem that recognises the lands and people of the British Isles and not just a very privileged person,calling for more glorification of her and then protection of her too,someone whose ancestors long ago stopped leading the Brits into wars anyway.

It belongs in the far past in my view,not having any relevance or even being appropriate to 'have' to be sung by anyone anywhere in this day and age.
Until it contains lyrics that recognise the people of these Isles not just the one person.
Pathetic and the fuss as to him not singing it is totally ridiculous.

My Dad,My Brothers were in the Army,RAF and one in the Navy,all think our National Anthem outdated and really boring to listen to,never mind sing.

[joeysteele]

I'd have sang it myself but fail to see why it needed to be even sung at this function anyway.
This was to honour the pilots in the Battle of Britain,not to further glorify an already over privileged person.

I am a Royalist and would hate to be a Republic but for me we have probably the worst so called National anthem anywhere.
It makes no mention of the real people of these Islands and requests more personal glorification and protection for one individual,namely the Monarch.
Who has not the slightest bit of power anyway.

I think its melody is dreary and in fact depressing and the words meaningless for a multi Nation United Kingdom in the 21st century.

Look however, had he sang it, he would have then been hailed a hypocrite for doing so, by not singing it,he still gets a backlash.
He stood in silence respectfully,that for me was fine, had he remained seated and snubbed the whole thing, that would have been a diffferent thing.

For goodness sake, we have loads of great musicians in the UK, surely someone could bring about a National anthem that reflected the peoples of these islands and had some real inspiritional melody and words that brought some oomph to all proceedings.

[the truth]

Originally Posted by joeysteele

I'd have sang it myself but fail to see why it needed to be even sung at this function anyway.
This was to honour the pilots in the Battle of Britain,not to further glorify an already over privileged person.

I am a Royalist and would hate to be a Republic but for me we have probably the worst so called National anthem anywhere.
It makes no mention of the real people of these Islands and requests more personal glorification and protection for one individual,namely the Monarch.
Who has not the slightest bit of power anyway.

I think its melody is dreary and in fact depressing and the words meaningless for a multi Nation United Kingdom in the 21st century.

Look however, had he sang it, he would have then been hailed a hypocrite for doing so, by not singing it,he still gets a backlash.
He stood in silence respectfully,that for me was fine, had he remained seated and snubbed the whole thing, that would have been a diffferent thing.

For goodness sake, we have loads of great musicians in the UK, surely someone could bring about a National anthem that reflected the peoples of these islands and had some real inspiritional melody and words that brought some oomph to all proceedings.

agreed joey....Britain has produced many of the best musicians and the best rock stars ever ....surely to goodness we can produce something better....for what its worth whilst I like the flower of Scotland tune, im not keen on the words, too much blood and guts, the Marseille is magnificent but again its all war based....one of the irish anthems is good, the welsh anthem is magnificent, the American is great, the german anthem is nice, the Russian one is catchy, candaian I like, new Zealand and aussie are lovely and the south African is possibly the best of all

[joeysteele]

Originally Posted by the truth

agreed joey....Britain has produced many of the best musicians and the best rock stars ever ....surely to goodness we can produce something better....for what its worth whilst I like the flower of Scotland tune, im not keen on the words, too much blood and guts, the Marseille is magnificent but again its all war based....one of the irish anthems is good, the welsh anthem is magnificent, the American is great, the german anthem is nice, the Russian one is catchy, candaian I like, new Zealand and aussie are lovely and the south African is possibly the best of all

Glad we agree the truth.