[smudgie]

Until the day They stop paying pensioners who haven't put anything into the pot a state pension then it is fair enough to call it a benefit.

[Kizzy]

If you did take the entire welfare budget, remove the state pension portion and the 12 billion in cuts what would you be left with for 2015/16 I wonder?

[joeysteele]

Originally Posted by smudgie

Until the day They stop paying pensioners who haven't put anything into the pot a state pension then it is fair enough to call it a benefit.

I don't agree and I think you may be very surprised how small an effect that would have with respect anyway.
Multi millionaires get the State pension and rightly, welfare spending costs should only be for in the main the means tested benefit system, not the automatic rights for all.

You actually think it is right that someone who is a millionaire and gets the State pension should be included in social security spending welfare statistics.
I certainly don't,never ever,under any govt.

Also as Vicky says the State pension is rising whereas all other benefits are near frozen or even being cut,that means in effect because the State pension is included in social security welfare figures, the cost appear to rise but not because of the other benefits being paid, only from the State pension rises in the greater part.

[joeysteele]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

If you did take the entire welfare budget, remove the state pension portion and the 12 billion in cuts what would you be left with for 2015/16 I wonder?

Probably around 40% of the current statistic Kizzy.The last programme on this said 57% of welfare spending was mainly on pensions.

[DemolitionRed]

This shows where our contributions go http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...-benefits.html

[smudgie]

Originally Posted by joeysteele

I don't agree and I think you may be very surprised how small an effect that would have with respect anyway.
Multi millionaires get the State pension and rightly, welfare spending costs should only be for in the main the means tested benefit system, not the automatic rights for all.

You actually think it is right that someone who is a millionaire and gets the State pension should be included in social security spending welfare statistics.
I certainly don't,never ever,under any govt.

Also as Vicky says the State pension is rising whereas all other benefits are near frozen or even being cut,that means in effect because the State pension is included in social security welfare figures, the cost appear to rise but not because of the other benefits being paid, only from the State pension rises in the greater part.

I don't doubt that sometime in the future all State pensions will be means tested. Then the fun and games will really start.
Until then, and until only them that contribute are allowed to claim it I just can't see any change in it being called a benefit.
Just waiting to see who dares do it.

[joeysteele]

Originally Posted by smudgie

I don't doubt that sometime in the future all State pensions will be means tested. Then the fun and games will really start.
Until then, and until only them that contribute are allowed to claim it I just can't see any change in it being called a benefit.
Just waiting to see who dares do it.

How many get the State pension who have never worked and never paid into the system at all.
Do you know because with respect I certainly don't but in relation to the numbers and costs,I would dare bet it is a small number.

If you could say half of those getting State pension were people who never paid into it, (and if they didn't then they get a smaller pension anyway due to less contributions).
Then perhaps I could be persuaded.
I have no figures so if you have any,I would love to see them as to 'only' those getting State pension who have never worked or paid into the system at all.

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by smudgie

I don't doubt that sometime in the future all State pensions will be means tested. Then the fun and games will really start.
Until then, and until only them that contribute are allowed to claim it I just can't see any change in it being called a benefit.
Just waiting to see who dares do it.

I think that is happening right now, the 'when you pay in your boss pays in' I feel is a way to gauge who, what, where and when you contribute.