[Tom4784]

Originally Posted by Cherie

Where were the child's parents when he was given this to model

His mother commented on the issue saying that she didn't see it as racist.

Originally Posted by Brillopad

To me this shows how easy it is for people who want to be offended, in order to make a political point, to be offended by taking an everyday non-race related comment such as ‘cheeky little monkey’ and blowing it out of all proportion. It is an agenda. It is those that do this that are obsessed with skin colour and are effectively racist.

racist
ˈreɪsɪst/Submit
noun
1.
a person who shows or feels discrimination or prejudice against people of other races, or who believes that a particular race is superior to another.
"I had a fear of being called a racist"
synonyms: racial bigot, racialist, xenophobe, chauvinist; More
adjective
1.
showing or feeling discrimination or prejudice against people of other races, or believing that a particular race is superior to another.
"we are investigating complaints about racist abuse at a newsagents"

So not really, at all. Try again.

[Cherie]

Originally Posted by Dezzy

His mother commented on the issue saying that she didn't see it as racist.

Interesting p, but then her son was being handed a wedge of cash

[Brillopad]

Originally Posted by Dezzy

His mother commented on the issue saying that she didn't see it as racist.





So not really, at all. Try again.

So if childrens’ clothing has a slogan saying ‘cheeky little monkey’ is that racist in your opinion. There is clearly no racist INTENT. If a black parent is that sensitive then they won’t put it on their child.

And what about clothing stating white is beautiful - is that not allowed. It seems pretty racist to me to only be allowed to state that one skin colour is beautiful.

[bots]

Originally Posted by Brillopad

So if childrens’ clothing has a slogan saying ‘cheeky little monkey’ is that racist in your opinion. There is clearly no racist INTENT. If a black parent is that sensitive then they won’t put it on their child.

And what about clothing stating white is beautiful - is that not allowed. It seems pretty racist to me to only be allowed to state that one skin colour is beautiful.

but it didnt say cheeky monkey, it said something with a completely different meaning.

[Tom4784]

Originally Posted by Cherie

Interesting p, but then her son was being handed a wedge of cash

Yeah, people have used her statement as a reason to say it isn't racist but I don't think her thoughts really do anything to dispel that, at best, this is a case of incredible stupidity on the part of the marketing execs that okayed this.

Originally Posted by Brillopad

So if childrens’ clothing has a slogan saying ‘cheeky little monkey’ is that racist in your opinion. There is clearly no racist INTENT. If a black parent is that sensitive then they won’t put it on their child.

And what about clothing stating white is beautiful - is that not allowed. It seems pretty racist to me to only be allowed to state that one skin colour is beautiful.

Who said that the clothes themselves were racist? No one that's who. Pay attention.

Dressing a black child in clothes that say 'coolest monkey in the jungle' is problematic as hell and there are racial implications there whether intentional or not (I don't think it's intentional, I just think whoever okayed this is a ****ing moron). Trying to make it about the clothing is just you trying to downplay something that makes you uncomfortable because accusations of racism are more offensive to you than actual racism itself.

If you actually read the topic and the story properly you would know that the controversy has come, not from the clothes, but the choice of model wearing them.

[Brillopad]

Originally Posted by Dezzy

Yeah, people have used her statement as a reason to say it isn't racist but I don't think her thoughts really do anything to dispel that, at best, this is a case of incredible stupidity on the part of the marketing execs that okayed this.



Who said that the clothes themselves were racist? No one that's who. Pay attention.

Dressing a black child in clothes that say 'coolest monkey in the jungle' is problematic as hell and there are racial implications there whether intentional or not (I don't think it's intentional, I just think whoever okayed this is a ****ing moron). Trying to make it about the clothing is just you trying to downplay something that makes you uncomfortable because accusations of racism are more offensive to you than actual racism itself.

If you actually read the topic and the story properly you would know that the controversy has come, not from the clothes, but the choice of model wearing them.

So we need segregated clothing now - making such a big thing about the choice of model amounts to just that. What a big step forward that is.

And yes I disrespect those throwing around the word racist at every turn BECAUSE it is used to SHUT DOWN opinions. It is about the INTENT! Just more PC hysteria!

[Tom4784]

Originally Posted by Brillopad

So we need segregated clothing now - making such a big thing about the choice of model amounts to just that. What a big step forward that is.

And yes I disrespect those throwing around the word racist at every turn BECAUSE it is used to SHUT DOWN opinions. It is about the INTENT!

For the love of god, IT'S NOT ABOUT THE CLOTHING, what is so difficult for you to understand about that? Who is even talking about segregated clothing? You keep trying to push this whole 'people who think this is racist are actually racist themselves' angle but I've already reduced that argument of yours to dust through the godamn definition of racism.

The choice to model this particular hoodie on a black child is the problem. I don't know why you are struggling so much to understand that.

As for the bolded point, you've accused everyone who has taken issue with this image as being inherently racist, I'd ask you if you truly don't see the hypocrisy in that but I've known you long enough to know that you don't.

If someone accuses you of racism, you tackle that accusation head on and show them why that accusation isn't true. You've accused me of plenty in the past and I don't go 'wah wah, you're shutting down my opinion wah' I take your accusation and show you how silly it is and then I rip it to shreds.

If you are unwilling to defend yourself against apparently untrue accusations than that's your problem, you can't tell people they can't call out racism just because it makes you uncomfortable.

[Brillopad]

Originally Posted by Dezzy

For the love of god, IT'S NOT ABOUT THE CLOTHING, what is so difficult for you to understand about that? Who is even talking about segregated clothing? You keep trying to push this whole 'people who think this is racist are actually racist themselves' angle but I've already reduced that argument of yours to dust through the godamn definition of racism.

The choice to model this particular hoodie on a black child and is the problem. I don't know why you are struggling so much to understand that.

As for the bolded point, you've accused everyone who has taken issue with this image as being inherently racist, I'd ask you if you truly don't see the hypocrisy in that but I've known you long enough to know that you don't.

If someone accuses you of racism, you tackle that accusation head on and show them why that accusation isn't true. You've accused me of plenty in the past and I don't go 'wah wah, you're shutting down my opinion wah' I take your accusation and show you how silly it is and then I rip it to shreds.

If you are unwilling to defend yourself against apparently untrue accusations than that's your problem, you can't tell people they can't call out racism just because it makes you uncomfortable.

It is about clothing if you are implying a black child can’t wear a hoodie with the slogan cheeky little monkey for instance. We all know about the negative connotations of the word monkey used in the past but if people are going to apply the same connotation in their minds to a harmless fun slogan on a child’s hoodie that really is their problem - not the child’s or anyone else.

If people want to see hate in a word whatever the context and intent there is no moving forward in my opinion.

[GoldHeart]

I remember seeing this on msn news page Popping up and I was perplexed by it and couldn't believe they actually did this as these days people try their hardest NOT to offend .

Especially a clothing brand like H&M ,what were they thinking . The whole thing is just weird . How was it given the green light ? .

Yes it's just a sweater but the logo and advert makes you think why didn't they choose another kid to wear it . As things can be taken The wrong way . Just looks really bizarre how it's been done .

[Vicky.]

Originally Posted by Brillopad

It is about clothing if you are implying a black child can’t wear a hoodie with the slogan cheeky little monkey for instance. We all know about the negative connotations of the word monkey used in the past but if people are going to apply the same connotation in their minds to a harmless fun slogan on a child’s hoodie that really is their problem - not the child’s or anyone else.

If people want to see hate in a word whatever the context and intent there is no moving forward in my opinion.

A black child can wear any top they want. Totally up to them if they chose something like this,

The problem is with modelling such a top on a black child. Its very offensive to a lot of people, and I am astounded that it managed to pass a bunch of people by..its not like there is only one person making decisions like this in such a huge company, and some people are paid specifically to make sure stuff like this does not happen

I read about the mother not finding it racist. thats fine as its her opinion on it and I have heard black friends saying they did not find it offensive too. But a lot DO find it offensive. And I don't blame them as I know the history of how 'monkey' has been used against black people. FFS we still have idiots throwing bananas at footballers and doing monkey chants and stuff. Its not exactly something thats way in the past so people can use the excuse that they don't know about it...

[Ammi]

...this reminds me a bit of what Spike Lee’s said when he talked of the lack of diversity in Hollywood...that there needed to be more black people in that room where these decisions are made with movies, that was the starting point to have a more diverse ‘body’ of decision makers...it would be interesting to know if the decision makers with this had any diversity on their panel/board etc....because many people sat down and approved this...that should never have happened because it’s already become offensive in the manufacturing and production etc ...so an apology starts to become a bit meaningless...the child’s parent may have said they were ok with it but has her child ever experienced anything negative being said to them personLly in their young life...and if they had, would she still be ok with it and not given it more thought...because some young children have experienced cruel things having been said to them and I can’t imagine a parent of theirs thinking the garment was fine and ‘cool’...

...there seems to have been a few similar advertising cases similar to this recently..the Dove one was another one and think maybe Nivea also..?...this is 2018, we all know what’s offensive and what isn’t offensive to all sections of society ...and certainly the people/..board in ‘that room’ know because they’re being paid to know...these things should just not happen..not at all...

[Ammi]

Originally Posted by Vicky.

A black child can wear any top they want. Totally up to them if they chose something like this,

The problem is with modelling such a top on a black child. Its very offensive to a lot of people, and I am astounded that it managed to pass a bunch of people by..its not like there is only one person making decisions like this in such a huge company, and some people are paid specifically to make sure stuff like this does not happen

I read about the mother not finding it racist. thats fine as its her opinion on it and I have heard black friends saying they did not find it offensive too. But a lot DO find it offensive. And I don't blame them as I know the history of how 'monkey' has been used against black people. FFS we still have idiots throwing bananas at footballers and doing monkey chants and stuff. Its not exactly something thats way in the past so people can use the excuse that they don't know about it...

..or similar to this, we must have posted at the same time.../...you’re just quicker on the keyboard...

[Brillopad]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...ungle-row.html

A bunch of thugs who think they have an excuse to act like a bunch of thugs. They should be charged.

[Vicky.]

Originally Posted by Brillopad

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...ungle-row.html

A bunch of thugs who think they have an excuse to act like a bunch of thugs. They should be charged.

Absolutely disgusting behaviour. Talk about going over the ****ing top...

[Kazanne]

Maybe the people that passed this are not the racist ones,surely it's the people that are saying it is racist are the problem,people make things worse by throwing wobblys about something that I don't see as racist, I just saw a cute kid in a hoodie,now I see something different because of the fall out, kids are called little monkeys all the time, I had a top with a bunny on once doesn't mean I was a playboy bunny.

[Kazanne]

Originally Posted by Brillopad

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...ungle-row.html

A bunch of thugs who think they have an excuse to act like a bunch of thugs. They should be charged.

Talk about going over the top,Jesus and they think that will make things better,effing idiots.

[Brillopad]

Originally Posted by Kazanne

Maybe the people that passed this are not the racist ones,surely it's the people that are saying it is racist are the problem,people make things worse by throwing wobblys about something that I don't see as racist, I just saw a cute kid in a hoodie,now I see something different because of the fall out, kids are called little monkeys all the time, I had a top with a bunny on once doesn't mean I was a playboy bunny.

It’s madness Kaz. I can’t help but think that seeing ‘colour’ in everything, even something as harmless as a child’s hoodie, is a combination of either forced offence as part of a political agenda or an unconscious preoccupation with skin colour.

Maybe, just maybe the people producing the hoodie gave it little thought because they don’t focus on skin colour and just see children and children’s clothes. It does make you wonder where racism really begins and ends.

[Kazanne]

Originally Posted by Brillopad

It’s madness Kaz. I can’t help but think that seeing ‘colour’ in everything, even something as harmless as a child’s hoodie, is a combination of either forced offence as part of a political agenda or an unconscious preoccupation with skin colour.

Maybe, just maybe the people producing the hoodie gave it little thought because they don’t focus on skin colour and just see children and children’s clothes. It does make you wonder where racism really begins and ends.

Too true,people seem to look for anything to have a go at.

[smudgie]

Originally Posted by Vicky.

Absolutely disgusting behaviour. Talk about going over the ****ing top...

Ah, I got the video on FB early on, warning to keep away from certain malls and shopping centres due to this carry on.


Obviously if was a shared post from one of my SA friends.

[Tom4784]

Originally Posted by Brillopad

It is about clothing if you are implying a black child can’t wear a hoodie with the slogan cheeky little monkey for instance. We all know about the negative connotations of the word monkey used in the past but if people are going to apply the same connotation in their minds to a harmless fun slogan on a child’s hoodie that really is their problem - not the child’s or anyone else.

If people want to see hate in a word whatever the context and intent there is no moving forward in my opinion.

Again, it isn't. You are constantly misunderstanding the point. The child can wear what he wants, the problem is that H&M thought that it would be a good idea to use a picture of a black child modelling that hoodie as a way of advertising it online. Honestly, I'm tired of explaining this, it should be obvious what the problem is.

This whole 'blame the people who take offense' approach is just an overly PC reaction that you always have whenever anyone, regardless of the situation, is accused of racism. You're the most PC person on this website, it's just you get on a soapbox when it comes to racism accusations and not actual racism itself.

[Tom4784]

Originally Posted by Brillopad

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...ungle-row.html

A bunch of thugs who think they have an excuse to act like a bunch of thugs. They should be charged.

They don't look much like protesters to me, more like chavs looking for an excuse to be chavs.

[Marsh.]

Originally Posted by Brillopad

To me this shows how easy it is for people who want to be offended, in order to make a political point, to be offended by taking an everyday non-race related comment such as ‘cheeky little monkey’ and blowing it out of all proportion. It is an agenda. It is those that do this that are obsessed with skin colour and are effectively racist.

There was no "cheeky little monkey" phrase used.

[Brillopad]

Originally Posted by Marsh.

There was no "cheeky little monkey" phrase used.

It comes from something said by another poster.

[Brillopad]

Originally Posted by Dezzy

Again, it isn't. You are constantly misunderstanding the point. The child can wear what he wants, the problem is that H&M thought that it would be a good idea to use a picture of a black child modelling that hoodie as a way of advertising it online. Honestly, I'm tired of explaining this, it should be obvious what the problem is.

This whole 'blame the people who take offense' approach is just an overly PC reaction that you always have whenever anyone, regardless of the situation, is accused of racism. You're the most PC person on this website, it's just you get on a soapbox when it comes to racism accusations and not actual racism itself.

No-one could be more PC than you.

[Tom4784]

Originally Posted by Brillopad

No-one could be more PC than you.

So you've got nothing more to actually add to the discussion, then.