[GoldHeart]

Originally Posted by Cherie

Would you be happy to be filmed without your consent?

say if you lay injured in the road, would you be happy people were filming you for likes rather than calling an ambulance, because that is where we are at right now?

FGS Cherie , firstly NO I would NOT be happy but I wouldn't be surprised as this is the culture we're in and have been in for a while whether we like it or not.

I don't agree with everything being filmed of course not.

But I can understand why some people film certain situations if they're getting abuse for no reason , as they want evidence to show it was unprovoked and so on.

[Toy Soldier]

Originally Posted by Dezzy

There is absolutely no way you can prove that to be true since the only stats available are the attacks that have been reported, there's plenty of victims who haven't come forward for a plethora of reasons.

Attacks by men on men are quite widely known to be the most common... At least the most common requiring hospital treatment at least, and it would make sense that the overall figure would correlate to some extent.

It is to an extent comparing apples with oranges though, as there are scant figures on how many of those assaults involve "mutual" physical attacks (fighting).

When it comes to domestic violence women obviously are the primary victims, although female-on-male violence is reported less. Both are woefully under-reported of course. HOWEVER - and I do think this is an important stat - domestic violence incidents resulting in serious injury or death are MASSIVELY skewed to male-on-female.

[Toy Soldier]

Originally Posted by James

One of the main problems is a rush to judgement... as well as an unreliable standard of information.

I agree and that's why I understand the terror of the woman in the video. She knows fine well that people don't actually give a **** what happened... They'll have made up their mind before even watching the video, and lives have been ruined on far less.

[Cherie]

Originally Posted by GoldHeart

FGS Cherie , firstly NO I would NOT be happy but I wouldn't be surprised as this is the culture we're in and have been in for a while whether we like it or not.

I don't agree with everything being filmed of course not.

But I can understand why some people film certain situations if they're getting abuse for no reason , as they want evidence to show it was unprovoked and so on.

Oh fair dues

[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

The problem with all of this justification, is that examples of extreme individuals are being passed around on social media so that they start to seem like that's "likely" or "normal" and are then used to categorise & harass people who have nothing to do with any of it. The whole thing is infused with aggression and gang mentality and it's not a good look on anyone.

I think for me, to answer the thrwat topic at this point... The nicknaming and stereotyping is needless, damaging, and yet another symptom of banal social media group-think and tribalism. Bin social media. Bin the name-calling. Fling all of it to ****, its the worst of human nature in digital form.

Yeah totally agree, it also dehumanises people, all you have to say is that person is a "Karen" and that's it they're bad and deserve everything they get

[Tom4784]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

Attacks by men on men are quite widely known to be the most common... At least the most common requiring hospital treatment at least, and it would make sense that the overall figure would correlate to some extent.

It is to an extent comparing apples with oranges though, as there are scant figures on how many of those assaults involve "mutual" physical attacks (fighting).

When it comes to domestic violence women obviously are the primary victims, although female-on-male violence is reported less. Both are woefully under-reported of course. HOWEVER - and I do think this is an important stat - domestic violence incidents resulting in serious injury or death are MASSIVELY skewed to male-on-female.

The problem is that any statistic is inevitably flawed because none of them can ever truly quantify an exact number. Rape often goes unreported so there's really no way of saying that Rape is less common than something else because it can never really be proven as such because the exact numbers are unknowable.

Plus the whole 'assault>rape'-ness of the statement just doesn't sit well with me. It feels like Oliver's original statement was downplaying rape by comparing it to another crime and that just grosses me out.

[Ammi]

...just to say that the comment was that men get physically assaulted more often than women get raped...and that’s what Dezzy said was impossible to know ...


...rapes may not be reported for varying reasons...

[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by Ammi

...just to say that the comment was that men get physically assaulted more often than women get raped...and that’s what Dezzy said was impossible to know ...





...rapes may not be reported for varying reasons...

Well, when you look at how rape victims are treated in court and the conviction rates, its easy to see why

[Ammi]

Originally Posted by Niamh.

Well, when you look at how rape victims are treated in court and the conviction rates, its easy to see why

...yeah exactly, which I presumed is what Dezzy meant in saying it would be impossible to compare etc..

[Cherie]

Originally Posted by Niamh.

Yeah totally agree, it also dehumanises people, all you have to say is that person is a "Karen" and that's it they're bad and deserve everything they get

Pretty much, lazy stereotyping

[GoldHeart]

Originally Posted by Cherie

Oh fair dues

Yeah I don't agree with harassment / filming . And to follow someone home is just creepy and wrong .

[Oliver_W]

Originally Posted by Cherie

Pretty much, lazy stereotyping

Depends on the context. If it's used to laugh at one of "those" people, it's fine.

But there is a short list of words - Karen, gammon, incel, SJW, cuck, woke, simp - anyone who uses one of those words with a straight face needs to spend less time in front of a screen and meet actual people once in a while

[Swan]

Originally Posted by Oliver_W

Depends on the context. If it's used to laugh at one of "those" people, it's fine.

But there is a short list of words - Karen, gammon, incel, SJW, cuck, woke, simp - anyone who uses one of those words with a straight face needs to spend less time in front of a screen and meet actual people once in a while

I've stayed out of this mess, but i certainly agree with that.

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

I agree and that's why I understand the terror of the woman in the video. She knows fine well that people don't actually give a **** what happened... They'll have made up their mind before even watching the video, and lives have been ruined on far less.

But that's not the case is it? You're suggesting his actions will be justified as she has be labelled a karen..and they are not. There's lots of people who think his actions were abusive.

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by Niamh.

Yeah totally agree, it also dehumanises people, all you have to say is that person is a "Karen" and that's it they're bad and deserve everything they get

I don't agree, there is context to 'karen', she is not a social media construct, she is if anything social commentary in the way ' white van man' and 'yuppies' were in recent history.

[Toy Soldier]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

But that's not the case is it? You're suggesting his actions will be justified as she has be labelled a karen..and they are not. There's lots of people who think his actions were abusive.

? Obviously they're not justified by everyone, not everyone buys into this sort of trash. They are being justified by plenty of people, and that's enough of a problem?

Originally Posted by Kizzy

I don't agree, there is context to 'karen', she is not a social media construct, she is if anything social commentary in the way ' white van man' and 'yuppies' were in recent history.

I disagree, "karen" started out as a light-hearted observation based meme of a certain type of person and has now been hijacked/usurped into something far more serious, aggressive and sinister. Both are social media constructs.

[Cherie]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

? Obviously they're not justified by everyone, not everyone buys into this sort of trash. They are being justified by plenty of people, and that's enough of a problem?



I disagree, "karen" started out as a light-hearted observation based meme of a certain type of person and has now been hijacked/usurped into something far more serious, aggressive and sinister. Both are social media constructs.

I have only come across it very recently, it looks to me like its being used to bully people into silence, don’t raise your head above the parapet, be seen and not heard, or you will receive the modern day equivalent of being thrown to the lions

[Kazanne]

I don't know much about what a 'Karen' is, I presume it's a derogatory term ,reading through the thread I am in agreement with Toy Soldier, Niamh ,Oliver and ,Cherie, why can't people just take people at face value and stop labelling them ?

[Mystic Mock]

Originally Posted by Oliver_W

I'm basically a boomer despite being in my twenties - I liike old shows and movies and music, and I'm a bit of a fuddyduddy

There's no shame in that tbf.

I watched the Disney version of Alice In Wonderland a couple of days ago and it's one of the most fun Movies that I've seen in awhile.

Basically we can be boomers United.

[Mystic Mock]

Originally Posted by Ammi

...just to say that the comment was that men get physically assaulted more often than women get raped...and that’s what Dezzy said was impossible to know ...


...rapes may not be reported for varying reasons...

I agree with you and Dezzy on this one.

Rape is so rarely reported it's hard to know how many people get raped in a year.

[Oliver_W]

Originally Posted by Mystic Mock

There's no shame in that tbf.

I watched the Disney version of Alice In Wonderland a couple of days ago and it's one of the most fun Movies that I've seen in awhile.

Basically we can be boomers United.

Even my phone is boomer, I go out with a standard call-and-text thing

I do have an excuse though! My "main" phone was a smartphone, until it broke. I bought a cheap handset to use until my new phone came, and that one used a different SIM card. So I only use it in the house for smartphone type things, and carry the cheap one out in the world

[Mystic Mock]

Originally Posted by Oliver_W

Even my phone is boomer, I go out with a standard call-and-text thing

I do have an excuse though! My "main" phone was a smartphone, until it broke. I bought a cheap handset to use until my new phone came, and that one used a different SIM card. So I only use it in the house for smartphone type things, and carry the cheap one out in the world

Omg.

Tbf I don't have the most advanced Phone either so I can't mock too heavily on this one.

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

? Obviously they're not justified by everyone, not everyone buys into this sort of trash. They are being justified by plenty of people, and that's enough of a problem?



I disagree, "karen" started out as a light-hearted observation based meme of a certain type of person and has now been hijacked/usurped into something far more serious, aggressive and sinister. Both are social media constructs.

There will always be twats. . It's just a given, anyone with half a brain cell knows he was out of order.

It has no baring on the existence of karen or why they are relevant from a modern sociological perspective. Imo

Many social observations started out as jokes or even whole characters remember 'loadsamoney'?... he came to embody Essex man the first true blue collar tories.

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by Cherie

[/B]

I have only come across it very recently, it looks to me like its being used to bully people into silence, don’t raise your head above the parapet, be seen and not heard, or you will receive the modern day equivalent of being thrown to the lions

I thought this at first... it's not unusual for there to be derogatory comments aimed at women on the internet, there will be those who lazily label all middle aged women 'karen' or all middle aged persons 'boomers'
Just like there are those who label all young persons 'millenials' or 'snowflakes'.

The defining feature here is context, I'm a middle aged woman and I think karens exist, I've met some. There have been lots of terms to define sections of society for many years. Chavs, hoodies, milfs, slone rangers, yuppies, bimbos, wags, goths. There's many more that share a common theme in their ideology, dress, age, class. It would be silly to suggest we can't add to that list expecially in the time of the internet as compiling evidence for a shared outlook and or view and dress is made glaringly apparent.

It's not wrong or offensive to admit there are subgroups within society.
And don't forget, if you oppose one you have to oppose all?
For balance and all that

[Toy Soldier]

The context of use is important too, though, and in my opinion unless those terms are being used tongue-in-cheek then yeah... I'd oppose all. As soon as any of these terms is used as an attack, or a social media battle horn, it becomes aggressive and sinister. In recent months, the term "Karen" has lost its original usage and is now primarily used aggressively as an insult, taunt or bait or as a lazy dehumanising tactic. Its not just "a few people" at this point. That's the primary function of these terms, and they don't belong anywhere near any rational or civilised debate. And yes, that applies to all of the examples you gave. Do you honestly take anyone seriously once they start throwing around terms like "snowflake", "bloody millenials" or "OK boomer", unironically?

In a WhatsApp message with your friends? Sure. That's different. And it's where these things should stay.