[Ammi]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

Oh I have absolutely no doubt that the same kids who vanished off the face of the earth last time will be AWOL again this month. Thankfully there are no kids in my daughter's class who are actually at physical risk - they all have, at least, comfortable homes with parents who are taking care of their GENERAL wellbeing - the kids who are missing from the online classes are healthy and happy "in the moment" ... just falling further and further behind. I honestly think there are kids who, at this point, already have no chance of ever catching up to where they should be at this point. They're in their final Primary School year and there are multiple kids in that class who are going to be heading off to their first year of high school next year simply not prepared for the step up. Best we can hope for, I think, is for high schools to be aware of that and ready to support those kids next year, and not be too surprised when they're not at the expected level.

Of course things get even more complicated when there are kids in the class who might not even be being looked after properly at all and don't have other adult eyes on them for months on end...

I think that's really why many people can't understand why it's not a simple decision. Most people expect that kids are at least happy and healthy at home with their family... and are blissfully unaware that this is not always the case

...with looked after children and the huge issues those children can obviously have...?...Foster parenting is always and has always been done with huge support from many agencies, as well as schools... a very extensive wrap around care is needed for just one looked after child and a school is a huge focus for that... but that’s obviously had to operate within restrictions as well... there must, though, always be the level still given that is possible in the times we live...

[Tom4784]

I'm hoping for tougher restrictions on retail, a lot of shops are closed but the ones that are open are being swarmed by morons who are going shopping just 'cus or for frivolous things that are available in 'essential' shops.

[arista]

[England goes BACK into full lockdown: Boris will
plunge country into March-style curbs in 8pm TV address
tonight - with fears schools will stay shut]

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ruled-out.html

[arista]

Ch4HDnews has extended
7PM-8:30PM


They could even move Eastenders at 8PM
BBC1HD

[Nicky91]

Originally Posted by arista

Ch4HDnews has extended
7PM-8:30PM


They could even move Eastenders at 8PM
BBC1HD

of course since Eastenders isn't live tv anyway, can easily be delayed for 30-45 minutes as long as Boris needs

[Toy Soldier]

Originally Posted by Dezzy

I'm hoping for tougher restrictions on retail, a lot of shops are closed but the ones that are open are being swarmed by morons who are going shopping just 'cus or for frivolous things that are available in 'essential' shops.

I feel that there's just no way to do this that doesn't rely heavily on staff discretion, and thus it can't be mandated. The list of essential vs non-essential would have the be exhaustive and who gets the job of going through a list of "every product in every shop" to decide on essential vs non-essential?

e.g. one might argue that the entire upstairs area of my local Tesco is non-essential... however it has tech items and I would argue that, if you're working from home and wake up one morning to find that your keyboard or mouse has given up, suddenly those items become very much essential (and there's a big difference between a 30 minute trip to the supermarket and a one-or-two-day wait for an online order).

Last time round it was argued that kids clothes are non-essential which anyone who has ever had kids knows is daft.

People might assume that kids toys are non-essential - absolutely not the case if, for example, you have a child with special needs who is now stuck at home 24/7. Again you can make a case for ordering online but that ends up being discriminatory against people who don't "do tech", or people who don't have access to online payment methods (yes, more exist than you would think).

It's just a minefield and it gets very silly, very quickly, with clueless 20-year-old staff blustering around bellowing about what is and isn't "an essential purchase".

[DouglasS]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

I feel that there's just no way to do this that doesn't rely heavily on staff discretion, and thus it can't be mandated. The list of essential vs non-essential would have the be exhaustive and who gets the job of going through a list of "every product in every shop" to decide on essential vs non-essential?

e.g. one might argue that the entire upstairs area of my local Tesco is non-essential... however it has tech items and I would argue that, if you're working from home and wake up one morning to find that your keyboard or mouse has given up, suddenly those items become very much essential (and there's a big difference between a 30 minute trip to the supermarket and a one-or-two-day wait for an online order).

Last time round it was argued that kids clothes are non-essential which anyone who has ever had kids knows is daft.

People might assume that kids toys are non-essential - absolutely not the case if, for example, you have a child with special needs who is now stuck at home 24/7. Again you can make a case for ordering online but that ends up being discriminatory against people who don't "do tech", or people who don't have access to online payment methods (yes, more exist than you would think).

It's just a minefield and it gets very silly, very quickly, with clueless 20-year-old staff blustering about bellowing about what is and isn't "an essential purchase".

Exactly the point.

I don’t think people should be judging people for the items they buy or assume they are “non essential”. The purchase of highlighting pens could be essential to some sitting exams, others may not think so. Like you said electronics may be essential rather than waiting for delivery.. your work will not accept you taking two days off because your keyboard has broke and your awaiting for a delivery - you could be working as NHS admin from home..

Judging people for what is and isn’t essential seems ridiculous

[Ammi]

...since mask wearing became compulsory, supermarkets don’t appear to have a queuing system anymore with limited customers allowed in at one time to allow for the required spacing...I think that’s an essential thing to do again as well for staff and customer safety...

[Vanessa]

Originally Posted by Ammi

...since mask wearing became compulsory, supermarkets don’t appear to have a queuing system anymore with limited customers allowed in at one time to allow for the required spacing...I think that’s an essential thing to do again as well for staff and customer safety...

I think I will go back to online shopping.
Much better.

[Lee.]

Originally Posted by Ammi

...since mask wearing became compulsory, supermarkets don’t appear to have a queuing system anymore with limited customers allowed in at one time to allow for the required spacing...I think that’s an essential thing to do again as well for staff and customer safety...

Since Nicola’s statement, the supermarkets here have gone mental! They’re mobbed with massive queues. I despair for some people, I really do. Surely they realise that there’s no need to panic buy?

[Toy Soldier]

Originally Posted by Ammi

...since mask wearing became compulsory, supermarkets don’t appear to have a queuing system anymore with limited customers allowed in at one time to allow for the required spacing...I think that’s an essential thing to do again as well for staff and customer safety...

Most of the ones around here have an electronic traffic-light system at the door but, tbh, I've never seen it NOT on green (and in the week leading up to Christmas, it was FAR too busy inside).

We did go to M&S on the 23rd and there was a queue (a pretty long one) but that's the first queue I've seen since probably May.

[Vanessa]

When I go to the supermarkets here they aren't crowded, but I do think there should be a queueing system.

[Tom4784]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

I feel that there's just no way to do this that doesn't rely heavily on staff discretion, and thus it can't be mandated. The list of essential vs non-essential would have the be exhaustive and who gets the job of going through a list of "every product in every shop" to decide on essential vs non-essential?

e.g. one might argue that the entire upstairs area of my local Tesco is non-essential... however it has tech items and I would argue that, if you're working from home and wake up one morning to find that your keyboard or mouse has given up, suddenly those items become very much essential (and there's a big difference between a 30 minute trip to the supermarket and a one-or-two-day wait for an online order).

Last time round it was argued that kids clothes are non-essential which anyone who has ever had kids knows is daft.

People might assume that kids toys are non-essential - absolutely not the case if, for example, you have a child with special needs who is now stuck at home 24/7. Again you can make a case for ordering online but that ends up being discriminatory against people who don't "do tech", or people who don't have access to online payment methods (yes, more exist than you would think).

It's just a minefield and it gets very silly, very quickly, with clueless 20-year-old staff blustering around bellowing about what is and isn't "an essential purchase".

Such things have to be mandated at this point, it can't go on like this and if we return to the whole staff on the door approach then we open them up to more abuse from a moronic public that can't sit on their arse at home when they are told.

Limit shop hours, limit the days that supermarkets can be open, limit the stock they sell to only essentials. The public have abused the shops and their workers throughout this entire pandemic and enough is enough.

If the hedge cases you brought up suffer for it, they can blame the morons who treat going shopping during a pandemic as a day out. Keep smaller shops open to handle the every day stuff, but they need to find a way to limit people from cramming into supermarkets and places like B&M, Home Bargains, etc like the plague of locusts they are.

[Toy Soldier]

Originally Posted by Lee.

Since Nicola’s statement, the supermarkets here have gone mental! They’re mobbed with massive queues. I despair for some people, I really do. Surely they realise that there’s no need to panic buy?

Oh FFS I was about to head out . The border closures were at least a decent reason to be a little prepared (though I must admit they were resolved pretty quickle ) but lockdown was never a reason to panic buy... and not only that... but we now know FROM EXPERIENCE that they're not a reason to panic buy. Why do people think lockdown will be a problem for supply now when it wasn't last year?

Please tell me they're not all buying up toilet roll again...

[Ammi]

Originally Posted by Lee.

Since Nicola’s statement, the supermarkets here have gone mental! They’re mobbed with massive queues. I despair for some people, I really do. Surely they realise that there’s no need to panic buy?

...especially after the stocking up festive season, the store cupboards usually last until around March as it is...

[Tom4784]

Originally Posted by DouglasS

Exactly the point.

I don’t think people should be judging people for the items they buy or assume they are “non essential”. The purchase of highlighting pens could be essential to some sitting exams, others may not think so. Like you said electronics may be essential rather than waiting for delivery.. your work will not accept you taking two days off because your keyboard has broke and your awaiting for a delivery - you could be working as NHS admin from home..

Judging people for what is and isn’t essential seems ridiculous

Nah, I can and will judge morons if they go out for ****ing cushions and throws in a pandemic, if they hear 'Tier 4' and think 'Let's pop to the shops for some paint and decorate!'

A pandemic is a ****ing pandemic, people need to wake up and start treating it as such or it'll never end.

[Ammi]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

Most of the ones around here have an electronic traffic-light system at the door but, tbh, I've never seen it NOT on green (and in the week leading up to Christmas, it was FAR too busy inside).

We did go to M&S on the 23rd and there was a queue (a pretty long one) but that's the first queue I've seen since probably May.

...it’s obviously different areas, then...all of our essential open shops through the last lockdown only allowed for limited body’s inside at one time and it was always staffed from outside the store...but since compulsory masks, there hasn’t seemed to be those limited numbers and spacing has become more stressful...

[Nicky91]

Originally Posted by Dezzy

Nah, I can and will judge morons if they go out for ****ing cushions and throws in a pandemic, if they hear 'Tier 4' and think 'Let's pop to the shops for some paint and decorate!'

A pandemic is a ****ing pandemic, people need to wake up and start treating it as such or it'll never end.

exactly


and also we need to all listen more to Merkel's advice, how corona can only go away if we all work together

[Toy Soldier]

Originally Posted by Dezzy

Such things have to be mandated at this point, it can't go on like this and if we return to the whole staff on the door approach then we open them up to more abuse from a moronic public that can't sit on their arse at home when they are told.

Limit shop hours, limit the days that supermarkets can be open, limit the stock they sell to only essentials. The public have abused the shops and their workers throughout this entire pandemic and enough is enough.

If the hedge cases you brought up suffer for it, they can blame the morons who treat going shopping during a pandemic as a day out. Keep smaller shops open to handle the every day stuff, but they need to find a way to limit people from cramming into supermarkets and places like B&M, Home Bargains, etc like the plague of locusts they are.

Yes but again - what is essential? Who decides what is essential? If you're telling me that an actual adult with some sort of qualification will do it and mandate it then that might be something to consider but I just don't think having teenage shelf stackers try to figure out what to yell at customers for is a sustainable situation.

To be brutally honest here - Home Bargains/B&M etc are just not essential retail and should be shut if non-essential retail is shut. Yes, they sell some food, but it's abundantly clear that no one goes to B&M *just* to get their food shopping... they go for other things/for a browse and might pick up some food on the way round if it's a good offer. No one "needs" to go to Home Bargains for their essentials when there's inevitably a Lidl right next to it.

So the simpler rule, really, would be to say that if a store's PRIMARY FINCTION is not the sale of food/essential items, it shouldn't be opening at all, instead of opening with 80% of the shop closed off.

[DouglasS]

Originally Posted by Dezzy

Such things have to be mandated at this point, it can't go on like this and if we return to the whole staff on the door approach then we open them up to more abuse from a moronic public that can't sit on their arse at home when they are told.

Limit shop hours, limit the days that supermarkets can be open, limit the stock they sell to only essentials. The public have abused the shops and their workers throughout this entire pandemic and enough is enough.

If the hedge cases you brought up suffer for it, they can blame the morons who treat going shopping during a pandemic as a day out. Keep smaller shops open to handle the every day stuff, but they need to find a way to limit people from cramming into supermarkets and places like B&M, Home Bargains, etc like the plague of locusts they are.

You do realise limiting shop hours/closing supermarkets on certain days means the same number of people will be required to go to the shop but in a smaller amount of a Window, resulting in larger crowds and more people per a trip... the logic makes zero sense. Are you spreading a message to spread the virus further?

This is a perfect example of the public or Facebook comments do not always know best.. some ideas are seriously dangerous, it’s not as easy as people think making all of these decisions..

[Nicky91]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

Yes but again - what is essential? Who decides what is essential? If you're telling me that an actual adult with some sort of qualification will do it and mandate it then that might be something to consider but I just don't think having teenage shelf stackers try to figure out what to yell at customers for is a sustainable situation.

To be brutally honest here - Home Bargains/B&M etc are just not essential retail and should be shut if non-essential retail is shut. Yes, they sell some food, but it's abundantly clear that no one goes to B&M *just* to get their food shopping... they go for other things/for a browse and might pick up some food on the way round if it's a good offer. No one "needs" to go to Home Bargains for their essentials when there's inevitably a Lidl right next to it.

So the simpler rule, really, would be to say that if a store's PRIMARY FINCTION is not the sale of food/essential items, it shouldn't be opening at all, instead of opening with 80% of the shop closed off.

some of our clothing stores also sell food (which makes their owners think they are ''essential'')

not that they remained open though, basically just supermarkets which remain open here and everywhere of course but then again you can't close those

other stores here make good usage of their online store section, with the corona regulations on each of the stores their sites

[arista]

ITV1HD has it at 8PM
BBC1HD 8PM
SkyNewsHD 8pm
Ch4HDnews 8PM
LBC Radio.
Radio5

[Tom4784]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

Yes but again - what is essential? Who decides what is essential? If you're telling me that an actual adult with some sort of qualification will do it and mandate it then that might be something to consider but I just don't think having teenage shelf stackers try to figure out what to yell at customers for is a sustainable situation.

To be brutally honest here - Home Bargains/B&M etc are just not essential retail and should be shut if non-essential retail is shut. Yes, they sell some food, but it's abundantly clear that no one goes to B&M *just* to get their food shopping... they go for other things/for a browse and might pick up some food on the way round if it's a good offer. No one "needs" to go to Home Bargains for their essentials when there's inevitable a Lidl right next to it.

So the simpler rule, really, would be to say that if a store's PRIMARY FINCTION is not the sale of food/essential items, it shouldn't be opening at all, instead of opening with 80% of the shop closed off.

The distinction of what makes a shop essential is just too broad.

Do you sell cleaning products? Pet stuff? Any kind of food, medicine or hygienic stuff? DIY tools for repairs? You're essential regardless.

I could easily dictate what is and what isn't essential, let's take the B&M/Home Bargains type places as an example. First off, rope off the majority of the home living sections, leaving only the basics such as lights, candles, blankets etc. Secondly, write off most of the stationary section, and only offer essentials such as pens, basic notepads, and potentially common computer items and such.

When it comes to DIY, paint and wallpaper should not be sold, decorating is not essential and if people want to decorate in a lockdown, they should buy that **** online. Most other typical DIY items would be considered essential. When it comes to the garden stuff, anything decorative should be prohibited and sales in stores should be restricted to stuff like produce seeds. Toys should be locked off.

Rope off those kind of things and you'll get a lot less people coming in for bull****. Honestly, these types of shops really need to be limited in opening hours and times though. People use these places as an excuse to browse more than anything else.

I would honestly be here for shops not opening if their core function isn't essential, but it'll never happen, the best thing we can do is give morons a reason not to flood these places by roping off the non-essentials.

[Lee.]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

Oh FFS I was about to head out . The border closures were at least a decent reason to be a little prepared (though I must admit they were resolved pretty quickle ) but lockdown was never a reason to panic buy... and not only that... but we now know FROM EXPERIENCE that they're not a reason to panic buy. Why do people think lockdown will be a problem for supply now when it wasn't last year?

Please tell me they're not all buying up toilet roll again...

I believe they are

[Toy Soldier]

Originally Posted by DouglasS

You do realise limiting shop hours/closing supermarkets on certain days means the same number of people will be required to go to the shop but in a smaller amount of a Window, resulting in larger crowds and more people per a trip... the logic makes zero sense. Are you spreading a message to spread the virus further?

This is a perfect example of the public or Facebook comments do not always know best.. some ideas are seriously dangerous, it’s not as easy as people think making all of these decisions..

Have to agree with that - limiting store opening times is only going to condense the customers into closer contact which is really the last thing you want. If anything, supermarkets should operate LONGER opening hours and messaging should be put out to encourage "night owls" to shop at night when it's quieter.

Years ago I used to regularly do the weekly shop after my shift on a Saturday (so at around 10.30/11pm) and I loved it, very few people in, a nice, socially distanced, peaceful experience. Then they started closing at 10pm and I had to do my shopping in the day time like some sort of animal .