[lostalex]

Originally Posted by Ammi

..there is no coming back from shoot to kill if it's implemented, no margin of human error and it's a human who is holding the gun..if someone is innocent of a crime, then they are dead ..if someone is guilty of a crime, then their sentence of death has been decided out of any law/justice system...

how many innocent people are actually killed by cops though?

even in this whole silly #blacklivesmatter thing, all of the black epople killed by cops were doing something wrong.

people who aren't doing anything wrong don't get killed by cops.

I haven't seen any recent examples of a completely innocent person getting killed by a cop...

[Ammi]

...even in cases of guilt though/of committing a crime..would that crime bring a death sentence ...what's the point of innocent until proven guilty and a justice system if police are given the power to shoot to kill in any situation...

[lostalex]

Originally Posted by Ammi

...even in cases of guilt though/of committing a crime..would that crime bring a death sentence ...what's the point of innocent until proven guilty and a justice system if police are given the power to shoot to kill in any situation...

when the criminal reacts violently/unpredictably, yes, the cops lives matter more, because they are actually innocent. don't you agree?

[Ammi]

Originally Posted by lostalex

when the criminal reacts violently/unpredictably, yes, the cops lives matter more, because they are actually innocent. don't you agree?

...hmmm, no I don't think that I do agree Alex because in a split second of someone's life being taken...'unpredictably' would in many cases not be clearly enough defined but at the most, just be perceived as being 'imminent danger' ....maybe in some cases correct, but in others...no...yet regardless, both situations would have the same death sentence...

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by lostalex

how many innocent people are actually killed by cops though?

even in this whole silly #blacklivesmatter thing, all of the black epople killed by cops were doing something wrong.

people who aren't doing anything wrong don't get killed by cops.

I haven't seen any recent examples of a completely innocent person getting killed by a cop...

Then where is the justice... The police aren't there to be judge, jury and executioner are they?

[Tom4784]

Defending the police and acting like they can do no wrong and victim blaming is foolish. Nothing will ever change if you bury your head in the sand.

[bots]

In the UK we just don't have a problem with gun crime like they have in the USA. If for example, a suspect puts his hand in his pocket here, its pretty unlikely he is going to bring out a gun, in the USA, its probably a high chance. There is therefore little justification for having a blanket shoot to kill policy here even with a current threat from terrorists.

We have to examine the number of interactions the police have on a daily basis with "normal" suspects against those with gun holding terrorists. That provides the perspective and sets the norms.

[DemolitionRed]

Originally Posted by lostalex

how many innocent people are actually killed by cops though?

even in this whole silly #blacklivesmatter thing, all of the black epople killed by cops were doing something wrong.

people who aren't doing anything wrong don't get killed by cops.

I haven't seen any recent examples of a completely innocent person getting killed by a cop...

You mean in the UK?

If we do have a shoot to kill policy it should only be used against an armed and dangerous criminal, not someone who has done wrong but is no danger to the police or the public; otherwise we just end up with another version of gun-ho America.

In America there are plenty of people who get shot and killed by cops. Whilst most of them are doing something wrong, many of them are shop lifters, car thief's or even just a speeding violation. http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/s...olice-killings and here is the list of unarmed people killed across America this year http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/n...s-us-database#

[Marsh.]

Originally Posted by lostalex

but it gives the criminals another advantage, doesn't it?

Maybe in America where guns are handed out with the morning papers.

[lostalex]

Originally Posted by Marsh.

Maybe in America where guns are handed out with the morning papers.

Ive lived in America for 33 years, and the only people i've ever met that had guns were people that lived on large farms and killed geese and deer for meat.

[DemolitionRed]

It depends what part of America. We lived in Louisiana for a year and in the first week of arriving it was suggested we go to a gun fair and buy ourselves a weapon. We didn't even need a permit to buy a semi automatic weapon.

We didn't buy one but everyone we knew carried handguns and in the year we were there, there was a shooting incident in the papers every week.

[Mystic Mock]

I believe only in very serious cases like The Police Officers life was in danger if he/she didn't take the shot, or a Civilian was about to get killed and the only form of action that could be taken was to shoot the crook dead.

[kirklancaster]

In Alex's defence - No amount of legislation will prevent those criminal elements who form the very class of people such legislation would be targeted at (no pun intended) from possessing guns, because they have no regard for 'Law and Order' and would STILL have their guns.

We have laws prohibiting all manner of things - from speeding and driving without license, tax and insurance, to the actual unlawful possession of firearms - yet every day someone somewhere commits these very offences.

Laws only keep those citizens lawful who would be lawful anyway without the laws. They DO NOT and never will dissaude the unlawful from being so.

There ARE rogue cops in America, just as there are in any police force anywhere in the world, but if US police WERE disarmed, you would witness the biggest escalation in ALL crime there - specifically 'gun crime' - along with the greatest escalation in cop deaths in history.

This country is becoming more violent and gun crime more frequent and in a few years when we have caught the US up - as we ALWAYS do - then you will SEE our cops fully armed to combat this rise -- and rightfully so.

[DemolitionRed]

Actually I've got nothing against our police force carrying guns. They do so in most of Europe so why not here? Carrying a gun though shouldn't give them the right to shoot to kill, except in exceptional circumstances.

I firmly believe that our armed forces are the best in the world, regardless of their armoury being hand me downs. The training they get is second to none and perhaps their dedicated willingness to work as a team, which they are so renowned for, is a Brit thing. If our police forces are trained to be as tactical as our armies, then a shoot to kill policy would only be used in extreme circumstances.