[the truth]

theyre maximum working hours are being reduced from 91 to 72 hours, theyre being more overworked on the old contract? their argument makes no sense

[Kizzy]

How is it possible to work less hrs over 7 days with the same staff and resources?

[the truth]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

How is it possible to work less hrs over 7 days with the same staff and resources?

are you serious? because now only a small percentage of junior doctors actually currently work weekends under the new contract 100% will work some weekends

this contracts spreads the workload more evenly this is how rota systems work in every other sector in the world apart from the nhs

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by the truth

are you serious? because now only a small percentage of junior doctors actually currently work weekends under the new contract 100% will work some weekends

this contracts spreads the workload more evenly this is how rota systems work in every other sector in the world apart from the nhs

So the line has changed from 'greedy drs want overtime for weekends' to 'hardly any drs work weekends'?

[the truth]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

So the line has changed from 'greedy drs want overtime for weekends' to 'hardly any drs work weekends'?

I never said the former or the latter, the fact is a majority of junior doctors do NOT work weekends and 90% of gps do NOT work weekends, I suggest you direct your anger at this anomaly the next time you or your loved ones do not get scanned or treated as thoughly on the weekends as the weekdays...the results can be catastrophic

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by the truth

I never said the former or the latter, the fact is a majority of junior doctors do NOT work weekends and 90% of gps do NOT work weekends, I suggest you direct your anger at this anomaly the next time you or your loved ones do not get scanned or treated as thoughly on the weekends as the weekdays...the results can be catastrophic

If a department requires drs they are on, if it doesn't they aren't.

[Kazanne]

I found this quite a good read http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-34775980

[Kizzy]

As is this
http://www.theguardian.com/commentis...P=share_btn_tw

[the truth]

THE BMA should be renamed as the doctors union as that is really all it is.

[Kizzy]

The cover is consultants so I'd say people were adequately taken care of.

[joeysteele]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

The cover is consultants so I'd say people were adequately taken care of.

They were indeed and all emergency situations have been dealt with as you say adequately.

Now the put off cases that could wait for over 2 days and more will be dealt with too,none that were in any way current emergencies,

Routine appointments get altered many times even when there are no strikes or disputes going on anyway.

[the truth]

patient groups have warned the accumulation of postponed treatments - nearly 40,000 operations have now been delayed during the whole dispute - is taking its toll and causing harm. Alongside routine treatments, there have been reports of cancer patients facing delays.

[the truth]

40,000 cancelled operations what an absolute disgrace

[waterhog]

Originally Posted by the truth

40,000 cancelled operations what an absolute disgrace

if the government keep dictating to the doctors - it wont be long before there are no appointments. so 40 000 cancelled is nothing compared to what we could loose if we don't make a stand.

show back bone - do you really think our doctors want to hurt us - they entered into a care profession to care .


I am truly sick of this debate now - have to switch off - ohhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh nurse - medication time - I want to go to bed.

[the truth]

Originally Posted by waterhog

if the government keep dictating to the doctors - it wont be long before there are no appointments. so 40 000 cancelled is nothing compared to what we could loose if we don't make a stand.

show back bone - do you really think our doctors want to hurt us - they entered into a care profession to care .


I am truly sick of this debate now - have to switch off - ohhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh nurse - medication time - I want to go to bed.

Its the wrong backbone. the labour party need to fight to overturn their own insane gp contract in 2004 that allowed 90% of gp's to NOT work at all out of hours. This is a massive part of the problem we now have. to fill that 90% is impossible , labour tried the absurd nhs hotline which was a failure and they pushed junior doctors to 91 hours a week maximum. the tories at least reduce that maximum to 72 hours. patients deserve a decent nhs over weekends and scans that can save lives. deaths increase by 10% on saturday and 15% more on sundays, thats a fact regardless how much people hate hunt. labour are as usuall missing the bigger picture, they are so blinded by tory hate and the politics of envy. they must fight to destroy that 2004 contract. ps 40,000 is a vast amount of operations and a hell of a lot of innocent peoples lives ruined by the immoral disgraceful antics of junior doctors who are ill advised and deeply immoral

[joeysteele]

Originally Posted by waterhog

if the government keep dictating to the doctors - it wont be long before there are no appointments. so 40 000 cancelled is nothing compared to what we could loose if we don't make a stand.

show back bone - do you really think our doctors want to hurt us - they entered into a care profession to care .


I am truly sick of this debate now - have to switch off - ohhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh nurse - medication time - I want to go to bed.

Absolutely waterhog.
If they really do end up forcing this contract on the Junior Doctors, they are firstly likely to have Consultants up in arms, and then a good number of the Doctors they will need leaving the NHS here completely.
As in fact that process has started now anyway.

[DemolitionRed]

Originally Posted by waterhog

if the government keep dictating to the doctors - it wont be long before there are no appointments. so 40 000 cancelled is nothing compared to what we could loose if we don't make a stand.

show back bone - do you really think our doctors want to hurt us - they entered into a care profession to care .


I am truly sick of this debate now - have to switch off - ohhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh nurse - medication time - I want to go to bed.

If anyone is put at risk, it's not because of the doctors striking to protect their rights and everybody's safety, it's because of the twats who pushed them in a corner.

The doctors can't afford to lose this battle. If the government win against the doctors, no NHS employee is safe, not the nurses, the midwives, the radiologists, the cleaners, the receptionists, NOBODY. The NHS and the government can't be allowed to get away with it.

Well, that's how I see it.

[the truth]

if we stay in the eu that means the nhs cannot recruit doctors and nurses outside the eu and also means corporations will have easier access to take over and privatise the nhs
so your arguments on europe and nhs dont make sense. you fail to see they are directly connected. you must see the bigger picture

[waterhog]

demred - you say that with such conviction.

[DemolitionRed]

To suggest junior doctors are being greedy either means we lack full understanding of what our government is proposing or we think everyone should just tow the party line regardless of how heinous it is

The only reason this new contract is happening is because all these ‘Trusts’ are having a tough time paying their ‘now’ private owners. As the government moves further and further away from funding the health care system, we will see bigger staff shortages, reduced salaries and more and more professional burnout. Greed is the bogeyman Hunt is using to justify what the Conservative government are trying to do and whilst some people are buying it, the majority of us have woken up to the NHS system being demoralized, defunded and destroyed.

[waterhog]

Originally Posted by DemolitionRed

To suggest junior doctors are being greedy either means we lack full understanding of what our government is proposing or we think everyone should just tow the party line regardless of how heinous it is

The only reason this new contract is happening is because all these ‘Trusts’ are having a tough time paying their ‘now’ private owners. As the government moves further and further away from funding the health care system, we will see bigger staff shortages, reduced salaries and more and more professional burnout. Greed is the bogeyman Hunt is using to justify what the Conservative government are trying to do and whilst some people are buying it, the majority of us have woken up to the NHS system being demoralized, defunded and destroyed.

our NHS is the envy of the world - proud to have it and so proud of everyone who contributes to it. you are all fantastic.

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by DemolitionRed

To suggest junior doctors are being greedy either means we lack full understanding of what our government is proposing or we think everyone should just tow the party line regardless of how heinous it is

The only reason this new contract is happening is because all these ‘Trusts’ are having a tough time paying their ‘now’ private owners. As the government moves further and further away from funding the health care system, we will see bigger staff shortages, reduced salaries and more and more professional burnout. Greed is the bogeyman Hunt is using to justify what the Conservative government are trying to do and whilst some people are buying it, the majority of us have woken up to the NHS system being demoralized, defunded and destroyed.

[DemolitionRed]

We went out with some friends last night and one of them, a doctor, said... "I'm not a gynaecologist but I know what a ***** looks like".

How is the 7 day NHS system going to be funded?

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