[Thotmas]

Originally Posted by lewis111

Even if those stats are right, it still confirms police kill innocent unarmed people even if it is rarely

It's not rare enough and should never happen especially in a case like this where he was clearly unarmed and was lying on the ground

People are just filled with Racism it's disgusting.

Yes and yes to Jack.

[Yuki Maru Hoshi]

This is what I read from Miami local news yesterday...

http://www.miamiherald.com/news/loca...e90905442.html

When a 23-year-old autistic man carrying a toy truck wandered from a mental health center out into the street Monday, a worker there named Charles Kinsey went to retrieve him.

A few minutes later the autistic man was still sitting cross-legged blocking the roadway while playing with the small, rectangular white toy. And Kinsey was prone on the ground next to him — a bullet from an assault rifle fired by a police officer having struck his leg.

“He throws his hands up in the air and says, ‘Don’t shoot me.’ They say lie on the ground, so he does,” Kinsey’s attorney Hilton Napoleon said Wednesday. “He’s on his back with his hands in the air trying to convince the other guy to lie down. It doesn’t make any sense.”
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Cellphone video footage obtained by Napoleon clearly shows the heavy-set autistic man sitting and playing with his toy while Kinsey, dressed in a yellow shirt and shorts, obeys police orders to lie down on his back.

The video, taken before the officer fired his weapon, shows Kinsey on his back with his hands in the air telling police he didn’t have a weapon and asking them not to fire. At one point the autistic man appears to yell at Kinsey to shut up. A second brief video shows officers who are carrying rifles physically patting down Kinsey and the autistic man while they are lying on the ground.
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In an interview with WSVN-Channel 7, Kinsey said that after he was shot, officers approached and flipped him over and handcuffed him.

“Sir, there’s no need for firearms,” Kinsey told the news station he said to police before he was shot. “It was so surprising. It was like a mosquito bite.”
NW Miami-Dade man killed by police after he reaches for weapon, cops say

Kinsey said when he asked the officer why he fired his weapon, the cop responded, “I don’t know.”

By Wednesday, North Miami police hadn’t offered much of an explanation. Assistant Police Chief Neal Cuevas said the investigation has been turned over to the Miami-Dade State Attorney’s Office.

Cuevas said officers received a 911 call indicating a man was in the street with a gun threatening to kill himself. They responded to Northeast 127th Street and about 14th Avenue and began barking orders. When the autistic man didn’t comply, an officer fired three times, striking Kinsey once in the leg. He was transported to Jackson Memorial Hospital.
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Cuevas said he didn’t know who the officer was aiming at when he struck Kinsey. The offier’s name hasn’t been released.

In a prepared statement, North Miami police spokeswoman Natalie Buissereth said “arriving officers attempted to negotiate with the two men on the scene, one of whom was later identified as suffering from autism... At some point during the on-scene negotiation, one of the responding officers discharged his weapon.”

Police still hadn’t released any paperwork or the incident report of the shooting by Wednesday. There is no indication that a weapon of any kind was found. The officer who fired his weapon has been placed on administrative leave, as is standard, for at least a week.
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Kinsey, 47, who’s worked at MacTown Panther Group Homes for a little over a year, wasn’t badly injured and is expected to be home by Thursday.

By Wednesday, Napoleon said he was already negotiating a possible settlement with the city of North Miami.

“They realize this was something inappropriate regarding the shooting,” he said. “If police departments come out more and admit fault, that would probably go a long way,” toward improving relations with the public, he said.

The incident highlights how explosive a situation can get when cops already on edge are forced to confront someone with autism or a mental disability.

In dealing with the mentally ill, experts say, those dangers only multiply.

“I was more worried about him than myself,” Kinsey told Channel 7 of the autistic man, whose name hasn’t been released.

Said his wife Joyce Kinsey: “I’m just grateful he’s alive and able to tell his story.”

[Yuki Maru Hoshi]

Several 911 calls were made about a man with a gun, one saying he was suicidal.

Look at it this way... he's in front of a assisted care facility and a man is seen trying to "coax" or "talk" to the troubled and likely agitated resident. If they had been told about the 911 calls (likely) and they see the supposed "gunman" yelling back to the other man or otherwise appearing overly agitated with a weapon, then fitting 911 caller's description, the police then may think they also have cause to think it is a potential aggravated man with a gun with a possible suicide in progress...

Supposedly the cop was firing at the man on the ground and that would make sense seeing as the staff member was hit in the leg. Of course sometimes they do aim for the leg... wouldn't make sense in this case if they weren't trying to shoot the other guy because he was right there also

If only they had full video of this... could show this to a class because I think it's a good example of how appearances can be very deceiving even when you think you have all the correct information.

[user104658]

Originally Posted by Maru

Several 911 calls were made about a man with a gun, one saying he was suicidal.

Look at it this way... he's in front of a assisted care facility and a man is seen trying to "coax" or "talk" to the troubled and likely agitated resident. If they had been told about the 911 calls (likely) and they see the supposed "gunman" yelling back to the other man or otherwise appearing overly agitated with a weapon, then fitting 911 caller's description, the police then may think they also have cause to think it is a potential aggravated man with a gun with a possible suicide in progress...

Supposedly the cop was firing at the man on the ground and that would make sense seeing as the staff member was hit in the leg. Of course sometimes they do aim for the leg... wouldn't make sense in this case if they weren't trying to shoot the other guy because he was right there also

If only they had full video of this... could show this to a class because I think it's a good example of how appearances can be very deceiving even when you think you have all the correct information.

Again, what you're saying is this is all OK if it's true that he was aiming at the other man. A distressed, confused and scared autistic person. That's who he was aiming at? In my opinion that only makes his actions worse.

[Ammi]

Originally Posted by Maru

Several 911 calls were made about a man with a gun, one saying he was suicidal.

Look at it this way... he's in front of a assisted care facility and a man is seen trying to "coax" or "talk" to the troubled and likely agitated resident. If they had been told about the 911 calls (likely) and they see the supposed "gunman" yelling back to the other man or otherwise appearing overly agitated with a weapon, then fitting 911 caller's description, the police then may think they also have cause to think it is a potential aggravated man with a gun with a possible suicide in progress...

Supposedly the cop was firing at the man on the ground and that would make sense seeing as the staff member was hit in the leg. Of course sometimes they do aim for the leg... wouldn't make sense in this case if they weren't trying to shoot the other guy because he was right there also

If only they had full video of this... could show this to a class because I think it's a good example of how appearances can be very deceiving even when you think you have all the correct information.

..yeah that was my initial thought as well, Maru...(it's so annoying because the actual shot isn't in the vid and that seems quite odd..?..)...but maybe his hand with the toy truck was fleetingly in front of Charles Kinsey's leg and it was to try to shoot the gun out of his hand to remove the danger and the threat, which the officers couldn't be certain of ...this is almost like one of the situations that Mr Maru posted of a 'training scenario', isn't it ..which have made me think a lot so I'm really reluctant to try to judge it from media releases ...the thing that really concerns me though..(if true..)...is that when Charles asked the officer why he fired his weapon..?...he said that he didn't know and that should never ever be an acceptable answer...even if calls are made incorrectly and they must inevitably be sometimes..an officer should always be able to reply to 'why..?..'....hmmmm....

[Yuki Maru Hoshi]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

Again, what you're saying is this is all OK if it's true that he was aiming at the other man. A distressed, confused and scared autistic person. That's who he was aiming at? In my opinion that only makes his actions worse.

Never said anything was OK.

Originally Posted by Ammi

..yeah that was my initial thought as well, Maru...(it's so annoying because the actual shot isn't in the vid and that seems quite odd..?..)...but maybe his hand with the toy truck was fleetingly in front of Charles Kinsey's leg and it was to try to shoot the gun out of his hand to remove the danger and the threat, which the officers couldn't be certain of ...this is almost like one of the situations that Mr Maru posted of a 'training scenario', isn't it ..which have made me think a lot so I'm really reluctant to try to judge it from media releases ...the thing that really concerns me though..(if true..)...is that when Charles asked the officer why he fired his weapon..?...he said that he didn't know and that should never ever be an acceptable answer...even if calls are made incorrectly and they must inevitably be sometimes..an officer should always be able to reply to 'why..?..'....hmmmm....

I don't really know what to suggest should change with regards to training except maybe to show the situations where false information can make a situation seem something it is not. Clearly they can't just go by 911 calls for all their information. An eyewitness account (someone on scene) might be a better solution, but even then you open yourself up to risk...

Ultimately though there's really no way to completely remove human error.

It might've been a good idea though for the facility to have called 911 at the time that he got out (and maybe they did for all we know ) to let them know a patient escaped and voluntarily give out information that he is unarmed. I would even suggest it should be a high priority call for law enforcement to answer the calls because the sooner they are back in a facility, the less they are a harm to themselves and the public.

Maybe at that point when more agencies have adopted units trained in mental health issues, those calls can be hopefully be answered by those specific units instead of regular officers.

[Tom4784]

Another indefensible act of violence from an incompetent officer that shouldn't be allowed a stapler without supervision never mind a gun.

I look forward to see how racists try to spin this into being the victim's fault.