[arista]

Originally Posted by DemolitionRed

Avoid who?

A Charity that is taking
a corrupt amount for Admin,


Thats who DR.
http://www.thisisbigbrother.com/foru...d.php?t=316713

[Cherie]

Originally Posted by DemolitionRed

Most employers will not use charity work for a CV and so in many cases, it won't be accepted as experience.

Totally disagree, it depends where you place yourself, I've seen a number of volunteers at my workplace end up getting employed, as long as you place yourself in the area you want to work in, get a qualification while volunteering or if you already have one, when a job comes up you have your foot in the door, management are more likely to employ you over an unknown, this doesn't work for every sector but it can't be dismissed across the board. Doing unpaid volunteering can be a stepping stone, as long as you aren't volunteering 5 days a week 9 to 5 and there is an end goal it can be a useful way of getting employed

[DemolitionRed]

Originally Posted by Cherie

Totally disagree, it depends where you place yourself, I've seen a number of volunteers at my workplace end up getting employed, as long as you place yourself in the area you want to work in, get a qualification while volunteering or if you already have one, when a job comes up you have your foot in the door, management are more likely to employ you over an unknown, this doesn't work for every sector but it can't be dismissed across the board. Doing unpaid volunteering can be a stepping stone, as long as you aren't volunteering 5 days a week 9 to 5 and there is an end goal it can be a useful way of getting employed

If you get a qualification that's a whole other thing. If you prove yourself as a volunteer and that company is genuinely looking to take on a paid member of staff, then a preferred method of in house recruitment is going to probably swing in your favour.

I work for a very large nationwide company and we never accept references for voluntary work, even if that voluntary work was about getting work experience for the position they are applying for. I've never really understood why but I know its not unusual.

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by Cherie

Totally disagree, it depends where you place yourself, I've seen a number of volunteers at my workplace end up getting employed, as long as you place yourself in the area you want to work in, get a qualification while volunteering or if you already have one, when a job comes up you have your foot in the door, management are more likely to employ you over an unknown, this doesn't work for every sector but it can't be dismissed across the board. Doing unpaid volunteering can be a stepping stone, as long as you aren't volunteering 5 days a week 9 to 5 and there is an end goal it can be a useful way of getting employed

DR specifically said charity work not volunteering, there is a difference.
Charity work is not SMART, whereas unpaid internships, NVQ placements that sort of thing are.

[Cherie]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

DR specifically said charity work not volunteering, there is a difference.
Charity work is not SMART, whereas unpaid internships, NVQ placements that sort of thing are.

any kind of voluteering is charity work isn't it? all I am saying is that if people used their brain and placed themselves in an a role where they could see themselves eventually getting a job it unpaid work can pay off, so all unpaid work is not a good or a bad thing, as with everything there are varying shades of grey, not sure why you need the need to speak for DR we had already covered this all by ourselves Mum

[Beso]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

DR specifically said charity work not volunteering, there is a difference.
Charity work is not SMART, whereas unpaid internships, NVQ placements that sort of thing are.

Stick to what you have said not what dr has said.

[user104658]

If it's something that simply isn't going to get done otherwise and it is truly VOLUNTARY (forcing people into unpaid work with coercion and threats is not voluntary) then it's totally up to the individual. For example, a local mum here volunteers as a classroom / playground assistant at the primary school because she enjoys it, and it's been a godsend for them. The funding isn't there for someone to do it paid so it's not an issue of there being a paid position taken away.

If it's "you must volunteer or else" from the DWP, or having people work for free on things that should clearly be paid (like road maintenance ffs) then I am entirely against it.

And as mentioned before, I am against using cheap apprenticeships with meaningless qualifications in place of real minimum wage jobs. It's literally nothing more than an excuse to hire young people for less than minimum wage, and makes a mockery of the concepts of both minimum wage AND real apprenticeships with real qualifications at the end.

[arista]

"It's literally nothing more than an excuse to hire young people for less than minimum wage, and makes....."


TS there is nothing wrong with that
no young folks are harmed in any way.


TS Feel The Force

[smudgie]

The article is a load of tosh, I thought it was showing you the actual people doing the actual job, not the politics show discussing it.
The man shown actually doing the volunteer work was neither looking for payment or employment. He was happy to have something to do with his time whilst helping his community at the same time.
The council paid for all the gear he needed so he wasn't out of pocket.
Is this really any different to volunteers working in libraries to stop them shutting down, or people going into school to help out with reading etc..it's called community spirit, something to be praised not used as political propaganda.

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by smudgie

The article is a load of tosh, I thought it was showing you the actual people doing the actual job, not the politics show discussing it.
The man shown actually doing the volunteer work was neither looking for payment or employment. He was happy to have something to do with his time whilst helping his community at the same time.
The council paid for all the gear he needed so he wasn't out of pocket.
Is this really any different to volunteers working in libraries to stop them shutting down, or people going into school to help out with reading etc..it's called community spirit, something to be praised not used as political propaganda.

It does show the guy doing it, he was happy to do it he wouldn't have offered otherwise, although that's not strictly the point.
You can't effectively close down a road like you can a library too.
This is what I'm trying to put across if they are relying on volunteers to do community based work then how is anyone in the community going to earn a living? :/

[smudgie]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

It does show the guy doing it, he was happy to do it he wouldn't have offered otherwise, although that's not strictly the point.
You can't effectively close down a road like you can a library too.
This is what I'm trying to put across if they are relying on volunteers to do community based work then how is anyone in the community going to earn a living? :/

Nobody has lost their job, the wage earners are doing the bigger jobs, the community volunteers are taking the pressure off their workload in this case.
They are only filling in the piddly ones, big enough to annoy motorists and cyclists but not top of the list for major works. Win win I reckon.
As long as it is 100% volunteer work and no pressure on people to do it then I am all for it.

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by smudgie

Nobody has lost their job, the wage earners are doing the bigger jobs, the community volunteers are taking the pressure off their workload in this case.
They are only filling in the piddly ones, big enough to annoy motorists and cyclists but not top of the list for major works. Win win I reckon.
As long as it is 100% volunteer work and no pressure on people to do it then I am all for it.

I didn't say anyone had lost their job, piddly little roads are paid for just as much as major roads, it's unfair for semi rural areas to rely on volunteers and their road maintenance budget be used elsewhere.
Social care is being scapegoated and used as an emotional lever to suggest they need the budget that is wrong, they are playing on the good nature of communities while siphoning off funding and corroding earning potential at the same time.

[Brillopad]

Anyone that chooses to do unpaid work, effectively charity work, are free to do so. Admirable for those doing it purely through choice.

I also feel that those on benefits should be expected to do 'unpaid' work in return for their benefits. It should be a condition of claiming benefit.

[ebandit]

Originally Posted by Brillopad

I also feel that those on benefits should be expected to do 'unpaid' work in return for their benefits. It should be a condition of claiming benefit.

ok but surely? min wage per hr worked should still apply..............

Mark L

[Tom4784]

Originally Posted by Brillopad

Anyone that chooses to do unpaid work, effectively charity work, are free to do so. Admirable for those doing it purely through choice.

I also feel that those on benefits should be expected to do 'unpaid' work in return for their benefits. It should be a condition of claiming benefit.

I disagree with this. To claim any kind of unemployment benefit you have to provide 35 hours worth of jobsearch a week so where would you fit a 'voluntary' position? Unless you are suggesting that unemployed people should work longer hours than full time employers for a pittance?

Unpaid work should be a choice, not something forced on the unemployed when it won't benefit anyone but the companies using them for free labour.

[Beso]

Imagine having to get up in the morning to do an unpaid job to get your benefits for not having a job..

[Tom4784]

Originally Posted by parmnion

Imagine having to get up in the morning to do an unpaid job to get your benefits for not having a job..

Silly, isn't it?

If it was a position that would result in a job then I could understand but I don't understand why we should force the unemployed to work for their benefits in a position that likely won't lead to a job or teach any marketable skills. If they are expected to work than their unemployment benefits should match that of the wage they'd be paid if their unpaid work was an actual job. Employing someone to only pay them the amount they'd receive on benefits would be considered illegal because it's nowhere near being close to minimum wage.

[Cherie]

If people want to give something back the community, maybe look after their elderly neighbours, and look out for them or volunteer at your local hospital shop or radio or something that isn't taking a job that someone would get paid for and for which we pay our taxes away, filling potholes however small is a job for the highways agency, why do we pay road tax if some volunteer is going to do it, same with cutting grass verges etc,

[Brillopad]

Originally Posted by Dezzy

I disagree with this. To claim any kind of unemployment benefit you have to provide 35 hours worth of jobsearch a week so where would you fit a 'voluntary' position? Unless you are suggesting that unemployed people should work longer hours than full time employers for a pittance?

Unpaid work should be a choice, not something forced on the unemployed when it won't benefit anyone but the companies using them for free labour.

In which case their job search should be reduced depending on how many hours they work.

[Tom4784]

Originally Posted by Brillopad

In which case their job search should be reduced depending on how many hours they work.

So you want them to spend less time actually looking for a job so that they can work an unpaid job that ultimately won't benefit them in the long run?

[Brillopad]

Originally Posted by Dezzy

So you want them to spend less time actually looking for a job so that they can work an unpaid job that ultimately won't benefit them in the long run?

How many actually spend 35 hours on job search anyway. I'm talking more the long-term unemployed - 6 months+ anyway.

It will give them routine ie getting up in the morning and it has to carry some weight with future employers if they can demonstrate reliability and time-keeping. Hopefully it would also make them feel useful and good about contributing.

Don't see why some would be so negative about it.

[user104658]

If able bodied people were to work for minimum wage to earn the amount of their benefits, it would only amount to 9 hours. Yet they want to have people working 30+ hours for it?

[ebandit]

...with much experience of signing on i can add............never at any time was i expected to jobsearch for 35 hrs.............fulfilling my agreement only takes a few
mins a day

when under work programme and doing 'voluntary' work the 30 hr working week includes time for organised jobsearch + jobcentre advisors make allowance accepting
a reduced jobsearch diary

Mark L

[Cherie]

Originally Posted by ebandit

...with much experience of signing on i can add............never at any time was i expected to jobsearch for 35 hrs.............fulfilling my agreement only takes a few
mins a day

when under work programme and doing 'voluntary' work the 30 hr working week includes time for organised jobsearch + jobcentre advisors make allowance accepting
a reduced jobsearch diary

Mark L

Job searching for 35 hours a week did seem a bit of a reach tbf

[Vicky.]

Originally Posted by Cherie

Job searching for 35 hours a week did seem a bit of a reach tbf

As far as I know (this is from what I have been told so may not be entirely accurate) when on universal credit you have to prove you are jobsearching 35 hours a week. I know years back they used to lie and say you had to sign up to the universal jobmatch site and log EVERYTHING you did and if it didn't add up to enough time they could (and did) sanction you off the back of it. Regardless of how many jobs applied for and such. It seemed really silly as...come on...what can you realistically do to search for that long every week when looking on the internet takes seconds and there are next to no jobs anyway. Yes a decent application can take a few hours, but there are not enough positions to spend all day everyday writing cover letters and tailoring your CV.