[Twosugars]

Originally Posted by bitontheslide

We can get all self righteous about someone being attacked on British soil, and it's fair enough to be upset about it, but if you look at any of those that have been targeted, with the exception of Skripal's daughter, they all have blood on their hands. What goes around usually comes around

As a sovereign country we can't allow foreign powers to execute people here as they please. It's a matter of principle. We'd be a laughing stock if we did.

[arista]

Originally Posted by Twosugars

As a sovereign country we can't allow foreign powers to execute people here as they please. It's a matter of principle. We'd be a laughing stock if we did.

Sure
but they will never have 100% Proof
as another nation may have done this
using bought Russian Nerve Gear
or made their own Nerve Gear in another nation,
then the UK would be in the wrong.

[arista]

Russia 'highly likely' to be behind spy poisoning, PM says

https://news.sky.com/story/live-pm-s...eting-11286994

[user104658]

Lol. Literally nothing at all.

[Twosugars]

Originally Posted by arista

Sure
but they will never have 100% Proof
as another nation may have done this
using bought Russian Nerve Gear
or made their own Nerve Gear in another nation,
then the UK would be in the wrong.

The investigation is not over, let's see what they find out.

[arista]

Originally Posted by Twosugars

The investigation is not over, let's see what they find out.

Of course
but be this Weds
the PM has a Conclusion
much the same as she has spoken right now.


Russia is one nation that makes the nerve gear
What about the Others?

[bots]

Originally Posted by arista

Of course
but be this Weds
the PM has a Conclusion
much the same as she has spoken right now.


Russia is one nation that makes the nerve gear
What about the Others?

Nerve agents are highly controlled. This particular variant was Russian state manufactured. That's all we really need to know. It is the Russian states responsibility.

As to what we can do about it, there is nothing we can do that has any meaningful consequence.

[arista]

Originally Posted by bitontheslide

Nerve agents are highly controlled. This particular variant was Russian state manufactured. That's all we really need to know. It is the Russian states responsibility.

As to what we can do about it, there is nothing we can do that has any meaningful consequence.

Yes that was stated days ago.
Of Course ,Russia says they did not do it
So the PM must do something herself,
Expel Russian Diplomats, should be one measure


Will that change anything?

UK Diplomats in Russia will then get kicked out etc

[Twosugars]

She could do something, the question is whether she's up to it.
I mean freezing assets etc

I think it was a mistake not to do more after Litvinienko. Putin felt he could get away with it so he carried on.

[arista]

Originally Posted by Twosugars

She could do something, the question is whether she's up to it.
I mean freezing assets etc

I think it was a mistake not to do more after Litvinienko. Putin felt he could get away with it so he carried on.

That was a New Labour feck Up.

Putin will be Elected again on Sunday
no one can stop him.
Blair got on well with Putin (as shown in the recent BBC2HD Docu on Putin)

[Matthew.]

Originally Posted by Nicky91

Russia is great

right

[arista]

Originally Posted by Nicky91

Russia is great

Sure Nicky
but its not against the Russian Nation


Its a about the the Leader Putin.

[kirklancaster]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

Lol. Literally nothing at all.

Lolling with you because I agree - ZILCH.

[Twosugars]

Originally Posted by arista

That was a New Labour feck Up.

Putin will be Elected again on Sunday
no one can stop him.
Blair got on well with Putin (as shown in the recent BBC2HD Docu on Putin)

Well, of course he will be elected.
UK's (Con and Lab, and the West in general) attitude to Russia is not consistent and Putin takes advantage.

[Twosugars]

Originally Posted by kirklancaster

Lolling with you because I agree - ZILCH.

is it a lolling matter?
so you think we should not do anything?

[jet]

Corbyn has proved he is not fit to be a PM, his forte is always going to be that of a mud slinging backbencher. Thank goodness other Labour members realised the significance of what had happened and showed their disgust at his pathetic opportunistic point scoring speech.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics...t-opportunism/

The Prime Minister had just solemnly updated the Commons about attempted murder on British soil by, in all likelihood, a foreign enemy. But, far from setting aside party differences in the name of unity, the Leader of the Opposition was seizing the opportunity to score points against his political opponents. Indeed, to judge from his manner, he sounded more worked up about his political opponents than he did about the attempted murder.
The disbelieving silence was soon replaced by disbelieving anger……..

......“It would put our national security at risk,” said John Woodcock (Lab, Barrow & Furness), through gritted teeth, “if [Britain] were led by anyone who did not understand the gravity of the threat which Russia poses to the nation.” This earned him a roar of indignant approval.

“There are circumstances in which we take party-political differences of opinion,” sniffed Chris Leslie (Lab, Nottingham East). “But when our country is under attack, that is just not appropriate.” Another angry cheer.

“Does the PM agree,” asked Phil Wilson (Lab, Sedgefield), “that there is no place for honourable members to appear on Russia Today? It is a propaganda mouthpiece for the Russian state.” This prompted a full-throated “hear, hear”. Meanwhile, Mr Corbyn sat with his chin on his hand, silently smouldering.

[Tom4784]

Theresa May vs Putin

Youtube video

[Barry.]

I am worried. Russia could be dangerous.

[user104658]

Originally Posted by Twosugars

is it a lolling matter?
so you think we should not do anything?

The UK is in literally no position to do anything at all about Russia, and certainly not over what I'm sorry to say is (in global terms) a very minor incident.

I can only assume that the idea that the UK can "do something about" Russia stems from the same place as someone's lusicrous suggestion in another thread that Britain is a "global super power"; i.e. A complete misunderstanding of where we sit on the global hierarchy. Like someone forgot to post the memo that Britain WAS powerful at the height of the British empire... But those days are over.

So it's not really a matter of "should" morally, I guess. We CAN'T "do anything about Russia", and we shouldn't try because the attempt would cause nothing but harm.

DEFINITELY not over something that is quite blatantly an internal Russian political issue that happens to have spilled over. Its not like they're attacking the UK.

[Nicky91]

Originally Posted by arista

Sure Nicky
but its not against the Russian Nation


Its a about the the Leader Putin.

yeah Putin, he's like a god so damn hot

[bots]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

The UK is in literally no position to do anything at all about Russia, and certainly not over what I'm sorry to say is (in global terms) a very minor incident.

I can only assume that the idea that the UK can "do something about" Russia stems from the same place as someone's lusicrous suggestion in another thread that Britain is a "global super power"; i.e. A complete misunderstanding of where we sit on the global hierarchy. Like someone forgot to post the memo that Britain WAS powerful at the height of the British empire... But those days are over.

So it's not really a matter of "should" morally, I guess. We CAN'T "do anything about Russia", and we shouldn't try because the attempt would cause nothing but harm.

DEFINITELY not over something that is quite blatantly an internal Russian political issue that happens to have spilled over. Its not like they're attacking the UK.

We can do things like asset freezing, throwing out diplomats, making it more difficult for Russians to enter the UK. We can say ... hey Russia, we are jolly upset about this. Will that stop them doing it again? No. Will it inconvenience them? Maybe a little. That's about it.

The world cup is being hosted in Russia so lets boycott it ..... Politics should never ever interfere with sport. So, it's a big No No. Let's show Russia how upset we are by stopping Prince William attending .... yeah that's really going to cause a seismic shock.

The bottom line is we can implement measures as a face saving exercise, but they will mean squat to anyone.

[user104658]

Originally Posted by bitontheslide

We can do things like asset freezing, throwing out diplomats, making it more difficult for Russians to enter the UK. We can say ... hey Russia, we are jolly upset about this. Will that stop them doing it again? No. Will it inconvenience them? Maybe a little. That's about it.

The world cup is being hosted in Russia so lets boycott it ..... Politics should never ever interfere with sport. So, it's a big No No. Let's show Russia how upset we are by stopping Prince William attending .... yeah that's really going to cause a seismic shock.

The bottom line is we can implement measures as a face saving exercise, but they will mean squat to anyone.

But Russia IS still a super-power and also a huge marketplace... So yeah, we could put sanctions on them, technically... Except that the UK ceasing trade would have an insignificant impact on the Russia economy, would have MORE impact on the UK economy (although to be fair still not very significant) and would basically be kicking the bear for a frankly not very good reason. I mean I know it might seem bad but every country is involved in political assassination, its naive to think otherwise. It would be different if they had assassinated a UK political figure or something but... Basically, this is just internal Russian crap that happened to spill over into a UK city. Obviously the fact that a UK police officer was collateral damage is horrendous, but again, let's not start pretending that all countries aren't guilty of causing significant collateral damage in other nations.

[Kazanne]

Originally Posted by Nicky91

yeah Putin, he's like a god so damn hot

Really Nicky ? He could go in the 'weird crush' thread.

[Northern Monkey]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

But Russia IS still a super-power and also a huge marketplace... So yeah, we could put sanctions on them, technically... Except that the UK ceasing trade would have an insignificant impact on the Russia economy, would have MORE impact on the UK economy (although to be fair still not very significant) and would basically be kicking the bear for a frankly not very good reason. I mean I know it might seem bad but every country is involved in political assassination, its naive to think otherwise. It would be different if they had assassinated a UK political figure or something but... Basically, this is just internal Russian crap that happened to spill over into a UK city. Obviously the fact that a UK police officer was collateral damage is horrendous, but again, let's not start pretending that all countries aren't guilty of causing significant collateral damage in other nations.

I tend to agree.I reckon British,US,Russian and god knows how many other countries secret services have been doing this stuff for years.Only when Russia does it they do it not so covertly.They use nerve agents and radioactive materials which they know will be traced back to them.I think they do it this way to send a message.Just like when they send aircraft and ships over to ping our radar.
The problem with their methods is that they ramp up tensions.They force our PM into a situation where she has to react somehow so we as a country don’t appear weak.It also gets our politicians putting huge pressure on the PM to ‘do something’.Our problem is that there’s not much we can do unilaterally.It has to be a Nato response to have any impactful effect.As you say though it’s not wise to poke the bear too much over something like this I don’t think.The PM is in a tricky situation really.

[Kazanne]

It will be interesting to see if Russia respond to the PMs midnight deadline.