[Shasown]

Originally Posted by MrGaryy

alright no need to speak to me like I'm a ******. I misread, my point still stands.

PMSL there is a comeback to that ..... nah sorry mate didnt mean to imply you were, just some people dont seem to understand there is a difference.

But yeah you are quite right in the point you made, forgiveness and acceptance dont seem to be the focus of many Christians. As far as I can recall Jesus never said its wrong for women to love one another or even for men to do likewise, that was man putting words into the mouth of god.

[Crimson Dynamo]

Originally Posted by Shasown

PMSL there is a comeback to that ..... nah sorry mate didnt mean to imply you were, just some people dont seem to understand there is a difference.

But yeah you are quite right in the point you made, forgiveness and acceptance dont seem to be the focus of many Christians. As far as I can recall Jesus never said its wrong for women to love one another or even for men to do likewise, that was man putting words into the mouth of god.

Christianity is based on the life and character of Jesus not of man

the "that is not a very Christian attitude" guff is so old it may yet make an InOne avatar

[MrGaryy]

Originally Posted by Shasown

PMSL there is a comeback to that ..... nah sorry mate didnt mean to imply you were, just some people dont seem to understand there is a difference.

But yeah you are quite right in the point you made, forgiveness and acceptance dont seem to be the focus of many Christians. As far as I can recall Jesus never said its wrong for women to love one another or even for men to do likewise, that was man putting words into the mouth of god.

haha sorry if I seemed a little brash there :P

I mean I'm not justifying the Christina church's view or actions, but there are some things that will never change, or at least not any time soon so in my opinion they were looking for trouble in the first place. The very fact they went a newspaper with the story and had their photo taken professionally for the story, screams attention-seeking to me.

[iRyan]

There is so much ignorance going on in this thread it's quite sad.

Annoying lesbians trying to make some kind of 'stand' against the Church is really... well annoying.
So I can understand why the Church asked them to leave.

I'm not sure it's 'overtly sexual' but then again as lesbians their hands would be their version of penises. So in that sense it was like they were rubbing their wieners together.

How it's it AT ALL the lesbians fault? All they were doing was holding hands in church, much like any straight couple would. What is so wrong with that? And how the **** is holding hands like having sex for them? That's one of the dumbest things I'd heard in a long time.

And I don't see what the big deal is with the one woman going through a divorce with her husband whilst in a relationship with a woman. The woman was obviously a lesbian but she married a man because she thought she would "grow out of it" or the feelings would go away, just like pretty much all homosexuals do when they marry a straight person. But it didn't and she was unhappy. So she got a divorce and found a woman she loved. What is so wrong with that?

[InOne]

Nothing is wrong with it, but like Gary said, they knew what the church was like and what to expect.

[Crimson Dynamo]

The very fact they ran to the papers, allowed themselves to be pictured tells you all you need know about "the only lezzer in the village" type here

pathetic. another example of people who think that their individual sexual preferences somehow an identity.

a couple of sad women who could do with growing up and taking their responsibilities seriously as well as getting a new wardrobe, some hair advice and a trip to specsavers

[Shasown]

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet

The very fact they ran to the papers, allowed themselves to be pictured tells you all you need know about "the only lezzer in the village" type here

pathetic. another example of people who think that their individual sexual preferences somehow an identity.

a couple of sad women who could do with growing up and taking their responsibilities seriously as well as getting a new wardrobe, some hair advice and a trip to specsavers

Very true but its also an excellent example of Christian Hypocrisy.

[Captain.Remy]

I may be a Christian but that's taken a bit too far. I mean, so what if they love eating each other's mussel ? They still believe in God. Religion needs to move on according to the time it's being applied on. We live in the 21st century, time to cut the bull**** about condoms, abortion and same sex marriage.

By the way, last night I've watched "Lesbo Jumbo Dildo Combo Volume IX". Amazing.

[Wildcat!]

What a ridiculous situation. Anyways, for me, I dont understand if youre a homosexual, why you would want to go to a church anyways, listening to the sermon of someone who obviously thinks you live in sin. The argument that did Jesus say its wrong to be a homosexual, is just stretching it. Some things are just obvious. NOt saying that its wrong, biblical religions dont accept it. The fact that same sex marriages arent allowed is all you need to know, and sex outside of marriage is a sin. So ots obvious what the church's stand on that is.

SO yeah, my point is, I dont understand why you would go to the church. I can understand, people who believe in christianity and are homosexuals, creating their own place of whorship. YOu dont need to go the church to pray, you can do that anywhere you want.

JUst some questions for me by the way. I do think everyone has the right to go to church no matter what, so its their choice. Its also the churchs choice to kick you ut obviously, weather hypocritical or not!

[Shasown]

Originally Posted by Wildcat!

What a ridiculous situation. Anyways, for me, I dont understand if youre a homosexual, why you would want to go to a church anyways, listening to the sermon of someone who obviously thinks you live in sin. The argument that did Jesus say its wrong to be a homosexual, is just stretching it. Some things are just obvious. NOt saying that its wrong, biblical religions dont accept it. The fact that same sex marriages arent allowed is all you need to know, and sex outside of marriage is a sin. So ots obvious what the church's stand on that is.

SO yeah, my point is, I dont understand why you would go to the church. I can understand, people who believe in christianity and are homosexuals, creating their own place of whorship. YOu dont need to go the church to pray, you can do that anywhere you want.

JUst some questions for me by the way. I do think everyone has the right to go to church no matter what, so its their choice. Its also the churchs choice to kick you ut obviously, weather hypocritical or not!

Maybe they believed the congregation whom they had known for years would accept them as a couple, maybe they believed that their sexual beliefs didnt make them sinners. Maybe they wanted to court publicity for themselves by having such a situation kick off.

[Stu]

Originally Posted by Wildcat!

What a ridiculous situation. Anyways, for me, I dont understand if youre a homosexual, why you would want to go to a church anyways, listening to the sermon of someone who obviously thinks you live in sin. The argument that did Jesus say its wrong to be a homosexual, is just stretching it. Some things are just obvious. NOt saying that its wrong, biblical religions dont accept it. The fact that same sex marriages arent allowed is all you need to know, and sex outside of marriage is a sin. So ots obvious what the church's stand on that is.

SO yeah, my point is, I dont understand why you would go to the church. I can understand, people who believe in christianity and are homosexuals, creating their own place of whorship. YOu dont need to go the church to pray, you can do that anywhere you want.

JUst some questions for me by the way. I do think everyone has the right to go to church no matter what, so its their choice. Its also the churchs choice to kick you ut obviously, weather hypocritical or not!

And I think you will find that churches are full of people who have had sex outside marage.

Everyone in the damn church is a sinner. That's part of the idea. None of us are free from sin. So why target out the gays?

[Wildcat!]

And BTW, why wasnt there more such type lesbians in the L word!

[Wildcat!]

I am not looking at it from the POV of the church. In that regard, we all know, they do not accept same sex union. I think its obvious, weather you want to talk about logistics r not, if youre honest with yourself, you know the religion does not condone it.

BUt fair enough if you think its an omission by the church, and a misinterpretation. In that case I think if I was in the situation (ie I am homosexual, but I believe in the teachings of Jesus Christ), then I would whorship in my own way, I wouldnt go to church, unless its a church that accepts my sexuality.

AGAIN, this is just what I would do, and I was just stating my misunderstanding of the people who insist on putting it out there, in the church which obviously dont accept it.

Again, just me!

[Stu]

And all of that church not accepting rubbish relates to people who have had sex before or outside marriage too, who fill pews.

But they are different .

[Wildcat!]

Yeah, just like there are people who have committed all kinds of acts, deemed sin by the church, including stealing lying or whatever else. But its a sin, like any other. The church doesnt say their congregation dont commit sins! Christian believers refer to themselves as sinners, because of course, no one is perfect. The difference is, church goers accept that those are sins according to the bible, and therefore, they go to church, pray, confess and whatnot, to be forgiven their sins. I dont think the homosexual, consider that they are sinning, or goes to church to be forgiven their sins. Which is fair enough.

But that brings me back to my point of, why go to church, if you fundamentally disagree with it in that sense? I think basically, that they have their own religion.

[Stu]

Originally Posted by Wildcat!

Yeah, just like there are people who have committed all kinds of offenses deemed sin by the church, including stealing lying or whatever else. But its a sin, like any other. The church doesnt say their congregation dont commit sins! Christian believers refer to themselves as sinners, because of curse no one is perfect. The difference is, church goers accept that those are sins according t the bible, and therefore, they go to church, pray, confess and whatnot, to be forgiven their sins. I dont think the homosexual, consider that they are sinning, or goes to church to be forgiven their sins. Which is fair enough.

But that brings me back to my point of, why go to church, if you fundamentally disagree with it in that sense?

Exactly. So the Lesbian couple accept that it is a sin according to the Bible, admit they are sinners, and are going to church to pray and coffess. Hey presto.

Of course the Lesbians can still go to church. Maybe there are parts they believe and parts they don't Most Christians have never read The Bible. They don't know what the hell they are worshipping.

It's riddiculous that you are seperating 'ordinary' sinners from gay ones.

[Shasown]

Originally Posted by Wildcat!

Yeah, just like there are people who have committed all kinds of acts, deemed sin by the church, including stealing lying or whatever else. But its a sin, like any other. The church doesnt say their congregation dont commit sins! Christian believers refer to themselves as sinners, because of course, no one is perfect. The difference is, church goers accept that those are sins according to the bible, and therefore, they go to church, pray, confess and whatnot, to be forgiven their sins. I dont think the homosexual, consider that they are sinning, or goes to church to be forgiven their sins. Which is fair enough.

But that brings me back to my point of, why go to church, if you fundamentally disagree with it in that sense? I think basically, that they have their own religion.

So what you are saying is a separate church for homosexuals because its in some way a different form of sin.

Yet serial adulterers, reoffending criminals etc are okay as church members but a person who may live his life impeccably as a christian is barred because of their sexual preference?

I dont understand the christian viewpoint, it is and always has been hypocrisy on a lot of churches to ostracise or treat homosexuals differently than other sinners. Even if that church believes their very lifestyle to be a sin. No one is perfect, And a person having a long term affair is in my eyes a hypocrite if they continue to attend church while having the affair.

[Wildcat!]

Originally Posted by Shasown

So what you are saying is a separate church for homosexuals because its in some way a different form of sin.

Yet serial adulterers, reoffending criminals etc are okay as church members but a person who may live his life impeccably as a christian is barred because of their sexual preference?

I dont understand the christian viewpoint, it is and always has been hypocrisy on a lot of churches to ostracise or treat homosexuals differently than other sinners. Even if that church believes their very lifestyle to be a sin. No one is perfect, And a person having a long term affair is in my eyes a hypocrite if they continue to attend church while having the affair.

It goes without saying, that the person who is having an affair, while still attending church, is lying t themselves, and to the church goers. In most cases, they are going to church t actually suggest that they are not doing what they do on the side. Of course there are always exceptions. Not everyone in church are cheating on their significant others right?


But like I said before, I dont think the homosexual consider themselves as sinners, so thats why I think they believe differently than the christian religion, thats why I think their place of whorship should be seperate. Again, I dont think its the church who should kick them out, because after all, everyone should be allowed in church, n matter the level of the sins they commit. BUt if you dont believe in that yourself, why would you want to go?

Again, looking at it, from the Point of view of the homosexual. I am trying to determine, why he or she, would want to go to church!

The church is what it is! Its not like youre gonna change their views!

[Shasown]

Originally Posted by Wildcat!

Again, looking at it, from the Point of view of the homosexual. I am trying to determine, why he or she, would want to go to church!

The church is what it is! Its not like youre gonna change their views!

Except even the church has to follow the law of the land and its illegal to discriminate on the grounds of sexuality. Or would you again draw lines in the sand saying churches shouldnt hide paedophile behaviour because thats against the law but then they should be allowed to ban homosexuals even though thats against the law as well?

Believe it or not but homosexuality is a natural state and surely even if the church believes its a sinful state they still have to accept that some of their congregations will be in that state just as there will always be people in states of other sins.

[Wildcat!]

Firstly, I do not think most gay people wh are christian, consider themselves as sinning, when it comes to their sexuality. imo, they think the interpretation is wrong, and that they should be allowed to marry! Correct me if I am wrong. So in that sense, no, they dont g to church to be forgiven that particular sin!

And secondly, if you go to church, youre not going there to sin some more are you? And the lesbian who g in there holding hands, arent exactly repentant are they??? Imo, they are blatantly (not like they are having sex or anything), but they are basically standing there saying we are lesbians, and that's just not right imo!

Once again, I believe its their right, But I do think its the sin in the eye of the church, and I dont think most homosexuals think so! Therefore, I dont understand why they would want to go to church.
Isnt what I am saying logical?

[Stu]

So they are commiting a sin even by holding hands? Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahah. Brah. Seriously. It's not exactly a practicing act. It's not as if they were in the confession box going all scissor sisters on each other with Cher banging away on the organ.

As for what your saying being logical, well, it would need to be legible first. And it's a far cry from that lofty milestone.

[Wildcat!]

Originally Posted by Stu

So they are commiting a sin even by holding hands? Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahah. Brah. Seriously. It's not exactly a practicing act. It's not as if they were in the confession box going all scissor sisters on each other with Cher banging away on the organ.

As for what your saying being logical, well, it would need to be legible first. And it's a far cry from that lofty milestone.

I edited my post! I am not saying they are sinning by holding hands, but they are basically saying they are a couple, and Imo, they should refrain from doing that, if they are in the church.

Once again, you cant have a discussion without being rude! My fault for thinking that people change and actually grow up!

[Stu]

Originally Posted by Wildcat!

I edited my post! I am not saying they are sinning by holding hands, but they are basically saying they are a couple, and Imo, they should refrain from doing that, if they are in the church.

Once again, you cant have a discussion without being rude! My fault for thinking that people change and actually grow up!

So openess, love and honesty don't count amongst what you think the Christian church should encourage?

Fair enough.

[Fetch The Bolt Cutters]

Originally Posted by Stu

It's not as if they were in the confession box going all scissor sisters on each other with Cher banging away on the organ

[Wildcat!]

The whole homosexuality is a natural state, has not been proven, its a theory, and not a scientific fact!


Illegal?? I dont think anyone will kick you out of the church, because they know you are a homosexual! I have never heard of that before, as long as its not manifested in the church! And clearly, 2 people who are known to be homosexuals, and are holding hands in the church, are manifesting it. Once again, I am looking at it forom a logical point of view.

And again, I dont understand why as a homosexual, you would want to go in there!! BEcause youre not gonna change any views of the church, weather it generates publicity, or not!