[Livia]

Tony Blair took THIS country to war. Bush didn't... Tony Blair was the leader of this country at the time. And it was the wrong decision made on faulty information.

I don't see why he should ever be allowed to forget.

[GoldHeart]

Originally Posted by Livia

Tony Blair took THIS country to war. Bush didn't... Tony Blair was the leader of this country at the time. And it was the wrong decision made on faulty information.

I don't see why he should ever be allowed to forget.

But DIDN'T you claim people swept Blair's actions under the carpet ?? .
I was pointing out that's NOT the case at all .

I never agreed with his decision , obviously we should NEVER of gone to war .

[kirklancaster]

Why is this thread being deflected onto Blair/May/The Size Of Donald Duck's Beak?

The subject here is ALL the decades of INCONTROVERTIBLE evidence that Corbyn is anti-Semitic and PRO-TERRORIST.

And as BOTS has pointed out the two are interrelated.

Mitigate all you want, deny all you want, deflect all you want, but the TRUTH is out there for all but the self-blind to see.

[user104658]

Originally Posted by kirklancaster

Why is this thread being deflected onto Blair/May/The Size Of Donald Duck's Beak?

The subject here is ALL the decades of INCONTROVERTIBLE evidence that Corbyn is anti-Semitic and PRO-TERRORIST.

And as BOTS has pointed out the two are interrelated.

Mitigate all you want, deny all you want, deflect all you want, but the TRUTH is out there for all but the self-blind to see.

Because it's a debate forum and - whilst they did unthinkably add "celeb news" into the mix - as far as I'm aware, the forum is still called "Serious debates and News (...and Celebrity stuff)", not "Serious Announcements, Proclamations and Soapbox Speeches".

[kirklancaster]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

Because it's a debate forum and - whilst they did unthinkably add "celeb news" into the mix - as far as I'm aware, the forum is still called "Serious debates and News (...and Celebrity stuff)", not "Serious Announcements, Proclamations and Soapbox Speeches".

You KNOW all about 'soapbox speeches' T.S. being the greatest exponent, but your post still does not answer why the thread topic is being diverted away from Corbyn.

[GoldHeart]

Originally Posted by kirklancaster

Why is this thread being deflected onto Blair/May/The Size Of Donald Duck's Beak?

The subject here is ALL the decades of INCONTROVERTIBLE evidence that Corbyn is anti-Semitic and PRO-TERRORIST.

And as BOTS has pointed out the two are interrelated.

Mitigate all you want, deny all you want, deflect all you want, but the TRUTH is out there for all but the self-blind to see.

Nothing is being deflected , it's a political thread therefore politics is talked about.

Corbyn is still the main topic

[Nicky91]

Originally Posted by GoldHeart

Nothing is being deflected , it's a political thread therefore politics is talked about.

Corbyn is still the main topic

true it's still very much on topic about Corbyn, i'd wish he wouldn't be a trending topic anymore tbh, i'm also the same tired about all the trump news, who is the only trending subject to talk about in america ugh


like there isn't anything other in the news than a corbyn or trump

[Livia]

Originally Posted by kirklancaster

Why is this thread being deflected onto Blair/May/The Size Of Donald Duck's Beak?

The subject here is ALL the decades of INCONTROVERTIBLE evidence that Corbyn is anti-Semitic and PRO-TERRORIST.

And as BOTS has pointed out the two are interrelated.

Mitigate all you want, deny all you want, deflect all you want, but the TRUTH is out there for all but the self-blind to see.

Because all the gentile Corbyn supporters say that he's not antisemitic. Just like we knew they would. Even Corbyn himself has admitted he was there... but no, he was just there as an innocent bystander. Allegedly.

[arista]

Yes he did a New TV news Interview saying it was about
the Attack on Tunisia

[Maru]

I think we can simply point out (as bits just eloquently did), hey I think that is deflecting here, the reasons why and then just go back to the original issue, and let that be part of the debate...

Though one of my biggest pet peeves during conversation, real life especially, is when it's with folk who almost always want to bring up their annoyances on how they wish the discussion would proceed rather than simply having one. It happens often with certain people, and I almost always end up rage-quitting internally every time... it's usually indicative of defensiveness for me, though there are some people who like too much to referee discussions. I tend to think they suck at conversation for that reason.

Anyway I think off-topic rule should apply here to an extent. Though I should mention quite a few of us are very bad at this at the moment tbqf*f (like right now) ...

[Crimson Dynamo]

why was he there graves or no graves?

what has it to do with the UK?

[Oliver_W]

haha!

[Maru]

Originally Posted by Oliver_W

haha!

The root cause, his subconscious has an addiction to controversy! Time to sign up for rehab...

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by Maru

The root cause, his subconscious has an addiction to controversy! Time to sign up for rehab...

And being on the right side of any controversial decision made by the previous or this govt in respects to war and bombings?... is that so controversial?... do people need rehab who go against state sponsored murder, drone strikes. war arms sales that have over the years caused the deaths of thousands of deaths of civilians, refugees, and military personnel.

I would go as far as to say there is something pretty rotten in the subconscious of anyone who brays along with the crowd when there's calls for strikes.. then, when the controversial nay sayers are proved to be right in their condemnation there's an attempt to point the finger of blame on them! ( not you personally)

Whether or not he did or didn't is irrelevant, it's a convenient stick to beat him with. There's so much misinformation out there at the moment it's embarrasing our media is a joke! first the terrorists are buried there and then they aren't... is that responsible reportage or something to whip up the public?

Meanwhile this is a perfect smokescreen it has to be said for the far right dalliances of the no deal brexiteers, primarily boris...this is pure gold for him as it keeps his alt right trope spewing column off the front pages, or any pages.

Jeremy Corbyn is NOT an antisemite, if he chooses not to accept the full definition ( with the acceptance and understanding of the author no less) then why the constant harassment?
The constant barrage of abuse, hate, accusations, lies and misinformation surrounding this whole issue is sickening.

I truly feel for the Jewish community, their plight is being politicised in the worst way that's the most shocking thing to come from this and should some respond in defence of Cobyn they are vilified or ignored!

It's the most distasteful point in British political history for a long long time.

[GoldHeart]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

And being on the right side of any controversial decision made by the previous or this govt in respects to war and bombings?... is that so controversial?... do people need rehab who go against state sponsored murder, drone strikes. war arms sales that have over the years caused the deaths of thousands of deaths of civilians, refugees, and military personnel.

I would go as far as to say there is something pretty rotten in the subconscious of anyone who brays along with the crowd when there's calls for strikes.. then, when the controversial nay sayers are proved to be right in their condemnation there's an attempt to point the finger of blame on them! ( not you personally)

Whether or not he did or didn't is irrelevant, it's a convenient stick to beat him with. There's so much misinformation out there at the moment it's embarrasing our media is a joke! first the terrorists are buried there and then they aren't... is that responsible reportage or something to whip up the public?

Meanwhile this is a perfect smokescreen it has to be said for the far right dalliances of the no deal brexiteers, primarily boris...this is pure gold for him as it keeps his alt right trope spewing column off the front pages, or any pages.

Jeremy Corbyn is NOT an antisemite, if he chooses not to accept the full definition ( with the acceptance and understanding of the author no less) then why the constant harassment?
The constant barrage of abuse, hate, accusations, lies and misinformation surrounding this whole issue is sickening.

I truly feel for the Jewish community, their plight is being politicised in the worst way that's the most shocking thing to come from this and should some respond in defence of Cobyn they are vilified or ignored!

It's the most distasteful point in British political history for a long long time.

Corbyn ISNT antisemitic ! They can't even get the god damn story right .
One minute the terrorists are buried there ,then they're not . All the focus on this wreath ,with a photo to use against him .

Like I said it's a hate campaign against Corbyn, and there's a lot of smoke & mirrors to distract us from the farce of the current government.

[user104658]

Originally Posted by Maru

It is possible to make multiple points against a single point in the same post since it has already been brought up.

That doesn't make it sensible to state that you dislike people saying "other people do it too" in an attempt to lessen the severity of an accusation, and then on the next line... Say "Labour did it too!" about an accusation against the Tories. Its either relevant / valid always, or never... Otherwise there's some phrase about having cake and also eating said cake or something like that. And not being able to.

[Maru]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

That doesn't make it sensible to state that you dislike people saying "other people do it too" in an attempt to lessen the severity of an accusation, and then on the next line... Say "Labour did it too!" about an accusation against the Tories. Its either relevant / valid always, or never... Otherwise there's some phrase about having cake and also eating said cake or something like that. And not being able to.

I'm not going to speak for Bits, but as I interpreted it, I read it as he was talking about himself and gave full a construction on his different points of view... I didn't take it to be for arguments sake? Just that he agreed/disagreed with various points, in multiple ways... Otherwise I'd agree with you in general, it's undermining the other point during argument.

[Northern Monkey]

The media definitely have a hard on for Corbyn and they have been known to bend the truth but they can’t just make situations up and out and out lie.There has to be some fire creating the smoke or where are they getting the pictures from?
The problem is,It’s not just one incident is it.More and more things from his murky past keep coming out.Are people saying it’s all a made up conspiracy?There’s no truth to any of it?
And every story that comes out is baseless?
That is the more unbelievable hypothesis.
He has a history of calling terrorists friends,brothers etc and he’s admitted being at this event.

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by Northern Monkey

The media definitely have a hard on for Corbyn and they have been known to bend the truth but they can’t just make situations up and out and out lie.There has to be some fire creating the smoke or where are they getting the pictures from?
The problem is,It’s not just one incident is it.More and more things from his murky past keep coming out.Are people saying it’s all a made up conspiracy?There’s no truth to any of it?
And every story that comes out is baseless?
That is the more unbelievable hypothesis.
He has a history of calling terrorists friends,brothers etc and he’s admitted being at this event.

He has a history of diplomacy, you catch more flies with honey than ****...or bombs.
There is no murky past! If there was a murky past it would be easier to oust him as there would be more ammunition, all there is a pic of him at a ceremony to commemorate the victims of terrorism and another couple of him at protests in the 70s! ...come on get some perspective.

[GoldHeart]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

He has a history of diplomacy, you catch more flies with honey than ****...or bombs.
There is no murky past! If there was a murky past it would be easier to oust him as there would be more ammunition, all there is a pic of him at a ceremony to commemorate the victims of terrorism and another couple of him at protests in the 70s! ...come on get some perspective.

I agree

[Livia]

The fact remains that many Jews, including Jewish Labour supporters, feel they have a case to be answered. Corbyn fans can twist and turn as much as they want... their denial makes him and his refusal to take a stand against antisemitism in his own party look even more shoddy.

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by Livia

The fact remains that many Jews, including Jewish Labour supporters, feel they have a case to be answered. Corbyn fans can twist and turn as much as they want... their denial makes him and his refusal to take a stand against antisemitism in his own party look even more shoddy.

If this is in reply to my comments and I'm not suggesting for a second it is, personally I am a Labour/ Corbyn supporter, not a Corbyn fan.
That term I'm sure you'll understand delegitimises any genuine socio-political interest as simply hero worship... I wouldn't want any confusion on that regard.

There is a fact that there is a case to be answered yes, it has been answered, there have been inquiries, reports and personal testimony... it has reached saturation point almost. how many times can the same assurances be made that any abuse is not condoned by or tolerated by the Labour party?..

Take the latest front page assault, a misrepresentation of the term 'zionist'.. We all know they exist, we also know that is a derogatory term used to describe Jews. The media twist is now to infer that the comment referred to the modern abusive non traditional reference and not the traditionally accepted term.

I personally agree as I have said on many occasions across many threads with relating back to history, there IS an irony there.... It's uncomfortable to address but the similarities are there ... There will be bluster and outrage but history cannot be rewritten to suit modern power battles.

[Robodog]

One of my favourite Corbyn moments was his speech at Glastonbury last year, talking about Trump etc:

"Build bridges, not walls!" he trumpeted to the crowd, and they cheered...

...all from inside the heavily-guarded walls of their privileged festival (@Ł238-a-ticket).


Funny how no-one tried tearing THAT wall down, in order to let everyone else into their party.

[bots]

Jeremy is in trouble again after a video of him filmed in 2013 emerges

A Jewish Labour MP says she feels "unwelcome" in the party after a video emerged showing Jeremy Corbyn accusing British Zionists of having "no sense of English irony".

Liverpool Wavertree MP Luciana Berger described the Labour leader's comments in a 2013 speech as "inexcusable".

The clip was published on the Daily Mail website as Mr Corbyn makes efforts to tackle anti-Semitism in his party.

A spokesperson for Mr Corbyn denied the comments were offensive.

The spokesperson said: "He was referring to a group of pro-Israel activists misunderstanding -and then criticising - the Palestinian ambassador for a speech at a separate event about the occupation of the West Bank."

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-45292218


the video on the daily mail website http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...my-Corbyn.html

The picture below shows Corbyn at he meeting

On the far right is Daud Abdullah, who called for attacks on the Royal Navy and led a boycott of Holocaust Memorial Day. In the center is Stephen Sizer, who suggested that Israel was behind the 9/11 attack

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by bitontheslide

Jeremy is in trouble again after a video of him filmed in 2013 emerges

A Jewish Labour MP says she feels "unwelcome" in the party after a video emerged showing Jeremy Corbyn accusing British Zionists of having "no sense of English irony".

Liverpool Wavertree MP Luciana Berger described the Labour leader's comments in a 2013 speech as "inexcusable".

The clip was published on the Daily Mail website as Mr Corbyn makes efforts to tackle anti-Semitism in his party.

A spokesperson for Mr Corbyn denied the comments were offensive.

The spokesperson said: "He was referring to a group of pro-Israel activists misunderstanding -and then criticising - the Palestinian ambassador for a speech at a separate event about the occupation of the West Bank."

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-45292218


the video on the daily mail website http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...my-Corbyn.html

The picture below shows Corbyn at he meeting

On the far right is Daud Abdullah, who called for attacks on the Royal Navy and led a boycott of Holocaust Memorial Day. In the center is Stephen Sizer, who suggested that Israel was behind the 9/11 attack

I don't think the issue is the lack of understanding of English irony... it's the English ignorance that's the real problem,faced with a powerful account of the historic implications emotively relayed by a Palestinian ambassador in relation to the conflict ... What are they reduced to for our viewing pleasure?.... Luciana Berger is upset :/


'Asked on BBC Radio 4’s Today programme about the row, John McDonnell, the shadow chancellor and a close ally of Corbyn, said the leader’s words had been taken out of context.

“In certain contexts, certain phrases are appropriate. To take them out of context is unacceptable and I think is not helping the issue, it’s exacerbating the issue,” he said.

A Labour spokesperson added on Friday night: “This was a speech about the need to better teach the history of Israel-Palestine and about the brutality of colonialism, occupation and dispossession.

“A section of the speech that was edited out of the footage posted on YouTube sets his comments in context. He had been speaking about Zionists and non-Zionist Jews and very clearly does not go on to use Zionists as any kind of shorthand for Jews.”

https://www.theguardian.com/politics...ism-row-labour