[Mitchell]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

Indeed. I'm not wishing him harm (or dead) because he's still a human being, but even if one somehow believes him to be doing a good job lately - no one should forget that the NHS would have been much more robust and better prepared for this if it wasn't for the Tories, and Boris himself. They've underfunded and undermined it for ten years and they've been jeering and clapping the entire time. I personally hope he's having a very long, hard think whilst under NHS care this week.

Exactly my thoughts, I don’t want anyone to die from this, unfortunately he disagreed.

[Crimson Dynamo]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

Indeed. I'm not wishing him harm (or dead) because he's still a human being, but even if one somehow believes him to be doing a good job lately - no one should forget that the NHS would have been much more robust and better prepared for this if it wasn't for the Tories, and Boris himself. They've underfunded and undermined it for ten years and they've been jeering and clapping the entire time. I personally hope he's having a very long, hard think whilst under NHS care this week.

It's simply not true. The NHS is so badly run no matter who the government is it's always one step away from a crisis. Its not fit for purpose and pretending it's the Tory government fault is part of the problem.

[Mitchell]

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet

It's simply not true. The NHS is so badly run no matter who the government is it's always one step away from a crisis. Its not fit for purpose and pretending it's the Tory government fault is part of the problem.

Don’t remember seeing other parties cheering when they won a vote not to give NHS staff a pay rise...

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet

It's simply not true. The NHS is so badly run no matter who the government is it's always one step away from a crisis. Its not fit for purpose and pretending it's the Tory government fault is part of the problem.

Nope... more misinformation the NHS was self sustaining untill the profitable parts were tendered.

[Kazanne]

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet

It's simply not true. The NHS is so badly run no matter who the government is it's always one step away from a crisis. Its not fit for purpose and pretending it's the Tory government fault is part of the problem.

I agree the NHS are not faultless, some of their admin is terribly run and money wasted because of some peoples greed and inability to run it properly,it is a collection of faults not totally a governments, the fat cats at the top of the NHS need to take some responsibility, The NHS is a wonderful thing we have in this country but its not beyond abuse afterall its run by humans.

[GoldHeart]

Think what you want about the NHS , it's still a million times better than the American health system! .

If you want to know what real greed & profiteers are , just look at the mess America is in with their health care.

[Jake.]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

Indeed. I'm not wishing him harm (or dead) because he's still a human being, but even if one somehow believes him to be doing a good job lately - no one should forget that the NHS would have been much more robust and better prepared for this if it wasn't for the Tories, and Boris himself. They've underfunded and undermined it for ten years and they've been jeering and clapping the entire time. I personally hope he's having a very long, hard think whilst under NHS care this week.

My sentiments exactly

[Kash Doll]

Clapping just cause someone’s ill is abit patronising omg

[user104658]

Also my hands are baby soft because I've never done a day's manual labour in my life .

Well, I did hang a door last week. One of my proudest moments to be quite honest. DIY SOS right here.

[Marsh.]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

Also my hands are baby soft because I've never done a day's manual labour in my life .

Well, I did hang a door last week. One of my proudest moments to be quite honest. DIY SOS right here.

Your poor family waiting for the day it topples off and causes damage.

[Livia]

The trouble with the NHS is, look at the funding they got 30 or 40 years ago, look at the funding they get now, then think about the equipment they use now compared to 30 or 40 years ago. The cost of some of the NHS equipment is astronomical. And I think there's a lot of money wasted on prescribing drugs people don't need and on missed appointments.

[GoldHeart]

That's why more funds and resources are needed for the NHS .

I think the ones who can afford to , should be putting money into helping the NHS instead of wasting money.

Well in an ideal world prescription drugs wouldn't cost so much, but as usual pharmacy companies just want to profit.

[Denver]

So there is a #Clap4Adam tonight

[Tom4784]

No, I found the clapping to be a pointless gesture in the first place. If you want to help the NHS, stick to the rules of the lockdown, give to charities or funds for the workers or volunteer if you aren't vulnerable. Clapping does little when most NHS workers just want people to stay inside.

I'm not going to clap for someone who leads the party that's helped put the NHS under immense financial strain. I don't wish him harm but I'm not gonna waste my time on pointless gestures. He'll take the credit for the unprecedented things the Tories have done to help but I'm more willing to apply the true credit to the likes of Rishi Sunak.

[Tom4784]

Also you should definitely care to learn about the horrors of the US healthcare system, if we aren't careful and critical of the government it could easily become our healthcare system.

[GoldHeart]

Originally Posted by Dezzy

Also you should definitely care to learn about the horrors of the US healthcare system, if we aren't careful and critical of the government it could easily become our healthcare system.

Exactly what I've been saying too .

[user104658]

There are huge administrative problems within the NHS and a lot of poor management and ineffective leadership, that much is true, but I'm not sure how anyone could possibly think that the solution to that problem is funding cuts, low pay for front line staff, or a shift to privitisation.

Government should have been providing world-class funding AND addressing the other issues at the same time. At the end of the day, the buck stops with the government... where the NHS has been mismanaged that should have been addressed as a separate issue. Instead they used it as an excuse to say "you'd have plenty of money if you managed it better" and cut funding expecting (supposedly) that the problem would then "have to" fix itself. Which of course it did not, management did not improve, and services suffered further. But then they didn't expect funding cuts to fix it, it was just an excuse to cut funding that they wanted to cut anyway and push for privitisation.

We're now getting a stark look at why private healthcare systems are a disaster and hopefully the Tories are paying attention.

[GoldHeart]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

There are huge administrative problems within the NHS and a lot of poor management and ineffective leadership, that much is true, but I'm not sure how anyone could possibly think that the solution to that problem is funding cuts, low pay for front line staff, or a shift to privitisation.

Government should have been providing world-class funding AND addressing the other issues at the same time. At the end of the day, the buck stops with the government... where the NHS has been mismanaged that should have been addressed as a separate issue. Instead they used it as an excuse to say "you'd have plenty of money if you managed it better" and cut funding expecting (supposedly) that the problem would then "have to" fix itself. Which of course it did not, management did not improve, and services suffered further. But then they didn't expect funding cuts to fix it, it was just an excuse to cut funding that they wanted to cut anyway and push for privitisation.

We're now getting a stark look at why private healthcare systems are a disaster and hopefully the Tories are paying attention.

That's why I'm hoping some good comes out of this horrible pandemic!, Boris being in intensive care should be a wake up call for him.

[Crimson Dynamo]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

There are huge administrative problems within the NHS and a lot of poor management and ineffective leadership, that much is true, but I'm not sure how anyone could possibly think that the solution to that problem is funding cuts, low pay for front line staff, or a shift to privitisation.

Government should have been providing world-class funding AND addressing the other issues at the same time. At the end of the day, the buck stops with the government... where the NHS has been mismanaged that should have been addressed as a separate issue. Instead they used it as an excuse to say "you'd have plenty of money if you managed it better" and cut funding expecting (supposedly) that the problem would then "have to" fix itself. Which of course it did not, management did not improve, and services suffered further. But then they didn't expect funding cuts to fix it, it was just an excuse to cut funding that they wanted to cut anyway and push for privitisation.

We're now getting a stark look at why private healthcare systems are a disaster and hopefully the Tories are paying attention.

When we get angry by other organisations who are poorly run by well paid execs– the police, the BBC, utility companies, supermarkets, banks, the Church – we have a right go at those who run them

WHen its the NHS (I think because most folk dont see who runs it and dont understand) its never their fault its always "da government)


Labour bang on about how the NHS is the envy of the world but they never mention why no one copies it...

[user104658]

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet

When we get angry by other organisations who are poorly run by well paid execs– the police, the BBC, utility companies, supermarkets, banks, the Church – we have a right go at those who run them



WHen its the NHS (I think because most folk dont see who runs it and dont understand) its never their fault its always "da government)





Labour bang on about how the NHS is the envy of the world but they never mention why no one copies it...

The NHS is the world's first example of universal healthcare and there are now 18 first world countries with Universal healthcare, and many more working towards it.

So yes... a lot of people have "copied it".

The problem with being "first" of course is that the NHS didn't have the benefit of other countries experience in order to make tweaks in the set up, and thus has deep roots in an outdated system.

The answer is making the effort to fix it, not underfunding or dismantling it, or shifting to an insurance model.

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

There are huge administrative problems within the NHS and a lot of poor management and ineffective leadership, that much is true, but I'm not sure how anyone could possibly think that the solution to that problem is funding cuts, low pay for front line staff, or a shift to privitisation.

Government should have been providing world-class funding AND addressing the other issues at the same time. At the end of the day, the buck stops with the government... where the NHS has been mismanaged that should have been addressed as a separate issue. Instead they used it as an excuse to say "you'd have plenty of money if you managed it better" and cut funding expecting (supposedly) that the problem would then "have to" fix itself. Which of course it did not, management did not improve, and services suffered further. But then they didn't expect funding cuts to fix it, it was just an excuse to cut funding that they wanted to cut anyway and push for privitisation.

We're now getting a stark look at why private healthcare systems are a disaster and hopefully the Tories are paying attention.

Yep yep and yep. Managers with no clinical expertise cannot run departments effectively imo, you can't run the NHS like a business.. it's just not possible.

[Crimson Dynamo]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

Yep yep and yep. Managers with no clinical expertise cannot run departments effectively imo, you can't run the NHS like a business.. it's just not possible.

and its even more impossible to run it any other way

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet

and its even more impossible to run it any other way

Not true it was run very effectively for decades before the restructuring.

[bots]

the NHS has not been run effectively in my life time and that spans many tory and labour governments. Neither have been in charge of a good NHS

[Livia]

I didn't clap for Boris, I didn't clap for the NHS either because there's no one anywhere near me to hear. If people want to clap, that's up to them.Who am I to tell people what they should be doing?