[cheapbbfan]

It does take two to tangle and Hazel has been straddling along the line for quite some time. She's not completely innocent

[anne666]

Kate 2013, well said . I agree with everything other than she should have been evicted.He went completely OTT. BB wanted sexual activity in there to boost ratings and anything else that happened was immaterial. If they had got that any pants pulling down etc wouldn't have mattered at all to them. She has morally behaved appallingly but he went further than that.BB is responsible for so much and will get away with it all.

[bez87]

Listen when it comes down to it, the only one responsible for what happened is Daley.
Forget the pants pulling moment, the moment he turned was well before that, and deep down we all know it changed when they went into the safe house, just by the way he was talking to her about the make-up something didn't sound right in my mind. We all have choices in life at any given moment.

Hazel did wrong by pulling his pants down, but from what she told Dan it was a bit of fun, i agree with her, i think she thought that this was his way of flirting, because he demanded she come back into the house and go to sleep like a good little girl. She was drunk he was drunk forget the camera's were even their i don't think neither of them really gave much thought to them, like some people on this board think their playing a game every moment of every day. This incident does not justify what happened next and it comes down all on Daley.

But give credit where it's due, Daley has apologized and understands completely what he has done. He does need help.

The one thing i didn't like about the interview was the it takes 2 to tango which when watching the show, she clearly says this when talking about the incident.
The other main big concern was, the talk about this whole girlfriend thing, this so called "KATIE" who we should all feel sorry for and all that, was back stage waiting for him, why was she even there, absolutely nothing came of that. What we have to remember is Emma would of been briefed before hand on what she can and cannot say to him.

[Livia]

Originally Posted by bez87

Listen when it comes down to it, the only one responsible for what happened is Daley.
Forget the pants pulling moment, the moment he turned was well before that, and deep down we all know it changed when they went into the safe house, just by the way he was talking to her about the make-up something didn't sound right in my mind. We all have choices in life at any given moment.

Hazel did wrong by pulling his pants down, but from what she told Dan it was a bit of fun, i agree with her, i think she thought that this was his way of flirting, because he demanded she come back into the house and go to sleep like a good little girl. She was drunk he was drunk forget the camera's were even their i don't think neither of them really gave much thought to them, like some people on this board think their playing a game every moment of every day. This incident does not justify what happened next and it comes down all on Daley.

But give credit where it's due, Daley has apologized and understands completely what he has done. He does need help.

The one thing i didn't like about the interview was the it takes 2 to tango which when watching the show, she clearly says this when talking about the incident.
The other main big concern was, the talk about this whole girlfriend thing, this so called "KATIE" who we should all feel sorry for and all that, was back stage waiting for him, why was she even there, absolutely nothing came of that. What we have to remember is Emma would of been briefed before hand on what she can and cannot say to him.

My favoruite post of the day so far.

[Livia]

Sigh... I'm not going into the whole "assault and provocation" thing again... Everyone has has to be responsible for their own actions. But when one person strikes another, it's game over.

[CaudleHalbard]

Originally Posted by bez87

Listen when it comes down to it, the only one responsible for what happened is Daley


.

Add "in my opinion" and that's fine.

The viewing public do not share that opinion. But there's nothing wrong with being a minority, even a small minority.

[Livia]

Originally Posted by CaudleHalbard

Add "in my opinion" and that's fine.

The viewing public do not share that opinion. But there's nothing wrong with being a minority, even a small minority.

I think he's talking about the assault. And like I've said about a squillion times... but one more time for the Queen: you cannot claim someone provoked you into striking them. That's not an opinion, that's the law.

[bez87]

Originally Posted by CaudleHalbard

Add "in my opinion" and that's fine.

The viewing public do not share that opinion. But there's nothing wrong with being a minority, even a small minority.

Well if i'm a minority thinking that Daley threatening another human being for hardly any reason at all esp a woman then, the world has gone made, and no one has morals anymore, or dares to stand up and take resonsibility seems like we have become a world who would rather put the blame on everyone else. disgraceful

[anne666]

Originally Posted by bez87

Well if i'm a minority thinking that Daley threatening another human being for hardly any reason at all esp a woman then, the world has gone made, and no one has morals anymore, or dares to stand up and take resonsibility seems like we have become a world who would rather put the blame on everyone else. disgraceful

You are in a majority on here I think. Some however are in the category of the last part of your sentence. Running round in a wheel not aware of that.Claiming men have no self control so its all the womans fault .

[bez87]

Originally Posted by anne666

You are in a majority on here I think. Some however are in the category of the last part of your sentence. Running round in a wheel not aware of that.Claiming men have no self control so its all the womans fault .

Thanks, i mean some of the members here completely disgust me, how they hate someone so much they make it up in their own mind to justify this sort of behaviour that it comes down to the person they hate.

I mean do they live in the real world, seriously if i ran into a night club and pulled someones pants down and ran off, it would be a slap on the wrist and probably a chuckle from the police station and to say don't do it again. yes humilating but for a couple it's nothing but a bit of fun, she probably forgot about the camera's being drunk and the lights off, after 3weeks in their, the camera's are probably at the back of many of there minds by now.

If i told a woman that i may get angry and then choke her and tell her if she didn't respect me then i'd nut her, that would be at least a suspended jail sentence at least, thats the fact.

The whole lads and girls equals thing, it's more common that a lad would just laugh it off and carry on, but a girl is alot more emotional, i'm not being sexiest thats just the real world.

[anne666]

Originally Posted by bez87

Thanks, i mean some of the members here completely disgust me, how they hate someone so much they make it up in their own mind to justify this sort of behaviour that it comes down to the person they hate.

I mean do they live in the real world, seriously if i ran into a night club and pulled someones pants down and ran off, it would be a slap on the wrist and probably a chuckle from the police station and to say don't do it again. yes humilating but for a couple it's nothing but a bit of fun, she probably forgot about the camera's being drunk and the lights off, after 3weeks in their, the camera's are probably at the back of many of there minds by now.

If i told a woman that i may get angry and then choke her and tell her if she didn't respect me then i'd nut her, that would be at least a suspended jail sentence at least, thats the fact.

The whole lads and girls equals thing, it's more common that a lad would just laugh it off and carry on, but a girl is alot more emotional, i'm not being sexiest thats just the real world.

It is ALL so obvious to objective adults. Blind and nonsensical subjectivity abounds and is worrying.

[CaudleHalbard]

Originally Posted by Livia

I think he's talking about the assault. And like I've said about a squillion times... but one more time for the Queen: you cannot claim someone provoked you into striking them. That's not an opinion, that's the law.

There were several assaults that night by both Hazel and Daley. Which particular one do you mean?

[bez87]

Originally Posted by CaudleHalbard

There were several assaults that night by both Hazel and Daley. Which particular one do you mean?

What assaults???? pulling pants down doesn't come close to wanting to headbutt someone for nothing.

[anne666]

Originally Posted by bez87

What assaults???? pulling pants down doesn't come close to wanting to headbutt someone for nothing.

Well it does if you are a raging angry, misogynistic control freak who should never have been selected in the first place

[Livia]

Originally Posted by CaudleHalbard

There were several assaults that night by both Hazel and Daley. Which particular one do you mean?

Hazel did not assault Daley.

[CaudleHalbard]

Originally Posted by bez87

What assaults???? pulling pants down doesn't come close.

It would rank as indecent assault. Usually considered pretty serious.

Ok, how about Hazel pressing a pillow down on Daley's face? How about her kicking out at him?

Any of these assaults you'd like to chat about?

[Livia]

Originally Posted by CaudleHalbard

It would rank as indecent assault. Usually considered pretty serious.

Ok, how about Hazel pressing a pillow down on Daley's face? How about her kicking out at him?

Any of these assaults you'd like to chat about?

There was no indecent - or any other kind of assault, apart from when Daley first struck and then put his hands around Hazel's throat aggressively. Seriously... Were you watching a different programme?

[GiRTh]

Originally Posted by Livia

There was no indecent - or any other kind of assault, apart from when Daley first struck and then put his hands around Hazel's throat aggressively. Seriously... Were you watching a different programme?

slightly off topic but I'm curious. If you and me were having an argument and you took a couple of steps toward me, if I then raise my hand to stop you and a fight ensued, who would legally have started that?

[kistar]

Originally Posted by Livia

There was no indecent - or any other kind of assault, apart from when Daley first struck and then put his hands around Hazel's throat aggressively. Seriously... Were you watching a different programme?

She struck him first, and when he grabbed her by the throat she did it straight back to him and she said something along the lines of "do you think I'm intimidated by aggressive men?" meaning no she wasn't she also lifted herself up towards him in so her face was close to his , Livia , woman or man it doesn't matter she was goading him and she experienced the consequences of her actions, surely we all have to be responsible for what we do and with whom and when , had she given him back his cover said okay enough now and not pulled his shorts down none of it would have happened.

What annoys me is you are making women out to be the weaker sex and vulnerable to men and I for one am not. If you own your part in it you are not a victim, and you are making Hazel sound like a victim. I said in one post it's all about perception and I meant that based on life experiences and beliefs, my view point is coloured by my experiences .Just because I think Hazel should take responsibility for her actions does not in any way shape or form mean I side with men or hate her for being gorgeous either.

We have to acknowledge at some level too men have a weakness in their need and desire to procreate and as women we should not use that as leverage and be aware that we have the equipment to bring them to their knees if we like, so again we should take responsibility for our actions .

[ChristmasNeeve]

Originally Posted by kistar

She struck him first, and when he grabbed her by the throat she did it straight back to him and she said something along the lines of "do you think I'm intimidated by aggressive men?" meaning no she wasn't she also lifted herself up towards him in so her face was close to his , Livia , woman or man it doesn't matter she was goading him and she experienced the consequences of her actions, surely we all have to be responsible for what we do and with whom and when , had she given him back his cover said okay enough now and not pulled his shorts down none of it would have happened.

What annoys me is you are making women out to be the weaker sex and vulnerable to men and I for one am not. If you own your part in it you are not a victim, and you are making Hazel sound like a victim. I said in one post it's all about perception and I meant that based on life experiences and beliefs, my view point is coloured by my experiences .Just because I think Hazel should take responsibility for her actions does not in any way shape or form mean I side with men or hate her for being gorgeous either.

We have to acknowledge at some level too men have a weakness in their need and desire to procreate and as women we should not use that as leverage and be aware that we have the equipment to bring them to their knees if we like, so again we should take responsibility for our actions .

Are you kidding me?

[the truth]

Originally Posted by Niamh.

Are you kidding me?

no shes not. why cant you have a conversation about this without mocking?

[RodHull]

Originally Posted by Niamh.

Are you kidding me?

Sadly not... seems many people still think men are just mindless bags of testosterone waiting to be manipulated by the evil women who ruined the world for everyone by eating the apple in the garden of eden

As for the utter bulls**t about her striking him first, hers was a playful slap, his playful slap was equally fine. It was the choking and pinning her down that crossed the line... massively

And the equally utter bulls**t that she was goading him when he had her pinned, do you people use your eyes and brains at all?? She was scared by then, what was she to do, beg her master for forgiveness. She had only two options at that point, show her weakness by asking him to stop or submitting or front him up and hope he backed off and saw sense.

Sadly it didnt work and he just got worse. When it was stopped by BB she was barely responding anymore and was clearly scared, to the point were she went across the room away from him. Even she said she wasnt sure what happened or why she didnt try to make him look bad at all, if anything she tried to mitigate for him cause she felt bad for her part in it.

Yes she played with fire and got burned, but that doesnt mean the fire should not be put out or stopped. Its fine to have little sympathy for her but it doesnt stop what happened being wrong and totally his fault.

[anne666]

Originally Posted by kistar

She struck him first, and when he grabbed her by the throat she did it straight back to him and she said something along the lines of "do you think I'm intimidated by aggressive men?" meaning no she wasn't she also lifted herself up towards him in so her face was close to his , Livia , woman or man it doesn't matter she was goading him and she experienced the consequences of her actions, surely we all have to be responsible for what we do and with whom and when , had she given him back his cover said okay enough now and not pulled his shorts down none of it would have happened.

What annoys me is you are making women out to be the weaker sex and vulnerable to men and I for one am not. If you own your part in it you are not a victim, and you are making Hazel sound like a victim. I said in one post it's all about perception and I meant that based on life experiences and beliefs, my view point is coloured by my experiences .Just because I think Hazel should take responsibility for her actions does not in any way shape or form mean I side with men or hate her for being gorgeous either.

We have to acknowledge at some level too men have a weakness in their need and desire to procreate and as women we should not use that as leverage and be aware that we have the equipment to bring them to their knees if we like, so again we should take responsibility for our actions .

Disagree .

[bez87]

Originally Posted by kistar

She struck him first, and when he grabbed her by the throat she did it straight back to him and she said something along the lines of "do you think I'm intimidated by aggressive men?" meaning no she wasn't she also lifted herself up towards him in so her face was close to his , Livia , woman or man it doesn't matter she was goading him and she experienced the consequences of her actions, surely we all have to be responsible for what we do and with whom and when , had she given him back his cover said okay enough now and not pulled his shorts down none of it would have happened.

What annoys me is you are making women out to be the weaker sex and vulnerable to men and I for one am not. If you own your part in it you are not a victim, and you are making Hazel sound like a victim. I said in one post it's all about perception and I meant that based on life experiences and beliefs, my view point is coloured by my experiences .Just because I think Hazel should take responsibility for her actions does not in any way shape or form mean I side with men or hate her for being gorgeous either.

We have to acknowledge at some level too men have a weakness in their need and desire to procreate and as women we should not use that as leverage and be aware that we have the equipment to bring them to their knees if we like, so again we should take responsibility for our actions .

But thats not the whole story and you say you have a view point which is coloured by your experiences. Then you would take into account that he has become controlling over the last couple of days, and that it was Daley who demanded Hazel come in and go to sleep "like a good little girl".

Daley said he couldn't sleep until she was in bed, yet he had been in bed for awhile before she came in, she asked why he wasn't in her bed and he said he didn't want to blah blah, the conversation then turned that Daley said she should come over to him, so this in turn signals a response for something in Hazel, she was giddy from the booze and nicked his quilt in a playful many, for him to come over, this was not the case and Daley turned,

Hazel slapped his bum playfully, but he smacked her arse in a alot more aggressive manner, She never said anything about intimidated, she said she can handle an aggressive man, but in a sexual tease sort of tone of voice, you could tell she wanted it to be a sexual flirtatious sort of thing.

The moment when she realises that this could be getting abit out of hand and in that instance when she should of thought enough enough, instead is ups her game by pulling his pants down because she is still abit well he still may be flirting, before this moment tho she did just ask him for a hug to try and calm the situation down, it was a mistake she pulled his pants down but a mistake was all it was. After this she goes quiet and she turns to the side and allows him to get the quilt at this moment she has defused herself from it and wants nothing more to do with it, but he takes the quilt and then goes back, and at this point he tries to hold her hands down she grabs him to try and get him off, yes by the throat, but he puts his hand on her throat and tells her to respect her elders otherwise he will nut her.

So at no point in any of this, Hazel signals the behaviour that Daley portrays. Yes at the beginning of it, she encourages it, but i believe that Hazel has the impression that this is roleplay. she stops as soon as it's gone to far and he isn't showing any signs that this is for sexual preference.

[anne666]

Originally Posted by CaudleHalbard

It would rank as indecent assault. Usually considered pretty serious.

Ok, how about Hazel pressing a pillow down on Daley's face? How about her kicking out at him?

Any of these assaults you'd like to chat about?

How many times are you going to go on repeating this. You have had answers , some of us disagree. You and others repeating the stuff that some disagree with will not change my viewpoint, at least, one iota.