[Brother Leon]

I see nothing wrong with what he said...

[BBUK-Fan]

I feel India is rude to Ginuwine by the fact they know he has a lot of kids, 9 to be exact, to 5 different women so she asks him about dating a transgender person because he's been with lots of women before so India is bugging him about being with one thinking he'll be with lots more women. I don't like how India is thinking of Ginuwine

[smudgie]

Don’t ask a question if you are not prepared to accept the answer in good faith.
All this victim crap is rubbish, she is 50+ years old, learn to bloody grow up, if she is lucky she will meet the man of her dreams, if he has any sense will run a mile and get away from the misery she is.

[Marsh.]

I'd never date or have sex with a transperson either.

[Jake.]

Originally Posted by Marsh.

I'd never date or have sex with a transperson either.

Luckily enough for them

[Marsh.]

Originally Posted by Jake.

Luckily enough for them

You cheeky bitch. Anyone would be lUCKY to have me.

[teeeny]

i wonder would she date a trans man? not liking India at all very hypocritical and Malika was exactly right, shes a victim

[GoldHeart]

Originally Posted by teeeny

i wonder would she date a trans man? not liking India at all very hypocritical and Malika was exactly right, shes a victim

India would never date a trans man that's the hypocrisy of it!!. i wish somebody asked her this and flipped the tables on her .

[chuff me dizzy]

If the boot had been on the other foot and Ginuwine had grabbed India to try to kiss her she would have kicked up such a stink,he would have been removed

[chuff me dizzy]

If India had done to a man on the outside what she did to Ginuwine she would have got battered

[lostalex]

gender and sex are 2 different things. 1 of them is real the other is not.

[Vicky.]

Originally Posted by lostalex

gender and sex are 2 different things. 1 of them is real the other is not.

Gender is a social construct...nothing more than personality + dress sense when it comes down to it. Sex is real, and unchangeable with science as it stands today, and India does not even slightly 'pass' so India has no chance with anyone who is solely attracted to female people.

[optimisticcynic]

Originally Posted by Vicky.

Gender is a social construct...nothing more than personality + dress sense when it comes down to it. Sex is real, and unchangeable with science as it stands today, and India does not even slightly 'pass' so India has no chance with anyone who is solely attracted to female people.

There is often an issue differentiating between gender identity and gender role. I am happy to admit that I am baffled as to how people can be born “the wrong gender”. People are born as they are born, and may decide to do something about this at a later time. That is completely their call. But to identify the birth status as a mistake suggests predestination which makes little scientific sense. Is it possible that gender role which is so variable between cultures and times is more at the root of dissonance experienced? Can you be born the wrong race? Wasn’t there huge outrage when religious groups have claimes that people have been born with the wrong sexuality and that this can and should be “fixed”?
Intrigued to know more.

[Vicky.]

Originally Posted by optimisticcynic

There is often an issue differentiating between gender identity and gender role. I am happy to admit that I am baffled as to how people can be born “the wrong gender”. People are born as they are born, and may decide to do something about this at a later time. That is completely their call. But to identify the biryh status as a mistake suggests predestination which majes litgle scientific sense. Is it possible that gender role which is so variable between cultures and times is more at the root of dissonance experienced? Can you be born the wrong race? Wasn’t there huge outrage when religious groups have claimes that people have been born with the wrong sexuality and that this can and should be “fixed”?
Intrigued to know more.

Apparently not, but I actually do not see the difference between transgender and transracial, but apparently one is horrendous and the other totally fine The arguments seem to be exactly the same for both, to me.

If we did not live in such a 'gendered' society, I really doubt many trans people would exist, if men could wear dresses and sparkles without other people taking the piss and such. There would still be people with sex dysphoria, much in the way there will still be anorexic people even if the world stops being so obsessed with thinness...but there would not be as many as there are today, thats for sure. For so many 'transgender' people it seems to be about stereotypes rather than body. And its body, not stereotypes that make someone male or female. FFS if we are going on stereotypes followed, I am actually male. if we are going on 'internal gender identity' then I do not exist at all as I do not have one and do not believe in souls.

[Nicky91]

calling India a woman is shocking indeed, since i still see many male things about ha

i do get the feeling India went into CBB to argue, moan, whine and make everything go on about her

[poppsywoppsy]

Originally Posted by Nicky91

calling India a woman is shocking indeed, since i still see many male things about ha

i do get the feeling India went into CBB to argue, moan, whine and make everything go on about her

I agree but would add that my feelings are that India went in to show how brave she has been, how wonderful she was for highlighting her struggles, educating the morons on every aspect of her 50 years as a man in the wrong body and never letting anybody forget how she has transitioned by getting her false boobs out at every opportunity to prove she is now a real woman.

It hasn't happened the way she wanted and her pique at realizing it is manifesting itself in petty spitefulness and throwing her toys out of the pram.

[Gusto Brunt]

Originally Posted by Nicky91

calling India a woman is shocking indeed, since i still see many male things about her

i do get the feeling India went into CBB to argue, moan, whine and make everything go on about her

[Shaun]

Originally Posted by Livia

Not being attracted to someone isn't racist. If someone's not into black guys, I think that's just like not being into blonde guys, or guys with tats. For some men, dating India would be like dating a man, she looks like a man - I'm stating that as a fact and not to be insulting. We can't all pretend that fancy everyone so as not to offend, surely! I'm pretty sure there are men out there who wouldn't date me for a variety of reasons... and one of them would be because I'm Jewish. My reaction is that it's their loss.

It's generalising every single black person as the same - not worthy of your body, how is it not racist? It's not hateful, sure, but I'm entirely uncomfortable with just going "no jews, no latinos" or whatever on a dating profile. Maybe I'm just not fussy

Originally Posted by bitontheslide

I wouldn't go out with a guy, that's writing off an entire demographic too and perfectly acceptable. Sometimes its ok

An interesting point but is more down to your requirement of a sexual partner (presumably, not a penis) rather than something like their skin colour, hair colour, operation history etc.

[Livia]

Originally Posted by Shaun

It's generalising every single black person as the same - not worthy of your body, how is it not racist? It's not hateful, sure, but I'm entirely uncomfortable with just going "no jews, no latinos" or whatever on a dating profile. Maybe I'm just not fussy

Well, that is what I heard............

[Marsh.]

Originally Posted by Shaun

It's generalising every single black person as the same - not worthy of your body, how is it not racist? It's not hateful, sure, but I'm entirely uncomfortable with just going "no jews, no latinos" or whatever on a dating profile. Maybe I'm just not fussy



An interesting point but is more down to your requirement of a sexual partner (presumably, not a penis) rather than something like their skin colour, hair colour, operation history etc.

Tbf it's not about deciding someone is not "worthy" of your body.

You're either sexually attracted to them or you're not.

[Livia]

India hasn't experienced that whole being a teenage girl, going through puberty, experimenting with makeup and clothes, falling for the wrong bloke... consequently she has no idea how to dress herself as a fifty something woman, or how to act age-appropriately. You would have thought she had some female friends who would tell her straight... unless, as I suspect, she never thinks she's ever wrong. And her performance last night when she found out someone who has no shortage of female attention, didn't want to date her. She was embarrassing. However, I was really impressed with the others, there seems to be a really good, inclusive feeling in there, and I particularly liked Courtney's take on stuff, especially considering how India had insulted her earlier in the evening.

[MTVN]

Eh I can understand why it's a bit of a kick in the teeth for transwomen to hear that their very status as a transwoman rules them out as a viable partner for a lot of men and it undermines what they hoped to become by transitioning. I don't think India's view is that outrageous really and the counterarguments that people were making were quite poor in saying Ginuwine might also not be attracted to Malika etc. because like India said they're not talking about individuals..

[Shaun]

She didn't put herself across well at all but that could very easily have been a disaster area for Ginuwine.

Whilst she made it about herself and everyone seemed to think she was just upset because he wouldn't go for her, she did have a point to be fair in that writing off an entire demographic is a little bit ignorant. It's not acceptable for people to say "I wouldn't date/marry/**** black guys" so this isn't really that different. Might not have found one attractive yet, and the biology might be confusing/off-putting, but it's still a sweeping generalisation, and something that a lot of people can excuse their bigotries with calling it "a preference".

Reminds me of that Sky show about 15 years ago, 'There's Something About Miriam'. It's very possible for people to pass as sexually desirable until someone mentions the dirty word and you have to wonder how many of those on that show would indeed have slept with her without the stigma. I have to admit I'm not well-versed on the biology/practicality of full MTF genital surgery though.

Sadly I think a lot of transphobia is going to be peddled because India happens to be a self-centred, ignorant drama queen, and that's not fair on her or anyone who's a little less whiney.

[bots]

Originally Posted by Shaun

She didn't put herself across well at all but that could very easily have been a disaster area for Ginuwine.

Whilst she made it about herself and everyone seemed to think she was just upset because he wouldn't go for her, she did have a point to be fair in that writing off an entire demographic is a little bit ignorant. It's not acceptable for people to say "I wouldn't date/marry/**** black guys" so this isn't really that different. Might not have found one attractive yet, and the biology might be confusing/off-putting, but it's still a sweeping generalisation, and something that a lot of people can excuse their bigotries with calling it "a preference".

Reminds me of that Sky show about 15 years ago, 'There's Something About Miriam'. It's very possible for people to pass as sexually desirable until someone mentions the dirty word and you have to wonder how many of those on that show would indeed have slept with her without the stigma. I have to admit I'm not well-versed on the biology/practicality of full MTF genital surgery though.

Sadly I think a lot of transphobia is going to be peddled because India happens to be a self-centred, ignorant drama queen, and that's not fair on her or anyone who's a little less whiney.

I wouldn't go out with a guy, that's writing off an entire demographic too and perfectly acceptable. Sometimes its ok

[MTVN]

Originally Posted by Shaun

She didn't put herself across well at all but that could very easily have been a disaster area for Ginuwine.

Whilst she made it about herself and everyone seemed to think she was just upset because he wouldn't go for her, she did have a point to be fair in that writing off an entire demographic is a little bit ignorant. It's not acceptable for people to say "I wouldn't date/marry/**** black guys" so this isn't really that different. Might not have found one attractive yet, and the biology might be confusing/off-putting, but it's still a sweeping generalisation, and something that a lot of people can excuse their bigotries with calling it "a preference".

Reminds me of that Sky show about 15 years ago, 'There's Something About Miriam'. It's very possible for people to pass as sexually desirable until someone mentions the dirty word and you have to wonder how many of those on that show would indeed have slept with her without the stigma. I have to admit I'm not well-versed on the biology/practicality of full MTF genital surgery though.

Sadly I think a lot of transphobia is going to be peddled because India happens to be a self-centred, ignorant drama queen, and that's not fair on her or anyone who's a little less whiney.