[Nicky91]

Originally Posted by arista

ew at that nasty headline

no need for such nastiness to anyone, since we are all in this together in this horrible coronacrisis

[Ammi]

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet

the District Nurse just came and finally me old mam got the vaccine

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet

Bit worried that my mum who is a literal pincushion yelped a bit

....amazing.....such a relief, LT...and she was probably yelping for you/at the thought of you having it...thinking, well this is perfectly fine for me but what about that middle generation LT, he’s such a lightweight...will he cope..?...he’s no TS, you know...

[user104658]

Originally Posted by Nicky91

ew at that nasty headline



no need for such nastiness to anyone, since we are all in this together in this horrible coronacrisis

Of course it's a nasty headline - it's "the daily star"... Most of their headlines are completely false.

On this occasion though there is an element of truth there - the scaremongering that's come from Europe about vaccines, on multiple occasions, has fed right into the hands of people who are against vaccines AND into the anxieties of people who want to be vaccinated but are scared. It remains to be seen what effect it'll have on overall uptake, but it certainly will have had an effect, and this will cost lives. I'm sorry but the politicians and press from Europe has been quite reckless with this one. The medical experts it seems were NEVER calling for a halt but many nations went ahead for political reasons... Now they're re-starting saying all is well, but the damage is done. Confidence has been eroded.

[Nicky91]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

Of course it's a nasty headline - it's "the daily star"... Most of their headlines are completely false.

On this occasion though there is an element of truth there - the scaremongering that's come from Europe about vaccines, on multiple occasions, has fed right into the hands of people who are against vaccines AND into the anxieties of people who want to be vaccinated but are scared. It remains to be seen what effect it'll have on overall uptake, but it certainly will have had an effect, and this will cost lives. I'm sorry but the politicians and press from Europe has been quite reckless with this one. The medical experts it seems were NEVER calling for a halt but many nations went ahead for political reasons... Now they're re-starting saying all is well, but the damage is done. Confidence has been eroded.

our europe is not scaremongering though

fake news

[user104658]

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet

Bit worried that my mum who is a literal pincushion yelped a bit



mind you she had blood taken from her artery a week ago and said that the covid jag was a walk in the park in comparison

The jab itself was basically painless, my wife said the same of Pfizer, if you don't look you'd barely know it happened at the time. It's a small needle and a relatively small volume of fluid that goes in. She might have been unlucky if they (literally) hit a nerve.

[Nicky91]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

The jab itself was basically painless, my wife said the same of Pfizer, if you don't look you'd barely know it happened at the time. It's a small needle and a relatively small volume of fluid that goes in. She might have been unlucky if they (literally) hit a nerve.

the jab itself is painless, but that is not the important bit


its what goes inside you, toxic trash from chimp virus

[AnnieK]

Originally Posted by Nicky91

the jab itself is painless, but that is not the important bit


its what goes inside you, toxic trash from chimp virus

Its saving lives Nicky... its not toxic trash

[user104658]

Originally Posted by Nicky91

our europe is not scaremongering though



fake news

I don't know what else you can call it? Halting vaccines when there's no medical evidence that it's necessary to do so, heavily reporting on issues that haven't been properly investigated... It may not be deliberate scaremongering but at the very least, the effects of casting doubt on vaccination were not properly thought through. And this is coming from someone who absolutely understands the importance of informed consent with vaccines and has always championed that; the medical risks should always be explained and outlined... but massive halts were put in place and reports put out without them being medically verified at all.

[Nicky91]

Originally Posted by AnnieK

Its saving lives Nicky... its not toxic trash

no, it doesn't save lives

the virus will go away on its own at some point, like spanish flu 100 yrs ago, ok 50 million have died but it did go away without a vaccine

[user104658]

Originally Posted by Nicky91

the jab itself is painless, but that is not the important bit





its what goes inside you, toxic trash from chimp virus

Can you properly outline your concerns about what's in them Nicky? Because compared to MANY routine vaccines these Covid ones are actually relatively "clean" in terms of their contents.

Have you had vaccines before like measles/MMR, etc?

[AnnieK]

Originally Posted by Nicky91

no, it doesn't save lives

the virus will go away on its own at some point, like spanish flu 100 yrs ago, ok 50 million have died but it did go away without a vaccine

How does it not save lives? Have you seen our numbers of deaths and ventilation patients since the start of the programme?

You would rather millions more die needlessly? That's a terrible attitude to have

[Nicky91]

Originally Posted by AnnieK

How does it not save lives? Have you seen our numbers of deaths and ventilation patients since the start of the programme?

You would rather millions more die needlessly? That's a terrible attitude to have

no, but here you got blood clots with this vaccine, also not good


i refuse the vaccine since i am young anyway, i can take my chances with corona but not that i myself socialize a lot or go to many places anyway (also gonna go on holiday this year again, to that cabin/bungalow but more extra thorough even more than normal cleaning and disinfecting the whole place, wearing face mask, gloves)

[Ammi]

...I was chatting with my nieces a few days ago...they both live in Paris...and their estimated time atm for their age group etc...to be vaccinated...?...is around 2023, so obviously hugely behind us in this country...I think, whereas we are thinking about decisions on vaccinations now and the for and against etc...other countries have got a lot more deliberating to do in that in between time, we don’t know if any new developments that would impact decisions etc...

[user104658]

Originally Posted by Nicky91

no, it doesn't save lives



the virus will go away on its own at some point, like spanish flu 100 yrs ago, ok 50 million have died but it did go away without a vaccine

The virus that caused Spanish flu didn't "go away", it was H1N1 influenza and very much still exists. The pandemic did burn out on its own eventually, yes, and Covid-19 probably would too eventually.

The point is that in doing that, millions of people would die. Several hundred million with global population what it is right now, to be honest.

Also if we have to carry on with lockdowns much longer, there's just no coming back from it.

[bots]

nicky clearly read some bs on twitter, so thats his view for the hour. Quite frankly, i don't care if others dont take the vaccine, that's up to them. Covid isn't going away. We will never achieve world wide herd immunity, so whether someone decides to take it or not is largely irrelevant. Those who choose vaccination will end up getting an annual booster to cope with the latest dominant strain, and life will continue

[Nicky91]

Originally Posted by Ammi

...I was chatting with my nieces a few days ago...they both live in Paris...and their estimated time atm for their age group etc...to be vaccinated...?...is around 2023, so obviously hugely behind us in this country...I think, whereas we are thinking about decisions on vaccinations now and the first and against etc...other countries have got a lot more deliberating to do first and in that in between time, we don’t know if any new developments that would impact decisions etc...

yes this quick vaccine rollout might be helpful for the UK, but british people even when vaccinated you can still carry and spread the virus onto not vaccinated people, so still you must stick to covid guidelines when going on holiday outside UK again etc

also every country has a different approach to this pandemic, we really shouldn't be nasty to other countries governments, their health/medical experts

[Ammi]

...to be fair to Nicky, he’s not having to make decisions so early as us...(...I don’t think...)...so he’s absorbing lots of information on all aspects...Nicky, when would it be estimated for you to have a vaccination, do you know...?..

[Nicky91]

Originally Posted by Ammi

...to be fair to Nicky, he’s not having to make decisions so early as us...(...I don’t think...)...so he’s absorbing lots of information on all aspects...Nicky, when would it be estimated for you to have a vaccination, do you know...?..

i really have no idea for my age group

[Ammi]

Originally Posted by Nicky91

i really have no idea for my age group

...actually it looks as though it might be this year sometime but I don’t know the accuracy of the site that I looked at...

[Nicky91]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

The virus that caused Spanish flu didn't "go away", it was H1N1 influenza and very much still exists. The pandemic did burn out on its own eventually, yes, and Covid-19 probably would too eventually.

The point is that in doing that, millions of people would die. Several hundred million with global population what it is right now, to be honest.

Also if we have to carry on with lockdowns much longer, there's just no coming back from it.

yes you got a good point on lockdowns, it just feels like a safety zone for me to get numbers down

but you're right, everyone needs to adapt to the new normal i think


also vaccinating should always remain a free choice, i feel like we only need to protect the more vulnerable and elderly risk groups to get numbers down

but to slow down the spread into making it burn out i guess if we get up to 70 or 75% vaccinated all countries i mean herd immunity idea

[AnnieK]

Originally Posted by Nicky91

yes you got a good point on lockdowns, it just feels like a safety zone for me to get numbers down

but you're right, everyone needs to adapt to the new normal i think


also vaccinating should always remain a free choice, i feel like we only need to protect the more vulnerable and elderly risk groups to get numbers down

but to slow down the spread into making it burn out i guess if we get up to 70 or 75% vaccinated all countries i mean herd immunity idea

The problem with only locking down and not getting vaccines into as many people as possible is that it is not sustainable. We cannot stay locked down forever, or very much longer really, we know need to get moving again or the economic effects will be irreversible.

[user104658]

Originally Posted by AnnieK

The problem with only locking down and not getting vaccines into as many people as possible is that it is not sustainable. We cannot stay locked down forever, or very much longer really, we know need to get moving again or the economic effects will be irreversible.

I've actually started to see that in theory the economy could adapt in relatively short time; more remote working, more automisation of manufacturing/warehouse type work, retail moving almost entirely online, and then Universal Basic Income given to those who would be working in those unskilled/low wage positions... I mean, what is furlough/Universal Credit if not a rudimentary form of that? They'd have to finally get around to adapting taxation on the massive companies to fund it, but those companies would have a massively reduced labour bill anyway.

What is a bigger concern and on the verge of being truly devastating is the psychological effects of lockdown with no end in sight. Human beings are group-living/social animals and even family groups are somewhat isolating .. .. we're not "supposed to" live like this and it can't go on indefinitely without huge, largely unknown, sociological effects.

[bots]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

I've actually started to see that in theory the economy could adapt in relatively short time; more remote working, more automisation of manufacturing/warehouse type work, retail moving almost entirely online, and then Universal Basic Income given to those who would be working in those unskilled/low wage positions... I mean, what is furlough/Universal Credit if not a rudimentary form of that? They'd have to finally get around to adapting taxation on the massive companies to fund it, but those companies would have a massively reduced labour bill anyway.

What is a bigger concern and on the verge of being truly devastating is the psychological effects of lockdown with no end in sight. Human beings are group-living/social animals and even family groups are somewhat isolating .. .. we're not "supposed to" live like this and it can't go on indefinitely without huge, largely unknown, sociological effects.

we already adapted having many more working than in the first lock down. The areas that suffer are physical retail and the hospitality/entertainment industries which are going to suffer from any pandemic.

Now that the vulnerable are vaccinated, the death rate will drop to single digits by April and if a booster vaccination is required every year, so be it. I think we need to look at the positives that came from this. Vaccination technology has progressed exponentially, working off site is easily feasible, business flights will sustain at a low level

[Vicky.]

Originally Posted by Cherie

They are only started doing the over 55's in the last two weeks?

I forget this seems to be..regional. Ours appear to be on 35-40 now and have been for the past week or so!

[Nicky91]

Originally Posted by AnnieK

The problem with only locking down and not getting vaccines into as many people as possible is that it is not sustainable. We cannot stay locked down forever, or very much longer really, we know need to get moving again or the economic effects will be irreversible.

which is why we need to figure out ways of a new normal where we can also work on the economic health, as well as ourselves staying safe


we cannot rely on a lockdown AND a vaccine (bc latter well once you got the vaccine you will have to have this vaccine every year same as regular flu)