[Kizzy]

No

[Withano]

He took part in three live debates and made a twat of himself. People who get persuaded by a speech he didnt write are hopeless.

[Withano]

I got to 56 seconds. Why is he talking about divisions being a bad thing when basically saying we need more of it is why hes doing so well in the first place? I wont watch the rest for my sanity.

[Toy Soldier]

Originally Posted by Withano

People who get persuaded by a speech he didn't write are hopeless.

Exactly. Huge part of the problem with Trump support. He simply promises people the world, grand statements about putting "American Steel into the spine of the US", "Making America Great Again" and people just lap it up.

They are words. Nothing more. He tells people what they want to hear and is like "Yeah we'll do this, and this, and yep we'll totally do that too!" with very little idea of how any of it is actually going to happen or be vaguely possible (because most of it isn't).

"Speech that would convince most people on here to support him"? Anyone who finds themselves swayed or convinced by any contrived slice of oratory, in any situation, is an idiot. The same people who are swayed into buying any product because the advertising was good. That's all it is. Advertising. And the product very rarely lives up to the hype.

...He's the "No Man's Sky" of candidates.

[Toy Soldier]

Originally Posted by the truth

.

Rebuilding the industries

His plan is extremely vague and not even a clue as to funding it, he seems to think he can just "do it". "I'm gunna build 20 million new factories y'all!"


Increasing tariffs on chinese steel

His idea being that this will revive American steel. In reality it'll just make most large projects involving steel unaffordable. e.g. the above factories.


Raising taxes on those taking american jobs abroad

Again, sounds like a positive but he's offered nothing on how this would actually be implemented or how this would actually work. He also assumes blindly that it will result in more "American jobs for Americans" - rather than the entire companies simply relocating.


reducing government red tape on small businesses
This is designed to benefit people who are already multi-millionaires. "Small" does not mean your local take-away owner. At the same time it also essentially means reduced regulation / more shady and underhanded business tactics making things worse for the average worker.


spending more on war veterans
This is a simple buzz-policy. Most people have a war vet in their family or at least know one. A policy purely designed for public opinion. Great if he actually does it, but essentially it's little more than a relatively inexpensive popularity boost.


protecting the borders against criminal illegal immigrants entering
Will cost a fortune and have little to zero practical effect. He won't stop illegal immigration or even reduce it by more than a few %. Another vanity project for people to dribble over.


Tax breaks for american businesses who remain in the usa and reduce their regulation to help them grow home grown jobs.

See above. This will benefit people who are already millionaires, whilst damaging working conditions for employees.

to stop supplying weapons to so called rebels we dont even know across the middle east when the weapons often end up in the hands of ISIS

Again, whilst this would be great (if every country would it it), in reality it's just "buzz politics" and will have little to zero practical effect. The terrorists will still be armed, the policy will change absolutely nothing, other than being able to say "Well it's not us arming them". Of course it's the right thing to do but it isn't going to "improve America" or the world in any practical way, only morally.

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

Exactly. Huge part of the problem with Trump support. He simply promises people the world, grand statements about putting "American Steel into the spine of the US", "Making America Great Again" and people just lap it up.

They are words. Nothing more. He tells people what they want to hear and is like "Yeah we'll do this, and this, and yep we'll totally do that too!" with very little idea of how any of it is actually going to happen or be vaguely possible (because most of it isn't).

"Speech that would convince most people on here to support him"? Anyone who finds themselves swayed or convinced by any contrived slice of oratory, in any situation, is an idiot. The same people who are swayed into buying any product because the advertising was good. That's all it is. Advertising. And the product very rarely lives up to the hype.

...He's the "No Man's Sky" of candidates.

It worked here is why... We lapped all the 'taking back control' and 'sovereignty' rubbish, our gullible believed it and theirs will too.

[Northern Monkey]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

It worked here is why... We lapped all the 'taking back control' and 'sovereignty' rubbish, our gullible believed it and theirs will too.

So anyone who voted leave are gullible now?Nice way to insult more than half of the voting public

[kirklancaster]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

Exactly. Huge part of the problem with Trump support. He simply promises people the world, grand statements about putting "American Steel into the spine of the US", "Making America Great Again" and people just lap it up.

They are words. Nothing more. He tells people what they want to hear and is like "Yeah we'll do this, and this, and yep we'll totally do that too!" with very little idea of how any of it is actually going to happen or be vaguely possible (because most of it isn't).

"Speech that would convince most people on here to support him"? Anyone who finds themselves swayed or convinced by any contrived slice of oratory, in any situation, is an idiot. The same people who are swayed into buying any product because the advertising was good. That's all it is. Advertising. And the product very rarely lives up to the hype.

...He's the "No Man's Sky" of candidates.

I actually agree with most of your post T.S.

But your points apply equally to ALL political aspirants to any 'High Office' in ANY Democratic country of the world, not just to Donald Trump and the USA Presidential race.

Further;

Although, as you rightly say, MOST pre-Election promises made by politicians seeking office are NOT kept, NO ONE can ever absolutely state with total certainty that such promises will definitely not be kept, because such prescience cannot be verified until after the election - indeed, after the term of office of the Elected politician who made the promises has actually ended.

Then, and ONLY then, can anyone say with absolute certainty that pre-Election promises were NOT kept.

[Toy Soldier]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

It worked here is why... We lapped all the 'taking back control' and 'sovereignty' rubbish, our gullible believed it and theirs will too.

That's why I have money on Trump to win, Kizzy

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by Northern Monkey

So anyone who voted leave are gullible now?Nice way to insult more than half of the voting public

In my opinion yes, or at best misguided... overly optimistic that the lies they were being fed were going to come to anything.
It corresponds very well to the blind faith in Trump to 'make America great again' it's just a mantra, it means nothing.

[kirklancaster]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

It worked here is why... We lapped all the 'taking back control' and 'sovereignty' rubbish, our gullible believed it and theirs will too.

I'm afraid that your post - in addition to being personally insulting to those of us who voted to Brexit - is not only absolute meaningless nonsense, but also PREMATURE absolute meaningless nonsense at that.

We have NOT YET Brexited.

Knee-Jerk reactions and 'Private Fraser' type irrational screaming of 'We're Doomed, we're all doomed' are ludicrous.

[Toy Soldier]

Originally Posted by kirklancaster

I actually agree with most of your post T.S.

But your points apply equally to ALL political aspirants to any 'High Office' in ANY Democratic country of the world, not just to Donald Trump and the USA Presidential race.

Further;

Although, as you rightly say, MOST pre-Election promises made by politicians seeking office are NOT kept, NO ONE can ever absolutely state with total certainty that such promises will definitely not be kept, because such prescience cannot be verified until after the election - indeed, after the term of office of the Elected politician who made the promises has actually ended.

Then, and ONLY then, can anyone say with absolute certainty that pre-Election promises were NOT kept.

True, it's the system that's a mess more than any one candidate. The other "side" of Trump support being those who don't believe his rhetoric, but think that electing someone like Trump will "change the game"... which I very much doubt it will.

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by kirklancaster

I'm afraid that your post - in addition to being personally insulting to those of us who voted to Brexit - is not only absolute meaningless nonsense, but also PREMATURE absolute meaningless nonsense at that.

We have NOT YET Brexited.

Knee-Jerk reactions and 'Private Fraser' type irrational screaming of 'We're Doomed, we're all doomed' are ludicrous.

I know we haven't, and yet we know any pre referendum promises were lies already.
The same will happen with all these pie crust promises from trump.

[kirklancaster]

Originally Posted by Withano

I got to 56 seconds. Why is he talking about divisions being a bad thing when basically saying we need more of it is why hes doing so well in the first place? I wont watch the rest for my sanity.

Not for the first time in Serious Debate threads, you have just DISQUALIFIED yourself from any right to be even contributing to this debate, and negated any validity which your comments may have otherwise have had.

The OP SPECIFICALLY presented a video of a Donald Trump speech upon which her ENTIRE premise is centred.

How can ANYONE contribute to a debate when - by their own admission they have NOT watched the video which is pivotal to such debate?

A post which criticises, condemns, disputes or dismisses another poster's premise without comprehensive examination of that premise, is more bigoted comment than contributory discussion.

And I AM referring to your posts here NOT you personally, just to be perfectly clear.

[Toy Soldier]

Originally Posted by kirklancaster

Not for the first time in Serious Debate threads, you have just DISQUALIFIED yourself from any right to be even contributing to this debate, and negated any validity which your comments may have otherwise have had.

The OP SPECIFICALLY presented a video of a Donald Trump speech upon which her ENTIRE premise is centred.

How can ANYONE contribute to a debate when - by their own admission they have NOT watched the video which is pivotal to such debate?

A post which criticises, condemns, disputes or dismisses another poster's premise without comprehensive examination of that premise, is more bigoted comment than contributory discussion.

And I AM referring to your posts here NOT you personally, just to be perfectly clear.

Wait wait wait wait wait...

Wait...

...wait...

...Liberty4eva is female?

[kirklancaster]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

I know we haven't, and yet we know any pre referendum promises were lies already.
The same will happen with all these pie crust promises from trump.

You KNOW NOTHING about FUTURE events.

You can suspect, surmise, suggest, but you CANNOT 'know' until TIME has elapsed to prove your suspicions.

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by kirklancaster

You KNOW NOTHING about FUTURE events.

You can suspect, surmise, suggest, but you CANNOT 'know' until TIME has elapsed to prove your suspicions.

Like it did with the referendum?....Ok.

[Tom4784]

Nothing could make me support him when his policies are both flimsy and beneficial to the wrong people.

That's without taking into account that he has zero leadership qualities, his repugnant personality, and most importantly of all, his lack of political and democratic skill and prowess.

[Withano]

Originally Posted by Northern Monkey

So anyone who voted leave are gullible now?Nice way to insult more than half of the voting public

Tbf, its probably fallen down to a quarter now they can see what theyve done to the pound

[Withano]

Originally Posted by kirklancaster

Not for the first time in Serious Debate threads, you have just DISQUALIFIED yourself from any right to be even contributing to this debate, and negated any validity which your comments may have otherwise have had.

The OP SPECIFICALLY presented a video of a Donald Trump speech upon which her ENTIRE premise is centred.

How can ANYONE contribute to a debate when - by their own admission they have NOT watched the video which is pivotal to such debate?

A post which criticises, condemns, disputes or dismisses another poster's premise without comprehensive examination of that premise, is more bigoted comment than contributory discussion.

And I AM referring to your posts here NOT you personally, just to be perfectly clear.

Yeh i wasnt planning on sticking around, the -I love Trump and so should you- threads are nauseating. I didnt reply with anything i thought was worth discussing, i just left a throwaway statement after wasting my time here for a bit.. But a thread with a video which lasts 36 minutes and shows obvious flaws in the first 1 minute shouldnt be taken seriously really so im not sure if this thread has a place on the SERIOUS debates section at all. I suppose thats a debate in itself which im open to discussing. Unless somebody with a good reputation round here can promise me that the last 35 isnt more of the exact same then i think my opinion is just as valid as yours, and i dont think youve said anything worthwhile here either.

If you want to dismiss the feelings of those who only watched one minute of the video, then perhaps dont reply to their comments? That is well within your capabilities. But I've noticed before and not for the first time in a serious debates thread that youre very bad at this and often spend your words being confused and angry at people who disagree with you.

[Northern Monkey]

As was said on Question Time.
Donald Trump is definitely not an ideal candidate for president.
However compared with Hilary he is a Boy Scout.Anyone else who did what Hilary has done would be in prison and definitely not running for the position of The President of The United States of America,the land of the free,the greatest country in the world etc etc.
Another good point was that Donald Trump has not been complicit in many of the awful decisions and corruption in American politics over the last twenty years.Hilary quite clearly has.
If i was a US citizen I wouldn't vote.

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by kirklancaster

Not for the first time in Serious Debate threads, you have just DISQUALIFIED yourself from any right to be even contributing to this debate, and negated any validity which your comments may have otherwise have had.

The OP SPECIFICALLY presented a video of a Donald Trump speech upon which her ENTIRE premise is centred.

How can ANYONE contribute to a debate when - by their own admission they have NOT watched the video which is pivotal to such debate?

A post which criticises, condemns, disputes or dismisses another poster's premise without comprehensive examination of that premise, is more bigoted comment than contributory discussion.

And I AM referring to your posts here NOT you personally, just to be perfectly clear.

Nobody needs permission to post do they Kirk? well not yours at least :/

[Tom4784]

Supporting Trump just doesn't make much sense, there's not really an argument for him that holds water. Hillary could gun down a school and she'd still be a better candidate.

He has no political knowledge or skill, his policies are both weak and unrealistic and he'd likely be Russia's puppet. Let's not even get into the business of his party being divided over him or the HUGE fact that he doesn't believe in the democratic process as he basically said he won't accept the result when he loses.

He is a child.

[arista]

Originally Posted by Dezzy

Supporting Trump just doesn't make much sense, there's not really an argument for him that holds water. Hillary could gun down a school and she'd still be a better candidate.

He has no political knowledge or skill, his policies are both weak and unrealistic and he'd likely be Russia's puppet. Let's not even get into the business of his party being divided over him or the HUGE fact that he doesn't believe in the democratic process as he basically said he won't accept the result when he loses.

He is a child.

No Dezzy
He is a wordsmith
That is helping the Half of America Dumped
With no future or no jobs,

He will get. Rid of Clinton Corruption
Give him a go

[Toy Soldier]

Originally Posted by Dezzy

Supporting Trump just doesn't make much sense, there's not really an argument for him that holds water. Hillary could gun down a school and she'd still be a better candidate.

He has no political knowledge or skill, his policies are both weak and unrealistic and he'd likely be Russia's puppet. Let's not even get into the business of his party being divided over him or the HUGE fact that he doesn't believe in the democratic process as he basically said he won't accept the result when he loses.

He is a child.

The argument appears to be that Hillary has been involved in "dodgy" political activity whereas Trump has not... conveniently overlooking the fact that Trump has not been in the position to be involved in said activity, as he has only recently become involved in politics. If Trump had been a politician for decades, do we imagine that he would be this "squeaky clean boy scout"? Hmmm. Hillary has a closet full of skeletons like every other high profile career politician. Is this ideal? No, but it is "the norm", and as bad as "the norm" is... Trump is just not the answer. It's like the US voters are trying to put out a fire by throwing petrol on it.