[Kazanne]

Originally Posted by Jack_

Maybe you should both lighten up a little? Unless you're not aware of the song it's taken from idk

I happen to think exercising your democratic right to protest is highly intelligent, actually. Using the word '****' doesn't negate that, astounded that people think it does.

Do you actually think ALL those people there know what they are protesting about? If one were asked I doubt they'de have a clue. This is just hysteria gone mad.

[Toy Soldier]

TBQFH I think this is a red herring. As I said on Livia's thread, for one, the wording of the petition about offending the poor little queen makes me puke. I am against not just our monarchy, but the very concept of royalty and everything it stands for.

Secondly... as awful as Trump is... what makes him truly awful is the fact that he is the president of the United States, and all of the implications that come with that. In terms of world leaders in general, if we're comparing them like-for-like, if you're going to ban Trump you'd have to ban about 80% of the rest of them too ...

[Livia]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

TBQFH I think this is a red herring. As I said on Livia's thread, for one, the wording of the petition about offending the poor little queen makes me puke. I am against not just our monarchy, but the very concept of royalty and everything it stands for.

Secondly... as awful as Trump is... what makes him truly awful is the fact that he is the president of the United States, and all of the implications that come with that. In terms of world leaders in general, if we're comparing them like-for-like, if you're going to ban Trump you'd have to ban about 80% of the rest of them too ...

I agree with you TS. Someone alert the media...

[Toy Soldier]

Originally Posted by Kazanne

Do you actually think ALL those people there know what they are protesting about? If one were asked I doubt they'de have a clue. This is just hysteria gone mad.

Nah. If it was summer, maybe. People are FAR too lazy / cosy to go out in the winter just for the sake of it. You could maybe argue that they don't all have the best reasoning skills and don't REALLY understand all of the politics behind it, that would be a fair (almost inevitable) assumption, but I think everyone "in general" does know what it's about and why they instinctively "don't like this".

[Cherie]

Originally Posted by Jack_

That is inspired. One of the best protest chants of all time?

It felt more like dumbing down the issue than ensuring it was taken seriously

[Toy Soldier]

Originally Posted by Cherie

It felt more like dumbing down the issue than ensuring it was taken seriously

I have to admit that's something that bug me too. Much harder to have an issue taken seriously when there are brainless mob chants going on. This of course applies to both sides with the whole Trump thing, some of the pro-Trump mobs... ... let's just say I think more than a few long-lost cousins were running into each other at those.

[jaxie]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

TBQFH I think this is a red herring. As I said on Livia's thread, for one, the wording of the petition about offending the poor little queen makes me puke. I am against not just our monarchy, but the very concept of royalty and everything it stands for.

Secondly... as awful as Trump is... what makes him truly awful is the fact that he is the president of the United States, and all of the implications that come with that. In terms of world leaders in general, if we're comparing them like-for-like, if you're going to ban Trump you'd have to ban about 80% of the rest of them too ...

Nicely put. Sort of what I meant when I said there were others who have a worse record but you kind of said it better I think. Nice to be able to agree with you for a change though I will say the pomp and ceremony of royalty isn't bad for the tourist industry.

Baying mobs look pretty ignorant, whatever they are baying about.

[Toy Soldier]

Originally Posted by jaxie

Nicely put. Nice to be able to agree with you for a change though I will say the pomp and ceremony of royalty isn't bad for the tourist industry.

My feeling on that one is that disbanding the monarchy would have very little effect on the tourist industry vs having a historical monarchy, and it even opens up the possibility of truly opened up tourist hotspots in ex-royal buildings. I am far from convinced that the relatively modest money the Active Royal Tourism industry brings in justifies the subliminal sociological message that the concept of Royalty / "hereditary superiority" oozes into the public mindset. I think it by design is supposed to remind us that we are "less than"... and I have major issues with that, for any amount of money. I whole-heartedly believe that every individual is at least BORN equal, whether they're being neglected in a mouldy tower block or cherished like Precious Little George.

...but this is pretty majorly off topic so...

[Jack_]

Originally Posted by Kazanne

Do you actually think ALL those people there know what they are protesting about? If one were asked I doubt they'de have a clue. This is just hysteria gone mad.

Do you think ALL the people who voted to leave the EU, or for Trump, or for the Tories at the last general election - knew what they were voting for?

You could apply the same supposition to almost anything, it's like delete as applicable to whatever particular cause you wish to belittle. The number of people there who know what they're protesting about is irrelevant, the very fact that people are exercising their democratic right (one that, btw, is chastised far too much for my liking in recent years - it's almost as if people have little understanding of its worth and history) is a good thing, people say the same about voting and this works in exactly the same way.

I also think the reason for this protest is getting lost in translation. It is both against him being afforded an official 'state' visit at the expense of the tax payer (as opposed to him visiting on his own terms), and the related issue of anti-racism and Islamaphobia. People seem to be forgetting that many dual nationals in Britain were and are directly affected by the policy, and Theresa May's reluctance to condemn such an abhorrent stance is a stain on Britain's image. If the Prime Minister of the US' closest neighbour can publicly criticise it, I think we're more than capable of not disappearing up the arse of Donald ****ing Trump.

[DemolitionRed]

Originally Posted by Jack_

Do you think ALL the people who voted to leave the EU, or for Trump, or for the Tories at the last general election - knew what they were voting for?

You could apply the same supposition to almost anything, it's like delete as applicable to whatever particular cause you wish to belittle. The number of people there who know what they're protesting about is irrelevant, the very fact that people are exercising their democratic right (one that, btw, is chastised far too much for my liking in recent years - it's almost as if people have little understanding of its worth and history) is a good thing, people say the same about voting and this works in exactly the same way.

I also think the reason for this protest is getting lost in translation. It is both against him being afforded an official 'state' visit at the expense of the tax payer (as opposed to him visiting on his own terms), and the related issue of anti-racism and Islamaphobia. People seem to be forgetting that many dual nationals in Britain were and are directly affected by the policy, and Theresa May's reluctance to condemn such an abhorrent stance is a stain on Britain's image. If the Prime Minister of the US' closest neighbour can publicly criticise it, I think we're more than capable of not disappearing up the arse of Donald ****ing Trump.

Well said Jack.

The protests are going to be huge when Trump comes here and I don't doubt that all the Trump loyalists on here will complain about how its costing the taxpayers money.

May dived into her own bear trap and clearly didn't consider the British peoples reaction. Typical Tory leader!

[Tom4784]

Originally Posted by jaxie

You presume a great deal with very few facts.

All this rabid anti Trump reaction is bizarre to me when there are bigger fish to fry but as is often the case those with a bee in their bonnet are not listening to other opinions or to common sense.

In my view it's about picking your battles and this isn't the right one. Maybe it's because Trump is a 'safe' target.

I presume nothing, if the greatest security minds in the world are in agreement that this ban achieving nothing but inflaming the situation then I'm gonna respect their experience and knowledge in the field and pay attention.

If there are 'bigger fish to fry' then why aren't you concerning yourself with them instead? People get involved in issues that are meaningful to them, you are not the judge of what is and isn't important.

Trump has pretty much flouted the foundation that the US was built upon and the ban is pretty much unconstitutional, if you think people are 'picking a safe target' rather than protesting a serious issue that does affect the world then that's worrying.

All leaders should be held accountable for their actions, this need to protect Trump from peaceful protesting and opposing opinions is rather grim.

[Livia]

Originally Posted by DemolitionRed

Well said Jack.

The protests are going to be huge when Trump comes here and I don't doubt that all the Trump loyalists on here will complain about how its costing the taxpayers money.

May dived into her own bear trap and clearly didn't consider the British peoples reaction. Typical Tory leader!

Please stop calling forum members who don't agree with you "Trump loyalists". It's very narrow-minded and nothing's that black and white. I do not support Trump, but I support his right to come here as a democratically elected president.

[jaxie]

Originally Posted by DemolitionRed

Well said Jack.

The protests are going to be huge when Trump comes here and I don't doubt that all the Trump loyalists on here will complain about how its costing the taxpayers money.

May dived into her own bear trap and clearly didn't consider the British peoples reaction. Typical Tory leader!

I don't support Trump. Why are you calling everyone who disagrees with you a Trump loyalist?

I do think it's ridiculous to pee your panties over a Trump state visit when Putin, Mugabe, Seko, Ceaușescu, Hirohito, Putin and Xi Jinping have all had state visits.

[jaxie]

Originally Posted by Dezzy

I presume nothing, if the greatest security minds in the world are in agreement that this ban achieving nothing but inflaming the situation then I'm gonna respect their experience and knowledge in the field and pay attention.

If there are 'bigger fish to fry' then why aren't you concerning yourself with them instead? People get involved in issues that are meaningful to them, you are not the judge of what is and isn't important.

Trump has pretty much flouted the foundation that the US was built upon and the ban is pretty much unconstitutional, if you think people are 'picking a safe target' rather than protesting a serious issue that does affect the world then that's worrying.

All leaders should be held accountable for their actions, this need to protect Trump from peaceful protesting and opposing opinions is rather grim.

Yeah you presumed I don't protest or that I don't concern myself, and look, you still are. I don't let other minds thing for me, no matter who they are. Sorry you do.

Who said I am protecting trump? I am suggesting those who are overreacting, are, in fact, overreacting. I can admit to being slightly gobsmacked that there wasn't a sniff of all this fuss when Xi Jinping went to visit the Queen.

I have every confidence that the US will deal with this themselves as a free democratic country.

[Tom4784]

Originally Posted by jaxie

Yeah you presumed I don't protest or that I don't concern myself and look you still are.

Who said I am protexcting trump? I am suggesting those who are overreacting, are, in fact, overreacting. I can admit to being slightly gobsmacked that there wasn't a sniff of all this fuss when Xi Jinping went to visit the Queen.

I asked you why you weren't concerning yourself with the 'bigger fish' if this issue isn't that important to you. I don't think I've ever commented on whether or not you protest and I don't care if you do or don't. The opinion that a protest isn't valid unless the protesters also protest other issues is not an opinion I hold, in fact I think I've spoken out about it in this thread.

I guess the one who was doing the presuming was you all along.

[DemolitionRed]

Originally Posted by jaxie

I don't support Trump. Why are you calling everyone who disagrees with you a Trump loyalist?

I do think it's ridiculous to pee your panties over a Trump state visit when Putin, Mugabe, Seko, Ceaușescu, Hirohito, Putin and Xi Jinping have all had state visits.

If all the posters on here were Trump loyalists then I simply wouldn't be here but clearly, there are Trump loyalists on here or do you disagree?

And I don't pee my panties as you are so rudely suggesting, but I do show grave concerns over Trump because American politics have such a huge influence on British politics.

[jaxie]

Originally Posted by DemolitionRed

If all the posters on here were Trump loyalists then I simply wouldn't be here but clearly, there are Trump loyalists on here or do you disagree?

And I don't pee my panties as you are so rudely suggesting, but I do show grave concerns over Trump because American politics have such a huge influence on British politics.

It wasn't personal.

I wouldn't know who is a Trump loyalist or who isn't but it is just as rude to say that in generalisation as it is to assume a wad of people are peeing their panties over a Trump visit. If you don't want people to make potentially rude remarks, then don't give them out. Your grave concerns might be better off encouraging the government to seek dialogue with Trump and try to be a good influential force than to rampage through London and demand he should be shunned. You are smart lady, you should know this.

What disturbs me most of all is that you are more worried about what I said about people peeing their panties, than the list of names I gave.

[jaxie]

Originally Posted by Dezzy

I asked you why you weren't concerning yourself with the 'bigger fish' if this issue isn't that important to you. I don't think I've ever commented on whether or not you protest and I don't care if you do or don't. The opinion that a protest isn't valid unless the protesters also protest other issues is not an opinion I hold, in fact I think I've spoken out about it in this thread.

I guess the one who was doing the presuming was you all along.

Projecting again.

[DemolitionRed]

Originally Posted by jaxie

It wasn't personal.

I wouldn't know who is a Trump loyalist or who isn't but it is just as rude to say that in generalisation as it is to assume a wad of people are peeing their panties over a Trump visit. If you don't want people to make potentially rude remarks, then don't give them out. Your grave concerns might be better off encouraging the government to seek dialogue with Trump and try to a good influential force than to rampage through London and demand he should be shunned. You are smart lady, you should know this.

I'm not allowed to name names.

To be quite frank the sarcasms and put downs (that have come out of your mouth) towards a number of people of late have made the hair on the back of my neck stand up. Keep in mind, you are no innocent in this.

Oh and I didn't rampage through London, I walked peacefully arm to arm with solidarity. Thank fcuk I live in a democracy that allows me to speak out about injustices.

[jaxie]

Originally Posted by DemolitionRed

I'm not allowed to name names.

To be quite frank the sarcasms and put downs (that have come out of your mouth) towards a number of people of late have made the hair on the back of my neck stand up. Keep in mind, you are no innocent in this.

Oh and I didn't rampage through London, I walked peacefully arm to arm with solidarity. Thank fcuk I live in a democracy that allows me to speak out about injustices.

Well I'm sorry I'm disturbing your hairs. I do stand up for myself that's for sure.

Again the phrase rampage through London wasn't personal, just a reflection of the excited rampage through London.

[Brillopad]

Originally Posted by DemolitionRed

I'm not allowed to name names.

To be quite frank the sarcasms and put downs (that have come out of your mouth) towards a number of people of late have made the hair on the back of my neck stand up. Keep in mind, you are no innocent in this.

Oh and I didn't rampage through London, I walked peacefully arm to arm with solidarity. Thank fcuk I live in a democracy that allows me to speak out about injustices.

Oh please, there were a couple of occasions I bit my tongue when you were being downright rude and attempting to put down a poster who isn't rude to anyone because he has an unusual delivery. Patronising and uncomfortable.

[Toy Soldier]

Originally Posted by Livia

Please stop calling forum members who don't agree with you "Trump loyalists". It's very narrow-minded and nothing's that black and white. I do not support Trump, but I support his right to come here as a democratically elected president.

To be fair to DR, there are some Trump (what I would call) Loyalists on the forum. By which I mean, there are people who will literally twist anything and everything into a positive no matter how unrealistic when it comes to anything Trump-related. It does make some threads into a fun "how will this be spun" guessing game, though .

[Kizzy]

There are some bigly trump fans who think it bigly important this leader of the free world with all his prejudices comes to the UK.

[Tom4784]

Originally Posted by jaxie

Projecting again.

Generally if you are going to attempt to mock someone by using their words against them it's general best to do so in a situation that fits the quote.

Keep trying, Jaxie.

[DemolitionRed]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

To be fair to DR, there are some Trump (what I would call) Loyalists on the forum. By which I mean, there are people who will literally twist anything and everything into a positive no matter how unrealistic when it comes to anything Trump-related. It does make some threads into a fun "how will this be spun" guessing game, though .

Thanks TS and as for you Livia, you have the right to be offended even though I didn't offend you directly.