[parmnion]

What with coal being the number one cause in of the worlds pollution and her closing the coal mines?

[arista]

Blair was Connected to Thatcher.
New Labour.

I can see what your saying

[Toy Soldier]

Originally Posted by parmnion

What with coal being the number one cause in of the worlds pollution and her closing the coal mines?

Even if air quality improvements resulted from it, that was hardly why she did it. Coal didn't stop being used as much because there was a lack of supply and people then had to find alternatives... The alternatives started being used and lessened the demand for coal. Her vision was a purely neoliberal one driven by a desire to increase the private sector.

[Scarlett.]

No.

[arista]

Originally Posted by Chewy

No.

Yes its so far back.
No one would know of such
a Future. It was "Chewy" in Star Wars
1st film , for example time.


So I can understand your brief
reply , Chewy.

[bitontheslide]

yes

[joeysteele]

No,not in that sense.

I think part of the mining changes were a bit of revenge for disruption,particularly of Con govt,by the unions.

I ask myself, would I have voted for her had I been born then, likely yes in 1979 and 1983 certainly.
Not so sure as to 1987.

She was more just and fair than the PM we have now for sure and Thatcher probably did have more vision as to success and right on other things.

My Dad,who was a strong solid Conservative was not totally keen on her,he always maintained Michael Heseltine was the best PM the UK never got to have.

So no,Thatcher not a visionary on this issue,a strong,impressive leader no doubt however.

[Northern Monkey]

Well she f’ked up the Argies.

[bitontheslide]

it was visionary in the sense that it was an energy source that was vital to the country and that was being controlled by a bunch of militants, and she directed efforts in removing our dependence on that energy source and its controllers. So, she did the right thing, perhaps not for the right reasons, but people very rarely do things for the right reasons at the time, that usually only becomes clear in hindsight.

[DemolitionRed]

By 'visionary' you mean 'future thinker' and so regardless of the damage she did and the future she created, yes, she was a visionary, but keep in mind Starlin, Hitler and Mussolini were also visionaries. What Thatcher did was pave the way for neoliberalism. Neoliberalism was certainly Thatchers future vision, though I somehow doubt she wanted it to go quite this far... perhaps I'm wrong.

As for the coal industry, she didn't destroy it because coal is a dirty fuel. Good grief, once we'd closed down the mines we started importing coal from overseas! She closed most of the pits or sold them on to private investors because they were not economically viable. Harold Wilsons government closed more pits than she did. The problem with Thatcher was, she supported and encouraged police brutality on picketing miners. She wreaked havoc on long-established communities and that will never be forgotten in pit land north.
She heavily demonized and rallied to destroy unions because unions spoke for the working man. She openly described both the union and the miners as 'enemies within our nation' and her propaganda machine was so good, the older generation today still curse British unions! Thatcher created the most bitter industrial dispute in British history.

There are many unforgivable things Thatcher did but a few that come to mind are: She promoted and brought about a new act against homosexuality which resulted in resentment and distrust of the LGBT community (something Cameron apologized for in 2009) and she did this under the guise of, "we must protect our children.

She openly supported human right abusers like Augusto Pinochet and the South African apartheid.

She divided ethnic minorities which brought about the Brixton riots.

She was actually quite a brutal woman.

[LeatherTrumpet]

yes and she paved the way for women in top jobs

history will be very kind to her going forward

[DemolitionRed]

Originally Posted by bitontheslide

it was visionary in the sense that it was an energy source that was vital to the country and that was being controlled by a bunch of militants, and she directed efforts in removing our dependence on that energy source and its controllers. So, she did the right thing, perhaps not for the right reasons, but people very rarely do things for the right reasons at the time, that usually only becomes clear in hindsight.

The NUM was a powerful bunch and Thatcher wanted to curtail that power. Its the way she curtailed it that's the problem. There was never a strategy put in place to protect all those men who were about to lose their livelihoods.

[DemolitionRed]

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet

yes and she paved the way for women in top jobs

history will be very kind to her going forward

It depends on where you live and how you were affected by her rule. In many towns up and down the UK, 'Thatcher' is and always will be a curse word.

[LeatherTrumpet]

Originally Posted by DemolitionRed

It depends on where you live and how you were affected by her rule. In many towns up and down the UK, 'Thatcher' is and always will be a curse word.

a lot of that hate is sheer bigotry

[DemolitionRed]

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet

a lot of that hate is sheer bigotry

More like anyone who was affected by her policies. Nothing wrong with the word bigotry though. Anyone who enjoys politics will, to some extent have bigoted views.

[Wizard.]

Margaret Thatcher - Prime Minister Titties of My heart

[Northern Monkey]

Originally Posted by DemolitionRed

It depends on where you live and how you were affected by her rule. In many towns up and down the UK, 'Thatcher' is and always will be a curse word.

Yep.It’s very much like that where i grew up and probably a very big influence as to why i’ve never voted Tory.I was brought up hearing many unrepeatable adjectives about the woman.

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by parmnion

What with coal being the number one cause in of the worlds pollution and her closing the coal mines?

She only closed them here .... we still use coal, we just import it from places where wages, workers rights and safety standards are not an issue.

[hijaxers]

Originally Posted by parmnion

What with coal being the number one cause in of the worlds pollution and her closing the coal mines?

No that trout did no end of damage and we are still reaping the repercussions of her policies. Make the rich richer - How happy she would be . Everyone should own their own home - well done Maggie - what a complete balls up !

[parmnion]

Originally Posted by hijaxers

No that trout did no end of damage and we are still reaping the repercussions of her policies. Make the rich richer - How happy she would be . Everyone should own their own home - well done Maggie - what a complete balls up !

Im a nobody but i made 70g profit thanks to maggie an her council house schemes.

[parmnion]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

She only closed them here .... we still use coal, we just import it from places where wages, workers rights and safety standards are not an issue.

What places are they? And do we use as much as we did when maggie was about?

[Firewire]

No she was a cunt.

[DemolitionRed]

Originally Posted by parmnion

What places are they? And do we use as much as we did when maggie was about?

Mainly Russia and Columbia.

[GiRTh]

Originally Posted by Firewire

No she was a cunt.

Agree with this but with Reagan she changed the face of the Western world so to the OP question I would have to say she was definitely a visionary but not for her dismantling of the coal industry. The emphasis on free market trade has changed this country for ever. For the better? That's a different debate and in my opinion...no but - due wholly to the fact that she changed the country and the changes are clear for all to see today then Thatcher was definitely a visionary.

[James]

She knew a lot about climate change because of her background in science. Made a speech in 1988 about it - http://www.margaretthatcher.org/document/107817

Although the miners' strike was a few years earlier, 1984 so don't know if it was anything to do with that.