[Ant.]

Right so I need an outlet for this and I remember talking about shipping in Friends on here a few months ago but I NEED to get this off my chest

Spoiler:

Rosschel
Rosschel was amazing up until their first break up. Their first kiss scene (the one in Central Perk at night while it rains, not the friendship kiss in the laundromat) still gives me goosebumps and what they had between them felt so real. Like, when Ross says "I've been [hiding my feelings] since the 9th grade I've gotten good at it!" I just felt it. And then the way Rachel kicks him out and says "NOW I'VE GOT CLOSURE!" like... where's my wig @? Oh yeah Rosschel TOOK IT!
And the way Rachel kept laughing while she and Ross tried getting it on <3 it just all felt real

Anywho Idk if it's controversial but I thought Ross was understandable in sleeping with another woman thinking he and Rachel broke up. But the way he handled the situation was AWFUL (when he called Chloe 'different' when Rachel asked how was she in bed... YIKES!), from making jokes about it to not even acknowledging he hurt Rachel. He just CAN'T handle that he might be wrong!

Anywho fsr Ross and Rachel never admit their feelings and address the big fat elephant in the coffee house until Rachel decides to prioritise her work which is GROWTH cuz girl left a man at a wedding altar and cut off her dad at the start of the series.... and then the series ends with her not taking a once-in-a-lifetime job for a guy who's been at the wedding altar many many times. is there... some sorta cruel irony here

Like Ross and Rachel have this amazing chemistry but there's toxicity between them and I always tear up when Rachel says she got off the plane </3 but I sorta hope that when they were all in Central Perk one final time Ross was like "haha Rachel we were on a break" and Rachel loses her **** and grabs Emma and flies away to France for her work (or alternatively, Ross and Rachel both move to France because let's be real, Ross lost custody of Ben the moment he started trying to shag his cousin and sleeping with students, so it's not like New York had anything there for him)

anywho that brings me onto

Joey x Rachel
They're such a healthy relationship between two friends who love each other but... I just don't feel any heat or chemistry between them. It just felt awkward between them for me and it sucks because Rachel (and Emma's) presence around Joey did cause him to grow as a character but I just felt nothing between them!!

Chandler x Rachel
Hm idk it's wild but I think Rachel's best pairing would've been with Chandler. There was always this care and love between them that isn't always apparent and sorta died down the moment he got with Monica and it sucks. Thing is though, Rachel didn't want a family (or at least she wasn't vocal about wanting one, she said she wanted a baby and to be married around the age of 30 but that was it and this was after Mondler got married) and I think Chandler needed Monica's firmness, love and desire of a family to make him realise he also wants children and that he isn't afraid of commitment. Rachel just wouldn't have been able to give him that! They had the chemistry but there was nowhere to go with it

Mondler
yknow how I just acknowledged how great Monica and Chandler were for their stories and their growth? yh I can't stand them together. Idk if Monica became unbearable in the later half of Friends because of Chandler but regardless she wasn't enjoyable. like. they clearly love each other and you can tell they love each other but I just don't feel REAL chemistry between them

---

right so basically what I'm getting at is that I love the toxic taste that is Rosschel because they got good chemistry while I heavily dislike healthy relationships like Joey and Rachel and Mondler because I don't like their (lack of?) chemistry! Anyone else have my problem?

[Epic.]

This is way better than RileyH's ranking thread

[Cal.]

Hmm all of the Friends became more extreme versions of themselves as the series went on with the exception of Chandler so DONT START with the Monica slander.

[Matthew.]

Originally Posted by Ant.

Chandler x Rachel
Hm idk it's wild but I think Rachel's best pairing would've been with Chandler. There was always this care and love between them that isn't always apparent and sorta died down the moment he got with Monica and it sucks. Thing is though, Rachel didn't want a family (or at least she wasn't vocal about wanting one, she said she wanted a baby and to be married around the age of 30 but that was it and this was after Mondler got married) and I think Chandler needed Monica's firmness, love and desire of a family to make him realise he also wants children and that he isn't afraid of commitment. Rachel just wouldn't have been able to give him that! They had the chemistry but there was nowhere to go with it

[Matthew.]

Originally Posted by Epic.

This is way better than RileyH's ranking thread

[Shaun]

An easier analysis: the writing went rapidly downhill after season 5 or 6 and the rest just sucked. All the characteristics were amped up to the point of making all of the characters unbearable. Phoebe in the early seasons: a bit aloof, says weird things, is actually fun to watch. Phoebe mid-run-to the end? Shrieking hippie with an unspeakably horrific background who has a song every other episode. Monica is turned from the group support-figure to an overbearing OCD monster. Rachel turns from girl next door to absolute diva. Joey turns from struggling actor with a loveable dumbness to Grade A idiot and sleaze.

Only two that maintain some level of consistent "good character" are Chandler and Ross, but Ross does become a lot more irritating when they realise he can just rest on a one-word catchphrase.

[Epic.]

Now do Joey x Phoebe!

(I still prefer her with Mike but it is an interesting analysis cause there was always moments between the two even after Phoebe got with Mike and during the first few seasons, Lisa Kudrow and Matt LeBlanc even wanted the two to have a fling)

[Marsh.]

How were Rachel and Joey healthy? They couldn't even have sex.

They had a healthy/mature friendship. But a romantic/sexual relationship was so Unhealthy it ended before it began.

[Ant.]

Originally Posted by Cal.

Hmm all of the Friends became more extreme versions of themselves as the series went on with the exception of Chandler so DONT START with the Monica slander.

EXCUSE ME? How did Phoebe and Joey even become caricatures of themselves? Phoebe mellowed down while staying whacky true to form and found love and a family, while Joey shown a more respectful side to women in later seasons. THIS IS FAKE NEWS

Originally Posted by Shaun

An easier analysis: the writing went rapidly downhill after season 5 or 6 and the rest just sucked.

Yknow the sad thing is you're right. Ross became unbearable after his second divorce and I wasn't big on Mondler so seasons 5-10 just don't have the magic the earlier seasons have for me

Originally Posted by Matthew.

I was literally thinking of this scene (and the one where Chandler comforts Rachel in his living room <3) when I wrote that

[Ant.]

Originally Posted by Marsh.

How were Rachel and Joey healthy? They couldn't even have sex.

They had a healthy/mature friendship. But a romantic/sexual relationship was so Unhealthy it ended before it began.

that's what I meant I'm so silly

and what you said abt the sex is one of the reasons I get so MIFFED when I see people posting "Rachel should've been with Joey!!!" LET RACHEL HAVE SEX YOU COWARDS

[Marsh.]

Originally Posted by Ant.

EXCUSE ME? How did Phoebe and Joey even become caricatures of themselves? Phoebe mellowed down while staying whacky true to form and found love and a family, while Joey shown a more respectful side to women in later seasons. THIS IS FAKE NEWS

The One Where Joey Speaks French suitably displays what he means.

He goes from womanising but likeable dumb guy to braindead slag.

Ross is irritating throughout all 10 seasons for me but even he is turned up to extreme in seasons 9 and 10 with his shrieking and stupidity.

I can't watch The One Where Ross is Fine for precisely that reason. "EEEEEEE" Caah, make it stop!

[Marsh.]

Aww, I really liked Rachel and Chandler. Jennifer Aniston and Matthew Perry worked well together.

[Marsh.]

The only one I would say changed for the better was probably Rachel.

Throughout the 10 seasons she grows up and goes from being a selfish, lazy, greedy, spoilt bitch to a grown up, responsible single mother with a good career.

[Epic.]

Originally Posted by Marsh.

The only one I would say changed for the better was probably Rachel.

Throughout the 10 seasons she grows up and goes from being a selfish, lazy, greedy, spoilt bitch to a grown up, responsible single mother with a good career.

Chandler had the best development imo, went from a commitment-less, lonely, cynic to a caring, selfless, mature, witty husband, all the while being a moody legend the whole way through

[Marsh.]

Originally Posted by Epic.

Chandler had the best development imo, went from a commitment-less, lonely, cynic to a caring, selfless, mature, witty husband, all the while being a moody legend the whole way through

Come on now, he never matured!

[Ant.]

Originally Posted by Epic.

Now do Joey x Phoebe!

(I still prefer her with Mike but it is an interesting analysis cause there was always moments between the two even after Phoebe got with Mike and during the first few seasons, Lisa Kudrow and Matt LeBlanc even wanted the two to have a fling)

Apparently they were meant to meet up for love-making once a month (and while I like Phoebe and Mike together, seeing Phoebe and David break up broke my heart ""and then you tell me that you love me and you'll never forget me. And then you say it's almost midnight and you say you gotta go because you don't wanna start the new year with me if you can't finish it". I'm gonna miss you, you scientist guy." )

anywho

Joey x Phoebe
Probably the best friendship and the most dynamic, for a good while I wanted them to get together. However as the seasons progressed it felt like they had no sexual chemistry? So I was sorta put off by them getting together. and I think if Joey was developed better he would've been great for Phoebe
What really resonates with me is when Phoebe gets married she emphasises how she never had a family but now she does.

And I get thinking about who has a notably big family - Joey. Yet his family propped up once (or maybe twice). I really think if his sisters had more of a recurring role in Friends it could've set up for a great Phoebe and Joey relationship. For one, we would've got to see Joey's more protective and brotherly side that was only apparent in the episode where Chandler kissed one of his sisters, and that would've nicely contrasted to how he could come off as ignorant of women's feelings sometimes. And I like to think that Phoebe would've seen how protective and loving he is, and how he has a family, and I like to think the two of them could've grown together. Phoebe subconsciously wanting a family could've paired well with Joey slowly mellowing down from his womanising ways and how he is a family man (also, with how great he was with Emma, it's pretty clear he would've also wanted children, just like Phoebe)

Like I really think they could've worked as they were if they just hooked up and married in Season 10 because they had that chemistry but there were groundworks that could've been set up to make them really work better

[Ant.]

Originally Posted by Marsh.

The One Where Joey Speaks French suitably displays what he means.

He goes from womanising but likeable dumb guy to braindead slag.

Ross is irritating throughout all 10 seasons for me but even he is turned up to extreme in seasons 9 and 10 with his shrieking and stupidity.

I can't watch The One Where Ross is Fine for precisely that reason. "EEEEEEE" Caah, make it stop!

I always thought joey became less of a slag as the time goes on It does feel like his relationships with women became more prominent in later seasons BUT how heartbroken he was when he made an effort with that chick Phoebe and Rachel pushed him with, and how sensitive he became, I can't help but feel like he became less of a slag and more of a "lover" for lack of a better term

And I'm not even gonna protest the "brandead" thing. "Le poo poo" WILL NEVER be funny and neither will the other times Joey is dumb for no reason besides a cheap laugh

Originally Posted by Marsh.

The only one I would say changed for the better was probably Rachel.

Throughout the 10 seasons she grows up and goes from being a selfish, lazy, greedy, spoilt bitch to a grown up, responsible single mother with a good career.

I agree in that Rachel easily had the best and most consistent story but I can't help but feel like Phoebe and Chandler also had a good story and character development! (conveniently they are my top three Friends)

Originally Posted by Marsh.

Come on now, he never matured!

I agree with everything Epic said oops. He certainly stayed sarcastic but it felt mellowed down and I don't see how he could've became a better character while staying true to Chandler

[Tony Montana]

Thoughts on Ross and Phoebe?

[Epic.]

Originally Posted by Marsh.

Come on now, he never matured!

He went from getting into all the wrong relationships, inadvertently leading on women, and fleeing from commitment, to eventually finally falling in love, and facing any problems in his relationship (incapability to have children, brief possible attractions between Monica and several different men, finding the right parent to adopt from, getting rid of Janice, etc.). Even after he managed to commit, previous flaws in vulnerability made him run away from his wedding but still find the courage to go through with it. He is pretty much what the point of the show is, in showing the positive effect your friends and relationships have on your life

[Cal.]

My one qualm with Rachel was how she ruined Ross’ marriage to Emily and then after it was ruined literally just said ‘Oh I’m over that whole mess! and cast it aside leaving Ross divorced and homeless.

[Epic.]

Originally Posted by Cal.

My one qualm with Rachel was how she ruined Ross’ marriage to Emily and then after it was ruined literally just said ‘Oh I’m over that whole mess! and cast it aside leaving Ross divorced and homeless.

nnn you've just made me remember the time he was about to go on holiday with Rachel but ran into Emily at the airport, chased her to try and prove he wasn't dating Rachel, and left Rachel going to another country by herself. I *didn't* get off the plane!

[Cal.]

Does the pilot know that we’re moving??

[Marsh.]

Originally Posted by Cal.

My one qualm with Rachel was how she ruined Ross’ marriage to Emily and then after it was ruined literally just said ‘Oh I’m over that whole mess! and cast it aside leaving Ross divorced and homeless.

Tbf, Ross ruined his own marriage by saying Rachel's name.

Emily didn't trust him for that reason and then ended things when she heard him in the same room as her, after he insisted she join them.

Don't defend him!!

[Tony Montana]

Ross calling Emily “Rachel” is still a Classic

[Ant.]

Originally Posted by Tony Montana

Thoughts on Ross and Phoebe?

Ross and Phoebe
I really think Ross' scientific way of thinking combined with his weird necessity of being right could've been challenged with how open Phoebe was with ideas and how spiritual she was. That became apparent when Phoebe believed her mother came back to life as a cat, and I think if there was to be a relationship between them, it'd have to be that moment (or a similar one). And I think that would've been great for their characters. I don't think Phoebe ever went wild with her head in the clouds but it could've been nice to have Ross keeping her feet on the ground, but Ross certainly would've needed Phoebe to bring him up to the sky.
Ross became a caricature of himself once he broke up with Emily. As Carol said in Season 3, Ross is a good person and a good friend. And he certainly was. He never meant harm and always ****ed up with good intentions. By the later seasons, he's putting his career on the line by sleeping with students, trying to seduce his blood-related cousin, and even tried to jeopardise Rachel's career just so she could stay in NYC (although he did have a change of heart and told her to go for the job in Paris, he also ****ed with her head and told her to get off the plane... so... good deed undone)

I think Phoebe could've loosened him up and could've been a good rebound following his divorce with Emily (sorta like how Ross and Phoebe try and hook up the moment Ross finds out Carol's a lesbian. Talking of that scene, there's a nice air between them. Despite the awkwardness, they're still jokey and it felt right, not forced). Perhaps with Ross being uncomfortable with Chandler and Joey's living situation, he goes to Phoebe for comfort, and thus begins a relationship. Phoebe admits to missing Carol and she already saw Ross (and Monica's) family plenty, so I'm certain she could've easily found the family she forgot she needed in Ross (plus I think becoming closer to Ross and by extension, Ben, could've helped mature her maternal qualities that we very briefly saw when she wanted to keep one of the triplets (although I can't help but wonder why the triplets appeared like, twice after their birth given how Phoebe cared so much about finding and piecing together the family she had when there were kids and a brother there for her anytime she wanted... meh)

tl;dr Ross' family could've given Phoebe the structure her life needed, while her open-mind and free spirit could've helped Ross heal from Emily and stopped him snowballing into the disaster he became