[Toy Soldier]

I still disagree on WW's feminism . In my opinion there are several mis-steps.

1) Hyper-sexualised appearance

2) Costume and hair are impractical for the purpose of aesthetics. Obviously not unusual for the genre but again, the reasons are obvious (eye candy).

3) She lives naive and isolated on an island of women until a world-wise street-smart man comes along and introduces her to "the real world". This is the biggest and most glaring problem and IMO is enough to completely negate any feminist message that the movie might otherwise have.

[Marsh.]

This is what happens when you attempt to let an average actress like Sophie Turner lead a movie.

Trying to capitalise on her GoT fame and it's backfired.

She's supporting at best.

[Tom4784]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

I still disagree on WW's feminism . In my opinion there are several mis-steps.

1) Hyper-sexualised appearance

2) Costume and hair are impractical for the purpose of aesthetics. Obviously not unusual for the genre but again, the reasons are obvious (eye candy).

3) She lives naive and isolated on an island of women until a world-wise street-smart man comes along and introduces her to "the real world". This is the biggest and most glaring problem and IMO is enough to completely negate any feminist message that the movie might otherwise have.

I remember watching a youtuber a while back and she was speaking about the differences between WW in the Zack Snyder films and in her solo film and she bought up her hair as a tangent and how she looked in WW as a positive because she took it as a sign that women had a lot of creative control in that film compared to the other films because they made her look great in every scene while she had flat hair in Justice League and such. She basically said something like 'women don't let other women look bad while males wouldn't often recognise the details' such as plumping up the hair to make it look better. It's a light point but it did make me think that the way WW looks in her solo film is as much for women as it is for men.

I don't think your third point is enough to negate the feminism in the film because, like I said before, the whole point of feminism in Wonder Woman is that they push equality and mutual respect. A man showing her a world she's never known doesn't make the film any less feminist especially considering that in the sequel the roles are reversed which suggests that gender didn't even play a role in that decision. Wonder Woman at it's heart is about co-operation, not competition. To me, that's what feminism is, recognising the struggles that women go through and working together to try to improve things and solve problems neither gender could do alone.

[LukeB]

Originally Posted by Marsh.

This is what happens when you attempt to let an average actress like Sophie Turner lead a movie.

Trying to capitalise on her GoT fame and it's backfired.

She's supporting at best.

We stan Famke Janssen

[Marsh.]

Yeah, I agree that a male character teaching a female character something is not sexist or "anti-feminist" in itself, only if used as a trope of male characters being superior and more intelligent than female.

I've not watched the new Wonder Woman (well kind of but was with a group and half of it was spent chatting) so can't really recall its brand of feminism.

[Marsh.]

Originally Posted by LukeB

We stan Famke Janssen

Tea.

[Oliver_W]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

I still disagree on WW's feminism . In my opinion there are several mis-steps.

1) Hyper-sexualised appearance

2) Costume and hair are impractical for the purpose of aesthetics. Obviously not unusual for the genre but again, the reasons are obvious (eye candy).

3) She lives naive and isolated on an island of women until a world-wise street-smart man comes along and introduces her to "the real world". This is the biggest and most glaring problem and IMO is enough to completely negate any feminist message that the movie might otherwise have.

1) Eh, films are visual medium. People like to look at pretty people.

2) As above

3) Should she have googled "the rest of the world" and then went to see it?

[Oliver_W]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

I rewatched Capt. Marvel a few days ago and I still don't really understand the shade it gets. It's fun and still easily in the top 50% of MCU films .

Pretty much what Dezzy said. Plus, Brie Lawson is uncharasmatic as as a block of wood. If the film was just another MCU film it'd be fine, but Disney/Marvel were trying to push her as the most amazing hero ever, and that she'd be the new face of the MCU. She just doesn't have it tbh. Out of the remaining heroes, Spidey has the most potential for that.

[Tony Montana]

Originally Posted by Oliver_W

Pretty much what Dezzy said. Plus, Brie Lawson is uncharasmatic as as a block of wood. If the film was just another MCU film it'd be fine, but Disney/Marvel were trying to push her as the most amazing hero ever, and that she'd be the new face of the MCU. She just doesn't have it tbh. Out of the remaining heroes, Spidey has the most potential for that.

Tea.

Captain Marvel was nothing special. I don't think I could stomach a rewatch.

[Tony Montana]

Watching Dark Phoenix on Saturday so I'll give my verdict on it.

[Toy Soldier]

Originally Posted by Oliver_W

Pretty much what Dezzy said. Plus, Brie Lawson is uncharasmatic as as a block of wood. If the film was just another MCU film it'd be fine, but Disney/Marvel were trying to push her as the most amazing hero ever, and that she'd be the new face of the MCU. She just doesn't have it tbh. Out of the remaining heroes, Spidey has the most potential for that.

The thing is, for the most part, this is a "stock internet opinion" practically copy-pasted from Reddit and the huge irony is that it's an opinion mainly thrown around by males. I very rarely see any actual females stating that Brie Larson's Captain marvel was an awful character, and interestingly, I'm not sure I've seen any declaring that WW is an amazing example of feminism portrayed correctly. I'm sorry guys but the idea that "we can tell it was made by women for women because her hair sure is always real nice" is one of the most bizarre supposedly "feminist" statements I've ever heard? Like it's bordering on offensive stereotype .

But yeah there's something just laughable about Men On The Internet getting together to declare what is and isn't good feminism, surely. I'm more inclined to trust the actual females who are both feminist and movie fans (and yes I genuinely know a couple) and the general and more realistic consensus there is that Capt Marvel is a more realistic human being (if, I agree, not the most charismatic actress) whilst WW is a two-dimensional fantasy version of "a strong woman".

Another thing worth pointing out is that it would be a ridiculous stretch to claim that Gal Gadot oozes charisma or isn't "wooden" in the WW role... she just gets more of a pass because she's easy on the eye, and humble and demure in interview settings like a good girl. And isn't that something in itself .

[Ammi]

...I haven’t see Captain Marvel yet but I will say that Wonder Woman for me hugely represents feminism...and Gal Gadot is magnificent in portraying the character....


..Wonder Woman..9/10....I loved it, I loved everything about it...Gal Gadot is beautiful....she remained every essence of femininity, even while kicking all those asses around, there was no feminazi there..the perfect ‘empowerment’ of someone who happened to be female...an amazing feminism movie, not so much saving mankind but saving people kind....

[Oliver_W]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

The thing is, for the most part, this is a "stock internet opinion" practically copy-pasted from Reddit

So lots of people think the same?

I'd never say consensus=correct, but still.

[Marsh.]

Originally Posted by Oliver_W

1) Eh, films are visual medium. People like to look at pretty people.

Well, first of all it being a visual medium doesn't make it all about sexual attraction.

Second of all, "pretty" is subjective.

[Marsh.]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

Capt Marvel is a more realistic human being

[LukeB]

Seen this yesterday and yikes not a good movie at all. It's not worst movie ever but it's not good, probably just ok.

The fight scenes were meh, the storyline and writing seemed a bit flat and the acting was messy it seemed like they were just ready for it to end.

[LukeB]

This was nowhere near as good as Captain Marvel.

[LukeB]

I think this is slightly better than The Last Stand purely because Dark Phoenix did focus on the phoenix storyline. The Last Stand was a bit messy with the war and the cure storyline which should have been a different movie imo. The Last Standing has the better cast though

Spoiler:

I wonder when Disney takes over will they reboot X-Men or carry on where fox left off because of X-Men: Days of Future Past, if you remember Jean Grey was alive in 2023 and looking well but the Phoenix took place before

[Oliver_W]

Originally Posted by LukeB

I think this is slightly better than The Last Stand purely because Dark Phoenix did focus on the phoenix storyline. The Last Stand was a bit messy with the war and the cure storyline which should have been a different movie imo. The Last Standing has the better cast though

Spoiler:

I wonder when Disney takes over will they reboot X-Men or carry on where fox left off because of X-Men: Days of Future Past, if you remember Jean Grey was alive in 2023 and looking well but the Phoenix took place before

I think it's more likely they'd reboot it tbh.

[Toy Soldier]

Originally Posted by Marsh.

It's not even about whether or not you like the character on that one. I've met multiple people who Carol Danvers reminds me of. Can you hand-on-heart say you've ever met an actual human being like Gal Gadot's Wonder Woman? Like actually in the real world?

[Marsh.]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

It's not even about whether or not you like the character on that one. I've met multiple people who Carol Danvers reminds me of. Can you hand-on-heart say you've ever met an actual human being like Gal Gadot's Wonder Woman? Like actually in the real world?

Oh I didn't mean she was likeable, I was poking fun at a Marvel hero being "realistic".