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Ammi · 23-10-2020, 06:13 AM

...this is specifically a story regarding supermarkets in Wales but it’ll apply more widely I’m sure and I didn’t want it to get lost in the main COVID thread...I mean, I totally get the ‘theory’ of this, to try to ‘level’ it a bit for retail businesses which can’t stay open...but it’s the lack of clarity of essential and non essential and how it’s indeed very far from ‘being made clear’...certain items of clothing as a for instance...(...if a child needed a specific item for school or an elderly person needed a clothing item etc...)...would be more of an essential than confectionary/unhealthy or luxury food items etc...?...but those things will continue to be sold as essentials, while other more essential for some, won’t be...is that correct...?...

Supermarkets will be unable to sell items like clothes during the 17-day Covid firebreak lockdown in Wales.
First Minister Mark Drakeford said it would be "made clear" to them they are only able to open parts of their business that sell "essential goods".
Many retailers will be forced to shut but food shops, off-licences and pharmacies can stay open when lockdown begins on Friday at 18:00 BST.
Retailers said they had not been given a definition of what was essential.
The Association of Convenience Stores and the Welsh Retail Consortium have written urgently to the first minister, expressing alarm over the new regulations.
Sara Jones, head of the Welsh Retail Consortium, said: "Compelling retailers to stop selling certain items, without them being told clearly what is and what isn't permitted to be sold, is ill-conceived and short-sighted."
Welsh Conservative Andrew RT Davies tweeted: "The power is going to their heads."
But Plaid Cymru's Helen Mary Jones said "smaller businesses should not be put at an unfair disadvantage during the firebreak lockdown".

...full article...

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-politics-54648194

arista · 23-10-2020, 06:16 AM

Put Wales
in the title, please

Ammi · 23-10-2020, 06:43 AM

...no because it’s expanding out to a general ‘essential and non essential’ vibe...the article about Wales is just more used as an example...

Nicky91 · 23-10-2020, 06:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ammi

...no because it’s expanding out to a general ‘essential and non essential’ vibe...the article about Wales is just more used as an example...

agree with you Ammi, also we need to prevent the whole ''hamstering'' mess what happened in the first wave too

hamstering is not necessary, you can still go grocery shopping each week or every 2 weeks, just mask up (which also increases your chances of not catching the virus, some masks protect up to either 94% 96% or 97%

and for elderly who can't rely on other family members, there is always a last resort thing as online grocery shopping, which is very handy and delivered at your doorstep, with just exactly the amount you order, nothing less or too much

also toilet paper can be ordered via online shopping either, but more a minimal amount so not that you can hamster via that

bitontheslide · 23-10-2020, 06:53 AM

I completely understand the reasoning for it, but essential is in the eyes of the individual, not the collective so I don't think that can be reconciled. I think so many stores have an on line presence now, that you can get anything you want, just not in person, so it's a pretty meaningless debate in that context.

There is a more fundamental problem. High street shopping isn't compatible with a covid environment because it encourages population concentration no matter how covid secure a particular shop may be. That's why high streets shops have continued to struggle, people just don't want to converge on mass at the moment in any way shape or form and that wont change until there is a vaccine or 100% effective treatment

Cherie · 23-10-2020, 06:59 AM

This has nothing to do with food Nicky, it’s about section of supermarkets that sell clothes, electrical goods, etc

I can see where they are coming from as shops selling only clothes/shoes have had to close so allowing supermarkets to continue to retail them does smack of unfairness, most people can go without buying clothes for 17 days it’s just the logistics as if you kettle blows up that’s an essential, so sealing off entire sections will be a logistical nightmare

I think treats are essential especially during a lockdown ..no?

Ammi · 23-10-2020, 07:01 AM

...but because COVID is not going to be a ‘short term’ thing and could indeed be our lives for a very long time...then it’s more about the definition of essential and non essential...and restrictions shouldn’t be applied unless they’re not only clarified but justified as logical as well...certain items of clothing over the extended period we’re living with COVID would become essentials more than say, confectionary items...

Cherie · 23-10-2020, 07:08 AM

As Bots sails it’s pretty pointless anyway as people can order online, I think in a short lockdown it’s viable, but if extended longer they would have to look at it again, they are trying to make it fair for everyone, unfortunately that’s pretty impossible

Cherie · 23-10-2020, 07:10 AM

This is Easter Egg gate all over again basically

I think it was Zizu who said he tried to buy some hand towels in the first lockdown in Tesco and was refused as they weren’t essential

It’s basically a mess

Ammi · 23-10-2020, 07:14 AM

...well that’s the point of it...it’s a mess and makes no logical sense at all unless it’s clearly defined as to essential and non essential...this is a time when it’s important to apply thought beyond surface gestures that will ultimately be meaningless anyway...

Cherie · 23-10-2020, 07:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ammi

...well that’s the point of it...it’s a mess and makes no logical sense at all unless it’s clearly defined as to essential and non essential...this is a time when it’s important to apply thought beyond surface gestures that will ultimately be meaningless anyway...

I would imagine some small businesses have complained to their MPs so it’s a box ticking exercise in the main

Ammi · 23-10-2020, 07:31 AM

...yeah I don’t know if it’s for box ticking but it’s most definitely something which only goes to restrict further in essential items for many households...one absolute essential with COvID is a public compliance which ill thought out decisions appear to be pushing farther and farther away ....

bitontheslide · 23-10-2020, 07:43 AM

It's pure frustration coming out and I completely understand it. They do everything to comply with covid security and then get told to close anyway, who wouldn't be pissed off in that situation, and what is not being made clear to them is that it is not their fault, the issue is the general movement of people and trying to reduce that. The problem is that schools being open dwarfs any other population movement (with the exception of work commuting). Schools need to re-think their education plans and how they go about it. That will bring the rate of infection down dramatically

Zizu · 23-10-2020, 07:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cherie

This is Easter Egg gate all over again basically

I think it was Zizu who said he tried to buy some hand towels in the first lockdown in Tesco and was refused as they weren’t essential

It’s basically a mess

Yeah it was one of our friends .. Tesco took his towels out of his trolley at checkout..

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

Ammi · 23-10-2020, 07:52 AM

...it’s only going to lead to more frustration though...this isn’t the supermarkets, it’s the government restricting the supermarkets, therefore restricting the public further, without the applying more thought to essential and non essential...

Cherie · 23-10-2020, 08:07 AM

I am not surprised that businesses are complaining, upset and frustrated, when we have gone out to restuarants, they have all bent over backwards to ensure our safety and now some of those are shut through no fault of their own, but people can have house parties where there is no one bending over backwards to comply with the rules, its a complete mess

joeysteele · 23-10-2020, 08:13 AM

I'd be against this actually.

Supermarkets if allowed to open should be selling their full range.
I mean would bedding, hardware, are even newstands and publications really necessary.

Clothing however, needed for themselves and children.
This seems unnecessary.

Also the size of supermarkets, all areas open, as long as distancing and masks are on, then the more of the store operating, opens up.more space in the store too when people are in.

I can't see any logical reason for restricting the buying of anything a supermarket usually sells, once you're letting customers in, in the first place.

Ammi · 23-10-2020, 08:36 AM

...I think that one of the most obvious ones is alcohol...(...I’m not suggesting that alcohol not be sold btw...)...but based on the restrictions being placed and the reasoning why...alcohol selling businesses aren’t being allowed to open and complete livelihoods will be lost...so a ‘levelling’ for that as was stated, would be for alcohol not to be sold in supermarkets...and therefore obviously reducing the access to alcohol for house parties as well, which are said to be a large infection contributing factor...the government really can’t continue to keep blundering in and all over etc...we’re several months into this virus and several months into restrictions and thought has to be applied otherwise where is the confidence that is being demanded by the public...

bitontheslide · 23-10-2020, 08:45 AM

If supermarkets block off access to areas containing "non essential" items, they are pushing everyone in the supermarket into a smaller area, this increases the chances of infection. Many people walk up and down aisles even if they don't buy anything in them thus spacing everyone out more .... People are just not thinking these things through

Cherie · 23-10-2020, 08:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bitontheslide

If supermarkets block off access to areas containing "non essential" items, they are pushing everyone in the supermarket into a smaller area, this increases the chances of infection. Many people walk up and down aisles even if they don't buy anything in them thus spacing everyone out more .... People are just not thinking these things through

I wonder if they will have to queue again in Wales during full lockdown, more people at home, and bored so they go out to the shop!

Ammi · 23-10-2020, 08:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bitontheslide

If supermarkets block off access to areas containing "non essential" items, they are pushing everyone in the supermarket into a smaller area, this increases the chances of infection. Many people walk up and down aisles even if they don't buy anything in them thus spacing everyone out more .... People are just not thinking these things through

...is exactly my thoughts in this bots/...hence the thread...and this is far too important and we’re far too aware of ‘lack of thought’ for these things to continue to be thrown out there and causing more stress on an already stressed to limits public...?...to be able to replace an item of clothing for a child while at the supermarket, for instance...?...would very much be an essential for many, many parents...as would buying a Christmas gift and putting it aside etc...