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Toy Soldier · 26-10-2021, 11:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AnnieK

So the professional who has seen all the evidence months after it was collected and agrees with your train of thought is credible but the professional who worked the case as it happened isn't credible and could believe in God? Riiigghht

Quote:

Originally Posted by Niamh.

Seems about right.....

"McHoskey (1995) found that conspiracy beliefs may be in part a product of biased assimilation—accepting information that confirms one’s views and scrutinizing information that disconfirms one’s views (see also Thorson, 2015)."

Niamh. · 26-10-2021, 12:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

"McHoskey (1995) found that conspiracy beliefs may be in part a product of biased assimilation—accepting information that confirms one’s views and scrutinizing information that disconfirms one’s views (see also Thorson, 2015)."

Yeah i can definitely see that. Tbh when it first happened I didn't think the parents did have anything to do with it, It's not a nice thought to think they did, I don't want them to have had anything to do with it (well a part from, it may have been the easiest thing for Madeline herself to have died in an accident, some of the other scenarios could be awful) but thinking a parent or both parents were responsible in some way is awful. I guess, to me when I think about how they were willing to leave 3 virtual babies alone at night in an an apartment, the likelihood of some thing happening accidentally seems likely to me.

jet · 26-10-2021, 12:10 PM

I haven’t really followed the case from the beginning or read anything in detail about it, but weren’t all the adults dining that night taking it in turns to check on all the kids every half hour? How would it be possible for one of the McCanns to dispose of her body so thoroughly that it has never been found in that time frame? For those who think the parents did it, what are the theories concerning the hiding of the body?

Niamh. · 26-10-2021, 12:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jet

I haven’t really followed the case from the beginning or read anything in detail about it, but weren’t all the adults dining that night taking it in turns to check on all the kids every half hour? How would it be possible for one of the McCanns to dispose of her body so thoroughly that it has never been found in that time frame? For those who think the parents did it, what are the theories concerning the hiding of the body?

I mean they Said they were but that doesn't mean that's true and that's the actual window of opportunity, They also refused to do a reenactment for the investigation

Concerning hiding the body? I have no idea but I don't think you really need to have a theory on what they did with her afterwards to think they might be involved in some way

Toy Soldier · 26-10-2021, 12:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jet

I haven’t really followed the case from the beginning or read anything in detail about it, but weren’t all the adults dining that night taking it in turns to check on all the kids every half hour? How would it be possible for one of the McCanns to dispose of her body so thoroughly that it has never been found in that time frame? For those who think the parents did it, what are the theories concerning the hiding of the body?

They claimed so however in my opinion they were most likely checking far less often, and they collectively decided to say they checked frequently as they knew it would look worse if they admitted it was infrequent (or not at all).

jet · 26-10-2021, 01:00 PM

It still means there was a limited time frame to hide Maddies body so thoroughly that it has never been found in what is really a limited seach area if it was them that caused her death.
....and as the kids were all playing together before bedtime, either or both of the McCanns would have to have been missing from the meal for quite some time in that case....
Much more likely that she was taken and driven far away by a stranger.

Niamh. · 26-10-2021, 01:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jet

It still means there was a limited time frame to hide Maddies body so thoroughly that it has never been found in what is really a limited seach area if it was them that caused her death.
....and as the kids were all playing together before bedtime, either or both of the McCanns would have to have been missing from the meal for quite some time in that case....
Much more likely that she was taken and driven far away by a stranger.

All what kids? When was she actually seen alive by people other than the McCanns or their friends?

jet · 26-10-2021, 01:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Niamh.

All what kids? When was she actually seen alive by people other than the McCanns or their friends?

The friends kids. Do you think the McCanns friends knew they caused her death and have been covering for them all these years?

Niamh. · 26-10-2021, 01:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jet

The friends kids. Do you think the McCanns friends knew they caused her death and have been covering for them all these years?

I just checked and the last time anyone saw Maddie was 6pm at the Kids club where Maddie and the twins ate dinner then returned to the apartment, they didn't see or play with anyone elses kids after that

https://www.theguardian.com/uk/2008/...adeleinemccann

jet · 26-10-2021, 01:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Niamh.

I just checked and the last time anyone saw Maddie was 6pm at the Kids club where Maddie and the twins ate dinner then returned to the apartment, they didn't see or play with anyone elses kids after that

https://www.theguardian.com/uk/2008/...adeleinemccann

Gerry asked a friend to check on Kate and the kids at 6.30 and arrives back at the apartment at 7PM.
So there is 1 hour 30 mins - between 7pm and 8.35 to accidentally kill Maddie, dispose of her body so well it has never been found, without being seen by anyone, get back to the apartment and shower and change and be the first to arrive at the restaurant for dinner at 8.35 where they act totally normal? It’s too far fetched for me.

Niamh. · 26-10-2021, 02:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jet

Gerry asked a friend to check on Kate and the kids at 6.30 and arrives back at the apartment at 7PM.
So there is 1 hour 30 mins - between 7pm and 8.35 to accidentally kill Maddie, dispose of her body so well it has never been found, get back to the apartment and shower and change and be the first to arrive at the restaurant for dinner at 8.35 where they act totally normal? It’s too far fetched for me.

He did, iirc the versions of events of that that call were very different between Kate and David Payne (the friend) though, it seemed fishy. I'll try to find that if I can for you to read

Toy Soldier · 26-10-2021, 02:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jet

Gerry asked a friend to check on Kate and the kids at 6.30 and arrives back at the apartment at 7PM.
So there is 1 hour 30 mins - between 7pm and 8.35 to accidentally kill Maddie, dispose of her body so well it has never been found, get back to the apartment and shower and change and be the first to arrive at the restaurant for dinner at 8.35 where they act totally normal? It’s too far fetched for me.

Everything between 6pm and 10.15pm is "self reported" (unverified by anyone other than the McCann group). Also, the prevailing theory is that she was hidden nearby and moved the following day.

The theories are compelling and just as realistic as the idea that she was taken (there are several holes in that theory, too) BUT for me the important factor is simply remembering that ALL explanations for what happened to her are just theories.

No one knows what happened to her. There is no solid evidence of any kind. Not of someone who knew her doing harm to her... not of a kidnapping... nothing. The only thing in the entire case that is a verified fact is that she disappeared. A lot of people think it's "established" that she was kidnapped and the idea that this wasn't what happened is a "counter-narrative". This is largely because of how it was reported in the UK press... and is not representative of the facts. It has not been established in any way that she was kidnapped.

jet · 26-10-2021, 02:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Niamh.

He did, iirc the versions of events of that that call were very different between Kate and David Payne (the friend) though, it seemed fishy. I'll try to find that if I can for you to read

Ok, thanks.

jet · 26-10-2021, 02:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

Everything between 6pm and 10.15pm is "self reported" (unverified by anyone other than the McCann group). Also, the prevailing theory is that she was hidden nearby and moved the following day.

The theories are compelling and just as realistic as the idea that she was taken (there are several holes in that theory, too) BUT for me the important factor is simply remembering that ALL explanations for what happened to her are just theories.

No one knows what happened to her. There is no solid evidence of any kind. Not of someone who knew her doing harm to her... not of a kidnapping... nothing. The only thing in the entire case that is a verified fact is that she disappeared. A lot of people think it's "established" that she was kidnapped and the idea that this wasn't what happened is a "counter-narrative". This is largely because of how it was reported in the UK press... and is not representative of the facts. It has not been established in any way that she was kidnapped.

The only way the McCanns could have done it that I can see is if their friends all agreed to a cover - up and helped them. If that was the case, I wonder how their consciences are faring seeing the McCann’s doing everything they can over the years to keep the case open and alive.
Why on earth would the McCanns do that? Surely they would be saying ‘we got away with it’, and want it forgotten like the thousands of other children who are missing, especially since they have 2 more children to consider?

Niamh. · 26-10-2021, 02:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Niamh.

He did, iirc the versions of events of that that call were very different between Kate and David Payne (the friend) though, it seemed fishy. I'll try to find that if I can for you to read

So these are both from the official Police interviews. As you can see the versions on David calling are different. In Davids version he says he called to check if Kate was Ok about Gerry staying at the tennis court a bit longer where as Kate says that David had called to help her bring the kids down to the recreation area near the courts but that she'd changed her mind about going as the kids were too tired. In Davids version he went inside and marveled at how angelic the kids looked and what a perfect family they were. In Kates version, she'd just got out of the shower when she heard the knock and was wrapped in a towel, David only stood there for 30 seconds and never came in to the apartment -

but I remember then you know I went over to see err Gerry at the err you know tennis courts, just to see you know what was happening, and err decided that we'd, you know I'd come, come back to play tennis and err Gerry had asked me just to pop in and check everything was alright err with Kate or you know again I can't remember the exact reason whether he was just making sure it was alright that he could stay there and you know more time but you know he'd asked me to pop in.
So I walked back err from the tennis courts, err back to err you know Kate and Gerry's apartment and the time you know looking at, you know we've looked obviously at photographs since then and you know the time that we've got that I was you know going to Kate's about six thirty, err and I went into their apartment through the patio doors. The three children were all you know dressed you know in their pyjamas, you know they looked immaculate, you know they were just like angels, they all looked so happy and well looked after and content and I said to Kate, you know it's a bit early for the you know, for the three of them to be going to bed, she said ah they've had such a great time, they're really tired and you know err so I say, you know I can't remember exactly what, what you know the night attire, what the children were wearing but white was the predominant err colour, but you know just to reinforce they were just so happy, you know seeing you know obviously Gerry wasn't there but they were just all, just so at peace and you know they looked like a family who'd had such a fantastic time

https://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/D...E-ROGATORY.htm

While the children were eating and looking at some books, Kate had a shower which lasted around 5 minutes. After showering, at around 6:30/6:40PM and while she was getting dry, she heard somebody knocking at the veranda door. She wrapped herself in a towel and went to see who it was. This door was closed but not locked as Gerry had left by this door. She confirmed it was David Payne, because he called out and had opened the door slightly. David's visit was to help her to take the children to the recreation area. When David returned from the beach he was with Gerry at the tennis courts, and it was Gerry who asked him to help Kate with taking the children to the recreation area, which had been arranged but did not take place. David was at the apartment for around 30 seconds, he didn't actually enter the flat, he remained at the veranda door. According to her he then left for the tennis courts where Gerry was. The time was around 6:30-6:40PM.

https://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/K...NN_ARGUIDO.htm

jet · 26-10-2021, 03:00 PM

Thanks Niamh

I'll read through those links when I get time, its not something I've been following; just reading about some of it on here, but I want to look into it all more.

Niamh. · 26-10-2021, 03:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jet

Thanks Niamh

I'll read through those links when I get time, its not something I've been following; just reading about some of it on here, but I want to look into it all more.

It's an interesting case for sure, a real mystery that unfortunately I think will never be solved. I just hope whatever did happen to her that she didn't suffer too much or for too long