[Billy]

There were Muims on GTMV this morning and even they were saying was pathetic she got in trouble

[XxShortyxX]

I can't believe this, how pathetic. Poor women.

[Stu]

Originally posted by ~kizwiz~
I dont agree that its right but who are we to question rules of other nations?

Of course we can question the rules of other nations. And the peoples of the nation must also do so.

Remember World War II? Would you rather nobody had intervened in Hitlers plans?

[Riz]

i am muslim and i just feel thats its ridiculous and pathetic.

[~Kizwiz~]

Originally posted by Stu

Of course we can question the rules of other nations. And the peoples of the nation must also do so.

Remember World War II? Would you rather nobody had intervened in Hitlers plans?

Of course not..... I dont think that she should be there at all, its shocking that she got 15 days for this, and the prospect of 40 lashes was truly heinous. But what can we do? Its the people in power that should be shouting and screaming. There is nothing, apart from pressing our MP to force the government to intervene, that was as British public can do.

[Stu]

Originally posted by ~kizwiz~

Of course not..... I dont think that she should be there at all, its shocking that she got 15 days for this, and the prospect of 40 lashes was truly heinous. But what can we do? Its the people in power that should be shouting and screaming. There is nothing, apart from pressing our MP to force the government to intervene, that was as British public can do.

I see your point about us being able to do little about this case in particular , but the point I was trying to illustrate is that people should not just lie face down and wait for the law to walk all over their backs. Law should be challenged as its pretty much the only way it can gradually be improved. Religion should not be the law. Its supposed to be a choice. And like I said , its all also trampling on the golden rule of all religions.

Screw honor and law , some of these people just reap the benefits of being able to act in a violent manner. Hypocritical sadists.

[Mrluvaluva]

Originally posted by Sticks

Not if you are a Muslim

To a large number of Muslims this was deeply deeply offensive to them as their Holy prophet was grossly insulted by comparing it to an unclean animal. For some, this is so offensive that for them the only punishment should be death.

Hence the reaction in Khartoum today

And you agree with that do you? A person should lose their life for naming a teddy bear Mohammed?

[Mrluvaluva]

Originally posted by GiRTh
I dont think it has. She broke the law she must face the consequences. Religion is a hot topic all over the world so she should have known better.

OK. I haven't disputed her jail sentence. But 40 lashes as a considered option in my eyes is just plain wrong. And as for calling for her death, well that is just plain ridiculous.

[Tanser_Man]

Don't get me wrong, I’m not generalising and jumping to assumptions but some of these situations have been laughable.

First of all a cartoon which was a joke, it may have been right or wrong but protesters call for him to be executed, hanging effigies of his body and basically a tragic overreaction, leaving a man fearing for his safety. Secondly this situation where a teacher, trying to do right for these children by passing on her knowledge for there advantage, forgetting all right she is doing for the community, only because she called a cuddly toy Muhammad (which I must add was a decision by the pupils, not hers). Now she deserves to die and be imprisoned?

Isn’t the Islam faith supposed to strong and peaceful?!

There’s being passionate in what you believe and then there’s being barbaric and not caring what you believe. I can’t help but think, if the tables were turned and a Muslim lady called a teddy ‘Moses’, would we react and call for the lady to be treated so appallingly? It goes without saying that any suggestion like that would and should be laughed at because it is irrelevant what name she uses… whether it’s Tom, Dick or Harry!

It’s just another excuse for extremists for promote there hate and brainwash yet more innocent victims.

It isn’t about rules and regulations; it’s about hate, and if these people concentrated on there own problems more, maybe they could focus there attentions on more important things in there country such as the murder and rape of 200-400,000 men, women and children within its Darfur province?

[dupin]

Originally posted by Tanser_Man
Don't get me wrong, I’m not generalising and jumping to assumptions but some of these situations have been laughable.

First of all a cartoon which was a joke, it may have been right or wrong but protesters call for him to be executed, hanging effigies of his body and basically a tragic overreaction, leaving a man fearing for his safety.

Actually, it's a huge rule of Islam that you CANNOT draw Mohammed or Allah, as they don't have an image, as such. To do so, especially in the way it was done, is incredibly disrespectful to the Islam faith. I don't think it was an overreaction as such, because you have to remember that for devout Muslims, Islam is their life, it's more important than anything else.

[Tanser_Man]

Originally posted by dupin

Actually, it's a huge rule of Islam that you CANNOT draw Mohammed or Allah, as they don't have an image, as such. To do so, especially in the way it was done, is incredibly disrespectful to the Islam faith. I don't think it was an overreaction as such, because you have to remember that for devout Muslims, Islam is their life, it's more important than anything else.

So you seriously think a drawing of somebody, who in fairness could be as fictitious as Santa Clause, justifies thousands of these devout Muslims burning effigies, chanting such things as death to the west with mass protests using guns and swords in response to something like that?

If any of that is justifiable because a religion says so then these people need to wake up and smell the stench they are creating. Religion is supposed to promote peace; unity and strength not excuses so hate filled idiots can wage endless tirades on innocent people.

[dupin]

Originally posted by Tanser_Man

So you seriously think a drawing of somebody, who in fairness could be as fictitious as Santa Clause, justifies thousands of these devout Muslims burning effigies, chanting such things as death to the west with mass protests using guns and swords in response to something like that?

If any of that is justifiable because a religion says so then these people need to wake up and smell the stench they are creating. Religion is supposed to promote peace; unity and strength not excuses so hate filled idiots can wage endless tirades on innocent people.

I agree, the rules are odd, but still, they are rules, however stupid you may think they are. And stuff like this is important to Muslims, so for someone to draw that is very disrespectful, and the artist must have known that.

[Stu]

Originally posted by dupin

I agree, the rules are odd, but still, they are rules, however stupid you may think they are. And stuff like this is important to Muslims, so for someone to draw that is very disrespectful, and the artist must have known that.

Its absoloutely not. Most Muslims are not extremists. Ive met many Muslims who think everything like this is a disgrace.

Speaking of the whole denouncing of materialism...is their an exception for the home made masterpieces that make their way to Al-Jazeera?

[dupin]

Originally posted by Stu

Its absoloutely not. Most Muslims are not extremists. Ive met many Muslims who think everything like this is a disgrace.

Speaking of the whole denouncing of materialism...is their an exception for the home made masterpieces that make their way to Al-Jazeera?

I think Islam in Muslim countries is very different in terms of that Muslims in Britain are in a Christian country.

[Stu]

Originally posted by dupin

I think Islam in Muslim countries is very different in terms of that Muslims in Britain are in a Christian country.

Still , lets not stereotype all of them as fear mongering hypocrites. Some of them are about as strict as most of us are with Christianity , they just dont get to show it , because Religion is the law in some countries.

[Xander]

I think its ridiculous the whole thing, its like someone from their country coming over here doing exactly the same thing but naming a teddy bear winston(Or any iconic figure of the U.K) But yet, we wouldn't punish them or even jail them

[Lauren]

Originally posted by Xander
I think its ridiculous the whole thing, its like someone from their country coming over here doing exactly the same thing but naming a teddy bear winston(Or any iconic figure of the U.K) But yet, we wouldn't punish them or even jail them

And who are we to dictate that our way of life is more 'right' than theirs? It's nothing like your analogy, not at all - we live by different rules and norms as do they - we are NOT in the right position to say that our way of life is more justified.

[Sticks]

Originally posted by Xander
I think its ridiculous the whole thing, its like someone from their country coming over here doing exactly the same thing but naming a teddy bear winston(Or any iconic figure of the U.K) But yet, we wouldn't punish them or even jail them

On Friday I heard on the radio a letter from a Christian admiring the demonstrators because they were standing up for their beliefs.

[Stu]

Originally posted by Sticks

On Friday I heard on the radio a letter from a Christian admiring the demonstrators because they were standing up for their beliefs.

I suppose then we should admire the Nazi movement? Or is this sort of hate justified because its set in Religion?

Originally posted by Lauren
we are NOT in the right position to say that our way of life is more justified.

Arent we? Really? Because I think our way of life is definately better. We are a free peoples in terms of Faith over here. We may be apathetic towards the church nowdays but I would rather be in apathy towards an unconfirmed-he-exists god than burn effigys in the name of it.

Again , I ask of you all , what happened to the Golden Rule for these people?

''None of you [truly] believes until he wishes for his brother what he wishes for himself."

[Tanser_Man]

Originally posted by Stu

I suppose then we should admire the Nazi movement.

And the innocent slaying of millions of people in Sudan.

Oh wait, all of this is ok because they have there own rules and beliefs. The keyword here being there 'own' rules, Islam is changed to whatever these extreamists want it to be, regardless of how ludacris it seems.

I keep hearing the Western world wants to shape the world, but i bet if you asked most of the women, men and children in Sudan and many neighbouring countries, what they want the most from life... the answer would be the stability of the west.

£160million in aid from our government, yet the Billions of sterling they make from oil is used to buy weapons to beat and maim there own people.

[Scarlett.]

The teacher will be released within the hour

[Red Moon]

Freedom for jailed teddy bear teacher as Sudanese government grant her full pardon

Jailed British teacher Gillian Gibbons is to be freed after being given a full presidential pardon by the Sudanese government.

The 54-year-old will now be put on a flight out of the country within the next few hours.

But despite her ordeal, Miss Gibbons was said to want to stay on in Sudan to continue teaching. "I am sad to be leaving," she said.

"I have great respect for Islam and am sorry to have caused distress."

Her pardon follows huge pressure from the international community, including pleas by high ranking diplomats and a petition calling for Miss Gibbons' release on the Mail Online.

This morning, Prime Minister Gordon Brown said he was "delighted" Miss Gibbons was to be freed.

In Liverpool, her son John said: "I've just spoken to the Prime Minister.

"He called to give me the good news himself and I've spoken to the Foreign Office as well.

"Obviously we're very pleased.

"We've just got to contain our excitement until she's on the plane. The family won't be 100 per cent happy until she's on the plane.

"I'd like to thank the Government for all they have done, the hard work behind the scenes, especially the two peers who went out there.

"Everyone's been really great.

"Obviously it's a great feeling today, we're very pleased, we have been under a lot of pressure."

Asked if he had spoken to his mother since her release, he said no but added:

"I'm sure she'll be very pleased although quite embarrassed to be on the news permanently, but very pleased.

"It's been a strange old week, very stressful and particularly bad for the family but now she's coming home, fingers crossed.

"If this week has taught me anything it is that anything can happen."

Mrs Gibbons' former teaching colleagues also expressed their joy at her release.

Rick Widdowson, headteacher of Garston Primary School, where she spent 12 years, said: "Everyone is very relieved and very pleased.

"We feel it should never have come to this but it's a good ending.

"One or two of the staff see Gill socially and I am sure they will be meeting up to celebrate with her."

Inayat Bunglawala, spokesman for the Muslim Council of Britain, said: "If it is confirmed, obviously this is wonderful news.

"Gillian should never have been arrested in the first place, let alone held in jail. She had done nothing wrong.

"It will be wonderful to see her back in the UK. I am sure she will be welcomed by both Muslims and non-Muslims after her quite terrible ordeal at the hands of the Sudanese authorities."

Reacting to this morning's development, Dr Khalid al-Mubarak, of the Sudanese Embassy in London, said: "Congratulations. I am overjoyed.

"She is a teacher who went to teach our children English and she has helped a great deal and I am very grateful.

"What has happened was a cultural misunderstanding, a minor one, and I hope she, her family and the British people won't be affected by what has happened.

"The demonstrations were an argument from the fringe.

"I hope for the best relationship with Britain in the months ahead." A spokesman for the Foreign and Commonwealth Office said he could not confirm reports of the pardon.

The mother-of-two was given a 15-day sentence last week after being found guilty of insulting Islam by calling a teddy Mohammed.

Over the weekend, sources at the British Embassy in Khartoum said there were "high hopes" she would be on her way home today after top-level negotiations.

Two British Muslim peers had flown into Khartoum on Saturday to press Sudanese president Omar al-Basir for Miss Gibbons' release.

And it appears that the pleas of Labour peer Lord Ahmed and Tory Baroness Warsi finally produced a result.

The pair had been scheduled to fly back today, but delayed their departure amid signs that progress was being made.

Lord Ahmed said President al-Bashir had listened carefully during their talks.

Speaking from the capital, Khartoum, to CNN International, Lord Ahmed said:

"This was an unfortunate, unintentional misunderstanding and I did say to him Gillian loves Sudan, the children in her school and the religion of Sudan and how much she would love to come back to this country."

Mrs Gibbons, who is being held in a detention centre rather than a prison for her own safety, said she was in good spirits.

She joked: "I have been given so many apples I could set up my own stall."

The career teacher was put on trial last Thursday after allowing her class of seven-year-olds to name a teddy bear "Mohammed" for a school project.

It was seen as a blasphemous insult - giving a toy the name of the Prophet.

The mother of two had taken up the post at Khartoum's Unity High

School only this autumn after her marriage ended in divorce.

The two peers, whose visit is described as a "private initiative", have had a series of meetings with Sudanese government officials.

They admitted the talks had been difficult, but Lady Warsi added: "I think we made quite a lot of progress".

Only the president had the power to change the sentence, but his position has been complicated by the angry demonstrations in Khartoum on Friday, when mobs carrying swords and knives called for the teacher to be killed.

The peers have also met Mrs Gibbons, who yesterday made only her second public statement since she was arrested two weeks ago.

"I'm fine, I'm well," she said. "I'm very grateful to all the people working on my behalf. I know so many people have done so much.

"I know the Prime Minister has called my son, and I'm really grateful to everyone.

"I want people to know I've been well treated, and especially that I'm well fed.

"I've been given so many apples I feel I could set up my own stall.

"The guards are constantly asking if I have everything I need.

"The Sudanese people in general have been pleasant and very generous.

"I'm really sad to have to leave and if I could go back to work tomorrow then I would."

Foreign Secretary David Miliband had called the Sudanese foreign minister to stress his "very strong concern" that Mrs Gibbons is still being held.

He also phoned her 25-year-old son John to insist that the Government has been doing everything it can.

Mrs Gibbons's Sudanese lawyer claimed she may have been the unintended victim of a "spiteful plot" by a bitter colleague.

Kamal al-Gizouli said office worker Sarah Khaward had fallen out with the school principal Marina Hitchens.

She decided to tell the authorities about Mohammed the teddy bear in the hope they would arrest the head.

Intead, they turned their attentions to Mrs Gibbons.

Mr al-Gizouli said he tried to cross-examine Miss Khaward on the issue during last week's court hearing but she refused to answer.

Source: Daily Mail

[Sunny_01]

What wonderful news for her and her friends and family. I am so glad they were able to negotiate a suitable solution to this terrible mess.

[Sticks]

It is not over until she lands in the UK, and even then she might never be safe if someone who is a hardliner gets it into their head to take "the law into their own hands"

Remember Salman Rushdie?

[Sunny_01]

Oh I love your optimistic outlook on life Sticks