[kirklancaster]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

As always I admire your endless optimism Ammi but... MOST hatred is fuelled by fear and ignorance, from little old Betty to the most hardcore and violent Britain First skinhead. The latter has got himself buffed up into what he sees as a "soldier" to fight back, while Betty hides in her home, but he's no less afraid and that's why he wants to fight.

I guess my point is... Pointing out that Betty's hatred is borne out of fear and ignorance does not stop it from being hatred.

You live in Scotland - in which particular 'bubble' of splendid isolation the Lord only knows - so what qualifies you to denigrate decent English people, old or otherwise, who have genuine grievances about the impairment to the quality of their lives, wrought by unfettered immigration into their communities?

The majority of British people - and that, by their own voilition, includes huge numbers of long domiciled immigrants, coloured or otherwise - who are concerned about uncontrolled runaway immigration, are NOT racist, xenophobic, or ignorant. They are ordinary, decent, people who have genuine concerns borne of actual direct personal experience, of the extremely adverse effects on their traditional way of life.

These 'indigenous' people are not filled with hatred, just concern. They are not against immigrants in reasonable numbers who integrate, just alarmed by huge numbers of immigrants who have not integrated, but formed ghettos; scaled down replications of the native villages, towns, and cities in their own countries - THE countries which they have left to come to Britain.

In addition to the now long established and accepted Asian usurpation of huge parts of the UK, there is now ever increasingly more areas in Great Britain where British people are GENUINELY suffering because their traditional British way of life has been, and increasingly still is being, usurped by the relentless influx of Eastern European immigrants.

Which areas of the UK now does not have its 'Little Polands', 'Little Romanias' etc? - areas where the shops, businesses, houses, and markets are owned, staffed and patronised by immigrants. Areas where English is a foreign language, and British traditions and culture even more foreign.

No one in authority has done anything to allay the concerns of these usurped indegeous citizens, because they are prejudiced against such concerns by their own political persuasions, or are fearful of the P.C. driven backlash, or are rendered impotent by 'EU Legislation'.

So yes, these people are concerned, and feel marginalised, forgotten, contemptuously ignored by the politicians whom they elected to serve them and trusted with their votes.

And YES, the win by the 'Vote Leave' campaign was partly due to the votes of these anxious citizens, because it was 'payback' time - a message to the Government, that if immigrants lives matter, then so should the lives of the downtrodden, suffering people who put this Government in power.

These people are NOT Xenophobic and NOT racist, and neither is their concerns bred of ignorance or irrational fear, but very much borne from the real increasingly adverse experiences of how uncontrolled immigration is decimating the lives of decent, ordinary people.

[arista]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

Do you know what I've noticed and find really sad? Over the last couple of weeks, and especially since Thursday, there's been a noticeable difference in a lot of my immigrant customers. They're making obvious deliberate efforts to make small talk / chat about sports and events / generally making clear efforts to, for want of a better term, "be liked".

Not that this is a bad thing in itself, of course the outcome of such efforts can only be a good thing. But the REASONS for it - the obvious desperation to be accepted and liked and not glared at or whispered about (and believe me there has been plenty of that) - is very sad.

TS its only the first week
its a temp blip.


Conservatives
Run The UK


Farage is not part of the Cabinet.


Fecking Get that old Tory of the BBC Breakfast
he is stupid keeps saying they need Farage



FARAGE is UKIP
another Party

[arista]

"You live in Scotland -"


How Nice

[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by Northern Monkey

That's a generalisation which we apparently should'nt make.Some Polish are great and some are definately not.We had some living down our street who were constantly pissed and upsetting the neighbours.Many of them had arguments with them but i don't judge them all on just the ones i know.

This is why i said "in my experience"

[Toy Soldier]

So you open your denial that you / others are xenophobic by directly commenting on my nationality and inferring certain things about what that means.

Slow. Clap

[Tom4784]

I was in town today, a bunch of Takeaways have had their windows smashed and the atmosphere was generally tense as ****.

We employ quite a few polish people at work and I'm worried for them, I hope they haven't been targeted.

[Niamh.]

Ian Paisley Jnr is advising Unionists in Northern Ireland to get a ROI passport

[LeatherTrumpet]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

Do you know what I've noticed and find really sad? Over the last couple of weeks, and especially since Thursday, there's been a noticeable difference in a lot of my immigrant customers. They're making obvious deliberate efforts to make small talk / chat about sports and events / generally making clear efforts to, for want of a better term, "be liked".

Not that this is a bad thing in itself, of course the outcome of such efforts can only be a good thing. But the REASONS for it - the obvious desperation to be accepted and liked and not glared at or whispered about (and believe me there has been plenty of that) - is very sad.

It would be the same for any british people in their country if the roles were reversed I am sure

[arista]

Originally Posted by Niamh.

Ian Paisley Jnr is advising Unionists in Northern Ireland to get a ROI passport

Yes the Irish Passport Office Needs More Staff
can you spare 46hours a week Fine Lady
to Assist

[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by arista

Yes the Irish Passport Office Needs More Staff
can you spare 46hours a week Fine Lady
to Assist

I already have a job I'm afraid Arista

[arista]

Originally Posted by Niamh.

I already have a job I'm afraid Arista

OK Fine Lady


Have A Good Week

[Vicky.]

Originally Posted by Ithinkiloveyoutoo

But but but I thought Brexiters weren't racist?

"Leave vote it's not about trade and other business it's about immigration simple as that! It's to stop the Muslims..."

Movement is alright just not from brown people

Erm..leaving the EU will have no effect on any immigrants from Africa and such anyway? Another who doesn't seem to know what he was voting for...

[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by Vicky.

Erm..leaving the EU will have no effect on any immigrants from Africa and such anyway? Another who doesn't seem to know what he was voting for...

"The movement of people from Europe, fair enough" .....isn't that exactly who is going to be affected by it?

[Vicky.]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

Do you know what I've noticed and find really sad? Over the last couple of weeks, and especially since Thursday, there's been a noticeable difference in a lot of my immigrant customers. They're making obvious deliberate efforts to make small talk / chat about sports and events / generally making clear efforts to, for want of a better term, "be liked".

Not that this is a bad thing in itself, of course the outcome of such efforts can only be a good thing. But the REASONS for it - the obvious desperation to be accepted and liked and not glared at or whispered about (and believe me there has been plenty of that) - is very sad.

This is not really going to be a popular post, but I king of think they should always have been making some kind of effort to integrate rather than isolating themselves. I feel like some of the...unsavoury..views a lot of British people have come from fear of the unknown. People ignoring you when you walk past them, blanking you if you attempt to talk..etc.

Of course a lot of immigrants do make an effort to 'fit in' but a lot also don't bother, the guys who own the shop up the road from me speak perfect English, but they often talk in their own language when there are English in the shop, which tbh I find quite ignorant :/

[Vicky.]

Originally Posted by Niamh.

"The movement of people from Europe, fair enough" .....isn't that exactly who is going to be affected by it?

yup...bright spark that one eh

[kirklancaster]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

So you open your denial that you / others are xenophobic by directly commenting on my nationality and inferring certain things about what that means.

Slow. Clap

I am more than secure in the knowledge that my post was reasoned and reasonable, but I'm afraid your deflectory response is yet further proof that trying to be reasonable and genial with you T.S. just does not work.

The fact that I pointed out that you live in Scotland is neither xenophobic or racist, or any other 'tosh' label which you disingenuously wish to falsely label it with.

I used the fact of your geographical location to underscore my point, that you are just not qualified to KNOW the true circumstances of any people living in any other country of the United Kingdom who may have concerns about unlimited immigration, and because you do not have that intimate personal knowledge of these people's lives, you also cannot have any insight into their reasons for having concerns, therefore to denigrate them as you did is out of order.

To underscore your condemnation of the 'EU Referendum' verdict, there is no one on here more than you, who has pointed out over the past days, that 'Scotland' is a 'separate nation' - now, because I am innocently using the fact that you live in Scotland NOT England, Northern Ireland, or Wales, to underscore what I am saying, you accuse me of being xenophobic or racist.

[Toy Soldier]

My wife is English, my first daughter was born in England (though she insists she "identifies as American" ) , and I lived there for just under 4 years, if that helps?

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by kirklancaster

If you have ever deeply researched 'Immigration and The UK' or regularly watched programmes on immigration - such as 'Immigration Undercover', 'Illegal Immigrant and Proud', 'The Truth About Immigration' etc, or the excellent 'Border Force UK', you will soon come to realise, that:

a) The British Government does not KNOW how many LEGAL IMMIGRANTS' are in the UK.

b) The British Government does not know how many ILLEGAL IMMIGRANTS are in the UK

c) The UK Border Agency make very little difference to the numbers of ILLEGAL IMMIGRANTS entering the UK, and have even less of an impact in ensuring that those they do catch are removed or 'secured', because - under the absurd EU laws - the greater percentage of detected illegal immigrants are simply placed in open accomodation in London (paid for by the UK taxpayer) and simply told 'not to abscond'.

It is NOT the Immigrants to blame - it is the Government and the system.

Out of the EU, we can and will, repeal all the inane EU laws which have rendered it nigh impossible for us to control immigration, and unfettered immigration will be reduced and more thorough policing of our ports and airports will be initiated.

Immigration may have been high on the list of the concerns of a lot of people who voted to 'Leave' the EU, but it is not the ONLY concern, and I do not believe at all, that 'immigration is all anyone was bothered about'.

If you have ever deeply researched 'Immigration and The UK' or regularly watched programmes on immigration - such as 'Immigration Undercover', 'Illegal Immigrant and Proud', 'The Truth About Immigration' etc, or the excellent 'Border Force UK', you will soon come to realise, that:.......this is how the media is utilised to influence the public as a tool of informal control.

[Kizzy]

Ah look at all the lovely malleable ignorant people spouting their sun/mail bigotry, shouting for people to 'go home' into channel 4 news cameras...

murdocks muppets.

[DemolitionRed]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

Do you know what I've noticed and find really sad? Over the last couple of weeks, and especially since Thursday, there's been a noticeable difference in a lot of my immigrant customers. They're making obvious deliberate efforts to make small talk / chat about sports and events / generally making clear efforts to, for want of a better term, "be liked".

Not that this is a bad thing in itself, of course the outcome of such efforts can only be a good thing. But the REASONS for it - the obvious desperation to be accepted and liked and not glared at or whispered about (and believe me there has been plenty of that) - is very sad.

I don’t know about you but because racism and bigotry is at the forefront at the moment, I make a special effort with foreign shop assistants to be extra pleasant. Before they were just shop assistants like anyone else but because I’m now aware of how they are possibly feeling, it makes me want interact with them more. I like to think they are being extra nice because they are feeling accepted by all us none bigot/racists and not because they are attempting to be more accepted.

[DemolitionRed]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

If you have ever deeply researched 'Immigration and The UK' or regularly watched programmes on immigration - such as 'Immigration Undercover', 'Illegal Immigrant and Proud', 'The Truth About Immigration' etc, or the excellent 'Border Force UK', you will soon come to realise, that:.......this is how the media is utilised to influence the public as a tool of informal control.

Exactly Kizzy and this didn't start within earshot of a referendum, this started with those bastard neoliberals who used immigration and fear of terrorism as a ruse to bring in more snooping laws. Prejudice wasn't born from UKIP, it was just nurtured and watered by them. These Tories planted the seed and sat back and allowed the media to fuel it for all it was worth.

Cameron's little game went woefully wrong and now he has fallen on his own sword.

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by kirklancaster

You live in Scotland - in which particular 'bubble' of splendid isolation the Lord only knows - so what qualifies you to denigrate decent English people, old or otherwise, who have genuine grievances about the impairment to the quality of their lives, wrought by unfettered immigration into their communities?

The majority of British people - and that, by their own voilition, includes huge numbers of long domiciled immigrants, coloured or otherwise - who are concerned about uncontrolled runaway immigration, are NOT racist, xenophobic, or ignorant. They are ordinary, decent, people who have genuine concerns borne of actual direct personal experience, of the extremely adverse effects on their traditional way of life.

These 'indigenous' people are not filled with hatred, just concern. They are not against immigrants in reasonable numbers who integrate, just alarmed by huge numbers of immigrants who have not integrated, but formed ghettos; scaled down replications of the native villages, towns, and cities in their own countries - THE countries which they have left to come to Britain.

In addition to the now long established and accepted Asian usurpation of huge parts of the UK, there is now ever increasingly more areas in Great Britain where British people are GENUINELY suffering because their traditional British way of life has been, and increasingly still is being, usurped by the relentless influx of Eastern European immigrants.

Which areas of the UK now does not have its 'Little Polands', 'Little Romanias' etc? - areas where the shops, businesses, houses, and markets are owned, staffed and patronised by immigrants. Areas where English is a foreign language, and British traditions and culture even more foreign.

No one in authority has done anything to allay the concerns of these usurped indegeous citizens, because they are prejudiced against such concerns by their own political persuasions, or are fearful of the P.C. driven backlash, or are rendered impotent by 'EU Legislation'.

So yes, these people are concerned, and feel marginalised, forgotten, contemptuously ignored by the politicians whom they elected to serve them and trusted with their votes.

And YES, the win by the 'Vote Leave' campaign was partly due to the votes of these anxious citizens, because it was 'payback' time - a message to the Government, that if immigrants lives matter, then so should the lives of the downtrodden, suffering people who put this Government in power.

These people are NOT Xenophobic and NOT racist, and neither is their concerns bred of ignorance or irrational fear, but very much borne from the real increasingly adverse experiences of how uncontrolled immigration is decimating the lives of decent, ordinary people.

It was a UK referendum, Scotland is as entitled to their say as England remember?

[joeysteele]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

It was a UK referendum, Scotland is as entitled to their say as England remember?

It seems not Kizzy, what some in England appear to want to do is dominate and dictate even more to the likely seen as bothersome and other burden Nations of the UK.

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by joeysteele

It seems not Kizzy, what some in England appear to want to do is dominate and dictate even more to the likely seen as bothersome and other burden Nations of the UK.

Yes it does appear that way to me too, England do not call all the shots in UK affairs.

[Ithinkiloveyoutoo]

Originally Posted by Vicky.

Another 2 people on my FB shared this

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?f...type=3&theater

Definitely allowing more racists to come out of the closet. Never saw anything like this in all the years I have been on there, the sheer amount of racism and ignorance is shocking.

Aw...