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Pyramid* · 28-12-2010, 09:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by InOne

If someone killed a Paedophile cos they raped their daughter, do they deserve to die?

In case it has escaped your attention: the discussion was being based around those who took another person's life. Murder, not rape.

InOne · 28-12-2010, 09:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pyramid*

Until you can add something constructive - why don't you give it a rest with your slagging off forum members - or is that as good as your discussion skills go? There are plenty of valid reasons that have been given. Fine if you don't agree, but quit with the sarcastic and very immature personal comments on people who are posting.

Nothing is personal, I don't even know you. I've seen the way you 'debate' anyway. I've been through this argument countless times with members, it's boring.

InOne · 28-12-2010, 09:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pyramid*

In case it has escaped your attention: the discussion was being based around those who took another person's life. Murder, not rape.

Read what I said

Angus · 28-12-2010, 09:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pyramid*

They lost the right to be classed as human beings when they take another person's life.

Paid their debt to society? How do they pay that debt exactly? By having their every basic need attended to for years in prison? What about the debt of one life that is owed to the family of the person who's life they took away - as well as the untold suffering the family of the victim suffer until they die?

Completely agree - how on earth anyone can seriously equate a few years in prison as sufficient punishment and redemption for taking another human being's LIFE is beyond me. No wonder society is down the plughole when you get mealy mouthed apologists telling the rest of us that murdering scum have "paid their debt to society"; murderers are hardly quaking in their boots for fear of any real retribution!

And for the record, YES I do resent even 1p of my taxes being spent to feed murderers, rapists and terrorists.

Pyramid* · 28-12-2010, 09:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MTVN

I dont want to get into a big debate over this but the first line is merely subject to opinion, I disagree myself

And I believe that serving a life sentance is paying your debt to society, I dont think lives should be counted as debts or should be traded. My idea of a justice system is to have a mix of reformation and retribution, but I think if we resort to killing someone then we become no better than those we seek to punish, we simply have different motives

You realise that in the UK, life sentence does not mean 'Life'.

I don't see why my taxes should be used to keep someone fed, clothed, put a roof over their head, et al - when they thought it acceptable to take another person's life. And then, once they've done their time: out they come, at the cost of millions, with new identities, given homes, kitted out, given jobs - again all at massive cost to the tax payer.

A life for a life. That's it in a nutshell. I'm not quite saying the vigilante route is the best - clearly and rationally it's not - but if true justice was served - there would be a quick end to it (and them).

Is my view an extreme one? Yes. Of course it is. But I still stand by it.

Pyramid* · 28-12-2010, 09:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by InOne

Read what I said

My sincere apologies to you. I see what you are getting at.

Truthfully - I'd say no, and I would say that due to the circumstances.... but I see precisely where you are coming from on that one. It's actually a very good point.

From where I'm coming: I mean someone who simply commits murder out of being evil.

MTVN · 28-12-2010, 09:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pyramid*

You realise that in the UK, life sentence does not mean 'Life'.

I don't see why my taxes should be used to keep someone fed, clothed, put a roof over their head, et al - when they thought it acceptable to take another person's life. And then, once they've done their time: out they come, at the cost of millions, with new identities, given homes, kitted out, given jobs - again all at massive cost to the tax payer.

A life for a life. That's it in a nutshell. I'm not quite saying the vigilante route is the best - clearly and rationally it's not - but if true justice was served - there would be a quick end to it (and them).

Is my view an extreme one? Yes. Of course it is. But I still stand by it.

Hate to be cliched and quote Ghandi but "An eye for an eye makes the whole world blind"

And I do realise "life" doesnt mean life thankyou, I'm not an idiot

Pyramid* · 28-12-2010, 09:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by InOne

Nothing is personal, I don't even know you. I've seen the way you 'debate' anyway. I've been through this argument countless times with members, it's boring.

Oh I don't mind debates and heated ones at that. It does piss me off that it gets derailed though because it all gets into personal slagging matches - that's more where I was coming from - rather than the subject matter in hand being discussed.

InOne · 28-12-2010, 09:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pyramid*

My sincere apologies to you. I see what you are getting at.

Truthfully - I'd say no, and I would say that due to the circumstances.... but I see precisely where you are coming from on that one. It's actually a very good point.

From where I'm coming: I mean someone who simply commits murder out of being evil.

Some Travis Bickle type might get some sadistic pleasure out of something like that, and that is wrong in itself. Society can't be do or die cos in some cases they could get it wrong. And if you're wrongly accused you'll have that label on you no matter what.

Pyramid* · 28-12-2010, 09:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MTVN

Hate to be cliched and quote Ghandi but "An eye for an eye makes the whole world blind"

And I do realise "life" doesnt mean life thankyou, I'm not an idiot

Hate to be cliched and quote the Bible but "An eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth". (and yes, the same Bible that quotes, "Forgiveness" blah blah blah).

No need for you to get all uppity, I didn't suggest you were an idiot. A great many people are under the misconception that Life means quite literally, 'Life behind bars'.

spitfire · 28-12-2010, 09:57 PM

There's something not right about this whole case.
Hundred's of people go missing every year and never get as much media attention as this.
I think the full facts are being withheld.

InOne · 28-12-2010, 09:57 PM

"An eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth" means you look out for one another, not that you seek revenge. It's a primitive version of the golden rule.

Pyramid* · 28-12-2010, 09:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by InOne

Some Travis Bickle type might get some sadistic pleasure out of something like that, and that is wrong in itself. Society can't be do or die cos in some cases they could get it wrong. And if you're wrongly accused you'll have that label on you no matter what.

Oh I agree in that it has to be 100% certain - I do completely and utterly agree there must be no room for doubt.

As for being wrongly accused, that unfortunately is a fact of life: and it applies to any form of criminality and being accused - whether it be shoplifting, rape or murder.

Pyramid* · 28-12-2010, 10:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by InOne

"An eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth" means you look out for one another, not that you seek revenge. It's a primitive version of the golden rule.

It is down to personal interpretation.

InOne · 28-12-2010, 10:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spitfire

There's something not right about this whole case.
Hundred's of people go missing every year and never get as much media attention as this.
I think the full facts are being withheld.

Exactly, something very odd. Little bits just seem to leak now and then.

InOne · 28-12-2010, 10:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pyramid*

It is down to personal interpretation.

Well most people have it wrong then

MTVN · 28-12-2010, 10:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pyramid*

Hate to be cliched and quote the Bible but "An eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth". (and yes, the same Bible that quotes, "Forgiveness" blah blah blah).

No need for you to get all uppity, I didn't suggest you were an idiot. A great many people are under the misconception that Life means quite literally, 'Life behind bars'.

Do you know the whole of that quote? Jesus says "You have heard that it was said, 'An eye for an eye and a tooth for a tooth'. But I say to you, do not resist an evildoer. If anyone strikes you on the right cheek, turn to him the other also."

Pyramid* · 28-12-2010, 10:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by InOne

Exactly, something very odd. Little bits just seem to leak now and then.

What I don't get is..... those who know the area, live there, walk past where her body was .... all of them are saying that if the body had been there for days, that it would have been noticed. People who actually walked past the spot where her body was found have said there is no way that it had been there.

There does seem to be something 'not quite right'.

InOne. You didn't write the bible, so you are like everyone else - you've got your interpretation, I've got mine - you don't know with any more certainty that the 'most' that you mention are either right or wrong.

arista · 28-12-2010, 10:18 PM

yes she may have known her killer

Pyramid* · 28-12-2010, 10:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by arista

yes she may have known her killer

Given that it was reported that she left her purse, handbag, phone etc in the flat - and left the flat..... I'd say it was a safe bet she knew who it was.

Pretty damning for the boyfriend that he wasn't in town at the time though - rightly or wrongly - it was one hell of a coincedence all the same, great alibi for him (if.... only if). Either way: it's one ****ty position for him to be in.

spitfire · 28-12-2010, 10:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by arista

yes she may have known her killer

I think that she probably knew the killer. She left early from a pub party,bought food on the way home (a large pizza, enough for two) and additional alcohol. Did she have a secret visitor in her boyfriend's absence?The lack of obvious injury suggests that she didn't put up a fight. Her valuables were not taken so the motive was obviously not robbery.I will be interested to learn if traces of semen are found on her body.
And before anyone starts raging,no I'm not stating anything definite or attacking a dead woman..just conjecturing,in the age of Facebook stranger things have happened.

Angus · 28-12-2010, 10:39 PM

There's also the possibility that she was followed home and abducted from her own home. Her boyfriend had apparently been visiting his family, so surely that can easily be checked out. Forensics will be able to determine exactly when she was killed and no doubt if there is anyone else's DNA on her. She was missing for a week, and her body apparently only placed in its final location just before it was found, so where was she for that week?

Pyramid* · 28-12-2010, 11:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by angus58

There's also the possibility that she was followed home and abducted from her own home. Her boyfriend had apparently been visiting his family, so surely that can easily be checked out. Forensics will be able to determine exactly when she was killed and no doubt if there is anyone else's DNA on her. She was missing for a week, and her body apparently only placed in its final location just before it was found, so where was she for that week?

Quote:

'We believe Joanna's body had been there for several days before being discovered on Christmas morning.

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...#ixzz19SHFZPv4

This is what I find strange. The stories keep changing.....