[Kazanne]

Originally Posted by joeysteele

I don't mind hard graft and am happy to pay all my taxes and work darn hard and sometimes long hours too.
I'd never support this set of Conservative representatives because,while I am happy to do hard work.
I hate with a passion all that's been done and what I've come across, as the heartless robbing from the sick and disabled by this govt.

Where sick and disabled,incurable and terminally I'll have had to go to court to win back benefits wrongly taken off them or denied them
You may admired that as strong govt,I certainly don't.

They will pay multi millions to a French and American company to assess the UKs sick and disabled with the view of forcing people who cannot at this time work,or reduce the benefits they should be getting.

Saving a pittance in reality and then likely nothing at all when taxpayer funded court appeals are heard and won,which the vast majority are.

A rotten govt that demonstrates how rotten it is by how it treats the weakest,sick and disabled in its society.
It fills me with solid sadness and shame.

Hi Joey,I really don't think it's that bad,maybe we have just had different experiences,I know disabled people ,my mom looked after one until he passed away in October, he was always treated well and helped as much as he needed it,the only thing that was lacking was the pittance mom was given for looking after him,but she was ok with it as it wasn't about money for her, so I can only go on my experiences and at the moment Labour hold nothing enticing for me ,My nan is also a pensioner,she gets basic state pension,but manages fine on it,it depends what you want out of life and how you spend your money I think,she gets help with her fuel bills in the winter and most companies will do payment plans to accommodate her. I understand you may have not had good experiences from them,but at least you didn't stoop so low to call me a 'chav' I thank you for thatOh and btw,IF the Tories ever bring back fox hunting,I will be a none voter.

[ebandit]

Originally Posted by Alf

Who are the chavs by the way?

there's me...................i'm pretty apathetic about the forthcoming election

...............won't even get any decent odds on the result

Mark L

[Toy Soldier]

Originally Posted by Kazanne

Well I suppose if it makes the losers feel better ,lol, the Tories appeal to me at the moment as they are the only party with some realistic policies and people with a bit of nouse,all the others seem a bit brain dead, and their followers seem to get annoyed easily and then start name calling,knock yourselves out

... She said, sounding annoyed and calling people "losers".

[Withano]

Originally Posted by Kazanne

but at least you didn't stoop so low to call me a 'chav' I thank you for thatOh and btw,IF the Tories ever bring back fox hunting,I will be a none voter.

Originally Posted by Withano

I suggested that they appeal to both of these populations, and that they didnt two years ago.

I have no idea if you're a chav or not and I certainly didnt say that you were.
Chavs exist, and I didnt use it as an insult.. you're presumed its an insult and you denounced an entire sub-culture of Britain which was a bit rude
I dont believe chavs would have voted for tories 2 years ago, but I have seen their fanbase get chavvier, thus tories have expanded their fanbase to at least one new area, there may be others - as Alf mentioned, they're also getting the backing of brexiteers
Feel free to contribute to the thread with your own ideas instead of putting down others

[Withano]

Originally Posted by Kazanne

Or maybe they appeal to people who don't mind a bit of hard graft and want the best for the country

I think this describes most people in Britain, not just tory voters

[Withano]

Originally Posted by jaxie

Or that using derogatory terms like chav is just as bad as using derogatory racist or sexist terms?

Since when was chav a derogatory term at all. Why are you putting it on the same level as racism and sexism. Completely inappropriate.

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by jaxie

Once again lots of labelling and stereotyping going on most particularly from those who try to claim the moral high ground of the left. Do people even realize how much they are doing this? Or that using derogatory terms like chav is just as bad as using derogatory racist or sexist terms?

It isn't as bad, using a modern slang term is not as bad as being racist or sexist, maybe those on the left are just more aware of this differential?

Personally I don't think that there is any such thing as a 'chav' it's another made up term to describe a those who fall into a certain socio economic group. There are terms used as a collective term for many groups, 'PC' 'snowflakes' or 'SJWs'

If you have used a collective term yourself it's hard not to suggest you're being hypocritical to finger wag when others do it.

[Kazanne]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

... She said, sounding annoyed and calling people "losers".

Well whats good for the goose is good for the gander,not nice is it?

[Kazanne]

Originally Posted by Withano

I have no idea if you're a chav or not and I certainly didnt say that you were.
Chavs exist, and I didnt use it as an insult.. you're presumed its an insult and you denounced an entire sub-culture of Britain which was a bit rude
I dont believe chavs would have voted for tories 2 years ago, but I have seen their fanbase get chavvier, thus tories have expanded their fanbase to at least one new area, there may be others - as Alf mentioned, they're also getting the backing of brexiteers
Feel free to contribute to the thread with your own ideas instead of putting down others

I never mentioned you in my post

[Toy Soldier]

Originally Posted by Kazanne

Well whats good for the goose is good for the gander,not nice is it?

I have no problem with people "being insulting" actually. However, I don't like hypocrites. Whining about people name calling whilst name calling, for example.

[Kazanne]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

I have no problem with people "being insulting" actually. However, I don't like hypocrites. Whining about people name calling whilst name calling, for example.

Good way out of that one eh? I wasn't being a hypocrite ,I was giving an example,as we were labelled as 'chavs' but no bother that you chose to ignore that.

[Toy Soldier]

Originally Posted by Kazanne

I know disabled people ,my mom looked after one until he passed away in October, he was always treated well and helped as much as he needed it

Oh this changes everything! Your mum "looked after one". I didn't realise that you had a family member who had cared for "one of those". You probably know all about it, then. I for one will be much more comfortable deferring to your extensive knowledge and experience of "those" from now on.

[Withano]

Why am I still explain half a sentence from one post 38 posts later lol

Clarification
I dont think all tory voters are chavs and/or wealthy
I dont think all wealthy are tory voters
I dont think all chavs are tory voters
I think chavs and wealthy people are two populations that the tories appeal to in general
I dont think they had the same fanbase two years ago
I think that this is one of the reasons that tory will win, they are expanding in to new groups, whilst their competition is not
I also dont think chav is a derogatory term, there was a mixup about that too
I also take issue with people proposing its on a similar level to racism and sexism

[Toy Soldier]

Originally Posted by Withano

Why am I still explain half a sentence from one post 38 posts later lol

Because it's TiBB and people will decide that your posts mean what they want them to mean, so that they can agenda-whine in response (whilst pretending to be amused but oozing passive aggression). Pretty standard, really.

[Kazanne]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

Oh this changes everything! Your mum "looked after one". I didn't realise that you had a family member who had cared for "one of those". You probably know all about it, then. I for one will be much more comfortable deferring to your extensive knowledge and experience of "those" from now on.

What a nasty person you are, you just quoted that part of my post to suit your agenda,I gave JOEY ,my reasons for how I was voting nothing to do with you,the gent she looked after was a family friend for years and not " one of those" and he was a great loss, Joey knows this,so butt out ,with your insensitive remarks.

[Toy Soldier]

Originally Posted by Kazanne

What a nasty person you are, you just quoted that part of my post to suit your agenda,I gave JOEY ,my reasons for how I was voting nothing to do with you,the gent she looked after was a family friend for years and not " one of those" and he was a great loss, Joey knows this,so butt out ,with your insensitive remarks.

I quoted it because it was the part that jumped out at me, because it makes it abundantly clear that you think that all disabled people roughly fall under the same heading and that knowing about the issues of one individual means that you have any idea about the complex nature of the struggles faced by the disabled or those who care for them.

If you want to talk to just Joey, PM Joey. If you want your posts to be open and free for analysis and comment, post them publicly on a debate forum. As you did.

[Livia]

Originally Posted by Withano

Since when was chav a derogatory term at all. Why are you putting it on the same level as racism and sexism. Completely inappropriate.

I had a post deleted because I said someone looked like a redneck. I'd say chav was just as insulting... more so in fact.

[Livia]

Originally Posted by Kazanne

What a nasty person you are, you just quoted that part of my post to suit your agenda,I gave JOEY ,my reasons for how I was voting nothing to do with you,the gent she looked after was a family friend for years and not " one of those" and he was a great loss, Joey knows this,so butt out ,with your insensitive remarks.

Ignore button. x

[Kazanne]

Originally Posted by Livia

Ignore button. x

I think so xx

[Withano]

Originally Posted by Livia

I had a post deleted because I said someone looked like a redneck. I'd say chav was just as insulting... more so in fact.

Seems like you were getting personal.. 'looks like a chav' probably would be a similar level I agree, but I'd never get that personal, no need for it. Both groups exist, stating it so isn't the problem.

[Toy Soldier]

Originally Posted by Kazanne

I think so xx

Oh no.

[Livia]

Originally Posted by Withano

Seems like you were getting personal.. 'looks like a chav' probably would be a similar level I agree, but I'd never get that personal, no need for it. Both groups exist, stating it so isn't the problem.

I was referring to a housemate in Big Brother.

For an intelligent person, you do talk some rubbish sometimes, Withano, you really do.

[Withano]

Originally Posted by Livia

I was referring to a housemate in Big Brother.

For an intelligent person, you do talk some rubbish sometimes, Withano, you really do.

Well, I'm not a mindreader, Livia, nor have I read through every single one of your posts.
I don't know why your post was deleted - seems fine to me - the way you described it anyway... although I rarely comment on peoples looks so I dont know where the line is there, I'm not the guy to ask.

[Livia]

Originally Posted by Withano

Well, I'm not a mindreader, Livia, nor have I read through every single one of your posts.
I don't know why your post was deleted - seems fine to me - the way you described it anyway... although I rarely comment on peoples looks so I dont know where the line is there, I'm not the guy to ask.

I'm not asking you. I'm saying the term CHAV is insulting. I was drawing a comparison. You were wrong to use the term in my opinion, and no amount of semantics and denial is going to change that.

[Toy Soldier]

Originally Posted by Livia

I was referring to a housemate in Big Brother.

For an intelligent person, you do talk some rubbish sometimes, Withano, you really do.

Redneck is racials because it specifically refers to a specific group, i.e. white people from a certain area. Chavs can be of any ethnicity and can be found all across the UK .

Stop being so racist about rednecks, Livia