View Full Version : Manufactured vs 'Real' Music
Thought it would be a good thread off the back of RATM/Joe stuff, although not related to them in any way but more just in general.
OK so whats the fuss about these two types? Why is one different from the other and why do people look down on manufactured acts giving those who write their own music the moral upper ground? And why do people get looked down on for listening to certain types of music?
At the end of the day, if it sounds good it sounds good and if it doesn't it doesn't, so whats the big deal with it all?
MrGaryy
20-12-2009, 10:43 PM
it's not about looking down on someone if they like a certain type of music, its how they try and justify it. I like Heidi Montag's music a lot but I won't be seen nominating her in 'best singer ever' comps or talking about her artistry. It's about putting these people, who are really just dolls being used to display other's talents in the same category as true artists.
Twilight
20-12-2009, 10:44 PM
I agree with everything you said there.
Its about if i like the songs, who cares if its manufactured or not.
I agree with what you said about people get looked down on for listening to certain types of music as well.
it's not about looking down on someone if they like a certain type of music, its how they try and justify it. I like Heidi Montag's music a lot but I won't be seen nominating her in 'best singer ever' comps or talking about her artistry. It's about putting these people, who are really just dolls being used to display other's talents in the same category as true artists.
Right I don't know who she is or anything about her music but why should she not get 'best single ever' if people think that? I mean she might not have written it but surely people like the song because she is singing it, and the way she does?
teabag.
20-12-2009, 10:50 PM
To be honest its just what people prefer to listen too, I don't like manufactured music because i don't like the sound of it but a lot of people do.
Billy
20-12-2009, 10:53 PM
People look down it because they like to act superior.
ILoveTRW
20-12-2009, 10:54 PM
can i talk about the real world in this thread :conf:
Shaun
20-12-2009, 10:55 PM
Because art is created, not manufactured.
Twilight
20-12-2009, 10:55 PM
can i talk about the real world in this thread :conf:
WTF no duh
Jack_
20-12-2009, 10:56 PM
can i talk about the real world in this thread :conf:
PMSFL ILY :joker:
ILoveTRW
20-12-2009, 10:56 PM
WTF no duh
it says real in the title
i thought that might of been a prompt or something
Twilight
20-12-2009, 10:56 PM
LMao:P
Stephanie
20-12-2009, 10:59 PM
LOL
:joker:
ILoveTRW
20-12-2009, 11:00 PM
:joker:
More heart and soul goes into the music and lyrics that have been written and produced by the artist. I have more respect for bands that do this.
MrGaryy
20-12-2009, 11:01 PM
Right I don't know who she is or anything about her music but why should she not get 'best single ever' if people think that? I mean she might not have written it but surely people like the song because she is singing it, and the way she does?
Because Heidi won't have written it or had anything to do with the production. She'll turn up into a studio, sing, be autotuned and maybe look hot in a video. She did nothing of any musical merit. How can anyone possibly justify her winning the award over another artist like Lady GaGa par example who will have written and produced the song her self, had total creative control in it's performance and video?
James
20-12-2009, 11:03 PM
Thought it would be a good thread off the back of RATM/Joe stuff, although not related to them in any way but more just in general.
OK so whats the fuss about these two types? Why is one different from the other and why do people look down on manufactured acts giving those who write their own music the moral upper ground? And why do people get looked down on for listening to certain types of music?
At the end of the day, if it sounds good it sounds good and if it doesn't it doesn't, so whats the big deal with it all?
Because the success of manufactured acts is generally more based around image (i.e looks, fashion, being cool) than the actual sounds they make. The image/music balance is more weighted to music with non-manufactured acts.
Because art is created, not manufactured.
But do you not think manufactured acts can put their own stamps onto songs so it basically becomes 'theirs'? Manufactured doesn't have to mean generic.
Patrick
20-12-2009, 11:10 PM
Because RATM arent music there talentless rock dicks screaming.
MrGaryy
20-12-2009, 11:10 PM
But do you not think manufactured acts can put their own stamps onto songs so it basically becomes 'theirs'? Manufactured doesn't have to mean generic.
name me a manufactured artist who doesn't release generic music?
MrGaryy
20-12-2009, 11:11 PM
Because RATM arent music there talentless rock dicks screaming.
who write, produce all of their own music?
Because RATM arent music there talentless rock dicks screaming.
:rolleyes:
They have more talent than Joe.
But do you not think manufactured acts can put their own stamps onto songs so it basically becomes 'theirs'? Manufactured doesn't have to mean generic.
Well I dunno about you, but I can tell the difference between a cookie-cutter singer and an artist. They all have that generic sound.
name me a manufactured artist who doesn't release generic music?
Elvis. Not only a manufactured artist, but regarded as one of the best artists ever. Yet he never wrote his own stuff and was as manufactured as Girls Aloud
Elvis. Not only a manufactured artist, but regarded as one of the best artists ever. Yet he never wrote his own stuff and was as manufactured as Girls Aloud
This was because he was a great performer and shaped rock and roll.
Well I dunno about you, but I can tell the difference between a cookie-cutter singer and an artist. They all have that generic sound.
N Dubz and Lady Gaga both write their own material, anyone would think they're as manufactured as the next one to fall off the conveyor belt.
This was because he was a great performer and shaped rock and roll.
But he was still manufactured.
Oh and where do you draw the line between manufactured acts and covering songs? E.g. Whitney Houston- I Will Always Love You and Mariah Carey- Can't Live, two of the most well known songs ever by artists who write their own songs ... both covers. Much in the way that Snow Patrol was covered by Leona, but only the latter is compared to the original?
But he was still manufactured.
I ain't denying that. I had more recent music in mind.
He is considered one of the best musicians though for those reasons.
I ain't denying that. I had more recent music in mind.
He is considered one of the best musicians though for those reasons.
But a lot of 'real' artists also sound manufactured, so where do you draw the line and whats the difference?
N Dubz and Lady Gaga both write their own material, anyone would think they're as manufactured as the next one to fall off the conveyor belt.
I dunno about that. A lot of hip hop artists write their own material anyway. No surprise there.
Lady Gaga IS manufactured though, no matter how kooky she is.
I don't think there is a definitive line between what is manufactured and what is not. It's a tricky subject. Anyone that asks you "what is the definition of manufactured music" would need to think long and hard about the answer.
I listen to manufactured artists and music all the time. I don't particularly care that they are. I just have huge respect for those that put more effort and passion into it.
MrGaryy
20-12-2009, 11:35 PM
Elvis. Not only a manufactured artist, but regarded as one of the best artists ever. Yet he never wrote his own stuff and was as manufactured as Girls Aloud
How many people who slam manufactured artists who put Elvis under this label? He doesn't even count because his stage presence and way of performer defined him not his music.
lily.
20-12-2009, 11:36 PM
I like bands who've worked their way to where they are... can write their own material.. can play instruments.. have done their time in the small-club circuit and independant record labels.. I have a lot of respect for them.
I also like listening to music from some manufactured artists. Liking their music and respecting them as artists don't go hand in hand.
MrGaryy
20-12-2009, 11:43 PM
N Dubz and Lady Gaga both write their own material, anyone would think they're as manufactured as the next one to fall off the conveyor belt.
not really. Even haters know GaGa is very talented and totally in control of her music. and a lot of people know that she made it by performing in clubs and auditioning for labels.
Princess
20-12-2009, 11:47 PM
People forget that manufactured bands can also be very talented. Take That were a manufactured band,Kelly Clarkson came outta American Idol.
MrGaryy
20-12-2009, 11:48 PM
I dunno about that. A lot of hip hop artists write their own material anyway. No surprise there.
Lady Gaga IS manufactured though, no matter how kooky she is.
not even slightly :/ everything her releases she has total control over, she comes up with the concepts for her videos, writes her own music, produces it, controls her image, got to the top from starting in New York clubs, ect. she isn't manufactured in the slightest.
MrGaryy
20-12-2009, 11:50 PM
People forget that manufactured bands can also be very talented. Take That were a manufactured band,Kelly Clarkson came outta American Idol.
yeah but they only had manufactured beginnings, look at them now. and I think people as talented as TT and Kelly would have made it regardless, if they wanted it enough.
yeah but they only had manufactured beginnings, look at them now. and I think people as talented as TT and Kelly would have made it regardless, if they wanted it enough.
What about Cheryl Cole? She is manufactured but has more control than people give her credit for always puts on a pretty good performance. Do her performance skills put her above other manufactured acts?
Cheryl Cole does not have any REAL control. She is simply the "middle man". She is told what to wear and what to say. She may come across as an independent and powerful woman but that is her IMAGE.
Cheryl Cole does not have any REAL control. She is simply the "middle man". She is told what to wear and what to say. She may come across as an independent and powerful woman but that is her IMAGE.
Unlike people like Britney Spears who are pretty similar (manufactured, good performers but ultimately crap singers) Cheryl has had quite a lot of input into most of her songs. Plus she has roots in ballroom so she knows how to perform. Its not just a case of being told to do that, she puts herself there.
Oh great another thread where people will argue about music. Just what we need. Lets all mourn Brittany. :)
Princess
21-12-2009, 12:09 AM
yeah but they only had manufactured beginnings, look at them now. and I think people as talented as TT and Kelly would have made it regardless, if they wanted it enough.
Yeah but if they had never been manufactured,TT wouldn't even know each other,or Robbie for that matter.
Sophii3x
21-12-2009, 12:09 AM
I like bands who've worked their way to where they are... can write their own material.. can play instruments.. have done their time in the small-club circuit and independant record labels.. I have a lot of respect for them.
I also like listening to music from some manufactured artists. Liking their music and respecting them as artists don't go hand in hand.
This.
lily.
21-12-2009, 12:10 AM
Go to the Brittany thread then.. we can pass the time guessing who's next while we mourn. :thumbs:
MrGaryy
21-12-2009, 12:18 AM
i actually rofled at the mention of Cheryl Cole's 'control'.
i actually rofled at the mention of Cheryl Cole's 'control'.
She has more than you realise :thumbs:
And I could laugh at you for thinking Lady Gaga isn't manufactured
MrGaryy
21-12-2009, 12:25 AM
She has more than you realise :thumbs:
And I could laugh at you for thinking Lady Gaga isn't manufactured
no honey I can assure you, she does not. and I could laugh at the fact you know **** all about Lady GaGa or her back story.
Lady Gaga is just a gimmick. Remove all of her gimmicks, sorry quirkiness, and what are you left with? Europop. She might write her own stuff but she has a powerful team behind her.
MrGaryy
21-12-2009, 12:36 AM
Lady Gaga is just a gimmick. Remove all of her gimmicks, sorry quirkiness, and what are you left with? Europop. She might write her own stuff but she has a powerful team behind her.
and what the **** does what her music sounds like and her PR team have to do with the fact that she isn't even slightly manufactured. SHe got to the top through hardwork. I'm not calling her revolutionary or even slightly original but the fact is, she's a creation of her own imagination and determination.
and what the **** does what her music sounds like and her PR team have to do with the fact that she isn't even slightly manufactured. SHe got to the top through hardwork. I'm not calling her revolutionary or even slightly original but the fact is, she's a creation of her own imagination and determination.
Her success is more to do with her PR team than her though, I mean she isn't remotely special and her 'uniqueness' is a gimmick there to make her stand out. If the Lady Gaga we know today was genuinely the same one as a year ago (ie not pushed by a PR team and all on her own merit) then why didn't she jump into her 'quirkiness' from day 1, and why have we been gradually introduced and told how quirky she is?
Look back at her Just Dance video, she seems practically normal.
Princess
21-12-2009, 12:46 AM
I thought GaGa Lady was rubbish live,us lot were all just booing her. But I'm bias so whatever.
InOne
21-12-2009, 12:48 AM
I thought GaGa Lady was rubbish live,us lot were all just booing her. But I'm bias so whatever.
Who is 'us lot'? Did you go see her with Gazza and the boys? :tongue:
I thought GaGa Lady was rubbish live,us lot were all just booing her. But I'm bias so whatever.
Because she can only sing a bit when shes stood still. She isn't autotuned within an inch of her life for no reason :joker:
Princess
21-12-2009, 12:50 AM
Who is 'us lot'? Did you go see her with Gazza and the boys? :tongue:
Us as in the Thatters :p I saw her twice when she supported TT. Was meant to see her three times,but she had a big strop about lightning and refused to perform at 2 of their shows,hence the booing when she did perform a week later.
MrGaryy
21-12-2009, 12:50 AM
yes we did? there was no one like her in the mainstream. Her fashion was always out there her music had little quirks. It's called growing and maturing as an artist.
Princess
21-12-2009, 12:52 AM
Because she can only sing a bit when shes stood still. She isn't autotuned within an inch of her life for no reason :joker:
She sounded awful to me and was just random and kept saying stuff like 'I can't believe how many people are here' as if to see her *rolls eyes* And she took the longest fricking changes ever.
InOne
21-12-2009, 12:53 AM
Us as in the Thatters :p I saw her twice when she supported TT. Was meant to see her three times,but she had a big strop about lightning and refused to perform at 2 of their shows,hence the booing when she did perform a week later.
Ahhh, didn't think she'd be supporting them, seems an odd mix
Her success is more to do with her PR team than her though, I mean she isn't remotely special and her 'uniqueness' is a gimmick there to make her stand out. If the Lady Gaga we know today was genuinely the same one as a year ago (ie not pushed by a PR team and all on her own merit) then why didn't she jump into her 'quirkiness' from day 1, and why have we been gradually introduced and told how quirky she is?
Look back at her Just Dance video, she seems practically normal.
I saw one video of her from a few years back I presume. She had dark hair and a tan and was wearing a plain dark dress and flip flops. It is clear she has not always been this quirky or unique, so it does make me wonder if this is just a gimmick.
Princess
21-12-2009, 12:55 AM
Ahhh, didn't think she'd be supporting them, seems an odd mix
It was. They had The Saturdays,James Morrison,The Script and then Lady GaGa. It just didn't work at all.
LemonJam
21-12-2009, 12:55 AM
I have a larger respect for people who write their own music, but I can appreciate those who don't aswell if they're a good artist.
InOne
21-12-2009, 12:57 AM
It was. They had The Saturdays,James Morrison,The Script and then Lady GaGa. It just didn't work at all.
All them before TT? Guess to be a Thatter you need to have a little patience ;)
yes we did? there was no one like her in the mainstream. Her fashion was always out there her music had little quirks. It's called growing and maturing as an artist.
But it was just a bit different. Then it grew a bit more in Pokerface, then we were lead to believe she had a screw loose during Paparazzi and thats when her quirkiness really took off. Noone had really noticed until then. We've been given more and more as each video progresses until the last couple of months where shes emerged as a fully blown freak. It has been manufactured because it has been eased into us.
I saw one video of her from a few years back I presume. She had dark hair and a tan and was wearing a plain dark dress and flip flops. It is clear she has not always been this quirky or unique, so it does make me wonder if this is just a gimmick.
Theres no wondering about it, it IS a gimmick. Just look at her silly tea cup for that
Princess
21-12-2009, 01:00 AM
All them before TT? Guess to be a Thatter you need to have a little patience ;)
Lol no,they switched around! I think they did 4 dates each or were meant to at least. GaGa did 2 and The Script ended up doing 5. Gary Go was on first and then one of them,then Take That :P
Anyways I've gone way off topic as per usual *gets outta thread*
But it was just a bit different. Then it grew a bit more in Pokerface, then we were lead to believe she had a screw loose during Paparazzi and thats when her quirkiness really took off. Noone had really noticed until then. We've been given more and more as each video progresses until the last couple of months where shes emerged as a fully blown freak. It has been manufactured because it has been eased into us.
Theres no wondering about it, it IS a gimmick. Just look at her silly tea cup for that
You saw the Jonathan Ross interview then? Probably the most cringe-worthy interviews I have ever seen! I dunno what was wrong with her that night, usually she's quite charismatic.
Of course it's all down to how it sounds of course, but it's still possible to keep 'real' and manufactured music seperate in your head. I listen to plenty of pop, but I keep it to one side in my brain. It's like watching a dumb action movie to chill out. 'Real' music is my passion.
Sure it's all noise but it should still be possible to evaluate. What does Britney Spears actually do that contributes towards her being a musical artist, for instance? Not a whole lot.
So when it may all be sounds in your head I believe it is completely within out rights to say, free from being pretentious, that some of them are more 'real artists' than others.
Sorry if that sounded awkward, but it's 8:34 and the brain has not kicked in yet :hugesmile:.
xDramatick
21-12-2009, 09:46 AM
Eh, I'll listen to whatever I think sounds good.
However, I only have respect for those artists who write, have creative input into their music and perform live.
edit;; oh & Enid, she didn't really start forming the Lady GaGa persona 'til late 06 / early 07 iirc.
vids of her with dark hair like the one where she's like.. 16? and performing 'Captivated' and 'Electric Kiss', is Stefani.
'Lady GaGa' was created after one of her team described her performances as theatrical, and due to being on quite a low budget, she'd dress:
http://images.newcelebritypics.com/img/celebs/images/l/lady_gaga-12506.jpg
http://media.onsugar.com/files/ons1/286/2862078/18_2009/c6657aa874a86742_lady-ga-ga04.jpg
which is how 'Lady GaGa' began.
she can't wear all the unique, quirky fashion style clothes she wears now if she couldn't afford, hence the mis-matched coloured leotards, random disco balls and underwear+heels combinations.
Vladimir
21-12-2009, 10:39 AM
:rolleyes:
They have more talent than Joe.
:joker:
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