View Full Version : Oklahoma women to have ultrasound before abortion
Crimson Dynamo
03-05-2010, 11:10 AM
Pregnant women in the US state of Oklahoma will be given an ultrasound and receive detailed information about their unborn baby before going through with an abortion, under new laws.
Pro-lifers say the new measures, passed by the state’s legislature, are an attempt to save the lives of unborn children and prevent psychological trauma to pregnant women.
Women will hear about the dimensions of the baby, whether arms, legs and internal organs are visible and whether there is cardiac activity.
A key supporter of the change in the law, Tony Lauinger, vice president of the National Right to Life Committee, said: “The intent of the law is to provide a woman with full and complete information in advance of an irrevocable act that will take the life of an unborn child”.
Mr Lauinger added: “It is hoped that with the benefit of that information some women will opt to allow their baby to continue to live.”
Ultrasound
Mary Spaulding Balch, a director at National Right to Life, said: “Ultrasound gives a mother a window to her womb. It helps to prevent her from making a decision she may regret for the rest of her life and it empowers her with the most accurate information about her pregnancy so that she can make a truly informed ‘choice’.”
A second new law attempts to protect doctors by stopping “wrongful life” lawsuits, which have become increasingly common.
In such cases, women sue their doctors if their child is born with an abnormality claiming they would have had an abortion if they had known about it.
Earlier this week it was revealed that a baby boy in Italy had survived for two days after a botched abortion at 22 weeks.
Press reports today claim the mother chose to abort the baby after a prenatal scan showed he had a cleft lip and palate.
He was wrapped in a sheet and left to die by staff at the Rossano Calabro hospital in Italy, but the day after the abortion the baby boy, who still had his umbilical cord attached, was discovered moving and breathing by a Roman Catholic priest.
The baby was rushed to another nearby hospital, where he died the following day.
In Britain the remarkable youngster’s fight for life has fuelled calls for a reduction in the upper time limit for abortions, which are currently allowed up to 24 weeks.
A spokesman for the ProLife Alliance said: “There cannot be anybody in the world who is not horrified by a story like this nor anybody in the UK who would not support a massive reduction in the upper limit for abortion.”
http://www.christian.org.uk/news/oklahoma-women-to-have-ultrasound-before-abortion/
Ninastar
03-05-2010, 11:12 AM
I think this is kinda a good thing. It will make people think twice before an abortion.
Crimson Dynamo
03-05-2010, 11:18 AM
I think this is kinda a good thing. It will make people think twice before an abortion.
yes
Tom4784
03-05-2010, 04:46 PM
I don't agree with it at all, it's basically a guilt trip. If someone wants to have an abortion then let them get on with it and leave them alone, it's their choice to do so and nobody else's.
Crimson Dynamo
05-05-2010, 12:28 PM
I don't agree with it at all, it's basically a guilt trip. If someone wants to have an abortion then let them get on with it and leave them alone, it's their choice to do so and nobody else's.
Heaven forbid when you have children
Tom4784
05-05-2010, 01:53 PM
Heaven forbid when you have children
Heaven forbid you actually try to debate something for once.
Jessica.
05-05-2010, 01:55 PM
It should be like that everywhere!
teamandre
05-05-2010, 02:00 PM
i dont agree in abortions only in speical situatons but if you can lay down and spreed yer legs then pay price
Crimson Dynamo
05-05-2010, 02:14 PM
Heaven forbid you actually try to debate something for once.
"I don't agree with it at all, it's basically a guilt trip. If someone wants to have an abortion then let them get on with it and leave them alone, it's their choice to do so and nobody else's. "
i
rest
my
case
:xyxwave:
Lucy.
05-05-2010, 02:18 PM
I don't agree with it at all, it's basically a guilt trip. If someone wants to have an abortion then let them get on with it and leave them alone, it's their choice to do so and nobody else's.
Damn right they should be guilty!
Unless they were raped then they should have to deal with the consequences of not saying 'No'.
Beastie
05-05-2010, 02:19 PM
The abortion limit must be lowered. Also if you want an abortion you should PAY for it and not have it through the NHS. It will make people think twice before having unprotected sex. Abortion should still be legal. There are lots of young people having babies who working people are paying for and they get a council house given to them by the government. This is not fair, I think the baby should be taken away from them rather than working people paying for them to have their own house and imenities, etc..
Crimson Dynamo
05-05-2010, 02:19 PM
Damn right they should be guilty!
Unless they were raped then they should have to deal with the consequences of not saying 'No'.
by allowing them to avoid the consequences we just keep on killing babies rather than make people responsible
Lucy.
05-05-2010, 02:20 PM
by allowing them to avoid the consequences we just keep on killing babies rather than make people responsible
Are you arguing with me here or agreeing? Because i don't agree with abortion unless it's because of rape so your arguing for no point if that's the case.
Tom4784
05-05-2010, 02:24 PM
"I don't agree with it at all, it's basically a guilt trip. If someone wants to have an abortion then let them get on with it and leave them alone, it's their choice to do so and nobody else's. "
i
rest
my
case
:xyxwave:
What's wrong with that? People have the right to choose do they not?
Princess
05-05-2010, 02:24 PM
That story about the poor in Italy,my god! The abortion limit in the UK is ridiculous,there have been babies who've been born and survived at 24 weeks.
Crimson Dynamo
05-05-2010, 02:26 PM
What's wrong with that? People have the right to choose do they not?
the right to chose to kill a baby?
Lucy.
05-05-2010, 02:27 PM
People have the right to choose do they not?
I never realised Murder was a choice.
Crimson Dynamo
05-05-2010, 02:27 PM
Are you arguing with me here or agreeing? Because i don't agree with abortion unless it's because of rape so your arguing for no point if that's the case.
abortion is wrong and one day will be illegal and seen as a disgusting stain on human existance
Lucy.
05-05-2010, 02:28 PM
abortion is wrong and one day will be illegal and seen as a disgusting stain on human existance
Abortion is wrong, I agree o_0
I just don't think it's AS bad if the woman has been raped, I still don't think they should do it but I can understand their reasons.
Tom4784
05-05-2010, 02:33 PM
I never realised Murder was a choice.
the right to chose to kill a baby?
Oh please, most abortions take place very early in the pregnancy when the foetus is just an egg.
Also it's very easy to judge when you're not in the situation yourself. Lucy especially, if you were to become pregnant you would consider abortion although you'd probably swear blind you wouldn't. The point is you don't know how you'd act and feel in that situation unless you've experienced so don't judge the people who do have abortions when you don't know what's going through their heads.
Lucy.
05-05-2010, 02:35 PM
Lucy especially, if you were to become pregnant you would consider abortion although you'd probably swear blind you wouldn't.
The difference is most sensible people know how to keep it in their pants or atleast use protection so they don't have that problem in the first place. If you can't do the time don't do the crime!
abortion is wrong and one day will be illegal and seen as a disgusting stain on human existance
Illegalising abortion? Are you sh!tting me? That will cause more harm than good. There are enough unwanted children as it is, not to mention over-population.
Why ruin a young woman's life just because she was stupid and naive one time? We all make mistakes. She also does not want to be stuck with a rape baby.
Pro-choice all the way, baby. :laugh:
The difference is most sensible people know how to keep it in their pants or atleast use protection so they don't have that problem in the first place. If you can't do the time don't do the crime!
Yes, well a lot of people aren't sensible, and therefore unfit to have children anyway.
Lucy.
05-05-2010, 02:41 PM
Yes, well a lot of people aren't sensible, and therefore unfit to have children anyway.
Well they shouldn't be allowed the easy way out by a quick trip to a clinic to absolve them of all reponsibility. 'Naive' bull****. Their just too lazy to give a stuff.
Jessica.
05-05-2010, 02:42 PM
Oh please, most abortions take place very early in the pregnancy when the foetus is just an egg.
Also it's very easy to judge when you're not in the situation yourself. Lucy especially, if you were to become pregnant you would consider abortion although you'd probably swear blind you wouldn't. The point is you don't know how you'd act and feel in that situation unless you've experienced so don't judge the people who do have abortions when you don't know what's going through their heads.
It stops being an egg at the moment of conception.
Jessica.
05-05-2010, 02:42 PM
abortion is wrong and one day will be illegal and seen as a disgusting stain on human existance
I am glad it is illegal here.
Lucy.
05-05-2010, 02:43 PM
I am glad it is illegal here.
Nah, illegal doesn't help anything, people just have backstreet abortions and that's not good.
Crimson Dynamo
05-05-2010, 02:45 PM
Illegalising abortion? Are you sh!tting me? That will cause more harm than good. There are enough unwanted children as it is, not to mention over-population.
Why ruin a young woman's life just because she was stupid and naive one time? We all make mistakes. She also does not want to be stuck with a rape baby.
Pro-choice all the way, baby. :laugh:
can you tell me and everyone else how many "rape pregnancies" there were in the UK last year, or indeed any year?
Tom4784
05-05-2010, 02:46 PM
The difference is most sensible people know how to keep it in their pants or atleast use protection so they don't have that problem in the first place. If you can't do the time don't do the crime!
Again, it's easy to judge isn't it? People make mistakes with contraception. It's not foolproof and celibacy isn't a viable option really. Like Enid said, making it illegal would only cause more harm.
People aren't perfect and no contraception is 100% guaranteed to work, I don't agree with people using abortion as a form of contraception but I don't judge people who don't make the choice lightly.
Jessica.
05-05-2010, 02:46 PM
Nah, illegal doesn't help anything, people just have backstreet abortions and that's not good.
I have never heard of anyone in Ireland having an illegal abortion, people do go to England to have them sometimes though. It's only a trip across the water on a ferry. If there are abortions going on in Ireland then there are definitely less than there would be if it was legal.
Crimson Dynamo
05-05-2010, 02:47 PM
Nah, illegal doesn't help anything, people just have backstreet abortions and that's not good.
Perhaps rather than worry about that it would be better to stop the pregnancies actually occurring?
maybe we should concentrate on cause that on result
Well they shouldn't be allowed the easy way out by a quick trip to a clinic to absolve them of all reponsibility. 'Naive' bull****. Their just too lazy to give a stuff.
You're also being naive about the situation. Sometimes it is an incredibly difficult decision and situations change. It's never as simple as taking a trip down to the clinic. Well maybe in some cases, but you know what I mean.
I'd rather a girl have an abortion than see her try to raise a child before she's physically, emotionally and financially stable to support it. I see it every day.
Crimson Dynamo
05-05-2010, 02:48 PM
Again, it's easy to judge isn't it? People make mistakes with contraception. It's not foolproof and celibacy isn't a viable option really. Like Enid said, making it illegal would only cause more harm.
People aren't perfect and no contraception is 100% guaranteed to work, I don't agree with people using abortion as a form of contraception but I don't judge people who don't make the choice lightly.
again
what are the numbers of failed contraception pregnancies that you refer to, UK stats would do?
Lucy.
05-05-2010, 02:49 PM
If there are abortions going on in Ireland then there are definitely less than there would be if it was legal.
That is true but I don't see how even having one backstreet abortion is right. They are horrorific.
Lucy.
05-05-2010, 02:50 PM
I'd rather a girl have an abortion than see her try to raise a child before she's physically, emotionally and financially stable to support it. I see it every day.
Well she shouldn't open her legs then should she?!
:bored:
Can't be arsed with this if people are going to be so narrow-minded.
Crimson Dynamo
05-05-2010, 02:54 PM
:bored:
Can't be arsed with this if people are going to be so narrow-minded.
Enid you have a very poor and stereotypical view of this subject, it is you that has the keyhole view here
Lucy.
05-05-2010, 02:55 PM
It's not narrow-mindedness.
Feel free to explain to me why you think murdering a life is acceptable, i'm all ears.
Crimson Dynamo
05-05-2010, 02:56 PM
http://www.cbrinfo.org/
This is not for the feint hearted so dont go there (ie warning).
It's not narrow-mindedness.
Feel free to explain to me why you think murdering a life is acceptable, i'm all ears.
Lol, "murder". It isn't a life. It isn't even a human being. Sorry, but we are clearly very different people. Maybe I don't value "human life" as much as you do, but I do value freedom of choice.
NOTHING is right or wrong, it is merely opinion. There is absolutely nothing to say murder or abortion is wrong. I don't have to explain why I think abortion is right. I've already been through it anyway.
Damn, this is just annoying as those "MEAT IS MURDER" protests.
Lucy.
05-05-2010, 03:04 PM
There is absolutely nothing to say murder is wrong.
Psychopath much?
Crimson Dynamo
05-05-2010, 03:04 PM
Lol, "murder". It isn't a life. It isn't even a human being. Sorry, but we are clearly very different people. Maybe I don't value "human life" as much as you do, but I do value freedom of choice.
NOTHING is right or wrong, it is merely opinion. There is absolutely nothing to say murder or abortion is wrong. I don't have to explain why I think abortion is right. I've already been through it anyway.
Damn, this is just annoying as those "MEAT IS MURDER" protests.
"It isn't even a human being"
why?
explain
It's not narrow-mindedness.
Feel free to explain to me why you think murdering a life is acceptable, i'm all ears.
So your a hardcore vegan who takes care not to step on flowers or squish bugs?
Life is experience. The good things, the bad things. Life begins at birth. Before that you are an empty template. I have no problem with women aborting foetuses in the early stages. What is it exactly? Where do you draw the line?
If you consider an aborted foetus to be killing a life, then I'm rubbing a few civilizations off my chest with a tissue after I have a wank, surely? Where do you draw the line?
To me life is thought. Not a series of biological functions by an organism in the early stages of it's development. If your all for saving a 'life' which countless other species are capabale of dwarfing in terms of cognitive function, then you had better not be eating chicken tonight. After all, it exhibits far more signs of life than a ****ing egg.
Psychopath much?
You don't get what I'm saying. To say murder is wrong is not a fact. It is an opinion. I never said I think murder is right. Oh, well, I am pro-choice, so maybe I did, hehe.
Lucy.
05-05-2010, 03:08 PM
Life begins at birth. Before that you are an empty template.
An empty template that can feel pain.
Right on.
"It isn't even a human being"
why?
explain
Sorry, but I'm not going to try to rationalise with a religious nut. We are going to bump heads on pretty much everything.
An empty template that can feel pain.
Right on.
Virtually every animal on the planet can feel pain. It's hardly a hallmark of human life.
An empty template that can feel pain.
Right on.
Very later on in the pregnancy. To say that a little foetus or embryo can feel pain is just moronic.
Lucy.
05-05-2010, 03:11 PM
Virtually every animal on the planet can feel pain.
I am not disputing that. All i'm saying is that i don't think it's right to kill a baby when in the majority of cases if you hadn't wanted one you could have avoided it in the first place.
Lucy.
05-05-2010, 03:12 PM
To say that a little foetus or embryo can feel pain is just moronic.
I never said they could. If you look i have never actually said anything about abortion very early on, that's a different thing to killing a foetus which is actually a life.
I am not disputing that. All i'm saying is that i don't think it's right to kill a baby when in the majority of cases if you hadn't wanted one you could have avoided it in the first place.
I don't think it's right to kill a baby either. I don't support a womans choice to kill a baby. I support a womans choice to kill a young foetus. If you think they compare in any way, shape or form then so be it, but that is where we differ.
I am not disputing that. All i'm saying is that i don't think it's right to kill a baby when in the majority of cases if you hadn't wanted one you could have avoided it in the first place.
I agree with you. Many women even use it as the new contraceptive.
The option should always be there, however. If a woman wants to have an abortion, if she feels like a child would be a burden, she should be allowed that choice.
Lucy.
05-05-2010, 03:13 PM
I don't think it's right to kill a baby either. I don't support a womans choice to kill a baby. I support a womans choice to kill a young foetus. If you think they compare in any way, shape or form then so be it, but that is where we differ.
I don't.
Crimson Dynamo
05-05-2010, 03:13 PM
Very later on in the pregnancy. To say that a little foetus or embryo can feel pain is just moronic.
It is not moronic and unless you can back that up I would not make the call. I am still waiting on your rape stats?
It is not moronic and unless you can back that up I would not make the call. I am still waiting on your rape stats?
Why do you need rape statistics, LT? It happens, doesn't it? That's all you need to know.
It is not moronic and unless you can back that up I would not make the call. I am still waiting on your rape stats?
Your Christian. You don't get to harass others for proof.
Crimson Dynamo
05-05-2010, 03:17 PM
Why do you need rape statistics, LT? It happens, doesn't it? That's all you need to know.
It is a red herring. the numbers are so small noone one would seriously use it for legislation. It is just a line that folks like you troop out with little thought
Crimson Dynamo
05-05-2010, 03:17 PM
http://womensissues.about.com/od/reproductiverights/a/AbortionArgumen.htm
Your Christian. You don't get to harass others for proof.
Hahah nice one.
That story about the poor in Italy,my god! The abortion limit in the UK is ridiculous,there have been babies who've been born and survived at 24 weeks.
this!!!
Crimson Dynamo
05-05-2010, 03:41 PM
Your Christian. You don't get to harass others for proof.
its not so much proof as we all know that it can happen but it is the tiny numbers that fully undermine it as an argument for abortion.
its not so much proof as we all know that it can happen but it is the tiny numbers that fully undermine it as an argument for abortion.
I know what your getting at, yeah. But it's hardly the only argument for abortion. I do think a good reason is needed.
Crimson Dynamo
05-05-2010, 03:57 PM
I know what your getting at, yeah. But it's hardly the only argument for abortion. I do think a good reason is needed.
just knocking down this one
i hope you will be voting tomorrow?
Crimson Dynamo
05-05-2010, 04:16 PM
When a pregnant woman, one who intends to have the baby born, looses that baby the reaction is always as if that baby is alive and a real human (same if she is murdered or dies). noone ever says "oh well at least it was not a human" and so forth...
When a pregnant woman, one who intends to have the baby born, looses that baby the reaction is always as if that baby is alive and a real human (same if she is murdered or dies). noone ever says "oh well at least it was not a human" and so forth...
I assume because it was a wanted pregnancy. Nobody is going to say "at least it was not a human" because that would be an arsey thing to do.
Different attitude altogether.
Shasown
05-05-2010, 04:22 PM
just knocking down this one
i hope you will be voting tomorrow?
Voting for what LT?
Finger on the pulse as always.
Crimson Dynamo
05-05-2010, 04:27 PM
Voting for what LT?
Finger on the pulse as always.
For the Scottish girl on Over the Rainbow. she is a fox.
grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrroooooooooooooooowllll lllllllll
Crimson Dynamo
05-05-2010, 04:28 PM
I assume because it was a wanted pregnancy. Nobody is going to say "at least it was not a human" because that would be an arsey thing to do.
Different attitude altogether.
:conf:
just knocking down this one
i hope you will be voting tomorrow?
Voting on what? Polling stations across Ireland will be closed tommorow.
Shasown
05-05-2010, 04:53 PM
Voting on what? Polling stations across Ireland will be closed tommorow.
In Lt's mind the whole world are voting tomorrow.
Reality and him dont often meet.
WOMBAI
05-05-2010, 07:41 PM
abortion is wrong and one day will be illegal and seen as a disgusting stain on human existance
More like a case of wishful thinking! It will not become illegal in this country -because women do have a say what happens to their own body's in the developed world in the 21st Century! Once again LT you sit up there on your high horse thinking you and other like-minded people have the right to impose their views on others! Fortunately - you don't!
The situation in Oaklahoma is just emotional blackmail - a desperate, low act!
... wow, the self imposed ban didn't last long, did it?
WOMBAI
06-05-2010, 07:00 AM
Anything - to disappoint you! Comments such as 'now Wombai has gone' just a red rag to a bull!
Anything - to disappoint you! Comments such as 'now Wombai has gone' just a red rag to a bull!
And comments such as 'he will be back, he needs TIBB more than it needs him!' are fondly remembered by yours truley, especially in light of the fact that I never left, and you did. It's hillarious. Super hillarious.
WOMBAI
06-05-2010, 07:09 AM
And comments such as 'he will be back, he needs TIBB more than it needs him!' are fondly remembered by yours truley, especially in light of the fact that I never left, and you did. It's hillarious. Super hillarious.
Touched a nerve did I! Remember away!
No, no, no nerves. It's just ... pretty damn hillarious. Funny watching you try and turn it back with abstract, meaningless 'touched a nerve' comments, too. Just damn good fun, s'all I'm saying. I think I'm at peace. I have this to look back at anytime I feel like I am getting worked up on here.
I can smile. It's great.
WOMBAI
06-05-2010, 07:22 AM
So happy to hear you are at peace with yourself!
Until the next time the spaceman spies some more bandwagons to jump upon!
So happy to hear you are at peace with yourself!
Until the next time the spaceman spies some more bandwagons to jump upon!
Some more?
That would indicate that I have jumped on bandwagons in the past. Do tell. I believe you may be full of ****. Cashing cheques with your keyboard that you can't prove later on is part of your reputation, right?
Anyway, congratulations on a highly successful forum exodus.
WOMBAI
06-05-2010, 07:57 AM
Some more?
That would indicate that I have jumped on bandwagons in the past. Do tell. I believe you may be full of ****. Cashing cheques with your keyboard that you can't prove later on is part of your reputation, right?
Anyway, congratulations on a highly successful forum exodus.
Speaking of sh*t .....!
Crimson Dynamo
06-05-2010, 08:43 AM
In Lt's mind the whole world are voting tomorrow.
Reality and him dont often meet.
I cant believe the polling stations in Eireland will be closed, the lazy gits. No wonder that country has gone to the dogs if they cant be bothered to vote. As part of England the Queen should make them get out of the bars and vote.
They are nothing but a poor mans Greece that bunch..
Speaking of sh*t .....!
Oh look, you can't answer the question.
I cant believe the polling stations in Eireland will be closed, the lazy gits. No wonder that country has gone to the dogs if they cant be bothered to vote. As part of England the Queen should make them get out of the bars and vote.
They are nothing but a poor mans Greece that bunch..
Has your wumming gotten this cookie cutter? :joker:
Niamh.
06-05-2010, 11:27 AM
I don't agree with it at all, it's basically a guilt trip. If someone wants to have an abortion then let them get on with it and leave them alone, it's their choice to do so and nobody else's.
If there's nothing wrong with abortion then how could you feel guilty?
If there's nothing wrong with abortion then how could you feel guilty?
I think for some woman Niamh its not a case of they don't think that there's nothing wrong with abortion more a case of feeling that is the best choice for them at that time.
I agree that if some women are using it as a form of contraception then that is terrible ,but in reallity you would want to be a right hardhearted emotionless cow to go through with an abortion everytime you fell pregnant.
If there's nothing wrong with abortion then how could you feel guilty?
It's still very easy to make someone feel guilty. Think about the guilt campaigns against smokers.
Niamh.
06-05-2010, 11:53 AM
I think for some woman Niamh its not a case of they don't think that there's nothing wrong with abortion more a case of feeling that is the best choice for them at that time.
I agree that if some women are using it as a form of contraception then that is terrible ,but in reallity you would want to be a right hardhearted emotionless cow to go through with an abortion everytime you fell pregnant.
It's not that I think these women should be tortured or anything but I just think our society has gone so soft that people have no respect anymore. If it wasn't so easy and tender to have an abortion then the people who do see nothing wrong it might, shouldn't they be made aware of exactly what they are doing? I think they should. I think the same about single mothers (and I was one btw) It rarely happened years ago because you were so shamed and the baby was taken off you, but people didn't have kids until they could support and look after them, themselves, now don't get me wrong, it was too much but we went from that to handing them everything on a plate, and making it worth their while to pop out a few. I mean when I had my daughter, I applied for single parents allowance but I also had a part time job and the social welfare officer told me I'd be better off not working at all! I mean doesn't that sound crazy??? I understand people make mistakes but it should be harder for these people so they realise that they have made a mistake not encourage them to do it again so they can get a bigger house or what ever.
It's not that I think these women should be tortured or anything but I just think our society has gone so soft that people have no respect anymore. If it wasn't so easy and tender to have an abortion then the people who do see nothing wrong it might, shouldn't they be made aware of exactly what they are doing? I think they should. I think the same about single mothers (and I was one btw) It rarely happened years ago because you were so shamed and the baby was taken off you, but people didn't have kids until they could support and look after them, themselves, now don't get me wrong, it was too much but we went from that to handing them everything on a plate, and making it worth their while to pop out a few. I mean when I had my daughter, I applied for single parents allowance but I also had a part time job and the social welfare officer told me I'd be better off not working at all! I mean doesn't that sound crazy??? I understand people make mistakes but it should be harder for these people so they realise that they have made a mistake not encourage them to do it again so they can get a bigger house or what ever.
Firstly Niamh there is nothing "easy & tender" about having an abortion,if you have encountered women that have had numerous abortions and feel it is so then tbh thats shocking.
I have been living in Ireland 11yrs and have only met 2 women that have confided in me that they went to england to have abortions.neither found their choice an easy one.
Quite frankly I would think that alot of adults today in Ireland would much rather the shame of living with their single mothers than growing up in those hell holes they were placed in.And if times have changed so that mother and child are allowed to stay together then times have changed for the better.
The welfare system over here is crazy.I am South African and you would not in a million years get this at home,not even JSB or JSA.The child benefit here is I think although gone down a little is a crazy amount and I agree would probably encourage some women to have more kids.There is a family down the road from me who have 8 kids and they were getting over 1200e a month as well as the other grant for kids under 5.In saying that I have seen my very good friend/neighbour loose their home as their sole income is now social welfare and its a real struggle.they have had to move back to louth from kildare
Niamh.
06-05-2010, 12:40 PM
Firstly Niamh there is nothing "easy & tender" about having an abortion,if you have encountered women that have had numerous abortions and feel it is so then tbh thats shocking.
I have been living in Ireland 11yrs and have only met 2 women that have confided in me that they went to england to have abortions.neither found their choice an easy one.
Quite frankly I would think that alot of adults today in Ireland would much rather the shame of living with their single mothers than growing up in those hell holes they were placed in.And if times have changed so that mother and child are allowed to stay together then times have changed for the better.
The welfare system over here is crazy.I am South African and you would not in a million years get this at home,not even JSB or JSA.The child benefit here is I think although gone down a little is a crazy amount and I agree would probably encourage some women to have more kids.There is a family down the road from me who have 8 kids and they were getting over 1200e a month as well as the other grant for kids under 5.In saying that I have seen my very good friend/neighbour loose their home as their sole income is now social welfare and its a real struggle.they have had to move back to louth from kildare
Well look I'm not for one minute suggesting that it should go back to the way it was years ago where girls had no choice, their child was taken away and that was that but it should how ever be made a bit more tough than it is now where you're basically rewarded the more kids you have and the less work you do
Well look I'm not for one minute suggesting that it should go back to the way it was years ago where girls had no choice, their child was taken away and that was that but it should how ever be made a bit more tough than it is now where you're basically rewarded the more kids you have and the less work you do
Less work ? In some cases they have never had a job in their lives nor do they intend to,and its most probable that their children will follow suit.
I know of a couple who live together ,he works she claims single parents.they got the back to school allowance last year booked a holiday to Portugal and were on said holiday when Vincent de Paul called around with the school books as she had phoned them with a sad story .they left the books with her mother.she was bragging about this in my local:devil: haven't given a cent to Vincent de Paul since i heard her because it pissed me of so much.
sorry gone right off topic:o
We need an entire thread devoted to bashing our messed up Irish social welfare system. Been waiting four months for my ****ing dole now, the bastards.
Niamh.
06-05-2010, 01:13 PM
Less work ? In some cases they have never had a job in their lives nor do they intend to,and its most probable that their children will follow suit.
I know of a couple who live together ,he works she claims single parents.they got the back to school allowance last year booked a holiday to Portugal and were on said holiday when Vincent de Paul called around with the school books as she had phoned them with a sad story .they left the books with her mother.she was bragging about this in my local:devil: haven't given a cent to Vincent de Paul since i heard her because it pissed me of so much.
sorry gone right off topic:o
Yeah, this is what really angers me too. I'm all for giving someone a helping hand to get back on their feet but we're been made a laughing stock out of. Their isn't room in our jails for the scumbags who steal our cars and break into our houses but they have plenty of resources to catch the people who's road tax (ha road tax???) is out of date. They play on our fear because we have something to loose where as the guy who breaks into my house has feck all to loose and has never been made to work for a thing in his life ggggrrrr:devil:
Niamh.
06-05-2010, 01:16 PM
We need an entire thread devoted to bashing our messed up Irish social welfare system. Been waiting four months for my ****ing dole now, the bastards.
We definitely do, I'm so fed up of it, I swear. That politican (don't know his name) is refusing to hand back his €100k pension on principle, ON PRINCIPLE???? on what *****ing principle tell me??? They've just cut firemen and the gards wages but he thinks he has a point to prove?????
vBulletin® v3.8.11, Copyright ©2000-2025, vBulletin Solutions Inc.