Steve is categorically not a hero

[MrGaryy]

There was another thread on this but it got terribly sidetracked and was closed before I got to it so I opened this one to discuss the matter.

First of all, walking past a bomb and getting blown up does not make you a hero. That is an insult to the real heroes of the world. I would consider someone who did something exceptionally brave or someone who is solely responsible for saving another person's life in a crisis a hero. Walking past a barrel does not make you a hero just desperately unlucky.

Secondly, to those who say the fact he joined the forces in the first place makes him a hero as he was risking his life for freedom - he was fighting in Northern Ireland, the troubles were not about freedom they were about power and prejudice. Something which is in a way almost proven by how bigoted Steve has shown himself up to be in so many respects.

Brave for joining the army, yes. A hero, absolutely not.

[Zippy]

He's never called himself one so its not fair to use it against him. He's a victim and a survivor. Thats enough.

Rebuilding your life physically and emotionally after such a tragedy takes great strength. You cant take that away from him.

But he is still a dull HM.

[Braden]

I think what you said, is what alot of people think but just don't have the guts to actully come out and say it. I'm only going to base Steve as a Big Brother housemate, nothing else.

[MrGaryy]

I know he hasn't called himself one, I'm not using it against him. He's shown himself to be a completely unpleasant, nasty bit of work all by himself irregardless of his war connotations.

[Zippy]

You could argue that all serving service men are heroes for putting themselves in very dangerous positions for a living. He was certainly in a dangerous place.

[serensilver]

Thats a bit harsh, he hasnt said he's a hero, but at the end of the day he went to war and was willing to put his life on the line for his country!

Him being in the war will not change my mind on him winning/being evicted i dont think he's that entertaining and shouldnt win based on his past/disability.

I do however respect him for what he did or was willing to do for his country :wavey:

[ElProximo]

First of all, walking past a bomb and getting blown up does not make you a hero.

Yes it does. He took the blast that.. if not for his sacrifice.. would have been taken by another.
If not taken by another soldier it would have been used on innocent civilians.
He is a hero.
You are not.
He is a giant and you ought to wish you could have 1/2 the brass balls Steve had in not just taking a blast so others did not but also for the huge character in that guy for coming out a cheerful positive person who doesn't have to belittle others to feel bigger about himself.

[Angus]

I know he hasn't called himself one, I'm not using it against him. He's shown himself to be a completely unpleasant, nasty bit of work all by himself irregardless of his war connotations.

Well then why not just talk about those characteristics instead of going on about whether or not he's a hero?

It makes me laugh that the ones who go on about the hero stuff are probably pathetic little cowards who would poo their pants if they were sent to a war zone - probably the sort of people who expect others to fight for them, but would never in a million years do it themselves.

[Stu]

Thats a bit harsh, he hasnt said he's a hero, but at the end of the day he went to war and was willing to put his life on the line for his country!

Him being in the war will not change my mind on him winning/being evicted i dont think he's that entertaining and shouldnt win based on his past/disability.

I do however respect him for what he did or was willing to do for his country :wavey:
War.

LOL.

Yes it does. He took the blast that.. if not for his sacrifice.. would have been taken by another.
If not taken by another soldier it would have been used on innocent civilians.
He is a hero.
You are not.
He is a giant and you ought to wish you could have 1/2 the brass balls Steve had in not just taking a blast so others did not but also for the huge character in that guy for coming out a cheerful positive person who doesn't have to belittle others to feel bigger about himself.
Are you sure he willingly blew himself up? I'm not so sure. I think you might be making an assumption there.

Well then why not just talk about those characteristics instead of going on about whether or not he's a hero?

It makes me laugh that the ones who go on about the hero stuff are probably pathetic little cowards who would poo their pants if they were sent to a war zone - probably the sort of people who expect others to fight for them, but would never in a million years do it themselves.
Because he wants to set the record straight, not against Steve himself, but against others who might call him a hero?

Also, this whole macho ass not being allowed to say a word about army folk unless you yourself are willing to pedal a plane into an Al Qaeda fortress armed with nothing but the grace of god and a small miniature terrier is really, really old.

Damn right I'm a coward when it comes to shipping myself to wars. I can still criticize.

[Julie10]

I know he hasn't called himself one, I'm not using it against him. He's shown himself to be a completely unpleasant, nasty bit of work all by himself irregardless of his war connotations.


When has he been a nasty piece of work. What is your gripe really? Everyone has a nasty side to them so why shouldn't he have his bad days and flip out occasionally after all he is human. It sounds as if you have another axe to grind. He has never once said he is an angel or any other description.

[Zippy]

I honestly dont even think of the whole war/hero stuff that keeps getting dragged up. All I see is a guy who faced a life changing trauma and dealt with it and continues to deal with it in an amazingly inspiring way. He doesnt make a fuss of his disabilities even though Im sure it makes life extremely difficult.

And I see a dull HM. Thats it.

Stop using the war stuff against him. Its irrelevent.

[Stu]

When has he been a nasty piece of work. What is your gripe really? Everyone has a nasty side to them so why shouldn't he have his bad days and flip out occasionally after all he is human. It sounds as if you have another axe to grind. He has never once said he is an angel or any other description.
More than just being a nasty piece of work though, he does seem like he is a very bigotted person with very old fashioned, more often than not silly, views. You could almost fill a white board with a list of the views he holds. I know that's horribly assumptive of me, but you know.

Also, his constant harping on about team play gets on my tits. Your in a TV studio. Lighten up and have fun. I know they need to work to a certain extent to get food and stuff but he looks like a ****in' slave driver at times.

'Right lads, enough of this nonsense. It's TEAM TIME. RAGHHHHHHHHH!'.

[daniel-lewis-1985]

Yes it does. He took the blast that.. if not for his sacrifice.. would have been taken by another.
If not taken by another soldier it would have been used on innocent civilians.
He is a hero.
You are not.
He is a giant and you ought to wish you could have 1/2 the brass balls Steve had in not just taking a blast so others did not but also for the huge character in that guy for coming out a cheerful positive person who doesn't have to belittle others to feel bigger about himself.

Mate he didnt jump on the bomb to save a civillian or another soldier. The irish detonated it as he was walking past.

So he did not intentionally save anyones life hence not making him a hero. It was a fluke.

He's not a hero but to be fair he doesnt want to be labelled that.

He is however a very very dull housemate and if he wins this show then its completely on a sympathy vote and personally as soon as he's up for eviction (unfortunatly noone will nominate the dullard) im voting him out.

[MojoNixon]

There was another thread on this but it got terribly sidetracked and was closed before I got to it so I opened this one to discuss the matter.

First of all, walking past a bomb and getting blown up does not make you a hero. That is an insult to the real heroes of the world. I would consider someone who did something exceptionally brave or someone who is solely responsible for saving another person's life in a crisis a hero. Walking past a barrel does not make you a hero just desperately unlucky.

Secondly, to those who say the fact he joined the forces in the first place makes him a hero as he was risking his life for freedom - he was fighting in Northern Ireland, the troubles were not about freedom they were about power and prejudice. Something which is in a way almost proven by how bigoted Steve has shown himself up to be in so many respects.

Brave for joining the army, yes. A hero, absolutely not.

He never was your hero right from the start. But if there were not guys like Steve, you would speak russia or germany right now. And i don't say it because it was WWII, but cowards like you make me puke. Now crawl back behind your keyboards pansy.

[MojoNixon]

Thats a bit harsh, he hasnt said he's a hero, but at the end of the day he went to war and was willing to put his life on the line for his country!

Him being in the war will not change my mind on him winning/being evicted i dont think he's that entertaining and shouldnt win based on his past/disability.

I do however respect him for what he did or was willing to do for his country :wavey:

Thank you :kiss:

[Stu]

He never was your hero right from the start. But if there were not guys like Steve, you would speak russia or germany right now. And i don't say it because it was WWII, but cowards like you make me puke. Now crawl back behind your keyboards pansy.
I'm sure they say that in - oh wait, plenty of countries speak English. Oh well.

Thankfully others do the fighting, like you said.

Sometimes it's smart to be a coward.

Let the people who want to go to war, go to war. I'll sit at home, scratch my balls, and watch it on the news.

[MojoNixon]

Yes it does. He took the blast that.. if not for his sacrifice.. would have been taken by another.
If not taken by another soldier it would have been used on innocent civilians.
He is a hero.
You are not.
He is a giant and you ought to wish you could have 1/2 the brass balls Steve had in not just taking a blast so others did not but also for the huge character in that guy for coming out a cheerful positive person who doesn't have to belittle others to feel bigger about himself.

I used to hate ELProximo back then (i was harryrag back then). But now ELProximo has become a my fav TIBB person.

[Zippy]

Mate he didnt jump on the bomb to save a civillian or another soldier. The irish detonated it as he was walking past.

So he did not intentionally save anyones life hence not making him a hero. It was a fluke.



Service men have a huge target on their backs. Which makes civilians less likely to be targeted. They are risking their lives just by being in certain places. That is a fact.

But nobody wants to be a dead hero. Like anything in life its a calculated risk. he paid a huge price. The least he deserves is respect. Some round here seem to begrudge him even that much.

[Livia]

There was another thread on this but it got terribly sidetracked and was closed before I got to it so I opened this one to discuss the matter...... etc. etc. etc..................



How lucky are we to have you here! With your in-depth knowledge of bloody everything! And how amazingly intelligent you must be to have the final say on what does and doesn't constitute a hero. You must be so proud of yourself.

[Stu]

You know Steve himself denied hero status on many occasions, right?

But hey, this is the wisdom of someone who needs to let everyone know they have an ignore list. Pow pow, baby!

[Livia]

I'm sure they say that in - oh wait, plenty of countries speak English. Oh well.

Thankfully others do the fighting, like you said.

Sometimes it's smart to be a coward.

Let the people who want to go to war, go to war. I'll sit at home, scratch my balls, and watch it on the news.

Smart to be a coward... LOL Yeah, cowardice is such an attractive and admirable quality.

Luckily there are some people who are willing to go to war so that people like you can sit at home, scratch your balls and watch it on the news.

[MojoNixon]

All his haters never did do a **** but living with their parents money or social welfare.

[Stu]

Smart to be a coward... LOL Yeah, cowardice is such an attractive and admirable quality.

Luckily there are some people who are willing to go to war so that people like you can sit at home, scratch your balls and watch it on the news.
That's basically it, yes.

Now go to war, you coward.

[Livia]

You know Steve himself denied hero status on many occasions, right?

But hey, this is the wisdom of someone who needs to let everyone know they have an ignore list. Pow pow, baby!

You are not on my 'ignore list' "baby"... because your ignorance coupled with your astounding sense of self-importance amuses me.

[Livia]

That's basically it, yes.

Now go to war, you coward.

That doesn't even make any sense.

[daniel-lewis-1985]

I don't understand why these daddy hatingg teens even use teens are even using Steves background to judge him all the time. All his haters never did do a **** but living with their parents money or social welfare.

Im not a teen im 25.

I havnt lived with my parents since i was 15.

And i have never claimed any sort of benefit.

[calyman]

Yes it does. He took the blast that.. if not for his sacrifice.. would have been taken by another.
If not taken by another soldier it would have been used on innocent civilians.
He is a hero.
You are not.
He is a giant and you ought to wish you could have 1/2 the brass balls Steve had in not just taking a blast so others did not but also for the huge character in that guy for coming out a cheerful positive person who doesn't have to belittle others to feel bigger about himself.
Of course not, keely after all is only 4'11

[Stu]

You are not on my 'ignore list' "baby"... because your ignorance coupled with your astounding sense of self-importance amuses me.
I usually find that those intent on pointing out complete strangers sense of self importance tend to be the most self important themselves. I'm glad I provide you with entertainment.

'I HAVE AN IGNORE LIST LOL. I PRBABLY DNT WANT TO TALK TO YOU'.

I was also never aware that admitting cowardice to the prospect of armed combat made one self important. I find it rather humbling.
That doesn't even make any sense.
I'm a coward for not wanting to go to war and for admitting that I let other people do it for me [speaking hypopthetically, of course, because I'm not in the UK]. Thing is I admit it.

SO ... are you a coward? After all ... your not going to war, are you? Why not?

I just really don't see the big deal with admitting I'm a coward at the prospect of going to war. Most people are, even if they don't want to admit it. It hardly paints me out to be a coward in all other areas of life.

[MojoNixon]

That's basically it, yes.

Now go to war, you coward.

Stu, were you there? Livia was defending Steve.

[Stu]

Stu, were you there? Livia was defending Steve.
No wai!

I think I explained in my last post.

[vesavius]

My personal view is that a hero is someone that consciously does something brave and noble in a given situation to serve a higher cause or his comrades.



Becoming a soldier dosent automatically qualify a man for that.

[MojoNixon]

No wai!

I think I explained in my last post.

Ok, sorry :)

[Livia]

I usually find that those intent on pointing out complete strangers sense of self importance tend to be the most self important themselves. I'm glad I provide you with entertainment.. . etc. etc. etc. blah blah blah...



Actually, you initially answered something I'd posted to someone else... you jumped in with some citicism of me... I was a complete stranger. You've made me a bit of a project and used quote after quote of mine. You're wasting your time really, I have no intension of going backwards and forwards with you I see now that I was over-egging your entertainment value. You use a hell of a lot of words to say virtually nothing.

I refer you to my footer that you find so hilarious, which will save you the bother of ranting away ad nausium, and will save me the bother of reading your tedious posts.

[MojoNixon]

I just really don't see the big deal with admitting I'm a coward at the prospect of going to war. Most people are, even if they don't want to admit it. It hardly paints me out to be a coward in all other areas of life.

I do understand that. But i don't see any point to dismiss Steve JUST bacause he WAS there. I do understand that Irish pr1cks and teens are hating him (just because they hate their dads) but it is useless to use his background to hate him.

[Zippy]

Becoming a soldier dosent automatically qualify a man for that.

Being a serving soldier means you are on the frontline and in a potentially fatal position. Its a dirty job with the ultimate consequences. Somebody has to do it.

I think there is something heroic about that. Theyre sitting ducks and don't get hugely compensated for being such.

[Tom4784]

My personal view is that a hero is someone that consciously does something brave and noble in a given situation to serve a higher cause or his comrades.



Becoming a soldier dosent automatically qualify a man for that.

This basically, I respect the man for rebuilding and making the most of his life but he is an awful HM.

[Stu]

You use a hell of a lot of words to say virtually nothing.
Hmm ...

Actually, you initially answered something I'd posted to someone else... you jumped in with some citicism of me... I was a complete stranger. You've made me a bit of a project and used quote after quote of mine. You're wasting your time really, I have no intension of going backwards and forwards with you I see now that I was over-egging your entertainment value. You use a hell of a lot of words to say virtually nothing.

I refer you to my footer that you find so hilarious, which will save you the bother of ranting away ad nausium, and will save me the bother of reading your tedious posts.
Yep.

[daniel-lewis-1985]

This basically, I respect the man for rebuilding and making the most of his life but he is an awful HM.

Agree 100%

[Livia]

This basically, I respect the man for rebuilding and making the most of his life but he is an awful HM.

I agree with that.

[Stu]

I do understand that. But i don't see any point to dismiss Steve JUST bacause he WAS there. I do understand that Irish pr1cks and teens are hating him (just because they hate their dads) but it is useless to use his background to hate him.
But I'm not dismissing him, sweetheart. In fact I originally backed up that Steve already denied he was a hero, and that this topic perhaps was aimed more at OTHERS who consider him a hero.

Irish pr1cks
See now you are just being a ****.

****.

[MojoNixon]

Being a serving soldier means you are on the frontline and in a potentially fatal position. Its a dirty job with the ultimate consequences. Somebody has to do it.

I think there is something heroic about that. Theyre sitting ducks and don't get hugely compensated for being such.

But teens don't realize that. They have their ipods and playstations. Isn't world just peace loving place? Only UK soldiers are making it worse....

[Stu]

Everytime you scream about teens and social welfare, all the rest of us hear is 'I'm a bitter old bag'.

[vesavius]

Being a serving soldier means you are on the frontline and in a potentially fatal position. Its a dirty job with the ultimate consequences. Somebody has to do it.

I think there is something heroic about that. Theyre sitting ducks and don't get hugely compensated for being such.


Thats a valid way of seeing it, I get where your coming from.

I personally just don't being a career soldier makes you a hero... it earns you my respect and my thanks, but the word 'hero' has become overused and devalued I think.

[MojoNixon]

See now you are just being a ****.

****.

So who did blow him up then? But don't get me wrong, i don't hate Ireland.

[vesavius]

But teens don't realize that. They have their ipods and playstations. Isn't world just peace loving place? Only UK soldiers are making it worse....

Mojo, please... I am obviously not a teen and am making a valid point.

[Stu]

Thats a valid way of seeing it, I get where your coming from.

I personally just don't being a career soldier makes you a hero... it earns you my respect and my thanks, but the word 'hero' has become overused and devalued I think.
This is my view.

Also, going back to MojoNixon and his use of the term 'Irish pr1cks', I think this is why many of us have our doubts about Steve. He seems like the person who off camera would say things like that.

A bit of a MojoNixon, if you will.

[MojoNixon]

Everytime you scream about teens and social welfare, all the rest of us hear is 'I'm a bitter old bag'.

Maybe i should be. After all, i work my arse off every night. What do you do?
But again, i don't have anything against you. And i won't gonna continue fight with you. You are OK.

[Stu]

So who did blow him up then? But don't get me wrong, i don't hate Ireland.
Terrorists blew him up. I don't see what nationality has to do with it. They are Irish terrorists, yes, but the English have not all recently become a nation of pr1cks becuase Raoul Moat done a nut.

[MojoNixon]

Mojo, please... I am obviously not a teen and am making a valid point.

No you don't. I remeber you Che Guevara avatar, so i do know EXACTLY what you are thinking.

[Stu]

Maybe i should be. After all, i work my arse off every night. What do you do?
But again, i don't have anything against you. And i won't gonna continue fight with you. You are OK.
I work too, you know. It's this prepostrous assumptive attitude I don't like :wink:.

[Livia]

But teens don't realize that. They have their ipods and playstations. Isn't world just peace loving place? Only UK soldiers are making it worse....

We've turned into the kind of country where people, especially teens, like you say, spout the most unadulterated rubbish about the military. Their ignorance of the subject doesn't stand in the way of them making a snap judgement. Shame... We've turned into the kind of place that laughs at someone for being injured in a terrorist action, and build shrines to people like Raoul Moat.

[MojoNixon]

This is my view.

Also, going back to MojoNixon and his use of the term 'Irish pr1cks', I think this is why many of us have our doubts about Steve. He seems like the person who off camera would say things like that.

A bit of a MojoNixon, if you will.

I said earlier that i don't have anything against Ireland. And sorry about that term. But why are you referring me to Steve? Just think by yourself.

But again, i'm not gonna fight with you because you are OK. But vesavius is a another story, he IS terrorist sympathizer.

[ElProximo]

Mate he didnt jump on the bomb to save a civillian or another soldier. The irish detonated it as he was walking past.

So he did not intentionally save anyones life hence not making him a hero. It was a fluke.



Wrong.
He volunteered to take that explosion. He did that when he signed up to serve. You need to understand that.
If he didn't do that on purpose then you or I would eventually be in line for it. Probably me. I'm not as brave as Steve but I have a feeling your less likely to be counted on if it comes to it.
The good news is that Steve volunteered to take that explosion first and so it will never make it to your front door or mine.

Steve is a dull HM?
One of the reasons you even get to watch entertaining HMs in a program called BB is BECAUSE OF PEOPLE LIKE STEVE IN THE FIRST PLACE.

The sad.. I mean just pathetic, sad and even downright disgusting things is when people don't even understand that.
That is a ****ing tragedy that far too many spoiled young people don't understand why their iPhone and BB voting parties and entertaining programs are OWED to the Steves of this world.

Anyways.. I also find him an intriguing HM so its all good for me.

[Stu]

I said earlier that i don't have anything against Ireland. And sorry about that term. But why are you referring me to Steve? Just think by yourself.

But again, i'm not gonna fight with you because you are OK. But vesavius is a another story, he IS terrorist sympathizer.
Fair dues.

And yes, I am well clued up on Che Guevara.

[WOMBAI]

Smart to be a coward... LOL Yeah, cowardice is such an attractive and admirable quality.

Luckily there are some people who are willing to go to war so that people like you can sit at home, scratch your balls and watch it on the news.

Stu is a keyboard warrier! He prefers to fight his battles verbally, in the safety of his bedroom! :hugesmile:

[MojoNixon]

Stu is a keyboard warrier! He prefers to fight his battles verbally, in the safety of his bedroom! :hugesmile:

Would love to see if he was so brave if he did live in Iran ;)

[Stu]

Stu is a keyboard warrier! He prefers to fight his battles verbally, in the safety of his bedroom! :hugesmile:
I asked Livia for her location so we could duke it out in a boxing ring, but alas no response.

Run along now.

It's the internet, WOMBAI. And it's not as if I haven't had discussions about the military with people face to face before. So what do you suggest I do?

And what does that make you? Coming in for another attack? Also a keyboard warrior?

[WOMBAI]

I asked Livia for her location so we could duke it out in a boxing ring, but alas no response.

Run along now.

It's the internet, WOMBAI. And it's not as if I haven't had discussions about the military with people face to face before.

Can I score! :hugesmile:

[MrGaryy]

Well then why not just talk about those characteristics instead of going on about whether or not he's a hero?

Because the point of this thread was to dispel this nonsense others drone on about - even Davina and some of the housemates - to justify how bigotted he is and how nasty he was to Keeley 'because he's a hero'.

Yes it does. He took the blast that.. if not for his sacrifice.. would have been taken by another.
If not taken by another soldier it would have been used on innocent civilians.
He is a hero.
You are not.
He is a giant and you ought to wish you could have 1/2 the brass balls Steve had in not just taking a blast so others did not but also for the huge character in that guy for coming out a cheerful positive person who doesn't have to belittle others to feel bigger about himself.

As far as I remember, he didn't exactly jump in front of the bomb he was just unlucky in that he happened to be walking along at the wrong time. He didn't 'take the blast' it was forced upon him.

He never was your hero right from the start. But if there were not guys like Steve, you would speak russia or germany right now. And i don't say it because it was WWII, but cowards like you make me puke. Now crawl back behind your keyboards pansy.

If you haven't noticed, this is an internet forum, everyone stands behind their keyboards, yourself included. You call me a pansy but are you in the army? I some how doubt that.

[Braden]

ROFL @ Wombai in this conversation!

[Stu]

Can I score! :hugesmile:
... wha?

A goal? A nice big bag of opium? A man?

[MrGaryy]

Would love to see if he was so brave if he did live in Iran ;)

Oh PLEASE tell me you are not comparing Northern Ireland to Iran?!

[MojoNixon]

MrGaryy. Age, location and political orientation please.

[WOMBAI]

ROFL @ Wombai in this conversation!

Elaborate please! :hugesmile:

[Zippy]

... wha?

I think she wants to be the referee!

[MrGaryy]

MrGaryy. Age, location and political orientation please.

erm, would you like my bank details while I'm at it?

[Stu]

I think she wants to be the referee!
I wasn't aware I was in a match :tongue:.

Oh well, read the title. Twas' always going to be a nasty one.

[MojoNixon]

Oh PLEASE tell me you are not comparing Northern Ireland to Iran?!

Well why not. If you gonna be blasted in iran or ireland, what is the difference after all? They both hate UK soldiers. Are you saying that Steve did have a church pin-nic over there in Ireland back then?

[WOMBAI]

I asked Livia for her location so we could duke it out in a boxing ring, but alas no response.

Run along now.

It's the internet, WOMBAI. And it's not as if I haven't had discussions about the military with people face to face before. So what do you suggest I do?

And what does that make you? Coming in for another attack? Also a keyboard warrior?

Yes, I know I am - but I am not condeming the soldiers for what they do am I - I support them! I admire their bravery!

[MrGaryy]

Well why not. If you gonna be blasted in iran or ireland, what is the difference after all? They both hate UK soldiers. Are you saying that Steve did have a church pin-nic over there in Ireland back then?

Don't be so facetious, of course I'm not saying that. But the Northern Ireland troubles looks like a day out in Alton Towers compared to the situation in Iran, lets be honest.

[MojoNixon]

erm, would you like my bank details while I'm at it?
No. But age and political orientation please. And are you teen?. And just please tell me are you immigrant or are you living in Ireland or not. Just simple little question. I ain't no hacker or "spy" or anything, so don't worry. I ain't gonna hack on your computer. Just wanna know if you hate Steve just because he reminds you of your dad or is it political issue.

[WOMBAI]

I wasn't aware I was in a match :tongue:.

Oh well, read the title. Twas' always going to be a nasty one.

You said you were gonna have a boxing match, jokingly, and I jokingly responded - that I would like to referee! What's not to get! :conf: Fool!

[Stu]

Yes, I know I am - but I am not condeming the soldiers for what they do am I - I support them! I admire their bravery!
Neither are my.

Oops. Looks like you jumped in the deep end of the wrong pool. Again.

Fool.

[WOMBAI]

Oh PLEASE tell me you are not comparing Northern Ireland to Iran?!

Northern Ireland was a very dangerous place to be for soldiers back then - so there really isn't that much difference!

[Stu]

You said you were gonna have a boxing match, jokingly, and I jokingly responded - that I would like to referee! What's not to get! :conf:
Have to say, that flew way over my head. I didn't know that was boxing terminology for a ref.

I thought the judges scored, myself.

[MojoNixon]

Northern Ireland was a very dangerous place to be for soldiers back then - so there really isn't that much difference!

Exactly, like i said earlier. But teens just don't get that.

[MrGaryy]

No. But age and political orientation please. And are you teen?. And just please tell me are you immigrant or are you living in Ireland or not. Just simple little question. I ain't no hacker or "spy" or anything, so don't worry. I ain't gonna hack on your computer. Just wanna know if you hate Steve just because he reminds you of your dad or is it political issue.

Yes I am a teen, 17 to be precise, with Irish parents if that helps. I'm a Republican but I assure you that is irrelevant with regards to my dislike for Steve. Oh and my dad is a company director of a small chains of restaurants, internet cafes and hostels among other ventures so no, I can't say I see any similarity between my father and Steve.

[MrGaryy]

Northern Ireland was a very dangerous place to be for soldiers back then - so there really isn't that much difference!

Yes I am fully aware of that, I'm not as totally ignorant as you and MojoNixon seem to assume because of my age. But I'm also aware of the situation in Iran and however dangerous N.Ireland was at the time, they are still not comparable imo.

[MojoNixon]

Yes I am a teen, 17 to be precise, with Irish parents if that helps. I'm a Republican but I assure you that is irrelevant with regards to my dislike for Steve. Oh and my dad is a company director of a small chains of restaurants, internet cafes and hostels among other ventures so no, I can't say I see any similarity between my father and Steve.

So living with your dad money...too bad you don't know or even understand how it was back then.

[MojoNixon]

But I'm also aware of the situation in Iran and however dangerous N.Ireland was at the time, they are still not comparable imo.

You are just stupid, now i can see that. Go and ask some money from your dad. OK?

[MrGaryy]

You are just stupid, now i can see that. Go and ask some money from your dad. OK?

How dare you assume that because of my father's position I am some stupid, spoiled, lazy bastard with no intentions of working. Who the **** do you think you are to speak to me like that in a debate about some unlucky bigot being labelled a hero simply. I know now why you were so eager to know my details, obviously in desperate need of a get out clause from this debate.

[Zippy]

Lol @ Mojo's fixation with teens!

[Stu]

Indeed.

[MojoNixon]

How dare you assume that because of my father's position I am some stupid, spoiled, lazy bastard with no intentions of working.

Yes you are :xyxwave:

Who the **** do you think you are to speak to me like that in a debate about some unlucky bigot being labelled a hero simply. I know now why you were so eager to know my details, obviously in desperate need of a get out clause from this debate.

Look kid, it's pointles to even get some sense on your head. If you don't realize how it was back then, no need to even get the message to you :spin:

[InOne]

How old were you 'back then' Mojo?

[MrGaryy]

Yes you are :xyxwave:



Look kid, it's pointles to even get some sense on your head. If you don't realize how it was back then, no need to even get the message to you :spin:

Honestly you're ridiculous, you've come to this assumption that I'm totally unaware of what it was like back then simply because I said that it wasn't comparable to ****ing Iran. Ironic really considering I'm the one who's studied it in school.

[MojoNixon]

How old were you 'back then' Mojo?

35 now.

and Ireland not a bad place back then???

OUUFgHMBrYk

[Stu]

No internet back in the day. No sir. We used to tear bits of leather off our boots, scrawl messages on them, and get Dino the pidgeon to deliver our views for us.

[MojoNixon]

How old were you 'back then' Mojo?

And one other thing InOne, you were great guy earlier. Now you had turned a totally ahole. I don't give a ****** about Morrissey (but his guitarist (Boz Boorer is amzing guy) and that another fhead Oasis brother on your signature.

[InOne]

35 now.

and Ireland not a bad place back then???

OUUFgHMBrYk

I never said it wasn't. And why assume something about someone because of their background? As he told you before he has Irish parents, so I am sure he does have knowledge of the situation. And why would he make a thread if he didn't think he'd be able to back up his points?

[InOne]

And one other thing InOne, you were great guy earlier. Now you had turned a totally ahole. I don't give a ****** about Morrissey (but his guitarist (Boz Boorer is amzing guy) and that another fhead Oasis brother on your signature.

Calm down, we can't agree all the time.

[Stu]

Has Morrissey really just been brought into this?

I'm remembering what's great about this place. Thread of the year contender, surely.

[Zippy]

I agree. A classic thread in the making!

[MojoNixon]

Has Morrissey really just been brought into this?

I'm remembering what's great about this place. Thread of the year contender, surely.

LOL :) *offthetopic* gonna calm down now, been working every night and it is my first day off. Just tired and getting drunk. And i do love some Morrissey songs. I have a rockabilly/psychobilly backgrond and Gaz Day (bass) and Boz Boorer and Alain Whyte (guitars) are great. But gonna calm down now. Cheers!

[Stu]

Getting drunk? Ada boy. I love getting drunk in the afternoon. The odd switches from monster nixon to nice nixon kinda gave it away too. And now the word 'psychobilly' has entered the fray.

Damn, I need to visit the offy now.

[GiRTh]

LMAO@this thread. Funny and tragic in equal measures. One thing, when were British troops deployed in IRAN?

[WOMBAI]

How dare you assume that because of my father's position I am some stupid, spoiled, lazy bastard with no intentions of working. Who the **** do you think you are to speak to me like that in a debate about some unlucky bigot being labelled a hero simply. I know now why you were so eager to know my details, obviously in desperate need of a get out clause from this debate.

He was more than unlucky - he was there because he was brave enough to sign up for a job that put him there!

[MrGaryy]

He was more than unlucky - he was there because he was brave enough to sign up for a job that put him there!

How the **** do you know why he was there? For all we know he could have been forced into it. And I think you'll find if you go back to the first page that I did in fact commend his bravery for being in the army, just not for being blown up. Darling.

[WOMBAI]

How the **** do you know why he was there? For all we know he could have been forced into it. And I think you'll find if you go back to the first page that I did in fact commend his bravery for being in the army, just not for being blown up. Darling.

Alas your age is becoming increasingly apparent! :nono: Oh I forgot - sweetie!

[brian3]

35 now.

and Ireland not a bad place back then???

OUUFgHMBrYk


I am not attacking you. But I would like to say that not everyone in Northen Ireland hates the British and British soliders.

That youtube vid was very likely put up by an american as they have a quite 1 sided view of things. There great, great, great grandad came from Ireland. So they think that meens they are Irish and understand everything that goes on there.

[Stu]

Aha plastic paddys. Sure Boston probably has a higher density of IRA supporters than Ireland.

[MrGaryy]

Alas your age is becoming increasingly apparent! :nono: Oh I forgot - sweetie!

sry i dont understand u bbz? i'm too yung for u 2 reply to so ya ave to nit pick on my post ignorin my main pnt innit honeyz?

[WOMBAI]

sry i dont understand u bbz? i'm too yung for u 2 reply to so ya ave to nit pick on my post ignorin my main pnt innit honeyz?

You don't need to try - it just comes naturally! :hugesmile: Poppet!

[JustKaz]

There was another thread on this but it got terribly sidetracked and was closed before I got to it so I opened this one to discuss the matter.

First of all, walking past a bomb and getting blown up does not make you a hero. That is an insult to the real heroes of the world. I would consider someone who did something exceptionally brave or someone who is solely responsible for saving another person's life in a crisis a hero. Walking past a barrel does not make you a hero just desperately unlucky.

Secondly, to those who say the fact he joined the forces in the first place makes him a hero as he was risking his life for freedom - he was fighting in Northern Ireland, the troubles were not about freedom they were about power and prejudice. Something which is in a way almost proven by how bigoted Steve has shown himself up to be in so many respects.

Brave for joining the army, yes. A hero, absolutely not.

You are intitled to your opinion, however my opinion is that your opinion is a massive insult to steve ans ALL armed forces, and an insutle to the familes of such, thats all I want to contribute to this thread, now I will read what every one else has contributed to see how many actually agree with your opinion.

[Shasown]

Got to love this thread, could I just say most junior ranks in the armed forces do not join up to lay down their lives for others, some believe the publicity about the training, esprit de corps, some join for the wages, its bloody good money for a 17-20 odd year old who has only Jobseekers Allowance to spend. A few join to get away from home. One or two are psychos who want to go out and see what its like to kill someone. Some join up out of family traditions.

Some join to prove themselves. A lot join for the adventure, that notion is soon changed for a lot the first time they have to arm up with live rounds. Saying that for a few the first time they come into contact with the enemy they become addicted to the buzz, its something that cant really be equalled in civvy street.

Steve was simply unlucky, wrong place wrong time, but to suggest he took the explosion for others is extremely naive. The IED was placed in a Nationalist area, the Falls Road was and still is part of the republican heartland in Belfast, no way would they have set off the bomb to take out civilians.

It was there to take out members of the security forces either the Army or the RUC. To show that the republicans still held sway over the area and that the security forces could operate in the area only at their peril. Its a tactic to prove that the security forces dont have total control of an area, and that the terrorists can operate with impunity.

[WOMBAI]

Got to love this thread, could I just say most junior ranks in the armed forces do not join up to lay down their lives for others, some believe the publicity about the training, esprit de corps, some join for the wages, its bloody good money for a 17-20 odd year old who has only Jobseekers Allowance to spend. A few join to get away from home. One or two are psychos who want to go out and see what its like to kill someone. Some join up out of family traditions.

Some join to prove themselves. A lot join for the adventure, that notion is soon changed for a lot the first time they have to arm up with live rounds. Saying that for a few the first time they come into contact with the enemy they become addicted to the buzz, its something that cant really be equalled in civvy street.

Steve was simply unlucky, wrong place wrong time, but to suggest he took the explosion for others is extremely naive. The IED was placed in a Nationalist area, the Falls Road was and still is part of the republican heartland in Belfast, no way would they have set off the bomb to take out civilians.

It was there to take out members of the security forces either the Army or the RUC. To show that the republicans still held sway over the area and that the security forces could operate in the area only at their peril. Its a tactic to prove that the security forces dont have total control of an area, and that the terrorists can operate with impunity.

I don't think most are suggesting that guys sign up with the intention of laying down their lives for others - but, when the time comes and they face danger to themselves and others, most do their job to best of their ability and accept the risks facing them!

A lot leave at the earliest opportunity, but many stay, knowing the risks - and that, in itself, is a brave decision, always being aware that today could possibly be your last!

In my book, Steve was brave because he was there doing his job, regardless of his reason for joining in the first place! If he wasn't there, someone else would have to be. And if there were no 'volunteer's - young guys, like those on this forum, would be conscripted to do it! They should be thanking them, not ridiculing them!

[MrGaryy]

I don't think most are suggesting that guys sign up with the intention of laying down their lives for others - but, when the time comes and they face danger to themselves and others, most do their job to best of their ability and accept the risks facing them!

A lot leave at the earliest opportunity, but many stay, knowing the risks - and that, in itself, is a brave decision, always being aware that today could possibly be your last!

In my book, Steve was brave because he was there doing his job, regardless of his reason for joining in the first place! If he wasn't there, someone else would have to be. And if there were no 'volunteer's - young guys, like those on this forum, would be conscripted to do it! They should be thanking them, not ridiculing them!

Nobody is ridiculing them for being in the army, as I've already said and reiterated, the thread was not to put down his bravery to be in the army and fight for his country, just to make it clear that walking past a bomb at the wrong time and being unlucky does not make you a hero.

Though on the flip side, I don't see why being an ex forces man makes him immune from being a dickhead and doesn't make him immune from dissecting his person. This is what the entire show is about after all.

[gio]

:nono:To put this into context... 'The troubles' in NI was not a war, the British Government view was that its occupation of NI was neutral - otherwise your War you talk of would have been civil war ...British forces v British people living in NI..... Forces were there to uphold law and order in NI and the right of the people of Northern Ireland to democratic self-determination, so effectively Steve has never fought in a war

[WOMBAI]

Nobody is ridiculing them for being in the army, as I've already said and reiterated, the thread was not to put down his bravery to be in the army and fight for his country, just to make it clear that walking past a bomb at the wrong time and being unlucky does not make you a hero.

Though on the flip side, I don't see why being an ex forces man makes him immune from being a dickhead and doesn't make him immune from dissecting his person. This is what the entire show is about after all.

Fair enough - being ex forces does not make anyone immune from being a twat!

What makes me see red is when people, and plenty do, start taking the piss out of his disability - especially considering how he got that way!

[MrGaryy]

Fair enough - being ex forces does not make anyone immune from being a twat!

What makes me see red is when people, and plenty do, start taking the piss out of his disability - especially considering how he got that way!

But I don't think anyone in this thread has taken the piss out of his disability?

[Shasown]

Nobody is ridiculing them for being in the army, as I've already said and reiterated, the thread was not to put down his bravery to be in the army and fight for his country, just to make it clear that walking past a bomb at the wrong time and being unlucky does not make you a hero.

Though on the flip side, I don't see why being an ex forces man makes him immune from being a dickhead and doesn't make him immune from dissecting his person. This is what the entire show is about after all.

I agree with that.

I admire Steve for getting his life back together after his injuries.

However could i just say that most ex forces, myself included are dickheads. You have to be to sign up in the first place knowing that in peacetime we are barely tolerated if not hated. And the only time we are appreciated is when we are needed.

After training and any length of service most follow a regimented way of life, we are opinionated and in most cases we are generally right. We like leching at pretty girls and have been known to make a fool of ourselves over them.

[JustKaz]

Got to love this thread, could I just say most junior ranks in the armed forces do not join up to lay down their lives for others, some believe the publicity about the training, esprit de corps, some join for the wages, its bloody good money for a 17-20 odd year old who has only Jobseekers Allowance to spend. A few join to get away from home. One or two are psychos who want to go out and see what its like to kill someone. Some join up out of family traditions.

Some join to prove themselves. A lot join for the adventure, that notion is soon changed for a lot the first time they have to arm up with live rounds. Saying that for a few the first time they come into contact with the enemy they become addicted to the buzz, its something that cant really be equalled in civvy street.

Steve was simply unlucky, wrong place wrong time, but to suggest he took the explosion for others is extremely naive. The IED was placed in a Nationalist area, the Falls Road was and still is part of the republican heartland in Belfast, no way would they have set off the bomb to take out civilians.

It was there to take out members of the security forces either the Army or the RUC. To show that the republicans still held sway over the area and that the security forces could operate in the area only at their peril. Its a tactic to prove that the security forces dont have total control of an area, and that the terrorists can operate with impunity.

ok I will contribute more to this thread. i do agree with a lot you say here, yes steve was unlucky, but I am sure too he would know the risk of what could happen to him as many others in armed forces and those that choose to join are brave ( and also heros to an extent)

Lets take Steve out of the BB equation, and give a diferent senario for example..
The original poster of this thread is at a function where there are armed forces are being welcomed home, and among them are wounded soliders just like steve, would the original poster feel 'whats all the fuss? and have the same opinion that the soilders are NOT heros?

Another senario Would it have made a difference if another soilder was beside steve at the time he walked past this barrel, and steve pushed him out o the way, staving his life and taking the blast? would that THEN make him a hero to original poster ( as he says what he thinks a real hero is)

Also as many say Steve has not called himself a hero, others have.

Going back to BB those house mates were NOT randomly pick, steve was because of what has happened to him, and I do believe that some of the public would find it difficult to look beyond this and go just by his personality when juding him.

MY very first opinion when steve was picked (so called randomly) and the fact that BB theme was circus, is that why they choose him and I was not sure that I was disgrace at myself for thinking it or disgraced at BB...I mean there was some very strange people in line up in the launch show.

Steve auditioned, got in I dont agree he should win just because of what happened to him, but IMO he is a hero to have suvived what he went through and rebuild his life considering he was 19yrs old when this happened.

Hope I have made sense here.

[Beastie]

As a housemate Steve is dull.

I want Keeva out next week. Steve out the week after.

[Vicky.]

Some of the posts in here are ridiculous.

Also, mojonixen is banned for his stupid assumptions and insults in general.

[MrGaryy]

ok I will contribute more to this thread. i do agree with a lot you say here, yes steve was unlucky, but I am sure too he would know the risk of what could happen to him as many others in armed forces and those that choose to join are brave ( and also heros to an extent)

Lets take Steve out of the BB equation, and give a diferent senario for example..
The original poster of this thread is at a function where there are armed forces are being welcomed home, and among them are wounded soliders just like steve, would the original poster feel 'whats all the fuss? and have the same opinion that the soilders are NOT heros?

Another senario Would it have made a difference if another soilder was beside steve at the time he walked past this barrel, and steve pushed him out o the way, staving his life and taking the blast? would that THEN make him a hero to original poster ( as he says what he thinks a real hero is)

Also as many say Steve has not called himself a hero, others have.

Going back to BB those house mates were NOT randomly pick, steve was because of what has happened to him, and I do believe that some of the public would find it difficult to look beyond this and go just by his personality when juding him.

MY very first opinion when steve was picked (so called randomly) and the fact that BB theme was circus, is that why they choose him and I was not sure that I was disgrace at myself for thinking it or disgraced at BB...I mean there was some very strange people in line up in the launch show.

Steve auditioned, got in I dont agree he should win just because of what happened to him, but IMO he is a hero to have suvived what he went through and rebuild his life considering he was 19yrs old when this happened.

Hope I have made sense here.

I think you're mistaken. The only housemate who was supposedly chosen at random was Mario. The producers were perfectly clear that the others were chosen by them.

To be totally honest, and I don't meant o be disrespectful, I don't see the point in taking this out of the BB scenario, because out of that scenario nobody would think twice about his story and status nor would they know him well enough to bother dissecting it.

[Zippy]

Though on the flip side, I don't see why being an ex forces man makes him immune from being a dickhead and doesn't make him immune from dissecting his person. This is what the entire show is about after all.

So why start a whole thread along the war hero lines? Criticise him for his behaviour in the house. Your judging him for labels others put on him.

Contradiction much.

[Beastie]

Some of the posts in here are ridiculous.

Also, mojonixen is banned for his stupid assumptions and insults in general.

Lol.

[Beastie]

Steve has done well.. well he is a good role model and that.. fighting for our country.. okay he may not be a hero.. but he is a brave honourable person!

However as a housemate.. MEH.

But.. when he is evicted.. he deserves to be cheered!!

[WOMBAI]

I used to hate ELProximo back then (i was harryrag back then). But now ELProximo has become a my fav TIBB person.

You were harryrag! :shocked: What about Charliegimbert?

[MrGaryy]

So why start a whole thread along the war hero lines? Criticise him for his behaviour in the house. Your judging him for labels others put on him.

Contradiction much.

Oh my god. You are entirely missing the point that I keep making. The thread is not about him as a person. But if you haven't noticed, many people are justifying his horrid behavior towards Keeley and just general unpleasantness by labelling him a 'war hero' and some have even used that as a reason why he should stay even though he's clearly a pointless housemate. And his fellow housemates are clearly scared to nominate him because they think he's perceived as a hero, besides Ben the only one with enough sense to see past the surface. The point of the thread was to say - actually no, he's not a war hero therefore there is no reason what so ever to keep him there.

[MrGaryy]

Steve has done well.. well he is a good role model and that.. fighting for our country.. okay he may not be a hero.. but he is a brave honourable person!

However as a housemate.. MEH.

But.. when he is evicted.. he deserves to be cheered!!

If there is one thing he is not, it's a role model. He's behaved terribly in there, nothing he's done in that house should be admired or looked up to. I don;t see why he should leave to cheers as opposed to anyone else.

[Vicky.]

His life outside the house has nothing to do with it.

Did everyone say makosi should be cheered, because she was a nurse? No.

I do not see any reason why, whatever they have done before BB should come into it, we judge them as housemates, and thats it.

[luvJJ]

Steve walked past a bomb when he was 19 years old. He is now 41. He has overcome adversity, but has also lived off the state and rested on his laurels for 22 years, ie the majority of his life.

In my eyes, a true hero (who was unable to work due to the longstanding effect of injuries sustained as a teenager) would have thrown himself into voluntary work, done something to inspire others, something creative or worthwhile, given his time and experience to a worthy cause, ie achieved something other than spending an army pension and hundreds of thousands of pounds of state benefits on tattoos and working out.

Harsh? Yes.
True? Yes.

[Zippy]

His life outside the house has nothing to do with it.

Did everyone say makosi should be cheered, because she was a nurse? No.

I do not see any reason why, whatever they have done before BB should come into it, we judge them as housemates, and thats it.

Well said.

The OP is being disengenuous to say the least. If you wanna criticise his house behaviour then STICK TO THAT. Don't mix it in with stuff about him being a war hero.

Personally I just think he's a dull HM. I don't think he's done anything terrible or disgusting. He's been quite restrained in truth. Too restrained probably.

[charliegimbert]

You were harryrag! :shocked: What about Charliegimbert?

Yes it was me (MojoNixon). I did not even remember this account anymore. You mods don't have to worry and remove my message, i don't use this account anyway anymore. I was banned until 24.7.2010. AND i won't create any new accounts with false IP (unlike some shabby fan does). And just wanna thank some moderator for calling me stupid.

[MrGaryy]

Well said.

The OP is being disengenuous to say the least. If you wanna criticise his house behaviour then STICK TO THAT. Don't mix it in with stuff about him being a war hero.

Personally I just think he's a dull HM. I don't think he's done anything terrible or disgusting. He's been quite restrained in truth. Too restrained probably.

OH MY ****ING GOD. Are you purposely not reading what I say or what? Because I've explained so. many. times. now that this thread was not judging Steve as a housemate it was just to dispel these illusions of heroism that people use when they are judging him. And if you can;t understand that after what, four posts clearly explaining it to you then I don't know what I can say.

[Shasown]

LMAO@this thread. Funny and tragic in equal measures. One thing, when were British troops deployed in IRAN?

Coalition Forces crossed the start lines (moving forward into Iraq) for Operation New Dawn/Iraqi Freedom on March 20 2003, (at 02:35 GMT - 05:35Zulu - local time) however Special Forces and Air assets had been operating in Iraq and over it (reinforcing no fly zones etc eventually leading to a full air offensive) for years before hand.

[billy123]

Steve walked past a bomb when he was 19 years old. He is now 41. He has overcome adversity, but has also lived off the state and rested on his laurels for 22 years, ie the majority of his life.

In my eyes, a true hero (who was unable to work due to the longstanding effect of injuries sustained as a teenager) would have thrown himself into voluntary work, done something to inspire others, something creative or worthwhile, given his time and experience to a worthy cause, ie achieved something other than spending an army pension and hundreds of thousands of pounds of state benefits on tattoos and working out.

Harsh? Yes.
True? Yes.so travelling the country talking to seriously injured servicemen helping with their rehabilitation and showing them that they do have a future ahead of them a life that they can rebuild isnt a worthy cause?
your post is at the very least very ill informed not to mention irrelevant to big brother.

[WOMBAI]

This basically, I respect the man for rebuilding and making the most of his life but he is an awful HM.

Steve walked past a bomb when he was 19 years old. He is now 41. He has overcome adversity, but has also lived off the state and rested on his laurels for 22 years, ie the majority of his life.

In my eyes, a true hero (who was unable to work due to the longstanding effect of injuries sustained as a teenager) would have thrown himself into voluntary work, done something to inspire others, something creative or worthwhile, given his time and experience to a worthy cause, ie achieved something other than spending an army pension and hundreds of thousands of pounds of state benefits on tattoos and working out.

Harsh? Yes.
True? Yes.

An awful lot of assumptions being made there - how do you know whether or not he has done any voluntary work over the past 22 years and how do you know when his tatoos were done! Also maybe his wife works and he looks after the children, nothing wrong with that!

[brian3]

Steve more than any of the other HM would want to be judged on his personality, and would not want people not to vote for him because of his disabilty.

[billy123]

Im failing to see any relevance to big brother or how this thread is in any way constructive it would be better locked.

[Shasown]

Steve walked past a bomb when he was 19 years old. He is now 41. He has overcome adversity, but has also lived off the state and rested on his laurels for 22 years, ie the majority of his life.

In my eyes, a true hero (who was unable to work due to the longstanding effect of injuries sustained as a teenager) would have thrown himself into voluntary work, done something to inspire others, something creative or worthwhile, given his time and experience to a worthy cause, ie achieved something other than spending an army pension and hundreds of thousands of pounds of state benefits on tattoos and working out.

Harsh? Yes.
True? Yes.

Glad to see you looked into his life after his medical discharge from the service.

In fact he would have received a full medical pension, pretty much equivalent to his wages at the time. As was his due.

However since that time he has raised many thousands if of pounds for various service charities including Help for Heroes. As well as organising, running and raising support for his local disabled basketball team he also sailed across the Atlantic raising funds for service charities.

[MrGaryy]

Im failing to see any relevance to big brother or how this thread is in any way constructive it would be better locked.

We're debating whether or not he should be considered a war hero, something that many Big Brother viewers, forum members and even the presenters and housemates themselves have called him. I don't see why it should be locked?

[WOMBAI]

Glad to see you looked into his life after his medical discharge from the service.

In fact he would have received a full medical pension, pretty much equivalent to his wages at the time. As was his due.

However since that time he has raised many thousands if of pounds for various service charities including Help for Heroes. As well as organising, running and raising support for his local disabled basketball team he also sailed across the Atlantic raising funds for service charities.

Glad to see someone knows what they are talking about! :thumbs:

[Possiblehousemate]

most pointless housemate ever award.

[BJ]

:thumbs:[QUOTE=Zippy;3510849]He's never called himself one so its not fair to use it against him. He's a victim and a survivor. Thats enough.

Rebuilding your life physically and emotionally after such a tragedy takes great strength. You cant take that away from him.

But he is still a dull HM.

Yes - absolutely right

[vivsgirl]

Yep, agreed - Steve was a guy who chose to join the British Army (which I do not believe automatically makes him a 'hero' in itself), and was desperately unlucky. This DOES NOT make him a hero, OR necessarily worthy of any more respect than, e.g. the victim of a car crash. Worthy of sympathy, yes, but respect ? Mm...not sure. Furthermore, I personally do not particularly admire the way he has dealt with what happened to him - ANYONE who chooses to have EIGHT children in this day in age and then call themselves 'Big Daddy' is 1) incredibly selfish and 2) an idiot.
Oh yeah, and he's boring as hell as a housemate - I just hope he doesn't win.

[WOMBAI]

Yep, agreed - Steve was a guy who chose to join the British Army (which I do not believe automatically makes him a 'hero' in itself), and was desperately unlucky. This DOES NOT make him a hero, OR necessarily worthy of any more respect than, e.g. the victim of a car crash. Worthy of sympathy, yes, but respect ? Mm...not sure. Furthermore, I personally do not particularly admire the way he has dealt with what happened to him - ANYONE who chooses to have EIGHT children in this day in age and then call themselves 'Big Daddy' is 1) incredibly selfish and 2) an idiot.
Oh yeah, and he's boring as hell as a housemate - I just hope he doesn't win.

Anyone who signs up for a dangerous job deserves respect! And as long as he supports his children - it is nobody else's business how many he has!

[toby843]

So there seems to be alot of reasons to not call Steve a hero. What would we say is a hero then?

[as90]

He is a hero to us British, obviously he won't be to the irish.

[toby843]

He is a hero to us British, obviously he won't be to the irish.

Royal Artillery?

[erichardse10]

I haven't seen Steve claim he was a hero?. He strikes me as a guy thats getting on with being in the bb house?. He's a dull housemate, for sure, but I ceetainly don't think hes claiming to be any hero or anything?

[vivsgirl]

Anyone who signs up for a dangerous job deserves respect! And as long as he supports his children - it is nobody else's business how many he has!

It is EVERYBODYS business when someone decides to have 8 kids - can you imagine what would happen if ALL families decided to have as many kids as this? Have you noticed what is happening to our planet recently? To make a comment like this, you must be really ignorant about the environmental impact of having loads of children - I don't mean to be insulting, it's just basic common sense - my 6 year old understands why huge families are not a good idea in this day and age. (And do you know for a fact that Steve has not claimed government support to help raise all these children? - Though that is not the issue......).

[Niamh.]

There was another thread on this but it got terribly sidetracked and was closed before I got to it so I opened this one to discuss the matter.

First of all, walking past a bomb and getting blown up does not make you a hero. That is an insult to the real heroes of the world. I would consider someone who did something exceptionally brave or someone who is solely responsible for saving another person's life in a crisis a hero. Walking past a barrel does not make you a hero just desperately unlucky.

Secondly, to those who say the fact he joined the forces in the first place makes him a hero as he was risking his life for freedom - he was fighting in Northern Ireland, the troubles were not about freedom they were about power and prejudice. Something which is in a way almost proven by how bigoted Steve has shown himself up to be in so many respects.

Brave for joining the army, yes. A hero, absolutely not.

absolutely agree Gary.

[vivsgirl]

I haven't seen Steve claim he was a hero?. He strikes me as a guy thats getting on with being in the bb house?. He's a dull housemate, for sure, but I ceetainly don't think hes claiming to be any hero or anything?

I accept that I've never actually heard Steve describe HIMSELF to be a hero, but equally, I have never heard him correct any of the other housemates when they make a big deal about the fact that he IS a hero, e.g. he's never said anything like "I was just really unlucky", or "I was just in the wrong place at the wrong time", which is the truth of the matter.

[Livia]

It is EVERYBODYS business when someone decides to have 8 kids - can you imagine what would happen if ALL families decided to have as many kids as this? Have you noticed what is happening to our planet recently? To make a comment like this, you must be really ignorant about the environmental impact of having loads of children - I don't mean to be insulting, it's just basic common sense - my 6 year old understands why huge families are not a good idea in this day and age. (And do you know for a fact that Steve has not claimed government support to help raise all these children? - Though that is not the issue......).

This is going to come as a shock to you... but no, it isn't any of your business how many kids he's got. This is not China.

[Livia]

so travelling the country talking to seriously injured servicemen helping with their rehabilitation and showing them that they do have a future ahead of them a life that they can rebuild isnt a worthy cause?
your post is at the very least very ill informed not to mention irrelevant to big brother.

I agree. These threads questioning what does or does not make a hero are getting a bit tiresome.

[MrGaryy]

Anyone who signs up for a dangerous job deserves respect! And as long as he supports his children - it is nobody else's business how many he has!

So by that logic, a stunt man deserves respect also? or a dare devil? or a rally driver? Have balls or blind faith does not command respect. In fact more often than not it's out of sheer stupidity rather than bravery.

[vivsgirl]

So there seems to be alot of reasons to not call Steve a hero. What would we say is a hero then?

For me, a hero would be someone who risks their life in order to save another (e.g. someone diving in to dangerous water to save the life of another or entering a burning building to save someone's life) or maybe someone who devotes their life to, e.g. finding a cure for cancer or AIDS, or devotes their life to helping those less fortunate than themselves (e.g. Aid workers in war zones), or even an organ donor who saves a life through organ donation would qualify in my book.
Merely signing up for the British Army and being unlucky enough to be involved in a street bombing in Northern Ireland is not enough - if he had saved someone else in the process then I would doubtless reconsider.

[as90]

He fought for Britain and the democratic world against faceless terrorists, that's a pretty heroic act.

[Livia]

For me, a hero would be someone who risks their life in order to save another (e.g. someone diving in to dangerous water to save the life of another or entering a burning building to save someone's life) or maybe someone who devotes their life to, e.g. finding a cure for cancer or AIDS, or devotes their life to helping those less fortunate than themselves (e.g. Aid workers in war zones), or even an organ donor who saves a life through organ donation would qualify in my book.
Merely signing up for the British Army and being unlucky enough to be involved in a street bombing in Northern Ireland is not enough - if he had saved someone else in the process then I would doubtless reconsider.

Do you know why the army were in Northern Ireland? And what about the way he's supported and encouraged other young servicemen disabled by terrorist action? Does that not knock him up a notch or two on your impossibly idealistic scale of what makes a hero? Your posts show a great lack of knowledge about... well, a lot of things.

[Niamh.]

Do you know why the army were in Northern Ireland? And what about the way he's supported and encouraged other young servicemen disabled by terrorist action? Does that not knock him up a notch or two on your impossibly idealistic scale of what makes a hero? Your posts show a great lack of knowledge about... well, a lot of things.

Well lets be honest here, If the British army had never come across the water to Ireland in the first place there would have been no IRA.

[Livia]

Well lets be honest here, If the British army had never come across the water to Ireland in the first place there would have been no IRA.

I espect if we went back decades, you'd be right. I never knew a serviceman who wanted to go to Ireland. And really, if you asked anyone in the street in England what they thought about the Troubles, the consensus would probably be that what the IRA were asking for wasn't unreasonable. It's the way they went about it. Not saying that the Loyalist terrorists weren't as bad. And I acknowledge that the British army did some terrible stuff over the years.

It'd be a great world if we could all make a bit more of an effort to get on and understand each other. Maybe one day, eh?

[Niamh.]

I espect if we went back decades, you'd be right. I never knew a serviceman who wanted to go to Ireland. And really, if you asked anyone in the street in England what they thought about the Troubles, the consensus would probably be that what the IRA were asking for wasn't unreasonable. It's the way they went about it. Not saying that the Loyalist terrorists weren't as bad. And I acknowledge that the British army did some terrible stuff over the years.

It'd be a great world if we could all make a bit more of an effort to get on and understand each other. Maybe one day, eh?

No, you're absolutely right. In my opinion it started off as a noble cause (and I mean the start, not when they were bombing civilians in England btw) but in the end things had just gone too far to ever go back.

[MTVN]

I espect if we went back decades, you'd be right. I never knew a serviceman who wanted to go to Ireland. And really, if you asked anyone in the street in England what they thought about the Troubles, the consensus would probably be that what the IRA were asking for wasn't unreasonable. It's the way they went about it. Not saying that the Loyalist terrorists weren't as bad. And I acknowledge that the British army did some terrible stuff over the years.

It'd be a great world if we could all make a bit more of an effort to get on and understand each other. Maybe one day, eh?

No, you're absolutely right. In my opinion it started off as a noble cause (and I mean the start, not when they were bombing civilians in England btw) but in the end things had just gone too far to ever go back.

Yeah, I agree. The IRA's motives were justified, their means were not.

[vivsgirl]

This is going to come as a shock to you... but no, it isn't any of your business how many kids he's got. THis is not China.

If selfish, ignorant people like Steve continue to have 8 kids, the UK may need to think about enforcing laws like China - it's not beyond the beyond. I'm not going to get on a soapbox here, but you need to do a bit of research and get some facts right. I maintain - if a person decides to have umpteen children, it concerns EVERYONE (even those thousands of miles away who've never even heard of Big Brother). If you are unable to see that, you must have a very small mind.

[vivsgirl]

Do you know why the army were in Northern Ireland? And what about the way he's supported and encouraged other young servicemen disabled by terrorist action? Does that not knock him up a notch or two on your impossibly idealistic scale of what makes a hero? Your posts show a great lack of knowledge about... well, a lot of things.

I would say exactly the same to you. I feel you are both narrow-minded and entirely ignorant about stuff that to most people is basic common sense. We'll just have to agree to differ - I'm not getting into a slanging match. But suffice to say there are more people who seem to agree with me!

[Pato]

i think anyone who's willing to die for our country is a hero

[WOMBAI]

I would say exactly the same to you. I feel you are both narrow-minded and entirely ignorant about stuff that to most people is basic common sense. We'll just have to agree to differ - I'm not getting into a slanging match. But suffice to say there are more people who seem to agree with me!

I wouldn't say that! At least he supports his children! There are plenty of young men going around fathering children they neither see or support - hence the existence of the CSA! What about religious groups that have loads of children - really don't see why you are singling Steve out!

[BitterFruit]

He's never called himself one so its not fair to use it against him. He's a victim and a survivor. Thats enough.

Rebuilding your life physically and emotionally after such a tragedy takes great strength. You cant take that away from him.

But he is still a dull HM.

you can't say fairer than that ...really can't :thumbs:

[toby843]

For me, a hero would be someone who risks their life in order to save another (e.g. someone diving in to dangerous water to save the life of another or entering a burning building to save someone's life) or maybe someone who devotes their life to, e.g. finding a cure for cancer or AIDS, or devotes their life to helping those less fortunate than themselves (e.g. Aid workers in war zones), or even an organ donor who saves a life through organ donation would qualify in my book.
Merely signing up for the British Army and being unlucky enough to be involved in a street bombing in Northern Ireland is not enough - if he had saved someone else in the process then I would doubtless reconsider.

So in that vain, an organ donor who runs into the school he built for blind african aids victims when its on fire and drags out all the kids and the vital testube holding the cure for aids he's spent his life working on would be a super hero?? Sweet, there's hope for me yet.

[AquaShots]

I wouldn't say that! At least he supports his children!

From what I can gather, I don't think he does to 3 of them. His wife is outraged that he hasn't even seen them for 6 years... the trouble when you go on a show like this is all your dirty washing gets aired for us all to see. :hugesmile:

[MojoNixon]

AquaSquirts is back. Desperate JJ fan i see.

[AquaShots]

AquaSquirts is back. Desperate JJ fan i see.

Put your glasses on then cos you are mistaken. :joker:

[MojoNixon]

Put your glasses on then cos you are mistaken. :joker:

No need, i guess you are that desperate, miserable Shabby lovin teen then.

[AquaShots]

No need, i guess you are that desperate, miserable Shabby lovin teen then.

You clearly have me confused with someone else. :tongue:

[WOMBAI]

From what I can gather, I don't think he does to 3 of them. His wife is outraged that he hasn't even seen them for 6 years... the trouble when you go on a show like this is all your dirty washing gets aired for us all to see. :hugesmile:

And his ex may have an enormous axe to grind - never listen to exes!

[AquaShots]

And his ex may have an enormous axe to grind - never listen to exes!


oooh yeah true! :rolleyes:

Especially if she thinks he has a chance of winning, and she wont see a penny of the prize! Good point!

[MojoNixon]

delete

[MojoNixon]

You clearly have me confused with someone else. :tongue:

Oh! So you are her EX??? :shocked: So he did find hotter new wife after you :xyxwave:

[moghirl]

There was another thread on this but it got terribly sidetracked and was closed before I got to it so I opened this one to discuss the matter.

First of all, walking past a bomb and getting blown up does not make you a hero. That is an insult to the real heroes of the world. I would consider someone who did something exceptionally brave or someone who is solely responsible for saving another person's life in a crisis a hero. Walking past a barrel does not make you a hero just desperately unlucky.

Secondly, to those who say the fact he joined the forces in the first place makes him a hero as he was risking his life for freedom - he was fighting in Northern Ireland, the troubles were not about freedom they were about power and prejudice. Something which is in a way almost proven by how bigoted Steve has shown himself up to be in so many respects.

Brave for joining the army, yes. A hero, absolutely not.

Totally agree with you especially reagrds "The Troubles were not about freedom they were about power and prejudice " .. hear hear !

Servicemen and women know exactly what they're siging up to although I bet recruitment fail to elaborate on the facts that they could probably lose a limb or two and possibly come home in a box ..

Here's a wee tune by Billy Connolly that sums it all up ..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pdBoSu56_3Q

[Livia]

I would say exactly the same to you. I feel you are both narrow-minded and entirely ignorant about stuff that to most people is basic common sense. We'll just have to agree to differ - I'm not getting into a slanging match. But suffice to say there are more people who seem to agree with me!

LOL... don't judge me by your own low intellect. And no, you're not getting into a slanging match with me because if you did, you'd be lost.

I refer you to my footer.

[AquaShots]

I refer you to my footer. :joker:

[MojoNixon]

I would say exactly the same to you. I feel you are both narrow-minded and entirely ignorant about stuff that to most people is basic common sense. We'll just have to agree to differ - I'm not getting into a slanging match. But suffice to say there are more people who seem to agree with me!

You and those another new accounts you have created?

[Late for the Party]

First you say thisIf selfish, ignorant people like Steve continue to have 8 kids, the UK may need to think about enforcing laws like China
Then you finish your post with this you must have a very small mind.

So how many kids, would steve be allowed have, if you were in charge of this hypothetical British Communist regime

[StGeorge]

Well lets be honest here, If the British army had never come across the water to Ireland in the first place there would have been no IRA.

Hi Niamh,
I hadnt spotted this till others revived this thread, but its an interesting comment you make and goes down the lines of the chicken and the egg question.

Now obviously the IRA has been around for hundreds of years in one form or another, but im assuming that you are on about when the troops entered NI in 1969?

On researching this period, it looks like there had been a reasonable period of stability from the initial flareups in the early 1920s up until the 1960s. The WW2 probably occupied alot of peoples attention for awhile.
Irish Nationalism never disappeared and the original IRA members were around in various forms and with varying agendas and aims, and on the 50th anniversary of the Easter Rising (an Irish armed revolt in 1916 against Britain resulting eventually to talks and partition), the perceived resurection of the IRA led to the Unionists forming the Ulster Volunteer Force (UVF) who started the campaign of violence towards catholic targets. And it was then that a split occurred in the IRA thinking and the Provisional IRA appeared with intent on armed activity.
It was at this point that the Irish Republic issue a warning that it couldnt sit by and watch innocent catholics being murdered, which drove the Northern Ireland authorities to request that Britain helped out with Troops.
These Troops were initially welcomed by both sides of the innocents, but gradually over time the Nationalist community began to hate the troop presence and saw it as an occupation. (Bloody Sunday was a massive turning point in this attitude).

IMO Ireland has been buggered up since the Brit settlers of the 1600s, but colonialism was not confined to Ireland, who themselves carried out this action when invading and colonising Pictland(?) (now Scotland).

But i think that the real damage was done in the 1920s when there was an agreement for division, but it was done badly with Nationalists trapped on the wrong side of the border. The Troubles (as they have since been called) were always there just waiting to boil over, which they eventually did in 1960s.

You can compare this with other such bad politically managed border jigging with the Germany (post WW1 & WW2), Vietnam, Korea, and the former Yugoslavia. All failed attempts to seperate a given country due to political division. Korea only, remains divided like NI, a melting pot of tension that could one day spill over and burn the world again due to our ancestors inability to sort it out properly in the first place. And us now will suffer.

I end this long (yawn) piece by saying that NI today is relatively peaceful, and only the people of NI that truly want peace can ensure it never erupts again. Irrespective of what happened centuries ago, they are all Irish now and should work together as free Irish and alienate the trouble makers.
This Englishman will back them 100%.

[Niamh.]

I wasn't referring to when they entered Northern Ireland in 1969 no. I was refering to when they first formed in 1913.

[Shasown]

I wasn't referring to when they entered Northern Ireland in 1969 no. I was refering to when they first formed in 1913.

It was the Irish Volunteers that formed in 1913. They has the little row in the town in 1916. During that period the term Irish Republican Army was used by the Irish Volunteers and the Irish Republican Brotherhood to loosely describe themselves. The IRB co-opted James Connelly's Irish Citizens Army.

There were splits within organisations after the suspension of the Home Rule Act in 1914 after the declaration of war. But at that time the IRA wasnt a term used to describe any or all of the nationalists movements.

If you read the text of the Easter Proclamation you will see this backs up the above

Poblacht na h Éireann.

The Provisional Government
of the
Irish Republic
To the people of Ireland.

IRISHMEN AND IRISHWOMEN: In the name of God and of the dead generations from which she receives her old tradition of nationhood, Ireland, through us, summons her children to her flag and strikes for her freedom.

Having organised and trained her manhood through her secret revolutionary organisation, the Irish Republican Brotherhood, and through her open military organisations, the Irish Volunteers and the Irish Citizen Army, having patiently perfected her discipline, having resolutely waited for the right moment to reveal itself, she now seizes that moment, and, supported by her exiled children in America and by gallant allies in Europe, but relying in the first on her own strength, she strikes in full confidence of victory.

The remaining forces left of those organisations were formally called the IRA in 1919 upon the formation of the Dáil Éireann in Dublin on 21 January 1919.(First sitting and inaugaration of the Aireacht.)

The term had been used before however IN America in the 1860's The acronym IRA was first used by the IRB organization in America (also known as the Fenian Brotherhood).

[StGeorge]

I think its safe to say that the recent politics of Ireland as a whole (100yrs or so), has been a mess that both sides should not look back at with pride.

As i have said, i think the Troubles (1960s onwards) was a direct result of a botched partition.
But i also beleive that in a modern civilised society, to take up arms instead of going to the ballot box, then you have lost your argument.

[Niamh.]

It was the Irish Volunteers that formed in 1913. They has the little row in the town in 1916. During that period the term Irish Republican Army was used by the Irish Volunteers and the Irish Republican Brotherhood to loosely describe themselves. The IRB co-opted James Connelly's Irish Citizens Army.

There were splits within organisations after the suspension of the Home Rule Act in 1914 after the declaration of war. But at that time the IRA wasnt a term used to describe any or all of the nationalists movements.

If you read the text of the Easter Proclamation you will see this backs up the above



The remaining forces left of those organisations were formally called the IRA in 1919 upon the formation of the Dáil Éireann in Dublin on 21 January 1919.(First sitting and inaugaration of the Aireacht.)

The term had been used before however IN America in the 1860's The acronym IRA was first used by the IRB organization in America (also known as the Fenian Brotherhood).

Yes we learned all about it in school

[StGeorge]

Yes we learned all about it in school

Unfortunately Niamh there are many Brits who only know about Ireland from what they see on TV news.

I just hope that the youth of NI can work together for its future and maybe decades down the line the island can be reunited like the Germanies were..in peace and with agreement. I doubt it will happen in my lifetime.

I just wish that forums like this were not used as a place for people to spout untruths and bigotry just cos a BB HM happened to have been blown up in NI whilst a serving soldier. Dislike him for reasons to do with his BB performance..and not due to his former career.

[Niamh.]

Unfortunately Niamh there are many Brits who only know about Ireland from what they see on TV news.

I just hope that the youth of NI can work together for its future and maybe decades down the line the island can be reunited like the Germanies were..in peace and with agreement. I doubt it will happen in my lifetime.

I just wish that forums like this were not used as a place for people to spout untruths and bigotry just cos a BB HM happened to have been blown up in NI whilst a serving soldier. Dislike him for reasons to do with his BB performance..and not due to his former career.

I never said I disliked him because he was a soldier though?

[StGeorge]

I never said I disliked him because he was a soldier though?

Sorry, i didnt mean you....i refer to the numpties who are attacking him for being either a slob, or perv or generally for living on earth, but use his service and where he got his disability as an excuse for vitriol.

[Niamh.]

Sorry, i didnt mean you....i refer to the numpties who are attacking him for being either a slob, or perv or generally for living on earth, but use his service and where he got his disability as an excuse for vitriol.

oh lol, sorry crossed wires. I don't particularly like him but only because he's a boring HM:hugesmile:

[StGeorge]

The thing im trying to say is that i dont think that a BB forum should be used to discuss Irish politics due to a HMs employment in the services and his obvious disability caused whilst serving there.

I tend to just post my bit to try an correct anomalies with comments like "Steve and Britain invading Northern Ireland", which is just not historically true.


BTW....As you did mean the 1916 period, then all i can say about your original comment below, is that the British Army at the time was made up of 10 of 1000s of Irishmen who were serving as a part of the UK forces for which Ireland belonged. It was the subsequent disagreement about how HomeRule was going and the emergence of a Unionist armed militia, that saw the IRA emerge as well. If partition wasnt agreed by Nationalists like Collins, then Civil War was on the cards. From what i can ascertain, the Brits wanted out and had actually agreed to HR when the 1st WW started. What happened after that was a botch job and fault IMO lays on both sides.

Well lets be honest here, If the British army had never come across the water to Ireland in the first place there would have been no IRA.

[StGeorge]

oh lol, sorry crossed wires. I don't particularly like him but only because he's a boring HM:hugesmile:

No worries..i actually understand your viewpoint and agree with alot of what you say.

TBH im finding it really difficult this year to actually like any of them. No one stands out as a decent character to get my support..they all have various flaws. JJ2 seems normal at the mo' but its early days yet....he is a suck arse to JJ1 tho'.

[boomoo]

Wrong.
He volunteered to take that explosion. He did that when he signed up to serve. You need to understand that.
If he didn't do that on purpose then you or I would eventually be in line for it. Probably me. I'm not as brave as Steve but I have a feeling your less likely to be counted on if it comes to it.
The good news is that Steve volunteered to take that explosion first and so it will never make it to your front door or mine.

Steve is a dull HM?
One of the reasons you even get to watch entertaining HMs in a program called BB is BECAUSE OF PEOPLE LIKE STEVE IN THE FIRST PLACE.

The sad.. I mean just pathetic, sad and even downright disgusting things is when people don't even understand that.
That is a ****ing tragedy that far too many spoiled young people don't understand why their iPhone and BB voting parties and entertaining programs are OWED to the Steves of this world.

Anyways.. I also find him an intriguing HM so its all good for me.

I agree with your posting.
Plus you have to be very courageous to make a life for yourself after such horrific injuries no matter how they were caused.
Unless you have been close to someone who has been terribly injured you cannot have any idea what they have been through.
There are years of painful operations and the continual problems with the end of the legs.
He has never complained once on BB. He has shown up the housemates.
I do not think he will win but he does not deserve to be villified for being injured while serving our country.
I suppose the majority of bloggers were not born when this country was facing daily terrorist threats from NIreland.