Cheryl voting second [MERGED]

[Zippy]

When Simon had two acts in the sing off he was allowed to go last and didnt therefore have to choose. Thats the decent and right way to do it.

No need to create bad feeling between an act and their mentor just for tv drama sake. Dermot was yet again trying to sh!tstir by going to Cheryl 2nd.

And she was 100% right to not throw one of her acts under the bus when it was totally unnecessary to do so.

[Adamw92]

She was right and as she said, she wanted to take it to deadlock if there it ended up in a 2-1 vote.

[patsylimerick]

Do you really believe that Dermot was acting unilaterally there? Consider this. The producers knew Katie was last on the public vote. They decided that they would go to Cheryl second and bump her out of the reckoning; then they have a 2 to 1 and away TreyC goes. None of this, IMHO, happens by chance.

[Vicky.]

OK, I'm over raging at cheryl for not voting. Kind of. And I realize it was a bit unfair to go to her second, as usually the mentor with two acts in the bottom gets to vote last, taking it to nearly certain deadlock. In fact, I dont think what happened tonight has ever happened before...

Why the change this week?

Was it possibly because Katie was the bottom of the public vote...and the almost certain deadlock with cheryl voting would have removed her?

Not really one for consipracy ****...but why change how things work this week...

[Locke.]

Well Cheryl didn't seem to know that it was going to happen the way she reacted... Maybe Dermot just ****ed up?

[Niamh.]

absolutely 100% agree, they're saving Katie for some reason, I think she knows someone involved in X factor or something. Why would they do that????

[Zippy]

Do you really believe that Dermot was asking unilaterally there? Consider this. The producers knew Katie was last on the public vote. They decided that they would go to Cheryl second and bump her out of the reckoning; then they have a 2 to 1 and away TreyC goes. None of this, IMHO, happens by chance.

Whoever makes his decisions my point about Cheryl remains. She didnt need to make such a big decision at that point. I cant remember ever in the past when a judge has been asked to choose between their acts as the second judge. They usually always get left until last. Especially since the deadlock thing.

Dermot even asked Simon who he would have ditched between his acts AFTER the decision had been made(when he had two acts in sing off). So he(or voices in his ear) is clearly sh!tstirring for no good reason other than drama.

[Vicky.]

Well Cheryl didn't seem to know that it was going to happen the way she reacted... Maybe Dermot just ****ed up?

Hmm maybe. never thought of that, but then surely someone would have shouted at him in his earpiece telling him to move to someone else :S

[Novo]

absolutely 100% agree, they're saving Katie for some reason, I think she knows someone involved in X factor or something. Why would they do that????

LOL!!!!!!!!!

I've heard it all you bitter little thing :pat:

[Kerry]

Not sure why they changed the voting order but I knew she would not vote. Infact said it here at home that I could guarentee she wouldn't. To be fair other judges in the past have done the same. Even Simon

[fruit_cake]

I think Dermot was shaken up and disorientated from Simon's blanking earlier on in the show and made a mistake going straight to Cheryl accidentally

[patsylimerick]

Whoever makes his decisions my point about Cheryl remains. She didnt need to make such a big decision at that point. I cant remember ever in the past when a judge has been asked to choose between their acts as the second judge. They usually always get left until last. Especially since the deadlock thing.

Dermot even asked Simon who he would have ditched between his acts AFTER the decision had been made(when he had two acts in sing off). So he(or voices in his ear) is clearly sh!tstirring for no good reason other than drama.

But my point was that Cheryl going second was part of the script, a script that ensured TreyC went, which is "right up Cheryl's street".

[MissKittyFantastico]

Her staged shock at them coming to her second pissed me off too, they think we're stupid.

Why would they change the order, they usually come to the judge with two acts in the bottom last so why did it change this time?

Katie messed up her sing off song, and Simon always says he bases it on that, so why change THAT this week as well? The public don't like her, she's been bottom three times now. Pisstake.

Wagner to win.

[Mystic Mock]

OK, I'm over raging at cheryl for not voting. Kind of. And I realize it was a bit unfair to go to her second, as usually the mentor with two acts in the bottom gets to vote last, taking it to nearly certain deadlock. In fact, I dont think what happened tonight has ever happened before...

Why the change this week?

Was it possibly because Katie was the bottom of the public vote...and the almost certain deadlock with cheryl voting would have removed her?

Not really one for consipracy ****...but why change how things work this week...

dont forget it was a bottom 3 this week but they changed it in the last miniute,hmmm i wonder why.

[Jack_]

It's not Dermot's fault - it's the producer(s) in his ear.

And I don't blame them if they want to save Katie anyway, regardless of my opinion of her, she is interesting and creates headlines. This is exactly what they want. We all know how the show works by now, it's better for the show [in terms of entertainment and press attention] that she stays.

[Vicky.]

It's not Dermot's fault - it's the producer(s) in his ear.

And I don't blame them if they want to save Katie anyway, regardless of my opinion of her, she is interesting and creates headlines. This is exactly what they want. We all know how the show works by now, it's better for the show [in terms of entertainment and press attention] that she stays.

But fixing the result...for whatever reason, isn't on though :S

And that is what has happened tonight, unless it was by some chance a genuine mistake by dermot/the producers whatever...but I doubt that

[Zippy]

But my point was that Cheryl going second was part of the script, a script that ensured TreyC went, which is "right up Cheryl's street".

well Im not one for conspiracies..

All Tv shows manipulate. Either way they got rid of the act who was least value to the show. Her sing off performance was offkey too so she didnt blast Katie out of the water when she had the chance.

[patsylimerick]

OK, I'm over raging at cheryl for not voting. Kind of. And I realize it was a bit unfair to go to her second, as usually the mentor with two acts in the bottom gets to vote last, taking it to nearly certain deadlock. In fact, I dont think what happened tonight has ever happened before...

Why the change this week?

Was it possibly because Katie was the bottom of the public vote...and the almost certain deadlock with cheryl voting would have removed her?

Not really one for consipracy ****...but why change how things work this week...

I just said much the same in another thread. Maybe they're hanging onto Katie in case their darling Cher ever ends up in the bottom two. They'd give her the old heave ho then.

[SocietyIsRuined]

Do you really believe that Dermot was acting unilaterally there? Consider this. The producers knew Katie was last on the public vote. They decided that they would go to Cheryl second and bump her out of the reckoning; then they have a 2 to 1 and away TreyC goes. None of this, IMHO, happens by chance.

You're completely correct. I even believe the judges are told after the bottom two are revealed what the public vote is. All smoke and mirrors.

[Niamh.]

LOL!!!!!!!!!

I've heard it all you bitter little thing :pat:

she messed up her song...........again, she's w hinging horrible drama queen

[Jords]

Great OP, think you hit the nail on the head with tonight's farce Vicky!

[GiRTh]

LOL

Zippy, once again, loses sight of the big picture and just decides to praise Cheryl.

[Kerry]

How can it be a fix though? Cheryl said she'd have taken it to deadlock had she been last to vote. Plus can nobody remember the crap TV companies got into for vote fixing a year or two ago? Theres no way they can get away with that now

[Novo]

she messed up her song...........again, she's w hinging horrible drama queen

Well Unlucky she is here for another week :dance:

[Jack_]

But fixing the result...for whatever reason, isn't on though :S

And that is what has happened tonight, unless it was by some chance a genuine mistake by dermot/the producers whatever...but I doubt that

I don't really see how it's 'fixing the result' though. If Cheryl wanted to vote she could have, and let's say she sent home Katie following Simon sending home TreyC, and then Dannii sent home Katie and then Louis sent home TreyC [which is what happened, bar Cheryl's hypothetical vote] - then it would've been Deadlock. Or, Cheryl could've voted to send home TreyC, that would've meant two votes for her, Dannii could've/would've sent home Katie, and then Louis could have done the same also giving Deadlock.

[Vicky.]

How can it be a fix though? Cheryl said she'd have taken it to deadlock had she been last to vote. Plus can nobody remember the crap TV companies got into for vote fixing a year or two ago? Theres no way they can get away with that now

Its not fixing the actual public vote though.

And yes, cheryl said she would take it to deadlock...so her vote was disallowed. Thats my point, obviously cheryl wouldnt have wanted to kick one of her own acts out, obviously she would take it to deadlock...which is WHY they went to her second instead of last. The judge with two acts always goes last, so they have the chance of deadlock. But this week, I think katie got the least votes, so they panicked. Knowing full well cheryl would take it to deadlock :)

[Vicky.]

I don't really see how it's 'fixing the result' though. If Cheryl wanted to vote she could have, and let's say she sent home Katie following Simon sending home TreyC, and then Dannii sent home Katie and then Louis sent home TreyC [which is what happened, bar Cheryl's hypothetical vote] - then it would've been Deadlock. Or, Cheryl could've voted to send home TreyC, that would've meant two votes for her, Dannii could've/would've sent home Katie, and then Louis could have done the same also giving Deadlock.

Oh god.

It is fixing it, by making her pick second instead of last...LIKE ALWAYS HAPPENS.

She couldnt have made her vote, as she said she wanted to take it to deadlock. She could not have picked one second, that wouldnt guarantee that it went to deadlock :S

Yes, hypothetically(now that we know the results), she could have voted for katie, to make it deadlock, but she didnt know how the other judges were going to vote did she? I didnt see her crystal ball sitting on the table there...

[Niamh.]

Well Unlucky she is here for another week :dance:

well it's quite obvious the public hate her, so once it's taken out of the judges hands or she's up against someone decent she's toast

[Kerry]

Still doesn't discount the fact that they don't HAVE to vote. If time runs out they don't vote. If they refuse (obviously) they don't vote. Theres never been a rule that they HAVE to vote. Can no one remember Simon not voting before? Louis hasn't voted before and Sharon Osbourne on one the talent shows hasn't voted before. Not once has it been ever said the judges HAVE to

[Vicky.]

Still doesn't discount the fact that they don't HAVE to vote. If time runs out they don't vote. If they refuse (obviously) they don't vote. Theres never been a rule that they HAVE to vote. Can no one remember Simon not voting before? Louis hasn't voted before and Sharon Osbourne on one the talent shows hasn't voted before. Not once has it been ever said the judges HAVE to

Everyone seems to be totally missing the point.

Everytime there is two acts of the same mentor in the bottom, the mentor gets to pick last, and to my recollection always choses to take it to deadlock.

This week that was changed, for seemingly no reason...

[Kerry]

Everyone seems to be totally missing the point.

Everytime there is two acts of the same mentor in the bottom, the mentor gets to pick last, and to my recollection always choses to take it to deadlock.

This week that was changed, for seemingly no reason...

OK I get you. Just making the point that she didn't have to vote. There seems to be some vendetta against her for not doing so.

[Zippy]

LOL

Zippy, once again, loses sight of the big picture and just decides to praise Cheryl.

My thread is specifically about Cheryls decision..duh.

She did the honourable thing and fck whatever rules there are about a judge having to make a decision. She didnt need to go 2nd so she had every right to refuse to be forced.

[Jack_]

Oh god.

It is fixing it, by making her pick second instead of last...LIKE ALWAYS HAPPENS.

She couldnt have made her vote, as she said she wanted to take it to deadlock. She could not have picked one second, that wouldnt guarantee that it went to deadlock :S

Yes, hypothetically(now that we know the results), she could have voted for katie, to make it deadlock, but she didnt know how the other judges were going to vote did she? I didnt see her crystal ball sitting on the table there...

Fair enough - but she had already lost her vote anyway by refusing to vote. Dermot [and Konnie later] explained that. As far as I remember, she said 'I'll take it to Deadlock' after he'd stated that it was then a 'majority vote'. Even if it wasn't after - there must be a rule in which states if a Judge refuses to vote, they lose their vote.

I don't think there's an alterior motive behind any of this anyway, I expect it was probably a mistake and they just rushed from right to left along the panel without thinking it through [they were running out of time anyway].

[Vicky.]

OK I get you. Just making the point that she didn't have to vote. There seems to be some vendetta against her for not doing so.

Yeah, I was raging at her to start with for not voting. until I realised it was totally unfair the way that the order of it all changed this week.

[patsylimerick]

Still doesn't discount the fact that they don't HAVE to vote. If time runs out they don't vote. If they refuse (obviously) they don't vote. Theres never been a rule that they HAVE to vote. Can no one remember Simon not voting before? Louis hasn't voted before and Sharon Osbourne on one the talent shows hasn't voted before. Not once has it been ever said the judges HAVE to

But what's being argued is that it was all part of the plan. Go to Cheryl second, take her vote out of the equation; then it's down to a majority vote, no option for deadlock, which the producers knew TreyC would win because Katie finished last. Not that I know that, that's just the highly plausible, IMHO, explanation that's being posited.

[Jords]

I agree to a point, but she should have stuck to her guns and gone to DEADLOCK at the end.

[Niamh.]

OK I get you. Just making the point that she didn't have to vote. There seems to be some vendetta against her for not doing so.

it's not about Cheryl though Kerry, it's about who ever told Dermot to go to Cheryl second rather than last as would be normal procedure for the judge with 2 acts in the bottom

[Vicky.]

Fair enough - but she had already lost her vote anyway by refusing to vote. Dermot [and Konnie later] explained that. As far as I remember, she said 'I'll take it to Deadlock' after he'd stated that it was then a 'majority vote'. Even if it wasn't after - there must be a rule in which states if a Judge refuses to vote, they lose their vote.

I don't think there's an alterior motive behind any of this anyway, I expect it was probably a mistake and they just rushed from right to left along the panel without thinking it through [they were running out of time anyway].

Because they came to her second, instead of last like they ALWAYS do if a mentor has two acts in the bottom...

IF she had been last to vote, she would have took it to deadlock, she even said for the others to vote first THEN let her have her vote, which is what is done any other week.

Yes, there is a CHANCE that it was a mistake, just seems too well timed tbh :laugh:

[Niamh.]

But what's being argued is that it was all part of the plan. Go to Cheryl second, take her vote out of the equation; then it's down to a majority vote, no option for deadlock, which the producers knew TreyC would win because Katie finished last. Not that I know that, that's just the highly plausible, IMHO, explanation that's being posited.

exactly, everyone seems to be completely missing the point here!

[Kerry]

I'm normally the first to think these things are fixed and would agree totally here but IMO I really don't think tonights has been. I just can't see a TV company risking it after all the crap a year or so ago. I respect that many may think it is though

[GiRTh]

My thread is specifically about Cheryls decision..duh.

She did the honourable thing and fck whatever rules there are about a judge having to make a decision. She didnt need to go 2nd so she had every right to refuse to be forced.The honourable thing? Thats a first for her.

[Jords]

DEADLOCK is an exciting word.

Zippy, Im sending you to.... DEADLOCK. :devil:

[Zippy]

Can I just say;

BOTH ACTS GOT THE LEAST VOTES FROM THE PUBLIC.

just reminding you while you get so carried away with conspiracy theories. They are both dispensable and unpopular clearly so does it really matter which goes first? The other will go soon enough.

[Kerry]

it's not about Cheryl though Kerry, it's about who ever told Dermot to go to Cheryl second rather than last as would be normal procedure for the judge with 2 acts in the bottom

But people are slating her for it (or were)

[fruit_cake]

I thought it was a cock up that suited them in the end so they never said anything.. If it had been a cock up in TreyC's favour, they'd have asked Cheryl to take it too deadlock

[Vicky.]

Can I just say;

BOTH ACTS GOT THE LEAST VOTES FROM THE PUBLIC.

just reminding you while you get so carried away with conspiracy theories. They are both dispensable and unpopular clearly so does it really matter which goes first? The other will go soon enough.
I know that, neither would win, and whoever stays will likely be in the bottom next week anyways.

But why on earth change the voting order and make cheryl look a **** when she (quite rightly) refused to vote until the end, and wanted to take it to deadlock like any other judge with two acts in the bottom would. I at first was raging at cheryl, until I clicked on that it was unfair to expect her to go second, when it has never been done before in that situation...

[Niamh.]

But people are slating her for it (or were)

not in this thread though, I wouldn't blame her at all for what she did, it's just why did they do it that way is the question? if not to avoid deadlock

[Zippy]

DEADLOCK is an exciting word.

Zippy, Im sending you to.... DEADLOCK. :devil:

Im still recovering from the shock of you calling me evil way back...now you send me to deadlock?

We were like brothers once...:bawling:

[Kerry]

not in this thread though, I wouldn't blame her at all for what she did, it's just why did they do it that way is the question? if not to avoid deadlock

Vicky just admitted she was raging with Cheryl at first



Anyway, not going to argue about a TV show. It's an entertainment show and thats what it provides. Good, bad or ugly. The good will get record deals either way

[Vicky.]

Vicky just admitted she was raging with Cheryl at first



Anyway, not going to argue about a TV show. It's an entertainment show and thats what it provides. Good, bad or ugly. The good will get record deals either way
yes, at first I was. And then I realised what was said in my OP :S

[fruit_cake]

Cheryl never complained about not being allowed to take it to deadlock once Louis voted TreyC out..

[Kerry]

yes, at first I was. And then I realised what was said in my OP :S

And like I said, at first

[patsylimerick]

Cheryl never complained about not being allowed to take it to deadlock once Louis voted TreyC out..

EUREKA!! :dance:

[Vicky.]

And like I said, at first

Yes, BEFORE making this.

Not once in this thread have I blamed cheryl. This thread is not about blaming cheryl, this is SYMPATHY for cheryl. She looked a dick, so that the producers could fix the result/possibly due to a genuine mistake.

It was never about cheryl.

[Kerry]

Yes, BEFORE making this.

Not once in this thread have I blamed cheryl. This thread is not about blaming cheryl, this is SYMPATHY for cheryl. She looked a dick, so that the producers could fix the result/possibly due to a genuine mistake.

It was never about cheryl.

Christ I just said you was angry at her at first and admitted it. Not that you'd aimed the thread at her

[Novo]

Brilliant thread :joker:

carry on

[Vicky.]

Christ I just said you was angry at her at first and admitted it. Not that you'd aimed the thread at her

Yes, it is just annoying when people are coming in deliberately missing the point :)

[joeysteele]

Well at least we know one of the bottom lot next week, Katie again, as the public will be furious at the result tonight ,is that 3 weeks out of 5 she has been in the lower positions now?

She didn't even perform well in the sing off, however and this is massively unfair to Treyc but Cheryl would never have sent Katie home unless she was up against Cher,so the result happened as predicted by most.

Treyc was one of the best on last night, Katie who rides along the bottom every week except one is still there, but the public will get her out soon.

The sad thing is if she was in the last 2 or whatever next week and had to sing off against the likes of Paije or Wagner then the judges would save her again.

Still all the rules can be changed for Cheryl it seems, although for once she couldn't say anything or have an opinion or say who should go, quite a feat to get Cheryl to a point where she doesn't say anything since she usually derides others for indecision.

[Kerry]

Yes, it is just annoying when people are coming in deliberately missing the point :)

I didn't do it deliberately. I obviously misunderstood

[Patrick]

Well Cheryl didn't seem to know that it was going to happen the way she reacted... Maybe Dermot just ****ed up?

This, she was well gobsmacked.

[Mystic Mock]

Well at least we know one of the bottom lot next week, Katie again, as the public will be furious at the result tonight ,is that 3 weeks out of 5 she has been in the lower positions now?

She didn't even perform well in the sing off, however and this is massively unfair to Treyc but Cheryl would never have sent Katie home unless she was up against Cher,so the result happened as predicted by most.

Treyc was one of the best on last night, Katie who rides along the bottom every week except one is still there, but the public will get her out soon.

The sad thing is if she was in the last 2 or whatever next week and had to sing off against the likes of Paije or Wagner then the judges would save her again.

Still all the rules can be changed for Cheryl it seems, although for once she couldn't say anything or have an opinion or say who should go, quite a feat to get Cheryl to a point where she doesn't say anything since she usually derides others for indecision.

yes its katies 3rd time in the bottom 2 out of 5 weeks.

[joeysteele]

I agree to a point, but she should have stuck to her guns and gone to DEADLOCK at the end.

Correct, but I didn't hear her say her in her usual forceful tones, 'excuse me, I have an opinion here, I said if it went 2-1 I would take it to deadlock'.

For once she shut up because she had the result she wanted, good on Dannii for saying send Katie home, but ever so Miss false Cheryl, made no battle after the vote from Loiuis to insist it then went to deadlock.

What Cheryl said was, I'm not saying but go to these 2 first and if its 2-1 I'll take it to deadlock,so why did she not insist on that,I tell you this, had Louis voted with Dannii and made it 2-1 to send Katie home, Cheryl would have been up in arms demanding it went to deadlock then.Total hypocrite she is.

[GiRTh]

Correct, but I didn't hear her say her in her usual forceful tones, 'excuse me, I have an opinion here, I said if it went 2-1 I would take it to deadlock'.

For once she shut up because she had the result she wanted, good on Dannii for saying send Katie home, but ever so Miss false Cheryl, made no battle after the vote from Loiuis to insist it then went to deadlock.

What Cheryl said was, I'm not saying but go to these 2 first and if its 2-1 I'll take it to deadlock,so why did she not insist on that,I tell you this, had Louis voted with Dannii and made it 2-1 to send Katie home, Cheryl would have been up in arms demanding it went to deadlock then.Total hypocrite she is.This.

[joeysteele]

OOps, my apologies to you Zippy, I know you have great admiration for Cheryl and usually when I see a thread made by you as to Cheryl, I keep off it as I don't like her.

I didn't realise you had started this thread,so I am sorry for attacking Cheryl in a thread you began.

[Jack_]

Correct, but I didn't hear her say her in her usual forceful tones, 'excuse me, I have an opinion here, I said if it went 2-1 I would take it to deadlock'.

For once she shut up because she had the result she wanted, good on Dannii for saying send Katie home, but ever so Miss false Cheryl, made no battle after the vote from Loiuis to insist it then went to deadlock.

What Cheryl said was, I'm not saying but go to these 2 first and if its 2-1 I'll take it to deadlock,so why did she not insist on that,I tell you this, had Louis voted with Dannii and made it 2-1 to send Katie home, Cheryl would have been up in arms demanding it went to deadlock then.Total hypocrite she is.

Because Dermot clearly stated that it was now a 'majority vote', i.e that Cheryl had lost her vote, and only the other three counted, FFS. No amount of whining was going to change that rule. It was set in stone. You're either deaf or purposefully and desperately trying to find something to slate Cheryl for in order to continue your obsessive hatred, I personally think both. Get over it.

[patsylimerick]

Correct, but I didn't hear her say her in her usual forceful tones, 'excuse me, I have an opinion here, I said if it went 2-1 I would take it to deadlock'.

For once she shut up because she had the result she wanted, good on Dannii for saying send Katie home, but ever so Miss false Cheryl, made no battle after the vote from Loiuis to insist it then went to deadlock.

What Cheryl said was, I'm not saying but go to these 2 first and if its 2-1 I'll take it to deadlock,so why did she not insist on that,I tell you this, had Louis voted with Dannii and made it 2-1 to send Katie home, Cheryl would have been up in arms demanding it went to deadlock then.Total hypocrite she is.

Yep. Exactly. This.

[joeysteele]

yes its katies 3rd time in the bottom 2 out of 5 weeks.

Wow, she is really popular with the public then. How that fact can be ignored is beyond me. Her sing off was awful too compared to Treyc but I knew Simon would in that scenario send Treyc home but was surprised at Louis doing so too.

I dare bet had Louis voted with Danni to send Katie home too,then with that 2-1 to send Katie out, Ms Cole would have yelled the place down to make sure it went to deadlock.

[Niamh.]

Wow, she is really popular with the public then. How that fact can be ignored is beyond me. Her sing off was awful too compared to Treyc but I knew Simon would in that scenario send Treyc home but was surprised at Louis doing so too.

I dare bet had Louis voted with Danni to send Katie home too,then with that 2-1 to send Katie out, Ms Cole would have yelled the place down to make sure it went to deadlock.

you could guarantee that:rolleyes:

[Zippy]

Zzzzz

I honestly don't even get what you Cheryl haters are saying tbh. I dont care either because the bottom line is Cheryl refused to throw one of her acts under the bus and you can twist that whichever way you bloody like. Haterz gonna hate.

[GiRTh]

Zzzzz

I honestly don't even get what you Cheryl haters are saying tbh. I dont care either because the bottom line is Cheryl refused to throw one of her acts under the bus and you can twist that whichever way you bloody like. Haterz gonna hate.Thing is Zip. You started the thread and her actions tonight dont add up. That IS why you started this thread, isnt it? Or was it just to praise little miss perfect? She wasn't so perfect tonight.

[Tom]

Are people losing sight that Simon refused to say who he'd vote for after Dannii, Louis & Cheryl had all cast their votes, might I add Cheryl making the casting vote?

[Zippy]

Thing is Zip. You started the thread and her actions tonight dont add up. That IS why you started this thread, isnt it? Or was it just to praise little miss perfect? She wasn't so perfect tonight.

Her actions were very simple. She was asked to choose between them at an unnecessary point and refused to do so. If you want to build up a whole conspiracy story around that then thats your sad business.

Cheryl didnt eliminate one of her acts so she does not have their blood on her hands. Nor does she need to...just like Simon didnt a few weeks ago and many judges in past series. She should have been asked her opinion last which would have given her the option to take it to deadlock and let the public decide.

[Patrick]

She was mature about it, I love her.

People need to ****** up and leave her alone it wasn't her fault, or Dermot's for that matter, it was probably the person in the gallery talking to Dermot in his ear.

[GiRTh]

Her actions were very simple. She was asked to choose between them at an unnecessary point and refused to do so. If you want to build up a whole conspiracy story around that then thats your sad business.

Cheryl didnt eliminate one of her acts so she does not have their blood on her hands. Nor does she need to...just like Simon didnt a few weeks ago and many judges in past series. She should have been asked her opinion last which would have given her the option to take it to deadlock and let the public decide.But wasnt it strange that she wasnt asked last?

[Mr XcX]

When Simon had two acts in the sing off he was allowed to go last and didnt therefore have to choose. Thats the decent and right way to do it.

No need to create bad feeling between an act and their mentor just for tv drama sake. Dermot was yet again trying to sh!tstir by going to Cheryl 2nd.

And she was 100% right to not throw one of her acts under the bus when it was totally unnecessary to do so.

Very rarely do I agree with you Zippy but yes. Totally a mockery of the whole show!!!

[Zippy]

But wasnt it strange that she wasnt asked last?

My guess is the producers just wanted a bit of drama and knew she would refuse at that point. Thats all.

I dont think it was any great plot to save Katie.

[Tom]

No matter how Cheryl voted she was always going to be criticised for it. there are a few scenarios:

If she voted second to send home...

Katie- people would be saying how she only voted Katie to counteract Simon's vote
Treyc- people would be saying how Katie is her favourite

If she voted last ...

sending it to deadlock (which would have been voting for Katie)- she'd be a crap judge because she can't choose

if she had the third vote to eliminate Treyc, she would have done that because she doesn't like Treyc

The only situation where Cheryl would have got some kind of kudos was if Katie went in a 3-1 vote with Cheryl casting the third vote. People pick at every small thing she does and qutie frankly its pathetic

[GiRTh]

My guess is the producers just wanted a bit of drama and knew she would refuse at that point. Thats all.

I dont think it was any great plot to save Katie.It did save her though didnt it? In very dodgy circumstances.

[Vicky.]

No matter how Cheryl voted she was always going to be criticised for it. there are a few scenarios:

If she voted second to send home...

Katie- people would be saying how she only voted Katie to counteract Simon's vote
Treyc- people would be saying how Katie is her favourite

If she voted last ...

sending it to deadlock (which would have been voting for Katie)- she'd be a crap judge because she can't choose

if she had the third vote to eliminate Treyc, she would have done that because she doesn't like Treyc

The only situation where Cheryl would have got some kind of kudos was if Katie went in a 3-1 vote with Cheryl casting the third vote. People pick at every small thing she does and qutie frankly its pathetic

This isnt about cheryl though.

Its about WHY they chose to go to her second and make her LOOK like an idiot for not voting, instead of going last like every other mentor who has had 2 acts in the bottom. The option to take it to deadlock, should have been there.

[Tom]

copy & paste job from the other thread, its just as relevant here

No matter how Cheryl voted she was always going to be criticised for it. there are a few scenarios:

If she voted second to send home...

Katie- people would be saying how she only voted Katie to counteract Simon's vote
Treyc- people would be saying how Katie is her favourite

If she voted last ...

sending it to deadlock (which would have been voting for Katie)- she'd be a crap judge because she can't choose

if she had the third vote to eliminate Treyc, she would have done that because she doesn't like Treyc

The only situation where Cheryl would have got some kind of kudos was if Katie went in a 3-1 vote with Cheryl casting the third vote. People pick at every small thing she does and qutie frankly its pathetic

[Mr XcX]

This isnt about cheryl though.

Its about WHY they chose to go to her second and make her LOOK like an idiot for not voting, instead of going last like every other mentor who has had 2 acts in the bottom. The option to take it to deadlock, should have been there.

Agree Vicky. Total JOKE!!

THE X FACTOR IS SO FAKE!!

I bet if they wanted Wagner safe they would get Simon to take it to deadlock.

[Tom]

This isnt about cheryl though.

Its about WHY they chose to go to her second and make her LOOK like an idiot for not voting, instead of going last like every other mentor who has had 2 acts in the bottom. The option to take it to deadlock, should have been there.

Probably to mix it up a little bit to save us from the obvious. There were a few other changes on tonights show as well- there was build up music when Katie & Treyc both entered the stage for the performances and there was a bit before the show with Dermot

I wouldn't read much into it, whenever a judge refuses to vote it depends on the other 2. Sharon refused to vote a few times and thats what happened

I guess we'll find out when the results are released at the end of the series if Katie was bottom

[Jack_]

I've just remembered - Sharon 'walked off' on the first Live Show of Series 4, due to her having two of her acts in the Bottom Two. She was asked first [I know Cheryl was asked second, but still, neither were asked last], she refused and thus lost her vote - so it went to a majority vote of the other three Judges.

This is what happened tonight. So it HAS happened before.

[GiRTh]

copy & paste job from the other thread, its just as relevant here

No matter how Cheryl voted she was always going to be criticised for it. there are a few scenarios:

If she voted second to send home...

Katie- people would be saying how she only voted Katie to counteract Simon's vote
Treyc- people would be saying how Katie is her favourite

If she voted last ...

sending it to deadlock (which would have been voting for Katie)- she'd be a crap judge because she can't choose

if she had the third vote to eliminate Treyc, she would have done that because she doesn't like Treyc

The only situation where Cheryl would have got some kind of kudos was if Katie went in a 3-1 vote with Cheryl casting the third vote. People pick at every small thing she does and qutie frankly its patheticInteresting scenarios, but if she'd simply announced - she'd like to go last - then she would have avoided all the fix claims. Surely she'd thought about this in advance and played it out in her head. If she hadnt then she's not right to be on the judging panel.

[Zippy]

It did save her though didnt it? In very dodgy circumstances.

No. Thats just the thing; it wasn't dodgy at all. People just have an overactive imagination.

Bottom line; TreyC is good(not wow) singer but dull and invisible vs Katie is no great singer but interesting and headline grabbing.

Both regulars in bottom two so neither have a shot at winning. So which is better to keep for the show? Er....KATIE of course!

Dunno what the big hooha is all about tbh. The judges chose right.

[Vicky.]

I've just remembered - Sharon 'walked off' on the first Live Show of Series 4, due to her having two of her acts in the Bottom Two. She was asked first [I know Cheryl was asked second, but still, neither were asked last], she refused and thus lost her vote - so it went to a majority vote of the other three Judges.

This is what happened tonight. So it HAS happened before.

When there was 3 judges though, it didnt matter what the voting order was, as however the other 2 voted...the one with 2 in the bottom would have HAD to chose between them

Unless they just totally refused to vote...

[Jack_]

When there was 3 judges though, it didnt matter what the voting order was, as however the other 2 voted...the one with 2 in the bottom would have HAD to chose between them

Unless they just totally refused to vote...

Series 4 [my post] had four Judges? Sharon, Dannii, Louis, Simon.

[GiRTh]

No. Thats just the thing; it wasn't dodgy at all. People just have an overactive imagination.

Bottom line; TreyC is good(not wow) singer but dull and invisible vs Katie is no great singer but interesting and headline grabbing.

Both regulars in bottom two so neither have a shot at winning. So which is better to keep for the show? Er....KATIE of course!

Dunno what the big hooha is all about tbh. The judges chose right.You think the fact that one of the judges didnt vote isnt dodgy?

[Tom]

When there was 3 judges though, it didnt matter what the voting order was, as however the other 2 voted...the one with 2 in the bottom would have HAD to chose between them

Unless they just totally refused to vote...

The judges vote worked a lot better when there were 3 judges. If Cheryl goes to the American X Factor or if Dannii leaves/is sacked I don't think they should be replaced and the over 25s should be integrated into the 16-24 male/female categories

[Mr XcX]

Series 4 [my post] had four Judges? Sharon, Dannii, Louis, Simon.

They did that to piss Sharon off that is why!!!

They knew she would go off like a firework.

Good for ratings.

[Vicky.]

Series 4 [my post] had four Judges? Sharon, Dannii, Louis, Simon.

Oh did it :laugh:

My bad :)

[Zippy]

You think the fact that one of the judges didnt vote isnt dodgy?

wut?

she didnt need to vote! Simon didnt a few weeks back and I dont remember a fuss about that!

Only difference being that he was left until last to ask. Which is exactly what Cheryl should have been. They deliberately put her in an awkward postion and forced a drama for drama sake. If theyd just asked her last we wouldnt have all this...oh wait....the Cheryl haters would still find a way to blame her!

[Beastie]

Well I am happy Treyc went tonight!

I wanted Treyc, Mary or Wagner to go tonight.

Wagner does not entertain me as much as Jedward :(

I agree that the results was a fix though. Katie probably did get lowest amount of public votes so then the producer panicked and swapped how the judges vote when Cheryl should have come to last.

[Truth Teller]

Cheryl never complained about not being allowed to take it to deadlock once Louis voted TreyC out..

Very true......

don't know if everyone is aware it has been mooted that katie had a record contract with Sony in the US before auditioning for the X factor......Simon is linked to Sony and therefore so is Louis.........

Just a thought.

[Beastie]

Cheryl wanted to get rid pf Treyc. Let's face it. lol.

She was just being polite to Treyc.

Waste of time. She is a bore.

[GiRTh]

wut?

she didnt need to vote! Simon didnt a few weeks back and I dont remember a fuss about that!

Only difference being that he was left until last to ask. Which is exactly what Cheryl should have been. They deliberately put her in an awkward postion and forced a drama for drama sake. If theyd just asked her last we wouldnt have all this...oh wait....the Cheryl haters would still find a way to blame her!I say again, why did she not just say she wanted to go last? Surely THEN we would'nt have the drama.

[Zippy]

I say again, why did she not just say she wanted to go last?

she did!

after he asked her. She shouldn't have been asked 2nd.

Twist it all you like but you can't blame Cheryl for this one.

[GiRTh]

she did!

after he asked her. She shouldn't have been asked 2nd.

Twist it all you like but you can't blame Cheryl for this one.No her vote was disallowed. If she'd said she wanted to go last I dont think there would have been too many objections. She sat there like a tool acting like she didnt now what was going on when Dermot clearly asked her for her vote, twice.

[Beastie]

she did!

after he asked her. She shouldn't have been asked 2nd.

Twist it all you like but you can't blame Cheryl for this one.

I would say it is the producer to blame.

[Zippy]

No her vote was disallowed. If she'd said she wanted to go last I dont think there would have been too many objections. She sat there like a tool acting like she didnt now what was going on when Dermot clearly asked her for her vote, twice.

I dont even get what you mean.

You're making assumptions about what she knew. If she didnt know what order they would be asked then she probably assumed she'd be asked last like is usually the case.

When asked she effectively did say "Ill vote last so I can take it to a deadlock if need be".

I don't think any judge should have to eliminate their own acts. Its not even necessary with the current rules.

[GiRTh]

I dont even get what you mean.

You're making assumptions about what she knew. If she didnt know what order they would be asked then she probably assumed she'd be asked last like is usually the case.

When asked she effectively did say "Ill vote last so I can take it to a deadlock if need be".

I don't think any judge should have to eliminate their own acts. Its not even necessary with the current rules.But she didnt protest that she didn't get a vote. That alone speaks volumes.

[Zippy]

But she didnt protest that she didn't get a vote. That alone speaks volumes.

you've lost me. A hard decision was taken out of her hands and you want her to start protesting and causing a scene about it?

o...k..

[Beastie]

The producer's fault in Dermot's ear.

They didn't want to keep the bore that is Treyc!

[James]

My suggestion.

They should have the judges privately write down the name of the person they are voting to send home, then show them one-by-one. Much fairer. :thumbs:

[GiRTh]

you've lost me. A hard decision was taken out of her hands and you want her to start protesting and causing a scene about it?

o...k..No. She's a judge. She has a right to vote. She didn't put up much of a protest when that right was taken away from her. She said she'd take it to deadlock but when TreyC was voted off why didnt she insist on deadlock?

[Beastie]

My suggestion.

They should have the judges privately write down the name of the person they are voting to send home, then show them one-by-one. Much fairer. :thumbs:

Lol it's like going back to school!

I agree it was a fix but Treyc was a bore and I prefer Katie.

I still feel a bit sorry for Treyc though.

It was worse last year. When bloody boring Lloyd Daniels stayed over Rachel. Lloyd was kept in to keep the teeny girls happy. A lot of the teeny girls go on The X Factor tour.. so they would prefer to see Lloyd instead of Rachel :(

[Mystic Mock]

My suggestion.

They should have the judges privately write down the name of the person they are voting to send home, then show them one-by-one. Much fairer. :thumbs:

its not a bad idea,but still the judges could look at what name there writing down.

[Zippy]

Cheryl said she would take it to deadlock but Dermot overruled her and said they would just take the majority verdict of the other 3 judges. Maybe they had time issues.

I dont think Cheryl had a chance to protest even if she wanted to as it all happened so fast. I think she was just relieved to not have to make a decision herself.

[Legend killer]

After watching last nights show Cheryl has annoyed me more than i ever thought was possible. The bitch is getting paid millions and yet refuses to do what she is getting paid for.

Why the **** is she making a big deal of voting one of her acts of when she ovi doesnt care that much about them IE: ****en off to the states instead of helping them prepare for there performances

Get rid of the annoying Geordie and bring in someone who will actually do what there suppose to be getting paid for IE: Myself

[joeysteele]

After watching last nights show Cheryl has annoyed me more than i ever thought was possible. The bitch is getting paid millions and yet refuses to do what she is getting paid for.

Why the **** is she making a big deal of voting one of her acts of when she ovi doesnt care that much about them IE: ****en off to the states instead of helping them prepare for there performances

Get rid of the annoying Geordie and bring in someone who will actually do what there suppose to be getting paid for IE: Myself

For once, I am saying nothing more than I totally agree with all you said above.

[fruit_cake]

After watching last nights show Cheryl has annoyed me more than i ever thought was possible. The bitch is getting paid millions and yet refuses to do what she is getting paid for.

Why the **** is she making a big deal of voting one of her acts of when she ovi doesnt care that much about them IE: ****en off to the states instead of helping them prepare for there performances

Get rid of the annoying Geordie and bring in someone who will actually do what there suppose to be getting paid for IE: Myself

Legend, you'd make a better judge than Cheryl.. you have my vote!!! :cheer:

[nanaimo]

After watching last nights show Cheryl has annoyed me more than i ever thought was possible. The bitch is getting paid millions and yet refuses to do what she is getting paid for.

Why the **** is she making a big deal of voting one of her acts of when she ovi doesnt care that much about them IE: ****en off to the states instead of helping them prepare for there performances

Get rid of the annoying Geordie and bring in someone who will actually do what there suppose to be getting paid for IE: Myself

well said and i also want to see you as a judge :dance:

[Mystic Mock]

legend killer for x factor judge?:dance:

[tate]

spot on Legend Killer

[alc09]

She hasn't come out of this very well at all, silly woman.

[Tom]

I think people are missing the point that Dermot said "we're going to do a majority vote, is that OK" whilst pointing at Cheryl. We never saw Cheryls reaction but considering the way they continuted, you can guarantee she said yes

But hey if it lets people have yet another go at Cheryl then thats OK isnt it

[Rawrbear]

I 100% agree it was unfair on cheryl
i mean she also turned to a hate figure abit out of order

[patsylimerick]

If you're in the sing off and you get four votes to go home, you go home. If you get three votes to go home, you go home. If you get two votes to go home, it goes to deadlock. Treyc got two votes to go home. It didn't go to deadlock. This, to me, was a clear production decision to keep Katie in. The Cheryl fans on here are at pains to argue that Cheryl didn't know they were going to go to her second. Maybe she didn't. The point, however, is that Treyc is her act, she was her mentor. Surely it's her job to protect her act from a blatant injustice, no? And she blatantly didn't. Also, please stop acting like the toilet-attendant puncher is a delicate waif who needs to be defended from criticism. She's laughing all the way to LAX in 1st class at the X Factor fans. She needs to grow some metaphorical balls if she's to maintain any semblance of credibility.

[nanaimo]

If you're in the sing off and you get four votes to go home, you go home. If you get three votes to go home, you go home. If you get two votes to go home, it goes to deadlock. Treyc got two votes to go home. It didn't go to deadlock. This, to me, was a clear production decision to keep Katie in. The Cheryl fans on here are at pains to argue that Cheryl didn't know they were going to go to her second. Maybe she didn't. The point, however, is that Treyc is her act, she was her mentor. Surely it's her job to protect her act from a blatant injustice, no? And she blatantly didn't. Also, please stop acting like the toilet-attendant puncher is a delicate waif who needs to be defended from criticism. She's laughing all the way to LAX in 1st class at the X Factor fans. She needs to grow some metaphorical balls if she's to maintain any semblance of credibility.
Hear Hear!:cheer:

[StGeorge]

This isnt about cheryl though.

Its about WHY they chose to go to her second and make her LOOK like an idiot for not voting, instead of going last like every other mentor who has had 2 acts in the bottom. The option to take it to deadlock, should have been there.

I agree with Vicky here, and we will only know the motives behind the change at the end of the series because:

if it turns out Treyc had the least vote, then all conspiracy theories dont really work,

if it turns out Katie had the least vote, then quite rightly the fix looks like a ploy to prevent going to deadlock and so save Katie, and also save Cheryl voting off Treyc which she would of been slaughtered for like after her judges house fiasco. This scenario would be hard to prove but insinuates that the judges are pre-warned of a deadlock outcome so as to leave the act the producers/show/Scowell want.

IMO all this has left a bad taste in the mouth and as someone has said in another thread, Big Brother tampered with the format and crashed and burned....X-factor should be careful as it's lost all credibility this series.

[Jack_]

If you're in the sing off and you get four votes to go home, you go home. If you get three votes to go home, you go home. If you get two votes to go home, it goes to deadlock. Treyc got two votes to go home. It didn't go to deadlock. This, to me, was a clear production decision to keep Katie in. The Cheryl fans on here are at pains to argue that Cheryl didn't know they were going to go to her second. Maybe she didn't. The point, however, is that Treyc is her act, she was her mentor. Surely it's her job to protect her act from a blatant injustice, no? And she blatantly didn't. Also, please stop acting like the toilet-attendant puncher is a delicate waif who needs to be defended from criticism. She's laughing all the way to LAX in 1st class at the X Factor fans. She needs to grow some metaphorical balls if she's to maintain any semblance of credibility.

You are still missing the point that I've repeated numerous times today.

Cheryl confirmed she was refused to vote - therefore the rule is her vote is then void. It happened to Sharon in Series 4 and it happend last night. With Cheryl's vote void, there's only three votes left - making it a majority vote. No conspiracies whatsoever. Cheryl wouldn't have been able to object as she quite clearly confirmed, when asked, that she was refusing to vote. Like I said somewhere else, if Dannii had backtracked after she'd voted Katie and said 'oh wait, I've changed my mind, can I send home TreyC?', do you really think they would have allowed it? Or if on 'Who Wants To Be A Millionaire?', after the contestant has said 'final answer', they changed their mind - do you think they'd be able to change their answer then? No, no they wouldn't. And the same applies here, as it does in most TV shows. The first [or 'final' answer] is set in stone.

[Mystic Mock]

You are still missing the point that I've repeated numerous times today.

Cheryl confirmed she was refused to vote - therefore the rule is her vote is then void. It happened to Sharon in Series 4 and it happend last night. With Cheryl's vote void, there's only three votes left - making it a majority vote. No conspiracies whatsoever. Cheryl wouldn't have been able to object as she quite clearly confirmed, when asked, that she was refusing to vote. Like I said somewhere else, if Dannii had backtracked after she'd voted Katie and said 'oh wait, I've changed my mind, can I send home TreyC?', do you really think they would have allowed it? Or if on 'Who Wants To Be A Millionaire?', after the contestant has said 'final answer', they changed their mind - do you think they'd be able to change their answer then? No, no they wouldn't. And the same applies here, as it does in most TV shows. The first [or 'final' answer] is set in stone.

they still delibrately asked cheryl second so she couldnt take it to deadlock,and it makes a mockery of the show when last year rachel was easily better than lloyd on almost everything,yet he stayed because it was rachels 3rd time in the bottom 2 which is fair enough,but why get rid of rachel for that excuse but not katie who also forgot the words to the song?

[patsylimerick]

You are still missing the point that I've repeated numerous times today.

Cheryl confirmed she was refused to vote - therefore the rule is her vote is then void. It happened to Sharon in Series 4 and it happend last night. With Cheryl's vote void, there's only three votes left - making it a majority vote. No conspiracies whatsoever. Cheryl wouldn't have been able to object as she quite clearly confirmed, when asked, that she was refusing to vote. Like I said somewhere else, if Dannii had backtracked after she'd voted Katie and said 'oh wait, I've changed my mind, can I send home TreyC?', do you really think they would have allowed it? Or if on 'Who Wants To Be A Millionaire?', after the contestant has said 'final answer', they changed their mind - do you think they'd be able to change their answer then? No, no they wouldn't. And the same applies here, as it does in most TV shows. The first [or 'final' answer] is set in stone.

Yes, but was Sharon asked last of the three? If she was, then the cases are not comparable at all. I don't remember this incident with Sharon, so I don't know. The 'conspiracy theories' are very much centred upon the fact that Cheryl was asked to bow out - as she was obviously going to do, she has the spine strength of an amoeba - early on; so the Deadlock was completely ruled out. In any event, the point of MY post was that Cheryl did absolutely nothing to try and ensure fairness for Treyc. Fairness for her, given that she had only two votes to go home, would be access to the public vote results. That, as I said, was my point.

[Tom]

I agree with Vicky here, and we will only know the motives behind the change at the end of the series because:

if it turns out Treyc had the least vote, then all conspiracy theories dont really work,

if it turns out Katie had the least vote, then quite rightly the fix looks like a ploy to prevent going to deadlock and so save Katie, and also save Cheryl voting off Treyc which she would of been slaughtered for like after her judges house fiasco. This scenario would be hard to prove but insinuates that the judges are pre-warned of a deadlock outcome so as to leave the act the producers/show/Scowell want.

IMO all this has left a bad taste in the mouth and as someone has said in another thread, Big Brother tampered with the format and crashed and burned....X-factor should be careful as it's lost all credibility this series.

It loses "all" credibility every series when things like that happen, first and foremost its an entertainment show and this kind of stuff keeps the show afloat

Katie & Treyc were never going to win, they're just making up numbers and at this stage Treyc is far easily disposed of because shes had very little impact this series

[Jack_]

they still delibrately asked cheryl second so she couldnt take it to deadlock,and it makes a mockery of the show when last year rachel was easily better than lloyd on almost everything,yet he stayed because it was rachels 3rd time in the bottom 2 which is fair enough,but why get rid of rachel for that excuse but not katie who also forgot the words to the song?

Yes, but was Sharon asked last of the three? If she was, then the cases are not comparable at all. I don't remember this incident with Sharon, so I don't know. The 'conspiracy theories' are very much centred upon the fact that Cheryl was asked to bow out - as she was obviously going to do, she has the spine strength of an amoeba - early on; so the Deadlock was completely ruled out. In any event, the point of MY post was that Cheryl did absolutely nothing to try and ensure fairness for Treyc. Fairness for her, given that she had only two votes to go home, would be access to the public vote results. That, as I said, was my point.

No, she was asked first - hence why I compared the two. It was the first Live Show of Series 4 and it was the episode where she 'walked off', after refusing to vote when she had two of her acts in the Bottom Two. The same applies here, except Cheryl was asked second, not first. Not much difference.

I don't buy into the fact that the order they were asked in was 'fixed'. They were pushing for time, and probably felt it would be easiest to just go from right to left without thinking it through. I personally think it's irrelevant when a Judge is asked for their vote, when you're asked you give your vote - and if you refuse to vote then that's your decision. The Judge should not be in control of the voting order - and I can guarantee, that if for some bizzarre reason Cheryl had got her way, and they had gone back to her, all of her haters would be doing the rounds of internet forums continuing to claim she is 'favoured' and 'special' etc etc. She can't win.

And 'access to the public votes'? You really think that, upon request of Cheryl and other members of the public, they are going to give out access to the voting figures so far this series? It's never going to happen. Voting figures are released at the end of every series - so as not to effect the outcome of future votes during the series. That's not going to change for anyone, neither should it.

In short; she was required to cast her vote second, she refused - her vote was voided. Simple.

[patsylimerick]

No, she was asked first - hence why I compared the two. It was the first Live Show of Series 4 and it was the episode where she 'walked off', after refusing to vote when she had two of her acts in the Bottom Two. The same applies here, except Cheryl was asked second, not first. Not much difference.

I don't buy into the fact that the order they were asked in was 'fixed'. They were pushing for time, and probably felt it would be easiest to just go from right to left without thinking it through. I personally think it's irrelevant when a Judge is asked for their vote, when you're asked you give your vote - and if you refuse to vote then that's your decision. The Judge should not be in control of the voting order - and I can guarantee, that if for some bizzarre reason Cheryl had got her way, and they had gone back to her, all of her haters would be doing the rounds of internet forums continuing to claim she is 'favoured' and 'special' etc etc. She can't win.

And 'access to the public votes'? You really think that, upon request of Cheryl and other members of the public, they are going to give out access to the voting figures so far this series? It's never going to happen. Voting figures are released at the end of every series - so as not to effect the outcome of future votes during the series. That's not going to change for anyone, neither should it.

In short; she was required to cast her vote second, she refused - her vote was voided. Simple.

By access to the public vote I meant she should have been entitled to deadlock and the decision of the public - given that neither Danni nor Cheryl had voted her off. I, honestly, can't see how anyone could disagree with that argument. And Cheryl would never EVER have been in danger of being accused of favouring TreyC; believe me. She should have insisted after Louis' vote that it went to deadlock. It was the only fair thing to do. She's both spineless and dim.

[Mystic Mock]

No, she was asked first - hence why I compared the two. It was the first Live Show of Series 4 and it was the episode where she 'walked off', after refusing to vote when she had two of her acts in the Bottom Two. The same applies here, except Cheryl was asked second, not first. Not much difference.

I don't buy into the fact that the order they were asked in was 'fixed'. They were pushing for time, and probably felt it would be easiest to just go from right to left without thinking it through. I personally think it's irrelevant when a Judge is asked for their vote, when you're asked you give your vote - and if you refuse to vote then that's your decision. The Judge should not be in control of the voting order - and I can guarantee, that if for some bizzarre reason Cheryl had got her way, and they had gone back to her, all of her haters would be doing the rounds of internet forums continuing to claim she is 'favoured' and 'special' etc etc. She can't win.

And 'access to the public votes'? You really think that, upon request of Cheryl and other members of the public, they are going to give out access to the voting figures so far this series? It's never going to happen. Voting figures are released at the end of every series - so as not to effect the outcome of future votes during the series. That's not going to change for anyone, neither should it.

In short; she was required to cast her vote second, she refused - her vote was voided. Simple.

no because she said she wanted to vote last anyway which should have been the case in the first place.

[Jack_]

By access to the public vote I meant she should have been entitled to deadlock and the decision of the public - given that neither Danni nor Cheryl had voted her off. I, honestly, can't see how anyone could disagree with that argument. And Cheryl would never EVER have been in danger of being accused of favouring TreyC; believe me. She should have insisted after Louis' vote that it went to deadlock. It was the only fair thing to do. She's both spineless and dim.

For the last time [though I will probably have to say it another ten for some members on here] - once she had confirmed her refusal to vote, that was it. No going back. She had confirmed her refusal. Set in stone. It was from then on a 'majority vote'. That's the rules. She made her decision and there was no going back. I refer you to the earlier points I made regarding other television shows that take people's 'first answer'. The same applies here. She could not have 'insisted Deadlock' after Louis' vote as she had already refused to vote - rendering her vote void.

no because she said she wanted to vote last anyway which should have been the case in the first place.

No, she said that after she had confirmed to Dermot that she was refusing to vote. She had confirmed her decision, and then suddenly decided 'oh wait, nah go along the line and then I'll take it to Deadlock'. By which time it was too late - the decision of a 'majority vote' from the other three Judges was made. Like I said, Cheryl can't bend the rules [although some seem to think so, and would've complained had she got her own way anyway], neither can the other Judges. Neither do they decide which order to vote in. When they're asked they should vote, if they don't then that's their decision - but they lose their opportunity to vote and there is no going back.

That's the rules. How many more times do I need to repeat this?

[Zippy]

All this nonsense could have been avoided by Dermot leaving Cheryl until last. Maybe he was rushed for time and forgot that he was supposed to go to her last and just went along the line? They did seem pushed timewise. Maybe it was done for drama.

Whatever, no judge should be asked to send home one of their acts like that. It could be easily avoided by asking them last and therefore giving them the deadlock option. Which is exactly what Cheryl wanted to do.

But Dermot/producers suddenly decided to just let the other 3 judges decide. Thats not Cheryls fault at all. What, she is supposed to jump up and protest? Hardly. At that point I think she was just relieved that she didnt have to decide and accepted what the other judges chose.

Its the producers who are to blame here. In some ways theyve actually put Cheryl in a bad position. They didnt do this to Simon...quelle surprise.

[IheartBB]

Why should any judge have the casting vote? It shouldn't matter whether Cheryl voted second or last, her choice should still be the same. She was asked to vote off an act, she didn't, she loses her vote. Simple. Worried about hurting one of their feelings? Too bad. She knew what she signed up for. It's just business. It's not like she'll be in contact with either of them after the show is over.

[Mystic Mock]

Why should any judge have the casting vote? It shouldn't matter whether Cheryl voted second or last, her choice should still be the same. She was asked to vote off an act, she didn't, she loses her vote. Simple. Worried about hurting one of their feelings? Too bad. She knew what she signed up for. It's just business. It's not like she'll be in contact with either of them after the show is over.

it was still wrong that they asked her second when they knew she wanted to take it to deadlock.

[IheartBB]

it was still wrong that they asked her second when they knew she wanted to take it to deadlock.

So... you didn't actually read my post?

[Mystic Mock]

So... you didn't actually read my post?

i did.

[US Nacho]

I'm not sure if this was pointed out elsewhere or not, but today's X Factor AU ended up in just about the exact same scenario. One Judge had his two acts in the bottom two. The first judge votes for one group, the second votes for another and they go to the third judge who was mentoring both acts and he refuses to vote. They move to the 4th judge who then says "well I'm voting for Luke and Joel so now what are you going to do?" and then the presenter goes back to Judge #3 and says "I assume you're going to send this to deadlock then?" and he is given a 2nd chance to vote and does so.

I'm not one for these crazy conspiracy theories that often accompany shows like this, but especially in light of this, there really does seem like the producers are getting involved in order to keep Katie around for as long as possible. I don't know what else could explain it because they have never acted this way when similar situations have occurred.

[Zippy]

Why should any judge have the casting vote? It shouldn't matter whether Cheryl voted second or last, her choice should still be the same. She was asked to vote off an act, she didn't, she loses her vote. Simple. Worried about hurting one of their feelings? Too bad. She knew what she signed up for. It's just business. It's not like she'll be in contact with either of them after the show is over.

what cod.

yes she is worried about hurting one of their feelings. She did not sign up to cast the deciding vote at all. The structure is there for her to not have to...with deadlock. She did not have to choose between them if theyd simply asked her last. Not difficult to do and they manage to do it when its Simon in that position.

Cheryl has worked with and mentored these girls for months now and your post doesnt grasp that simple fact.

[Mystic Mock]

i would love every judge to refuse to vote next week,i wonder if people will defend them? no they wouldnt but still as i will keep saying,dermot shouldnt have gone to cheryl second.

[Zippy]

i would love every judge to refuse to vote next week,i wonder if people will defend them? no they wouldnt but still as i will keep saying,dermot shouldnt have gone to cheryl second.

actually I think they would all refuse in that position. Because they know that Dermot would then be forced to just move on to the next judge! Like he did last night.

If theyre asked at an unnecessary point then they should refuse to vote like Cheryl did. No judge should have to pick between their own acts like that.

[fruit_cake]

It was a tricky night all round for Dermot

[patsylimerick]

Anyone's position on this fiasco depends on what they believe happens backstage prior to the results being announced. I, personally, believe the judges know exactly what the results are and are told/decide what's going to happen next. It's a bloody pantomime, a poorly acted and increasingly tedious one at that. As to whose fault Sunday night's shenanigans were - all of them.

[Niamh.]

I'm not sure if this was pointed out elsewhere or not, but today's X Factor AU ended up in just about the exact same scenario. One Judge had his two acts in the bottom two. The first judge votes for one group, the second votes for another and they go to the third judge who was mentoring both acts and he refuses to vote. They move to the 4th judge who then says "well I'm voting for Luke and Joel so now what are you going to do?" and then the presenter goes back to Judge #3 and says "I assume you're going to send this to deadlock then?" and he is given a 2nd chance to vote and does so.

I'm not one for these crazy conspiracy theories that often accompany shows like this, but especially in light of this, there really does seem like the producers are getting involved in order to keep Katie around for as long as possible. I don't know what else could explain it because they have never acted this way when similar situations have occurred.

yes, this what you would expect to happen and has always done, it's a bit fishy to say the least

[robb]

Why should any judge have the casting vote? It shouldn't matter whether Cheryl voted second or last, her choice should still be the same. She was asked to vote off an act, she didn't, she loses her vote. Simple. Worried about hurting one of their feelings? Too bad. She knew what she signed up for. It's just business. It's not like she'll be in contact with either of them after the show is over.

I have a feeling that Cheryl thought the other 3 would just vote in favour of katie anyway.Simon already had. That would have meant she DIDN'T have to vote at the end. Her 'send it to deadlock' was presumptious anyway. How did she know she would have to? Anyway you could tell on ITV2 that she got what she wanted: Katie through, Treyc out.

[robb]

what cod.

yes she is worried about hurting one of their feelings. She did not sign up to cast the deciding vote at all. The structure is there for her to not have to...with deadlock. She did not have to choose between them if theyd simply asked her last. Not difficult to do and they manage to do it when its Simon in that position.

Cheryl has worked with and mentored these girls for months now and your post doesnt grasp that simple fact.

Pity she couldn't have decided, as Dannii did, who DESERVED to go through on the sing off. She would have earned far more respect for that, rather than her silly get out of jail tactic.

[IheartBB]

what cod.

yes she is worried about hurting one of their feelings. She did not sign up to cast the deciding vote at all. The structure is there for her to not have to...with deadlock. She did not have to choose between them if theyd simply asked her last. Not difficult to do and they manage to do it when its Simon in that position.

Cheryl has worked with and mentored these girls for months now and your post doesnt grasp that simple fact.

For the first three years of the show, there was no such thing as copout - sorry, deadlock. The three judges had the final say. What I was getting at in my post was that a judge's casting vote should not be swayed by the other judges or the crowd. I said in another thread that they should vote confidentially and have it come up on screen in front of them (ala Dancing on Ice or something).

You go ahead and think that Cheryl and her acts are all best buds if you wish. Just let me remind you of last week (or was it the week before) when she was stumped to embarrassing silence when Simon asked her to name Treyc's home town.

[Zippy]

Just let me remind you of last week (or was it the week before) when she was stumped to embarrassing silence when Simon asked her to name Treyc's home town.

Er, no she wasn't. She said Birmingham and added that she even went there herself to tell her she'd been chosen!

Just because she didnt answer in under 0.25 seconds doesnt somehow prove she doesnt care about TreyC!

Anyways, whatever. Cheryl was right not to choose between them and the producers(or Dermot) were wrong to ask her second. End of.

[Mystic Mock]

Er, no she wasn't. She said Birmingham and added that she even went there herself to tell her she'd been chosen!

Just because she didnt answer in under 0.25 seconds doesnt somehow prove she doesnt care about TreyC!

Anyways, whatever. Cheryl was right not to choose between them and the producers(or Dermot) were wrong to ask her second. End of.

actually treyc lives in tamworth so cheryl got it wrong.

[IheartBB]

Er, no she wasn't. She said Birmingham and added that she even went there herself to tell her she'd been chosen!

Just because she didnt answer in under 0.25 seconds doesnt somehow prove she doesnt care about TreyC!

Anyways, whatever. Cheryl was right not to choose between them and the producers(or Dermot) were wrong to ask her second. End of.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zjti6dV3Pjg

You think this is not embarrassing silence? :joker:

And seeing as though there is a very valid argument as to what order the judges should or should not be asked, it clearly is not the "end of" anything.