Joanna Yeates - 32 year old man arrested

[bmurphy71]

It's always struck me that her killer knew her. It wasnt a robbery and the killer must have known her routine very well. Strangulation is predominantly committed by men and is done to gain a sense of control. A very high proportion of strangulation victims know their killer. My initial response to the arrest of C.J. is that his eccentricities probably made him highly visable to the media and police, but I dont think he appears to fit the profile of her killer. I could be wrong of course!.

[Angus]

Also whoever killed Joanna must have known that her boyfriend was not there and must have called at the flat. There are no reports from the police of signs of a struggle in the flat as far as I'm aware. If she had gone out somewhere she would have taken her mobile, keys and coat etc surely? Therefore it has to have been a neighbour, friend or someone she knew well enough or felt comfortable enough to go off with impromptu, probably thinking she would only be gone a short time. The strangest thing is that she left her keys behind - maybe because the person she went off with has keys to her flat?

As far as I'm concerned the Landlord is still in the frame, and the fact he has been released on police bail clearly means they are not prepared at this stage to completely eliminate him. However, I hope they are also investigating her other neighbours, friends, relatives and acquaintances.

[InOne]

Reminds me of another case I saw a doc about, some girl went missing on new years eve. Went to go look after some puppies or something, didn't make it there.Turned out to be some guy who lived pretty near. They did a search of all the houses in the neighbourhood. They found her in is closet D: They instantly knew something was up when he couldn't find the key

[arista]

Do you think CJ
should be removed from your heading.


He is just a old perv.

[InOne]

When some more solid news comes up, nothing much else has happened yet

[Pyramid*]

Good to see the reporting slant on the newspapers front has ceased to label this man a pervert, having obsessions of death etc and that the witch hunt of an (as yet) innocent man appears to have ceased as far as papers are concerned.

Also good to see that the Guardian are reporting that CJ's lawyers have been in contact with at least one newspaper regarding their reporting of the matter.

Quotes from his aunt suggest tha he is looking to take legal action. Quite bloody right too.




Police and Yeates's boyfriend have expressed concern at some of the reporting of the case, particularly of the way Jefferies has been portrayed in mainstream media and on social networking websites.

Reardon said the "finger-pointing and character assassination" had been "shameful" and called for greater sensitivity. Last week the attorney general, Dominic Grieve, warned the media to be mindful of contempt of court laws.

It is understood that a lawyer for Jefferies has written to at least one newspaper criticising its reporting of the case.


http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2011/jan/02/joanna-yeates-police-safety-warning

The Sun quotes CJ's aunt.


His aunt Barbara Jefferies, 79, said: "Chris is fine now, but there's been enough damage done." Mrs Jefferies, of Wilmslow, Cheshire, added: "You will be hearing much more about this."

The bachelor is being represented by the Stokoe Partnership, a legal team with offices in London and Manchester.
A spokesman insisted his name had been "blackened".


http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/news/3327666/Joanna-Yeates-murder-suspect-Chris-Jefferies-Ill-fight-to-clear-name.html

[Pyramid*]

Do you think CJ
should be removed from your heading.


He is just a old perv.

What precisely in your mind, makes him a 'perv' Arista? On what basis are you judging him to allow you to suggest he is a pervert? :conf:

[Pyramid*]

Also whoever killed Joanna must have known that her boyfriend was not there and must have called at the flat. There are no reports from the police of signs of a struggle in the flat as far as I'm aware. If she had gone out somewhere she would have taken her mobile, keys and coat etc surely? Therefore it has to have been a neighbour, friend or someone she knew well enough or felt comfortable enough to go off with impromptu, probably thinking she would only be gone a short time. The strangest thing is that she left her keys behind - maybe because the person she went off with has keys to her flat?

As far as I'm concerned the Landlord is still in the frame, and the fact he has been released on police bail clearly means they are not prepared at this stage to completely eliminate him. However, I hope they are also investigating her other neighbours, friends, relatives and acquaintances.


I did very much think the same thing but remember Angus58 though, the missing pizza box. The pizza was found but not the external packaging - **sorry... pizza missing too... she could have eaten it!!** - the local council bin collections were made on the Monday, the search didn't begin until the day after - so by the time the police got round to it, it was too late to determine if she may have 'left the house' to dispose of the box...... and that's where either abduction or death took place. That would explain why these items remained in the house - and that is the one thing that appears to be 'throwing' people.

It could be that she did nothing more than simply take the empty box out to the bin - and met her killer there. It could have been a prowler, an opportunist, or a sexual deviant who may have overheard her in the pub beforehand, saying that Greg was leaving for the weekend, and they decided to act upon this informaton.

It could have been someone of the same nature, passing by when Greg's car was being given a jump start and realised he was leaving his girlfriend alone that night. It could be a number of things.

Recall the party goer in another street who heard screams just around 9pm.

[mrscolumbo]

Read on a blog that bf was still at the apartment trying to get his car started at 1900pm on the night of 17th.

[Angus]

I did very much think the same thing but remember Angus58 though, the missing pizza box. The pizza was found but not the external packaging - and the local council bin collections were made on the Monday, the search didn't begin until the day after - so by the time the police got round to it, it was too late to determine if she may have 'left the house' to dispose of the box...... and that's where either abduction or death took place. That would explain why these items remained in the house - and that is the one thing that appears to be 'throwing' people.

It could be that she did nothing more than simply take the empty box out to the bin - and met her killer there. It could have been a prowler, an opportunist, or a sexual deviant who may have overheard her in the pub beforehand, saying that Greg was leaving for the weekend, and they decided to act upon this informaton.

It could have been someone of the same nature, passing by when Greg's car was being given a jump start and realised he was leaving his girlfriend alone that night. It could be a number of things.

Recall the party goer in another street who heard screams just around 9pm.

I agree with all of the above and I also have another outside theory that she was followed home and attacked before she got home, and that the killer let himself into her flat with her belongings to create the "Mary Celeste" effect her boyfriend found that suggested she had been at home. Motive? To divert attention towards it being someone she knew. The killer could have found messages on her mobile indicating her boyfriend was away. It will be interesting to find out whether the police have found any unexplained dna evidence at her flat. We have still not been told whether she was sexually assaulted, or if any of her possession are missing.

As for the missing pizza box, I find it doubtful that she would bother to leave her flat to dispose of a single pizza box, since most people do have kitchen bins, and even if she had, i can't see her leaving her door open so she would have taken her keys.

All in all, the case is intriguing and I hope, for the sake of her parents they do find the killer, because if it were me, it would be a living hell to know that the person who killed my child had got away with it.

[Pyramid*]

Read on a blog that bf was still at the apartment trying to get his car started at 1900pm on the night of 17th.

No offence but that's been pretty much common knowledge since very early days.

[Pyramid*]

I agree with all of the above and I also have another outside theory that she was followed home and attacked before she got home, and that the killer let himself into her flat with her belongings to create the "Mary Celeste" effect her boyfriend found that suggested she had been at home. Motive? To divert attention towards it being someone she knew. The killer could have found messages on her mobile indicating her boyfriend was away. It will be interesting to find out whether the police have found any unexplained dna evidence at her flat. We have still not been told whether she was sexually assaulted, or if any of her possession are missing.

As for the missing pizza box, I find it doubtful that she would bother to leave her flat to dispose of a single pizza box, since most people do have kitchen bins, and even if she had, i can't see her leaving her door open so she would have taken her keys.

All in all, the case is intriguing and I hope, for the sake of her parents they do find the killer, because if it were me, it would be a living hell to know that the person who killed my child had got away with it.

The bin I have in my kitchen is only a small one - too small to hold a pizza box unless I ripped it into little pieces which would take far longer than me popping out and throwing it in the wheelie bin. I personally, nip out and chuck any large packaging like that straight into the bin - and I know many of my friends tend to do the same.

Why on earth would anyone take their keys / not leave their door oen when nipping out to put something in a bin? I don't, and I know none of my friends who would take keys, lock doors etc. We all literally open the door, leave door open, go out to bin a few steps away from door, dispose of item then come back into the house.

I'm not entirely sure about the killer looking through her phone to determine the boyfriend was away: at that stage, he'd already have been aware she was alone if he had access to her flat / her phone? If she was attacked before she got home, that doesn't explain the missing pizza *though I have to say: I think that's been nothing more than her having chucked it/and /or the wrapping in the bin, which was subsequently emptied.

It doesn't explain that possible sighting of her by CJ that evening. It doesn't explain the 'screams' (that may or may not have been Joanna) coming from the area her flat was in at 9pm that Friday evening.

I do agree it's intriguing. I'm not entirely convinced that it's a 'serial' killer either. I think it could something far less sinster - that all went very wrong. I don't think the killer went out to kill.... I think the intention has been far less than to kill, but something went wrong with whatever their intention was.

It is as you say - intriguing. Ghoulish I know, but intriguing.

[mrscolumbo]

Oh I am a bit behind the times thanks you for pointing it out Pyramid - no offence taken.

[mrscolumbo]

If the reports of bf still being in Bristol at or around 1945 hrs then there is an opportunity link.

[Angus]

Originally posted by mrscolumbo

"Why on earth would anyone take their keys / not leave their door oen when nipping out to put something in a bin? I don't, and I know none of my friends who would take keys, lock doors etc. We all literally open the door, leave door open, go out to bin a few steps away from door, dispose of item then come back into the house."

I live on the third floor of a block of flats and if I wanted to put anything in the bin I certainly wouldn't leave my front door open or unlocked while I was going down to ground level. I always close the door and take my keys.

As regards my outside theory - it is purely that and not one I have much faith in because it would require a fair few ifs and buts and suspensions of belief in terms of how an opportunist killer might behave. I still think that the killer is someone that Joanna knew fairly well.

If the BF was still in the area so late that evening, that doesn't let him off the hook either.
"

[Fetch The Bolt Cutters]

http://www.sickipedia.org/search/1/?q=joanna+yeates

:bored:

[Angus]

Originally posted by Pyramid

"Why on earth would anyone take their keys / not leave their door oen when nipping out to put something in a bin? I don't, and I know none of my friends who would take keys, lock doors etc. We all literally open the door, leave door open, go out to bin a few steps away from door, dispose of item then come back into the house."

I live on the third floor of a block of flats and if I wanted to put anything in the bin I certainly wouldn't leave my front door open or unlocked while I was going down to ground level. I always close the door and take my keys.

As regards my outside theory - it is purely that and not one I have much faith in because it would require a fair few ifs and buts and suspensions of belief in terms of how an opportunist killer might behave. I still think that the killer is someone that Joanna knew fairly well.

Hello this is not my posting![/QUOTE]

Lol, sorry, have amended the quote now.

[mrscolumbo]

angus58 - thank you for the amendment - already deleted my reply as it looked confusing:)

[Pyramid*]

I live on the third floor of a block of flats and if I wanted to put anything in the bin I certainly wouldn't leave my front door open or unlocked while I was going down to ground level. I always close the door and take my keys.

As regards my outside theory - it is purely that and not one I have much faith in because it would require a fair few ifs and buts and suspensions of belief in terms of how an opportunist killer might behave. I still think that the killer is someone that Joanna knew fairly well.

If the BF was still in the area so late that evening, that doesn't let him off the hook either.
"

LOL at the posts all going skew-wiff!! Nothing like confusion eh!:blush:

I understand you saying you would lock door given that you live on a 3rd floor, however Joanna and Greg lived in a basement flat - which isn't quite the same as living in 'higher' flats (if that makes any sense) - ground level is easily and conveniently reached - within a short distance of door. It was on that basis that I made my comments: in that the bins would not have been any real distance away - not enough to warrant taking keys, locking door etc.

ETA: Presumably Greg has a watertight alibi (receipts for filling stations etc) - but I have to say, I've 'voiced' my own thoughts on the convenience of him being away many posts ago........ but as I say, not much point as I would imagine family and partners would be the very first people to be considered, investigated and subsequently eliminated (rightly or wrong..... it's still very open).

[Pyramid*]

http://www.sickipedia.org/search/1/?q=joanna+yeates

:bored:

So boring you felt it necessary to include the link. :sleep:

[Fetch The Bolt Cutters]

So boring you felt it necessary to include the link. :sleep:

http://media.tumblr.com/tumblr_ld45vjT9E11qcvg69.gif

[mrscolumbo]

If this is an opportunist crime then forensic evidence would be in plentyful outside/inside the apartment as a struggle would be evident surely - which makes it pre meditated or a crime of passion - especially as the police consider no person to be at risk whilst the culprit remains at large.

[Pyramid*]

http://media.tumblr.com/tumblr_ld45vjT9E11qcvg69.gif

FGS Grow up. Clearly it's impossible to have any form of serious discussion on tibbs without this crap seeping in.

[Angus]

FGS Grow up. Clearly it's impossible to have any form of serious discussion on tibbs without this crap seeping in.

Clearly the crap dispenser is a graduate from the Frankie Boyle School of Comedy:rolleyes:

[mrscolumbo]

Pre meditated or crime of passion rules a stranger out - just to clarify my last post.

[Pyramid*]

If this is an opportunist crime then forensic evidence would be in plentyful outside/inside the apartment as a struggle would be evident surely - which makes it pre meditated or a crime of passion - especially as the police consider no person to be at risk whilst the culprit remains at large.


How do you know there was a struggle?

What would make any struggle 'evident' as you claim?

What 'makes' it pre-meditated?

What 'makes' it a crime of passion?

How do you know there would be plentyful forensic evidence outside?

What type of forensic evidence would you expect to be found given weather conditions, given that it was days later she was reported as missing? In an area that many would have access to - ie: friends, family, postman, ad hoc people delivering flyers etc, landlord, other neighbours, random prowlers?

Additionally, given that it appears to be at the current time, a 'one of' murder: the police are hardly going to create massive panic by saying, "There's a psychopathic killer on the loose, watch your every move".

I'm sorry, but given that you were offering up 'read on a blog about bf's car needing jumpstarted at 1900hrs' and then saying you weren't upto date : I find it a little odd in the extreme that you would be aware of so little of the story, but are able to offer up what you have in your post above.

[Pyramid*]

Clearly the crap dispenser is a graduate from the Frankie Boyle School of Comedy:rolleyes:

Absolutely!

[mrscolumbo]

Pyramid - didn't express there was a struggle in this case - but if it was someone lying in wait or just passing by and took the poortunity to pounce on Joanna as she put out the rubbish then a struggle would ensue leaving in its wake forensic evidence - my point was that lack of forensic evidence to suggest a stranger give raise to a motive of someone nearer home.

[Pyramid*]

Pyramid - didn't express there was a struggle in this case - but if it was someone lying in wait or just passing by and took the poortunity to pounce on Joanna as she put out the rubbish then a struggle would ensue leaving in its wake forensic evidence - my point was that lack of forensic evidence to suggest a stranger give raise to a motive of someone nearer home.

You appeared to dismiss the 'opportunist' angle, by way of your reasoning in respect of 'forensic evidence', 'struggle would be evident': which is why I asked what I did - and then you add your thoughts, "Which makes it pre-meditated or a crime of passion".

Which again, is why I asked what I did.

Out of interest, what would your replies to my other questions be?

[Iceman]

Holding a news conference at 3PM.

[Pyramid*]

Holding a news conference at 3PM.

Thanks for that Iceman! :blush:

[mrscolumbo]

Pyramid - lets take the malice aforthought could be someone who was resentful/held a grudge or anger these emotions would imply someone near to Joanna - crime of passion again could be resentful/grudge/anger only done spare of the moment without thought or consequence and again by someone very close to Joanna.

[Pyramid*]

Pyramid - lets take the malice aforthought could be someone who was resentful/held a grudge or anger these emotions would imply someone near to Joanna - crime of passion again could be resentful/grudge/anger only done spare of the moment without thought or consequence and again by someone very close to Joanna.

That doesn't really answer the things that I asked though in response to your post earlier though, does it? Not that it matters, it's hardly as though you are obliged to answer or reply to anything and clearly you're unwilling to do that - no harm done!

It could any manner of things: from the downright obscure and offbeat reason - to a random burglary that went horribly wrong - to the boyfriend bumping her off. Which led onto the points I raised to you, in respect of your dismissal of the 'opportunist' angle, I asked why (and in many ways) you appear to be dismissing that - in favour of 'Crime of passion / pre-meditated'.

Personally, I'm not convinced it was. If it was pre-meditated, the killer surely would have thought of a far better hiding place for the body.

[mrscolumbo]

Pyramid - IMHO the culprit is male and was known to Joanna therefore indicating one or other of my theories also strangulation was the cause of death therefore indicationg that it was someone Joanna was happy to allow into her personal space.

[Harry!]

BBC News are asking if anyone knows about the location of the Pizza and what she might of done with it.

[Pyramid*]

Pyramid - IMHO the culprit is male and was known to Joanna therefore indicating one or other of my theories also strangulation was the cause of death therefore indicationg that it was someone Joanna was happy to allow into her personal space.

Still no reply ref my many other questions...hay ho.

A male being statistically proven to be of the highest possibiities in any crime involving strangulation isn't really news breaking stuff really though. Statistically: given that she was strangled, the chances that the killer was a male are high.

Known to her? As much a possiblity as much as it may be a complete red herring - I did certainly have the initial thought at the beginning (and not only known, but a person VERY close to her), but now... mmmm.... not so sure at all.

****************************

News conference basically saying not a lot. Looks very much like the police have not a lot to be going on - I noted that it was stated by one of the reporters that CJ had been released on bail having been charged with NO crime. (ie: he is still being considered a suspect). Given what must be very scant info/evidence that the police have - I think it's pretty lame that he is still being labelled 'a suspect'.

Missing Pizza and wrapping - police 8/9 days into this are still unable to determine at this stage whether the pizza was eaten by Jo or not. :conf: Surely examining and determining the contents of a person's stomach can't be that time consuming....unless.... she did eat the pizza on Friday but didn't 'disappear' on the Friday - but disappeared after her body had digested and expelled the contents of her stomach, including said pizza.

Searching through 239tonnes of household rubbish - how many pizza boxes of this nature are purchased in this area? Presumably bar coding will allow them to determine if any boxes the found, allows the box to be deemed to be the one containing the pizza Joanna purchased?

Suddenly looking for a beige / light coloured 4x4. If so interested in this and thinking this may be linked to the crime: why is CJ still being considered - given that he does not have a 4 x 4 vehicle?

From where I am sitting: the police have absolutely nada. Or they are deliberately withholding info - as not a lot of this makes sense.

Curiouser and curiouser. :conf:

[Pyramid*]

BBC News are asking if anyone knows about the location of the Pizza and what she might of done with it.

I reckon she ate the pizza, flung the wrapping in the bin whilst it was cooking: which are now sitting in amongst that pile of 239 tonnes of rubbish that the police are sifting through.

I'm really 'missing' something re this pizza box not being available. Short of possible finger prints on it - there has been nothing mentioned of bodily fluids - what precisely are they hoping to find from it? Do they suspect the killer took a bite out of the box and that the 'bite impression' might match someone's dental record?

Something very strange that they are homing in on this so much - that they are not revealing.

[mrscolumbo]

Consider the police have made a complete and utter a**e of the investigation - the longer it goes on the colder the case becomes - shouldn't think for one moment the owner of the light coloured 4x4 seen in the area on the night of the 17th is likely to come forward - could well have been an innocent courting couple looking for a quiet place to park up - after the police handling of Mr Jefferies as a suspect and their desperation to nail somebody I suspect they have lost the confidence of the innocent public to come forward with any information especially if it puts them anywhere near the seen of the crime!

[mrscolumbo]

Consider this Pyramid if a certain persons fingerprints are on the pizza box who at the time of her purchasing the item claims was somewhere else then they have the culprit - that is why IMHO they are putting so much store on finding the packaging.

[Pyramid*]

Consider the police have made a complete and utter a**e of the investigation - the longer it goes on the colder the case becomes - shouldn't think for one moment the owner of the light coloured 4x4 seen in the area on the night of the 17th is likely to come forward - could well have been an innocent courting couple looking for a quiet place to park up - after the police handling of Mr Jefferies as a suspect and their desperation to nail somebody I suspect they have lost the confidence of the innocent public to come forward with any information especially if it puts them anywhere near the seen of the crime!

Given that I said something very similar yesterday : I totally agree on that point!


After the way CJ has been castigated up till this point - anyone going near the police even with the smallest piece of info after the way this has been handled so far, would quite seriously, have to have to be insane.



In absolute fairness: it's not necessarily been the police handling of the matter - they are quite at liberty to take a person into custody for questioning as long as they have reasonable cause to do so. That said, I'm not convinced that they did have as much 'reasonable cause' as they perhaps thought they did -but I'll mitigate that by stating that they must have had their 'reasons' - none which appear to have been enough, thus having to release the man without charge.

It was the media who created the problem as far as CJ is concerned, and in the interim, have most likely, damaged any chance of the public being as willing to be compliant in offering any possible assistance.

In all honestly: at this stage of the game, if it were me and I suddenly thought, "Oh hang on.... I remember when I drove past there in my nice 4 x 4, I saw this".......

[Pyramid*]

Consider this Pyramid if a certain persons fingerprints are on the pizza box who at the time of her purchasing the item claims was somewhere else then they have the culprit - that is why IMHO they are putting so much store on finding the packaging.

Really !!! LOL


who could have handled the pizza box ... oh I wonder..... *thinks for a split second*... lots of people!

At point of manufacture.

At point of being packed to store

At point of being unpacked at store.

At point of being placed in freezer at store

At point of another customer picking it up, then placing it back in freezer

At point of checkout assistant charging it on till

At point of Joanna touching it

At point of being emptied into bin lorry, wind could have caught it as bin emptied, bin man (not wearing gloves) could have picked it up and thrown in bin lorry....
yeah.....

Oh...and of course, the possibility of it being the killer.

You're not living up to your name much here really !!!

[mrscolumbo]

Fair comment Pyramid but if there are fingerprints that shouldn't be on the packaging and they belong to a 'suspect' bit hard for that 'suspect' to protest his innocence anymore - case closed.

[Pyramid*]

Fair comment Pyramid but if there are fingerprints that shouldn't be on the packaging and they belong to a 'suspect' bit hard for that 'suspect' to protest his innocence anymore - case closed.

This of course could be a possibility - but I guess it's the only thing that the police have on their only suspect - which at this point in time, still remains that they have nothing on him.

In response to your assumption earlier if a certain persons fingerprints are on the pizza box who at the time of her purchasing the item claims was somewhere else then they have the culprit - who is to say that Joanna's bin wasn't overflowing, CJ had been putting something in his own bin, noticed the overflowing bin of Joanna's, of which the pizza box was one of the things hanging over the edge, he lifts lid and pushes the box down to allow lid to close.

CJ's prints on a pizza box could have very plausible reason for it - and not beyond all comprehension either.

[Angus]

This of course could be a possibility - but I guess it's the only thing that the police have on their only suspect - which at this point in time, still remains that they have nothing on him.

In response to your assumption earlier - who is to say that Joanna's bin wasn't overflowing, CJ had been putting something in his own bin, noticed the overflowing bin of Joanna's, of which the pizza box was one of the things hanging over the edge, he lifts lid and pushes the box down to allow lid to close.

CJ's prints on a pizza box could have very plausible reason for it - and not beyond all comprehension either.

I really think the police are only focusing on the pizza box and the mysterious 4x4 in the absence of anything else to go on. It's amazing really that there is such a complete and utter lack of any hard evidence.

[Pyramid*]

I really think the police are only focusing on the pizza box and the mysterious 4x4 in the absence of anything else to go on. It's amazing really that there is such a complete and utter lack of any hard evidence.

The pizza box... unless there is something on Joanna's body that would indicate the need to find the box which the police have chosen not to make public for whatever reason - I'm mystified for all the reasons I've metioned earlier.

As for the 4x4. Given that's only pretty recent development (on the back of the 'vehicle being driven oddly and doing a 'u turn' a few days ago: I have to agree.

There seems to be great focus on DNA from the front door also: but not much is being mentioned - was it kicked in? Are there footprints on the door?

Was it a break-in/burglar who 'chibbed' there way in hence so much focus on the door? Did Joanna disturb them - is there blood on the box, does Jo have anything under fingernails to link to a killer? So many questions!!

I am beginning to think the police really have nothing tangible at all and are having to grasp at straws.

[InOne]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-bristol-12108338

So not sexually assaulted but not ruling out a sexual motive, hmmm.

[mrscolumbo]

Ah so the packaging - if it is ever found - could implicate an innocent person too - someone who was keeping the residents bin area clean and clear of rubbish like the good landlord Mr Jefferies would do.

[mrscolumbo]

No sexual assualt - however consensual intercourse may have taken place before Joanna's death - think that must rule out certain people.

[JobsForTheBoys]

The pizza box and the door will have vital pieces of the killers DNA on them.

The pizza box will have been disposed of for one reason only and thats because the killers DNA will have been on or inside the box. It will have been slightly harder to dispose of the front door in the same way as the pizza box and thats why the police have taken it away to be painstakenly scrutinised.

Yes there will be loads of fingerprints on it from delivery men and postmen etc. But what they are trying to find are fingerprints with pizza on them which can be matched to the pizza she bought. I think they can date fingerprints to within 6 hours.

One point to ponder on is that it seems highly likely she knew the killer to let him share her pizza because a random killer coming in off the street would not bother about sitting down and cooking or eating someones pizza after he has just killed somebody. And its unlikely she would have offered him a piece beforehand. So why would a stranger bother about taking a pizza box???

I have referred to the killer as a "he" because I dont think its a "she"

[mrscolumbo]

Well put Jobsfortheboys - I consider the packaging (inner) to hold vital dna as it would have only been handled by Joanna and the culprit - if the culprit swept the apartment clean as to leave no evidence as what had taken place on the evening of the 17th - probably not even the need for wearing marigolds etc to clean up - person must have been mighty relieved that the bins had been emptied on the Tuesday morning especially once the police had made a link with the timeline of the purchase of the pizza and Joanna's murder a couple of days later.

[Pyramid*]

Ah so the packaging - if it is ever found - could implicate an innocent person too - someone who was keeping the residents bin area clean and clear of rubbish like the good landlord Mr Jefferies would do.

yes.

The pizza box and the door will have vital pieces of the killers DNA on them.

The pizza box will have been disposed of for one reason only and thats because the killers DNA will have been on or inside the box. It will have been slightly harder to dispose of the front door in the same way as the pizza box and thats why the police have taken it away to be painstakenly scrutinised.

Yes there will be loads of fingerprints on it from delivery men and postmen etc. But what they are trying to find are fingerprints with pizza on them which can be matched to the pizza she bought. I think they can date fingerprints to within 6 hours.

One point to ponder on is that it seems highly likely she knew the killer to let him share her pizza because a random killer coming in off the street would not bother about sitting down and cooking or eating someones pizza after he has just killed somebody. And its unlikely she would have offered him a piece beforehand. So why would a stranger bother about taking a pizza box???

I have referred to the killer as a "he" because I dont think its a "she"

'The missing pizza box and your assumption that it has been disposed of because it holds vital DNA clues' - is precisely that. An assumption. It could have been disposed of by Joanna herself, innocently and into the bin outside. There is no 'one reason only' about it. It is however the only lame thing the police appear to have.

The front door is 'slightly harder to dispose of than a pizza box' (wtte). Feck me... no **** Sherlock !!:joker: Sorry.. but come on..... that type of comment just cannot be taken seriously.

They are trying to find prints that match prints with pizza on them and the type of pizza Jo bought? Now I would say that really sounds like a real pie in the sky idea but if some expert out there cares to explain, I'm open to consideration. I think I get what you mean but I really do think that's fairy tale stuff. (but hey, you could be right... I just happen to think it sounds too bizarre to be real).

The missing pizza box is a complete red herring imo. But we shall wait and see.


Well put Jobsfortheboys - I consider the packaging (inner) to hold vital dna as it would have only been handled by Joanna and the culprit - if the culprit swept the apartment clean as to leave no evidence as what had taken place on the evening of the 17th - probably no need for wearing marigolds etc to clean up - person must have been mighty relieved that the bins had been emptied on the Tuesday especially once the police had made a link with the timeline of the purchase of the pizza and Joanna's murder.

Well put my bum. You couldn't answer the question yourself but had to get someone else to try pick up the pieces mrscolumbo. I'll ask you again: what vital DNA do you think the inner packaging will hold apart from possible fingerprints? What DNA exactly?

As for the rest (no need for marigolds).

Every good killer keeps a fresh unused supply of Marigolds in their inner jacket pocket, didn't you know?

[Fetch The Bolt Cutters]

did mrscolumbo join tibb just to solve this mystery :shocked:

[mrscolumbo]

No Pyramid thats news to me about the marigolds lol - however as I said early if the (inner) packaging has fingerprints of someone who claim they were else where after the purchase then case closed.

[JobsForTheBoys]

Well put my bum. You couldn't answer the question yourself but had to get someone else to try pick up the pieces mrscolumbo. I'll ask you again: what vital DNA do you think the inner packaging will hold apart from possible fingerprints? What DNA exactly?

The killers DNA. Licking their fingers then grabbing another piece of pizza.

And another thing. I dont think she walked from the pub and around all those shops either.

[Pyramid*]

Oh.... one small point to consider.

Given external temperatures on the weekend in question: it's not beyond reasonable doubt that the killer was wearing gloves to keep their little handies warm..... and if so, could very well blow the fingerprint theories on boxes / doors / inner pizza wrappings etc right out of the window.

[mrscolumbo]

yeah I often cook and eat in my sheepskin mits lol.

[JobsForTheBoys]

Oh.... one small point to consider.

Given external temperatures on the weekend in question: it's not beyond reasonable doubt that the killer was wearing gloves to keep their little handies warm..... and if so, could very well blow the fingerprint theories on boxes / doors / inner pizza wrappings etc right out of the window.

Who eats pizza with gloves on?????????????:shocked:

[Zippy]

Bloody hell. Everybodies a detective!

Im sure the police and forensic scientists are two steps ahead of any of you lot.

[JobsForTheBoys]

yeah I often cook and eat in my sheepskin mits lol.

I think she's been on the pop.:joker:

[Pyramid*]

did mrscolumbo join tibb just to solve this mystery :shocked:


It would appear so. Not that so far, any great headway has been made. ;)


No Pyramid thats news to me about the marigolds lol - however as I said early if the (inner) packaging has fingerprints of someone who claim they were else where after the purchase then case closed.

Nope: you didnt say that. You've changed your slant on the story - previously you were discussing the box. ;)

The killers DNA. Licking their fingers then grabbing another piece of pizza.

I thought the killer didn't have the time nor inclination to cook and eat pizza??

Oh... you mean because she shared that same pizza. :blush: Then went out walkabout with the same person afterwards (bearing in mind that CJ said he saw what the thought to be Joanna and 2 others).

And another thing. I dont think she walked from the pub and around all those shops either.

I'm not entirely convinced that she walked all the way home from the pub/shops either though my mind tells me that if CJ was as nosey as he's been made out to be,that he'd have heard a car stopping to let her out, car doors being closed shut, see her walking down the path etc.....

[mrscolumbo]

Hang on jobsfortheboys hardly call Bollinger 'pop' - seriously though can't agree with your opinion that she wasn't on foot between shopping after leaving the pub - the route she took and the phone call to her best friend works out correct google earthed the direction she would have taken in cojunction with the timeline

[Pyramid*]

yeah I often cook and eat in my sheepskin mits lol.

mrscolumbo - you are now inferring that the killer cooked ate the pizza. My my, this is getting funnier and funnier!

Who eats pizza with gloves on?????????????:shocked:

You are assuming that the killer ate the pizza. (with or without gloves on.... yes, I'm kidding about the last part).


Bloody hell. Everybodies a detective!

Im sure the police and forensic scientists are two steps ahead of any of you lot.

Actually no, people on here are discussing the what, if, hows, whys - it's called discussion on a very topicial subject.

I'd say the police and forensic scientists (you don't have to be a scientist to be linked to forensics.... just thought I'd tip you the nod) have as much clue as any of us. Given that they are the experts yet are still not in a position to confirm even WHERE Joanna was killed (which intimates that after so many days, they have still not been able to determine if she was killed at her property - in or out of it), whether she had ate the pizza or not etc. So you might want to reassess your last statement there ! ;)

N

[Pyramid*]

I think she's been on the pop.:joker:

:hugesmile: cheeky bugger!

Fraid not. Back to work tomorrow and driving. Nae booze allowed. :bawling:

[JobsForTheBoys]

You are assuming that the killer ate the pizza. (with or without gloves on.... yes, I'm kidding about the last part).


Yes, why else would he dispose of the box.

[Pyramid*]

Yes, why else would he dispose of the box.

Who said he did?

Jo could have taken it out to the bin herself then the bins were emptied a few days later (before police realised) - she could have been doing precisely that having eaten the pizza herself - and that is where she met her killer - after she had put box in bin.

Feck... this is worse than Cluedo!!:hugesmile:

[mrscolumbo]

Pyramid - no it is not my obsevation that the pizza was eaten by Joanna and company - have not made any comment about who eat the pizza if indeed the pizza had been consumed - but if you care for an opnion I reckon the pet cat had munched on it cos it had either been left out on the side uncooked - taken into account that the poor animal had been left alone and unfed since 17th Dec. - ready for going in the oven - or it had been taken out of the oven put on the side cooked but before it could be consumed Joanna met her death - simple!

[Zippy]

So you might want to reassess your last statement there ! ;)

N

No, it needs no reassessment. Nothing you think up is gonna be new to them. Plus they have access to ALL the available info AND are probably learning more by the hour. So they certainly are two steps ahead of you. Sorry, they just are.

[JobsForTheBoys]

Who said he did?

Jo could have taken it out to the bin herself then the bins were emptied a few days later (before police realised) - she could have been doing precisely that having eaten the pizza herself - and that is where she met her killer - after she had put box in bin.

Feck... this is worse than Cluedo!!:hugesmile:

Hmmmmmm, I suppose so but what was the motive, and are you saying she was killed outside the flat?

[JobsForTheBoys]

Pyramid - no it is not my obsevation that the pizza was eaten by Joanna and company - have not made any comment about who eat the pizza if indeed the pizza had been consumed - but if you care for an opnion I reckon the pet cat had munched on it cos it had either been left out on the side uncooked - taken into account that the poor animal had been left alone and unfed since 17th Dec. - ready for going in the oven - or it had been taken out of the oven put on the side cooked but before it could be consumed Joanna met her death - simple!

So if the cat ate the pizza, what happened to the box????? Did it eat that as well?

[Pyramid*]

Pyramid - no it is not my obsevation that the pizza was eaten by Joanna and company - have not made any comment about who eat the pizza if indeed the pizza had been consumed - but if you care for an opnion I reckon the pet cat had munched on it cos it had either been left out on the side uncooked - taken into account that the poor animal had been left alone and unfed since 17th Dec. - ready for going in the oven - or it had been taken out of the oven put on the side cooked but before it could be consumed Joanna met her death - simple!

Ah.....it was the cat who dunnit. Is that where you're coming from? Starving from 2 days of no grub, it spied the soggy pizza, and scoffed the lot. When it realised that it might get into trouble, it grabbed the box and the inner wrapping, nipped out the catflat, jumped up and snuck the empty box in the bin, knowing the binmen were due. And they say cats aren't clever!! :hugesmile:

on a more serious note: I'd need to go check on this, but I am almost (almost) sure that no pizza was found? Can't be bothered going to check.




No, it needs no reassessment. Nothing you think up is gonna be new to them. Plus they have access to ALL the available info AND are probably learning more by the hour. So they certainly are two steps ahead of you. Sorry, they just are.
NOOOO !!!! :bawling: Say it's not true.... :bawling: Feck me, no flies on you eh!:rolleyes:

None of which alters the fact that they admitted in the Press Conf today that they still cannot determine where she was killed, time of death etc..... and indeed, are not commenting on whether they are looking for 'a killer' or 'killers'.

Not that any of that should prevent me or anyone else on this thread having a discussion on what we think may or may not have happened. I don't believe there is a law against partaking in discussing the possibilities in an unsolved murder case - which is all we are doing.

Keeps us all off the streets and being killers, so it's not all bad.

[mrscolumbo]

jobsfortheboys - no the packaging was removed by the culprit IMHO several days later ie between the timeline 17th-19th during a clean-up process!

[Pyramid*]

Hmmmmmm, I suppose so but what was the motive, and are you saying she was killed outside the flat?


I'm saying it's a possibilty - given that the party goer out having a smoke heard screams, the screams could have been connected - who knows!

So if the cat ate the pizza, what happened to the box????? Did it eat that as well?

lol.... beat me to it (see my last reply) Now don't be acting dumb here...you know that cats are fastidiously tidy - it was clearing up after itself and took it out to the bin itself, bin men came.... you know the rest.

[JobsForTheBoys]

jobsfortheboys - no the packaging was removed by the culprit IMHO several days later ie between the timeline 17th-19th during a clean-up process!

Why would the culprit get rid of the pizza box if he didnt have any pizza?????

[Pyramid*]

jobsfortheboys - no the packaging was removed by the culprit IMHO several days later ie between the timeline 17th-19th during a clean-up process!

Okay columbo. What happened to the pal of Jo's that was coming around on the Saturday to help Jo clean up the messy flat? (Actually...now I say that.... what indeed happened to that..... serious thought???) Did Jo cancel that arrangment? I can't actually recall reading / hearing anything about that. ?

[JobsForTheBoys]

lol.... beat me to it (see my last reply) Now don't be acting dumb here...you know that cats are fastidiously tidy - it was clearing up after itself and took it out to the bin itself, bin men came.... you know the rest.

I honestly dont think the pizza box went into the dustbin.

[Pyramid*]

Why would the culprit get rid of the pizza box if he didnt have any pizza?????

Hang about here... you were the one earlier on who was suggesting that he'd get rid of the pizza box because there would be finger prints on it (remember, bits of pizza fingerprints that I was finding hard to believe!):conf:

[JobsForTheBoys]

Okay columbo. What happened to the pal of Jo's that was coming around on the Saturday to help Jo clean up the messy flat? (Actually...now I say that.... what indeed happened to that..... serious thought???) Did Jo cancel that arrangment? I can't actually recall reading / hearing anything about that. ?

The police will be witholding a lot of information from the public.

[Pyramid*]

I honestly dont think the pizza box went into the dustbin.

I can confirm with absolute certainty that it most definately was not placed in that bin or indeed, any other bin, by the cat.

[JobsForTheBoys]

Hang about here... you were the one earlier on who was suggesting that he'd get rid of the pizza box because there would be finger prints on it (remember, bits of pizza fingerprints that I was finding hard to believe!):conf:

Yes, but if he never had any pizza why would he get rid of the box????????

Which means he must have had some.

Gimme a pint of what youve been drinking will ya.:joker:

[Pyramid*]

The police will be witholding a lot of information from the public.

If this person is not involved why not make mention of that .... they've done that with anyone else the think is not being considered for questioning.

Can you remember much being said about this person?

[JobsForTheBoys]

I can confirm with absolute certainty that it most definately was not placed in that bin or indeed, any other bin, by the cat.

I wonder if theyve checked the road (vergeside) to where she was found, or the quarry?

[JobsForTheBoys]

If this person is not involved why not make mention of that .... they've done that with anyone else the think is not being considered for questioning.

Can you remember much being said about this person?

Which person are we talking about here?

[mrscolumbo]

Well Pyramid what can I say - news to me that Joanna was expecting a friend to help clean apartment on the Saturday 18th haven't read that anywhere - which just adds to the mystery as to how the hell does a well loved friendly girl who doen't respond to calls get forgotten about or at the very least no friends/work colleagues concerned that she hasn't answered their calls - hmmm very suspicious if you ask me - especially bf calls.

[Pyramid*]

Yes, but if he never had any pizza why would he get rid of the box????????

Which means he must have had some.

Gimme a pint of what youve been drinking will ya.:joker:

nope. It means that the killer,the pizza and the box are unconnected - or rather, could be unconnected.

The police are clearly searching for this box as there may be (I'm willing to consider) fingerprints on it - but let's say the find the box, with fingerprints on it (that don't match CJ's) - the prints could belong to any Tom, Dick or Harry - and not the killer.

I think they are doing the box hunt as they still suspect CJ - and are pining hopes on his prints being on the box. If they find said box, and his prints aren't on it.....that's them really back to square one. But given that they appear to have so little of substance to be going on with, it's a long shot that they feel is worthwhilse persuing.

I personally don't think it is connected. I really don't.


Which person are we talking about here?

some person was to be going around to Joanna's on the Saturday to help clean the flat up - a friend of hers. Now I can't recall here much being mentioned about this friend - if they were male or female, if they arrived on the Saturday, if so, did they try to contact Jo, was the arrangment cancelled?

[Pyramid*]

Awwwwww I quite like her.:blush::hugesmile:

I quite like you too Jobs. :blush:

Well Pyramid what can I say - news to me that Joanna was expecting a friend to help clean apartment on the Saturday 18th haven't read that anywhere - which just adds to the mystery as to how the hell does a well loved friendly girl who doen't respond to calls get forgotten about or at the very least no friends/work colleagues concerned that she hasn't answered their calls - hmmm very suspicious if you ask me - especially bf calls.

yep, it was definately mentioned. Let me go have a wee mooch quickly - see if I can find something about it.

[Angus]

Well Pyramid what can I say - news to me that Joanna was expecting a friend to help clean apartment on the Saturday 18th haven't read that anywhere - which just adds to the mystery as to how the hell does a well loved friendly girl who doen't respond to calls get forgotten about or at the very least no friends/work colleagues concerned that she hasn't answered their calls - hmmm very suspicious if you ask me - especially bf calls.

It does seem odd that the BF in particular didn't try calling her between the evening of the 17th and the 19th when he returned home.

[JobsForTheBoys]

I think they are doing the box hunt as they still suspect CJ - and are pining hopes on his prints being on the box. If they find said box, and his prints aren't on it.....that's them really back to square one. But given that they appear to have so little of substance to be going on with, it's a long shot that they feel is worthwhilse persuing.

I think CJ was used as a scapegoat to appease the press and to lull the real killer into a false sense of security.

Also to make it look like they were doing something.

[mrscolumbo]

dear angus - apparently bf sent numerous calls and texts during the 17th - 19th Dec. which he got no replies from according to reports.

[Angus]

dear angus - apparently bf sent numerous calls and texts during the 17th - 19th Dec. which he got no replies from according to reports.

Well don't you think he would have raised the alarm immediately then?

[Pyramid*]

It does seem odd that the BF in particular didn't try calling her between the evening of the 17th and the 19th when he returned home.

I do too. I find it very odd. But hey, different folks, different strokes.

I think CJ was used as a scapegoat to appease the press and to lull the real killer into a false sense of security.

Also to make it look like they were doing something.

I do too.

Re: the friend of Jo's. I def recall reading / hearing it because I recall thinking that if a friend was coming round to help her clear up, that the flat must have been in some helluva state.

Still mooching - I did come across this though:-




Police said there were no signs of forced entry at the flat but Jo’s parents were convinced she had been abducted when they saw the state of the property. David said: “We knew what the flat was like. We know what she does and doesn’t do. “We were 100% convinced within 30 minutes of arriving she had been abducted.”


He said there were “other factors, other reasons that we’ve been asked by the police not to go into”, that left him convinced she had been snatched.



David added: “We had grave concerns based on what was in the flat. We knew she had not gone of her own volition. We came to the conclusion it was unlikely she would have been found alive.



“The state of the flat indicated she had been abducted. Jo and Greg were quite untidy and we knew she was planning on tidying up on Saturday.



“On top of that she did not respond to Greg’s texts that night and they were both devoted to each other.”








Last part is weird...... didnt either the mother or father say that it was not unususal for Jo not to respond to text messages? In fact, without hunting for it, I'm sure the wording that was reported was, "it was consistent" (ie; that she didn't respond to texts).

As for the what was 'in' the flat, and what the father said the police asked him not to go into:- the father has been pretty adamant all along that she was abducted (and then killed).

[Pyramid*]

Jo was reported missing after Greg, 27, returned to their flat on Sunday night following a weekend visiting his family in Sheffield.
Greg, who is also an architect, tried to contact Jo over the weekend but she failed to answer her phone and texts.
David said it was not unusual, adding: "It was consistent with what she was like."


From the Sun. http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/news/3317039/Familys-agony-over-missing-Jo-Yeates.html

so I'm unclear why at a later stage, the comment in my last post was made - as it's worded that her not responding was odd.

[mrscolumbo]

agree with jobsfortheboys Mr Jefferies was an easy target and his arrest released pressure on the police investigation - as they appear to have made no progress - however if a vital piece of evidence has been destroyed or gone forever into a land fill the real culprit will possibly remain at large for a very long time and an innocent man's character linked forever with the crime - shame on you avon & somerset police!

[JobsForTheBoys]

I do too. I find it very odd. But hey, different folks, different strokes.



I do too.

Re: the friend of Jo's. I def recall reading / hearing it because I recall thinking that if a friend was coming round to help her clear up, that the flat must have been in some helluva state.

Then can you obviously see her throwing a pizza box in the dustbin, especially after she's been out for a drink???

[babycakes]

Then can you obviously see her throwing a pizza box in the dustbin, especially after she's been out for a drink???

and not very tidy according to her parents. I think Pizza never made it home; it was dropped along the way perhaps ?

[Pyramid*]

Then can you obviously see her throwing a pizza box in the dustbin, especially after she's been out for a drink???

Yes..... a person can be untidy by means of having clothes lying around, paperwork, work related things, study thing - it doesn't mean there would allow bins to overflow etc. So yes, still possible. She / they might have been untidy buggars but they could have still have thrown rubbish away.

[JobsForTheBoys]

and not very tidy according to her parents. I think Pizza never made it home; it was dropped along the way perhaps ?

I think she got a lift home.

[Pyramid*]

and not very tidy according to her parents. I think Pizza never made it home; it was dropped along the way perhaps ?

It's a possibility! If she got a lift home as some are thinking - she could have accidentally left it in the car? If it was the killer who gave her a lift, they're hardly likely to let the police know, "Hey, I found your missing pizza and box".

There is something really weird about this whole thing (not just the pizza) the whole kittinkaboddle.

[JobsForTheBoys]

Yes..... a person can be untidy by means of having clothes lying around, paperwork, work related things, study thing - it doesn't mean there would allow bins to overflow etc. So yes, still possible. She / they might have been untidy buggars but they could have still have thrown rubbish away.

So they were only untidy with clothes and not food youre saying.:conf:

what categories do pizza boxes, toothpaste, carrier bags and cat litter come under?????? food or clothes???

[InOne]

Hmmm, it's weird that they found the reciept for the pizza in her house, yet the rest of it remains missing.

[Pyramid*]

So they were only untidy with clothes and not food youre saying.:conf:

what categories do pizza boxes, toothpaste, carrier bags and cat litter come under?????? food or clothes???

Yes, I'm saying it is entirely possible.

Because someone may be untidy - it doesn't automatically mean they will have overflowing rubbish all over the place.

The place could have been strewn with sketches, paintings, books, DVDs, CDs, clothing - it doesn't necessarily mean that they pile up rubbish.

[Pyramid*]

Hmmm, it's weird that they found the reciept for the pizza in her house, yet the rest of it remains missing.

Possibly because she ate it and chucked the box in the bin - she could have started clearing things up while it was cooking? Who knows?

[InOne]

Possibly because she ate it and chucked the box in the bin - she could have started clearing things up while it was cooking? Who knows?

Dunno, we'd have to know her personally to have a good idea. But we can assume the Pizza made it home, or at least it was in the house at one point.

[JobsForTheBoys]

Possibly because she ate it and chucked the box in the bin - she could have started clearing things up while it was cooking? Who knows?

So back to your theory that she was abducted outside her flat whilst dumping the pizza box.

Who got the pizza out of the oven???????

[mrscolumbo]

What I can't get my head around is the comment by the father - if it is correct - that after 30 minutes of being in the apartment - not forgetting this is a small one bed apartment - parents realised she had been abducted being familiar with her habits on tidyness etc. - was this because the apartment had been maticulous cleaned - not a trait of the daughter - why did it take 30 minutes and not 3 minutes after entering the apartment - unless their comment was 3 minutes and was misrepresented in the press.

[Pyramid*]

What I can't get my head around is the comment by the father - if it is correct - that after 30 minutes of being in the apartment - not forgetting this is a small one bed apartment - parents realised she had been abducted being familiar with her habits on tidyness etc. - was this because the apartment had been maticulous cleaned - not a trait of the daughter - why did it take 30 minutes and not 3 minutes after entering the apartment - unless their comment was 3 minutes and was misrepresented in the press.

there are too many 'weird things' with this whole thing.

A couple that the father says were devoted: were so devoted that she didn't go home with Greg when he was to travel to visit relatives and be gone for the weekend. Bad weather and he's travelling away -so devoted that she says cheerio and heads to the pub, leaving him to head home, pack up and head off on his own? Most couples I know - they'd have gone home together, one seeing the other one off.

He tries to contact her by calls and texts for 2 full days - gets nothing and doesn't think to call the parents/friends etc to ask "Hey, cant get hold of Jo, is she ok?"

Having not been able to get hold of her - upon his arrival, it's obvious from cat / cat litter box that she's not been around - yet it's 4 hours before he reports this.

Father says that Jo not responding to texts/calls was consistent with the way she was - then another comment is made that Greg had been trying to call her he says,“On top of that she did not respond to Greg’s texts that night and they were both devoted to each other.” - which has an inclination to the contrary to her not answering texts.

The father saying being so sure that she had been abducted due to the state the flat was in (as mscolumbo mentions - why 30minutes for it to dawn on the father? ) and what was in the flat? What WAS in the flat that the police want to keep away from the public.

The amount of importance being placed on this missing pizza box etc.

The father's comment of "Welcome Home" (or something incredibly similar) when she was found dead.

There are just too many things so not right with all of it. None of it makes sense. :conf:

[Pyramid*]

So back to your theory that she was abducted outside her flat whilst dumping the pizza box.

Who got the pizza out of the oven???????

for the 15millionth time... she ate the bloody pizza !!!!! PMSL!!

If I knew the answer unequivically, I'd be £10k richer!! I'm not saying she was abducted from outside the flat - I'm saying it is one of many possibilies.

[mrscolumbo]

well said pyramid - who the hell would say after seeing/hearing that a body of their loved one had been found in such tragic circumstances 'welcome home' - if it was my daughter I would be baying for the culprits blood - not exchanging such pleasentries on the discovery!

[Pyramid*]

well said pyramid - who the hell would say after seeing/hearing that a body of their loved one had been found in such tragic circumstances 'welcome home' - if it was my daughter I would be baying for the culprits blood - not exchanging such pleasentries on the discovery!

I totally understand that there are people who are able to remain completely calm, serene etc in such hellish and tragic circumstances - I know the shock factor may have had something to do with it - but that still didn't sound right.

Again, it's only a figure of speech and nothing really can be read into it, but at the stage where she was still considered 'abducted', prior to her body being found, the father used the past tense, "She had so much life....." I know that could simply be nothing more than him saying what his head most likely knew.

Same as you say, with him being so certain that she'd been abducted from the onset.

So many things just don't tie in (obviously since the public aren't aware of the 'full picture' and aren't privvy to all that the police know).

It makes me think though that perhaps the police need to release some more information? Must be a hell of a position for those investigating all the same.

[icemaiden]

I agree with who ever said the pizza was too big for one woman to eat!

could she not have had something to eat at the pub? most do food these days.

Did someone asked her to buy them a pizza?

Or, did she put the pizza in the freezer for when BF got back? did the police look in the freezer?

...and she spent 2 hours drinking with friends, why did she then buy 2 bottles of cider on the way home?

In all the photos of her she is drinking what looks like wine. Did she normally drink cider?

and also how easy is it to take a body out of a flat without anyone noticing? No matter what time of the day or night I go outside my door there is someone, either getting in/out of a car, Looking out their window, a car turning round in the road etc. Someone would see something.

[Pyramid*]

I agree with who ever said the pizza was too big for one woman to eat!

could she not have had something to eat at the pub? most do food these days.

Did someone asked her to buy them a pizza?

Or, did she put the pizza in the freezer for when BF got back? did the police look in the freezer?

...and she spent 2 hours drinking with friends, why did she then buy 2 bottles of cider on the way home?

In all the photos of her she is drinking what looks like wine. Did she normally drink cider?

and also how easy is it to take a body out of a flat without anyone noticing? No matter what time of the day or night I go outside my door there is someone, either getting in/out of a car, Looking out their window, a car turning round in the road etc. Someone would see something.

I often buy a pizza - and know that I will never eat all of it myself - either it have it later or throw the remainder out. Same with Chinese, Indian take aways etc.

I'd imagine that the police would have checked the freezer but hey: sometimes the very obvious is overlooked.

good point about the wine vs the cider all the same.

Agree with your comments about trying to move a body in a residential area.

it is all too bizarre.

[mrscolumbo]

Pyramid I am with you on this one - if the police hadn't been so tight lipped at the onset but revealed more crucial info they probably would be nearer getting a conviction then currently stumbling around in the dark - a poster likened them to the keystone cops - I agree with one exception - the keystone cops are fictional and therefore no accountability - avon & somerset cops have accountability but are acting like clowns.

[Pyramid*]

Pyramid I am with you on this one - if the police hadn't been so tight lipped at the onset but revealed more crucial info they probably would be nearer getting a conviction then currently stumbling around in the dark - a poster likened them to the keystone cops - I agree with one exception - the keystone cops are fictional and therefore no accountability - avon & somerset have accountability but are acting like clowns.


I shouldn't laugh as I'm pretty sure they have a damned hard job - but that amused me. :hugesmile:

[Kazanne]

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2010/12/30/article-1342794-0C9C5D46000005DC-197_306x405.jpg
Police quiz 'nutty professor' with a blue rinse , when younger

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1342794/Joanna-Yeates-murder-Flat-landlord-Chris-Jefferies-searched-bags-evidence-removed.html#ixzz19grsAa5A

I had to do a double take on this 'guy' when he was first shown,I couldn't make out if it was a manly woman or an effeminate man,very strange looking person.

[Angus]

Now the police are saying they believe that Joanna was killed by more than one person!
Anyone else get the feeling they really don't have a single clue?

[InOne]

Just heard a news beat. May or may not have been killed by more than one person (But they're not making assumptions) They're pretty sure she got home safely, but they don't know when or where she was killed. They are still going on about the pizza box that has vanished. Also they're hoping the nice man driving the 4x4 will come forward.

Ergo - They're clueless

[mrscolumbo]

Fat chance of the police getting the driver of the 4x4 to come forward - I reckon the time of night the car was spotted it would have been closing time at the pubs a courting couple after a drink looking for a private quiet place to say goodnight to each other before returning home quite innocently - think police are barking up the wrong tree with this one!

[mrscolumbo]

IMHO avon & somerset constabulary have lost credability with the general public in this case - the over zealous way they arrested Mr Jefferies on no evidence will make people wary of coming forward with any information especially if it puts them at either locations on or around the time of Joanna's death.

[JobsForTheBoys]

IMHO avon & somerset constabulary have lost credability with the general public in this case - the over zealous way they arrested Mr Jefferies on no evidence will make people wary of coming forward with any information especially if it puts them at either locations on or around the time of Joanna's death.

They seem to be wasting their time doing stupid things.

FFS they have even checked the landlords gym that he was a member of to ask them how fit he is (to see if he was capable of carrying out the murder)

Someone seriously needs to give them a good kick up the backside.

[InOne]

Apparently they're lauching an appeal on facebook. What is the world coming to lol

[arista]

Apparently they're lauching an appeal on facebook. What is the world coming to lol


The Police want those that will not Phone Them
to gop onto the Facebook page to post

[mrscolumbo]

Apparently they're lauching an appeal on facebook. What is the world coming to lol

Oh dear I expect they'll get a few post they didn't reckon on there - still desperate times call for desperate measures!

[Angus]

Apparently they're lauching an appeal on facebook. What is the world coming to lol

Oh dear I expect they'll get a few post they didn't reckon on there - still desperate times call for desperate measures!

Also massively open to abuse for anyone wanting to cause mischief or implicate people they hate, or just generally wanting to waste police time!

[mrscolumbo]

Hi angus my posting is in black - the blue post is a quote of inone - sorry for the confusion:)

[Angus]

Hi angus my posting is in black - the blue post is a quote of inone - sorry for the confusion:)

Lol, it's okay, I did realise that but I was just following on from your comment!:blush:

[Pyramid*]

Apparently they're lauching an appeal on facebook. What is the world coming to lol

WHAT!!!! Christ, that's laughable.

So they killer will be able to sit watching all that's being posted - giving them the heads up if someone posts something that they might be able to sort out before the police get them them - only one example that springs to my tired mind of how such a campaign could work to the killer's benefit, more than the police.

What a joke, it really is.

They really don't appear to have much to go on.

Has anything more been revealed in respect of CJ taking any legal action ? (just in and not had time to read papers yet).

[mrscolumbo]

IMHO A & S police are really getting desperate asking for info. on facebook - imagine the kind of responses they will get - nothing in my opinion will be of any use except to the police profilers - who will no doubt be trawling through the thousands of posts to try and spot the killer!

[Pyramid*]

Also massively open to abuse for anyone wanting to cause mischief or implicate people they hate, or just generally wanting to waste police time!

So much truth in this - can you imagine the people who willl post all sorts for a laugh, hoping to lead the police on wild goose chases. *Shakes head in disbelief*

[Pyramid*]

IMHO A & S police are really getting desperate asking for info. on facebook - imagine the kind of responses they will get - nothing in my opinion will be of any use except to the police profilers - who will no doubt be trawling through the thousands of posts to try and spot the killer!

Yep, and trying to spot a 'potential suspect' trying to put them off the scent, chasing IP addresses, tracking the person down, arresting them and reacting the whole CJ scenario again!

[Callum]

Who reckons this murder will remain unsolved for years? I'm starting to

[Pyramid*]

Who reckons this murder will remain unsolved for years? I'm starting to

it is beginning to look very much like that.

guess there's been no DNA test results come back so far to irrefutibly link CJ then eh!

[mrscolumbo]

Yep, and trying to spot a 'potential suspect' trying to put them off the scent, chasing IP addresses, tracking the person down, arresting them and reacting the whole CJ scenario again!

Pyramid got it in one - oh well takes the heat of DI Jones incompetant investigations sofar - why don't the police just come out with what they know would save a lot of specualtion - instead of doing things a**e about face - hope heads roll over this investigation I think Mr Jones can forget the OBE and look forward to a very early retirement!

[Pyramid*]

Pyramid got it in one - oh well takes the heat of DI Jones incompetant investigations sofar - why don't the police just come out with what they know would save a lot of specualtion - instead of doing things a**e about face - hope heads roll over this investigation I think Mr Jones can forget the OBE and look forward to a very early retirement!

Aye, it's not looking too good eh!

On a completely different sidenote ....... do you realise that this thread has received the 4th highest amount of views for all discussions in the Serious Debates section - considering the thread has been only on the go for about 9 days, that's a fair amount of views given the 'low count' of active posters. It's definately a topic people are reading, if they aren't posting on it.

[mrscolumbo]

Aye, it's not looking too good eh!

On a completely different sidenote ....... do you realise that this thread has received the 4th highest amount of views for all discussions in the Serious Debates section - considering the thread has been only on the go for about 9 days, that's a fair amount of views given the 'low count' of active posters. It's definately a topic people are reading, if they aren't posting on it.

Oh interesting I imagine 70 of these are the A & S police who are active in the investigations - however if they had 70 brain cells between them on looking at this thread they perhaps could have the real culprit in custody!

[JobsForTheBoys]

DEFENCE SOLICITOR......And where is the evidence that my client is the murderer???

DCI BLOGGS......We were told about it on Facebook and it must be right because they never ended the message with lol lol lol:conf::joker:

[Pyramid*]

Oh interesting I imagine 70 of these are the A & S police who are active in the investigations - however if they had 70 brain cells between them on looking at this thread they perhaps could have the real culprit in custody!

I hear the cat is considering setting up it's own "I am innocent" facebook account.

Sorry..... shouldn't really be taking the mickey..... but no wonder, I still can't quite believe they think it's a good idea. I'm astounded.

[mrscolumbo]

DEFENCE SOLICITOR......And where is the evidence that my client is the murderer???

DCI BLOGGS......We were told about it on Facebook and it must be right because they never ended the message with lol lol lol:conf::joker:

yeah sounds plausible considering we are dealing with clowns in police uniforms.

[mrscolumbo]

I hear the cat is considering setting up it's own "I am innocent" facebook account.

Sorry..... shouldn't really be taking the mickey..... but no wonder, I still can't quite believe they think it's a good idea. I'm astounded.

Poor cat the only witness to this tragedy!

[mrscolumbo]

Maybe Tom Hanks could be brought in along with sidekick Hooch II to solve this mystery and get the cat off the hook for eating the pizza including all packaging! :joker:

[Pyramid*]

Poor cat the only witness to this tragedy!

*ponders if the next step from the police is contacting Dr Dolittle*

catching up on newspapers and this I found interesting:-

But Mr Jones acknowledged for the first time that the murderer might have broken into her £200,000 basement flat in the affluent Clifton area, despite previous police claims that there were no signs of forced access.


Something many of us have been saying for some time now - that it could have been a burglar, or a 'random'. A killing that in fact wasn't actually planned - but a burglary gone horribly wrong.

It really does appear that the police are as baffled as the rest of us from the way they are changing their minds - from knowing her killer, to not knowing, from it being a killer, to possibly 'killers'. They are ruling out nothing because they appear to have nothing.

I'd still love to know what was 'in' the flat that made them think that she had been abducted....... they're still keeping that snippet very close to their chests.

[InOne]

Facebook could also open the gate for many Wearside Jack types. But obviously none would be taken seriously as that. 30 years since the Yorkshire Ripper was arrested today :shocked:

[Pyramid*]

Facebook could also open the gate for many Wearside Jack types. But obviously none would be taken seriously as that. 30 years since the Yorkshire Ripper was arrested today :shocked:
yep, totally agree... happy to lead the police down a merry path.

I caught a little bit of a documentary on tv the other night about JTR - didn't realise it was coming up to 30 years.... god that's flown by quickly.

[InOne]

If nothing happens in 2 weeks the media will get bored and we'll all forget about it.

[Pyramid*]

If nothing happens in 2 weeks the media will get bored and we'll all forget about it.


Fickle media .... !!! ;)

But you are right on that one - already it's dropping from the main headlines.

[InOne]

Fickle media .... !!! ;)

But you are right on that one - already it's dropping from the main headlines.

Yep, reports are getting smaller and smaller, clutching on straws at what to say. So it's either a really smart, or really lucky killer

[mrscolumbo]

*ponders if the next step from the police is contacting Dr Dolittle*

catching up on newspapers and this I found interesting:-



Something many of us have been saying for some time now - that it could have been a burglar, or a 'random'. A killing that in fact wasn't actually planned - but a burglary gone horribly wrong.

It really does appear that the police are as baffled as the rest of us from the way they are changing their minds - from knowing her killer, to not knowing, from it being a killer, to possibly 'killers'. They are ruling out nothing because they appear to have nothing.

I'd still love to know what was 'in' the flat that made them think that she had been abducted....... they're still keeping that snippet very close to their chests.

The flat shared by joanna & reardon holds all the keys - maybe reardon timeline of his exact whereabouts easy to prove as he is on a motorway in bad weather delays getting to destination on estimate time limit delays by 1,2 or maybe 3 hrs!

[Pyramid*]

Yep, reports are getting smaller and smaller, clutching on straws at what to say. So it's either a really smart, or really lucky killer

A big part of me favours the latter...... it's where her body was dumped that's throwing me off the 'well thought out part' - but hey: that could well be where the 'smart' killer part kicks in. Certainly, whoever is responsible isn't making it easy for the cops.

[Pyramid*]

The flat shared by joanna & reardon holds all the keys - maybe reardon timeline of his exact whereabouts easy to prove as he is on a motorway in bad weather delays getting to destination on estimate time limit delays by 1,2 or maybe 3 hrs!


There hasn't been much put forth in the way of stating his alibi etc, mind you, if the police are of the opinion he isn't a suspect, they must have their reasons I guess. (just that we don't know what they are, that makes it all the more 'alluring'!).

[InOne]

A big part of me favours the latter...... it's where her body was dumped that's throwing me off the 'well thought out part' - but hey: that could well be where the 'smart' killer part kicks in. Certainly, whoever is responsible isn't making it easy for the cops.

Well definitely a cold blooded killer. So as long as they're half assured they're in the clear (partly by what the police are letting out, which is nothing) They'll just get on with their routine and slip back into society.

[mrscolumbo]

Yep, reports are getting smaller and smaller, clutching on straws at what to say. So it's either a really smart, or really lucky killer

Its a callous killer IMHO who has thought out the consequences of what he has done - and by all accounts may have got away with it!

[InOne]

Maybe it's Fred and Rose West part 2 :shocked:

[Pyramid*]

Well definitely a cold blooded killer. So as long as they're half assured they're in the clear (partly by what the police are letting out, which is nothing) They'll just get on with their routine and slip back into society.

Its a callous killer IMHO who has thought out the consequences of what he has done - and by all accounts may have got away with it!

The thing is: the longer it takes, any leads the police may have could go cold. The killer could be hundreds of miles away by now with very little chance of being caught.

Apart from the awful situation for the family - and of course, for those living in the area, but the mystery surrounding it is intriguing all the same - and yes, I realise some might view that as warped to say the least.

[mrscolumbo]

IMHO its slowly, slowy catch a monkey with the facebook - we know reardon is/was quite prolific on the social network sites - maybe he wasn't so devoted to Joanna as everyone thinks - facebook along with other sites may well reveal another side to this devoted partner of Joanna!

[icemaiden]

The answer lies in where Joanna was for the eight days she was missing.

Local people, who used the laneway where she was found, said there was no way they could has missed seeing her body.

So somebody was hiding her either dead or alive for those eight days.

How do people who kill someone live with themselves - probably just carrying on as normal.

[mrscolumbo]

The answer lies in where Joanna was for the eight days she was missing.

Local people, who used the laneway where she was found, said there was no way they could has missed seeing her body.

So somebody was hiding her either dead or alive for those eight days.

How do people who kill someone live with themselves - probably just carrying on as normal.

Joanna probably met her death on the 17th Dec.and body disposed of between the evening of the 17-19 - Joanna was probably dumped whilst snow was falling - the culprit was aware that snowfalll in that area was going to happen about 11pmish perfect conditions for dumping a body especially if the forcast was for between 4-6 inches of snowfall - only person who would consider adverse weather conditions ideal for concealing a crime would be someone who has for days had an eye on the road conditions before setting off on a longish journey!

[mrscolumbo]

Joanna's cat IMHO is the only witness to what took place that fateful evening of the 17th - I believe Joanna was probably killed in the apartment by someone who knew her well enough to gain access to her inner space allowing strangulation to take place - this must be someone very intimate with Joanna - also who is taking care of the Joanna's cat - bet it's not bf or his family!

[arista]

http://news.sky.com/sky-news/content/StaticFile/jpg/2011/Jan/Week1/15879989.jpg

tomorrows mirror

[Shasown]

Who is to say she was murdered in or even near her flat.

Supposing she brought the cider and pizza in order to go to someones else house or flat for a bit of a session.

She goes home gets showered and changed, while doing so empties her purse or pockets and in amongst that stuff is the receipt for the pizza, after getting changed she then takes the cider and the pizza round to the party location.

She may not even have taken the pizza to her flat having already dropped it off at the other location.

Incidentally, the barcode on the pizza box will simply tell plod that the pizza was priced at and made by.... Its the batch/lot numbering with the best before date etc on the box that will indicate the box came from the same lots that she may have bought one of.

[Pyramid*]

Who is to say she was murdered in or even near her flat.

Supposing she brought the cider and pizza in order to go to someones else house or flat for a bit of a session.

She goes home gets showered and changed, while doing so empties her purse or pockets and in amongst that stuff is the receipt for the pizza, after getting changed she then takes the cider and the pizza round to the party location.

She may not even have taken the pizza to her flat having already dropped it off at the other location.

Incidentally, the barcode on the pizza box will simply tell plod that the pizza was priced at and made by.... Its the batch/lot numbering with the best before date etc on the box that will indicate the box came from the same lots that she may have bought one of.

The cider bottles (I believe) were found in the flat. One having been half drank, one being unopened.

[JobsForTheBoys]

http://news.sky.com/sky-news/content/StaticFile/jpg/2011/Jan/Week1/15879989.jpg

tomorrows mirror

The police have said the picture quality is so poor that they cant be sure its her.

What the newspapers will do to sell papers eh!

And even if it is her I guess theres no chance of those two (probably innocent) people coming forward in case they get the same treatment as the landlord.

[Angus]

The fact that the police don't have a single solid lead makes me believe that the killer(s) has done this before, such is his expertise in not only removing incriminating evidence, and my suspicion is that he may even have deliberately left misleading clues.

On the other hand, the news reports say "another person's DNA was on Joanna's body" so presumably they have eliminated her immediate family and friends etc, and if the DNA is not in their data banks they are either dealing with an opportunist random killer, or an extremely clever serial one.

[JobsForTheBoys]

On the other hand, the news reports say "another person's DNA was on Joanna's body" so presumably they have eliminated her immediate family and friends etc, and if the DNA is not in their data banks they are either dealing with an opportunist random killer, or an extremely clever serial one.

But she had just been to a works Christmas drink at the pub.

If I had been to a works Xmas drink I would probably have loads of peoples DNA on my body from xmas kisses, hugs etc.

[Angus]

But she had just been to a works Christmas drink at the pub.

If I had been to a works Xmas drink I would probably have loads of peoples DNA on my body from xmas kisses, hugs etc.

Then surely the police would, by now, have ELIMINATED those people from their enquiries since they are talking about a single person's DNA on her body which remains unexplained.

[InOne]

http://news.sky.com/sky-news/content/StaticFile/jpg/2011/Jan/Week1/15879989.jpg

tomorrows mirror

Suprised that even made front page

[lostalex]

There seems to be basically no real evidence yet. I havn't heard any compelling evdence yet, just a bunch of tabloids talking about a "creepy old guy" landlord.... but arn't all old landlords a bit creepy?


I'm still not convinced anyone is on the right trail yet. Very mysterious.

Finding out about the death of your daughter on Xmas day though, that is truly horrible. Can't help but only think about the family at this time. :(

It's starting to have the feel of a maddy mccann story though, another one of these lot of tabloid speculation and press interest, but no real leads. I hope not for the families sake, but it does seem to be going that way.

[mrscolumbo]

Well its appearing more likely that Joanna met her end in the apartment and the sock slipped of her foot as the killer disposed of the body - doubt Joanna would have allowed stranger(s) into her apartment - and if so surely there would have been some kind of struggle I also consider this to be the case if it were friend(s) or acquaintance - I think the police ought to focus more on the in-laws then the out-laws.

[Fronn]

I think she was probably killed in the flat. Either someone was waiting for her having let themselves in with a key or she let them in. If she had a door chain surely she'd have put that on? I'd be looking at keycutters to see if another key had been made (possibly by Jo). Either way she must have been moved to the lane in a vehicle - it seems impossible that fibres from the car's interior weren't found on her clothing? I had faith in the police to begin with, now I'm not so sure.

[mrscolumbo]

Apparently A & S police have banned ITN news from their conference because of the critical reporting of their investigations sofar - baby throwing it's rattle out of the pram springs to mind lol.

[icemaiden]

I don't go with the theory that someone let themselves into the flat. Because then the only suspect would be the LL and I am not sure I believe it's him anymore.

[Z]

I've not really followed this story, but from what I gather people are mystified as to how someone killed her and moved her body elsewhere/kidnapped her and moved her elsewhere, then killed her and dumped her, all without anybody seeing... I live in a residential area but don't know any of my neighbours both at home and in my flat in another city - a combination of luck and the cover of darkness in winter would be more than sufficient to leave the building. And, as people have speculated, she probably knew her murderer so perhaps she willingly left the building with them. Plus she was drunk I think? I think I read that somewhere. So her awareness and ability to function was impaired... I think the killer must be quite intelligent, but also had a bit of luck on his/her side.

[JobsForTheBoys]

Why has it taken the keystone cops a week and a half to volunteer the information of the missing sock to the press????

Instead of giving us bits of information in dribs and drabs why dont they tell us the full facts and maybe we can solve their case for them.

What are they hiding and what are they frightened of???????

[CarriKP]

I don't go with the theory that someone let themselves into the flat. Because then the only suspect would be the LL and I am not sure I believe it's him anymore.


Or - shock horror - the apparently innocent boyfriend - ??



BTW I never did think Christopher Jefferies was the guilty party.

[mrscolumbo]

Yes the bf he's vowed never to return to Bristol odd thing to say in that statement on Saturday can't see why he would have the need to reveal as there was a 'suspect' in the dock - maybe he is/was so confident that a charge was imminent it took the focus of him as having any involvement.

Hope the profiler is focusing in on what this man has said sofar as it appears he has made statements right out of context to the circumstances - not the words IMHO of a grieving, numbed loving partner living within the emotional turmoil of the situation.

[arista]

http://news.sky.com/sky-news/content/StaticFile/jpg/2011/Jan/Week1/15881204.jpg

[Angus]

Just now on the news a police spokesman holding up the remaining sock and with a straight face requesting info from the public re the missing sock. This case is descending into the realms of farce.

[Herb1e]

http://news.sky.com/sky-news/content/StaticFile/jpg/2011/Jan/Week1/15881204.jpg

A picture of the Express. Why? Surely as irrelevant as the Mirror, the Sun or the Daily Mail...

[InOne]

*double post*

[InOne]

Stangled with her sock, suggests the killer had some kind of sexual kink then.

[mrscolumbo]

Apparently Mr Jefferies is about to be released of all charges linking him to Joanna's murder and is considering legal action against A & S constabulary & the media - good luck to the man I say.

[Angus]

Apparently Mr Jefferies is about to be released of all charges linking him to Joanna's murder and is considering legal action against A & S constabulary & the media - good luck to the man I say.

He doesn't have a case against the Police since they are perfectly entitled to detain anyone if they have the slightest suspicion of their involvement in a murder. They did absolutely nothing wrong.

However, he does have a strong case against the newspapers that ran scurrilous stories about him and against the individuals who slandered him. I would take them all to court.

[icemaiden]

If Joanna's body was been carried DNA would be all over whoever was carrying her

So it might be possible that her sock came off as her body was been dragged by the feet somewhere?

...or if she was been dragged by one foot (she was small and light) and then sock discarded due to DNA.

[InOne]

Quater of a million people have now clicked on the facebook add to encourage people to people to come forward according to news beat. Can someone tell me how this helps and why this is all they're saying about it. Also the the police assure us they will catch the killer. Right... :rolleyes:

[arista]

Jo Yeates Murder: Landlord 'May Sue Police'

http://news.sky.com/skynews/Home/UK-News/Joanna-Yeates-Murder-Landlord-Chris-Jefferies-May-Sue-Police-For-Wrongful-Arrest---Sky-Sources/Article/201101115882405?lpos=UK_News_Carousel_Region_0&lid=ARTICLE_15882405_Joanna_Yeates_Murder%3A_Landl ord_Chris_Jefferies_May_Sue_Police_For_Wrongful_Ar rest_-_Sky_Sources


So CJ may have a go at the Police.

[Angus]

Jo Yeates Murder: Landlord 'May Sue Police'

http://news.sky.com/skynews/Home/UK-News/Joanna-Yeates-Murder-Landlord-Chris-Jefferies-May-Sue-Police-For-Wrongful-Arrest---Sky-Sources/Article/201101115882405?lpos=UK_News_Carousel_Region_0&lid=ARTICLE_15882405_Joanna_Yeates_Murder%3A_Landl ord_Chris_Jefferies_May_Sue_Police_For_Wrongful_Ar rest_-_Sky_Sources


So CJ may have a go at the Police.

Police have the right to arrest any suspect and detain them lawfully for the prescribed times, and he gave them enough reason to be suspicious so he has no case, unless he is going to allege police brutality or some such twaddle! Imagine if every released suspect started suing the police, it would undermine the whole justice system.

[mrscolumbo]

Blimey 1/4 million hits and counting on the facebook page - well if the police or profiler are hoping to find the answer to the murder there we could well be into another new year and beyond!

[JobsForTheBoys]

he gave them enough reason to be suspicious


Please explain how?

[Fronn]

Yep - cant see what on earth Facebook is going to achieve apart from attracting the curious. Regarding the sock, I'm not sure why this wasn't revealed at the start (perhaps they were hoping to find it in the flat). It may have been found by anyone in the meantime and discarded/recycled etc. They must have some idea if strangulation was with hands or a ligature such as a sock, surely distinctive marks are left?? Why dont they bring in the coppers who caught Steve Wright in Ipswich, they seemed to have forensic evience aplenty. Just hope the Bristol bloke's not planning a serial spree like Wright cos it looks like he'd have a free rein on current form.

[Angus]

Please explain how?

He dithered about the statements he made to his neighbours, changing his story depending who was asking him; he was the only one who DEFINITELY had a key to Joanna's apartment, he lived in the same building, and was by his own admission present in the building the night that Joanna disappeared. Any more questions?

[Pyramid*]

He dithered about the statements he made to his neighbours, changing his story depending who was askign him; he was the only one who DEFINITELY had a key to Joanna's apartment and he lived in the same building, and was by his own admission present in the building the night that Joanna disappeared. Any more questions?

We don't know what he actually told the police, and we only know what the neighbour 'recalls' (which may not have been precisely what CJ said).

Errrr.... Greg also would have had a key given that they shared the flat.

Another neighbour may have had a key, a friend of theirs, a family member, as well as possibly any previous tenant if the locks weren't changed over during tenancy changes. We don't know who may or may not have had keys -it is an assumption to say that the only one who definately had a key was CJ. Joanna could have given a copy key to a.n.other and not even told Greg for all any of us know.

I also go along with Fronn (Hello btw!). I cannot for the life of me, understand why the police have a sock that Joanna was wearing, but cannot determine whether it was used to strangle her - marks on the external skin from the friction of the fabric/fibres, damage to internal tissue at point of strangulation surely could be determined. I really am finding this hard to believe that the police have an item such as the remaining sock - yet after all this time, cannot say whether the 'missing one' would have been used.

I honestly am beginning to doubt the abilities of the forensics team and their level of expertise in this case, I really am.

One sock on Joanna, one missing - yet cannot yet determine if murder weapon or not.

A missing pizza and box that could have simply have been eaten and disposed.

Arresting a man with so little evidence so far that they have not enough to charge him.

Don't know if they are looking for a killer or killers.

Changing their mind to it probably being someone who knew joanna, to now not ruling out a burglar, random or a premeditated act.
It's not looking good, that's for sure.

[JobsForTheBoys]

He dithered about the statements he made to his neighbours, changing his story depending who was asking him; he was the only one who DEFINITELY had a key to Joanna's apartment, he lived in the same building, and was by his own admission present in the building the night that Joanna disappeared. Any more questions?

So what crime did he commit to get arrested?

[JobsForTheBoys]

We don't know what he actually told the police, and we only know what the neighbour 'recalls' (which may not have been precisely what CJ said).

Errrr.... Greg also would have had a key given that they shared the flat.

Another neighbour may have had a key, a friend of theirs, a family member, as well as possibly any previous tenant if the locks weren't changed over during tenancy changes. We don't know who may or may not have had keys -it is an assumption to say that the only one who definately had a key was CJ. Joanna could have given a copy key to a.n.other and not even told Greg for all any of us know.

I also go along with Fronn (Hello btw!). I cannot for the life of me, understand why the police have a sock that Joanna was wearing, but cannot determine whether it was used to strangle her - marks on the external skin from the friction of the fabric/fibres, damage to internal tissue at point of strangulation surely could be determined. I really am finding this hard to believe that the police have an item such as the remaining sock - yet after all this time, cannot say whether the 'missing one' would have been used.

I honestly am beginning to doubt the abilities of the forensics team and their level of expertise in this case, I really am.

One sock on Joanna, one missing - yet cannot yet determine if murder weapon or not.

A missing pizza and box that could have simply have been eaten and disposed.

Arresting a man with so little evidence so far that they have not enough to charge him.

Don't know if they are looking for a killer or killers.

It's not looking good, that's for sure.


How ya doing Miss Marple?:xyxwave:

[Pyramid*]

How ya doing Miss Marple?:xyxwave:

Cheeky buggar!! (Wish there was a 'two fingered humorous salute smilie! :hugesmile:) I guess I'm the 'anti Miss Marple' - I'm doing the oppositte in a way !

[Angus]

So what crime did he commit to get arrested?

He was taken in for questioning, and released within the prescribed timeframe. You don't have to have committed a crime, only be SUSPECTED of committing a crime. It's not the police who have blackened his name, but the media.

[JobsForTheBoys]

He was taken in for questioning, and released within the prescribed timeframe. You don't have to have committed a crime, only be SUSPECTED of committing a crime. It's not the police who have blackened his name, but the media.

More like the police were under pressure from the media and the public to make an arrest and he seemed like an easy target.

[Angus]

Pyramid, I am merely saying that the police had sufficient justification to take him in for questioning and they are perfectly within their scope of power to do so - he was detained within the prescribed time limits then released. Of course her BF had a key but presumably his alibi was watertight, whereas the Landlord's was not.

[Angus]

More like the police were under pressure from the media and the public to make an arrest and he seemed like an easy target.

Very likely, but I am pointing out that the police were acting entirely within their scope of power and if they had any suspicions whatsoever they would be remiss NOT to have questioned him, so what exactly is your point? That the police should not be able to take someone in for questioning if there is any suspicion of that person's involvement in a crime as serious as murder? I am confident that the Police have no case to answer, but media certainly does.

[JobsForTheBoys]

Very likely, but I am pointing out that the police were acting entirely within their scope of power and if they had any suspicions whatsoever they would be remiss NOT to have questioned him, so what exactly is your point? That the police should not be able to take someone in for questioning if there is any suspicion of that person's involvement in a crime as serious as murder? I am confident that the Police have no case to answer, but media certainly does.

They could have asked him to come to the station of his own free will (I'm sure he would have obliged) to answer their questions or even questioned him in his own home.

But I suppose an arrest sounds better. Makes them look like they are doing their job doesnt it?

[Pyramid*]

Pyramid, I am merely saying that the police had sufficient justification to take him in for questioning and they are perfectly within their scope of power to do so - he was detained within the prescribed time limits then released. Of course her BF had a key but presumably his alibi was watertight, whereas the Landlord's was not.

I don't believe I suggested they didn't have sufficient justification,nor that the police weren't within their scope of power to do so Angus. What I did say was that they have not any enough evidence to charge the man. Being a suspect doesn't mean the person is guilty.

Being on the property, having a key to the flat, not having a good enough alibi other than possibly being in on his own that fatal night - might simply have been enough for the police to bring him in for questioning, given that they clearly have not a clue what or who they are looking for, can't determine a murder weapon, where it happened, when, if she ate the pizza or not, was it a burglary or not.

As I say, it's assumption only that Joanna herself did not have a copy of a key made and gave to someone that Greg was unaware of. For all we know, Greg could have had a key made and gave it to a.n.other to do the dirty deed.... No one knows, therefore that too, reamains a possibility -no matter how slim.

[Angus]

I don't believe I suggested they didn't have sufficient justification,nor that the police weren't within their scope of power to do so Angus. What I did say was that they have not any enough evidence to charge the man. Being a suspect doesn't mean the person is guilty.

Being on the property, having a key to the flat, not having a good enough alibi other than possibly being in on his own that fatal night - might simply have been enough for the police to bring him in for questioning, given that they clearly have not a clue what or who they are looking for, can't determine a murder weapon, where it happened, when, if she ate the pizza or not, was it a burglary or not.

As I say, it's assumption only that Joanna herself did not have a copy of a key made and gave to someone that Greg was unaware of. For all we know, Greg could have had a key made and gave it to a.n.other to do the dirty deed.... No one knows, therefore that too, reamains a possibility -no matter how slim.

Somehow I think we're talking at cross purposes here - in response to Arista's post that he was contemplating suing the police, I originally stated that he has no case against the police since they were perfectly within their rights to arrest him with sufficient, albeit circumstantial, suspicions and question him within a prescribed time limit. He has been released without charge after their investigations, so he has no case against them. He has no basis to sue for "wrongful arrest".

The scurrilous media campaign against him - now that's a different story. I hope he sues the pants off them, and all the individuals who crawled out of the woodwork to put the boot in.

[Pyramid*]

Somehow I think we're talking at cross purposes here - in response to Arista's post that he was contemplating suing the police, I originally stated that he has no case against the police since they were perfectly within their rights to arrest him with sufficient, albeit circumstantial, suspicions and question him within a prescribed time limit. He has been released without charge after their investigations, so he has no case against them. He has no basis to sue for "wrongful arrest".

The scurrilous media campaign against him - now that's a different story. I hope he sues the pants off them, and all the individuals who crawled out of the woodwork to put the boot in.

Cross purposes - maybes aye, maybes no !! :blush:

I read that he was looking at the view of suing for wrongful arrest - I would imagine that his lawyers will be advising him in respect of what precisely constitues. As only he, the police and his lawyers will be aware if they did in fact have 'reasonable grounds' for his arrest. The police may have a lot more under their belt that just him being the landlord and having a key: they may not. The police may feel they had sufficient grounds, clearly CJ thinks otherwise - and perhaps so too, will his legal team? Only time will tell on that matter.


]
Wrongful Arrest (nicked from google)
Otherwise known as unlawful arrest and detention may result in damages payable to the victim for false imprisonment. If the police have acted outside their legitimate powers by detaining someone who has not been subjected to a lawful arrest and interfered with that persons liberty, the police officer may be acting outside the scope of his duty. When making an arrest, a police officer must have reasonable grounds for suspecting that an arrestable offence is being committed, or is about to be committed and if an arrest is made outside these grounds then a police officer will have acted outside his legal powers and may well be liable to pay damages for false imprisonment.


With regards to the way he was portrayed and libelled by the media, and slandered by some others - if he is indeed innocent - I'd be doing all I could to sue those responsible for blackening my name in the way the did with CJ.

[Angus]

I am 100% confident that he will not win any action against the police for "wrongful arrest".

[Pyramid*]

I am 100% confident that he will not win any action against the police for "wrongful arrest".

And I am 100% confident that as far as this case is concerned, nothing is for certain!! lol

[mrscolumbo]

Apparently there is now a forensic psycholgist, not the A & S profiler, who is suggesting that the killer of Joanna may have killed before - because of the lack of forensic evidence in this case the killer may have 'forensic awareness' and after the murder obliterated all forensic evidence of the crime!

Could it not simply be that the killer would have no real need to obliterate the crime scene of forensic evidence to eliminate him of the crime - if the crime scene is a place that would normally & naturally have a mixture of dna from both the victim and the perpetrator.

[Pyramid*]

Apparently there is now a forensic psycholgist, not the A & S profiler, who is suggesting that the killer of Joanna may have killed before - because of the lack of forensic evidence in this case the killer may have 'forensic awareness' and after the murder obliterated all forensic evidence of the crime!

Could it not simply be that the killer would have no real need to obliterate the crime scene of forensic evidence to eliminate him of the crime - if the crime scene is a place that would normally & naturally have a mixture of dna from both the victim and the perpetrator.


I think I 'see' who you might be getting at.... but without trawling back through posts /papers etc: didn't the police say that they found DNA on Joanna's body that had led them to not rule out 'killers' or an accomplice? If they have a real hunch towards that, it could throw the cat amongst the pigeons.

Interesting snippet about there being thoughts on the killer having more than a layman's knowledge of forensics........ there is a part of me that's going along with what you said - given that 'we' dont know what the other 'dna' found on Jo's body is that makes police think of killers- it could be saliva from someone giving her a Merry Christmas peck, strand of someones hair nestled on her top, caught during a Christmas hug/cuddle when she left the pub etc....

It's a real mystery, but I do favour 'where you are coming from'.

[JobsForTheBoys]

It's a real mystery, but I do favour 'where you are coming from'.


I'm just sitting back and reading yours and columbos posts. I cant be bothered to post myself.:sleep:

[Pyramid*]

I'm just sitting back and reading yours and columbos posts. I cant be bothered to post myself.:sleep:

Expect an invoice at the end of the month.

My terms are payment strictly within 30 days.

:thumbs:

[JobsForTheBoys]

Expect an invoice at the end of the month.

My terms are payment strictly within 30 days.

:thumbs:

I dont have any money.:joker:

[Pyramid*]

I dont have any money.:joker:

I am happy to accept payment in lieu of a pile of ironing being done. :cheer2:

[arista]

The Sun Newspaper
now offers 50,000 pounds reward
for help to catch the Killer.


SkyNewsHD


http://news.sky.com/sky-news/content/StaticFile/jpg/2011/Jan/Week1/15883925.jpg

[InOne]

Just like in the old west lol

[arista]

http://news.sky.com/sky-news/content/StaticFile/jpg/2011/Jan/Week1/15883844.jpg

http://news.sky.com/sky-news/content/StaticFile/jpg/2011/Jan/Week1/15883720.jpg


Did a Facebook friend kill Jo? Murder police bid to trace victim's 200 internet contacts

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1344831/Joanna-Yeates-Murder-Did-Facebook-friend-kill-Police-trace-200-contacts.html#ixzz1AIjaLHcJ

[keithafc]

This is a gripping story. I just wonder who dun it.

[mrscolumbo]

Keith I just wonder where everybody has gone!

[Fronn]

Well I'm about and still mulling it over. It must be awful for the poor girl's parents and all this sock speculation - was it used to strangle her? Has it been kept as a trophy? seems unecessarily cruel speculation without evidence. Don't think the landlord should sue the police (mainly because I'd like them to keep their finances to fight crimes like this one) - but he is owed one mega and very public apology.

[marney]

Someone mentioned the other bottle of cider and the police keep giving extra bits of information out. Jo had apparently sent a text to her brothers friend inviting him around to the flat. Life in Bristol might seem ideal for the young but it can be lonely.
He did not reply to her text and the symptoms of Joes death and the similarities to the one in 74 would rule him out having been too young. Jo they say was kind hearted and she had not had a reply from her text message so she could have offered the pizza and other bottle of cider to someone else in her block of flats, if she saw someone nearby or even took it to them. The police have not said anything about the other bottle but was it found in the suspects flat or green collection. If this is the case would they not have been able to identify Jo s finger print on that bottle. Looking for the Pizza seems to be a bit of a red herring ,that could have been binned and tipped as was the case before they started searching rubbish. They probably know who it is but will they do the right thing and nail them. The suspects employ good lawyers so they can wriggle and slide away from any evidence against themselves.

[Pyramid*]

Interesting comments in the Guardian (http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2011/jan/09/joanna-yeates-inquiry-police-media) in respect of the relationship between A&S Police and the Press.


The suspicion is growing that the force is holding back vital details. Distrust is mounting among a media corps that believes it has a duty to question whether the investigation is floundering. Publicly, detectives admit they still do not know where and when Joanna died.

Yet when ITN claimed last Tuesday that police were no closer to finding her killer, the force banned the broadcaster from press conferences. Eventually its journalists were allowed back into the fold, but the enduring concern that police attempted to interfere with the freedom of the press hangs over the investigation.


Given that the police admit they don't know when/where/what time Jo died, cannot confirm what was used to strangle her, are unsure if she ate the pizza or not, cannot rule out more than one person was involved in the killing, I think what ITN stated last week - and now almost a week late - stood true then, and most certainly now. Police certainly don't appear to be closing to fnding the killer.

FGS, It's almost 3 weeks later and they only began checking drains etc during the week there - ample time for any possible evidence to have been washed away and well into the sewer system by now.

Wonder why the police got so tetchy and threw the rattle out of the pram? Possibly because they are iindeed floundering and ITN hit the nail on the head? Here was me thinking the police were in the business of determining the truth, dealing with facts. Seems only if it is to their beneift, and as long as the word 'guilty' doesn't land firmly on their doorstep!

Re CJ: reporting that CJ appears to be progressing his intent to sue both police and certain newspapers.


Meanwhile, Christopher Jefferies, the former public school teacher arrested on suspicion of the 25-year-old's murder, is preparing to sue the police for wrongful arrest and various newspapers for defamation.

[Pyramid*]

Someone mentioned the other bottle of cider and the police keep giving extra bits of information out. Jo had apparently sent a text to her brothers friend inviting him around to the flat. Life in Bristol might seem ideal for the young but it can be lonely.

He did not reply to her text and the symptoms of Joes death and the similarities to the one in 74 would rule him out having been too young. Jo they say was kind hearted and she had not had a reply from her text message so she could have offered the pizza and other bottle of cider to someone else in her block of flats, if she saw someone nearby or even took it to them. The police have not said anything about the other bottle but was it found in the suspects flat or green collection. If this is the case would they not have been able to identify Jo s finger print on that bottle. Looking for the Pizza seems to be a bit of a red herring ,that could have been binned and tipped as was the case before they started searching rubbish. They probably know who it is but will they do the right thing and nail them. The suspects employ good lawyers so they can wriggle and slide away from any evidence against themselves.


Now I'm aware of her sending the text to this man - but I can't recall it being mentioned anywhere that she texted to invite him round.

I do however think this might give rise a little to specultion that Joanna was not quite as 'devoted' to Greg as parents are making out - as has been seen in various places (forums, newspapers etc).

Bearing in mind that she and Greg were to have a 'housewarming party' of some sort on the following Tuesday, she could have simply sent the guy a text inviting him to that - his name could have cropped up in conversation with someone she spoke to that Friday night in the pub, which spurred her to think, "God, wonder how he's doing, if he fancies coming to the party'.... It could of course, have been something very different to the 'devoted Joanna' we are given the picture of - however given that she and Greg had only just moved into the flat - I'm not convinced it was anything 'suspect'.

As for offering the pizza to someone else: I find that incredibly hard to accept. Sorry but I do!

On the matter of cider - far as I'm aware, it was reported that one bottle found unopened, and one found to have had some cider drunk. For all we know, both bottles could have been unopened at the point of Jo's disappearance from the flat and on returning on sunday night, he could have opened one up and poured himself a drink.

The cider bottles don't appear to be figuring highly (as far as we are aware) - so I'm guessing that their is no suspicious or unaccounted for DNA on the bottles.

[Pyramid*]

:xyxwave: To all the 'newbies' .....

I find it amusing to see that this one thread alone has brought in quite a few new members who appear to only be interested in posting in this particular thread !

[marney]

This was reported in the media
T A source said: "Jo was at a loose end as her boyfriend was away. As she walked home she passed close to the home of someone she hadn't seen for about 18 months. He's a friend of her brother, just a casual acquaintance.

"On the spur of the moment she decided to try to text him and ask if he was around to meet for a friendly drink, but she never got a reply.

PYRAMID

I don't see anything wrong in this she was probably lonely that is why I believe it was intended for this person but given away.
Where is it reported about to bottles been accounted for

[Pyramid*]

This was reported in the media
T A source said: "Jo was at a loose end as her boyfriend was away. As she walked home she passed close to the home of someone she hadn't seen for about 18 months. He's a friend of her brother, just a casual acquaintance.

"On the spur of the moment she decided to try to text him and ask if he was around to meet for a friendly drink, but she never got a reply.

PYRAMID

I don't see anything wrong in this she was probably lonely that is why I believe it was intended for this person but given away.
Where is it reported about to bottles been accounted for


That's correct. It is reported that she sent a text, that was not replied to (the guy said he was sleeping at the time the text came in). No where as far as I'm aware (of course I could be wrong), but no where have I read that she invited him round - which is what you stated in your very first post.

As for the cider bottles:- I'd suggest you google to find out. Sorry - but I'm not trawling through almost a month's worth of media reports - it was reported as I mentioned in my post.

why would she be lonely? She'd been at work all day, spent the evening at the pub, had no reason to leave so early but she chose to do, left the pub early in the evening, and had plans for a busy weekend while Greg was away, getting the flat cleaned up, making Mince Pies, and preparing for the 'housewarming' party that they were intending having on the following Tuesday. I really don't think 'lonely' is a word that figures in the whole scenario, I really don't.

[marney]

[B]Pyramid
Perhaps when the context of the text is known we might know if she did indeed invited him out on that night. As regards new posters everyone in this country is incensed by this mindless act of evil so why should that trouble you or do you have the monopoly on this subject it certainly appears like that. Still can't find anything on the bottles, Why on do you appear so rattled?

[Pyramid*]

[B]Pyramid
Perhaps when the context of the text is known we might know if she did indeed invited him out on that night. As regards new posters everyone in this country is incensed by this mindless act of evil so why should that trouble you or do you have the monopoly on this subject it certainly appears like that. Still can't find anything on the bottles, Why on do you appear so rattled?

Perhaps you shouldn't post things on the internet that are not known for sure - I mean re the text message and what it may give out or signal (re Jo or the man concerned), given the amount of harrassment a certain LL got through people doing the same thing. *Added: This was reported by the Sun. The source of this information as worded by the Sun - is not named., they quote it as 'a source*

The matter of the text to the man may be seen as defammatory - as you stated. Neither by the press not the police - and it is dangerous to assert such a thing - lest this man is also then subjected to the same witch hunt as CJ was. That's my point as far as the text message is concerned.

I said the amount of new posters posting coming onto the thread as being 'amusing' - I didn't say it trouble me - read what is written rather than make things up. Neither did I say, or infer, that I had a monopoly. I find it amusing because Tibbs isn't exactly one of the biggest forums around and given that it's not known for having the most serious of debates - that the reason why I found it amusing. Still do.

Rattled? Not at all. I do however find it bizarre that a month in to the case, with the maximum publicity being given, in every possible media outlet and the the interest being shown: that a new member would come on to enter discussions: when they so obviously have the barest of correct information. (ie: about the male friend, about the cider bottles etc). On the matter of the cider bottles: I've just googled and found many references to the bottles (both of them) - took seconds to find several hits. Seek and ye shall find.

[marney]

Pyramid
I find it amusing to see that this one thread alone has brought in quite a few new members who appear to only be interested in posting in this particular thread !



Amusing is not a word I would use in such a tragic case, heartwarming yes, that so many people are concerned about getting this murerder off our streets. Still cant find the bottles can you give me a clue.

[InOne]

You'd think it was the 70's the way they are dealing with the case. We can go over all the little details but it's clutching at straws still at the moment. Think they might've got away with this. They're hoping for someone to come forward I think.

[MojoNixon]

Quote from someone else :

Yes in the back of her head
so she may pull through.
after the swelling stops.

To many Young Yanks
with no jobs and posting crazy stuff on YouTube.


Fast firing pistal
a Death Machine in your hands.

[Fronn]

I'll admit I joined the forum to discuss this case - it intrigues me and I desperately want to see the gulity brought to justice. No offence taken by pyramid's remark by the way! I think the text message just indicates that Jo was a 'people person' with a wide network of friends of both sexes. Nothing wrong with that at all, but it may mean that her friendliness was misinterpreted by someone that she knew. I'm more convinced that she let in someone she knew, she anticipating a chat and a laugh but they anticipating a bit more. Maybe the visitor grabbed her by the throat when she screamed (as reported by neighbours) and killed her in panic in an attempt to silence her.

[Rob]

I sincerley hope the killer(s) are brought to justice and we can find out why the hell this even happened.

[Pyramid*]

Pyramid
I find it amusing to see that this one thread alone has brought in quite a few new members who appear to only be interested in posting in this particular thread !



Amusing is not a word I would use in such a tragic case, heartwarming yes, that so many people are concerned about getting this murerder off our streets. Still cant find the bottles can you give me a clue.

Again, don't read what isn't there - I didn't say the case was amusing - I stated, very clearly that I thought it amusing to see so many new members on this thread only - particularly as Tibbs isn't the busiest of forums (no offence Tibbs !!).

Can I give you a clue? Yes, I could give you a clue, I could give you a link. Am I going to give you one? No. Take from that what you will.

You'd think it was the 70's the way they are dealing with the case. We can go over all the little details but it's clutching at straws still at the moment. Think they might've got away with this. They're hoping for someone to come forward I think.

It is extemely bizarre - as and Rob has just said - as much as finding the killer is uppermost - to find out why, what motive did they have. That's probably as baffling to everyone at this point.

I'll admit I joined the forum to discuss this case - it intrigues me and I desperately want to see the gulity brought to justice. No offence taken by pyramid's remark by the way! I think the text message just indicates that Jo was a 'people person' with a wide network of friends of both sexes. Nothing wrong with that at all, but it may mean that her friendliness was misinterpreted by someone that she knew. I'm more convinced that she let in someone she knew, she anticipating a chat and a laugh but they anticipating a bit more. Maybe the visitor grabbed her by the throat when she screamed (as reported by neighbours) and killed her in panic in an attempt to silence her.


The remark wasn't meant to offend and I'm glad you personally haven't taken any as it wasn't the intention! That post I made was that off with a nice smiley wavy face to all newbies by way of a welcome - how that could be misconstrued as anything other than a welcome baffles me. I think it's great that new members are joining - more input, more involvment, more interraction. Makes the thread more interesting too.

[marney]

It has too many similarities to the 74 case , THAT IS THE PROBLEM OR THE ANSWER.

[Pyramid*]

I see the mysterious white van that was mentioned by police at the very beginning and felt not to be of significance has now come to the surface again and police are considering this now. 3 weeks later.:conf:

This was raised by a poster on DS that Babycakes referred to a few pages back (who knew CJ and who had provided some personal knowledge of CJ, his background etc)

post on DS that I'm referring to. (http://www.digitalspy.co.uk/forums/showpost.php?p=46974947&postcount=180)

[Pyramid*]

It has too many similarities to the 74 case , THAT IS THE PROBLEM OR THE ANSWER.

Personally, I don't believe it is related. 36 years is a long time for a person to kill.... then decide to kill again. Plus the 1974 killer would be 36 years older - with all that entail of a person aging by 36 years. I don't think they are connected.

[marney]

MAYBE NOT. SAME GROUP THOUGH REMEMBER POLICE BELIEVE MORE THEN ONE. I know I need not say more to you ,PYRAMID .

[marney]

I am sure you will agree with me on one thing that someday these excuses for human beings will be brought to justice, Pyramid.

[Pyramid*]

MAYBE NOT. SAME GROUP THOUGH REMEMBER POLICE BELIEVE MORE THEN ONE. I know I need not say more to you ,PYRAMID .


Group? What group?

I am sure you will agree with me on one thing that someday these excuses for human beings will be brought to justice, Pyramid.


We don't know if it will be plural. The police are not ruling it out but it's not known for certain at this time if there is one person responsible, or more than one. I may of course be mistaken but I thought there was nothing to indicate a definite involvement of more than one person. Far as I'm understanding, the police are yet to determine if it is one or more people. :conf:

[InOne]

What 74 case?

[Pyramid*]

What 74 case?
Glenis Carruthers. here.... (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/crime/8244606/Joanna-Yeates-murder-relatives-of-1974-victim-say-killer-could-be-same.html)

[InOne]

Glenis Carruthers. here.... (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/crime/8244606/Joanna-Yeates-murder-relatives-of-1974-victim-say-killer-could-be-same.html)

Haha no way. The killer must be pretty old by now and probably couldn't even take Joanna. I love how they posted a pic of Joanna with the hair similar to that girl as if that's some kind of link. It's stupid and proves they know **** all. I mean 1974 for gods sake!

[Pyramid*]

Haha no way. The killer must be pretty old by now and probably couldn't even take Joanna. I love how they posted a pic of Joanna with the hair similar to that girl as if that's some kind of link. It's stupid and proves they know **** all. I mean 1974 for gods sake!

I know.. I'm of the same opinion - a young very fit woman who is strong enough for sports that require muscle power (rowing, skiing etc) - if the killer was for example, 30 in 1974, they'd be 66 now and it's highly probably, that on a fitness level alone - Joanna would outmatch them. Remember: this is the woman who according to her parents, initiated new boyfriends with an arm wrestling match.

[InOne]

I know.. I'm of the same opinion - a young very fit woman who is strong enough for sports that require muscle power (rowing, skiing etc) - if the killer was for example, 30 in 1974, they'd be 66 now and it's highly probably, that on a fitness level alone - Joanna would outmatch them. Remember: this is the woman who according to her parents, initiated new boyfriends with an arm wrestling match.

Ha Ha go on Joanna

Well people assume at the site of some 'killer' women just suddenly flop and obey. When they usually give a pretty decent fight. Unless they're bludgeoned or something

[Pyramid*]

Yep, for me, whilst I understand the 'association' - the years that have passed and being made aware of how fit Joanna was, I really don't see it being probably. Possible? Yes. Probable? No.

[InOne]

What did you find out about all the sports stuff? Paper and that?

[Pyramid*]

What did you find out about all the sports stuff? Paper and that?

yeah, there was quite a fair bit of mention (I think at the beginning of either her going missing or just around when her body was found), said she was into snowboarding, rowing, (the arm wrestling thing I think was more recent).

In fact hang on..... there's a wiki page (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murder_of_Joanna_Yeates)set up and (I've just checked) - it mentions on there a few other bits n bobs - though how reliable that is, is as good (or not!) as some of the press stuff I guess.

[InOne]

The wiki is interesting but says nothing new. This case is also interesting, but they won't catch the killer now.

[Pyramid*]

The wiki is interesting but says nothing new. This case is also interesting, but they won't catch the killer now.

There is the possibility that there is very significant knowledge that we aren't privy to which might mean they are closer than they are letting on - and deliberately witholding info in case it alerts the killer as to them 'being on 'his' tail'..... but I seriously doubt it - there just seems to be too many if, buts, maybes and uncertainty all round.

[marney]

The carruthers case a dark haired man was seen in his twenties at the scene what would that make him now. Remember his last tenants said he was strong, taken off guard, suprised, anything is possible and the body dumped like jo to make a statement. They must be concerned about this case comming out as it could reveal the truth and i would imagine there is a real struggle going on behind the scene against exposing this case. If it does not come out now or no one is arrested or the wrong person taken into custody i feel it is only a matter of time, as it appears the public are becomming more aware and then the **** will really hit the fan.

[Mifletz]

Why did the boy friend refer to Joanna as being dead before her body had even been found?

[Mifletz]

Apart from the Clifton Suspension Bridge, how many other plausible crossing routes are there to get from her flat to where Joanna was found?

http://www.leeds-uk.com/cities/0-photo/fullimages/Bristol-SS-Great-Britain.jpg

And how many other routes are there in total, even the seemingly implausible circuitous ones?

[Pyramid*]

The carruthers case a dark haired man was seen in his twenties at the scene what would that make him now. Remember his last tenants said he was strong, taken off guard, suprised, anything is possible and the body dumped like jo to make a statement. They must be concerned about this case comming out as it could reveal the truth and i would imagine there is a real struggle going on behind the scene against exposing this case. If it does not come out now or no one is arrested or the wrong person taken into custody i feel it is only a matter of time, as it appears the public are becomming more aware and then the **** will really hit the fan.

A man being seen at the scene of the Carruthers case, doesn't mean that person was necessarily the killer. A man in his twenties.... Mid twenties to late twenties? if so, that would still make the person 60 to 65 years old today and unless they had kept themself in real good shape all these years since 1974 - I still don't feel they'd be a match for a very fit young woman like Jo. The element of surprise is always a possibility but I'm not convinced.

'His last tenants said he was strong, taken off guard, surprised'. This doesn't make sense..... who's last tenant? Who took him off guard? Are you referring to the Carruthers case or to Joanna's? If Joanna's - most reports from CJ's friends all report him as being the opposite - ie: not stong enough. :conf:

'I feel it's only a matter of time as it appears the public are more aware......hit the fan'. sorry, but again, this doesn't make much sense - public becoming more aware of what? :conf:

I'm not being obtuse - I genuinely don't understand what you are meaning in much of your post.

Why did the boy friend refer to Joanna as being dead before her body had even been found?

IIRC, the father also referred to Joanna in the past tense before her body was found (said something like, "She had so much life in her" or WTTE). I suppose retrospectively, it could be the unconscious mind working on the distinct possibility that was was dead?

[marney]

He always took great care of his appearance and would dress quite trendily for someone of his age. He was also incredibly fit for someone of his age. He was incredibly strong. This is a quote from his former tenants in jo s flat. The Telegraph.

AN INTERESTING DEVELOPEMENT ON THE TEXT MESSAGE JO SENT. SHE DID INVITE HIM OUT THAT NIGHT AND NOT AS YOU INTIMATED PYRAMID SO SHE COULD HAVE GIVEN THAT PIZZA TO SOMEONE ELSE AS APPARENTLY HE IS NOT A SUSPECT. ANOTHER TWIST TO THIS CASE THOUGH.

[Mifletz]

No way do a woman's father and her lover refer to a still recently missing person in the past tense. That is how the Soham murderer was caught, by a slip of the tongue: he said "I was probably the last person to see Holly and Jessica alive". How did he know they weren't alive: 'cos he slew them!

Is there any way Jo's father and boyfriend could somehow be in on her death?! I've heard stranger things!!


IIRC, the father also referred to Joanna in the past tense before her body was found (said something like, "She had so much life in her" or WTTE). I suppose retrospectively, it could be the unconscious mind working on the distinct possibility that was was dead?

[marney]

I see where you are coming from , but the parents said they feel the police are holding back information I would have doubts about them been involved. There seem to be too many other unsolved bits of information to make it viable. I don't believe they would have been holding Chris Jefferies for such a long time if they had nothing at all on him . The text message might bring out more clues and the police have said they will be looking at mobile phones and masts in the area to see if witness statements hold up.