Joanna Yeates - 32 year old man arrested

[Mifletz]

There may have been a conspiracy by several people to kill her eg if she had knowledge of a Clifton pedo ring including even policemen and judges; if her parents & brother had molested her as a child & she was threatening to spill the beans unless she inherited everything; if her fiance had found out/suspected that she was seeing other men and he engaged his friends to rough her up/seduce her/test her, and it all went horribly wrong etc etc, and all in cahoots with the landlord who'd let them in.

I think the police suspect something conspiratorial like this, but they have to tread exceedingly carefully.

Have the police taken DNA from her family, including the mother?

I see where you are coming from , but the parents said they feel the police are holding back information I would have doubts about them been involved.

[InOne]

There may have been a conspiracy by several people to kill her eg if she had knowledge of a Clifton pedo ring including even policemen and judges; if her parents & brother had molested her as a child & she was threatening to spill the beans unless she inherited everything; if her fiance had found out/suspected that she was seeing other men and he engaged his friends to rough her up/seduce her/test her, and it all went horribly wrong etc etc, and all in cahoots with the landlord who'd let them in.

I think the police suspect something conspiratorial like this, but they have to tread exceedingly carefully.

Have the police taken DNA from her family, including the mother?

All that sounds pretty crazy and farfetched lol

[Pyramid*]

He always took great care of his appearance and would dress quite trendily for someone of his age. He was also incredibly fit for someone of his age. He was incredibly strong. This is a quote from his former tenants in jo s flat. The Telegraph.

AN INTERESTING DEVELOPEMENT ON THE TEXT MESSAGE JO SENT. SHE DID INVITE HIM OUT THAT NIGHT AND NOT AS YOU INTIMATED PYRAMID SO SHE COULD HAVE GIVEN THAT PIZZA TO SOMEONE ELSE AS APPARENTLY HE IS NOT A SUSPECT. ANOTHER TWIST TO THIS CASE THOUGH.

Let's see a lot more of the article, from which you've posted comments above - from the Telegraph with today's date on the article - which refer to CJ.


As detectives continued to question the retired bachelor more details emerged of his early life.

Born in Grimsby he moved to Cheshire with his parents Kathleen and Edward, when he was aged ten.

A pupil at Sandbach Grammar School he excelled academically and studied English at Bristol University.

Neighbours of his late parents said he was especially keen on classical music as a youngster and had an organ in his bedroom as a child.
When his mother died he played the organ at her funeral.

He joined the staff at Clifton College public school in the late 1970s and despite earning a reputation as an eccentric was well regarded among the staff and pupils.

In 1991 he bought a flat belonging to the college in Canynge Road in the highly desirable Clifton area of Bristol and later bought a second apartment in the same building.

Miss Yeates and Mr Reardon moved into the basement flat owned by Mr Jefferies on October 1 this year.

Last night two former neighbours of Jefferies Gary and Kat Anderton, who lived in the flat next door to Miss Yeates said: “When we lived there he was always busy doing stuff around the house. He was very meticulous and liked things just so.

"We would see him working in the garden and his hair would blow on top of his head and stick up on top of his head.

"He always took great care of his appearance and would dress quite trendily for someone of his age. He was also incredibly fit for someone of his age. He was incredibly strong.”

Mr Anderton added: "He was a bit of a meddler and liked to know what we were doing but we never felt threatened by him. I would have let him babysit my daughter if I needed to.”

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/crime/8234399/Jonanna-Yeates-murder-police-investigate-second-property.html



Few things here that 'jump out at me' (not in what you personally are saying, but the comments from the article you mention). The article refers to CJ purchasing a flat that was owned previously by the college in 1991 (20 years ago) and later he purchased another apartment in the same building (presumably these flats are the one he lives in now and the one that he lets out, and the one that Jo & Greg rented). No year is given as to when he made this 2nd purchase - he could have purchased it 2 years after his initial purchase for all we know. It could have been purchased 5 years ago, for all we know. The article doesn't make reference to that. Incidental I know, but I make mention of it to show some possible anomolies in the reporting (well...what I feel are! They may not be of course!)

There is no reference as to WHEN this couple, Mr & Mrs Anderton actually lived in the flat next to Jo's. They could have stayed there 15 years ago, 10 years ago. The way the article is worded, it 'reads' as though they stayed there when Jo stayed there. I find that peculiar. Why? Because Jo only moved in there in October 2010. (and not 'this year' as the Telegraph have incorrectly stated). If this couple only moved out 2 months ago, I'd have expected them or the Telegraph to mention that, to give credence to their comments re the 'condition' CJ was in - ie: to show that their comments were based on the present time, rather than (for example) when they lived there 15 years ago. Since there is no reference as to how long ago they lived there - it could have been October this year, could have been October 2001.

Do you see what I mean? It leans a little toward intimating that Mr & Mrs Anderton stayed there during the time Joanna stayed there - which therefore could make the remaining comments re CJ's physicalities being current - when in fact, this description from them could be as they recall him from many years ago. It's misleading at best.

for all any of us know, this couple could have lived there 10 /15 years ago - and a lot can happen to a person's health in 10 / 15 years.

Mr Anderton also states that they never felt threatned by CJ, and to labour the point, also mentions that they would have let CJ babysit their daughter if they had to. Not many couples I know would let a 65 year old man (unless a very close friend /relative) babysit their young child - this makes me think (rightly or wrongly) that they are referring to a time when CJ was much younger than today. Say 50 or younger - and saying he was very fit for his age.

The limited photos that we've all seen recently of CJ, I certainly wouldn't say he dressed trendily for his age, or took great care over his appearance. I'm deeply sceptical by nature (as you'll have guessed).

The text message. Mmm... interesting but I've not caught up on the news a yet today - I'd have to go catch up on what's what.

You are correct though..... yet another twist!

[Pyramid*]

From the Daily Mail ref: text messsage Joanna sent:-



Police are also studying phone records after one of Jo's friends revealed that the landscape architect sent him a text at 8.20pm on December 17.

Jo had invited Matthew Wood out for a drink in the message but because he was at a Christmas party he didn't reply until 9.20pm.




Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1345764/Joanna-Yeates-murder-Anonymous-letter-scrap-pizza-box-posted-pub.html#ixzz1Af52VcK8

Okay. I'm confused. Weren't there reports that this guy didn't reply because he was sleeping? :conf: Yet it says here, he was at a Christmas Party. Am I losing the plot entirely !!! (highly possible and highly probable!!).

What it says that she invites him out for a drink: but what is missing is when and where - inviting someone 'out' for a drink usually indicates what it says, 'out' (as opposed to 'come round for a drink). Did the text state 'when' the intended 'invite out' for a drink, was? The following night? Or an invite later in the week?


Timeline from the Guardian.

8.10pm: Yeates was caught on CCTV popping into a Waitrose supermarket in the Clifton Triangle.
8.30pm: She used her mobile phone to ring her friend Rebecca Scott and arranged to meet on Christmas Eve.
8.40pm: At a Tesco Express on Regent Street in Clifton Village, about a quarter-of-a-mile from her flat, Yeates bought a pizza, which is missing. She then visits a nearby off-licence to buy a bottle of cider.

So she goes into 'Waitrose before texting this guy.

She sends him a text before she telphones her friend Rebecca.

Having no reply from this guy, she continues to to purchase pizza, and then into another shop for Cider.

Does this guy drink Cider I wonder? Was she buying in the hope he would join her at the flat? If so - I find that odd....... her boyfriend that she's loved up with and is devoted to, has left only 90 minutes earlier, and she's inviting another guy out for a drink :conf: on a weekend that she was telling friends that she was looking forward to being on her own, getting the flat all sorted, making nice Mince Pies etc...- I guess a lot rests on what or where the 'invite for drinks' was based on. That weekend when Greg was away? That night?

curiouser and curiouser!:conf:

[marney]

As I said she could have been lonely, just because you are in the hub of things means nothing and some people feel even more isolated. A platonic friendship maybe. But maybe more to this then we know. I didn't catch all the news tonight but no doubt you will be pleased that CJ is apparently going to be released.

[icemaiden]

From the Daily Mail ref: text messsage Joanna sent:-




Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1345764/Joanna-Yeates-murder-Anonymous-letter-scrap-pizza-box-posted-pub.html#ixzz1Af52VcK8

Okay. I'm confused. Weren't there reports that this guy didn't reply because he was sleeping? :conf: Yet it says here, he was at a Christmas Party. Am I losing the plot entirely !!! (highly possible and highly probable!!).

What it says that she invites him out for a drink: but what is missing is when and where - inviting someone 'out' for a drink usually indicates what it says, 'out' (as opposed to 'come round for a drink). Did the text state 'when' the intended 'invite out' for a drink, was? The following night? Or an invite later in the week?


Timeline from the Guardian.

8.10pm: Yeates was caught on CCTV popping into a Waitrose supermarket in the Clifton Triangle.
8.30pm: She used her mobile phone to ring her friend Rebecca Scott and arranged to meet on Christmas Eve.
8.40pm: At a Tesco Express on Regent Street in Clifton Village, about a quarter-of-a-mile from her flat, Yeates bought a pizza, which is missing. She then visits a nearby off-licence to buy a bottle of cider.

So she goes into 'Waitrose before texting this guy.

She sends him a text before she telphones her friend Rebecca.

Having no reply from this guy, she continues to to purchase pizza, and then into another shop for Cider.

Does this guy drink Cider I wonder? Was she buying in the hope he would join her at the flat? If so - I find that odd....... her boyfriend that she's loved up with and is devoted to, has left only 90 minutes earlier, and she's inviting another guy out for a drink :conf: on a weekend that she was telling friends that she was looking forward to being on her own, getting the flat all sorted, making nice Mince Pies etc...- I guess a lot rests on what or where the 'invite for drinks' was based on. That weekend when Greg was away? That night?

curiouser and curiouser!:conf:

Did she buy cider? no mention of receipts only for pizza. The girl who worked in bargain booze said she had no recollection of seeing Joanna that evening.

Joanna and Greg was having a party on Tuesday evening, maybe she was checking out the prices and what was available.

Maybe she took the cider from the pub with her. Maybe someone asked her to get him/her a pizza, she dropped it off to them and the rest is history.

[icemaiden]

As I said she could have been lonely, just because you are in the hub of things means nothing and some people feel even more isolated. A platonic friendship maybe. But maybe more to this then we know. I didn't catch all the news tonight but no doubt you will be pleased that CJ is apparently going to be released.

If she was that lonely would she not ring BF and have a chat, Or her mother or best friend?

[marney]

Exactly thats what i think she droped that pizza off. The note sent to the pub maybe not be a hoax but a list of pizza toppings for the person she was buying the pizza for. I hope the police have had a good look at the writing.

[marney]

When she phoned her friend she said she was at a loose end, boyfriend away lonely maybe.

[Pyramid*]

As I said she could have been lonely, just because you are in the hub of things means nothing and some people feel even more isolated. A platonic friendship maybe. But maybe more to this then we know. I didn't catch all the news tonight but no doubt you will be pleased that CJ is apparently going to be released.

:conf:

[marney]

Sorry Pyramid you might be disappointed It is Mr Jeffries and his lawyers that are asking and pushing for his release and expecting it to be imminently. The police are saying they have no intention of doing so. What have they got on him I wonder. Latest news. So the plot remains the same, interesting.

Five years ago the Andertons lived there so I would not expect him to lose much of his strength in that time. WE WERE QUESTIONING HIS STRENGTH NOT HIS CHARACTER SO WHY COME UP WITH ALL THE REST OF THE STUFF ITS NOT RELEVANT TO HIS STRENGTH WE WERE QUESTIONING IF HE WAS STRONG ENOUGH TO DO IT.

[Pyramid*]

Sorry Pyramid you might be disappointed It is Mr Jeffries and his lawyers that are asking and pushing for his release and expecting it to be imminently. The police are saying they have no intention of doing so. What have they got on him I wonder. Latest news. So the plot remains the same, interesting.

Five years ago the Andertons lived there so I would not expect him to lose much of his strength in that time. WE WERE QUESTIONING HIS STRENGTH NOT HIS CHARACTER SO WHY COME UP WITH ALL THE REST OF THE STUFF ITS NOT RELEVANT TO HIS STRENGTH WE WERE QUESTIONING IF HE WAS STRONG ENOUGH TO DO IT.

What on earth are you going on about? This is hardly newsbreaking stuff - this happened many days ago.

As for the rest -I mentioned nothing about CJ's strength of character - but was speaking of his physical strength - as was very clear in my post. VERY.

[marney]

I am afraid you are wrong this was on the local news tonight why are you so upset would they put out old news of many days ago, tonight go to the somerset local news. 10/1/11. Pull the other one.

[marney]

BUT TONIGHT THE POLICE DO NOT EXPECT ANY IMMEDIATE CHANGE HIS LAWYERS ARE PUSHING BUT THE POLICE ARE HAVING NONE OF IT. REPORTED 10/1/11 YOU SAID IT WAS REPOTED THAT HE WOULD BE RELEASED SOON. SO THIS IS NEW NEWS he will not be relesed from bail soon.

[Shasown]

BUT TONIGHT THE POLICE DO NOT EXPECT ANY IMMEDIATE CHANGE HIS LAWYERS ARE PUSHING BUT THE POLICE ARE HAVING NONE OF IT. REPORTED 10/1/11 YOU SAID IT WAS REPOTED THAT HE WOULD BE RELEASED SOON. SO THIS IS NEW NEWS he will not be relesed from bail soon.

Oh you mean the police wont remove his bail conditions?

Why didnt you just say that in post #505, as he already has been released, as in from police custody.

You mean his lawyers have approached the custody officer at the police station he was arrested and asked for the bail conditions to be lifted? Or is his lawyer now approaching the courts for removal of the conditions?

[marney]

Did not have all the details at the time OF 505 SO SORRY the police reply was that they were not changing his conditions, so lawyers must have asked for release of bail like you said. So I suppose their next step will be court. How long can they keep him on bail , what have they got on him to hold him so long.

[Shasown]

Did not have all the details at the time OF 505 SO SORRY the police reply was that they were not changing his conditions, so lawyers must have asked for release of bail like you said. So I suppose their next step will be court. How long can they keep him on bail , what have they got on him to hold him so long.

Minimal evidence, hearsay, next to nothing.

Not enough to charge him with anything otherwise they have arrested and charged him, had him in court and he would have been remanded till a court appearance.

He will have been given a date to turn up at the police station for his bail, they will then either inform him there are no charges forthcoming and remove his bail conditions.

Or arrest him again then either charge him or possibly release him on bail again. However if they do release him on bail again there will be increased criticism of their investigative methods.

While they may not have sufficient evidence to charge him with anything at the moment, they are possibly hoping either he will incriminate himself whilst on bail, or more probably someone else will come forward and either confess or provide evidence against either him or someone else who committed the murder.

The pizza box, cider bottles could provide additional evidence against the perpetrator but are unlikely to be as crucial as has been made out by the press. Unless there are only two forensic samples on them (either DNA, fingerprints) and they are Joanna's and a suspect.

I have a feeling though while they do have some evidence against Jefferies, they have someone else in the frame for the murder.

[Pyramid*]

I am afraid you are wrong this was on the local news tonight why are you so upset would they put out old news of many days ago, tonight go to the somerset local news. 10/1/11. Pull the other one.

BUT TONIGHT THE POLICE DO NOT EXPECT ANY IMMEDIATE CHANGE HIS LAWYERS ARE PUSHING BUT THE POLICE ARE HAVING NONE OF IT. REPORTED 10/1/11 YOU SAID IT WAS REPOTED THAT HE WOULD BE RELEASED SOON. SO THIS IS NEW NEWS he will not be relesed from bail soon.

Given that I am not psychic, I am not to be expected to understand your half-completed comments that you put up, most of which are often disjointed and make little sense. Additionally, I did not state he would be released soon - I said it was reported that he and his lawyers were looking to take action/sue the police (for wrongful arrest) and the media for their comments.

[marney]

Given that I am not psychic, I am not to be expected to understand your half-completed comments that you put up, most of which are often disjointed and make little sense. Additionally, I did not state he would be released soon - I said it was reported that he and his lawyers were looking to take action/sue the police (for wrongful arrest) and the media for their comments.

You must really calm down dear. Now is that sentence to disjointed for you or would you like me to explain in more detail.

[marney]

Minimal evidence, hearsay, next to nothing.

Not enough to charge him with anything otherwise they have arrested and charged him, had him in court and he would have been remanded till a court appearance.

He will have been given a date to turn up at the police station for his bail, they will then either inform him there are no charges forthcoming and remove his bail conditions.

Or arrest him again then either charge him or possibly release him on bail again. However if they do release him on bail again there will be increased criticism of their investigative methods.

While they may not have sufficient evidence to charge him with anything at the moment, they are possibly hoping either he will incriminate himself whilst on bail, or more probably someone else will come forward and either confess or provide evidence against either him or someone else who committed the murder.

The pizza box, cider bottles could provide additional evidence against the perpetrator but are unlikely to be as crucial as has been made out by the press. Unless there are only two forensic samples on them (either DNA, fingerprints) and they are Joanna's and a suspect.

I have a feeling though while they do have some evidence against Jefferies, they have someone else in the frame for the murder.

At long last a posting on this debate site that is totally logical.
. Of interest the Lawyers acting on Jefferies behalf are based in Manchester and London.

[InOne]

http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/news/3341940/Sicko-sent-pizza-box-to-Jo-Yeates-pub-just-after-her-body-was-found.html

Wonder if this is legit or a sick joke D:

[Pyramid*]

You must really calm down dear. Now is that sentence to disjointed for you or would you like me to explain in more detail.

How droll.

[Pyramid*]

http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/news/3341940/Sicko-sent-pizza-box-to-Jo-Yeates-pub-just-after-her-body-was-found.html

Wonder if this is legit or a sick joke D:

There are a lot of sick people out there (killers and not). Who knows - it could just be eejits thinking they are funny. It could also be the killer playing with the police. It's mental either way, that's for sure.

[JobsForTheBoys]

CCTV cameras on the Clifton Suspension bridge not working properly.

I bet if they were responsible for issuing speeding fines at £60 a time they would be properly maintained.

[Patrick]

No sign of Jo's pizza or packaging has been found.

Maybe the killer was hungry..?

[Mifletz]

Saliva!
http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/news/3346001/Saliva-found-on-Jo-body.html

[marney]

Saliva!
http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/news/3346001/Saliva-found-on-Jo-body.html

Good news, but going by this bit in the Sun they seemed to have narrowed the suspect down to her flat.

Further tests are being carried out on other swabs taken from 25-year-old Jo's body - and from clothing and possessions in the flat in Clifton, Bristol, where she lived with boyfriend Greg Reardon, 27.

[Vicky.]

Maybe the killer was hungry..?

Hungry enough to eat the packaging? :p

[marney]

..www.people.co.uk/.../dramatic-new-cctv-evidence-which-could-provide-a-breakthrough-image-of-joanna-yeatess-murderer-was-last-night-being-...

Why on earth were the police not given this information weeks ago.

[InOne]

Link doesn't work for me :S

[Enid]

This is getting so much attention because the stupid ****ing po-leece keep releasing information. Yeah okay, think about it. You're trying to catch this killer, yet you're telling the whole nation she had a shoe missing when they found the body. Obviously if the guy still had the shoe, he's now going to get rid of the evidence. WELL DONE GUYS.

[Pyramid*]

..www.people.co.uk/.../dramatic-new-cctv-evidence-which-could-provide-a-breakthrough-image-of-joanna-yeatess-murderer-was-last-night-being- (http://www.people.co.uk/.../dramatic-new-cctv-evidence-which-could-provide-a-breakthrough-image-of-joanna-yeatess-murderer-was-last-night-being-)...

Why on earth were the police not given this information weeks ago.

The article doesn't state that the police weren't given this info weeks ago - they could have had it for some time and that info is only now being released. Because the word 'new footage' is included in the article, doesn't mean it is new to the police - only 'new' in relation to the public being unaware of it.

Or.....

the 71 year old could have been away on holiday for a few weeks during the whole saga and has recently returned, hence late availability of this footage.

or......

they actually don't have anything and are playing "panic the killer into thinking they have something on them" ?

It's anyone's guess.

Link doesn't work for me :S

Presume it's this : http://www.people.co.uk/news/uk-world-news/2011/01/16/dramatic-new-cctv-evidence-which-could-provide-a-breakthrough-image-of-joanna-yeatess-murderer-was-last-night-being-studied-by-detectives-102039-22852165/

One thing that interests me is the saliva found on Joanna. The DNA from this saliva, that they need to try to match up as they think it belongs to the killer...... I'll take a guess then that it hasn't matched up to CJ's DNA then, otherwise they'd have hauled him back in PDQ.

[marney]

PEOPLE newspaper UK & World News

Dramatic new CCTV *evidence which could *provide a breakthrough image of Joanna Yeates’s murderer was last night beingThe footage was captured on the night she went missing by security cameras on a private house 100 yards from her home.

One set up on the side of the building faces out towards the top end of the road where Jo lived.

The other points across the common towards Bristol's Clifton Village entrance to her road.

Crucially the two private cameras are on 24 hours a day. Police are studying the tapes and an insider said: This could be the breakthrough we've been waiting for.

The cameras were fixed to the end-of-terrace Harley Lodge, the home of world-renowned maths professor Sir John Kingman. It stands on the corner of Clifton Down and Canynge Road, the street where Jo, 25, shared a flat with her boyfriend Greg Reardon, 27.

It is believed they cover the route Jo took home. The CCTV could provide information about the time she arrived and reveal whether she was being followed.
Landscape architect Jo walked back after enjoying an evening with work colleagues at the Ram pub in Bristol city centre.

Yesterday Sir John, 71, a former vice-chancellor of the University of Bristol, confirmed he had handed CCTV tapes to the police.

He said: I have given everything I have, all the tapes I had, over to police from my CCTV. I cant comment on what was on them. studied by detectives.

[marney]

The article doesn't state that the police weren't given this info weeks ago - they could have had it for some time and that info is only now being released. Because the word 'new footage' is included in the article, doesn't mean it is new to the police - only 'new' in relation to the public being unaware of it.

Or.....

the 71 year old could have been away on holiday for a few weeks during the whole saga and has recently returned, hence late availability of this footage.

or......

they actually don't have anything and are playing "panic the killer into thinking they have something on them" ?

It's anyone's guess.



Presume it's this : http://www.people.co.uk/news/uk-world-news/2011/01/16/dramatic-new-cctv-evidence-which-could-provide-a-breakthrough-image-of-joanna-yeatess-murderer-was-last-night-being-studied-by-detectives-102039-22852165/

One thing that interests me is the saliva found on Joanna. The DNA from this saliva, that they need to try to match up as they think it belongs to the killer...... I'll take a guess then that it hasn't matched up to CJ's DNA then, otherwise they'd have hauled him back in PDQ.

The saliva could belong to anyone and not the killer but the camera on twenty-four hours a day would reveal a lot about the times of people coming and going in the area. Let's hope so.

[Pyramid*]

The saliva could belong to anyone and not the killer but the camera on twenty-four hours a day would reveal a lot about the times of people coming and going in the area. Let's hope so.

Obviously and a matter which was discussed and recognised pages ago....(giving people in bar goodnight kisses on leaving, Christmas kisses and hugs etc) but seeing as the POLICE have given the impression that it is a possible link or one that they have to rule out as being possible evidence (it could be the killer's, it could be unrelated) - my point quite clearly is that if the police are not ruling that link out, it's highly unlikely that it's CJ's saliva as the police were still trying to match it to someone. I'm quite sure that they have plenty of DNA samples from CJ. That was my point in my referencing CJ and the saliva.

[marney]

obviously and a matter which was discussed and recognised pages ago....(giving people in bar goodnight kisses on leaving, christmas kisses and hugs etc) but seeing as the police have given the impression that it is a possible link or one that they have to rule out as being possible evidence (it could be the killer's, it could be unrelated) - my point quite clearly is that if the police are not ruling that link out, it's highly unlikely that it's cj's saliva as the police were still trying to match it to someone. I'm quite sure that they have plenty of dna samples from cj. That was my point in my referencing cj and the saliva.

more than one person has been mentioned many times before so you cannot rule him out as not being involved in this. I guess statements he has made will be scrutinized against this latest ccvt evidence.

[Pyramid*]

more than one person has been mentioned many times before so you cannot rule him out as not being involved in this. I guess statements he has made will be scrutinized against this latest ccvt evidence.

Absolutely - and conversly, on the premise that the saliva DNA doesn't match CJ's, I personally can be of the opinion that he can be ruled out. It doesn't make me right (nor wrong), I offer up only my opinion.

The CCTV may or may not have anything relative at all - and yes indeed it may prove to be the missing link. Time will tell if it is helpful or not.

I am becoming pretty close to thinking that there is as much chance of the killer being caught as there is of pigs flying.

Has anyone heard of the outcome/results of the police trawling through almost 300 tons of household rubbish in an effort to track the pizza/pizza box??

Cardboard box. Not the most difficult things to dispose of - permanently (ie: burning it) if indeed there was any 'link' to the killer as far as that goes. Given that the killer has so far manged to baffle so many in the police force and evade capture, if they have been smart enough to do that so far, I'm of the opinon that if the pizza box was to be a cruciall piece of evidence, said killer would have also have been smart enough to ensure it's complete destruction.

[marney]

I would say the Police are dealing with a well educated manipulative killer who has at his disposal the best of Lawyers . If it were just Joe Public of the masses he would have been brought to justice by now I am sure. This is only my opinion, but time will tell.

[Pyramid*]

I would say the Police are dealing with a well educated manipulative killer who has at his disposal the best of Lawyers . If it were just Joe Public of the masses he would have been brought to justice by now I am sure. This is only my opinion, but time will tell.


You have your heart so set on it being one person eh! and why not - the police certainly aren't able to make a convincing case for or against anyone so far.

[babycakes]

The saliva could belong to anyone and not the killer but the camera on twenty-four hours a day would reveal a lot about the times of people coming and going in the area. Let's hope so.

I know where the house is as my offspring lives very close by, and it's almost on the corner of a four way junction so there are 4 exit routes someone could have taken away from Jo's flat.

[marney]

I know where the house is as my offspring lives very close by, and it's almost on the corner of a four way junction so there are 4 exit routes someone could have taken away from Jo's flat.

I see what you mean it may help though, perhaps they should obtain all private CCTV information via the four ways you mentioned

[Fetch The Bolt Cutters]

another detective :shocked:

[marney]

another detective :shocked:

Yes Miss Marples:xyxwave:

[marney]

BBC News BRISTOL 18 January 2011 Last updated at 00:00
Jo Yeates's parents say killer must not be shielded The parents of Jo Yeates have urged anyone shielding her killer to come forward.

David and Teresa Yeates said holding back information was prolonging the family's torment and could allow the killer to strike again.Mrs Yeates said anyone noticing unusual behaviour in a friend or relative should tell police

[InOne]

Seems a ridiculous long show and makes the think the trail has gone stone cold.

[marney]

seems a ridiculous long show and makes the think the trail has gone stone cold.

it does seem that way but maybe the evidence they have wont stick. We dont know what is going on behind the scene

[Pyramid*]

Seems a ridiculous long show and makes the think the trail has gone stone cold.

I'm sure I read somewhere that after the first 28days, a new team of detectives are brought in - fresh eyes and minds. Can also recall reading that they were intending bringing in older and more experienced detectives etc. Will be interesting if fresh blood bring about anything new.

[icemaiden]

I'm sure I read somewhere that after the first 28days, a new team of detectives are brought in - fresh eyes and minds. Can also recall reading that they were intending bringing in older and more experienced detectives etc. Will be interesting if fresh blood bring about anything new.

That was probably newspaper speculation. Although, I am surprised Scotland Yard is not involved at this stage.

[Pyramid*]

That was probably newspaper speculation. Although, I am surprised Scotland Yard is not involved at this stage.


No, I mean as in something bona fide from a police p.o.v. - rather than tabloid reading. I must go have a mooch, I could be getting mixed up, but I'm sure I read it somewhere that it was standard practise.


Yep - here it is:-

One of the ways in which the police service in England and Wales has endeavoured to improve
the quality of murder enquiries is by conducting reviews of investigations. In 1989, the
Association of Chief Police Officers of England, Wales and Northern Ireland (ACPO) introduced a
policy recommending that reviews be carried out on all murders that remain undetected after 28
days. The aims of the review process were to identify and develop investigative opportunities that
will progress an investigation, to act as a form of quality assurance in relation to both the content
and process of an investigation, and to identify, develop and disseminate good investigative
practice. Further guidelines to enhance the conduct of reviews were issued in 1998 by ACPO
Crime Committee as part of the Major Incident Room Standard Administrative Procedures
(MIRSAP). Consequently, each force should have a policy in place for dealing with reviews based
upon these guidelines.

http://rds.homeoffice.gov.uk/rds/pdfs04/rdsolr2504.pdf Whether it was this exactly this or something more recent I can't recall, but it was in this type of format. It may not not be part of procedure, but as I say, I'm sure I read that it still was the way it works. I could of course be wrong.

[Shasown]

That was probably newspaper speculation. Although, I am surprised Scotland Yard is not involved at this stage.

No its not speculation at all, after 28 days the local force commander will instigate a review of the investigation and will on recommendation of the reviewing officer change parts of the investigation team if deemed necessary.

Mind you it is customary to wait 28 days after an investigation starts before a review is called, we are only on day 24 given the body was discovered on 25th December.

I would be more surprised if Scotland Yard ever got involved, it is the headquarters of the Metropolitan Police Force(of Greater London). Given that the murder is believed to have occurred in Bristol which is in the area policed by the Avon and Somerset Police Force, it would show no faith in the investigative powers of the home force if an outside force was called in to deal with it.

[marney]

Police said they not want to bring in a different investigative team now as they were close to a breakthrough this was reported a couple of days ago. In that case it seems odd that all this has gone out tonight and reconstruction on TV next week. Bu they may be just searching for more evidence to uphold what they already have. We saw what happened when they brought in a new police Constables to Jersey, in the Haut de la garenne case it was a total whitewash but it can't be much worse then what's going on now.

[InOne]

Police have comfirmed she didn't eat the pizza. And that the whole box and pizza are still missing. They're still insisting it's the ultimate piece of evidence that can solve what happened to her :S

[Pyramid*]

Police have comfirmed she didn't eat the pizza. And that the whole box and pizza are still missing. They're still insisting it's the ultimate piece of evidence that can solve what happened to her :S

Who knows. After the text she made to the male friend on her way home - the one who didn't text back taking her up on her offer of a drink..... (perhaps that was in her mind, get a pizza, invite him round for drinks, and there was something to nibble on on the assumption that he would accept her offer) - but when he didn't reply - she could have chucked the pizza in a bin on the way home. The receipt could have been in her jacket pocket (which the police found).

[marney]

Or she could have bought the pizza for someone , if they have not found the receipt then that could be the case . I know the police said receipts were found did that include the Pizza. The way the body was found on Christmas day, for all to see with one sock missing ,was the killer/s making some kind of statement. The police also think the killer went back to the body, all part of certain rituals. Was it the friend she phoned on the night, but would he have had access to a new 4x4 like the one seen in the area where Jo s body was found, would he not have left her body in the flat and surely he would have taken her mobile phone as it would have clearly implicated him. I can't see anyone wanting to move the body from that flat other than it was too close to home for those living there or for other purposes.

[arista]

A 32 year man has been arrested.



SkyNewsHD Live.

[GypsyGoth]

A 32 year man has been arrested.



SkyNewsHD Live.

I bet he killed her for the pizza.

[marney]

Good news, we will have to see what unfolds. If CJ is not involved then presumably he will be released soon.

[InOne]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-bristol-12238262

So vauge it pisses me off, telling us everything we already know. How many times can they reword the same few paragraphs!!

[arista]

I bet he killed her for the pizza.



That would be so Evil.

[marney]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-bristol-12238262

So vauge it pisses me off, telling us everything we already know. How many times can they reword the same few paragraphs!!

True

[Crimson Dynamo]

So this has been dominating the news, buit would she get this much attention if she wasn't good looking and in a decent job? The media is so fickle :bored:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-bristol-12080254

since she was killed around 35,500 others have been murdered around the world

approximately 1425 people get murdered every day

520,000 or so per year



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murder

[Patrick]

I'm bored of her now, seriously.
She's not even interesting.

[marney]

since she was killed around 35,500 others have been murdered around the world

approximately 1425 people get murdered every day

520,000 or so per year



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murder

Yes, but lets hope this is the start of things to come and every murder and abduction will get the same attention. But all the facts have to be made known for this to happen.

[Shasown]

Yes, but lets hope this is the start of things to come and every murder and abduction will get the same attention. But all the facts have to be made known for this to happen.

From the news article:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-bristol-12238262


Miss Yeates's parents, David and Teresa, made a televised appeal for information on Monday in which they urged "armchair detectives" to help police.


Did you offer your assistance to the police?

[marney]

Minimal evidence, hearsay, next to nothing.

Not enough to charge him with anything otherwise they have arrested and charged him, had him in court and he would have been remanded till a court appearance.

He will have been given a date to turn up at the police station for his bail, they will then either inform him there are no charges forthcoming and remove his bail conditions.

Or arrest him again then either charge him or possibly release him on bail again. However if they do release him on bail again there will be increased the moment, they are possibly hoping either he will incriminate himself whilst on bail, or more probably someone else will come forward and either confess or provide evidence against either him or someone else who committed the murder.

The pizza box, cider bottles could provide additional evidence against the perpetrator but are unlikely to be as crucial as has been made out by the press. Unless there are only two forensic samples on them (either DNA, fingerprints) and they are Joanna's and a suspect.

I have a feeling though while they do have some evidence against Jefferies, they have someone else in the frame for the murder.

No,I think they have already followed this thread. I think you have it spot on here, there is some talk that the guy they arrested lives in the same block of flats.

[arista]

The Flat is Owned by Vincent Tabek


SkyNewsHD Live

[arista]

I'm bored of her now, seriously.
She's not even interesting.


She will be
If she was Murdered for a Top End Tesco Pizza.

[Pyramid*]

32 year old man, police not releasing details but good old Twitter already doing the rounds as well as the press in jumping in there with the name of this 'alledged' yet to be confirmed suspect.

Mmm...... now this will be interesting. They lifted the LL and now somone else 'purportedly' to be a person who lived right next door. I shall not pass judgement yet till I hear/see hard evidence. Developments on this are going to be interesting. I bet CJ and his legal team will be watching this like a hawk.

[Mifletz]

Look how the only thing separating Joanna's bedroom from the Dutchman's was a 1/2" piece of plywood!

http://i56.tinypic.com/2i8k4uv.jpg

[Pyramid*]

Look how the only thing separating Joanna's bedroom from the Dutchman's was a 1/2" piece of plywood!

I know! If the site plans are correct & accurate - one blocked off door.

[marney]

Look how the only thing separating Joanna's bedroom from the Dutchman's was a 1/2" piece of plywood!

http://i56.tinypic.com/2i8k4uv.jpg

DID CJ tell the Police about this ,could it be easily dismantled and put back as not to be noticed.

[arista]

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2011/01/20/article-1348832-0CD6D068000005DC-409_306x423.jpg

Dutch architect Vincent Tabak, 32


I wonder if he had the top end tesco pizza


He can now be held for 4 days.

[InOne]

Do we actually know what they have on him? Or they not said...

[Mifletz]

Another presumed Dutch killer, Joran van der Sloot

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/e/ea/Joran_van_der_Sloot_Aruba_mugshot.jpg

presumed murderer of Natalee Holloway http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Natalee_Holloway

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/5/5f/Natalee_Holloway_yearbook_photo.jpg

These Dutchmen sure like blondes!

[Pyramid*]

Do we actually know what they have on him? Or they not said...

A quick scout on webland isn't throwing up much. After the fracas with CJ, I think they police will be very careful now.

[arista]

http://news.sky.com/sky-news/content/StaticFile/jpg/2011/Jan/Week3/15901888.jpg


http://news.sky.com/sky-news/content/StaticFile/jpg/2011/Jan/Week3/15901887.jpg

http://news.sky.com/sky-news/content/StaticFile/jpg/2011/Jan/Week3/15901907.jpg

Here we go again

[CarriKP]

A quick scout on webland isn't throwing up much. After the fracas with CJ, I think they police will be very careful now.

And quite rightly too.
As last time, the police don't seem to have released the name but the press have published both name and photos. Makes a mockery again of 'innocent until proved guilty.'
I found this spoof rather amusing but don't read it unless you can tolerate black humour
http://www.thespoof.com/news/spoof.cfm?headline=s1i89988#this

[CarriKP]

http://news.sky.com/sky-news/content/StaticFile/jpg/2011/Jan/Week3/15901888.jpg


http://news.sky.com/sky-news/content/StaticFile/jpg/2011/Jan/Week3/15901887.jpg

http://news.sky.com/sky-news/content/StaticFile/jpg/2011/Jan/Week3/15901907.jpg

Here we go again

Yes. After the "eccentric" landlord we have the "quiet" Dutchman.

I wonder if we'll end up with enough characters for a game of Cluedo?

[Kerry]

Bloody hell, someones touchy

[Pyramid*]

Bloody hell, someones touchy
:conf::conf::conf:

[Kerry]

:conf::conf::conf:

The above post seemed a little touchy and defensive of the alleged accused

I can't abide tabloids nor have any opinion really about this case at present as I don't know enough about it (and I may have misread the context of said above post) but it seemed touchy

[Pyramid*]

The above post seemed a little touchy and defensive of the alleged accused

I can't abide tabloids nor have any opinion really about this case at present as I don't know enough about it (and I may have misread the context of said above post) but it seemed touchy

Which post? (My settings show your post as being the 'last' one). I can't see any recent posts that seems 'a little touchy', and none that would warrant a 'bloody hell, someones touchy' reply. So I'm still :conf: and in the dark !!!

[Kerry]

Which post? (My settings show your post as being the 'last' one). I can't see any recent posts that seems 'a little touchy', and none that would warrant a 'bloody hell, someones touchy' reply. So I'm still :conf: and in the dark !!!

CarriKP's posts. As I say, I probably have read them out of context

[Pyramid*]

CarriKP's posts. As I say, I probably have read them out of context



I honestly think it's perhaps the way you've read it (maybe not mind you, but I don't think so). I read it as CarriKP was agreeing that it was best the police be wary of releasing info after the way the press jumped all over CJ - then Carri showed the way the press seem to be going down a similar line with a person that the police have not yet even named or confirmed to be the man all over the papers - an unnamed man not yet chraged/found guilty (which tbh, is fair comment given that some people have since the start, had CJ 'hung, drawn and quartered' without the man even being charged).

I think their Cluedo reference was showing a certain disdain through humour for the press now going to town with their 'labelling headlines', putting up pictures/details on this as yet, unnamed man (although given his employers are directing all enquires about this gentleman to A&S police, even Inspector Clouseau could work it out) - when although a suspect, the man hasn't yet been charged of anything and could be an innocent party. (Though I suspect that after the CJ situ, the police may have more tangible reasons for this arrest). We will soon find out!!

[Kerry]

Again, I clearly may have read out of context and do NOT agree with tabloid speculation.

[Pyramid*]

Again, I clearly may have read out of context and do NOT agree with tabloid speculation.

Yep, you'd think they'd wait a few days to see the outcome of the arrest before plastering pictures / family details all over the place. I'm all for freedom of information but at least wait until some credible information is released from the police. For all we know, this could be another CJ situation.

[Angus]

Surely the first thing they would have done is search all the flats in Jo's block, ESPECIALLY the next door neighbour? If not, what do they think they will find now after almost a month?

[Pyramid*]

Surely the first thing they would have done is search all the flats in Jo's block, ESPECIALLY the next door neighbour? If not, what do they think they will find now after almost a month?

One would have thought so - especially when the did CJ, and had invovlement with the other neighbour - the chap whose car was taken away. They've certainly given this guy a month to clear up if he was invovled.

[marney]

The above post seemed a little touchy and defensive of the alleged accused

I can't abide tabloids nor have any opinion really about this case at present as I don't know enough about it (and I may have misread the context of said above post) but it seemed touchy

You are right there are some very defensive posts on here concerning all of the suspects. If you read back you will see. I wonder why.

[arista]

Yes. After the "eccentric" landlord we have the "quiet" Dutchman.

I wonder if we'll end up with enough characters for a game of Cluedo?



Yes good one.


In his Flat there is something that connects him.


I think he is the one.

[Angus]

Yes good one.


In his Flat there is something that connects him.


I think he is the one.

If that is true then the Police are remiss in not having searched ALL the neighbours' flats immediately Jo went missing - never mind waiting till they found a body. They won't find anything now.

Interesting too that he is an architect with close links to the company Joanna worked for, his girlfriend is very similar looking to Joanna and his particular field of expertise is as a people flow analyst.

[Shasown]

If that is true then the Police are remiss in not having searched ALL the neighbours' flats immediately Jo went missing - never mind waiting till they found a body. They won't find anything now.

Interesting too that he is an architect with close links to the company Joanna worked for, his girlfriend is very similar looking to Joanna and his particular field of expertise is as a people flow analyst.

If only life were that simple.

The police are bound by the very laws they uphold, they cant just search someones property without evidence, if the evidence is only a vague suspicion of a crime having been committed in a property there are certain procedures they have to follow.

In the event of the property owner not being available to give permission for a search they would have needed to obtain a warrant, in which case they have to prove to a senior officer that they had good reason to search.

I note in some reports it says the man had just returned from holiday, they may have needed to speak to him again to confirm something he had possibly already told him, prior to launching a full scale forensic search of his pad.

Due to the high profile of the case and the ever present presence of the media they will have been conducting this investigation by the book.

[marney]

Police said he had an unusual picture on his website , long shadow is there a clue here.?

[Pyramid*]

If only life were that simple.

The police are bound by the very laws they uphold, they cant just search someones property without evidence, if the evidence is only a vague suspicion of a crime having been committed in a property there are certain procedures they have to follow.

In the event of the property owner not being available to give permission for a search they would have needed to obtain a warrant, in which case they have to prove to a senior officer that they had good reason to search.

I note in some reports it says the man had just returned from holiday, they may have needed to speak to him again to confirm something he had possibly already told him, prior to launching a full scale forensic search of his pad.

Due to the high profile of the case and the ever present presence of the media they will have been conducting this investigation by the book.

That's actually a good point, and I recall I also read a report saying that he had been on holiday. Additionally, I read that he hadn't been staying in the flat because of everything that had been going on.

[arista]

If that is true then the Police are remiss in not having searched ALL the neighbours' flats immediately Jo went missing - never mind waiting till they found a body. They won't find anything now.

Interesting too that he is an architect with close links to the company Joanna worked for, his girlfriend is very similar looking to Joanna and his particular field of expertise is as a people flow analyst.


You could be wrong there
as the First search was nothing like this Tech Team.

[Shasown]

You could be wrong there
as the First search was nothing like this Tech Team.

Very true, a preliminary search when someone goes missing will simply look for signs of a possible crime scene, evidence of a struggle, time manpower and financial resources limit it them to no more than a cursory look over.

However now they are able to zero in on possible crime scenes forensic team searches can find traces of blood invisible to the eye, even after it has been cleaned up.

Also carpets upholstery etc will be subject to trace searches, where the minutest traces of substances will be examined microscopically.

Its also a good sign to see the investigation team have applied for and been granted extra time to question Tabak.

[Angus]

So it seems it was Tabak's girlfriend that tipped the police off - the plot thickens!

[InOne]

They have until the end of the day to question him

[Angus]

Hmm, Tabak and his girlfriend split up in September and he was living alone. She bears a striking resemblance to Joanna. The landlord spoke to Tabak that evening telling him about Greg's difficulty in starting his car, so he would have known Joanna would be alone. Two separate people heard a woman scream "help me" around 9 pm on 17th coming from the direction of his flat. All pretty circumstantial at the moment, but adding up.

[Pyramid*]

Hmm, Tabak and his girlfriend split up in September and he was living alone. She bears a striking resemblance to Joanna. The landlord spoke to Tabak that evening telling him about Greg's difficulty in starting his car, so he would have known Joanna would be alone. Two separate people heard a woman scream "help me" around 9 pm on 17th coming from the direction of his flat. All pretty circumstantial at the moment, but adding up.

Which begs the question: was it Joanna that the CJ actually saw on Friday 17th - or was it Tabak's girlfriend?.......

[Sarah.]

He's been charged..
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-12257299

[Pyramid*]

Interesting .......


Here's a snippet from this morning's DM

The mother of Vincent Tabak broke her silence last night to back her son – insisting he was acting ‘normally’ in the week following Joanna Yeates’s death.

Mr Tabak left Bristol for a family holiday in Holland two days after Miss Yeates was reported missing.
He was only arrested last week after his return to the UK.



Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1349615/Jo-Yeates-murder-Vincent-Tabak-charged-murder.html#ixzz1BoZdmKPF

[arista]

"He's been charged."
Yes Sarah.


http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2011/01/23/article-1349615-0CD845A5000005DC-707_306x423.jpg


Yes 32 year old Tabak is now charged with her Murder
Evil man he is.
In Court tomorrow Monday.


http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2011/01/23/article-1349615-0CA9F794000005DC-104_306x423.jpg
25 year old Joanna Yeates
was not safe in those flats.

[Kerry]

Luckily, these days, you can't get away with murder. Not for long. It'll always catch up with you. Wether you're 18 or 80. One day.....

[Novo]

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2011/01/02/article-1343360-0C9DA7C0000005DC-960_306x423.jpg

Good old CJ, we all knew he was Innocent

[arista]

"Good old CJ, we all knew he was Innocent "




Yes the papers did a Number on him.

[Pyramid*]

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2011/01/02/article-1343360-0C9DA7C0000005DC-960_306x423.jpg

Good old CJ, we all knew he was Innocent

I'd say most of us on here had that gut feeling, that CJ was innocent.

There were some on here who had themselves convinced that CJ was guilty. I'm pleased that it appears to not be the case. I'd hate for some of these people to ever have to enter a court room as a jury member - so quick to point fingers and castigate an innocent man.

As for the parasites (prevous tenants and such like) in the background, coming forward to slate a senior citizen with their slanderous comments, and character assasinations - I bet they don't feel a shred of remorse in doing so - happy in the interim to tend to sharpening their pitchforks whilst waiting for the next time they can mouth off without substance.

Wonder how long it will take police to remove his bail / conditions? I hope he takes the bloody media for huge sums, I really do.

As for VT - after the CJ palava - I'm pretty sure that the police will have ensured their reasons to charge him would be watertight to ensure conviction. Time will tell.

[marney]

We have not got all the details of what went on seems a bit too cut and dry. We don't know if anyone else was involved and presumably they can t release CJ from bail until Monday.

[InOne]

"He's been charged."
Yes Sarah.


http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2011/01/23/article-1349615-0CD845A5000005DC-707_306x423.jpg


Yes 32 year old Tabak is now charged with her Murder
Evil man he is.
In Court tomorrow Monday.


http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2011/01/23/article-1349615-0CA9F794000005DC-104_306x423.jpg
25 year old Joanna Yeates
was not safe in those flats.


This goes back to my original point. Look how good she looks there, theres been loads of different photos. If she was fat and ugly and older it would not get this attention :bored:


But it's good they've found someone to give the family closure.

[Pyramid*]

You are right there are some very defensive posts on here concerning all of the suspects. If you read back you will see. I wonder why.

"All of the suspects" Which 'all suspects' do you refer to?

No need for you to wonder Marney - the reason is simple. Not all of us were prepared to label an eccentric older man as being the killer - there is this bizarre but well known phrase, let me introduce you to it: "Innocent until proven guilty".

Even as far as VT is concerned, he has been charged - charges can be dropped, and he still has to be found guilty - if the police have the evidence to prove this beyond reasonable doubt.

[Pyramid*]

We have not got all the details of what went on seems a bit too cut and dry. We don't know if anyone else was involved and presumably they can t release CJ from bail until Monday.

You presume wrong Marney. CJ could remain under bail conditions until the VT court trial is underway - there have been previous murder cases where person A was arrested, released under bail - person B then arrested, charged, and not until the trial of person B was underway that person A was actually freed from bail.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/suffolk/6729723.stm

more info on wiki about that case.

[marney]

I'd say most of us on here had that gut feeling, that CJ was innocent.

There were some on here who had themselves convinced that CJ was guilty. I'm pleased that it appears to not be the case. I'd hate for some of these people to ever have to enter a court room as a jury member - so quick to point fingers and castigate an innocent man.

As for the parasites (prevous tenants and such like) in the background, coming forward to slate a senior citizen with their slanderous comments, and character assasinations - I bet they don't feel a shred of remorse in doing so - happy in the interim to tend to sharpening their pitchforks whilst waiting for the next time they can mouth off without substance.

Wonder how long it will take police to remove his bail / conditions? I hope he takes the bloody media for huge sums, I really do.

As for VT - after the CJ palava - I'm pretty sure that the police will have ensured their reasons to charge him would be watertight to ensure conviction. Time will tell.

When these people are questioned by the police do you expect them to lie about what they know about CJ. They have told the truth as far as they know it. Obsessed with death lets himself in and out of the flats etc , etc . I think you should put the blame on the media for putting it out there in the first place if you want to blame someone, not the residents or those who know him for stating the facts.

[Pyramid*]

This goes back to my original point. Look how good she looks there, theres been loads of different photos. If she was fat and ugly and older it would not get this attention :bored:


But it's good they've found someone to give the family closure.

I'm still going with the angle that it was because of the time of year and in how much the parents went public on it.....and then with it going from a missing person enquiry to a murder hunt seeking the killer. That together with the previous unsolved case in the area over 30 odd years ago - I think all of those factors helped gain it coverage.

[Pyramid*]

When these people are questioned by the police do you expect them to lie about what they know about CJ. They have told the truth as far as they know it. Obsessed with death lets himself in and out of the flats etc , etc . I think you should put the blame on the media for putting it out there in the first place if you want to blame someone, not the residents or those who know him for stating the facts.

I expect people - like you - to be less obsessed with trying to label the landlord the killer, based on very scant and very twisted information, and information badly reported & portrayed by the media.

I expect people like the former tenants to keep their gobby mouths shut with their incriminating comments, until facts are given, rather than them wanting their 5 mintues of "Oooh.... I knew him " fame and wanting to stick the boot iin.

I love gory movies, the gorier the better (ie: Hostel, Saw ....that kind of stuff, all involving death, and painful terrifying ones). : I also used to have a key to the house I now live in,when I rented it out, and was able to check it whenever I liked - as was in the contract of lease. that must make me a killer then huh!

The one thing wrong with our Jury System is that people like you are allowed to sit on them - dishing out guilty votes/verdict based on what you read in trashy tabloids.

[MTVN]

I'm still going with the angle that it was because of the time of year and in how much the parents went public on it.....and then with it going from a missing person enquiry to a murder hunt seeking the killer. That together with the previous unsolved case in the area over 30 odd years ago - I think all of those factors helped gain it coverage.

I disagree with the time of year argument, I read an article last week about how three other people went missing the very same week - and are still missing - but have recieved no publicity

[Pyramid*]

I disagree with the time of year argument, I read an article last week about how three other people went missing the very same week - and are still missing - but have recieved no publicity



Still missing, but not found dead - I think that may have had much to do with the continued reporting - and as I mentioned, the previous unsolved murder in the area 30years ago etc.

Aslo - have these missing persons families pushed for media coverage - have they had any (I'm asking you something that you wouldn't perhaps be expected to know...sorry!!!)

The other thing that may have something to do with it is 'social class' (which I guess touches a little on InOne's original thoughts on Joanna 'having a good job') - that could be a factor, I agree.

Not being part of the media, like yourselves, I'm only open to my own thoughts. You may both be right.

[MTVN]

Still missing, but not found dead - I think that may have had much to do with the continued reporting - and as I mentioned, the previous unsolved murder in the area 30years ago etc.

Aslo - have these missing persons families pushed for media coverage - have they had any (I'm asking you something that you wouldn't perhaps be expected to know...sorry!!!)

The other thing that may have something to do with it is 'social class' (which I guess touches a little on InOne's original thoughts on Joanna 'having a good job') - that could be a factor, I agree.

Not being part of the media, like yourselves, I'm only open to my own thoughts. You may both be right.

But this case still recieved a lot of publicity before she was found dead. In the case of one of the people who went missing, it had been the sixth time since July so that would have played a part.

I'm unsure if any family pushed for media coverage, they may well not have done, I'm not really in a position to say

[Pyramid*]

But this case still recieved a lot of publicity before she was found dead. In the case of one of the people who went missing, it had been the sixth time since July so that would have played a part.

I'm unsure if any family pushed for media coverage, they may well not have done, I'm not really in a position to say

I think Joanna's family's willingness to make public appeals when she was missing -at that time of year - put it in the spotlight intially. Given that it was just a week between her officially being reported missing and her body found: the case took a whole new twist - on hunting for a killer - especially when there appeared to be no real motive. Additionally, there was the comparison to a similar type unsolved murder from years ago.

the circumstances - with Greg the boyfriend being away that very weekend Joanna disappeared, her not joining him to 'wave him off goodbye' knowing he'd be driving in fairly bad / snowy driving conitions, him texting / her not replying / Joanna saying she was looking forward to weekend on her own then texting a male friend an hour or so after Greg left Bristol inviting them for a drink, both the father and boyfriend referring to Joanna in the past tense before her body had been found etc ..... there were a lot of elements to the situation which could have spun it in various ways.

Guess what I'm saying is that there were a lot of behaviours in the whole scenario (which could - 'could' - be construed as 'odd/strange/not quite right' - that gave it a far more (gruesomely) interesting angle to it - adding to the heightened intrest in the case. Rather than (for example) - some girl being randomly knifed to death in a shopping centre.

[marney]

I expect people - like you - to be less obsessed with trying to label the landlord the killer, based on very scant and very twisted information, and information badly reported & portrayed by the media.

I expect people like the former tenants to keep their gobby mouths shut with their incriminating comments, until facts are given, rather than them wanting their 5 mintues of "Oooh.... I knew him " fame and wanting to stick the boot iin.

I love gory movies, the gorier the better (ie: Hostel, Saw ....that kind of stuff, all involving death, and painful terrifying ones). : I also used to have a key to the house I now live in,when I rented it out, and was able to check it whenever I liked - as was in the contract of lease. that must make me a killer then huh!

The one thing wrong with our Jury System is that people like you are allowed to sit on them - dishing out guilty votes/verdict based on what you read in trashy tabloids.

I have already said there is on law for some and another for the masses and you have proved it.You can call label them Gobby but they should not be able to tell the truth as they see it and give their opinion on Jefferies, as being obsessed with death, strange, lets himself into other peoples flats etc.

[Pyramid*]

I have already said there is on law for some and another for the masses and you have proved it.You can call label them Gobby but they should not be able to tell the truth as they see it and give their opinion on Jefferies, as being obsessed with death, strange, lets himself into other peoples flats etc.

I hate to be the one to break the news to you Marney: but a person's opinion (which is what the gobby lot offered, and it's my opinion that they gobbed off) is precisely that - an OPINION.

An opinion is not a fact. :bored: Deary me, it's astounding that you seem unable to distinguish between the two.

The only thing you have proven is that there are people who are willing to take the opinion of others - and turn it into fact.

Many people are fascinated by death, many people are strange, many people have keys to other's homes (did CJ ever let himself into Joanna and Greg's flat!) - none of those things maketh a person a killer. ;) To clarify: this last sentence is a fact - not an opinion.

[marney]

I hate to be the one to break the news to you Marney: but a person's opinion (which is what the gobby lot offered, and it's my opinion that they gobbed off) is precisely that - an OPINION.

An opinion is not a fact. :bored: Deary me, it's astounding that you seem unable to distinguish between the two.

The only thing you have proven is that there are people who are willing to take the opinion of others - and turn it into fact.

Many people are fascinated by death, many people are strange, many people have keys to other's homes (did CJ ever let himself into Joanna and Greg's flat!) - none of those things maketh a person a killer. ;) To clarify: this last sentence is a fact - not an opinion.

Yes they may be opinions but was he detained on these opinions, I doubt it. So you are still no better by calling these people Gobby, I hope they SUE AS YOU KEEP HINTING JEFFERIES SHOULD.

Morbid interest in death I wouldn't trust anyone like that even if he was not actually the killer JUST MY OPINION THOUGH.

[Pyramid*]

Yes they may be opinions but was he detained on these opinions, I doubt it. So you are still no better by calling these people Gobby, I hope they SUE AS YOU KEEP HINTING JEFFERIES SHOULD.

Morbid interest in death I wouldn't trust anyone like that even if he was not actually the killer JUST MY OPINION THOUGH.

Gob$hites I'd really call them. To be precise. ;)

You hope they sue me!!! :laugh3:

... that's fricking hilarious!!! Yeah - sue me for having an opinion on them mouthing off to the press!! :pat:

Difference is Marney: my opinion isn't casting doubt on their killing intentions or offering enough opinion to give rise to public speculation by people (like you, who read far too much into other people's opinions) - for me to form the view that an innocent man could therefore be a killer. Do you see what I'm getting at here? My opinion isn't likely to damage them in any way shape or form. ;) They gave opinions at a crucial point where their words may have been damaging to CJ. I gave my view on their opinions and of the damage their opinions had.

Oh and seeing as you're still unable absorb precisely what I have said over and over again: I don't hint that CJ should sue the media - no hinting from me, I'm absolutely behind him if he and his legal team should wish to do so. 100%. That's 100% back up from me.

I'd far prefer to trust a person who had interest in death and dying, that trust a person who was willing to find an innocent man guilty when they had no real reason to do so - other than gossip that they read in low rate tabloids. ;)

[Mifletz]

What exactly is the legal definition in the UK of "Wrongful Arrest"? Is it actionable?

[Pyramid*]

What exactly is the legal definition in the UK of "Wrongful Arrest"? Is it actionable?

yes, it can be actionable.

I put up a link a few pages back (cba looking for it now - sorry....), but yes is the answer.

[marney]

Gob$hites I'd really call them. To be precise. ;)

You hope they sue me!!! :laugh3:

... that's fricking hilarious!!! Yeah - sue me for having an opinion on them mouthing off to the press!! :pat:

Difference is Marney: my opinion isn't casting doubt on their killing intentions or offering enough opinion to give rise to public speculation by people (like you, who read far too much into other people's opinions) - for me to form the view that an innocent man could therefore be a killer. Do you see what I'm getting at here? My opinion isn't likely to damage them in any way shape or form. ;) They gave opinions at a crucial point where their words may have been damaging to CJ. I gave my view on their opinions and of the damage their opinions had.

Oh and seeing as you're still unable absorb precisely what I have said over and over again: I don't hint that CJ should sue the media - no hinting from me, I'm absolutely behind him if he and his legal team should wish to do so. 100%. That's 100% back up from me.

I'd far prefer to trust a person who had interest in death and dying, that trust a person who was willing to find an innocent man guilty when they had no real reason to do so - other than gossip that they read in low rate tabloids. ;)


What's Happened To The Landlord?

Martin Brunt January 23, 2011 10:32 AM

Now the police say they've got their man, Vincent Tabak, for the Jo Yeates murder, there is one big question.

What about her landlord Chris Jefferies, the first suspect who fiercely denied any guilt?

He might have thought he would be eliminated now.

The police told me: "In the light of this latest development we are now considering the impact of this on other aspects of the investigation."

So, officially, he's still a suspect and still on bail.

Last heard of, his lawyers were sifting through media reports of his arrest and exploring legal action for defamation against various outlets.

The rather eccentric former public school master seemed to be gearing up for a major assault on journalists.

So, what's going on?

Oh, and another question.

Why didn't police arrest Mr. Tabak earlier?

Living next door to the victim he must have been a major 'person of interest' to the murder squad.

The golden rule for detectives on any investigation is to "clear the ground under your feet."

The policy is to TIE - trace, interview and eliminate - all those emotionally and physically close to the victim.

Mr. Tabak couldn't really have been any closer, physically. A few feet most of the time.

[Shasown]

What's Happened To The Landlord?

Martin Brunt January 23, 2011 10:32 AM

Now the police say they've got their man, Vincent Tabak, for the Jo Yeates murder, there is one big question.

What about her landlord Chris Jefferies, the first suspect who fiercely denied any guilt?

He might have thought he would be eliminated now.

The police told me: "In the light of this latest development we are now considering the impact of this on other aspects of the investigation."

So, officially, he's still a suspect and still on bail.

Last heard of, his lawyers were sifting through media reports of his arrest and exploring legal action for defamation against various outlets.

The rather eccentric former public school master seemed to be gearing up for a major assault on journalists.

So, what's going on?

Oh, and another question.

Why didn't police arrest Mr. Tabak earlier?

Living next door to the victim he must have been a major 'person of interest' to the murder squad.

The golden rule for detectives on any investigation is to "clear the ground under your feet."

The policy is to TIE - trace, interview and eliminate - all those emotionally and physically close to the victim.

Mr. Tabak couldn't really have been any closer, physically. A few feet most of the time.

Martin Brunt crime correspondent? Seems like he knows next to nothing doesnt it? It also seems like he is attempting to distance himself from the feeding frenzy like witch hunt the media decided to engage in regarding Jefferies.

Chris Jeffries could still be on bail while the police continue investigations into not only the murder itself but also any other crimes he may be suspected of which may or may not have come to light during the investigation.

They didnt arrest Tabak for a couple of reasons, they initially didnt suspect him, they had no evidence (they didnt attempt to arrest Tabak until after they had viewed the tapes from the old fellow down the roads's CCTV and the tapes from the Severn Bridge CCTV), they were building up a case including crime profile etc.

But perhaps the biggest reason is, he wasnt in the country. Its a bit difficult attempting to arrest someone when they arent in the same country, let alone county.

Besides until they interviewed him they still may not have had enough evidence to ask the Dutch Police to arrest and extradite for questioning. And they may have wanted not to scare him into running or fighting an extradition hearing.

Leaving Jefferies on bail would also have reassured Tabak to some extent that the police didnt suspect him.

[Pyramid*]

The mother of Vincent Tabak broke her silence last night to back her son – insisting he was acting ‘normally’ in the week following Joanna Yeates’s death.

Mr Tabak left Bristol for a family holiday in Holland two days after Miss Yeates was reported missing.
He was only arrested last week after his return to the UK.



Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1349615/Jo-Yeates-murder-Vincent-Tabak-charged-murder.html#ixzz1BoZdmKPF

What's Happened To The Landlord?

Martin Brunt January 23, 2011 10:32 AM

Oh, and another question.

Why didn't police arrest Mr. Tabak earlier?

Living next door to the victim he must have been a major 'person of interest' to the murder squad.

The golden rule for detectives on any investigation is to "clear the ground under your feet."

The policy is to TIE - trace, interview and eliminate - all those emotionally and physically close to the victim.

Mr. Tabak couldn't really have been any closer, physically. A few feet most of the time.

I'm afraid someone's geography and ability to work out distances isn't so good. Holland is more than a few feet away. Tabak was in Holland.

As for CJ?


' They had interviewed Miss Yeates’s landlord but nothing materialised from it and there was no concrete evidence linking him in any way to the murder.

‘It appears he had brought himself under suspicion by making a series of comments which now appear to be irrelevant and innocuous. There was no case against him.’


No one (genera public) knows why CJ has bail conditions placed upon him - for all we know, it could be something totally unconnected altogether .

[arista]

"Tabak was in Holland."



thats after he Dumped her body dead in England.

Typical murder
do not stick around after it.

[marney]

Chris Jefferies is expecting to be formally cleared today

Monday January 24,2011
By Daily Express reporter

[Mifletz]

The British police have truly lived up to their decline in their nicknames through the decades, starting with the "Peelers", the "Bobbies", the "Bluebottles", the "Woozers", the "Sweeney", the "Nick", the "Filth", the "Pigs", and now literally the "Plod"!

[Pyramid*]

"Tabak was in Holland."



thats after he Dumped her body dead in England.

Typical murder
do not stick around after it.

Arista - very good point indeed - so glaringly obvious but missed it completely. Well spotted.

Tabak was reported to have left for Holland 2 days after Joanna went missing - and it's been reported that he didn't return again to UK till last week. If so... how could he have dumpled Joanna's body.

Are the dates incorrect?

Are the dates correct but omit that perhaps he did a flying visit back to UK / back to Holland inbetween - at which point he had the opportunity to move Joanna's body?

Are the dates correct, did he remain in Holland from point of departing the UK, to return last week - are the police sure they have the right man?

Oh dear. So many questions.

[arista]

The Police have the correct Dates
Today he was Charged in Court.

[Pyramid*]

The Police have the correct Dates
Today he was Charged in Court.

I would hope the Police do have the correct dates!!

I mean in regards to what's been reported - and the confusion therein!

[marney]

arrest after charging Vincent Tabak

Monday, January 24th, 2011

Detectives investigating the murder of Jo Yeates are ‘reviewing’ the arrested status of her landlord Chris Jefferies, officers said today.

Jo Yeates murder: police reviewing Chris Jefferies arrest after charging Vincent Tabak

Former Clifton College teacher Mr Jefferies, 66, was arrested on suspicion of murder on December 30 – five days after the body of 25-year-old Jo was found.

He was released on bail three days later and last week police confirmed he was still considered a suspect in the case.

But after Dutchman Vincent Tabak, 32, appeared in court charged with Jo’s murder today, police revealed they would look again at the arrest of Jefferies.

His friends say they expect him to be ”de-arrested” in the next few days.

Police Inspector David Horwood, from Avon and Somerset police, confirmed: ”We are now considering the impact of the charge on other aspects of the investigation.”

Mr Jefferies, who appeared to give conflicting eye-witness accounts on the night Jo went missing, has kept a low profile since his release on bail.

He has not been spotted by neighbours back at his 44 Canynge Road flat in Bristol.

His legal representatives are believed to be preparing a case against Avon and Somerset Police for wrongful arrest.

Friend Irving Steggles, speaking from South Africa, said today: ”I think it would be unhelpful for me to offer further comment after Christopher’s expected de-arrest.”

[Mifletz]

Is there any way Tabak could plead "guilty" and thereby avoid a trial? Or is there so much money involved, that his own lawyers won't let him? Or could the holding officers do a "Fred West" on him ie give him a belt to hang himself before the trial, and even help him along?!

http://news.bbc.co.uk/olmedia/65000/images/_69928_fred_west_150.jpg

[Mifletz]

A shame the reconstruction was never aired. The blonde Joanna-lookalike would have got many marriage offers methinks!

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2011/01/18/article-1348324-0CD15E8A000005DC-169_634x404.jpg

To singlehandedly drag/carry/lift a 160lb clothed woman, especially a deadweight woman, who may even have started to go in to rigor mortis, even if in a giant black hold-all, is virtually beyond one man, especially in slippery snow/sludge, and in and out of a car seat or boot. It needed two men, or one very strong man.

Even at 6'4", does the Dutchman look up to it?!

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2011/01/21/article-1349217-0CD9E91A000005DC-506_642x783.jpg

[arista]

His Own Lawyers said keep him in Jail
while waiting for the next court date.

[marney]

Is there any way Tabak could plead "guilty" and thereby avoid a trial? Or is there so much money involved, that his own lawyers won't let him? Or could the holding officers do a "Fred West" on him ie give him a belt to hang himself before the trial, and even help him along?!

http://news.bbc.co.uk/olmedia/65000/images/_69928_fred_west_150.jpg

The concentration of people within that area with seemingly connections can't be just chance. If he does plead guilty does or worse , others get off. He went away with his girlfriend on the 28th so where was his girlfriend at the time of the murder. Jefferies said he saw three people so were they all alive at that point or was Jo taken somewhere else.

[InOne]

Latest on the case on Crimewatch tonight

[marney]

suspect in Jo Yeates murder case

Wednesday, January 26th, 2011

A leading criminologist has questioned why the landlord of Jo Yeates stills remains a suspect in her murder.

Criminologist questions why is Chris Jefferies is still Jo Yeates murder suspect

Eccentric Chris Jefferies, 66, was arrested on suspicion of murdering the 25-year-old on December 30 at the Canynge Road, Clifton, Bristol, where the two both lived.

Police obtained two extensions to keep Mr Jefferies detained for the maximum time limit but released him early on police bail, without charge, on January 1.

Dutch engineer Vincent Tabak, 32, was then arrested and charged with Jo’s murder.

But despite Tabak’s charge, Mr Jefferies has not had his police bail cancelled and is therefore still a suspect, police confirmed today.

David Wilson, professor of criminology and criminal justice at Birmingham City University, said it would be normal practice to release other suspects from bail following a charge.

Professor Wilson, who has researched many murderers including serial killer Fred West, Soham murderer Ian Huntley, and Suffolk strangler Steven Wright, said: ”I’ve not heard that the landlord Chris Jefferies has had his bail cancelled, which could be seen as significant.

”Now that they’ve charged Vincent Tabak it would make sense for police to cancel Mr Jefferies’ bail – that would be normal procedure.

”I’d expect the police to act quickly to end any misunderstanding in relation to Mr Jefferies not being released from bail.”

After Tabak was charged on Saturday evening Inspector David Horwood, from Avon and Somerset police, said: ”We’re now considering the impact of the charge on other aspects of the investigation.”

A force spokesman confirmed Mr Jefferies was still on bail but refused to comment further.


What do you make of this.

[Angus]

Perhaps Tabak has somehow implicated Jefferies when he was questioned - who knows? I remember at one time the theory was mooted that it was a two person crime, perhaps there are discrepancies in the testimonies of the two men. Clearly not all the evidence the police have has been made public.

[marney]

Have you seen postings on other sites and twitter, from people apparently trying to prove the two suspects innocent and claim that VT has an alibi for the night of the 17th, a rock solid witness, Hm. Also evidence the police have is scant. How do they know? The style and content looks very much like someone who posts regularly on this site, but has not for a couple of nights. I could be wrong.

They won't let this one go without a fight.


People of the same ilk as the mutter/s who murdered Jo are hell bent on defending the suspects, intent on muddying the waters and rubbishing police evidence. I hope the police are able to get through this one with enough evidence if they don't there will be no stopping these particular types of crimes.

[Shasown]

The style and content looks very much like someone who posts regularly on this site, but has not for a couple of nights. I could be wrong.

Why change the habit of a lifetime, you were wrong on pretty much every thing you put forward so far.

They won't let this one go without a fight.

People of the same ilk as the mutter/s who murdered Jo are hell bent on defending the suspects, intent on muddying the waters and rubbishing police evidence. I hope the police are able to get through this one with enough evidence if they don't there will be no stopping these particular types of crimes.

You ever think they may be telling the truth? While not defending them or anyone else, I think you are being a tad harsh branding them as being of the same ilk as the murderer(s).

While it is possible they are simply intent on causing trouble for the investigation, they may also be defending the suspects out of a misguided sense of loyalty, or if they are actually giving an alibi they may be confused as to the dates they are alibiing for.

[Pyramid*]

Have you seen postings on other sites and twitter, from people apparently trying to prove the two suspects innocent and claim that VT has an alibi for the night of the 17th, a rock solid witness, Hm. Also evidence the police have is scant. How do they know? The style and content looks very much like someone who posts regularly on this site, but has not for a couple of nights. I could be wrong.

They won't let this one go without a fight.


People of the same ilk as the mutter/s who murdered Jo are hell bent on defending the suspects, intent on muddying the waters and rubbishing police evidence. I hope the police are able to get through this one with enough evidence if they don't there will be no stopping these particular types of crimes.


Highly probable that you could be wrong. You have been and with stark regularity up to now so I'd say it was a safe bet that you are wrong! :rolleyes:

People of the same ilk as the mutter who murdered Jo are hell bent on defending the suspects? Ahh....... you mean in direct contrast to the way people like you want to hang, draw and quarter anyone (and everyone) that the police take more than a 2nd glance at - without you having been made aware of any hard fast and concrete evidence - happy to label them killers at the drop of a hat!

I'll say it again: we live in a land of innocent until proven guilty - and that applies even to those charges with crimes. Charges can be dropped. Here's something to really blow your mind - it also can apply to those convicted - ever heard of Miscarriage of Justice?

[Pyramid*]

The concentration of people within that area with seemingly connections can't be just chance. If he does plead guilty does or worse , others get off. He went away with his girlfriend on the 28th so where was his girlfriend at the time of the murder. Jefferies said he saw three people so were they all alive at that point or was Jo taken somewhere else.

If he does plead guilty or worse, others get off? 'or worse'...??? !!

What 'others' (plural) get off? Ahhh... I see your trying to bring VT's girlfriend into it as well now!

I'm sure you've forgotten to throw blame onto the local paperboy - when he was doing his rounds that night, collecting his paper money from everyone in that same building. You may as well include him in your killer list - be a shame for you to leave him out really - you know, what with him having 'seemingly connections'.

Deary me.

[marney]

Why change the habit of a lifetime, you were wrong on pretty much every thing you put forward so far.


Such as

I thought by your postings and the content we agreed on more or less the same line, that they were guilty, but now I see I was totally wrong in that assumption and you have more in common with Pyramid.






Certainly touched a nerve with Pyramid who is very "Cerebral" on other sites.

Highly probable that you could be wrong. You have been and with stark regularity up to now so I'd say it was a safe bet that you are wrong!

People of the same ilk as the mutter who murdered Jo are hell bent on defending the suspects? Ahh....... you mean in direct contrast to the way people like you want to hang, draw and quarter anyone (and everyone) that the police take more than a 2nd glance at - without you having been made aware of any hard fast and concrete evidence - happy to label them killers at the drop of a hat!

I'll say it again: we live in a land of innocent until proven guilty - and that applies even to those charges with crimes. Charges can be dropped. Here's something to really blow your mind - it also can apply to those convicted - ever heard of Miscarriage of Justice?
Last edited by Pyramid*; Today at 01:44 AM.
Pyramid* is offline Report Post Reply With Quote


Touched a nerve here again, must have, both posting at that time of night to get a point across. Interseting though.

[marney]

Is there any way Tabak could plead "guilty" and thereby avoid a trial? Or is there so much money involved, that his own lawyers won't let him? Or could the holding officers do a "Fred West" on him ie give him a belt to hang himself before the trial, and even help him along?!

http://news.bbc.co.uk/olmedia/65000/images/_69928_fred_west_150.jpg

You might be right here,if Tabak was innocent would he need to be on suicide watch. You would think with his background and expert help etc he would be trying to prove his innocence.

THE SUN
THE man charged with the murder of Jo Yeates has been placed on suicide watch in prison.

Dutch-born Vincent Tabak is being monitored around the clock at Long Lartin jail, where he is on remand.

Staff at the top-security prison have been told to check the 32-year-old every 30 minutes throughout the day and night.

An insider said: "He has been placed under constant observation by the assessment care in custody team.

"He'll be escorted wherever he goes by two staff. Specialist psychiatrists will also be closely monitoring him

Latest news ADDED 27/01/11
Police confirm landlord is still a suspect in murder case despite charging another man.

[Shasown]

Touched a nerve here again, must have, both posting at that time of night to get a point across. Interseting though.

Not interesting at all.

Two people pointing out your previous conclusions were wrong and no doubt are wrong again this time.

Oh but we did it at the same time of day. Well that definately makes us of the same ilk as the murderer, eh?

As for the suicide watch, people who get accused of crimes and remanded into custody till their trial often get depressed, the prison medical staff wont want to take chances, they will recommend a watch is put on them. This doesnt signify innocence or guilt.

What is interesting though is you still havent mastered how to quote or multi-quote yet, Sherlock.

[marney]

Not interesting at all.

Two people pointing out your previous conclusions were wrong and no doubt are wrong again this time.

Oh but we did it at the same time of day. Well that definately makes us of the same ilk as the murderer, eh?

As for the suicide watch, people who get accused of crimes and remanded into custody till their trial often get depressed, the prison medical staff wont want to take chances, they will recommend a watch is put on them. This doesnt signify innocence or guilt.

What is interesting though is you still havent mastered how to quote or multi-quote yet, Sherlock.

Why worry about that, quote or multi quote WHY THE PECISION, you have already understood what I said. Then there was Fred West, depressed I expect OR GUILTY.

Oh but we did it at the same time of day. Well that definately makes us of the same ilk as the murderer, eh?
I THINK YOU HAVE COPLETELY TAKEN THIS QUOTE OF CONTEXT. NEVER MIND.

[Shasown]

Then there was Fred West, depressed I expect OR GUILTY.

I THINK YOU HAVE COPLETELY TAKEN THIS QUOTE OF CONTEXT. NEVER MIND.

You do realise that current statistics from the department of justice show that of people remanded in custody to await trial just over 20% of them are later released after charges were dropped or are found innocent at trial?

http://www.straightstatistics.org/article/one-law-guilty-another-innocent
http://www.ws3.prisonreform.web.baigent.net/subsection.asp?id=2125

Another interesting fact is that all people who are remanded into custody are put on suicide watch after an initial medical assessment if they show any signs of neurological disorder? Given that 58% of remanded prisoners do show such signs that is a lot of innocent people put on suicide watch.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/news/datablog/2010/jan/11/suicide-deaths-prison-uk-statistics
http://www.mind.org.uk/help/rights_and_legislation/statistics_8_the_criminal_justice_system

Being put on suicide watch isnt an indicator of guilt nor is actually attempting or committing suicide as your posts seem to indicate.

Being placed in custody and having all liberty removed as well as the stress of being accused of a crime and potentially being found guilty at trial even though you may be innocent is enough to affect the balance of even the sanest and most honest person's mind.

[marney]

Is there any way Tabak could plead "guilty" and thereby avoid a trial? Or is there so much money involved, that his own lawyers won't let him? Or could the holding officers do a "Fred West" on him ie give him a belt to hang himself before the trial, and even help him along?!

http://news.bbc.co.uk/olmedia/65000/images/_69928_fred_west_150.jpg


You do realise that current statistics from the department of justice show that of people remanded in custody to await trial just over 20% of them are later released after charges were dropped or are found innocent at trial?

http://www.straightstatistics.org/article/one-law-guilty-another-innocent
http://www.ws3.prisonreform.web.baigent.net/subsection.asp?id=2125

Another interesting fact is that all people who are remanded into custody are put on suicide watch after an initial medical assessment if they show any signs of neurological disorder? Given that 58% of remanded prisoners do show such signs that is a lot of innocent people put on suicide watch.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/news/datablog/2010/jan/11/suicide-deaths-prison-uk-statistics
http://www.mind.org.uk/help/rights_and_legislation/statistics_8_the_criminal_justice_system

Being put on suicide watch isnt an indicator of guilt nor is actually attempting or committing suicide as your posts seem to indicate.

Being placed in custody and having all liberty removed as well as the stress of being accused of a crime and potentially being found guilty at trial even though you may be innocent is enough to affect the balance of even the sanest and most honest person's mind.
#

[Pyramid*]

Certainly touched a nerve with Pyramid who is very "Cerebral" on other sites.

Highly probable that you could be wrong. You have been and with stark regularity up to now so I'd say it was a safe bet that you are wrong!

People of the same ilk as the mutter who murdered Jo are hell bent on defending the suspects? Ahh....... you mean in direct contrast to the way people like you want to hang, draw and quarter anyone (and everyone) that the police take more than a 2nd glance at - without you having been made aware of any hard fast and concrete evidence - happy to label them killers at the drop of a hat!

I'll say it again: we live in a land of innocent until proven guilty - and that applies even to those charges with crimes. Charges can be dropped. Here's something to really blow your mind - it also can apply to those convicted - ever heard of Miscarriage of Justice?
Last edited by Pyramid*; Today at 01:44 AM.
Pyramid* is offline Report Post Reply With Quote


Touched a nerve here again, must have, both posting at that time of night to get a point across. Interseting though.


No nerves touched at all - it's quite funny as I am the bearer of bad news and may shatter your little made up fantasy world.... but I don't post on any other site. :pat: Used to be on DS before tibbs....but that's my whack.

Not that where I would chose to post has anything to do with you at all for that matter - but it's just brilliant knowing how wrong you are - and once again. You really are rubbish at playing detective.:joker:

While you're at it - for christ's sake, at least try to learn how to quote post correctly - having to deceipher your posts from what you are typing vs other people's posts being 'quoted', you pasting in news stories with no wrap tags etc..... is tedious to say the least.

As for your assumption (wrong again... do you see the pattern here!) - you think Shasown and I are the one person? Tell you what - go ask the mods. I look happy to you reporting back that you are once again wrong. PMSL.

[Pyramid*]

Why worry about that, quote or multi quote WHY THE PECISION, you have already understood what I said. Then there was Fred West, depressed I expect OR GUILTY.

Oh but we did it at the same time of day. Well that definately makes us of the same ilk as the murderer, eh?
I THINK YOU HAVE COPLETELY TAKEN THIS QUOTE OF CONTEXT. NEVER MIND.


Out of sheer interest Marney.

What is PECISION? ;)

[marney]

As for youe assumption (wrong again... do you see the pattern here!) - you think Shasown and I are the one person? Tell you what - go ask the mods. I look happy to you reporting back that you are once again wrong. PMSL.


Where on earth was that mentioned that I think you and Shasown are one person, are you hallucinating.

It has been said on this site that you are a troll, I certainly believe that.


Out of sheer interest Marney.
What is PECISION? ;)[/QUOTE] Have a guess go
on.

Oh and just another snipit I know you like them :joker:

Jo Yeates murder accused Vincent Tabak 'feels safe in jail'

by Don Mackay, Daily Mirror 27/01/2011
:hugesmile:

[Shasown]

THE SUN
THE man charged with the murder of Jo Yeates has been placed on suicide watch in prison.

Dutch-born Vincent Tabak is being monitored around the clock at Long Lartin jail, where he is on remand.

Staff at the top-security prison have been told to check the 32-year-old every 30 minutes throughout the day and night.





Oh and just another snipit I know you like them :joker:

Jo Yeates murder accused Vincent Tabak 'feels safe in jail'

by Don Mackay, Daily Mirror 27/01/2011
:hugesmile:

Makes me wonder, how you cant see the wood for the trees.

You quote the Sun saying he was in Long Larton Prison, thats in Evesham Worcestershire, its a Cat A (high security), under a suicide watch.

then you quote a mirror article claiming

The architect, 32, said he was coping well in Gloucester prison, where he is being held awaiting trial for the murder of Jo Yeates, 25.

He was moved from a jail in Bristol, the city in which Jo died
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/top-stories/2011/01/27/jo-yeates-murder-accused-vincent-tabak-feels-safe-in-jail-115875-22878251/

Gloucester and Bristol Prisons are both Cat B and the most likely locations for remand prisoners to be held.

Incidentally what was the "#" about when you quoted my post where I had challenged your point about "if he was innocent why would he need to be put on suicide watch" - post 651 in this thread?

[marney]

Makes me wonder, how you cant see the wood for the trees.

You quote the Sun saying he was in Long Larton Prison, thats in Evesham Worcestershire, its a Cat A (high security), under a suicide watch.

then you quote a mirror article claiming



Gloucester and Bristol Prisons are both Cat B and the most likely locations for remand prisoners to be held.

Incidentally what was the "#" about when you quoted my post where I had challenged your point about "if he was innocent why would he need to be put on suicide watch" - post 651 in this thread?

Yes if you look on other sites you will see that other people have also noticed the differences of these two reports The Sun and The Mirror 27th. I expect there was an overlap in time regarding the reports as he was probably moved the same day therefore it would appear conflicting news but actually it is not.

[Shasown]

Yes if you look on other sites you will see that other people have also noticed the differences of these two reports The Sun and The Mirror 27th. I expect there was an overlap in time regarding the reports as he was probably moved the same day therefore it would appear conflicting news but actually it is not.

Err no, once again you have failed to grasp the situation or understand the information available to you.

He was remanded into custody awaiting trial, he was put into Bristol Prison which is a Cat B prison, he didnt feel secure there because he feared there may be local Bristolians amongst the population who would hold a grudge against him, he was then moved to Gloucester another Cat B prison.

Long Larton is a Cat A prison, they dont normally stick prisoners on remand in there, its for serious cons, as in convicted criminals with serious records, those who cause trouble like riots or persistent escapers.

Incidentally you didnt answer my question reference the # in your post 651.

[Mifletz]

Although some men can be surprisingly stronger than they may appear (eg Christopher Jeffries), and an adrenaline surge can give a man 30% more strength, and even though he's 6'4", Tabak's average arms looks like he'd have really huffed and puffed moving a 75kg clothed female body, if he did do it singlehanded. And moving a 'deadweight' dead body is considerably more difficult than an unconscious live body.

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2011/01/23/article-1349615-0CDD7003000005DC-949_306x423.jpg

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2011/01/21/article-1348968-0CD823E3000005DC-132_306x423.jpg

[marney]

[QUOTE=Shasown;4075879]Err no, once again you have failed to grasp the situation or understand the information available to you.

He was remanded into custody awaiting trial, he was put into Bristol Prison which is a Cat B prison, he didnt feel secure there because he feared there may be local Bristolians amongst the population who would hold a grudge against him, he was then moved to Gloucester another Cat B prison.

Long Larton is a Cat A prison, they dont normally stick prisoners on remand in there, its for serious cons, as in convicted criminals with serious records, those who cause trouble like riots or persistent escapers.

E] Oh dear a slap on the wrist for not grasping it so what are the papers on about. Where is he.

[InOne]

Although some men can be surprisingly stronger than they may appear (eg Christopher Jeffries), and an adrenaline surge can give a man 30% more strength, and even though he's 6'4", Tabak's average arms looks like he'd have really huffed and puffed moving a 75kg clothed female body, if he did do it singlehanded. And moving a 'deadweight' dead body is considerably more difficult than an unconscious live body.

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2011/01/23/article-1349615-0CDD7003000005DC-949_306x423.jpg

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2011/01/21/article-1348968-0CD823E3000005DC-132_306x423.jpg

All depends how much time he had I guess.

[Shasown]

Err no, once again you have failed to grasp the situation or understand the information available to you.

He was remanded into custody awaiting trial, he was put into Bristol Prison which is a Cat B prison, he didnt feel secure there because he feared there may be local Bristolians amongst the population who would hold a grudge against him, he was then moved to Gloucester another Cat B prison.

Long Larton is a Cat A prison, they dont normally stick prisoners on remand in there, its for serious cons, as in convicted criminals with serious records, those who cause trouble like riots or persistent escapers.

E] Oh dear a slap on the wrist for not grasping it so what are the papers on about. Where is he.

The answer to that is in my post (and your badly quoted post). I typed it fairly slowly so you would understand it.

Now about the # in your post 651, any answer on that one or are you going to continue to ignore that question?

[Pyramid*]

Where on earth was that mentioned that I think you and Shasown are one person, are you hallucinating.

It has been said on this site that you are a troll, I certainly believe that.


Out of sheer interest Marney.
What is PECISION? ;) Have a guess go
on.

Oh and just another snipit I know you like them :joker:

Jo Yeates murder accused Vincent Tabak 'feels safe in jail'

by Don Mackay, Daily Mirror 27/01/2011
:hugesmile:

Yep, classic signs of a troll ..... spending much time on a serious debate thread. PMSL.

No hallucinating here Marney - you're the one with the overactive imagination on many levels - a point shown time and time again on this very thread.

I see you didn't actually answer what I asked..... , what is PECISION.

Why you would find it amusing that an incarcerated man is quoted as saying he feels safe in jail, is bizarre to say the least. However, given that your postings are increasingly becoming more of that 'ilk', I shouldn't be surprised.

I see you still fail on the ability to use the quote facility.

[Pyramid*]

Yes if you look on other sites you will see that other people have also noticed the differences of these two reports The Sun and The Mirror 27th. I expect there was an overlap in time regarding the reports as he was probably moved the same day therefore it would appear conflicting news but actually it is not.


I'm not clear on why a member of tibbs, posting on a thread on tibbs, should be expected (or it even be suggested) that they should look on other sites for what other people 'notice' or have posted? I think the point Shasown was making was the contradictory nature of your own posts on this thread, on this forum.

You've been asked a few times now about your reply of "#' to a post that Shasown took time to explain to you - yet still you chose to avoid answering their question. Is there any particular reason you continue to do so, given that the information they gave was pertinent?

[Pyramid*]

Although some men can be surprisingly stronger than they may appear (eg Christopher Jeffries), and an adrenaline surge can give a man 30% more strength, and even though he's 6'4", Tabak's average arms looks like he'd have really huffed and puffed moving a 75kg clothed female body, if he did do it singlehanded. And moving a 'deadweight' dead body is considerably more difficult than an unconscious live body.





I'm not entirely sure this is correct? An unconscious body (alive but unconsicous) person would be as difficult to move as a dead body, wouldn't it?

I'd have thought that given a person is unconscious and unable to use their own muscles to aid movement at all, isn't it that which gives rise to the term 'dead weight'? Therefore there would be little difference in the weight between unconscious and dead?

That aside, given what you have mentioned in respect of, "eg Christopher Jeffries" - I'd have thought that a lean, fit, 6'4", 32 years old man, even with the build of VT, would have more chance of lifting 75kgs of dead weight, than a 66 year old man of average height who certainly doesn't appear to have the fittest body shape to him. Can't swear on it, but if the comparison is being made VT vs CJ - I'd opt for VT being able to.

[Pyramid*]

Err no, once again you have failed to grasp the situation or understand the information available to you.

He was remanded into custody awaiting trial, he was put into Bristol Prison which is a Cat B prison, he didnt feel secure there because he feared there may be local Bristolians amongst the population who would hold a grudge against him, he was then moved to Gloucester another Cat B prison.

Long Larton is a Cat A prison, they dont normally stick prisoners on remand in there, its for serious cons, as in convicted criminals with serious records, those who cause trouble like riots or persistent escapers.


E] Oh dear a slap on the wrist for not grasping it so what are the papers on about. Where is he.

Another fail on the quote front I see.

If you pay a little more attention to what people post Marney, you'll find that the whereabouts of VT have already been given. Better than that, you actually have the answer in your very own version of a 'quote' in post number 659. :bored:

[Mifletz]

Probably.

Though those at the gym where he exercises weekly say that Jeffries is "very strong". And renters from 5 years ago who used to watch him garden, said that he was "stunningly strong".

Both the Englishman & the Dutchman have big strong hands, and asphyxiating the female by hand or by a sock/stocking would pose no problem: once those external carotid arteries are even slightly compressed, unconsciousness and death follow in seconds, poor soul.

I'd have thought that a lean, fit, 6'4", 32 years old man, even with the build of VT, would have more chance of lifting 75kgs of dead weight, than a 66 year old man of average height who certainly doesn't appear to have the fittest body shape to him. Can't swear on it, but if the comparison is being made VT vs CJ - I'd opt for VT being able to.

[Pyramid*]

Probably.

Though those at the gym where he exercises weekly say that Jeffries is "very strong". And renters from 5 years ago who used to watch him garden, said that he was "stunningly strong".

Both the Englishman & the Dutchman have big strong hands, and asphyxiating the female by hand or by a sock/stocking would pose no problem: once those external carotid arteries are even slightly compressed, unconsciousness and death follow in seconds, poor soul.

Now here's a wee thing... Marney logged on very briefly minutes ago, logged off, then you logged on and posted. Coincedentally, Marney had the very same notion of CJ - and with the people who rented from him years ago! How's that for two minds thinking alike!

I still am very much of the opinion that CJ was an easy target for police and had nothing to do with it.

[marney]

Probably.

Though those at the gym where he exercises weekly say that Jeffries is "very strong". And renters from 5 years ago who used to watch him garden, said that he was "stunningly strong".

Both the Englishman & the Dutchman have big strong hands, and asphyxiating the female by hand or by a sock/stocking would pose no problem: once those external carotid arteries are even slightly compressed, unconsciousness and death follow in seconds, poor soul.


Pyramid will contradict everything people post on this forum have you noticed.

[marney]

The answer to that is in my post (and your badly quoted post). I typed it fairly slowly so you would understand it.

Now about the # in your post 651, any answer on that one or are you going to continue to ignore that question?

Nothing more than a slip of the finger # along with the badly posted comments ?

[marney]

I certainly don't find it amusing where did I say that. The poor man should be regarded as a B case prisoner awaiting trial but has infract gone to an A graded prison .I certainly don't find it amusing where did I say that. The poor man should be regarded as a B case prisoner awaiting trial but has infract gone to an A graded prison .

Why you would find it amusing that an incarcerated man is quoted as saying he feels safe in jail, is bizarre to say the least. However, given that your postings are increasingly becoming more of that 'ilk', I shouldn't be surprised.

I see you still fail on the ability to use the quote facility.

I certainly don't find it amusing where did I say that. This man should be regarded as a B case prisoner awaiting trial but has infract gone to an A graded prison. I THINK I MAY HAVE USED THE QUOTE BUTTON FACILITY THIS TIME JUST FOR YOU

[Shasown]

Nothing more than a slip of the finger # along with the badly posted comments ?

Sorry but I have to laugh at that comment that the # was a slip of the finger, in post 651 you quoted Mifletz and myself and the only comment you typed was the errr "slip of the finger".

Are you simply trying to get your post count up?

As for the "badly posted comments", what are you talking about?

If you re-read my post you will see I typed "badly quoted posts", now I did type that post really slowly for you, as I know you have a problem keeping up, but come on.

READ the posts properly, sit and think about them for a while then formulate an intelligent response.

Type it out then read what you have typed, if it makes no sense to you then, it will be complete and utter gibberish to us, like a lot of your previous offerings.

[Shasown]

I certainly don't find it amusing where did I say that. This man should be regarded as a B case prisoner awaiting trial but has infract gone to an A graded prison. I THINK I MAY HAVE USED THE QUOTE BUTTON FACILITY THIS TIME JUST FOR YOU

Gosh you dont think the smileys in this post of yours could give that impression?

Oh and just another snipit I know you like them :joker:

Jo Yeates murder accused Vincent Tabak 'feels safe in jail'

by Don Mackay, Daily Mirror 27/01/2011
:hugesmile:

[marney]

I certainly don't find it amusing where did I say that. The poor man should be regarded as a B case prisoner awaiting trial but has infract gone to an A graded prison .I certainly don't find it amusing where did I say that. The poor man should be regarded as a B case prisoner awaiting trial but has infract gone to an A graded prison .
The above should be taken out
out of Pyramids post he did not post this comment This has got intertwined with mine my post sorry.

[Shasown]

I certainly don't find it amusing where did I say that. The poor man should be regarded as a B case prisoner awaiting trial but has infract gone to an A graded prison .I certainly don't find it amusing where did I say that. The poor man should be regarded as a B case prisoner awaiting trial but has infract gone to an A graded prison .
The above should be taken out
out of Pyramids post he did not post this comment This has got intertwined with mine my post sorry.

If you read back through the various posts, you will see he is in a Cat B prison not Cat A, as I have pointed out to you several times.

[marney]

Long Lartin (HM Prison) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
HM Prison Long Lartin is a Category A men's prison, located in the village of South Littleton (near Evesham) in Worcestershire, England. Long Lartin Prison

...Dutch-born Vincent Tabak is being monitored around the clock at Long Lartin jail, where he is on remand. Top security ... Tabak has been moved to Long ...
The Sun - 623 related articles

[Shasown]

Long Lartin (HM Prison) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
HM Prison Long Lartin is a Category A men's prison, located in the village of South Littleton (near Evesham) in Worcestershire, England. Long Lartin Prison

...Dutch-born Vincent Tabak is being monitored around the clock at Long Lartin jail, where he is on remand. Top security ... Tabak has been moved to Long ...
The Sun - 623 related articles

Yes marney I told you about Long Larton being a Cat A prison or has your short term memory disappeared?

How about this one then from The Sun:

THE man accused of murdering Jo Yeates was moved to a different prison yesterday amid fears for his safety.
Vincent Tabak had spent less than 24 hours in jail in Bristol before the 30-mile switch to Gloucester.


Funny that eh?

Dont believe me?

Try this link then, read it all,

http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/news/3371594/Vincent-Tabak-jail-switch-over-attack-fears.html

It doesnt mention Long Larton, now why is that?

Could the Sun have possibly made a mistake mentioning it?

Terry's (condescending) Tip of the Day: Always check your info from more than one source ;)

[Pyramid*]

Pyramid will contradict everything people post on this forum have you noticed.

I suggest you read what was written in respect of Mifletz post to which I replied, discussing the matter of 'dead weight' ..... you will see there is no contradiction. What I did do was offer up my own thoughts on whether there is a difference between the weight of a dead body, and the weight of an alive but unconscious person. Mifletz suggested there was a substantial difference in these weights - and my comment was worded quite clearly, in a manner which not only did I question if that was the case, I also mitigated my own uncertaintly by way of an explanation as to why I thought what I did. Try reading, digesting and at least try to understand context before criticising.

I certainly don't find it amusing where did I say that. This man should be regarded as a B case prisoner awaiting trial but has infract gone to an A graded prison. I THINK I MAY HAVE USED THE QUOTE BUTTON FACILITY THIS TIME JUST FOR YOU

If you didn't find your comment amusing, then why add in this smiley
-----> :hugesmile: - you used it immediately after the comment in question. That smiley represents 'big grin'. Most big grins indicate amusement. What on earth else was this smiley meant to represent?

And no, still you are unable to master the simple art of hitting the quote button.

[Pyramid*]

Sorry but I have to laugh at that comment that the # was a slip of the finger, in post 651 you quoted Mifletz and myself and the only comment you typed was the errr "slip of the finger".

Are you simply trying to get your post count up?

As for the "badly posted comments", what are you talking about?

If you re-read my post you will see I typed "badly quoted posts", now I did type that post really slowly for you, as I know you have a problem keeping up, but come on.

READ the posts properly, sit and think about them for a while then formulate an intelligent response.

Type it out then read what you have typed, if it makes no sense to you then, it will be complete and utter gibberish to us, like a lot of your previous offerings.

Call me a tad suspicious - but given that you can't master a single quote Marney - it's quite strange that you mastered a multi quote - but even several posts after multi quoting, you seem unable to grasp a single quote?. ;)

Did you slip up there - give yourself away a little bit! ;)

[Pyramid*]

If you read back through the various posts, you will see he is in a Cat B prison not Cat A, as I have pointed out to you several times.


*Builds another brick wall and offers bandages for head*

The other wall has become damaged beyond repair, having had to be used with alarming frequency.

[marney]

Long Lartin (HM Prison) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
HM Prison Long Lartin is a Category A men's prison, located in the village of South Littleton (near Evesham) in Worcestershire, England. Long Lartin Prison




Evesham Journal


Pershore News
Jo Yeates murder accused on suicide watch at Long Lartin Have they got it wrong to.
11:02am Thursday 27th January 2011

You two seem to be the only two dominating this site NEVER MIND GOOD LUCK.

[CarriKP]

You do realise that current statistics from the department of justice show that of people remanded in custody to await trial just over 20% of them are later released after charges were dropped or are found innocent at trial?

http://www.straightstatistics.org/article/one-law-guilty-another-innocent
http://www.ws3.prisonreform.web.baigent.net/subsection.asp?id=2125

Another interesting fact is that all people who are remanded into custody are put on suicide watch after an initial medical assessment if they show any signs of neurological disorder? Given that 58% of remanded prisoners do show such signs that is a lot of innocent people put on suicide watch.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/news/datablog/2010/jan/11/suicide-deaths-prison-uk-statistics
http://www.mind.org.uk/help/rights_and_legislation/statistics_8_the_criminal_justice_system

Being put on suicide watch isnt an indicator of guilt nor is actually attempting or committing suicide as your posts seem to indicate.

Being placed in custody and having all liberty removed as well as the stress of being accused of a crime and potentially being found guilty at trial even though you may be innocent is enough to affect the balance of even the sanest and most honest person's mind.

Thank you for a balanced, thoughtful and informative post with useful links.

Being put on suicide watch isnt an indicator of guilt nor is actually attempting or committing suicide as your posts seem to indicate.
Absolutely!
i'm surprised that it's possible for people not to be able imagine what it's like being arrested and incarcerated - and as you say above 1 in 5 of those so treated are not guilty!

Being placed in custody and having all liberty removed as well as the stress of being accused of a crime and potentially being found guilty at trial even though you may be innocent is enough to affect the balance of even the sanest and most honest person's mind.[/QUOTE]
Indeed - I wonder why it's possible for people not to realise that - I would suggest that the more innocent are the more desperate
- not being believed despite pleading the truth ...
why do I seem to hear the baying of hounds? - I thought hunting had been made illegal? .....

[Shasown]

Evesham Journal


Pershore News
Jo Yeates murder accused on suicide watch at Long Lartin Have they got it wrong to.
11:02am Thursday 27th January 2011

You two seem to be the only two dominating this site NEVER MIND GOOD LUCK.

The short answer is YES they got it wrong too.

The reason for that(the long answer) if you read the whole article you will see this:


THE man charged with the murder of Jo Yeates is believed to have been placed on suicide watch at Long Lartin Prison, near Evesham.

A national newspaper reported that Dutch-born Vincent Tabak was being monitored around the clock at the Category A prison, in South Littleton, where it thought he is currently on remand.
http://www.eveshamjournal.co.uk/news/8816703.Jo_Yeates_murder_accused_on_suicide_watch_ at_Long_Lartin/


You see some newspapers draw their feed(what they use to fill up on as news they dont report themselves) from other newspapers and the TV.

To further wipe your nose in it. The same source was used for this article

http://www.cotswoldjournal.co.uk/news/local/evesham/8816703.Jo_Yeates_murder_accused_on_suicide_watch_ at_Long_Lartin/

Given that all three local newspapers(Evesham Journal, Pershore News and Cotswold Journal) are run from the same head office, as well as the Evesham News, Vale of Evesham News and the Broadway News.

I should imagine they simply use the same feeds and sources in the case of national news. Its a common policy to save money on local rags. It saves having 5 or 6 teams of investigative reporters.

Incidentally if you go back and look at the time and date the Sun article was published, and then the same for the article claiming he was being held in Long Larton it would show the Sun undermines its own article about Long Larton.

He was charged by police and held overnight in police custody, he appeared in the local magistrates court where he was then remanded in custody until 31 Jan, he was taken to Bristol initially, then transferred to Gloucester, the transfer to Gloucester being carried out at the same time as his second court appearance where bail was discussed.


DYLAC

[Shasown]

Thank you for a balanced, thoughtful and informative post with useful links.

why do I seem to hear the baying of hounds? - I thought hunting had been made illegal? .....

Your welcome, am glad you found them informative.

Yeah I appreciate the hunting point, seems a lot of that happens on internet forums, something to do with the ability to vent regardless of knowledge or understanding.

Its a shame some people dont mull over the what ifs before posting vitriolic garbage.

[marney]

Got it wrong have they !!!!


http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/news/3373571/Man-charged-with-Jo-Yeates-murder-put-on-suicide-watch-in-prison.html

[Pyramid*]

Yes marney I told you about Long Larton being a Cat A prison or has your short term memory disappeared?

How about this one then from The Sun:



Funny that eh?

Dont believe me?

Try this link then, read it all,

http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/news/3371594/Vincent-Tabak-jail-switch-over-attack-fears.html

It doesnt mention Long Larton, now why is that?


Got it wrong have they !!!!

http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/news/3373571/Man-charged-with-Jo-Yeates-murder-put-on-suicide-watch-in-prison.html (http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/news/3373571/Man-charged-with-Jo-Yeates-murder-put-on-suicide-watch-in-prison.html)



Are you seriously so blinkered that you can't accept the Sun aren't able to even get their own story correct? The Sun publish 2 different articles on 2 different days both with differing information.

Shasown's link show's an article published in the Sun dated 26th Jan - which states that VT was moved from Bristol to Gloucester.

Your link here, shows the Sun publishing an article dated 27th Jan (a day later!!) stating he's still in Bristol. Please read this next part very carefully - the very same tabloid is reporting 2 very different things and is completely contradicting itself.

Article in the Mirror, dated 27th Jan. States he was moved from Bristol to Gloucester. http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/top-stories/2011/01/27/jo-yeates-murder-accused-vincent-tabak-feels-safe-in-jail-115875-22878251/

Article in the Metro, run from info from the Sun!! dated 26th Jan. States he was moved from Bristol to Gloucester. http://www.metro.co.uk/news/853763-vincent-tabak-moved-over-jail-attack-fears

Article on small world news - also run on info from the Sun... dated 26th Jan. States he was moved from Bristol to Gloucester, even mentions jails are 30 miles away. http://swns.com/vincent-tabak-moved-prison-over-attack-fears-260947.html

Is this finally sinking in yet? The Sun 'go back' on what they reported a day previous.

Thus, in reply to your comment, "Got it wrong have they" - Yes. Clearly the Sun have got it wrong and haven't got a clue what the left hand is doing from the right hand.

A point that Shausown made clear when they said the Sun were completely undermining their very own article in respect of Long Larton.

You're not really cut out for this detective lark are you!!

[Shasown]

Got it wrong have they !!!!


http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/news/3373571/Man-charged-with-Jo-Yeates-murder-put-on-suicide-watch-in-prison.html

I am presuming thats a question by the way, we normally use question marks not exclamation marks to end questions. So here goes:

Just a little, to add a little more to what Pyramid posted.

Normal monitoring of prisoners is carried out every 30-60 minutes depending on the risk category, when prisoners are locked in cells.

"Suicide watch" is a generic, non official term for increased monitoring due to the risk of self harm.

The Sun state the prison officers overseeing his care are to check on him every 30 minutes.

Dont you think monitoring a prisoner every 30 minutes would allow him to commit suicide easily in the time available? I certainly do.

If i was monitoring a prisoner who it is thought is at risk of self harming or suicide I would check on them at intervals of no less than 10 minutes (that is at least 6 checks an hour).

My reasoning being if he was to hang himself by some improvised method it would take a couple of minutes to set himself up, then you have a few minutes where he slowly strangulates or bleeds out. All in all about 8-10 minutes or so, unless he really knew what he was doing.

Hey and guess what?

The Home Office agree with me!!! Not with The Ferking Sun

Thats why they issued a Prison Service Order to deal with Suicide Prevention and Self Harm Management. Its called PSO 2700.

And guess what, you can read it here

http://pso.hmprisonservice.gov.uk/pso2700/PSO%202700_-_front_index_and_PSO_itself.htm

If that is too much for you to read you can cut out most of the crap and cut straight to the important bits, the annexes here:

http://pso.hmprisonservice.gov.uk/pso2700/PSO%202700_-_annexes_1-8.htm#Anx8g

Just one other point, all sorts of prisoners are routinely sent to Cat B prisons, all prison staff are trained to deal with Suicidal and self harming individuals, regardless of the category of prison they work at. So why would they send what is in essence a normal remand prisoner to a Cat A prison? Because of the high media interest?

[marney]

Are you seriously so blinkered that you can't accept the Sun aren't able to even get their own story correct? The Sun publish 2 different articles on 2 different days both with differing information.

Shasown's link show's an article published in the Sun dated 26th Jan - which states that VT was moved from Bristol to Gloucester.

Your link here, shows the Sun publishing an article dated 27th Jan (a day later!!) stating he's still in Bristol. Please read this next part very carefully - the very same tabloid is reporting 2 very different things and is completely contradicting itself.

Article in the Mirror, dated 27th Jan. States he was moved from Bristol to Gloucester. http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/top-stories/2011/01/27/jo-yeates-murder-accused-vincent-tabak-feels-safe-in-jail-115875-22878251/

Article in the Metro, run from info from the Sun!! dated 26th Jan. States he was moved from Bristol to Gloucester. http://www.metro.co.uk/news/853763-vincent-tabak-moved-over-jail-attack-fears

Article on small world news - also run on info from the Sun... dated 26th Jan. States he was moved from Bristol to Gloucester, even mentions jails are 30 miles away. http://swns.com/vincent-tabak-moved-prison-over-attack-fears-260947.html

Is this finally sinking in yet? The Sun 'go back' on what they reported a day previous.

Thus, in reply to your comment, "Got it wrong have they" - Yes. Clearly the Sun have got it wrong and haven't got a clue what the left hand is doing from the right hand.

A point that Shausown made clear when they said the Sun were completely undermining their very own article in respect of Long Larton.

You're not really cut out for this detective lark are you!!


Case list for Bristol Crown Court shows that Vincent Tabak is to appear via video link from HMP Longlartin for the preliminary hearing on Monday:


Not very good at this lark are you.

[Pyramid*]

Case list for Bristol Crown Court shows that Vincent Tabak is to appear via video link from HMP Longlartin for the preliminary hearing on Monday:


Not very good at this lark are you.


dont suppose you'd actually care to comment on the details of my post, the links provided that were in direct reply to your comment about the Sun tabloid getting it wrong?


Mmmm..... nah. I thought not.




Daily List for Monday 31 January 2011 at The Law Courts, Small Street,Bristol.

Court 1 - sitting at 10:00 AM
HIS HONOUR JUDGE LAMBERT
Plea and Case Management

T20100571 KENINGTON Craig A 52SB0003810
T20100813 REDFORD Jason H 52SB0004010
T20107481 WILLIAMS John P 52SB0412509 BACON Keela
L 52SB0412509 BATH Claire 52SB0412509
T20107552 REDFORD Jason H 52SB5003610
T20107489 BATH Joe A 52SB0412509
T20100322 BATH Joe A 52SB0055310 THIS HEARING RESERVED HHJ LAMBERT


See... I can quote stuff too from Court sittings. Better than that.... here's the link http://www.courtserve2.net/courtlists/current/crown/brist_T110131.02.htm

[CarriKP]

Got it wrong have they !!!!


http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/news/3373571/Man-charged-with-Jo-Yeates-murder-put-on-suicide-watch-in-prison.html

Sorry - what have 'they' got 'wrong' - ?
And who do you mean when you write 'they' ?
And - more importantly - how can anyone at all know what is 'right' or 'wrong' - in mostly any respect - at this stage?

[CarriKP]

Sorry - what have 'they' got 'wrong' - ?
And who do you mean when you write 'they' ?
And - more importantly - how can anyone at all know what is 'right' or 'wrong' - in mostly any respect - at this stage?

I should probably add that I've a few friends who have been gravely misquoted - and therefore misrepresented - by the tabloids -
in fact their catch phrase is 'but that's NOT what I SAID'
:confused:

[Mifletz]

Given the snowy weather conditions at the time, is it conceiveable that the covered body was dragged there.....on a sledge?! Else why drop it off a mere 3 miles away? Whereas 3 miles is at the limit of one man hauling 165lbs on a sledge over snow-covered tarmac! Instead of looking for a car/van on the Clifton Bridge road, maybe the police should look footage of the bridge's snow-covered pedestrian pavement!

http://faveluke.com/Images/fred_pulling_sledweb.jpg

[marney]

I suggest you read what was written in respect of Mifletz post to which I replied, discussing the matter of 'dead weight' ..... you will see there is no contradiction. What I did do was offer up my own thoughts on whether there is a difference between the weight of a dead body, and the weight of an alive but unconscious person. Mifletz suggested there was a substantial difference in these weights - and my comment was worded quite clearly, in a manner which not only did I question if that was the case, I also mitigated my own uncertaintly by way of an explanation as to why I thought what I did. Try reading, digesting and at least try to understand context before criticising.



If you didn't find your comment amusing, then why add in this smiley
-----> :hugesmile: - you used it immediately after the comment in question. That smiley represents 'big grin'. Most big grins indicate amusement. What on earth else was this smiley meant to represent?

And no, still you are unable to master the simple art of hitting the quote button.

I wish I :hugesmile:was so perfect as you:hugesmile:again

[Mifletz]

Will Tabak be actually asked tomorrow: "How do you plead"?

If he says "Guilty, m'lud", what exactly happens?

If he says "Not Guilty, m'lud", what exactly happens?

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2006/05/lordphillipPA300506_228x251.jpg

[marney]

If he was held at Bristol then Gloucester as a B category prisoner at what point and why did they did consider him to be A category. Makes you wonder if he or his Lawyers are going to fight this case.

[Pyramid*]

Given the snowy weather conditions at the time, is it conceiveable that the covered body was dragged there.....on a sledge?! Else why drop it off a mere 3 miles away? Whereas 3 miles is at the limit of one man hauling 165lbs on a sledge over snow-covered tarmac! Instead of looking for a car/van on the Clifton Bridge road, maybe the police should look footage of the bridge's snow-covered pedestrian pavement!

http://faveluke.com/Images/fred_pulling_sledweb.jpg


Perhaps the police also found a receipt in VT's pocket, for the hire of some of these.....

http://www.eventstravel.net/img/act/45.png

After all, a 6'4" man, pulling a dead body along in a sledge is the most normal looking thing to see in Bristol, looks completely inconspicious. You sure you're not related to Marney!! I have my suspicions!


I wish I :hugesmile:was so perfect as you:hugesmile:again

It's good to have an ambition in life, something to strive for Marney. ;)

Perfection is a very rare thing but it's touching that you seem to think I am perfect, what a lovely compliment! I suppose I should thank you but I won't bother. ;)

The ability to read what is written, to understand what is written however, isn't perfection. It is a fairly simple process for the majority of people - yet it seems one that continually eludes you - as you have proven repeatedly on this very thread.

[marney]

The ability to read what is written, to understand what is written however, isn't perfection. It is a fairly simple process for the majority of people - yet it seems one that continually eludes you - as you have proven repeatedly on this very thread.


You sound like a teacher with your consistent degrading comments on other peoples postings

People will be wondering if you are, especially with your consistent " Chris Jefferies is innocent" comments.

Surely you are too good to be wasting your time on these forums with such genius or are you especially on here to correct the masses, mistakes.

[Pyramid*]

You sound like a teacher with your consistent degrading comments on other peoples postings

People will be wondering if you are, especially with your consistent " Chris Jefferies is innocent" comments.

Surely you are too good to be wasting your time on these forums with such genius or are you especially on here to correct the masses, mistakes.

With my 'consistent degrading comments'? Consistent? Oh..... I see, you mean 'constant'. Deary me.

The way it works is simple Marney. If you want to come onto a very serious thread, being vitriolic, calling people trolls etc and do not a lot other than try to provoke reactions in other fms with your very own low grade brand of sarcasm, you have to learn that if you play with fire, you have to expect to get burnt. If you can't stand the heat and all that...... ;)

I believe Chris Jefferies is innocent - hardly makes me a teacher! There are thousands of others in the UK who will be thinking the same as me - do you wonder if they are all teachers too?

I'm here on this thread for sensible and mature discussion - your reason for being on this thread, is questionable.

I am however beginning to enjoy the challenge of trying to decipher some of your own posts, they do have a certain entertainment value to them - tedious although they may be at times.

[marney]

I'm here on this thread for sensible and mature discussion. Really

Started to degrade mifletz postings now have we.
After all, a 6'4" man, pulling a dead body along in a sledge is the most normal looking thing to see in Bristol, looks completely inconspicious. You sure you're not related to Marney!! I have my suspicions!

No I do mean consistent, can you read a thesaurus, I thought you are supposed to be clever.

Glad you find my post entertaining

[Shasown]

Will Tabak be actually asked tomorrow: "How do you plead"?

If he says "Guilty, m'lud", what exactly happens?

If he says "Not Guilty, m'lud", what exactly happens?



Yeah he will be informed of the actual charge he is accused of, whether its murder or manslaughter and asked how he pleads to the accusation. If he pleads not guilty the judge will set a date for trial, if both the defence and prosection lawyers agree that their cases can be prepared by then.

If he pleads guilty the judge will remand him into custody to await sentencing, and order both defence and prosecution to prepare statements.

Both the defence and prosecution teams will prepare statements for the judge to listen to in order to determine the sentence.

A statement of mitigation for the defence would explain why he committed the crime, the fact he is of otherwise good character etc, realises what he is done and is remorseful etc.

The prosecution generally makes a statement indicating what they and the police believe occurred and also play up the crime and how the person deserves to receive the maximum sentence etc. Though occassionally the CPS have asked for lesser sentences depending upon the motivation for the crime, the circumstances of the actual crime and co operation of the person.

[Pyramid*]

I'm here on this thread for sensible and mature discussion. Really

Started to degrade mifletz postings now have we.
After all, a 6'4" man, pulling a dead body along in a sledge is the most normal looking thing to see in Bristol, looks completely inconspicious. You sure you're not related to Marney!! I have my suspicions!

No I do mean consistent, can you read a thesaurus, I thought you are supposed to be clever.

Glad you find my post entertaining

Suggesting a theory that a body was dragged along Bristol on a sleigh (as Mifletz did) and my subsequent suggestion that maybe VT hired huskies for the job - is not degrading - it is exactly what it is: showing how ludicrious a suggestion I personally found it to be. I'm allowed to do that, it's my opinion.

Given some of your very own ludicrious posts, yes, I felt there was a meeting of minds between you and Mifletz - hardly an unusual phenomenon - people who share the same ideas. It's not a rare concept.

Glad you confirmed that I am consistent. Unlike your good self, who manages to offer up contradictions - (ie: the use of big grin smilies whilst commenting on a serious issue) - and when asked why - you fly off the handle, and rather than stop and think, "what would make them think that" and go back to review what you posted. I'll hazard a guess that you fail to do that as you may be too absorbed in trying to throw insults around to people.

So... now that we have all of that out of the way - I will reiterate what I said in my last reply to you Marney. Feel free to continue with your own brand of low grade sarcasm, and I'll be more than happy to joust with you - but puhhhlllleeezzzee.... stop with the pathetic whining - you came in with the tacky boots, don't blame me if the soles aren't thick enough to last the journey.

p.s. Chris Jefferies is innocent.

[marney]

Given some of your very own ludicrious posts, yes, I felt there was a meeting of minds between you and Mifletz - hardly an unusual phenomenon - people who share the same ideas. It's not a rare concept.

WHAT HAS MIFLETZ DONE TO DESERVE THOSE COMMENTS

Glad you confirmed that I am consistent.

YES RELIABLE IN YOUR DEGRADING OF PEOPLES COMMENTS.

ps. Chris Jefferies is innocent.

Have YOU inside information on that

[Pyramid*]

WHAT HAS MIFLETZ DONE TO DESERVE THOSE COMMENTS


You know, you're right. (even with your messed up quote again!!) Mifletz didn't deserve to be likened to you, it was extremely good of you to acknowledge that one yourself.


Have YOU inside information on that
CJ is innocent. Yes I have inside information. :pat:

[marney]

[quote=pyramid*;4082039]you know, you're right. (even with your messed up quote again!!) mifletz didn't deserve to be likened to you, it was extremely good of you to acknowledge that one yourself.



Why post it in the first place then, you should really stop and think before you send out comments like that if you dont believe them to be accurate after all you are always slagging off others.

cj is innocent. Yes i have inside information. :pat:

I thought you did.

[Mifletz]

If it does not go to trial, how long is it before all the details of the case become available on the public record: days, weeks, months or even years?

[Pyramid*]

Why post it in the first place then, you should really stop and think before you send out comments like that if you dont believe them to be accurate after all you are always slagging off others.

:laugh2: PMSL. You really aren't on the ball at all are you? !!!

I thought you did.
:laugh3:Like a moth to a flame Marney, like a moth to a flame. :pat:

[Shasown]

If it does not go to trial, how long is it before all the details of the case become available on the public record: days, weeks, months or even years?

If he pleads Guilty, he will be remanded in custody until sentencing. At the sentencing hearing his defence team and himself will be given the opportunity to make a statement in mitigation, basically saying something in his defence.

If the judge has no reporting restrictions imposed on the sentencing, thats when what the police believe to have happened will come out. Bearing in mind he may have confessed all to the police sometime between initial arrest and the sentencing hearing.

The prosecution recap in court what the police and themselves believe to have occurred, the defence isnt allowed to challenge the prosecutions version. The defendant has at that time agreed to the prosecutions version by virtue of pleading guilty in the eyes of the law.

As for the accuracy of what is stated by the prosecution depends how long in advance they have had to interview him after he decided to plead guilty, co-operating with the police and CPS generally lightens any potential sentence.

[Pyramid*]

If he pleads Guilty, he will be remanded in custody until sentencing. At the sentencing hearing his defence team and himself will be given the opportunity to make a statement in mitigation, basically saying something in his defence.

If the judge has no reporting restrictions imposed on the sentencing, thats when what the police believe to have happened will come out. Bearing in mind he may have confessed all to the police sometime between initial arrest and the sentencing hearing.

The prosecution recap in court what the police and themselves believe to have occurred, the defence isnt allowed to challenge the prosecutions version. The defendant has at that time agreed to the prosecutions version by virtue of pleading guilty in the eyes of the law.

As for the accuracy of what is stated by the prosecution depends how long in advance they have had to interview him after he decided to plead guilty, co-operating with the police and CPS generally lightens any potential sentence.

Very informative.

The motive (if indeed, there is one - in that if it wasn't premeditated, on the premise that it's not been something that went horribly wrong) will be interesting to hear as well as all the other unaswered questions after her immediate death etc.

Either way, it's bad enough having someone you loved murdered, but for it to be a neighbour and one that they will have possibly known only a few short months since moving in, one can't imagine the 'ifs, but, maybes' that must be going through Greg's head. That question of 'Why' must be a living nightmare for him and of course, Joanna's parents. Tragic whatever way you look at it.

[Mifletz]

Now that the hearing has been set for May and the trial for October, for how much longer legally can CJ be kept on bail, longest case scenario?

Is it possible in the UK to be kept on bail almost indefinitely?

Is VT's calm as unmelted Dutch butter and polite demeanour to the judge at his pending pre-trial possibly 9 months incarceration a sign that he is guilty and has accepted his fate, as a genuinely innocent man would be physically agitated and angry in the extreme?

[Shasown]

Now that the hearing has been set for May and the trial for October, for how much longer legally can CJ be kept on bail, longest case scenario?

There is no legally determined time a person can be kept on bail. However if CJ's legal team apply to the courts for the removal of his bail, a judge can determine the reasons for the police keeping him on police bail. The judge can also order the police to terminate the bail within a set time frame if no charges are forthcoming.

Is it possible in the UK to be kept on bail almost indefinitely?

Yes, he hasnt been charged with an offence yet, once he is there are certain guarentees in law like the right to a trial without undue delays etc. Release on bail has been known to last several months. Not sure what the record for the longest is but is over a year.

He may be on bail for a related or an unrelated offence discovered during the murder inquiry and the CPS may be making a decision as to whether its in the public interest to charge him.


Is VT's calm as unmelted Dutch butter and polite demeanour to the judge at his pending pre-trial possibly 9 months incarceration a sign that he is guilty and has accepted his fate, as a genuinely innocent man would be physically agitated and angry in the extreme?

Different people react in different way, as you say he may be guilty and have accepted his fate, though wouldnt he have just plead guilty at his initial court appearance? He may have the mind set that he is innocent and this will be proven after due process. He has been described by others purporting to know him as very calm and polite.

[Mifletz]

If he's innocent, to have to kick his heels in an English jail all those nine precious months until October, just to get to the start of the trial, must be a taste of Hell!

I know that other countries are even worse, but a nine month wait in jail for a trial is an inhuman insult.

Even if justice isn't served, all trials should be required to start within 2 months of being charged.

[CarriKP]

If he's innocent, to have to kick his heels in an English jail all those nine precious months until October, just to get to the start of the trial, must be a taste of Hell!

I know that other countries are even worse, but a nine month wait in jail for a trial is an inhuman insult.

Even if justice isn't served, all trials should be required to start within 2 months of being charged.

My slightly cheeky guess here is that the prosecution needs that amount of time to get a convincing case together.

[CarriKP]

My slightly cheeky guess here is that the prosecution needs that amount of time to get a convincing case together.

And as the date even then is 'provisional' it may never happen at all - perhaps?

[marney]

Joanna Yeates Funeral today 11/2/2011

A life taken needlessly, a death which touched the hearts of thousands. May your soul rest in peace Jo.

[Benjamin]

What happened with this? Did they find the killer?

[GypsyGoth]

Yea, it turned out that Braden was the killer.

[InOne]

Chris Jefferies is no longer a suspect. The Dutch guys trial is in Oct and he will most likely be found guilty.

All wrapped up in a nice neat little package :bouncy:

[Benjamin]

Yea, it turned out that Braden was the killer.

:laugh:

[Pyramid*]

Chris Jefferies is no longer a suspect. The Dutch guys trial is in Oct and he will most likely be found guilty.

All wrapped up in a nice neat little package :bouncy:

Has CJ been officially cleared and his bail conditions removed I take it? (Haven't really been keeping abreast since VT was arrested and charged).

Talking of VT - it puzzles me what his motive would have been?Or has it been somethng more innocent that all went tragically wrong? Either way - I guess the fact that he didn't exactly own up but let another man go through all sorts for nothing...... makes you wonder. Will be an interesting court case I think.

[InOne]

I just heard about CJ on the news this morning, was only a little snippet

[MTVN]

Yeah, he's definitely been released from bail now -http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-bristol-12664581 - shame his character was permanently tarnished after his arrest

[Pyramid*]

I just heard about CJ on the news this morning, was only a little snippet

Yeah, he's definitely been released from bail now -http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-bristol-12664581 - shame his character was permanently tarnished after his arrest


Thanks for that folks..... I wasn't aware of the update. I totally agree with you MTVN - bloody shame for the man - he might have been a bit odd, but a murderer that doesn't make him - but the connection will very unfortunately live on.

Making me wonder if he's had any joy in taking legal action against the police for wrongful arrest, and for the defamation of character/libel against the newspapers.

[Pyramid*]

Update on the situ:-

Joanna Yeates suffered 43 separate injuries in slow and painful death
Minutes after 'squeezing the life' out of her Tabak text girlfriend to say he was 'bored'
Killer went shopping at Asda with body in the boot of his car


Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2047800/Joanna-Yeates-killer-Vincent-Tabak-overpowered-victim-suffered-slow-painful-death.html#ixzz1aTWgE0vF

[Marc]

This whole story upsets me so much. It's just horrible to think that she didn't even know the guy and to hear all the details of her death. :sad:

[Marc]

Update on the situ:-

Joanna Yeates suffered 43 separate injuries in slow and painful death
Minutes after 'squeezing the life' out of her Tabak text girlfriend to say he was 'bored'
Killer went shopping at Asda with body in the boot of his car


Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2047800/Joanna-Yeates-killer-Vincent-Tabak-overpowered-victim-suffered-slow-painful-death.html#ixzz1aTWgE0vF

:sad: This guy is a nut job!! I want to swear etc. but this forum wont let me! :mad: