My fair opinion of tonight's argument.

[Mystic Mock]

Reasons why Helen was in the right - Why did Matthew sit in the room if he didn't want to be involved? Also I do feel that he was deliberately winding her up.

Reasons why Helen was in the wrong - She was too aggressive, too rude in the way that she put herself across, and she shouldn't be forcing her opinions down other peoples throats.

Reasons why Matthew was in the right - He kept his calm better, and he was able to be wity while she was going off at him so fair play to him on that.

Reasons why Matthew was in the wrong - He deliberately wound her up, if he didn't want to be apart of the game he could've just done his own thing without piping up, and also I've noticed that he was much more comfortable arguing with a woman than he is arguing on guys, I wonder why his whole persona changed all of a sudden?

[Macie Lightfoot]

Wow what a fair unbiased assessment!!!!!!!1

[Vicky.]

He deliberately wound her up? He made ONE comment...not even to her and she blew. Shes a ****ing nutter.

Never noticed his persona change one little bit either...

[Mystic Mock]

Wow what a fair unbiased assessment!!!!!!!1

Is that sarcasm lol? At least I'm not portraying Helen as a saint like some people are with Matthew lol.

[Mystic Mock]

He deliberately wound her up? He made ONE comment...not even to her and she blew. Shes a ****ing nutter.

Never noticed his persona change one little bit either...

I'm sorry but complaining about the game that they was playing was him trying to wind them up, I'm not saying that he was expecting just Helen to blow up at him, I think he was expecting people like Ash and Winston to get involved as well so it would look like he was being bullied, thankfully them two stayed out of it.

[LukeB]

way i see it matthew shouldnt of said what he said helen might of proberly thought he was looking down at them all but she went OTT with the agressiveness

[Vicky.]

I'm sorry but complaining about the game that they was playing was him trying to wind them up, I'm not saying that he was expecting just Helen to blow up at him, I think he was expecting people like Ash and Winston to get involved as well so it would look like he was being bullied, thankfully them two stayed out of it.

You have a serious obsession with this this year mock...honestly...

He made a little comment, quite quietly too. If he had been sitting (like Danielle normally does) making a huge fuss then I would agree he was purposely trying to cause trouble.

IMO the only thing he did wrong tonight was the saggy tits comment, and even that he was kinda pushed into.

[Mystic Mock]

You have a serious obsession with this this year mock...honestly...

He made a little comment, quite quietly too. If he had been sitting (like Danielle normally does) making a huge fuss then I would agree he was purposely trying to cause trouble.

IMO the only thing he did wrong tonight was the saggy tits comment, and even that he was kinda pushed into.

Well I haven't branded 13 Housemates as bullies like some people have this year so I'm not that obsessed compared to some people.

And I'm trying to be fair here, can people please stop treating Matthew like a saint please? Saying he hates the game in a small part of the room where loads of Housemates are then they're gonna hear it, unless you're saying that Matthew is thick?

[Mystic Mock]

way i see it matthew shouldnt of said what he said helen might of proberly thought he was looking down at them all but she went OTT with the agressiveness

An absolute fair post that I agree with.

[Vicky.]

I dont think theres beena day yet when I havent seen at least 3 posts from you accusing someone (usually who has been on the receiving end of helens rants) of trying for pity :umm2: Guess thats what you have to do when you support the house bitch though..

I'm not saying he's thick at all. But its hardly winding people up on purpose to make ONE comment. Normal people would ignore it. Not psychos though, clearly. Noone else had a problem but helen who had been looking for an excuse to blow simply because she had had a drink

[rusticgal]

Matthew had sat and played along for an hour....the game was degenerating into pathetic school-boyish sexual trivia and he simply wanted to no longer be involved. What's wrong with that?....Helen was just waiting for an opportunity to explode at any of the housemates she considers 'boring' to spout off at because I doubt a day goes by without her getting involved in some sort of confrontation...goby cow!!!

[Mystic Mock]

I dont think I have seen a post of yours yet that doesnt accuse someone of trying for pity :umm2: Guess thats what you have to do when you support the house bitch though..

I'm not saying he's thick at all. But its hardly winding people up on purpose to make ONE comment. Normal people would ignore it. Not psychos though, clearly. Noone else had a problem but helen who had been looking for an excuse to blow simply because she had had a drink

You clearly only read my posts on the Jale threads then.

And yes I said that Helen overreacted but he did deliberately try and make the people playing the game feel uncomfortable to play it? Or are you gonna disagree with me on it because it's Matthew and he argued on Helen?

[Marsh.]

Matthew had sat and played along for an hour....the game was degenerating into pathetic school-boyish sexual trivia and he simply wanted to no longer be involved. What's wrong with that?....Helen was just waiting for an opportunity to explode at any of the housemates she considers 'boring' to spout off at because I doubt a day goes by without her getting involved in some sort of confrontation...goby cow!!!

He wasn't playing at any point.

They were all in the garden, they asked who wants to play spin the bottle and everyone who did went into the living room. Matthew went to sit and watch, making his comments then Helen blew her top.

[Marsh.]

What's witty about his tits comment?

[Vicky.]

You clearly only read my posts on the Jale threads then.

And yes I said that Helen overreacted but he did deliberately try and make the people playing the game feel uncomfortable to play it? Or are you gonna disagree with me on it because it's Matthew and he argued on Helen?

I am going to disagree with you because I dont think making a slight comment is purposely making others feel uncomfortable...noone else commented bar Helen.

As I said, if he was sitting going on and on and on then I could understand the reaction from her. But for one comment to the titwank question...just no

[chuff me dizzy]

Why shouldnt he sit in the room ? its not Helens house, he was sat there quietly watching the game and said quietly he wouldnt play, he didnt tell them how low and dirty they were making themselves look as I would have done ,Helen was waiting for her chance to attack because she had her Rottweillers with her ,not one part of it was Matts fault

[Marsh.]

I didn't say he shouldn't sit in there, but he obviously went to watch because he said he knew what the questions would be like, and wanted to stick his nose up at it.

Entirely his right but seems quite petty to do if it's so beneath him.

Doesn't excuse Helens behaviour, she completely went over the top because she'd been drinking yet again but he can be a bit snobby Matthew.

[chuff me dizzy]

I didn't say he shouldn't sit in there, but he obviously went to watch because he said he knew what the questions would be like, and wanted to stick his nose up at it.

Entirely his right but seems quite petty to do if it's so beneath him.

Doesn't excuse Helens behaviour, she completely went over the top because she'd been drinking yet again but he can be a bit snobby Matthew.

I was answering OP not you flower

[Marsh.]

I was answering OP not you flower

:blush: :hehe:

[Mystic Mock]

What's witty about his tits comment?

Tbf I'm not gonna attack him for that one as she had took the piss about his weight.

I was thinking of his stuff in the Diary Room more than anything.

[rionablue]

Helen should have been removed from the house last night in my opinion Its one thing to bandy insults between Matt and her each one worse than the other but when she went and invaded his space and spoke in a menacing tone she should have b een shown the door. People have been removed for far less

[Mystic Mock]

Why shouldnt he sit in the room ? its not Helens house, he was sat there quietly watching the game and said quietly he wouldnt play, he didnt tell them how low and dirty they were making themselves look as I would have done ,Helen was waiting for her chance to attack because she had her Rottweillers with her ,not one part of it was Matts fault

Because most normal people leave a room (in a polite way of course) if they don't like a discussion/game, not deliberately slag the game off in front of them to make them feel uncomfortable.

[Marsh.]

Tbf I'm not gonna attack him for that one as she had took the piss about his weight.

I was thinking of his stuff in the Diary Room more than anything.

I didn't mean attack him, I just didn't find it witty. :shrug:

[Vicky.]

Helen should have been removed from the house last night in my opinion Its one thing to bandy insults between Matt and her each one worse than the other but when she went and invaded his space and spoke in a menacing tone she should have b een shown the door. People have been removed for far less
I disagree she should have been removed, however it would be interesting to see what BBs reaction would be if a bloke got up in a womans face like that :think:

[Mystic Mock]

Helen should have been removed from the house last night in my opinion Its one thing to bandy insults between Matt and her each one worse than the other but when she went and invaded his space and spoke in a menacing tone she should have b een shown the door. People have been removed for far less

I think there was 2 reasons why she was kept in.

1. She's the star of the series.

2. Conor from BB13 being kept in for far more offensive language.

[ruiphillips]

Your opinion is way off. How anyone can defend Helen's behavior is beyond me. That women has deep issues she needs working on instead of pumping her body with plastic.

[CaudleHalbard]

Helen is full of self-hatred, IMO. It spills out as bile. She needs help.

[joeysteele]

She did say in the diary room that she didn't know what was wrong with her. She also said she was sorry.

Helen is no way a favourite of mine and she is one of the people in there I would find it hard to live with a lot of the time but I also do find her entertaining and on the highlights last night, they were having a good time, and she was really good in those highlights.

I would actually have sided with Matthew tonight against her had I been in the house tonight but no way would I like to see her removed.
I don't like the free pass to the final at all but removing her from the house,no.

[Miranda123]

Reasons why Helen was in the right - Why did Matthew sit in the room if he didn't want to be involved? Also I do feel that he was deliberately winding her up.

Reasons why Helen was in the wrong - She was too aggressive, too rude in the way that she put herself across, and she shouldn't be forcing her opinions down other peoples throats.

Reasons why Matthew was in the right - He kept his calm better, and he was able to be wity while she was going off at him so fair play to him on that.

Reasons why Matthew was in the wrong - He deliberately wound her up, if he didn't want to be apart of the game he could've just done his own thing without piping up, and also I've noticed that he was much more comfortable arguing with a woman than he is arguing on guys, I wonder why his whole persona changed all of a sudden?

I think thats a very fair assessment
As they said, they all got up from the garden to go inside to play THAT game, Matthew, Toya, Ashleigh, all followed behind, afraid they will miss an opportunity to slag the others off
Helen was right to say, if you dont want to play then f..k off

Jale looked like she wanted to play, even Danielle was laughing, but then the thought police had to stick their ****ing oar in, this time in the shape of Matthew, it'll be Ashleighs turn next cause Toyas hiding til Friday

They are miserable basta.ds and Destroyers of Fun

[Mystic Mock]

I disagree she should have been removed, however it would be interesting to see what BBs reaction would be if a bloke got up in a womans face like that :think:

BB are very well known for reverse sexism lol.

[Mystic Mock]

I think thats a very fair assessment
As they said, they all got up from the garden to go inside to play THAT game, Matthew, Toya, Ashleigh, all followed behind, afraid they will miss an opportunity to slag the others off
Helen was right to say, if you dont want to play then f..k off

Jale looked like she wanted to play, even Danielle was laughing, but then the thought police had to stick their ****ing oar in, this time in the shape of Matthew, it'll be Ashleighs turn next cause Toyas hiding til Friday

They are miserable basta.ds and Destroyers of Fun

Thank you for reading my post without taking the piss lol.

[jet]

Reasons why Helen was in the right - Why did Matthew sit in the room if he didn't want to be involved? Also I do feel that he was deliberately winding her up.

Reasons why Helen was in the wrong - She was too aggressive, too rude in the way that she put herself across, and she shouldn't be forcing her opinions down other peoples throats.

Reasons why Matthew was in the right - He kept his calm better, and he was able to be wity while she was going off at him so fair play to him on that.

Reasons why Matthew was in the wrong - He deliberately wound her up, if he didn't want to be apart of the game he could've just done his own thing without piping up, and also I've noticed that he was much more comfortable arguing with a woman than he is arguing on guys, I wonder why his whole persona changed all of a sudden?

I disagree with you on several points. Matthew was part of the game until the 'sex' talk came up and he has as much right to voice his opinion as anyone else. I fail to see how he was deliberately 'winding her up'? Maybe he just didn't want the game to go there because he wasn't comfortable with that?

He said "I'm not playing". He didn't say "everyone stop playing right now because I don't approve"!

At that point it was a case of saying to him 'Fair enough" and carrying on with the game.
But Helen had to take personal offense as usual and make it all about her. She needs little excuse to kick off and if it hadn't been Matthew, she would have found a similarly petty reason sooner or later to start on someone else.

[Marsh.]

Matthew was not a part of the game jet.

Everyone was in the garden. Someone suggested spin the bottle and the people who were playing went inside. Matthew went with them to watch.

Then after Winston's question said that's why I'm not playing.

Instead of sticking with Toya and the others he went inside because he knew full well what the game would entail and liked to stick his nose up at it.

[jet]

Matthew was not a part of the game jet.

Everyone was in the garden. Someone suggested spin the bottle and the people who were playing went inside. Matthew went with them to watch.

Then after Winston's question said that's why I'm not playing.

Instead of sticking with Toya and the others he went inside because he knew full well what the game would entail and liked to stick his nose up at it.

How do you know all this? In the HL's it just cut to them playing it...and how do you know he went to stick his nose up at it? Because Helen or one of her clan said so? The thing is, we don't know squat really what he was thinking. He doesn't strike me at all as someone who plans for future confrontations or unpleasantness. If that was his aim, then it worked a treat but I doubt it.

Regardless of all that, it doesn't excuse Helen's behavior in the slightest. As I said, she could just have said 'fair enough' and carried on. SHE stopped the game with her over dramatic histrionics, not Matthew.

[Marsh.]

Because half of the discussion was about why he bothered to follow them indoors to play if he wasn't playing anyway. Then proceed to pass sarcastic comment at the people who were playing.

I never said it excused any of Helen's behaviour. It doesn't

But just because she acted the way she did doesn't take any credence away from her having an initial point in regards to Matthew.
I don't think he planned for a confrontation. On the contrary, he seemed completely surprised by the blow up. He just wanted to sit there and watch the others 'degrade' themselves and be judgemental about it.

His and Toya's speciality; judgement.

We saw it from Toya and Ashleigh yesterday, looking down their noses at people daring to have fun in the pool.

[jet]

I like him Marsh, so I'm going to view him with kinder eyes and not rate him as judgmental without more evidence :)

[Me. I Am Salman]

Because half of the discussion was about why he bothered to follow them indoors to play if he wasn't playing anyway. Then proceed to pass sarcastic comment at the people who were playing.

I never said it excused any of Helen's behaviour. It doesn't

But just because she acted the way she did doesn't take any credence away from her having an initial point in regards to Matthew.
I don't think he planned for a confrontation. On the contrary, he seemed completely surprised by the blow up. He just wanted to sit there and watch the others 'degrade' themselves and be judgemental about it.

His and Toya's speciality; judgement.

We saw it from Toya and Ashleigh yesterday, looking down their noses at people daring to have fun in the pool.

keep stanning

http://images.mirror.co.uk/upl/m4/sep2010/0/1/helen-wood-and-jenny-thompson-325662255.jpg

[Marsh.]

Well he was never at any point playing the game so. :hmph:

[uniquedude]

Helen said it herself she wasnt annoyed at Matthew because of his comment she was annoyed because he might hurt Mark, which I think is a bull excuse to be so aggressive if a man went up in a woman's face like that people would see more clearly how aggresive it was.

Seemed to me like shes just a bully and was annoyed because she couldnt get the better of Toya so she just starts targeting someone else who she thought she could get away with being rude to. I dont see how he was deliberatly winidng her up to be honest most normal people would not have had a problem with what he said.

[Cherie]

I think thats a very fair assessment
As they said, they all got up from the garden to go inside to play THAT game, Matthew, Toya, Ashleigh, all followed behind, afraid they will miss an opportunity to slag the others off
Helen was right to say, if you dont want to play then f..k off

Jale looked like she wanted to play, even Danielle was laughing, but then the thought police had to stick their ****ing oar in, this time in the shape of Matthew, it'll be Ashleighs turn next cause Toyas hiding til Friday

They are miserable basta.ds and Destroyers of Fun

What do you mean? Jale was playing, Winston asked her "the offending question" and that is when it all started?


I actually agreed with Helen's point that they were looking down their nose at them, yes they can sit in any part of the room they want but they were all part of the group but not participating, I think Helen was correct in her assessment in that, Matthew's comment was pretty mild but taken in the context of what Helen said it is understandable that she blew, that said I doubt she would have been as aggressive if she had not had a drink, she obviously becomes extremely nasty and a playground bully when drunk, it was inexcusable how personal she got with Matthew and really Ash should have stepped in rather than trying to fan the flames, he claims to be her friend but he is just letting her destroy herself.

[Cherie]

Also after umpteem series, can HMs not think of another game to play rather than spin the bottle :laugh:

[Marsh.]

Also after umpteem series, can HMs not think of another game to play rather than spin the bottle :laugh:

I remember in BB1 they'd play "Follow the Van" :umm2: Sounds stupid but was muckier than spin the bottle.

[Lola844]

I respect your opinion, trying to be fair and seeing both sides. However Helen already knew that night she was going to have a fight with Matt. She was just looking for an excuse. She thinks Matt will hurt Mark, and she stated it before even thinking about playing truth or dare.

I think she builds up anger towards someone in her mind, for no reason and as soon as they open their mouth she is ready to fight.

Helen has no sense of logic, I think she has a lot of anger inside. I don't think she's vile, we are all products of our experiences. She looks like she's had a harsh life and she's always angry. However this is not acceptable, she can't hurt people just because someone hurt her. She needs some sort of counselling, BB is not the place for her right now.

She is probably going to physically assault someone in there. If someone goes head to head with her, and she feels like she's not winning she will get physical.

[chuff me dizzy]

I'm sorry but complaining about the game that they was playing was him trying to wind them up, I'm not saying that he was expecting just Helen to blow up at him, I think he was expecting people like Ash and Winston to get involved as well so it would look like he was being bullied, thankfully them two stayed out of it.

He didnt complain ,he said he wasnt playing ,which is within his rights to do :shocked:

[Vanessa]

I remember in BB1 they'd play "Follow the Van" :umm2: Sounds stupid but was muckier than spin the bottle.

:laugh: sounds like a good game.

[Marsh.]

:laugh: sounds like a good game.

:evilgrin:

[chuff me dizzy]

Matthew was not a part of the game jet.

Everyone was in the garden. Someone suggested spin the bottle and the people who were playing went inside. Matthew went with them to watch.

Then after Winston's question said that's why I'm not playing.

Instead of sticking with Toya and the others he went inside because he knew full well what the game would entail and liked to stick his nose up at it.

EXACTLY as I saw it too

[flamingGalah!]

Helen was 100% in the wrong. Matthew made one little comment, which wasn't even bad or provoking, then Helen starts an argument with a tirade of abuse & personal insults. She is never happy unless she is having an argument, she has probably been waiting for ages to kick off at Matthew. And when someone is ranting & shouting abuse in your face like she was (in a very aggressive manner) what are they supposed to do? You slate him for "winding her up", but if he had shouted in her face & been as vile & aggressive as her you would be saying he was in the wrong for doing that to a woman (& BB would have either dragged him into the diary room or ejected him from the house)... I think Matthew behaved perfectly. He didn't shout, he remained calm & didn't give any insults until Helen had insulted him. He basically showed her up for the c ** t that she is & I think he will be in the final 3...