Time to say goodbye to civvy BB?

[Northern Monkey]

I think it's had it's day now tbh.
When you look at all this desperate crap they're having to do to pull in more viewers i reckon it's a definate sign that it's time to close the lid on civilian BB.
The premise of the show can't stand up on its own anymore.
When the producers have to start injecting fake drama in the style of TOWIE just to get anyone to watch then its time to call it a day.
I think BB has just been going on too long now,Its been done.It was a stroke of genius and it had a good innings but it's become so fake and forced now that it's more like watching Eastenders than a reality show.
The term 'reality' has become warped these days into scripted drama.
Even CBB feels more natural to watch.Atleast you expect to be watching media savvy celebs before you watch.

[MB.]

Yeah, they should just do an extended UBB and then cancel it to focus on CBB now.

[Jase.]

Give us another civilian series and if it's anything like this years (or worse), then yeah, axe it.

[Beetlejuice]

They should try at least one civilian series with the 24/7 live feed. It depresses me how much "fans" of this show want to bury it when one of the most important aspects of it has never been used by Channel 5.

There's so many obvious things they could do in this age of social media on the internet and yet it all such a shambles. From the housemates chosen to the lack of updates to the ridiculous twists and constant interference.

The civilian series has been ruined by the bad decisions made for it, not because of the format, which has never really been tried.

[Beetlejuice]

Yeah, they should just do an extended UBB and then cancel it to focus on CBB now.

CBB will be dead within 2 years. The same thing happened with Fame Academy.

Stop telling them to axe the show and argue for them to make a better one.

[MB.]

CBB will be dead within 2 years. The same thing happened with Fame Academy.

Stop telling them to axe the show and argue for them to make a better one.

What? :umm2: Fame Academy lasted two years, CBB has lasted fourteen. That comparison makes no sense.

CBB's by far Channel 5's biggest ratings hit, and they could get even better ratings if they put the money usually spent on civilian BB into it.

[Northern Monkey]

They should try at least one civilian series with the 24/7 live feed. It depresses me how much "fans" of this show want to bury it when one of the most important aspects of it has never been used by Channel 5.

There's so many obvious things they could do in this age of social media on the internet and yet it all such a shambles. From the housemates chosen to the lack of updates to the ridiculous twists and constant interference.

The civilian series has been ruined by the bad decisions made for it, not because of the format, which has never really been tried.

Well that is a big part of it.C5 can't give us the story lines that they wish to create with live feed.

[Marsh.]

This time last year I'd have said, stick with CBB as it's the only thing they try to make an effort with.

But judging by CBB14 and 15 since then it's going to go the same way as the civilian show.

They really need to sort this mess out if they hope to make it to the end of this new 3 year contract.

[Jason.]

This time last year I'd have said, stick with CBB as it's the only thing they try to make an effort with.

But judging by CBB14 and 15 since then it's going to go the same way as the civilian show.

They really need to sort this mess out if they hope to make it to the end of this new 3 year contract.

I think with CBB14 and CBB15 is that they were after BB15, so they were tampered with the constant negativity and conflict.

I think this summer CBB and next January's CBB will be a teller of whether CBB will remain successful or not.

[Beetlejuice]

What? :umm2: Fame Academy lasted two years, CBB has lasted fourteen. That comparison makes no sense.

Fame Academy carried on with celebrities for Comic Relief. It proved to be a greater success than the normal series. But when the original format dies, the celebrity version that it gave rise to soon dies afterwards.

CBB's by far Channel 5's biggest ratings hit

The normal Big Brother is still it's biggest show as well. Even with the poor ratings this year.

[Marsh.]

I think with CBB14 and CBB15 is that they were after BB15, so they were tampered with the constant negativity and conflict.

I think this summer CBB and next January's CBB will be a teller of whether CBB will remain successful or not.

Basing those CBBs off BB16 so far I don't think they've learnt any lessons from BB15 so I don't hold out much more hope. :worry:

[Marsh.]

Fame Academy carried on with celebrities for Comic Relief. It proved to be a greater success than the normal series. But when the original format dies, the celebrity version that it gave rise to soon dies afterwards.



The normal Big Brother is still it's biggest show as well. Even with the poor ratings this year.

But did it die because the original one died or because it was a show with a short shelf life anyway?

I think CBB could easily (especially at 2 series per year) survive on its own on channel 5.

[Jason.]

Is BB that big for Channel 5?

Looking at the 10 most watched Channel 5 shows, since it's debut in 1997.

The revival of BB/Launch of CBB8 is #1, with 5.27m, making it the most watched C5 show ever.

But after that, it's all CSI episodes, which aired way back in 2006, rating over 4.5m.

CBB comes close to that. But, BB is just getting 1m. Even CSI re-runs on Channel 5 get more than that.

Not to mention other shows like Don't Pay, We'll Take it Away.


Compare to Channel 4's Most Watched 10.
5/10 of the list is Big Brother episodes, rating from 8-10m.

BB was much bigger for C4, than BB is for C5.

[Marsh.]

Is BB that big for Channel 5?

Looking at the 10 most watched Channel 5 shows, since it's debut in 1997.

The revival of BB/Launch of CBB8 is #1, with 5.27m, making it the most watched C5 show ever.

But after that, it's all CSI episodes, which aired way back in 2006, rating over 4.5m.

CBB comes close to that. But, BB is just getting 1m. Even CSI re-runs on Channel 5 get more than that.

Not to mention other shows like Don't Pay, We'll Take it Away.

Precisely. CBB is its own thing now.

[LukeB]

I'm bored of the show now tbh

[Jason.]

Precisely. CBB is its own thing now.

Yeah.

I'd be happy if they ditched Big Brother, after BB17, in 2016.
And just had two CBB's a year, instead. One in January, and one in July.

Putting more money on a successful format is better than wasting money for crap civilian BB, which could be used to make CBB even better.

[MB.]

Fame Academy carried on with celebrities for Comic Relief. It proved to be a greater success than the normal series. But when the original format dies, the celebrity version that it gave rise to soon dies afterwards.



The normal Big Brother is still it's biggest show as well. Even with the poor ratings this year.

I know, but that's completely different. The celebrity Fame Academy was for charity and was rested to try other Comic Relief formats, because they'd done it for three years in a row. CBB isn't like that at all and is a show that can run for years considering the last time it was for charity was over a decade ago.

[Jason.]

CBB is the main event now.
BB has become the spin-off.

A decade ago, it was the complete opposite.

[Beetlejuice]

Is BB that big for Channel 5?

Looking at the 10 most watched Channel 5 shows, since it's debut in 1997.

The revival of BB/Launch of CBB8 is #1, with 5.27m, making it the most watched C5 show ever.

But after that, it's all CSI episodes, which aired way back in 2006, rating over 4.5m.

CBB comes close to that. But, BB is just getting 1m. Even CSI re-runs on Channel 5 get more than that.

Not to mention other shows like Don't Pay, We'll Take it Away.


Compare to Channel 4's Most Watched 10.

5/10 of the list is Big Brother episodes, rating from 8-10m.

BB was much bigger for C4, than BB is for C5.

Certainly it is it's biggest Summer show

Check the ratings...

http://www.barb.co.uk/whats-new/weekly-top-30

Big Brother is to Channel 5 what Corrie and Eastenders are to ITV and BBC

[Marsh.]

And flies are to sh*t.

[Beetlejuice]

I know, but that's completely different. The celebrity Fame Academy was for charity and was rested to try other Comic Relief formats

Funnily enough this is how Celebrity Big Brother got started.


because they'd done it for three years in a row. CBB isn't like that at all and is a show that can run for years considering the last time it was for charity was over a decade ago.

I just think people will get tired with it as well. The Summer series struggles compared to the one in January for starters.

And I maintain the problems with the civilian series are easily fixed by Channel 5 making one important decision re: the live feed and getting a production team that aren't full of imbeciles as every Big Brother seems to now have.

Again, it just depresses me to see fans of the show pretty much telling them to axe a programme that can be easily rescued.

[MB.]

Funnily enough this is how Celebrity Big Brother got started.

Which is why I said that in the next sentence. :thumbs:

BB can't continue in its current state for many more years, and it'd be much more worth it for them to shift their focus solely to CBB whilst the civilian version is still a sinking ship.

[Mystic Mock]

#BringAaronback
#BringAdjoaback
#BringKieranback

Yes I'm being a hypocrite.

[Beetlejuice]

CBB is the main event now.
BB has become the spin-off.

A decade ago, it was the complete opposite.

A decade ago there was 24/7 live coverage, a good website and a production team that knew what they were doing. All of that could come back and help the show considerably but the fans have given up even though you now have the presenter calling out for it and a lot of people on twitter saying it should be brought back as well.

[Marsh.]

Yes, of course it's not going to last forever. But the Celebrity edition has more life in it than the civilian version currently.

And of course the summer edition doesn't do as well as January, that's the same across the whole of television. Viewing figures are up across the board in the cold months and lower in the summer months.

[Jason.]

24/7 live feed won't bring in more viewers. Well not much, anyway.

If I was Endemol, and I re-introduced 24/7 live feed, just for 1.7m viewers. I'd think it was a waste.

Considering it used to get 3 times more the ratings, with the same thing.

[Marsh.]

A decade ago there was 24/7 live coverage, a good website and a production team that knew what they were doing. All of that could come back and help the show considerably but the fans have given up even though you now have the presenter calling out for it and a lot of people on twitter saying it should be brought back as well.

"Now"?

Those things have been happening for 4 years and.... no change.

Just as they actually listen and take 2 steps forward they do add something that takes them 10 steps back so the viewers giving up is naturally going to happen.

If they're not going to listen there's no point wasting more time.

But even when it comes to the viewers. Live feed won't increase those, the show is dying. It could survive quite fine without a feed but the way the entire show is managed brings it further down. Compare it to BB10, no live feed but still felt like old school BB. Everything is wrong with the current version.

[M X]

They should try at least one civilian series with the 24/7 live feed. It depresses me how much "fans" of this show want to bury it when one of the most important aspects of it has never been used by Channel 5.

There's so many obvious things they could do in this age of social media on the internet and yet it all such a shambles. From the housemates chosen to the lack of updates to the ridiculous twists and constant interference.

The civilian series has been ruined by the bad decisions made for it, not because of the format, which has never really been tried.

CH5 would never bring back the live feed, because then they wouldn't be able to manipulate and edit the highlights to create the storylines they want.

It's a shame, but it's a reality.

[Beetlejuice]

Which is why I said that in the next sentence. :thumbs:

Yes I saw that, but couldn't be bothered changing the post.

BB can't continue in its current state for many more years, and it'd be much more worth it for them to shift their focus solely to CBB whilst the civilian version is still a sinking ship.

I disagree. They will not get the best celebrities to do any longer than 4 - 5 weeks so there's still a huge gap in the summer (and BB is still their highest rated show for the longest period of time). The Civilian BB is in its current state for one reason alone and that is because of the complete lack of care that has been given to it and the brick wall these idiots have built up between it and the fans who have been asking for the live coverage, along with a few other things, for 5 years. The show can survive well enough if they reverse some of their decisions on these things. If they don't, then it's done. But I strongly suspect CBB will die with it. To be honest, whenever the producers put more of their focus into something, they just make it worse. They had a good format and they turned their back on it, and all their problems stem from that.

[Mystic Mock]

What? :umm2: Fame Academy lasted two years, CBB has lasted fourteen. That comparison makes no sense.

CBB's by far Channel 5's biggest ratings hit, and they could get even better ratings if they put the money usually spent on civilian BB into it.

CBB would be dead if Civilian BB was cancelled as a lot of the people that watch CBB are fans of the Civilian series.

[Marsh.]

They will not get the best celebrities to do any longer than 4 - 5 weeks so there's still a huge gap in the summer

They have never got the "best celebrities" so I don't see the relevance?

[Marsh.]

CBB would be dead if Civilian BB was cancelled as a lot of the people that watch CBB are fans of the Civilian series.

Considering the viewers of the civilian series are dwindling even further, I doubt it.

[MB.]

CBB would be dead if Civilian BB was cancelled as a lot of the people that watch CBB are fans of the Civilian series.

Well that's completely not true if only for the fact that CBB gets double its ratings. Why do you think people would refuse to watch CBB if civilian BB was cancelled? :umm2:

[MB.]

Considering the viewers of the civilian series are dwindling even further, I doubt it.

Yeah, CBB got its highest C5 ratings this year and civilian BB's on course to get its lowest ratings ever. Do the maths.

[Jason.]

Well that's completely not true if only for the fact that CBB gets double its ratings. Why do you think people would refuse to watch CBB if civilian BB was cancelled? :umm2:

Not even double anymore, TBH.

CBB15 is over 2m higher than BB16.
Sad.

[Beetlejuice]

They have never got the "best celebrities" so I don't see the relevance?

Best celebrities by the standards of BB I mean. Look, Davidson and Hopkins are good people to get on. It's no surprise their series did as well as they did.

[Jason.]

Best celebrities by the standards of BB I mean. Look, Davidson and Hopkins are good people to get on. It's no surprise their series did as well as they did.

You forgot Katie Price. :nono:

[MB.]

Best celebrities by the standards of BB I mean. Look, Davidson and Hopkins are good people to get on. It's no surprise their series did as well as they did.

CBB13 and CBB15 are Channel 5's highest rating CBBs, and they both had really good casts. Now, think what they could achieve if they pumped just some of the money saved from not doing BB into the casting.

[Marsh.]

But nobody's suggesting that CBB air for 10 weeks in the civilian's place through summer so whether the celebrities will only do 4 weeks is irrelevant.

Channel 5 only wanted CBB to begin with after its final series did extremely well on channel 4. Endemol insisted they came as a package but now I see they'd be justified in axing it considering its poor performance.

[Jason.]

Does anyone else think CBB can rate higher than 3.1m on Channel 5?

January CBB?

[Mystic Mock]

Considering the viewers of the civilian series are dwindling even further, I doubt it.

You don't think that CBB won't be affected in the ratings by Civilian BB's collapse in the ratings?

Beetlejuice is right, the only way to save the franchise is to bring the Live Feed back and stop this TOWIE/Geordie Shore **** as most people hate those shows.

[Beetlejuice]

"Now"?

Those things have been happening for 4 years and.... no change.

Never anything as blatant as Emma last Sunday. And with the figures hitting an all time low and the fact the Channel does now have new owners...

Just as they actually listen and take 2 steps forward they do add something that takes them 10 steps back so the viewers giving up is naturally going to happen.

If they're not going to listen there's no point wasting more time.

But even when it comes to the viewers. Live feed won't increase those, the show is dying. It could survive quite fine without a feed but the way the entire show is managed brings it further down. Compare it to BB10, no live feed but still felt like old school BB. Everything is wrong with the current version.

BB10 was the death of Big Brother. It was the lowest rated series ever on Channel 4. Reliant on desperate stunts like this one such as bringing ex housemates back and Noirin's boyfriend in. And the reduced live coverage (there was still some) was bitterly complained about. The executive producer Phil Edgar Jones blamed the live coverage for its poor performance in an interview with Digital Spy.

[Jason.]

Bringing back live feed won't get the viewers over 2m, anyway.

BB14 was close enough, but still failed.

[MB.]

Does anyone else think CBB can rate higher than 3.1m on Channel 5?

January CBB?

With the right casting, certainly. The only reason I think the ratings plateaued a little in January was because it went on for a week longer than usual and people weren't expecting that.

You don't think that CBB won't be affected in the ratings by Civilian BB's collapse in the ratings?

Well it hasn't so no. :umm2:

[Marsh.]

You don't think that CBB won't be affected in the ratings by Civilian BB's collapse in the ratings?

Beetlejuice is right, the only way to save the franchise is to bring the Live Feed back and stop this TOWIE/Geordie Shore **** as most people hate those shows.

No I don't think it would at all. CBB gets a huge audience that doesn't even bother with the civilian version which is long passed its prime.

Evidence in the fact that during its life on channel 5, CBB has INCREASED its viewership compared to civilian which has dropped lower and lower.

Live feed won't change that. The casuals turning away aren't interested in 24/7 feeds. They're just turned off by the general sh*tty production, casting etc.

[Beetlejuice]

Does anyone else think CBB can rate higher than 3.1m on Channel 5?

January CBB?

Actually I think it could. I think every series of BB on Channel 5 could do better if they returned the live coverage.

But you have to consider that the people responsible for the shambles that is this years show are also responsible for the Celeb series and though people don't mind all the meddling as much in a 4 week show when people nominate get evicted and then get straight back to nominating again they will ultimately destroy the show in much the same way they have the civilian one.

[Jason.]

With the right casting, certainly. The only reason I think the ratings plateaued a little in January was because it went on for a week longer than usual and people weren't expecting that.



Agree with that.
Plus it got too draining.

CBB15 should've lasted till Nadia's eviction, as after is when ratings dropped to like 2.9m.

[Marsh.]

Agree with that.
Plus it got too draining.

CBB15 should've lasted till Nadia's eviction, as after is when ratings dropped to like 2.9m.

This.

That last week was like watching the same episode over and over again, even I couldn't finish the series.

[Beetlejuice]

No I don't think it would at all. CBB gets a huge audience that doesn't even bother with the civilian version which is long passed its prime.

Live feed won't change that. The casuals turning away aren't interested in 24/7 feeds. They're just turned off by the general sh*tty production, casting etc.

The ****ty production and casting is in part because of the lack of the live coverage imo. The desperate stunts are needed because people aren't able to get to know the housemates or keep up with what is going on. A show that once had a sense of urgency and immediacy about it has become very slow. That is devastating to a show that was once all about people being able to keep up with everything that was going on as it unfolded. That is particularly essential in the age of 24/7 social media.

[Marsh.]

Also, when the show came to channel 5 in 2011, lack of live feed was one of the main flaws in its format.

As it stands in 2015, live feed is the LEAST of its worries. EVERYTHING is wrong with it now.

[MB.]

Agree with that.
Plus it got too draining.

CBB15 should've lasted till Nadia's eviction, as after is when ratings dropped to like 2.9m.

The problem is, when they're onto a good thing, they milk it for all its worth. Hence the heavy focus on Katie vs Perez, which ironically probably didn't help the ratings much in the end anyway.

[Marsh.]

The ****ty production and casting is in part because of the lack of the live coverage imo. The desperate stunts are needed because people aren't able to get to know the housemates or keep up with what is going on. A show that once had a sense of urgency and immediacy about it has become very slow. That is devastating to a show that was once all about people being able to keep up with everything that was going on as it unfolded. That is particularly essential in the age of 24/7 social media.

Casuals aren't interested in the feeds. It would have no bearing on ratings.

Live feed is a footnote on the never-ending list of problems leading to the show's deterioration. It is not the top priority.

Its social media platforms and website could do with a huge overhaul even without live feeds.

[Beetlejuice]

Also, when the show came to channel 5 in 2011, lack of live feed was one of the main flaws in its format.

As it stands in 2015, live feed is the LEAST of its worries. EVERYTHING is wrong with it now.

Yes, but in regards to Civilian BB all the other problems stem from the lack of the live coverage. People can't get to know the housemates well enough to care about them anymore, so they rely on pointless twists and desperate stunts. And even bringing back old housemates who people once did care about like Nikki and Brian.

[Mystic Mock]

Bringing back live feed won't get the viewers over 2m, anyway.

BB14 was close enough, but still failed.

Getting it to around 1.5m viewers would be good on Ch5, which it would do if people knew that they was watching an organic BB.

[Jason.]

The problem is, when they're onto a good thing, they milk it for all its worth. Hence the heavy focus on Katie vs Perez, which ironically probably didn't help the ratings much in the end anyway.

Yeah.

Macie said the same thing.
They cling on to something, which isn't even there, and milk the dead cow.

Had CBB15 lasted 24 days, instead of 31 days, it would've averaged 3.2m.

[Beetlejuice]

Casuals aren't interested in the feeds. It would have no bearing on ratings.

I just think you're wrong about this. Today everything is done on the internet. Casuals will be interested in it the moment there is a buzz about it on twitter. That's how social media works today and the lack of the 24/7 feed has taken away all of that buzz which generates interest among the casuals.

Live feed is a footnote on the never-ending list of problems leading to the show's deterioration. It is not the top priority.

Live feed is the absolute heart of the problem and always has been. The civilian show cannot survive without it.

[Marsh.]

Yes, but in regards to Civilian BB all the other problems stem from the lack of the live coverage. People can't get to know the housemates well enough to care about them anymore, so they rely on pointless twists and desperate stunts. And even bringing back old housemates who people once did care about like Nikki and Brian.

That's because C5 seem to think BB needs constant screaming shouting and arguing. Nothing to do with live feed.

Like a child they said, oooh some of those twists and huge stunts on C4 were popular. But without putting them into the context of a fantastically produced series they think they can get by on just twists, flashing lights, shouting voice overs and drama.

Live feed doesn't even come into it.

[Jason.]

Getting it to around 1.5m viewers would be good on Ch5, which it would do if people knew that they was watching an organic BB.

1.5m with 24/7 is awful.

Had they introduced it back in 2012/2013, the show would be getting at least 2.1m.

Roughly the same as summer CBB rates.

[MB.]

Live feed is the absolute heart of the problem and always has been. The civilian show cannot survive without it.

It's survived for nearly five series without it. Granted, it's been dragged along kicking and screaming for much of that time, but it's still survived.

[Beetlejuice]

Bringing back live feed won't get the viewers over 2m, anyway.

BB14 was close enough, but still failed.

BB14 was close and that was the first series to have extra live coverage, and not even the 24/7 coverage. And the website was **** that year.

[Marsh.]

Live feed is the absolute heart of the problem and always has been. The civilian show cannot survive without it.

I feel you're not fully understanding what I'm getting at but I'm too tired to continue trying to explain. No matter.

[ThriceShy]

The most pressing issue is to stop this interfering with nominations. It has killed the show.

I think this series might have developed nicely if they hadn't done the 4in4out thing.

[Marsh.]

I just think you're wrong about this. Today everything is done on the internet. Casuals will be interested in it the moment there is a buzz about it on twitter. That's how social media works today and the lack of the 24/7 feed has taken away all of that buzz which generates interest among the casuals.

You see, that's where it lies. TWITTER.

These social media nerds you speak of like to see things flash up "BREAKING NEWS AARON FREW EJECTED" "OOOH, HELEN AND NIKKI ARGUING AGAIN" followed by a 10 word sentence explaining what's happening or a 30 second video isolating the screaming and the shouting.

Would these people be glued to live feed? No.
Are this generation of people interested in old school Big Brother, getting to know these people and see how they cope in an enclosed environment with strangers? No.

[Mystic Mock]

No I don't think it would at all. CBB gets a huge audience that doesn't even bother with the civilian version which is long passed its prime.

Evidence in the fact that during its life on channel 5, CBB has INCREASED its viewership compared to civilian which has dropped lower and lower.

Live feed won't change that. The casuals turning away aren't interested in 24/7 feeds. They're just turned off by the general sh*tty production, casting etc.

CBB's ratings look impressive because it gets people that like Celebs watching on top of the Civilian series fans watching too, Civilian series fans won't watch if CBB is the only one on air hence trouble for the series as Ch5 desperately try to save it.

Live Feed will probably mean a better cast too as it will get genuine people to audition.

[Beetlejuice]

It's survived for nearly five series without it. Granted, it's been dragged along kicking and screaming for much of that time, but it's still survived.

You've answered your own response. It's best year, or at least its most successful year was the year of the 2 hour live coverage. And that came later. And indeed, the ratings went up and were maintain after going up in week 4 (the week the 2 hour live feed came back at midnight).

If that live coverage had been there from the very first night like it used to be with Channel 4 people could get much more involved and want to stick with it from the start. When it's not there, you just give up on trying to keep up with the show.

Remember, the launch night still does well when it is well publicized, they need to find a way of keeping those viewers hanging on, but when it's just 45 minute HL shows that tell you hardly anything about any of them, the show is doomed.

[rionablue]

I think it's had it's day now tbh.
When you look at all this desperate crap they're having to do to pull in more viewers i reckon it's a definate sign that it's time to close the lid on civilian BB.
The premise of the show can't stand up on its own anymore.
When the producers have to start injecting fake drama in the style of TOWIE just to get anyone to watch then its time to call it a day.
I think BB has just been going on too long now,Its been done.It was a stroke of genius and it had a good innings but it's become so fake and forced now that it's more like watching Eastenders than a reality show.
The term 'reality' has become warped these days into scripted drama.
Even CBB feels more natural to watch.Atleast you expect to be watching media savvy celebs before you watch.

I always prefer it to Celebrity Big Brother and still do

[Jason.]

If Live feed would bring in viewers.

Then how come those insulting 30 minutes we get every Friday, can't even rate above a million, or even 2 million for January CBB?

If people can't watch for 30 minutes, I doubt they will be able to watch for even 3 hours.

[Marsh.]

CBB's ratings look impressive because it gets people that like Celebs watching on top of the Civilian series fans watching too, Civilian series fans won't watch if CBB is the only one on air hence trouble for the series as Ch5 desperately try to save it.

Live Feed will probably mean a better cast too as it will get genuine people to audition.

The show already gets genuine people auditioning, production decides to cast certain types of people and then cast through agents certain types of people.

There's always genuine people willing to go on, they're just not being selected.

I don't see where you're getting the impression BB fans wouldn't watch CBB anyway?

If what you're saying is true, we'll take the BB viewers and subtract them from the CBB audience, the funny thing is that the CBB rating would STILL be more than double the civilian viewership. :joker: That's how unpopular the civilian version now is.

[Beetlejuice]

You see, that's where it lies. TWITTER.

These social media nerds you speak of like to see things flash up "BREAKING NEWS AARON FREW EJECTED" "OOOH, HELEN AND NIKKI ARGUING AGAIN" followed by a 10 word sentence explaining what's happening or a 30 second video isolating the screaming and the shouting.

Would these people be glued to live feed? No.
Are this generation of people interested in old school Big Brother, getting to know these people and see how they cope in an enclosed environment with strangers? No.

It's not a question about them being glued to the live feed. It's the question of the buzz that can be created through watching things unfold live. The fact that you can actually get to know the housemates and care about them.

The show cannot survive with housemates no one cares about, and it's now slow moving format is just a drain. There used to be thread after thread on Digital Spy about what was going on in the house, now there's nothing. Everything about this show is now so slow and laborious it is damn near impossible to give a damn about any of it. The only way they are able to make people care is by relying on housemates we once were able to get to know and did care about.

[Marsh.]

I always prefer it to Celebrity Big Brother and still do

I prefer real BB over CBB.

In their current forms, give me CBB every time.

[Jason.]

I prefer real BB over CBB.

In their current forms, give me CBB every time.

This.

CBB13 and CBB15 gave me that hype feeling, that BB5-BB7 used to give me.
That's the first time I've ever felt that in BB, ever since.

[Beetlejuice]

The show already gets genuine people auditioning, production decides to cast certain types of people and then cast through agents certain types of people.

There's always genuine people willing to go on, they're just not being selected.

I don't see where you're getting the impression BB fans wouldn't watch CBB anyway?

If what you're saying is true, we'll take the BB viewers and subtract them from the CBB audience, the funny thing is that the CBB rating would STILL be more than double the civilian viewership. :joker: That's how unpopular the civilian version now is.

Not really. The Summer CBB rates poorly compared to January.

[Mystic Mock]

If Live feed would bring in viewers.

Then how come those insulting 30 minutes we get every Friday, can't even rate above a million, or even 2 million for January CBB?

If people can't watch for 30 minutes, I doubt they will be able to watch for even 3 hours.

Who's gonna watch over 30 minutes of something that's not gonna be on for another 5 weeks when they could be watching the Soaps on the other side?

Live Feed I would put on the Ch5 website that you have to pay to watch anyway.

[Marsh.]

It's not a question about them being glued to the live feed. It's the question of the buzz that can be created through watching things unfold live. The fact that you can actually get to know the housemates and care about them.

That can happen without feed.

"AARON FREW EJECTED. HERE IS THE VIDEO."

That's the entire point of their website, they update with the big moments and the updates and the "buzz" worthy events but the small moments are all discarded.

Are these viewers interested in the small moments though, do they really care to "get to know" the housemates in such small ways through a feed? No, they're not.

[Beetlejuice]

I prefer real BB over CBB.

In their current forms, give me CBB every time.

So you agree that the old format of BB was better? All some of us are saying is that it needs to return to that in some way. We just happen to think the live coverage is a more important part of that old format than you obviously do.

[ThriceShy]

It's not a question about them being glued to the live feed. It's the question of the buzz that can be created through watching things unfold live. The fact that you can actually get to know the housemates and care about them.

The show cannot survive with housemates no one cares about, and it's now slow moving format is just a drain. There used to be thread after thread on Digital Spy about what was going on in the house, now there's nothing. Everything about this show is now so slow and laborious it is damn near impossible to give a damn about any of it. The only way they are able to make people care is by relying on housemates we once were able to get to know and did care about.

You are spot on.


But you are fighting a losing battle. The production have decided they must have complete control over everything that goes on in the house and everything that is seen by viewers, so they won't bring live feed back.

[Jason.]

Who's gonna watch over 30 minutes of something that's not gonna be on for another 5 weeks when they could be watching the Soaps on the other side?

Live Feed I would put on the Ch5 website that you have to pay to watch anyway.

Isn't that more of a reason to watch, considering we hardly get it?

Even the 2 hour live feed in the evenings during BB14 rated poorly. That was everyday. Till they axed it, after Week 4.

[Marsh.]

Who's gonna watch over 30 minutes of something that's not gonna be on for another 5 weeks when they could be watching the Soaps on the other side?

Live Feed I would put on the Ch5 website that you have to pay to watch anyway.

He's referring to the live feed after the live shows. If even those can't get the viewers with the lead-in from a live show, eviction night, twist, launch night etc then it's not going to do much in any larger form.

Unless Eastenders is robbing 10 million viewers with a late night special every Friday? :shrug:

[Marsh.]

So you agree that the old format of BB was better? All some of us are saying is that it needs to return to that in some way. We just happen to think the live coverage is a more important part of that old format than you obviously do.

No, I think live feed is important to the old format.

Do I think live feed is going to save the show in its current form? No.

Do I think doing such things will attract viewers and see the ratings soar? No.

I can differentiate between what I personally enjoy and find quality and what is realistically going to work.

Times change. Live feed isn't even the start of the problems with the show.

[Marsh.]

Not really. The Summer CBB rates poorly compared to January.

So?

It still rates much higher than the civilian version.

Summer TV across the board rates poorly compared to the winter months when everyone is indoors.

Either way CBB attracts the bigger ratings.

If we're comparing like for like, BB12 aired in the colder months and didn't perform much better than BB15.

[Beetlejuice]

That can happen without feed.

"AARON FREW EJECTED. HERE IS THE VIDEO."

We didn't find out he was ejected until quite a few hours later. And no one particuarly cared because no one really knew who any of these people were. And frankly, we still don't.

That's the entire point of their website, they update with the big moments and the updates and the "buzz" worthy events but the small moments are all discarded.

Their website is f'n awful. We didn't even find out that they nominated face to face in week 1 until 24 hours later. They are awful at keeping the viewers informed whether on the twitter feed or the site. The live coverage solves that problem for them.

Are these viewers interested in the small moments though, do they really care to "get to know" the housemates in such small ways through a feed? No, they're not.

Erm, yes. Many are. Hence the reason the biggest complaint year after year, and especially during BB10 and when it came back on Channel 5 was in regards to the live coverage. That was what Big Brother was about. Indeed that was Big Brother! And again, it was the constant interaction between the fans of the show and what was going on in the house that gave the show a sense of urgency and immediacy.

Ever since it has lost that completely, it has been in a terrible state. Which is to say, ever since it moved to Channel 5.

[Mystic Mock]

That can happen without feed.

"AARON FREW EJECTED. HERE IS THE VIDEO."

That's the entire point of their website, they update with the big moments and the updates and the "buzz" worthy events but the small moments are all discarded.

Are these viewers interested in the small moments though, do they really care to "get to know" the housemates in such small ways through a feed? No, they're not.

Well “these viewers” were interested in it on Ch4, so why can't they be interested in it now?

[abhorson]

YES. I hope it finishes. This constant tinkering with who stays and who does not, really annoys. If it were not for the final pass last year, Helen would not have won. That is not right. Only ****wits would have voted for her in the last week.

There were plenty of ****wits though!

[Beetlejuice]

So?

It still rates much higher than the civilian version.

Yes and I've told you why. But the highest rated Civilian series was the one with the extra live coverage. It actually got much closer to the CBB figures



Either way CBB attracts the bigger ratings.

If we're comparing like for like, BB12 aired in the colder months and didn't perform much better than BB15.

The launch night of Big Brother 12 was 2.77 million. Had the viewers actually been able to switch on the live coverage and get to know these people from the start, it probably would have hung on to a few more than it did. It was particularly disappointing because the Daily Star and all those involved with Channel 5 had promised that the red button interactive channel would be back.

[LukeB]

what is going on

[Marsh.]

We didn't find out he was ejected until quite a few hours later. And no one particuarly cared because no one really knew who any of these people were. And frankly, we still don't.



Their website is f'n awful. We didn't even find out that they nominated face to face in week 1 until 24 hours later. They are awful at keeping the viewers informed whether on the twitter feed or the site. The live coverage solves that problem for them.



Erm, yes. Many are. Hence the reason the biggest complain year after year, and specially during BB10 and when it came back on Channel 5 was in regards to the live coverage. That was what Big Brother was about. Indeed that was Big Brother! And again, it was the constant interaction between the fans of the show and what was going on in the house that gave the show a sense of urgency and immediacy.

Ever since it has lost that completely, it has been in a terrible state. Which is to say, ever since it moved to Channel 5.

A big complaint during BB10 = a huge proportion of viewers.
A big complaint now = a small percentage of a small number of viewers.

The casuals have already gone, live feed will not bring them back. An entire overhaul of the entire franchise is needed. And even then the show is 16 years old so may not even have an audience to attract anymore.

Yes, we found out hours later, does that matter to a lot of people? They found out when they find out, they still discuss it. Did everyone go "Oh, well it would've been better to hear about this at 8am than at 12pm that's killed the buzz of this breaking news"? No.

The issue over the crap website is a separate complaint. The opposite of that isn't necessarily live feed, it's a better website.

[zakman440]

Honestly, BBCAN is leading in the world of Big Brother at the moment for two reasons:

1: Live Feed. It's keeping people interested and the ratings a success for the network that it runs on.

Global makes way for more homegrown heavyweights with green lights of three Canadian original series, including ratings juggernaut Big Brother Canada which is set to return for a fourth season. This past season quickly became the most shocking, twisted, and dramatic season yet, captivating Canadians across the country. The show's third season, and its inaugural run on Global, grew its audience by 40% over its sophomore season on Slice* claiming its place as a top 20 series across all conventional programming since its premiere.** Fans flocked to bigbrothercanada.ca to engage and cast votes to impact the show and were glued to the live feeds with over 1.6 million hours of live streaming consumed during the season run, a 33% increase over last season.***

http://www.shawmedia.ca/Media/PressReleaseDetail.aspx?pressReleaseId=6442462338

2. Producer honesty.

Speaking ahead of the launch of its third season, showrunner Erin Brock said that 24-hour live streaming from the house forces the producers to be honest with viewers.

“We react to the fans online constantly on this show,” she told the Toronto Sun newspaper.

“Since they can watch you 24/7 online, you have to tell true stories, you have to tell people’s true experiences, and you can’t make up some cagey reality thing. You don’t have that choice. You’re held accountable to the truth of the experience with those houseguests. That’s why it really is an authentic social experiment.”


Read more: http://www.bbspy.co.uk/bbcan/news/0323/bb-canada-executive-producer-emphasises-importance-of-big-brother-live-feeds-honest-true-accountable-uk-bbuk-controversy#ixzz3dMqQMasr

That is what BBUK needs to be doing to keep people interested and to stop the ratings decreasing lower and lower.

[Marsh.]

Yes and I've told you why. But the highest rated Civilian series was the one with the extra live coverage. It actually got much closer to the CBB figures

BB14 had a higher audience because of the extra live coverage?

The same live coverage that had no viewers and was axed 4 weeks in, moved online and they still didn't see fit to bring back for BB15?

I don't think so.

The feed probably helped hang on to some of those die hards who became more engrossed. But the other 90% of the show needs to bring the viewers in first and then the live feed can possibly attract them. Like I said, feed is low on the priority list.

[ThriceShy]

Yep, the main reason I want live feed back is not so I can sit watching it. It is so I can be reassured that what I see in the highlights is real.

[Marsh.]

Well “these viewers” were interested in it on Ch4, so why can't they be interested in it now?

Were they by the end?

C4 axed the feed in 2009. It was only brought back because they were giving the show a final hurrah before axing it, they had nothing to lose.

Even back then the feed was losing viewers and wasn't worth the money.

We're also discussing a very different audience now, 5 years on.

[Marsh.]

Yep, the main reason I want live feed back is not so I can sit watching it. It is so I can be reassured that what I see in the highlights is real.

A very valid reason.

Is it the one golden answer to the show's problems and will attract all the viewers they need? Not really.

[Jason.]

Marsh slaying :flutter:

[Beetlejuice]

A big complaint during BB10 = a huge proportion of viewers.
A big complaint now = a small percentage of a small number of viewers.

The casuals have already gone, live feed will not bring them back.

A lot of casuals still come back for the launch night. Especially if it is well publicized and on at the right time. It as too early a start this year. But what you have to do is find a way to keep them watching. If you get an interesting mix in there on launch night and then give them a way to actually begin to get to know the housemates they can connect to them like they did in the past and will be much more likely to continue watching.


An entire overhaul of the entire franchise is needed. And even then the show is 16 years old so may not even have an audience to attract anymore.

An entire overhaul is what the show has had. That's why it's losing what viewers it has left. Discarding everything it has tried to be on Channel 5 and returning to a tried and tested format that people were arguing for since it began on Channel 5 is its only hope at this point.

Yes, we found out hours later, does that matter to a lot of people? They found out when they find out, they still discuss it. Did everyone go "Oh, well it would've been better to hear about this at 8am than at 12pm that's killed the buzz of this breaking news"? No.

There was no buzz regardless of when people found out because no one gave a ****. The reason no gave a **** is because half of the people still didn't know which one was Aaron, which one was Kieran and which one was Joel. I knew more about Dean and Bubble watching them up all night keeping a camp fire going than I still know about any of these people after 6 weeks. That is making the show impossible even for the biggest fans of it.

The issue over the crap website is a separate complaint. The opposite of that isn't necessarily live feed, it's a better website.

The solution is a better website built around the live coverage like Big Brother Canada has.

[Marsh.]

So people would've been buzzing over Aaron's ejection had we had 24/7 live feed?

Um, I don't think so.

Big Brother doesn't "buzz" anymore.

[Beetlejuice]

Were they by the end?

C4 axed the feed in 2009.

They axed the show in 2009. That was the idea. Reduce the live coverage and axe the show.

It was only brought back because they were giving the show a final hurrah before axing it, they had nothing to lose.

It was brought back because the producer Phil Edgar Jones felt it was a necessary part of the programme. Just as the executive producer of BIg Brother Canada believes it to be today.

Even back then the feed was losing viewers and wasn't worth the money.

We're also discussing a very different audience now, 5 years on.

I doubt we are. And again, if anything, the age of 24/7 social media, makes the live feed a perfect fit. The show is slow. So slow now it has become even more difficult to keep up with it.

[Marsh.]

Big Brother Canada has an advantage of being 2 years old.

It's kind of like wondering why the same pair of beautiful high heels work on a young model but not on a rusty pensioner. One is in its prime, the other has had its day.

Unfortunately, BBUk has had its day.

[Beetlejuice]

So people would've been buzzing over Aaron's ejection had we had 24/7 live feed?

There would have been a lot more buzz around it if they cared about any of the housemates which they can no longer do because they cannot get to know them. The buzz is generated on fan sites, forums and twitter... Even the biggest fans couldn't give a **** about Aaron.

Big Brother doesn't "buzz" anymore.

It buzzes on launch night, unfortunately, they then make it impossible to get to know any of the housemates thereafter.

[MB.]

So people would've been buzzing over Aaron's ejection

Ooh matron.

[Marsh.]

They axed the show in 2009. That was the idea. Reduce the live coverage and axe the show.

It was brought back because the producer Phil Edgar Jones felt it was a necessary part of the programme. Just as the executive producer of BIg Brother Canada believes it to be today.

It was brought back because the fans begged and, with it being the final year of the show, they had nothing to lose and threw in promotion to try and get more viewers with the free passes and charged everyone else.

Was Phil Edgar Jones in charge of live feed coming back or was that down to the people actually funding and airing the show?

I don't think anyone would argue about live feed being a valuable part of the format. Will they throw it out despite no one watching it and therefore it not being worth the cost? No.

[Marsh.]

There would have been a lot more buzz around it if they cared about any of the housemates which they can no longer do because they cannot get to know them. The buzz is generated on fan sites, forums and twitter... Even the biggest fans couldn't give a **** about Aaron.



It buzzes on launch night, unfortunately, they then make it impossible to get to know any of the housemates thereafter.

You keep bringing up people being more engaged if they "get to know" them through the feed.

I'm saying there is no audience for the feed to begin with.

Maybe that's where we're having difficulty.

[Beetlejuice]

Big Brother Canada has an advantage of being 2 years old.

It's kind of like wondering why the same pair of beautiful high heels work on a young model but not on a rusty pensioner. One is in its prime, the other has had its day.

Unfortunately, BBUk has had its day.

BBUK hasn't existed in 5 years. What we have is a Frankenstein's Monster version of BB which has left even the biggest fans fed up and disappointed. The only option they have left is to return to a tried and tested format and to publicize that return well next year. Select good housemates and give people a means to actually get to know them properly so that it is being spoken about through the day and night on the forums and now on twitter.

That is the only option it has.

[Marsh.]

BBUK hasn't existed in 5 years. What we have is a Frankenstein's Monster version of BB which has left even the biggest fans fed up and disappointed. The only option they have left is to return to a tried and tested format and to publicize that return well next year. Select good housemates and give people a means to actually get to know them properly so that it is being spoken about through the day and night on the forums and now on twitter.

That is the only option it has.

All shows have a shelf life. The BB 5+ years ago was losing viewers too as the franchise got older.

[Marsh.]

It was brought back because the producer Phil Edgar Jones felt it was a necessary part of the programme.

So nothing to do with the show ending?

If it was continuing you think they'd have brought the feed back still? I don't.

[Beetlejuice]

It was brought back because the fans begged and, with it being the final year of the show, they had nothing to lose and threw in promotion to try and get more viewers with the free passes and charged everyone else.

Was Phil Edgar Jones in charge of live feed coming back or was that down to the people actually funding and airing the show?

Here was what he said in an interview with Digital Spy...

Are you happy that the live feed is coming back?
"Oh definitely. The only reason it was stopped was for practical reasons. I think Channel 4 have done a brilliant thing in bringing it back and repaying all the fans from down the years. I think it helps people get into the show. I think last year's series was a great bunch of housemates and I wonder if we'd had the live feed in there, would more people have got connected and passionate about it."

If felt to me last year that we didn't get the full BB experience without it...
"I think you're right. Because we couldn't show everything all the time, it was harder to present everyone's storyline. Inevitably making an a hour-long TV show, there are things you can't show. And that is frustrating for us. For instance, things can happen at the beginning of the series and the thread of that story will be picked up later, but because you didn't show it at the start, there is no context for it. I'm moaning, but it is definitely great news we have the live feed back. Now everyone can slag us off even more. 24 hours a day!"



I don't think anyone would argue about live feed being a valuable part of the format. Will they throw it out despite no one watching it and therefore it not being worth the cost? No.

How much does it cost? Does anyone even know? If it helps revive the show then its worth the cost and you can just save money elsewhere. The tasks they do are utterly pointless. why bother with the cost of them at all.

[Beetlejuice]

All shows have a shelf life. The BB 5+ years ago was losing viewers too as the franchise got older.

And Channel 5 had a chance of reviving it by taking that format and adding to it. Instead, they turned their back on it entirely and put their fingers in their ears to how unpopular a decision it was with the fans. You can't do that with an interactive show that lives or dies on viewer involvement.

[Marsh.]

Yes, the interview is backing up what I said.

Phil Edgar Jones wasn't in charge of live feed or any other commissions as part of the Big Brother franchise. His job was to manage and produce what he was given by channel 4/endemol.

The only reason it was stopped was for practical reasons. I think Channel 4 have done a brilliant thing in bringing it back and repaying all the fans from down the years.

Stopped for practical reasons = financial/low figures

Repaying all the fans down the years = brought back to celebrate the show coming to an end after 10 years

Yes, PEJ points out all of the reasons live feed is so valuable. Does that mean he was in charge of it? No. Did that make it financially viable? No. Did that bring in viewers? No.

If live feed guaranteed an audience then there would've been no need to axe it to begin with. It's just over the 4 years of its life on channel 5, they've taken advantage of no live feed to manipulate the show to death. But it's not going to pluck a live feed audience out of thin air.

[Rob!]

The simple and undeniable fact is that civilian Big Brother is a cult show and has been for several years now. The fans that turned their back on it due to the lack of live feed have long gone and they are never coming back - even if a 24/7 live feed was brought back, they ain't going to be there to watch it.
Channel 5 have never pretended that they wanted the same show that channel 4 had. BB12's 18-30 cast, the fact they were ALL good looking, the fact that they focussed SO heavily on the romance aspect and the sheer feel of the series was enough to tell us that. Then they got lucky with Celeb BB. They had a couple of good series where the housemates provided their own far more interesting storylines and they grew on that. They also figured and realised that ratings grew when the tension did, and so twists were thrown in with care free abandon to make the housemates argue as much as possible. These days, there isn't even any subtlety behind it. Face to face noms are now more frequent than regular noms (this series alone has not had a single round of normal nominations), everything is big and in your face and any attempt to appease the hardcore fans they've managed to piss off is met with disdain because it is too little too late. They stopped listening a long LONG time ago. I don't believe they work deliberately to piss the viewers off, Big Brother is by far Channel 5's most expensive programme and it isn't in their interest to lose viewers by stupid stunts. They want to try and make the programme interesting, but the problem is that the tasks, twists and even in a lot of cases the housemates give each series of regular BB the same old feel. Nothing really feels that individual about it anymore. And whilst the celeb series continues to go from strength to strength (in January anyway. Time will tell how this summers performs), the civilian series limps along behind it, a victim of it's own success. The aspects of it that made is so huge in the early days are now negatives and it's safe to say, it's on it's last legs. I hope it can make it to the end of the new contract with it's head held as high as it can manage.
The viewers have the choice whether to hold their hands up and say "sorry, I'm not interested anymore" or try and enjoy it for what it is. I'm going to be here till it's dying day and so it seems will about a million other people. Nothing is keeping the viewers that watch it everyday but have nothing good to say about it watching other than their own sense of completion and, admittedly, the hope that things will improve.

[Marsh.]

the fact they were ALL good looking

:fan:

I find BB12 one of the ugliest casts in the show's history.

[Rob!]

I'd also like to add onto that the show does still have relevance. Social media was thriving after Aaron's ejection because the show does still have the power to create debate like no other (or very few) shows on television. Social issues are still at the core of BB, underneath all the glittery lights and thundering dramatic music. The problem is that the show doesn't feel like that's enough any more and maybe it isn't.

[CertifiedPoster]

C5 has ruined it tbh

I mean you get some enjoyable episodes still, but the last few years it has been made a chore to watch. Last year's series was terrible, and tbh this has been just as bad if not worse. The year before that wasn't that great either but at least had some pretty great housemates like Dexter, Callum and Gina. But overall most of the housemates they pick are just plain sh1t, the tasks/twists are also very very poor. No excitement, creativity or thought is put into anything now.

Someone raised a good point the other day, Brian Belo has come into the house and immediately stood out as probably the best character this year (or close to it), and he was one of the worst in his series..

To answer the OP's question yeah it probably should be scrapped now. Its regressing all the time

[Rob!]

:fan:

I find BB12 one of the ugliest casts in the show's history.

Each to their own, but there weren't any Jacks were there :laugh:

[Marsh.]

Each to their own, but there weren't any Jacks were there :laugh:

If "not fat" = attractive we'd all have a happy ending. :fan:

[Rob!]

If "not fat" = attractive we'd all have a happy ending. :fan:

You get what I'm trying to say though. :joker:

[Beetlejuice]

Yes, the interview is backing up what I said.

Phil Edgar Jones wasn't in charge of live feed or any other commissions as part of the Big Brother franchise. His job was to manage and produce what he was given by channel 4/endemol.

I didn't say he was in charge of it. But he was certainly someone who felt the show needed it.

Stopped for practical reasons = financial/low figures

It could mean anything frankly. Channel 4 wanted rid of BB that series (BB10). It announced it being axed that series. It had clearly had enough. That series was awful frankly, regardless of some of the housemates being good.


Yes, PEJ points out all of the reasons live feed is so valuable. Does that mean he was in charge of it? No. Did that make it financially viable? No. Did that bring in viewers? No.

The viewing figures were up for BB11. I know you'll say that was because it was the last series and maybe you're right, but the fact remains the lowest rated series of BB on Channel 4 was BB10, the highest rated series of BB on Channel 5 was BB14. So the series with reduced live coverage was the worst rating ever on Channel 4. And the series with extra live coverage was the best rating ever on Channel 5.

Again, the show is in dire straits, and they have to do something with it. To continue using a format that is destroying the show is lunacy, and the only other option they have is a return to a format the fans of the show have been asking for, for 5 years. They could actually earn some good will for themselves by doing that. To run the show in the ground as they are doing however will ultimately lead to the collapse of the whole franchise in my view.

Some of you would rather they just axe the show than return to that original format for one series for some reason I cannot even begin to fathom.

[Marsh.]

You get what I'm trying to say though. :joker:

:hehe: Kind of. :laugh:

[Marsh.]

I didn't say he was in charge of it. But he was certainly someone who felt the show needed it.



It could mean anything frankly. Channel 4 wanted rid of BB that series (BB10). It announced it being axed that series. It had clearly had enough. That series was awful frankly, regardless of some of the housemates being good.



The viewing figures were up for BB11. I know you'll say that was because it was the last series and maybe you're right, but the fact remains the lowest rated series of BB on Channel 4 was BB10, the highest rated series of BB on Channel 5 was BB14. So the series with reduced live coverage was the worst rating ever on Channel 4. And the series with extra live coverage was the best rating ever on Channel 5.

Again, the show is in dire straits, and they have to do something with it. To continue using a format that is destroying the show is lunacy, and the only other option they have is a return to a format the fans of the show have been asking for, for 5 years. They could actually earn some good will for themselves by doing that. To run the show in the ground as they are doing however will ultimately lead to the collapse of the whole franchise in my view.

Some of you would rather they just axe the show than return to that original format for one series for some reason I cannot even begin to fathom.

But BB10 having the lowest is what lead to its axe. BB10 followed a pattern from BB8. Dwindling down. It was just no longer what it was after 2007.

You can say BB10 (no feed) = least popular BB14 (some feed) = most popular but there's nothing suggesting feed had anything to do with either considering BB8 and 9 didn't do too much better than 10 and the live feed for 14 had next to no viewers hence the reason it too was axed. Not to mention the worst on channel 4 and the best rated on channel 5 are still separated by a wide margin. Therefore the problem is over and above live feed.

The feed was axed because it no longer attracted viewers.

I don't want to axe the entire show instead of trying a back to basics approach. But after nearly 5 years I'm tired of waiting for them to do so. If they're not then bye bye BB.

[Rob!]

People also seem to forget that BB12 and 13 had barely any twists. BB14, the most popular series on C5 thus far was the start of the much more twisted format. Unfortunately it was just a format that got old exceptionally quickly.

[Marsh.]

People also seem to forget that BB12 and 13 had barely any twists. BB14, the most popular series on C5 thus far was the start of the much more twisted format. Unfortunately it was just a format that got old exceptionally quickly.

I honestly think it's better rated because it was the first overhaul since it started on channel 5, Emma Willis' popularity had grown on TV and she was taking over from Brian, the casting was quite good and held onto a launch night boost for a while but the rot set in with the production.

The producers took the wrong lessons from BB14.

But even then, BB14 being the highest rated isn't even a big statement because the difference is so tiny. :laugh:

[Rob!]

True. Especially as at the time it was the lowest launch of any BB...and also the fact that a large part of the reason it got such a high overall rating as a series was because of a man pinning a girl down to a bed by her throat and threatened to nut her. British people are odd.

[Beetlejuice]

But BB10 having the lowest is what lead to its axe.

Everything about that series looked awful from the opening night. The decision to reduce the live coverage was just a precursor to the show being axed imo.

BB10 followed a pattern from BB8. Dwindling down. It was just no longer what it was after 2007.

The drop was huge though and I believe Channel 4 knew they wanted rid of the show before BB10 even started.

You can say BB10 (no feed) = least popular BB14 (some feed) = most popular but there's nothing suggesting feed had anything to do with either considering BB8 and 9 didn't do too much better than 10 and the live feed for 14 had next to no viewers hence the reason it too was axed.

The live feed that got no viewers and was therefore axed was the 7 pm live coverage on Channel 5. Everyone knew it would do poorly in that slot.

No one has any idea how many people watched the coverage at midnight. And BB8 and BB9 both did considerably better than BB10 even if the show clearly was in decline at that point.

You say there's nothing suggesting the feed had anything to do with BB14's success but it is another fact that the ratings for BB14 went up and stayed up after its re-introduction in week 4.


Not to mention the worst on channel 4 and the best rated on channel 5 are still separated by a wide margin. Therefore the problem is over and above live feed.

There are many problems, and no one expects Channel 5 to get higher ratings than Channel 4 did with the show. But the fact is fans are disillusioned with the show. When even the hardcore fans are giving up, and are repeatedly claiming things like the lack of the live coverage being part of the reason why, you can't stick your fingers in your ears the way these people have been doing for 5 years without thinking that's going cause trouble. It has eventually led to this.

The feed was axed because it no longer attracted viewers.

I don't want to axe the entire show instead of trying a back to basics approach. But after nearly 5 years I'm tired of waiting for them to do so. If they're not then bye bye BB.

The feed should be the first thing you see when you go to the website. A website with all sorts of interactive features and regular updates to go with it, including a diary room feed for live nominations. If anything interesting kicks off people will know about it from watching the feed and twitter users will then go to the site along with DS users who aren't already watching to find out what's going on. Before you know it BB starts being tweeted about a lot more throughout the day and thread after thread is being made on the forums.

The feed could actually help the site get a lot more visits throughout the day. Have some advertising in the feed and that can help with the costs as well.

[Rob!]

Channel 4 wanted rid of the show a long time before BB10. The guy in charge at the time wanted rid of it after the race row but I think after the success of BB7, they signed a new contract so they were stuck with it.

[Beetlejuice]

I honestly think it's better rated because it was the first overhaul since it started on channel 5, Emma Willis' popularity had grown on TV and she was taking over from Brian, the casting was quite good and held onto a launch night boost for a while but the rot set in with the production.

The producers took the wrong lessons from BB14.

But even then, BB14 being the highest rated isn't even a big statement because the difference is so tiny. :laugh:

Well, week 2 and 3 of BB14 had an average of 1.69 million. Week 4 grew to 1.75 million and week 5 to 1.87 million and it did pretty well in maintaining more than 1.8 for the rest of the show.

The series average when +1 is taken into account is supposed to be 1.9 million. When you consider where the show is at now just two year laters, that's a pretty big drop in percentage terms

[abhorson]

The CBB bed wetter, spooning, cheap GS show winner. With the average demographic of BB, i could understand. But, when Helen won last year! A big fat NO.

Time to end it.

[Marsh.]

Channel 4 wanted rid of the show a long time before BB10. The guy in charge at the time wanted rid of it after the race row but I think after the success of BB7, they signed a new contract so they were stuck with it.

Yes but that's also because the public's perception of it changed after that.

Would they have axed live feed if it got viewers and raked in the cash? No.
Would the main show have been axed at all if they kept up the top figures? No.

But, also, everything has a shelf life and I feel C4 were right to axe it. 10 years is a long time for any format.

[Marsh.]

The live feed that got no viewers and was therefore axed was the 7 pm live coverage on Channel 5.

And the feeds throughout 8 and 9 which dropped just as the main shows did. Then the online coverage for BB14 which was dropped after the series ended because.... you guessed it, lack of viewers.

You say there's nothing suggesting the feed had anything to do with BB14's success but it is another fact that the ratings for BB14 went up and stayed up after its re-introduction in week 4.

Did it rise significantly or was it hovering around the same marks as before and floating up and down? Wiki tells me the latter.

Did the live feed attract viewers other than the hardcore, forum browsing variety? The producer's response and subsequent axing of it tells me no.

So did the viewing figures rise and stay at 1.8 in the last couple of weeks because of live feed or because of the Hazel/Daley drama and the subsequent bitchfests with Gina?

including a diary room feed for live nominations.

Who needs that when they can simply nominate in front of one another or not nominate at all and let the producers do the choosing? :hee:

[Jay_Roberts441]

With the falling ratings and negative press and reaction for BB16 I think instead of Channel 5 axing the civillian BB just yet they could change the format and change the times of year BB is run in 2016 and see if running the civillian series in January followed by a CBB is better, also stick to 75 days for BB and 31 days for CBB.

Say for example:

2015:
CBB16: 3 Aug - 31 Aug (31 days)

2016:
BB17: 4 Jan - 18 Mar (75 days)
CBB17: 6 Apr - 6 May (31 days)
CBB18: 31 Aug - 30 Sept (31 days)

Big gap between CBB17 & CBB18 due to:

Euro 2016 from 10 June 2016 to 10 July 2016
Olympics from 5 August 2016 to 21 August 2016

[Rob!]

There has never been a live feed for the Diary room even in the show's hey day.

[Beetlejuice]

There has never been a live feed for the Diary room even in the show's hey day.

You're right. I was suggesting that as an extra they could do to get more people involved. I really do think creating a great modern website is the key to the future for BB if there is to be one.

They did do live nominations on E4 for one series I can't remember which.

[Rob!]

I really think a year's break wouldn't do any harm. Just give them a chance to recharge and come up with something completely original. The fact that C5 have aired SO many series of BB compared to Channel 4 suggests that they have simply run out of ideas. Maybe a break and a relaunch is what could help it, but the question is whether they think it's worth it.

[abhorson]

Could they just not be radical. And whoever was up for eviction (whether two or three etc) be the ones up, and leave it to the GBP.

Not difficult.

[Beetlejuice]

And the feeds throughout 8 and 9 which dropped just as the main shows did. Then the online coverage for BB14 which was dropped after the series ended because.... you guessed it, lack of viewers.

I don't believe anyone has ever given that reason actually. I suspect the Daley incident didn't help in the minds of the people making these decisions. The issue with the live coverage during the Channel 4 one certainly had something to do with the increase in regulations for television.


Did it rise significantly or was it hovering around the same marks as before and floating up and down? Wiki tells me the latter.

You'd have to define a significant rise. The fact is week 2 and 3 were lower than the weeks that followed. That's quite unusual.

Did the live feed attract viewers other than the hardcore, forum browsing variety? The producer's response and subsequent axing of it tells me no.

Who can answer that question. The fact is though that even if only hardcore fans are watching, that means they are talking about it much more on forums and social networking sites and word of mouth always helps.


So did the viewing figures rise and stay at 1.8 in the last couple of weeks because of live feed or because of the Hazel/Daley drama and the subsequent bitchfests with Gina?

Daley was ejected in week 5. It maintained a 1.8+ rating all the way to week 9.


Who needs that when they can simply nominate in front of one another or not nominate at all and let the producers do the choosing? :hee:

The reason for it is that it would get the viewers onto the website to watch things unfold live.

[Marsh.]

They did do live nominations on E4 for one series I can't remember which.

I really don't think they did.

Apart from special occasions when they would nominate live in a show presented by Davina. Such as the timed nominations in BB10 and CBB7.

[Beetlejuice]

I really don't think they did.

Apart from special occasions when they would nominate live in a show presented by Davina. Such as the timed nominations in BB10 and CBB7.

Pretty sure there was one series with live nominations on E4

[Marsh.]

I don't believe anyone has ever given that reason actually.

That has been the reason ever since the move to channel 5. Lack of interest makes it completely not worth it.

[Marsh.]

Pretty sure there was one series with live nominations on E4

Which series would this be?

They used to announce nominations results to the house live on BBLB?

[Beetlejuice]

That has been the reason ever since the move to channel 5. Lack of interest makes it completely not worth it.

Show me someone involved in Channel 5 giving that as the reason for anything other than the axing of the 7 pm live coverage.

[Rob!]

Show me someone involved in Channel 5 giving that as the reason for anything other than the axing of the 7 pm live coverage.

You do realise that the live feed that was shown on 5* was getting 70k for the majority of it's run and then towards the end was going as low as 8k?

[Beetlejuice]

Which series would this be?

They used to announce nominations results to the house live on BBLB?

Yeah I know. I've watched since the first series. I'm sure there was an E4 show that did live nominations. Though it might just have been a Diary Room Uncut show. I'm trying to find out

[Marsh.]

Show me someone involved in Channel 5 giving that as the reason for anything other than the axing of the 7 pm live coverage.

I really don't care to search at this time in the morning. Maybe search the terms in google might bring stuff up.

But it's certainly not a bizarre notion that it's not worth the money having a 24/7 feed for a show thats life span is spinning out.

[Jason.]

Yeah I know. I've watched since the first series. I'm sure there was an E4 show that did live nominations. Though it might just have been a Diary Room Uncut show. I'm trying to find out

Are you sure you're not thinking of Nominations Uncut, which aired on E4, during BB5, CBB3, and BB6?

[Beetlejuice]

I really don't care to search at this time in the morning. Maybe search the terms in google might bring stuff up.

But it's certainly not a bizarre notion that it's not worth the money having a 24/7 feed for a show thats life span is spinning out.

Given that no one here knows how much it costs to run and the guy who made the original decision not to do it said that the cost was not the issue, I'm not convinced.

[Marsh.]

Yeah I know. I've watched since the first series. I'm sure there was an E4 show that did live nominations. Though it might just have been a Diary Room Uncut show. I'm trying to find out

Diary Room Uncut was a regular show in the early years but always showed stuff from days after we'd already seen the highlights from a particular day or uncut nominations clips after we'd already seen the noms in highlights.

I know they never broadcast from the diary room in any live feed apart from snippets in channel 4 live shows.

[Marsh.]

Given that no one here knows how much it costs to run and the guy who made the original decision not to do it said that the cost was not the issue, I'm not convinced.

Who said cost wasn't the issue?

I don't need to know how much it costs to get that conclusion. Just like I didn't when channel 4 axed it.

[Beetlejuice]

Are you sure you're not thinking of Nominations Uncut, which aired on E4, during BB5, CBB3, and BB6?

I might be.

Either way this is a digression. I was just suggesting some sort of live diary room feed for nominations as something they could do to get people on the website, getting more involved in the show and talking about it.

There are so many things they could do with that website to make it better it's difficult to know where to begin. As it is, it must be the worst site I've ever seen for an interactive show.

[Beetlejuice]

Who said cost wasn't the issue?

Jeff Ford did.

[Rob!]

I remember they did live noms from the Diary room ONCE in Julie Goodyears series but it failed massively as it was only on for half an hour and they spent the entire time getting Julie to clarify her nominations and to get some bitchier reasons out of her.

[Marsh.]

Jeff Ford did.

Source?

[Beetlejuice]

Source?

I see I'm the one who has to source everything.

[Marsh.]

I see I'm the one who has to source everything.

No but you're claiming facts, I'm stating what I assume to be the case based on the information we're discussing.

You're stating outright something was said.

[Marsh.]

Anyway, found something...

Ford claimed that people had "moved on" from watching the live feed and cited a drop in numbers of live feed viewers in the later Channel 4 years as a primary reason for the decision.

"We could have done it if we wanted to," he said during a Q&A session at the Edinburgh TV Festival. "Channel 4 did do live streaming, but then they did less and less and less, then it became subscription so it hasn't completely changed radically.

"There was a time when people sleeping or something major happening was the most interesting thing and you had to watch Big Brother['s live feed], but then we all moved on."

Ford said that they had opted to spend the cash on Facebook and Twitter applications and the biggest ever house rather than the feed.


http://www.digitalspy.co.uk/tv/s149/big-brother/news/a337476/channel-5s-jeff-ford-we-all-moved-on-from-big-brother-live-feed.html#~pfV4cDhb6rNzOZ

Axed because of low figures, low figures means waste of cash so the money was placed elsewhere.

Pretty much the obvious.

[Beetlejuice]

I remember him saying they could have done the live feed but decided to spend the money on twitter and facebook because people had "moved on from watching people sleeping"

[GLENN BILL BB7]

Would everyone prefer BB if there was no nominations and everyone was just up every week but I think that would be too boring?

[Marsh.]

Another article in the run up the first January C5 CBB

Channel 5 is bringing back a limited amount of live feed for the new series of Celebrity Big Brother.

The reality show, which is based around the concept of 24-hour surveillance, did not feature any live feed during its first series on the network.

Despite protests from fans of the programme, Channel 5's controller Jeff Ford gave reasons including cost and a lack of significant interest from viewers as an explanation for the resource's axing. The broadcaster opted instead to focus more finances on social networking elements such as Facebook and Twitter pages.

No viewers. Waste of money.

[Jason.]

Would everyone prefer BB if there was no nominations and everyone was just up every week but I think that would be too boring?

Like I'm A Celeb?
It would be more of a popularity contest, that way.

But nominations is fundamental.

[Beetlejuice]

Anyway, found something...



http://www.digitalspy.co.uk/tv/s149/big-brother/news/a337476/channel-5s-jeff-ford-we-all-moved-on-from-big-brother-live-feed.html#~pfV4cDhb6rNzOZ

Axed because of low figures, low figures means waste of cash so the money was placed elsewhere.

Pretty much the obvious.

No one denies less people watch it now. The point is can you keep the viewers you still have without it... And they are now losing them each year. And the complaint is the same every year. And Jeff Ford stated clearly they could have done the live feed but chose instead to put the money into things that have not worked.

And there is no reason it cannot be put on the website. FFS they give housemates in secret rooms a chance to watch it every bloody year. It's not as if there isn't a 24/7 feed going all the time.

And the benefit to the website it could bring could help with costs and possibly lead to a lot more people visiting the site.

[ThriceShy]

How about nominations for who they want to save and then the rest go up for the public vote.

I think that would be an interesting slant on it.

[Marsh.]

No one denies less people watch it now. The point is can you keep the viewers you still have without it... And they are now losing them each year.

:unsure: Uh....

1) I provided those links because you said Jeff Ford said cost WASN'T the issue. Those articles quite clearly state it was the issue. It wasn't worth the money with no one watching it.

2) Of course they can keep hold of viewers without it, they've done it before. The entire show being bollocks is pushing the viewers away, not simply a lack of live feed, which when provided has shown doesn't attract many viewers at all.

And there is no reason it cannot be put on the website. FFS they give housemates in secret rooms a chance to watch it every bloody year. It's not as if there isn't a 24/7 feed going all the time.

Well unless you actually work for them at Elstree or are involved in commissioning at channel 5 then this doesn't really add much.
The housemates watching a screen in a secret room is not the same as broadcasting live footage over television or the internet.

Not to mention the feed for the housemates in a secret room does not require all of the filtering/monitoring/costs that a public feed would require. They don't just click a button and that's it forever.

[Jason.]

The reason why viewers are decreasing every year, particularly in the last two years is because of the decrease in quality of the show. The production is to blame for that.

BB14, despite being the highest rated civilian series has ironically damaged Big Brother, as it's pretty much set the stone for every future series that has come.

BB15 came along a year later, and set the stone for the last 2 CBB's as well.

[GLENN BILL BB7]

Like I'm A Celeb?
It would be more of a popularity contest, that way.

But nominations is fundamental.

Yea it wouldn't be interesting as its a big part of the show.

They need it nowadays to constantly **** stir!

Also your spoiler always makes me LOL :joker:

[Jason.]

Yea it wouldn't be interesting as its a big part of the show.

They need it nowadays to constantly **** stir!

Also your spoiler always makes me LOL :joker:

Glad you noticed. :hehe:

I had it as my sig, but the buzz kill mods made me resize it.

:fist:

[Rob!]

Resizing Wolfy is between her and laws of physics :hee:

[Jay_Roberts441]

Would a mix of BBUK and BBCAN/BBUS formats work for BB16?

Say we (the public) vote for the 3 housemates to face an Immunity challenge and let the housemates decide on who is evicted out of the 2 that are left.

[Jason.]

How about nominations for who they want to save and then the rest go up for the public vote.

I think that would be an interesting slant on it.

They had something like that in BB6, where they nominated to save during a week. I think it was Kemal vs. Orlaith week.

Surprised they've never done that nowadays, considering all the nomination twists we get.

But knowing the current production, they'll completely mess with it, and butcher the whole purpose of it.

[Beetlejuice]

:unsure: Uh....

1) I provided those links because you said Jeff Ford said cost WASN'T the issue. Those articles quite clearly state it was the issue. It wasn't worth the money with no one watching it.

People were watching it. Just less. But then less people would be watching it when you have less viewers in general. Ford clearly stated they could have done it but chose instead to put money into other things. Those other things failed miserably. And the lack of the live coverage has left fans disappointed with the show ever since and they have struggled to get involved in it.

2) Of course they can keep hold of viewers without it, they've done it before.

No, they haven't. The viewing figures have been going down every year with the one exception of BB14. The series with the extra coverage.

The entire show being bollocks is pushing the viewers away, not simply a lack of live feed, which when provided has shown doesn't attract many viewers at all.

And I must repeat the same argument again to you... The pointless twists, the desperate stunts, the reliance this year on past housemates. All the things that make the show bollocks comes from one simple problem... No one can get to know the housemates anymore and the show lacks all of the immediacy it once had. As a result they feel they have to constantly interfere with it to a point that is offputting.

[Beetlejuice]

Would a mix of BBUK and BBCAN/BBUS formats work for BB16?

Yes, they have the live coverage.

[Marsh.]

The viewing figures have been going down every year

As they did on channel 4 with live feed. Tends to happen with shows, they decline in viewership.


Not to mention the feed for the housemates in a secret room does not require all of the filtering/monitoring/costs that a public feed would require. They don't just click a button and that's it forever.

Live feed does not get enough viewers to justify the cost.
BB14 had higher viewers but still nowhere near a justifiable rating for the live feed to be cost efficient or anywhere near the reason for an increase in ratings.
The ratings increase wasn't significant in anyway, it's tiny.

That's the last thing I'll say now as we're going in circles.

[GLENN BILL BB7]

They had something like that in BB6, where they nominated to save during a week. I think it was Kemal vs. Orlaith week.

Surprised they've never done that nowadays, considering all the nomination twists we get.

But knowing the current production, they'll completely mess with it, and butcher the whole purpose of it.

Yea they should do this again for a change, I remember Makosi was being sneaky and didn't pick 'Her Best friend in the house' Kemal.

[Jason.]

No, they haven't. The viewing figures have been going down every year with the one exception of BB14. The series with the extra coverage.


Incorrect.

BB12 averaged 1.55m, then BB13 came along and averaged 1.64m. That's a slight increase. Despite, the Olympics slashing the ratings.

BB13 would've done better than BB14, had the Olympics, and the fact that only 3 people watched Caroline's eviction not ruined it.

BB14 then averaged 1.9m. Which is another increase.
BB15 averaged 1.57m. A 0.3m decrease, but still higher than BB12. And a reasonable rating.

It's this year that the ratings are seriously plummeting, to the low end of 1m. And are not on par with the loyal 1.6m audience that were present in 2011-2014.

[ThriceShy]

You keep talking about live feed allowing us to get to know and care about the housemates, which is true, but why would we bother investing the time to do that when the production team can just pull a stunt like 4in4out and get rid of people that haven't even been nominated?

[Marsh.]

Incorrect.

BB12 averaged 1.55m, then BB13 came along and averaged 1.64m. That's a slight increase. Despite, the Olympics slashing the ratings.

BB13 would've done better than BB14, had the Olympics, and the fact that only 3 people watched Caroline's eviction not ruined it.

BB14 then averaged 1.9m. Which is another increase.
BB15 averaged 1.57m. A 0.3m decrease, but still higher than BB12. And a reasonable rating.

It's this year that the ratings are seriously plummeting, to the low end of 1m.

Interesting. :hehe:

[Marsh.]

You keep talking about live feed allowing us to get to know and care about the housemates, which is true, but why would we bother investing the time to do that when the production team can just pull a stunt like 4in4out and get rid of people that haven't even been nominated?

Exactly. There's more pressing (and much less costly) problems with the show.

[Jason.]

Incorrect.

BB12 averaged 1.55m, then BB13 came along and averaged 1.64m. That's a slight increase. Despite, the Olympics slashing the ratings.

BB13 would've done better than BB14, had the Olympics, and the fact that only 3 people watched Caroline's eviction not ruined it.

BB14 then averaged 1.9m. Which is another increase.
BB15 averaged 1.57m. A 0.3m decrease, but still higher than BB12. And a reasonable rating.

It's this year that the ratings are seriously plummeting, to the low end of 1m. And are not on par with the loyal 1.6m audience that were present in 2011-2014.

My point is that live feed is not the reason why the ratings are low.

After BB14, the ratings have declined. And rightly so too, as that format involving heavy twists and manipulation is what has tampered with the show.
BB15 did it much worse than BB14 did, and look how that turned out.

They've done even worse this year with 4in4out, and the fact that the extremely heavy use of manipulation the year before, has put people off.

[Beetlejuice]

Not to mention the feed for the housemates in a secret room does not require all of the filtering/monitoring/costs that a public feed would require. They don't just click a button and that's it forever.

Internet feed would require less regulation. And how bloody hard can it be to get a couple of people who know what they're doing to push a button when need be?

Live feed does not get enough viewers to justify the cost.

You keep saying this but (1) you have no idea how many viewers it gets (something that would be impossible to measure with the 24/7 feed anyway) and (2) you have no idea what the cost actually is. Another problem (3) is that there is the cost of not having it and the lack of immediacy and interest hardcore fans now feel as a result which ultimately damages the viability of the product as a whole.


BB14 had higher viewers but still nowhere near a justifiable rating for the live feed to be cost efficient or anywhere near the reason for an increase in ratings.

This is pure speculation on your part as you have no idea how much it costs nor can any of us know exactly what the reason for the ratings increase was. Furthermore, there are ways of cutting costs with other things to pay for the feed, and if need be you could have a subscription charge. Only this time, unlike with BB11, create a website and fill it with features that actually justify any charge.


The ratings increase wasn't significant in anyway, it's tiny.

It's significant by the standards of Channel 5.

That's the last thing I'll say now as we're going in circles.

We are, but it's clear that the vast majority of the complaints on forums, fan sites and on twitter are to do with the live feed the lack of which harms the show considerably regardless of how many viewing figures it gets at any particular time. A great website with that at the heart of it would help the show, it would get more people visiting the site, and it would earn them the good will of those who continue to watch but who had been ready to give up on it. Which I'm sure they will if next year carries on the same as before (if there even is a next year)

[Marsh.]

Internet feed would require less regulation. And how bloody hard can it be to get a couple of people who know what they're doing to push a button when need be?

Because SHOCK HORROR, it requires more than pushing a button.

If only life was simple.

You keep saying this but (1) you have no idea how many viewers it gets (something that would be impossible to measure with the 24/7 feed anyway) and (2) you have no idea what the cost actually is. Another problem (3) is that there is the cost of not having it and the lack of immediacy and interest hardcore fans now feel as a result which ultimately damages the viability of the product as a whole.

Again, I don't need to know the cost or the viewers. The fact it was axed due to low figures tells me that. Why else was it not reinstated? As Jeff Ford said they felt the money would be better spent elsewhere as the viewers just weren't interested in live feed anymore.

You and a few others still being passionate about it doesn't change that fact.

but it's clear that the vast majority of the complaints on forums, fan sites and on twitter are to do with the live feed the lack of which harms the show considerably regardless of how many viewing figures it gets at any particular time.

Yes and, unfortunately, not enough of them are interested when it comes to live feed on the website. Thus it was axed.

[Beetlejuice]

Because SHOCK HORROR, it requires more than pushing a button.

It doesn't. You have the thing on a delay (30 minutes if need be) and you silence any problematic stuff. If it was any more problematic than that why would so many other countries have the live coverage including multiple feeds in some cases. All you need is one or two people who understand the legal issues and one person who knows how to cut anything that needs to be cut out.

Again, I don't need to know the cost or the viewers.

Yes, you do. If you're going to make a convincing case.

The fact it was axed due to low figures tells me that. Why else was it not reinstated? As Jeff Ford said they felt the money would be better spent elsewhere as the viewers just weren't interested in live feed anymore.

Yes and he proved himself an idiot on that. Jeff Ford consistently showed himself to not understand the show and what was most important to it. He believed the money was better spent on the twitter updates and facebook. That tells you everything you need to know about the fool.

You and a few others still being passionate about it doesn't change that fact.

It's the only thing people have complained about since it moved to Channel 5. So it's not just a few of us.

Yes and, unfortunately, not enough of them are interested when it comes to live feed on the website. Thus it was axed.

The 24/7 coverage has never been tried on the website. It had 2 hours at 7 pm on Channel 5 against soaps and it had 2 hours at midnight. The fact is with a 24/7 feed anyone who visits the site would be watching it at some point during the day and in doing so getting more involved with the characters and the show. As Phil Edgar Jones stated "I wonder if we'd had the live feed in there, would more people have got connected and passionate about it."

It is also important from a trust point of view. As the exec producer of BB Canada correctly pointed out... The Live feeds keep the show honest. And if any version of Big Brother has lost the trust of the viewers it must be this one.

[the_answers]

Why do you think people would refuse to watch CBB if civilian BB was cancelled? :umm2:
Cos guess there's people who enjoy "reality TV" but don't want celebrities.
But they put up with the celebrity thing cos it's still got the reality / BB element (or what's left of it) mixed in.

But yeah, reality TV is now moving into celebrity/soap territory.
Which could easily explain why "reality TV fans" are switching off from BB too.

To be frank, thought it was a much better show tonight.
And BOTS too.
But even on BOTS, Cristian is unanimously selected as the one to go even though he made tonights HL show all by himself.
Feels like they can't help themselves.

[Marsh.]

All you need is one or two people who understand the legal issues and one person who knows how to cut anything that needs to be cut out.

Yes, 24/7 for three months requires one or two people. Ok.

Yes, you do. If you're going to make a convincing case.

No I do not. :confused:

The people who's job it is to know that have said time and again there is not enough interest to justify paying the money for it.
That is all I need to know.

If it was any more problematic than that why would so many other countries have the live coverage including multiple feeds in some cases.

Because, like the UK did 10 years ago, they have the interest for it.
BBUK no longer does.
Why bother paying money and going through all of the effort for it when it does nothing for them in return. It's a waste of resources.

The 24/7 coverage has never been tried on the website.

Channel 4 had 24/7 coverage on the website and in Jeff Ford's own words the original decision to not carry it over to channel 5 was because of the poor performance during channel 4's final series.

The Live feeds keep the show honest. And if any version of Big Brother has lost the trust of the viewers it must be this one.

I couldn't agree more. And in its heyday that is what it did.

But at the end of the day, television is a business and if it's a waste of money they're not going to continue anything unless it's providing for them in return. The live feed no longer does that.

Television is a business first and foremost and cuts will be made for things no longer working. Sad fact but true, especially on a channel like 5.

[Beetlejuice]

Incorrect.

BB12 averaged 1.55m, then BB13 came along and averaged 1.64m. That's a slight increase. Despite, the Olympics slashing the ratings.

Couple of points...

BB12 aired from early September to early November. It did so after 3 weeks of Celebrity Big Brother. So it is a bit of an anomaly. BB13 is the first real summer series. One thing that is interesting is that the CBB launched with 5.27 million viewers. That is absolutely enormous for Channel 5! Just imagine how many of those they could have kept had they stuck with the format it had on Channel 4.

BB13 had a big launch night with 2.93 million on a Tuesday. That contributed greatly to a high first week figure. But it was going down by week 4, before the Olympics began. BB14 in contrast started with a comparatively low launch night figure, and had average ratings that went up in the second half (when there was extra live coverage)

BB13 would've done better than BB14, had the Olympics, and the fact that only 3 people watched Caroline's eviction not ruined it.

There's no way of knowing that. The fact is Big Brother 13 was dipping before the Olympics started.

BB14 then averaged 1.9m. Which is another increase.
BB15 averaged 1.57m. A 0.3m decrease, but still higher than BB12. And a reasonable rating.

So it's been going down every year since BB14.

It's this year that the ratings are seriously plummeting, to the low end of 1m. And are not on par with the loyal 1.6m audience that were present in 2011-2014.

The officials will put it up to 1.2/1.3

Big Brother 14 gets 1.9
Big Brother 15 gets 1.57
Big Brother 16 gets 1.3

So it's lost 600,000 viewers since the series with the extra live coverage. So it's lost about a third of its viewers in the space of two years.

[Marsh.]

Of course CBB's launch was huge, it's CBB.

CBB7 (the last on channel 4) drew in over 6 million for the launch, BB11 (the last on channel 4) drew in just over 5 million.

[the_answers]

If what you're saying is true, we'll take the BB viewers and subtract them from the CBB audience
So are you saying you'd like ratings to be high but if they plummet you're not really bothered ?

Or just that you think any decrease in figures will be so small or negligible as to not make any huge impact on current figures ?

[Marsh.]

So are you saying you'd like ratings to be high but if they plummet you're not really bothered ?

Or just that you think any decrease in figures will be so small or negligible as to not make any huge impact on current figures ?

I was responding to Mock's assumption that the hardcore BB fans would switch off from CBB too if it was axed and cause CBB to then fail.

Let's be generous and say every one of BB's audience is a hardcore fan and subtract that figure from the average CBB rating (to account for the hardcore fans switching off) and CBB STILL out-rates BB by more than double. That won't result in CBB failing and highlights just how small the civilian audience is.

[the_answers]

Not in the short term no.

[Marsh.]

Not in the short term no.

Elaborate? Explain? Source? Add to the discussion? :conf:

CBB can more than stand on its own two feet. It's the only one to get any media attention and was outperforming BB regularly even 5 years ago on channel 4.

[Beetlejuice]

Yes, 24/7 for three months requires one or two people. Ok.

They already have an enormous team. They would just need a few more to handle the legal side of it. It really is not that difficult to run as can be demonstrated by the fact that so many other countries have not just one feed but multiple feeds.

No I do not. :confused:

You do really. One proven idiot who doesn't understand the show and the long term costs of not having it is meaningless, and he clearly said it could have been done but they instead chose to invest in other things. Those other things have been a proven failure and can be scrapped.

The people who's job it is to know that have said time and again there is not enough interest to justify paying the money for it.
That is all I need to know.

One person. A man who thought the money was better spent investing in twitter updates and facebook. Your faith in thinking these people know what they're doing is nice, but they haven't shown much sign of doing so.


Because, like the UK did 10 years ago, they have the interest for it.

And there continues to be an interest for it here. As is made clear by the number of people who continue to argue for it on forums and twitter. And again, the website would benefit hugely from it.


BBUK no longer does. Why bother paying money and going through all of the effort for it when it does nothing for them in return. It's a waste of resources.

Because the show is suffering without it. They are killing the show stone dead. That is a far bigger waste if the show could still be viable.


Channel 4 had 24/7 coverage on the website and in Jeff Ford's own words the original decision to not carry it over to channel 5 was because of the poor performance during channel 4's final series.

I will have to go through a lot of Oathy's posts on Digital Spy to find the truth behind this, but there is actually a lot more to the story. I can't do it now as my eyes hurt and I'm ready to top myself.



I couldn't agree more. And in its heyday that is what it did.

But at the end of the day, television is a business and if it's a waste of money they're not going to continue anything unless it's providing for them in return. The live feed no longer does that.

You keep asserting this when it has never been tried on Channel 5. If they did one series with it and it failed then so be it, but to not do this is ridiculous.

Television is a business first and foremost and cuts will be made for things no longer working. Sad fact but true, especially on a channel like 5.

Cuts must be made. But it's what cuts you do make that are important. And they have cut something that is essential to the show where they could have made other cuts. In doing so they're killing the show off even for the most hardcore fans. From a business point of view, that is stupid.

[Beetlejuice]

Of course CBB's launch was huge, it's CBB.

It was the return of Big Brother on a new Channel that caused the major interest.

[the_answers]

Elaborate? Explain? Source? Add to the discussion? :conf:

CBB can more than stand on its own two feet. It's the only one to get any media attention and was outperforming BB regularly even 5 years ago on channel 4.
Well I don't know really, was just my guess.
I just think it feels like short-termism and if that's the problem with BB, then in the longer term maybe it might not work with CBB either.

But then again maybe it's comparing apples and pears.
Reality TV may not be a winner anymore.
Celebrity BB ?

All shows seem to need to remain interesting, relevant etc.

Just think the advantage old BB have is the underlying reality format of the show.
Take that out, I do wonder if chucking in new celebs is going to be the answer everytime.
Like I said I really don't know and I'm guessing but CBB's appeal seems a bit of a mix and match between being reality TV and being a celebrity puller.

If it can survive on celebrities alone then I guess it'll be fine.

[Marsh.]

It really is not that difficult to run as can be demonstrated by the fact that so many other countries have not just one feed but multiple feeds.

You're missing the point. Yes, they could, but why spend all that money and hire the staff to do these tasks when it's not justified by the viewing figures? It's a waste of time and money.

You do really. One proven idiot who doesn't understand the show and the long term costs of not having it is meaningless, and he clearly said it could have been done but they instead chose to invest in other things. Those other things have been a proven failure and can be scrapped.

Well that "one idiot" is long gone and has there been a change? No.
Of course it "could" be done, ANYTHING "could" be done, but again channel 5 is a business. They're not going to want to please the few viewers who will watch a live feed despite losing money on it.

Those other things have been a proven failure and can be scrapped.

They're not a failure, but they require improvements.

Your faith in thinking these people know what they're doing is nice, but they haven't shown much sign of doing so.

I haven't put faith in anyone, not the least a man who hasn't been running the place for years.
I don't care where they decided to place the money, but from a business standpoint it's quite clearly better spent in a place where there is a substantial number of viewers (social media).
They could do with spending even more in this department.

And there continues to be an interest for it here. As is made clear by the number of people who continue to argue for it on forums and twitter. And again, the website would benefit hugely from it.

Getting back to the point, not ENOUGH interest. You and your forum friends don't pay the bills for them I'm afraid. :hee:

Because the show is suffering without it. They are killing the show stone dead. That is a far bigger waste if the show could still be viable.

They are killing the show and I have yet to hear a valid comment from yourself that shows live feed is the prime reason. It has been proven however that the vast majority of the BB audience do not care for it.

You keep asserting this when it has never been tried on Channel 5. If they did one series with it and it failed then so be it, but to not do this is ridiculous.

They inherited a 10 year old show. They had all the data and research there to tell them what state the show was in and all of its extensions. Channel 4 had already deemed live feed not worth to keep going and channel 5 agreed and continued this decision.

And they have cut something that is essential to the show where they could have made other cuts.

So essential to the show, only a small few of an already niche programme are even watching it. It is essential to the spirit of what Big Brother was but was axed because viewers moved on from it.

We're a world away from when watching streaming from the house at any time on the internet was in anyway exciting or appealing to a general audience. No fancy website will change this.

The "hardcore" fans don't make up such a significant number, hence their say being a small voice in a large crowd. That doesn't pay for the show to do half of what it did in its heyday.

Popularity = Money

BB has neither anymore.

It was the return of Big Brother on a new Channel that caused the major interest.

Yes and CBB was more popular than the main show by this point, hence the reason channel 5 wanted to buy CBB and only CBB.

[Marsh.]

Well I don't know really, was just my guess.
I just think it feels like short-termism and if that's the problem with BB, then in the longer term maybe it might not work with CBB either.

But then again maybe it's comparing apples and pears.
Reality TV may not be a winner anymore.
Celebrity BB ?

All shows seem to need to remain interesting, relevant etc.

Just think the advantage old BB have is the underlying reality format of the show.
Take that out, I do wonder if chucking in new celebs is going to be the answer everytime.
Like I said I really don't know and I'm guessing but CBB's appeal seems a bit of a mix and match between being reality TV and being a celebrity puller.

If it can survive on celebrities alone then I guess it'll be fine.

I'm not saying anything is the answer.

I'm not saying CBB is in a better state than BB.

I personally feel the format is dead on the whole and reality TV as we've known it is being phased out (even American Idol is ending) but CBB is the one still with legs for this show. Whether those legs last another year, 2 years, 5 years or more is a different story. But the civilian shows legs were broken years ago and they're simply dragging its crippled carcass around the floor. IMO of course. :hee: It may manage to drag itself onto its knees every now and then but those moments are getting fewer and further between.

It needs at least a rest to patch up.

[Beetlejuice]

You're missing the point. Yes, they could, but why spend all that money and hire the staff to do these tasks when it's not justified by the viewing figures? It's a waste of time and money.

The viewing figures for what though? That the figures for the live coverage at any given time of day might be low I don't doubt. The point is, with a 24/7 feed how many people do watch at some point during the day, get more involved, and in doing so become more interested in the show. That can help with the actual viewing figures for the highlight shows. As I have pointed out, they have lost 600,000 viewers since 2 years ago. That is an enormous loss and it makes the show less viable. Had they found a way to build on the success of BB14 by increasing the live coverage they may have actually done better last year and continued to do well this year. But they didn't. They had less live coverage and now have become reliant on the sort of desperate headline grabbing stunts that have increasingly put viewers off as a result. So whatever the costs of the live coverage, the costs of not having it can be argued to be the ultimate destruction of the show.



Well that "one idiot" is long gone and has there been a change? No.
Of course it "could" be done, ANYTHING "could" be done, but again channel 5 is a business. They're not going to want to please the few viewers who will watch a live feed despite losing money on it.

It wouldn't just be pleasing them though. It's about making the whole show better for everybody who ever clicked on the website, which plenty would do if it was good and featured the things people want. Imagine one big argument in the first week and people on twitter who are watching start tweeting about it and a buzz is created. Immediately people would visit the website to watch what was going on and the fall out. It would be exciting in a way that watching the events happen 24 hours afterwards on a HL show just cannot be.



They're not a failure, but they require improvements.

The facebook site is ****. And the twitter updates are an embarrassment. Both can be scrapped in favour of the things that would actually make the show better.


I haven't put faith in anyone, not the least a man who hasn't been running the place for years. I don't care where they decided to place the money, but from a business standpoint it's quite clearly better spent in a place where there is a substantial number of viewers (social media).

It hasn't worked out that way for them has it. The fact is social media, social networking, 24/7 twitter activity, the live feed actually lends itself very well to these things. They have failed miserably to understand that.



Getting back to the point, not ENOUGH interest. You and your forum friends don't pay the bills for them I'm afraid. :hee:

Again... There could easily be, if done right.


They are killing the show and I have yet to hear a valid comment from yourself that shows live feed is the prime reason. It has been proven however that the vast majority of the BB audience do not care for it.

No, it has not. And certainly not by you.


They inherited a 10 year old show. They had all the data and research there to tell them what state the show was in and all of its extensions. Channel 4 had already deemed live feed not worth to keep going and channel 5 agreed and continued this decision.

Channel 4 got rid of the live coverage the same year they knew they were getting rid of the show. a show that had probably wanted rid of earlier because of the trouble it had gotten them into.


So essential to the show, only a small few of an already niche programme are even watching it.

What are you basing this **** on? How many people go to the website? Do you know? No. If every time they went to the site the first thing to open would be the live coverage they would be watching it. Putting it on at midnight isn't likely to bring a lot of viewers of it. Nevertheless, when they did do that it was the highest rated series on Channel 5.

It is essential to the spirit of what Big Brother was but was axed because viewers moved on from it.

Blah, blah, blah Jeff Ford.

We're a world away from when watching streaming from the house at any time on the internet was in anyway exciting or appealing to a general audience. No fancy website will change this.

The "hardcore" fans don't make up such a significant number, hence their say being a small voice in a large crowd. That doesn't pay for the show to do half of what it did in its heyday.

Popularity = Money

BB has neither.

It's the most popular show on Channel 5, but it is sinking fast because of the disillusionment of the fans. And one source of that disillusionment is the lack of the live feed.

A good website with the live coverage and a return to the old format, may boost its popularity by its current standards. If they don't do that, they will lose even more viewers, and therefore more money.

[Marsh.]

Ok.

[Marsh.]

And certainly not by you.

:joker: :joker: :joker:

[Rob!]

I'm pretty sure he's automated. He's being saying exactly the same thing for weeks. Maybe if whoever sticks money into his back to keep him talking gave some money to channel 5, then there'd be a live feed :worry:

[Marsh.]

It's the most popular show on Channel 5

Like saying your "King of the Shed". The fact that "channel 5" is part of that sentence says everything. :joker:

Most popular on channel 5 = not very popular at all = no interest = no money

[Beetlejuice]

Like saying your "King of the Shed". The fact that "channel 5" is part of that sentence says everything. :joker:

You can't expect it to be as popular as shows on other channels.

[Marsh.]

You can't expect it to be as popular as shows on other channels.

I don't expect it to.

But I expect a show that was once a part of those popular channels and now retired to channel 5 to have a severely reduced budget and smaller viewers resulting in a very different show to the one it was before. Live feed being a part of that.

So you can't expect the show to be in anyway similar to the one it was before when it comes to its interactivity.

The things they CAN change however such as the basic nominations format and the twists are a much more solvable problem at the moment. Then maybe in the future other things can be addressed before they're spending money they haven't got.

[Beetlejuice]

But I expect a show that was once a part of those popular channels and now retired to channel 5 to have a severely reduced budget and smaller viewers resulting in a very different show to the one it was before. Live feed being a part of that

So you can't expect the show to be in anyway similar to the one it was before.


I can actually. Providing they make the cuts where they need to and concentrate on what actually made the show work. Unfortunately they've cut what actually made the show work. And it is dying year after year now as a result of it.

And I don't accept that a live feed costs that much to run anyway.

[Marsh.]

I can actually. Providing they make the cuts where they need to and concentrate on what actually made the show work. Unfortunately they've cut what actually made the show work. And it is dying year after year now as a result of it.

And where else do you suggest they get the money from as the show is on the bones of its arse and resorted to hiring X Factor joke acts as presenters and decorating the house with buckets of glitter.


And I don't accept that a live feed costs that much to run anyway.

This 8 page thread tells me that. :hee:

[Beetlejuice]

And where else do you suggest they get the money from as the show is on the bones of its arse and resorted to hiring X Factor joke acts as presenters and decorating the house with buckets of glitter.

They could scrap the whole of BOTS for starters.

[Beetlejuice]

This 8 page thread tells me that. :hee:


And the amount of countries the world over who supply a 24/7 feed should tell you that it's true.

[Marsh.]

They scrap the whole of BOTS for starters.

Erase its one and only remaining companion show?

Talking about killing the franchise further.

[Beetlejuice]

Erase its one and only remaining companion show?

Talking about killing the franchise further.


Says the person who thinks its dead already anyway.

[Marsh.]

And the amount of countries the world over who supply a 24/7 feed should tell you that it's true.

So other countries providing live feeds = live feed is cheap? Doesn't really work like that. Countries like Canada have a thriving and popular show on their hands. Ours is dead.

It's not even necessarily about the exact cost but having it measured up against how much its used and its performance. If they can't justify the cost with a very small usage then a business is not going to spend in that area.

Very basic stuff.

[Marsh.]

Says the person who thinks its dead already anyway.

Yes, I do. So?

Pardon me for suggesting that your ideas for improving it will make it worse.

Slitting the throat of a wounded man will not save his life. :hee:

[Beetlejuice]

So other countries providing live feeds = live feed is cheap?

I think it suggests that the cost of it isn't anything close to what you seem to think it is.


It's not even necessarily about the exact cost but having it measured up against how much its used and its performance. If they can't justify the cost with a very small usage then a business is not going to spend in that area.

Again, the usage varies throughout the day with a 24/7 feed. And the benefits will be felt not in how many people watch it at any given time, but in the higher figures for the HL show as a result of people just being able to get involved to a greater degree which it is now impossible to do. Don't know the HMs, don't care about them. Don't care, you don't watch. The live coverage if it was there from the very first night (which it has never been on Channel 5) would help people with that

Very basic stuff.

It is very basic stuff. I agree. Take away an essential ingredient in a product and the product dies and you go bust.

[Beetlejuice]

Yes, I do. So?

Pardon me for suggesting that your ideas for improving it will make it worse.

Scrapping BOTS certainly wouldn't make it worse.

[Marsh.]

I think it suggests that the cost of it isn't anything close to what you seem to think it is.


Again, the usage varies throughout the day with a 24/7 feed.

I don't know how much it costs so I'm not "thinking" what is is. :conf: Other countries having it = they have substantial numbers of their viewers who use it.

Yes, I'm aware about it varying. But the number of visitors/viewers for a potential live feed is very small indeed. Therefore I fail to see why they would go to the trouble of providing such a service for such a minority.

[Marsh.]

Scrapping BOTS certainly wouldn't make it worse.

So that the programme has NO companion show at all, it would in my eyes.

Now improving BOTS for the better would be a step in the right direction, not eliminating even more of what we've got.

[Beetlejuice]

I don't know how much it costs so I'm not "thinking" what is is. :conf:

I think the fact that so many countries have the 24/7 coverage suggests it doesn't cost that much to run.

Yes, I'm aware about it varying. But the number of visitors/viewers for a potential live feed is very small indeed.

Figures? No? Can't provide anything. You never can. Just a quote from Jeff Ford

Therefore I fail to see why they would go to the trouble of providing such a service for such a minority.

Because the show cannot even begin to recover without it. It may not with it. But at this point, to not try it is just silly.

[Beetlejuice]

So that the programme has NO companion show at all, it would in my eyes.

Now improving BOTS for the better would be a step in the right direction, not eliminating even more of what we've got.

I would scrap it and bring back a thirty minute BBLB with fewer guests.

[Marsh.]

Figures? No? Can't provide anything.

Coming from the person who's come to the conclusion it's cheap based off other countries having it. :umm2:

[Marsh.]

As said earlier it's not even the cost, it's whether it's worth the set up for the amount of interest. BB has next to no interest to many people.

But, yeah, life is so simple just get that man to click a button, that magic red button over there. Go on. :idc:

[Beetlejuice]

Coming from the person who's come to the conclusion it's cheap based off other countries having it. :umm2:

If every other country can do it there's no reason why this country cannot.

And again, you still are yet to provide any info on the website or the sort of interest there really is in the live feed. You just seem to take it for granted that the people making decisions for this show know what they're doing, which given the state it is in is an amusing idea.

[Marsh.]

If every other country can do it there's no reason why this country cannot.

Again, anyone CAN do it. Doesn't mean they will.

I COULD work for free, doesn't mean I'm going to.


And again, you still are yet to provide any info on the website or the sort of interest there really is in the live feed. You just seem to take it for granted that the people making decisions for this show know what they're doing, which given the state it is in is an amusing idea.

No, I do not.

I look at the fact that the show is not popular whatsoever so any investment in things like live feed is a waste of time and money. There's barely an audience. That is a fact.

[Beetlejuice]

As said earlier it's not even the cost, it's whether it's worth the set up for the amount of interest. BB has next to no interest to many people.

So you keep saying. And less and less interest as they continue to ignore the requests of the fans. The surest way to run any business into the ground.

[Marsh.]

So you keep saying. And less and less interest as they continue to ignore the requests of the fans. The surest way to run any business into the ground.

Yes, because people turned away because of no live feed and not because they're simply bored with Big Brother?

:joker: Nobody believes that.

[Beetlejuice]

Again, anyone CAN do it. Doesn't mean they will.

What are you on about?

I COULD work for free, doesn't mean I'm going to.

I'm sure the people working on the live coverage in other countries aren't working for free either. And yet they find a way to do it in all these other countries.


No, I do not.

Yes you do.

I look at the fact that the show is not popular whatsoever

Could have been. 2.93 million for the BB13 launch... Could have tried to keep more of them sticking around, but they couldn't.

so any investment in things like live feed is a waste of time. There's barely an audience.

So you keep saying. And the more they ignore the requests of the fans the less of an audience there will be. Good business plan.

[Beetlejuice]

Yes, because people turned away because of no live feed and not because they're simply bored with Big Brother?

Turned away because they promised the return of a show they couldn't deliver on. Turned away because it's impossible to get know the people and therefore to care about them. Turned away because having taken away all the immediacy of the show they now rely on desperate stunts that put viewers off. That's the real cost of no live coverage whatsoever. A dead end show.

[Mystic Mock]

If Ch5 brought Live Feed back on the Internet this is the ways that you could get ratings back, plus see the quality improve.

1. Advertise everywhere on billboards and none stop on the TV Channels, and maybe try and get a few Radio Stations, and the Newspapers to promote the hell out of it.

2. Live Feed means not as much scripted TOWIE moments, as long as they don't do a BBCAN and constantly take the Live Feed down that is.

3. No stupid Launch Night twists more than likely as people can just go on the Live Feed service on the Internet and watch the house unfold, Ch5 only do the Launch Night twists so to make sure that an audience sticks around for the next couple of days.

[Marsh.]

I love how all countries are exactly the same with exactly the same circumstances/shows/budgets/viewers/producers/aims etc etc

:hee: How simple life is here.

[the_answers]

Get the impression the current format is trying to appeal to many people.
Bit of a twist here, some pysch on the couch there, bit of glam there.

Now I quite like that ! :)
And think it's doing ok (enjoyed the show tonight !).
But maybe (like noms !) problem is, it's sending out mixed messages.

Like tonight we see Cristian unanimously selected as "the one to go" on BOTS.
Even though he pretty much made tonights HL show. :conf:

Or there's healthy intellectual panel debate and free opinion on BOTS. (yes there is !)
Mixed in with an audience screaming to get a HM out.

Don't mind some twists as they sometimes provide good fun and entertainment.
But sometimes the twists go too far too.

Some say showmances are killing the show.
Yet the HL focus on them !
As a result HM are more interested in hooking up for airtime to protect themselves.
Then suprise suprise, back to the problem why the show isn't "entertaining" enough.

In all these things there's enough room to attract people from all different walks.
Or alternatively, put them all off !
Even those who enjoy showmances must sometimes get sick of the fumbling under the covers.

While I'm definitely interested in HMs, I've no desire to watch 3 hours live feed with cagy HM giving nothing away just so they can win.
But equally, I've little desire to watch a poorly edited HL show either.

So maybe the potential IS there and it's all about execution rather than any format.
It's frustrating cos it's so close to being a great show. (well it still is in many ways)

[Ashley.]

CBB will be dead within 2 years. The same thing happened with Fame Academy.

Stop telling them to axe the show and argue for them to make a better one.

Big Brother will never improve again.

[Ashley.]

Get the impression the current format is trying to appeal to many people.
Bit of a twist here, some pysch on the couch there, bit of glam there.

Now I quite like that ! :)
And think it's doing ok (enjoyed the show tonight !).
But maybe (like noms !) problem is, it's sending out mixed messages.

Like tonight we see Cristian unanimously selected as "the one to go" on BOTS.
Even though he pretty much made tonights HL show. :conf:

Or there's healthy intellectual panel debate and free opinion on BOTS. (yes there is !)
Mixed in with an audience screaming to get a HM out.

Don't mind some twists as they sometimes provide good fun and entertainment.
But sometimes the twists go too far too.

Some say showmances are killing the show.
Yet the HL focus on them !
As a result HM are more interested in hooking up for airtime to protect themselves.
Then suprise suprise, back to the problem why the show isn't "entertaining" enough.

In all these things there's enough room to attract people from all different walks.
Or alternatively, put them all off !
Even those who enjoy showmances must sometimes get sick of the fumbling under the covers.

While I'm definitely interested in HMs, I've no desire to watch 3 hours live feed with cagy HM giving nothing away just so they can win.
But equally, I've little desire to watch a poorly edited HL show either.

So maybe the potential IS there and it's all about execution rather than any format.
It's frustrating cos it's so close to being a great show. (well it still is in many ways)

Is this a poem?

[Mystic Mock]

The thing is the show is gonna die on this format, Ch5 should at least give a Live Feed Big Brother a chance just to see how it goes, I honestly don't see why that would hurt them so much?

[sungrass]

The thing is the show is gonna die on this format, Ch5 should at least give a Live Feed Big Brother a chance just to see how it goes, I honestly don't see why that would hurt them so much?

I want live feed - its the best

[Beso]

and this is a fans forum..lol.