Rita Ora discusses being a refugee (old interview, but relevant)

[JoshBB]

pGAkXoUVoZs

I think this interview is quite important in terms of recent politics surrounding refugees or the 'migrant crisis' as it's put by most media.

When you see headlines that only ever address refugees as a burden, and as part of a figure, it is relatively easy for people to become emotionally detached and unsympathetic towards those fleeing war. While Rita's story is one far less emotional than those out there (which you can search for if you'd like to), I thought I would share this in particular because Rita Ora is someone we all recognise as a 'normal british person'. Most people don't even know she was/is a Kosovan refugee. I think that since she is someone we see in music videos and on TV, people would identify with her more. She is a prime example of a muslim refugee who can integrate fully into society, and I have no doubts that 99% of those refugees who came from Syria and neighbouring countries can do the same.

She describes here that the words 'Get out' are hurtful and I think that they probably are, so while people on the internet may doubt the legitimacy of some/most of the refugees, when you post comments saying that we shouldn't let any refugees in.. or that we should kick them all out.. remember that these are actual human beings with actual human emotions.

[Denver]

I wish she hadnt come

[Kizzy]

Some support for the current refugees wouldn't have gone amiss then.

[kirklancaster]

Some of the Left Wing are truly confused and insane.

They forever whinge and bleat about the appalling state of the NHS. How it is starved of funds and in danger of total collapse. How there is not enough money to pay enough staff, or to adequately pay the staff we have. How people are dying through lack of proper treatment and lack of facilities.

They forever bleat and wail about the Homeless and the Housing Crisis. Of how people are living on the streets or living in squalid accommodation.

They weep and wail about inadequate benefits for the sick and for those out of work, and how there are not enough jobs, or how people who are in work are being forced to work for low wages.

They IGNORE the fact that for several decades now - those IN WORK, who pay tax and who are funding those not in work, ARE IN A MINORITY - YES, the non-tax payers outnumber the tax payers. Yes - the increasingly few are keeping the increasingly many.

More than any other kind of madness though - despite ALL the above - is the fact that the Left advocate an OPEN DOOR policy of LETTING ONE AND ALL into the UK willy nilly, whilst once again, NEVER putting forward ANY type of proposal of just HOW the UK can AFFORD this insanity, and nor do they EVER answer a question of just HOW we can LET IN ONE AND ALL without EXACERBATING our already severe HOUSING CRISIS, and NHS CRISIS and HOMELESSNESS CRISIS and BENEFITS CRISIS etc etc etc.

So COME ON you LEFT WING - How about answering this?

[MB.]

But How We Do (Party) is a bop Kirk

[Johnnyuk123]

Close the borders NOW!

[user104658]

That's some pretty misleading rhetoric there Kirk, only something like 7% of the working age population are unemployed. 90%+ in employment. Yes, fewer than 50% of the population works, but the vast majority of the other 50% are children and the elderly. With most of the children being supported by their parents and a large chunk of the elderly being supported by non-state pension funds and savings and investments.

[kirklancaster]

That's some pretty misleading rhetoric there Kirk, only something like 7% of the working age population are unemployed. 90%+ in employment. Yes, fewer than 50% of the population works, but the vast majority of the other 50% are children and the elderly. With most of the children being supported by their parents and a large chunk of the elderly being supported by non-state pension funds and savings and investments.

I don't disagree with your points here T.S., but I'm referring to those in actual 'Private' sector employment versus those in the 'Public' sector and those in receipt of benefits, those on any of the plethora of 'Further Education' schemes - bogus or genuine - those in the Military Services, those who work in our NHS, Fire and Police Services , our Education Services, those in Prisons or other 'Penal' institutions etc etc.

Just to be perfectly clear, lest certain people pounce; I am not denigrating ANY of the above people, and I realise that those in the above categories pay tax, but that does not alter the fact that the entire incomes of the above are funded in the first place by taxes paid by those in the Private Sector.

Just the cost of Civil Service Pensions for 2006 - 2007 was £128 billion, up by £27 billion from the year before and rising year in year out.

Another point, is that I am not addressing any disparity or unfairness in Salaries, Benefits, Wages etc, nor making comment on such - just pointing out that if one REALLY analyses the situation - then they will see that those employed in the Private Sector ARE funding a greater percentage of the populace who are NOT employed in the Private Sector.

Further; my point was only one of several to help illustrate, that BECAUSE of the above facts, and the fact that the AVERAGE ordinary working person in this country has increasingly LESS and LESS disposable income (if any at all) - Just WHERE do those who advocate FREE FOR ALL OPEN DOOR IMMIGRATION think the money to PAY for such charity is going to come from?

This is not a morality question merely an economic one - WE SIMPLY CANNOT AFFORD AN IMMIGRATION 'FREE FOR ALL'.

This country is ailing - and any additional funds necessary for any attempt to merely alleviate the suffering let alone fund a cure, can only be raised by one or more of only FOUR options:

1) Government BORROWING from outside sources.
2) Government 'Cut-Backs' in domestic spending.
3) Higher Direct Taxation.
4) More indirect taxation - 'Stealth' taxes, VAT etc.

I'll leave the last word to Brecht:

“Food comes first and then morality".

[user104658]

I agree that open-door immigration is impossible, anyone who thinks that a world with no borders can work in the 21st century I can only imagine has little to zero concept of just how that would look.

See it's not that I don't think a world like that COULD look better... It's just that we'd need an epic plague first, to knock the global population back to a more reasonable level. Ideally fewer than 0.5 billion humans.

With 7 to 8 billion of us trying to share one little planet, you simply have to accept that some (most) are not going to have a particularly comfortable existence... It's not feasible.

You don't have to LIKE it of course, and that's where I struggle philosophically, and to understand the way so many talk about it. With anger directed AT the people trying to find a better life for themselves. Of course they're going to do that! We all would. We all do, even. They don't owe us anything and, to me, it's perfectly reasonable for them to want a "slice of the pie" for themselves and their families. Which is why I feel empathy for these people. We can't let them all in... But it IS crappy and it IS unfair that we can't.

I guess look at it like the titanic going down. There weren't enough boats. That's the simple maths of it... If they'd let everyone into a boat, they would all have been sunk under the weight, and everyone would have drowned or froze. So, about 1/3 of the people got into the boats, and the rest died. It's not just, right, or fair... It's horrifying... And if you, me or anyone else was one of those people in the water, we'd be desperately trying to get into one of the boats, and not really caring about the risk of pulling it down with us.

And whose fault is it really?

The people in the water? The people in the lifeboats?

NOPE. It's the people who built and controlled the ship that sank.

So you can accept the numbers, you can say that it's just not possible for everyone to be saved, because it's true that it isn't. It would be foolish to try and we'd all go down too. But don't be angry at THEM for trying to save themselves... For not simply lying down and accepting their fate for our benefit. Be sorry that we can't help everyone - and blame the ****ers who built the damn ship.

[kirklancaster]

I agree that open-door immigration is impossible, anyone who thinks that a world with no borders can work in the 21st century I can only imagine has little to zero concept of just how that would look.

See it's not that I don't think a world like that COULD look better... It's just that we'd need an epic plague first, to knock the global population back to a more reasonable level. Ideally fewer than 0.5 billion humans.

With 7 to 8 billion of us trying to share one little planet, you simply have to accept that some (most) are not going to have a particularly comfortable existence... It's not feasible.

You don't have to LIKE it of course, and that's where I struggle philosophically, and to understand the way so many talk about it. With anger directed AT the people trying to find a better life for themselves. Of course they're going to do that! We all would. We all do, even. They don't owe us anything and, to me, it's perfectly reasonable for them to want a "slice of the pie" for themselves and their families. Which is why I feel empathy for these people. We can't let them all in... But it IS crappy and it IS unfair that we can't.

I guess look at it like the titanic going down. There weren't enough boats. That's the simple maths of it... If they'd let everyone into a boat, they would all have been sunk under the weight, and everyone would have drowned or froze. So, about 1/3 of the people got into the boats, and the rest died. It's not just, right, or fair... It's horrifying... And if you, me or anyone else was one of those people in the water, we'd be desperately trying to get into one of the boats, and not really caring about the risk of pulling it down with us.

And whose fault is it really?

The people in the water? The people in the lifeboats?

NOPE. It's the people who built and controlled the ship that sank.

So you can accept the numbers, you can say that it's just not possible for everyone to be saved, because it's true that it isn't. It would be foolish to try and we'd all go down too. But don't be angry at THEM for trying to save themselves... For not simply lying down and accepting their fate for our benefit. Be sorry that we can't help everyone - and blame the ****ers who built the damn ship.

:clap1::clap1::clap1:

I love the 'Titanic' analogy (Just wish I'd thought of it :laugh::laugh:)

[Ammi]

..can others view that vid...?...sorry it's not showing up for me Josh...

[user104658]

..can others view that vid...?...sorry it's not showing up for me Josh...

Looks like it's been deleted.

[Ammi]

Looks like it's been deleted.

...Government control again eh, eh, EH..:fist:...

[kirklancaster]

...Government control again eh, eh, EH..:fist:...

:laugh: Enough with the jokes already - someone might believe you. :hehe:

[user104658]

...Government control again eh, eh, EH..:fist:...

Well SOMEONE took it down... so... probably. :conf:

[Crimson Dynamo]

yes she reminds me of a 20 year old bloke economic migrant quite a bit

[user104658]

yes she reminds me of a 20 year old bloke economic migrant quite a bit

http://i66.tinypic.com/2h35v5v.jpg

[Crimson Dynamo]

http://i66.tinypic.com/2h35v5v.jpg

:nono:

you get in touble for images and gifs in SD

Im tellin

[user104658]

:nono:

you get in touble for images and gifs in SD

Im tellin

I won't, Niamh will say it's OK. :smug:

[MTVN]

Vid should be showing now, it was just that the code had been posted wrongly in the OP (you only need the part of the URL after the '=' sign, not the whole link)

[lostalex]

i don't see what rita ora could possibly complain about. Just be grateful you didn't wash up on a beach.

[Northern Monkey]

Poor Rita:bawling:

"We were a middle class family"

"My father purchased SOME pubs"

What about the Syrian Refugees

"I can relate"

[kirklancaster]

Poor Rita:bawling:

"We were a middle class family"

"My father purchased SOME pubs"

What about the Syrian Refugees

"I can relate"

:laugh:Yeah - The relevancy is astonishing.

[Johnnyuk123]

I have a question because it seems that most videos i see of these helpless immigrants in desperate need are not so desperate afterall.

Q: Why are most of them in designer trainers and chatting on smart phones?:shrug:

[user104658]

Poor Rita:bawling:

"We were a middle class family"

"My father purchased SOME pubs"

What about the Syrian Refugees

"I can relate"

Yessss I do get the feeling that her family were well off enough to have gone wherever they wanted in the western world... they just happened to choose the UK and gained permanent status by (to be fair, genuinely) claiming asylum as they couldn't continue to live safely where they had come from. However... I don't think they were bundling their few belongings into a box and abandonning home on foot, to cross the sea on a raft.

So I guess she can relate to how it feels to have to leave your home for political reasons... but, not the actual physical struggle.

[Northern Monkey]

Yessss I do get the feeling that her family were well off enough to have gone wherever they wanted in the western world... they just happened to choose the UK and gained permanent status by (to be fair, genuinely) claiming asylum as they couldn't continue to live safely where they had come from. However... I don't think they were bundling their few belongings into a box and abandonning home on foot, to cross the sea on a raft.

So I guess she can relate to how it feels to have to leave your home for political reasons... but, not the actual physical struggle.
Yes exactly.I don't even think she can relate personally to leaving her home country for political reasons as she was only one year old at the time.Saying she can relate to a Syrian refugee is just rubbish imo.She more than likely has sympathy for them like we all do and has heard her parents talk about moving countries.But relating to the Syrian refugees is a stretch.

[Ammi]

i don't see what rita ora could possibly complain about. Just be grateful you didn't wash up on a beach.



Yessss I do get the feeling that her family were well off enough to have gone wherever they wanted in the western world... they just happened to choose the UK and gained permanent status by (to be fair, genuinely) claiming asylum as they couldn't continue to live safely where they had come from. However... I don't think they were bundling their few belongings into a box and abandonning home on foot, to cross the sea on a raft.

So I guess she can relate to how it feels to have to leave your home for political reasons... but, not the actual physical struggle.


..(I still haven't watched the vid and don't have time this morning so I guess that I'm just going on posts as to what she's said../the gist of it...)...

...no, she wasn't washed up on a beach but tragically some immigrants are and they won't ever be able to tell their stories and relate....and the ones who do so brutally feel the physical struggles..?...well I doubt that they will ever be able to tell their stories which they could maybe directly relate, I would say that there would be very few, if any 'Rita Oras' or voices that would be heard there because their struggles will possibly go on through their entire life, in just making a living/earning food for their families even if they are fortunate enough to be accepted in the UK....


...I do think that she should be relevant even with her 'privileges' in life in being born into the family she was born into because surely, she's the closest/type voice that we're probably going to get in terms of directly 'relating'....the babies, small children like her for instance who don't have those privileges atm..in fact what there be any at all even..?..well they're either going to be refused anything that the UK could give them or they'll probably never have the opportunity in life to become a Rita Ora so the chances of there ever being a direct relating thing is quite small....their families will struggle to even get jobs at all...and she's just being dismissed as more irrelevant...I think if she's voicing anything at all to the current influx of immigrants, whatever she has to say is very relevant...(I will watch the vid when I get a chance though ooops..:laugh:..)...there has to be a voice, some kind of voice because the immigrants/asylum seekers will largely be denied one through their struggles in life..we all speak and we can't relate either...

[Ammi]

..also, I've never really understood the 'they come over here, claim benefits etc..'...well what else are many of them they to do..?...they have to establish themselves, have housing, find employments etc...that takes time so what in the meantime...?...some help with that, why should asylum seekers be denied that, where would be an opportunity for any quality of life for them if they were denied that..?...so yes, I do thing that should be forthcoming...all that does anyway is give them existence, it doesn't give them any type of luxury...a basic existence that they're unable to have in their own home country...and I do understand that there is not enough money for everything, for a 'perfect' situation but would there be anyway...would the homeless etc already existing in the UK be helped, would that issue be addressed if we didn't as a country accept and offer a very small help to those who have no life in their own countries..?..I doubt it because those things/many things were never addressed before the crisis immigrant situation....we ourselves..(UK people..)..spend our whole lives achieving very little in terms of money or providing any quality of life we would like to have in our country...and we see opportunities abroad, much cheaper places abroad etc...so many full take advantage of that, to get a better quality etc...?..isn't that taking advantage of what a country could give us, is that also wrong and something to be condemned...?...how do people in those countries feel about us, they've also worked and struggled their whole lives but still have nothing...ex pats may be able to afford basic medical treatment etc that they can't...is that not a similar thing..?...

[user104658]

"Expat" is an interesting term anyway, a very illuminating one. The common use of the word "expatriate" exists purely because affluent white western people find the word "immigrant" to have inherently dirty / inferior connotations, and don't want it to be associated with them.

British expats are migrants like any other... Nothing more, nothing less.

Its an interesting double standard, really, and does highlight some of the inherent prejudices that still exist. Take benefits, asylum, etc. Out of the equation for a second: do people consider an American specialist surgeon working in a UK hospital to be an "immigrant"? Or a German or white French doctor? No... But, do they consider an African or Indian surgeon with an accent, with exactly the same position and qualifications, to be an immigrant? Usually, yes.

This applies right across the qualification / income spectrum. A friend of ours is from the North East USA and has settled here, has a Scottish husband and three Scottish children... She is unqualified and a full-time housewife, her husband works full time but in a relatively low income job, so they get full tax credits etc.

She still has a strong American accent.

Do people think of her as an immigrant? No. Would they if she was African, Asian or (especially) Middle Eastern and had one of "those" accents? Almost certainly, yes. Literally the only thing that stops her from being considered a "scummy immigrant leeching benefits" is the fact that she is a white American.

[Kizzy]

"Expat" is an interesting term anyway, a very illuminating one. The common use of the word "expatriate" exists purely because affluent white western people find the word "immigrant" to have inherently dirty / inferior connotations, and don't want it to be associated with them.

British expats are migrants like any other... Nothing more, nothing less.

Its an interesting double standard, really, and does highlight some of the inherent prejudices that still exist. Take benefits, asylum, etc. Out of the equation for a second: do people consider an American specialist surgeon working in a UK hospital to be an "immigrant"? Or a German or white French doctor? No... But, do they consider an African or Indian surgeon with an accent, with exactly the same position and qualifications, to be an immigrant? Usually, yes.

This applies right across the qualification / income spectrum. A friend of ours is from the North East USA and has settled here, has a Scottish husband and three Scottish children... She is unqualified and a full-time housewife, her husband works full time but in a relatively low income job, so they get full tax credits etc.

She still has a strong American accent.

Do people think of her as an immigrant? No. Would they if she was African, Asian or (especially) Middle Eastern and had one of "those" accents? Almost certainly, yes. Literally the only thing that stops her from being considered a "scummy immigrant leeching benefits" is the fact that she is a white American.

Excellent point TS I agree.