Graves with bodies of hundreds or children found

[jaxie]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-41200949

Absolute wickedness. Why does religion and abuse and mass murder so often go hand in hand? We are often told that you can't blame religion for the actions of some followers so why does this kind of thing seem to happen again and again? It's absolutely toxic.

[Brillopad]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-41200949

Absolute wickedness. Why does religion and abuse and mass murder so often go hand in hand? We are often told that you can't blame religion for the actions of some followers so why does this kind of thing seem to happen again and again? It's absolutely toxic.

Truly shocking. Where is the care for vulnerable children and the general respect for human life from those supposed to care, those 'decent, caring adults' who were entrusted with their care. We often hear about this type of abuse in children's homes, and often involving religion - it is all such a far cry from what religion is supposed to represent. I gave up on religion a long time ago and see it for what it is - a form of control.

Those poor children had such awful, short little lives knowing nothing but suffering. It's things like that that make me wish there was an after-life and they got another chance at it.

[Vicky.]

Bloody disgusting :(

I do think people just use religion as an excuse though, and they would be sick ****s either way. If they didn't have religion to blame stuff on, they would find something else.

[Oliver_W]

Disgusting, such a shame they were discovered after the perps can face justice. Hopefully their God is burning them.

[joeysteele]

Truly shocking. Where is the care for vulnerable children and the general respect for human life from those supposed to care, those 'decent, caring adults' who were entrusted with their care. We often hear about this type of abuse in children's homes, and often involving religion - it is all such a far cry from what religion is supposed to represent. I gave up on religion a long time ago and see it for what it is - a form of control.

Those poor children had such awful, short little lives knowing nothing but suffering. It's things like that that make me wish there was an after-life and they got another chance at it.

Absolutely right all through.I agree with every word there.

This is disgusting but is another in a list of many.
Really horrifying.

Nothing more to add to what you've said.

[smudgie]

1870-1930, approx a third of them under 5 years old.
Only 24 over the age of 15.
All natural causes, all buried in a graveyard.
As it was a children's home, and taking the dates into account and the illnesses they died from I don't find anything surprising.
Does anybody realisically think that back in the day these children would be given individual graves with headstones, that would be lovingly attended with fresh flowers every week.
Unfortunately in times gone by there was nothing unusual in burying hundreds of babies, children and adults in one corner of a graveyard if no family could come forward and pay for a funeral.

[Vicky.]

Seems a lot of kids for such a short timespan to me really...I know the article claims 'most' died of natural causes but something just doesn't sit right about the whole thing :S

[Oliver_W]

Seems a lot of kids for such a short timespan to me really...I know the article claims 'most' died of natural causes but something just doesn't sit right about the whole thing :S

Yeah, if there were say ... 20 kids, I could buy it, back then it's conceivable one or more kid might die of natural causes, but THAT many? No.

[smudgie]

Seems a lot of kids for such a short timespan to me really...I know the article claims 'most' died of natural causes but something just doesn't sit right about the whole thing :S

Child mortality rate was high amongst the poor at the time Vicky.
Pleurisy, pneumonia and TB was rife without the cures and vaccinations we take for granted now.

[joeysteele]

I do understand the diseases issue.
This place was it seems run by Nuns of the order of St Vincent.

We hear a lot about respect and dignity of the individual and in the Catholic faith,last rites with oil and incense plus holy water used at funerals over the coffins.

Mass graves are and should be an affront to that,little wonder the order of Nuns this home was under,does not want to comment.

It's shocking pure and simple in my opinion.

[Cherie]

I do understand the diseases issue.
This place was it seems run by Nuns of the order of St Vincent.

We hear a lot about respect and dignity of the individual and in the Catholic faith,last rites with oil and incense plus holy water used at funerals over the coffins.

Mass grades are and should be an affront to that,little wonder the order of Nuns this home was under,does not want to comment.

It's shocking pure and simple in my opinion.

It was a different time, this was an orpanange in pre benefit times, I don't think it is right but there is nothing to say they weren't buried with the usual rituals just that they were buried in the same plot.. I expect it all came down to finance and saving the money for the living.... not saying abuse didn't go on in these homes because it patently did, and still does today in the care system, but once again everyone is tarred with the same brush, there were alot of decent people who took Holy Orders, just the same as not all teachers are paedos because of a few bad apples etc

[jaxie]

Bloody disgusting :(

I do think people just use religion as an excuse though, and they would be sick ****s either way. If they didn't have religion to blame stuff on, they would find something else.

Yes but the religion enables them by putting them in a position with the power to hurt others and it usually seems to cover up for them too. Religious organisations are definitely complicit. The Catholic Church is complicit.

With regard to the deaths they are hardly going to put down neglect and abuse as the cause but that's a lot of children in unmarked graves.

[Withano]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-41200949

Absolute wickedness. Why does religion and abuse and mass murder so often go hand in hand?

Am I missing something?

[jaxie]

Am I missing something?

No, it often goes hand in hand.

[Withano]

No, it often goes hand in hand.

Hmm, in the context of the article though?

[jaxie]

Hmm, in the context of the article though?

I already answered you, not playing, last response.

[Withano]

:suspect:

[Withano]

I already answered you, not playing, last response.

Well are we supposed to discuss the article or the words in your OP, they're two very different conversations.

[Cherie]

Infant mortality in England and Wales peaked in the 1890s at a tremendously high rate of approximately 150 deaths per 1000 births. These statistics demonstrate that, for both the adults and children that family historians study, the world was a dangerous place! The situation today is, of course, much improved.

[Kizzy]

Infant mortality in England and Wales peaked in the 1890s at a tremendously high rate of approximately 150 deaths per 1000 births. These statistics demonstrate that, for both the adults and children that family historians study, the world was a dangerous place! The situation today is, of course, much improved.

So the deaths at this and other establishments like it can be forgiven for stockpiling the corpses of hundreds of children? The article said most of the bodies were pre 1930...not all.

[Cherie]

So the deaths at this and other establishments like it can be forgiven for stockpiling the corpses of hundreds of children? The article said most of the bodies were pre 1930...not all.

ok what's your point? It was still an era of poverty and early death

[joeysteele]

So the deaths at this and other establishments like it can be forgiven for stockpiling the corpses of hundreds of children? The article said most of the bodies were pre 1930...not all.

One of them at least is from 1961.

Different times does not really wash with me,some Nuns could be really horrible individuals and don't let us get started on child abuse across the board as to both Nuns and Priests.

[Marsh.]

We are often told that you can't blame religion for the actions of some followers so why does this kind of thing seem to happen again and again? It's absolutely toxic.

For the same reason despicable things happen time and time again outside of religion... humanity is despicable.

[joeysteele]

For the same reason despicable things happen time and time again outside of religion... humanity is despicable.

That's a good point too Marsh,as to some of humanity anyway.

However religious orders run services should be a place,I feel should be anyway , where children and even people are kept safe and respected.

Hearing of this and as was shown on the news tonight, the disrespect of unmarked mass graves,should be a disgrace.
Especially when further up from said mass graves are the detailed,tidy and well cleaned headstones of the deceased Nuns.

Religious orders,just about all of them, should show example of decency and respect for individuals, children and adults, especially however any entrusted to their care.

[Marsh.]

That's a good point too Marsh,as to some of humanity anyway.

However religious orders run services should be a place,I feel should be anyway , where children and even people are kept safe and respected.

Hearing of this and as was shown on the news tonight, the disrespect of unmarked mass graves,should be a disgrace.
Especially when further up from said mass graves are the detailed,tidy and well cleaned headstones of the deceased Nuns.

Religious orders,just about all of them, should show example of decency and respect for individuals, children and adults, especially however any entrusted to their care.

Oh, certainly. That goes without saying I think.

I just think it's reductive to reduce it to "Why does this keep on happening in religion?" when things keep on happening in the world, religion or no.

Us humans should be loving and accepting of one another but it eludes us because humanity can be the most dangerous and disgusting thing.

[arista]

EVIL GOD


"Why does religion and abuse and mass murder so often go hand in hand?"


It Closed in 1981
The Nuns graves are nice and Clean??????


EVIL NUNS
FACT

[Niamh.]

There was a similar case here not so long ago

http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/republic-of-ireland/mass-grave-of-796-babies-found-in-septic-tank-at-catholic-orphanage-in-tuam-galway-30327483.html

[Marsh.]

EVIL GOD


But you don't believe in God?
And also chastise anyone who mentions a God with posts about Richard Dawkins book.

[arista]

But you don't believe in God?
And also chastise anyone who mentions a God with posts about Richard Dawkins book.


There is NOT one
its a fable you love


Dawkins could floor you in a Debate
remember that LAD

Feel The Force

[jaxie]

Infant mortality in England and Wales peaked in the 1890s at a tremendously high rate of approximately 150 deaths per 1000 births. These statistics demonstrate that, for both the adults and children that family historians study, the world was a dangerous place! The situation today is, of course, much improved.

It was a time of high infant mortality Cherie but if the graves of the.nuns are well tended and the children thrown in some pit it shows a significant lack of care and value of the existence of all those children and that's pretty vile as is the idea that because parents weren't married children couldn't be baptised. An innocent child is not responsible for any rules their parent breaks. It's clear there was a level of neglect in these institutions and even levels of malnutrition as outlined in the case in Ireland in a report in the 1940s. It doesn't matter what era it was, the nuns had a duty of care and it seems particularly careless in the way these bodies were disposed of.

Many good people may have gone into the church but you don't hear of those people ever rocking the boat and speaking out about these terrible things.

[Niamh.]

It was a time of high infant mortality Cherie but if the graves of the.nuns are well tended and the children thrown in some pit it shows a significant lack of care and value of the existence of all those children and that's pretty vile as is the idea that because parents weren't married children couldn't be baptised. An innocent child is not responsible for any rules their parent breaks. It's clear there was a level of neglect in these institutions and even levels of malnutrition as outlined in the case in Ireland in a report in the 1940s. It doesn't matter what era it was, the nuns had a duty of care and it seems particularly careless in the way these bodies were disposed of.

Many good people may have gone into the church but you don't hear of those people ever rocking the boat and speaking out about these terrible things.

Exactly. Horrific abuses of power and horrific deeds were carried out under the name of the church and when uncovered they try to brush them under the carpet rather than be outraged that such disgusting things were carried out in their name and within their institutions, where they were supposed to be looking after the most vulnerable people in society

[Kizzy]

ok what's your point? It was still an era of poverty and early death

The onus in this case is not that they died but how the bodies were mismanaged isn't it? That was my point.

[Marsh.]

There is NOT one
its a fable you love


Dawkins could floor you in a Debate
remember that LAD

Feel The Force
You don't know anything about me or what I may or may not believe in.

Remember that lad.

I'm merely pointing out your use of the words "evil God" don't line up with the way you talk to anyone who mentioned that word. Nobody mentioned God but you.

[arista]

"Nobody mentioned God but you. "

For Sure I did.
Then You started on me.

Evil Nuns result of Evil God

Do the Math.

[arista]

Marsh I do not need to know
you.
But I do know you follow the Church
Thats your RIGHT /


My RIGHT
is to speak the truth.

Let it all out Young Marsh.

Those Nuns Graves are Clean today
all others are in a mess.
FACT all News and Media


Sign Of The Times

[Marsh.]

Marsh I do not need to know
you.
But I do know you follow the Church
Thats your RIGHT /


My RIGHT
is to speak the truth.

Let it all out Young Marsh.

Those Nuns Graves are Clean today
all others are in a mess.
FACT all News and Media


Sign Of The Times
You do not need to know me... then proceed to think you know something about me which you clearly don't.

:joker:

I do not follow "the church" whatever that means.

[arista]

You do not need to know me... then proceed to think you know something about me which you clearly don't.

:joker:

I do not follow "the church" whatever that means.

Simply your trust in your God.
Which is your Right.

Less are nowdays
so I am with the Winners

[Withano]

Evil Nuns result of Evil God

Do the Math.

Schrödinger's God?

[Beso]

Are we surprised to see the catholic church imbroiled in this.......No.