Alarming rise in young people getting mouth cancer

[Brillopad]

http://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/news/liverpool-news/alarming-rise-young-people-getting-13789504

A worrying development. Mouth and throat cancers would for me be top of the list of cancers I would most fear getting. Throat cancer can be one of the most difficult to treat and mouth cancer can potentially be disfiguring. Opinions!

[smudgie]

Don't smoke, don't drink and use some nice flavoured condoms for a BJ, haven't a clue what a dam is but I can guess it's for a female.

Seriously though, everything we do nowadays is a danger for this that and the other, you have to work out for yourself what risks you are prepared to take and how you can still have a fun life as well.

[Cherie]

Diseases mutate and find a different part of the body to attack, I think we are all slowly being poisoned anyway by the food we eat and drink and the pollution in the atmosphere and in the seas, its just a question of how long an individuals body can hold out, and that is down to genes I think anyway

[Brillopad]

Diseases mutate and find a different part of the body to attack, I think we are all slowly being poisoned anyway by the food we eat and drink and the pollution in the atmosphere and in the seas, its just a question of how long an individuals body can hold out, and that is down to genes I think anyway

Yes I agree genes have a lot to with whether or not people contract certain diseases. I also agree about pollution and think many don’t realise what all the crap we are breathing in on a daily basis is doing to us. We do however have more control over the food we eat etc, but even that is easier said than done.

[user104658]

Given that other factors haven't changed much in recent years (smoking actually on the decline in younger generations)... I can only imagine that the major causes are pollutants and processed foods? Maybe even microwaving, given how many people just ignore the fact that you're supposed to leave food to stand for a minute after cooking in a microwave.

I can't see it being down to oral sex or alcohol, people have been doing those for thousands of years :joker:.

[Marsh.]

Yeah, remember when Michael Douglas blamed cunnilingus for his throat cancer.

Poor Catherine. :(

[DemolitionRed]

The reason we are seeing more people with mouth, throat, and tonsils cancer is the HPV virus. The good news is, out of around 200 strains of HPV, only 12 (thus far) have been shown to cause cancer. The bad news is, 8 out of ten people will of contracted the virus during their lifetime. Many will shake the virus off, others will get a harmless form of HPV that will never lead to cancer and some will be the unlucky ones who get a ‘high-risk’ HPV infection.

I believe every adult should know their HPV status and I say this because most people never have any symptoms until its too late.

[Kizzy]

vaping?

[DemolitionRed]

vaping?

Damn, I hope not. I'm an avid vaper!

[Kizzy]

Damn, I hope not. I'm an avid vaper!

Really? And I thought you were intelligent ;)

[DemolitionRed]

Really? And I thought you were intelligent ;)

Bitch!

[Kizzy]

Bitch!

:joker::joker::joker:

[user104658]

Ewwww vaping is worse than smoking.

[DemolitionRed]

Ewwww vaping is worse than smoking.

Why?

[Marsh.]

Vape will kill more people than cigarettes ever did.

[Beso]

Cocaine maybe.

[user104658]

Why?

I don't know how to describe the thinking in clear terms... so the only way I can put it is this...

Your average run-down post supermarket / online retail British town center used to consist of 3 bookies, 5 charity shops, and 6 or 7 take-aways.

Now they consist of 3 bookies, 5 charity shops, 6 or 7 take aways... and at least 3 grotty vape shops that constantly change location and owner. And they usually have signs that look like they were done by the guy who made the original XBOX logo after he dropped an acid.

Plus they look like sci-fi crackpipes.

[DemolitionRed]

For all those who think vaping is more dangerous or as bad as smoking, read the most up to date research http://scienceblog.cancerresearchuk.org/2017/02/06/new-study-comes-the-closest-yet-to-proving-that-e-cigarettes-arent-as-dangerous-as-smoking/

Tests continue and they may or may not find some problems but so far, its looking very positive.

The difference its made for me is, within six months of vaping I could once again run up steep hills and this year I cycled up and over the col du lautaret which is a hell of a climb and not something I could have done when I smoked cigarettes.

[Wizard.]

Vape will kill more people than cigarettes ever did.

That’s completely not based on any facts.

[Wizard.]

So if I took it up the bum I could get anal cancer? Gays for the HPV vaccine I don’t want to be Jade Goody 2.0!

[user104658]

So if I took it up the bum I could get anal cancer? Gays for the HPV vaccine I don’t want to be Jade Goody 2.0!

Yep, 90%+ of anal cancers are caused by HPV. Men (gay and straight) can also get knob cancer from it.

[Marsh.]

That’s completely not based on any facts.

Well, it's an opinion. But it is based on facts.

It's so new, however, people are looking for any excuse to say they're off the cigs. But have they curbed that addiction to an unhealthy substance? No, they've transferred it to another unhealthy substance which hasn't been tested half as much and the longterm effects aren't yet known. :worry:

[Wizard.]

Well, it's an opinion. But it is based on facts.

It's so new, however, people are looking for any excuse to say they're off the cigs. But have they curbed that addiction to an unhealthy substance? No, they've transferred it to another unhealthy substance which hasn't been tested half as much and the longterm effects aren't yet known. :worry:

Look at it this way, those poor people who die in terrorist attacks have no chance of survival, life taken away in the blink of an eye. So if you're going to get ill at least you have more of a fighting chance than sudden death.

[DemolitionRed]

Well, it's an opinion. But it is based on facts.

It's so new, however, people are looking for any excuse to say they're off the cigs. But have they curbed that addiction to an unhealthy substance? No, they've transferred it to another unhealthy substance which hasn't been tested half as much and the longterm effects aren't yet known. :worry:

Its true that they didn't find out about the harm from tobacco tar for some time but then they weren't in modern times and didn't have the knowledge or facilities they have today. Yes, to an extent its a wait and see but from the massive amount of modern research done so far, things are looking positive.

What kills smokers is tar. Nicotine is addictive and when smoked it can cause a temporary increase in blood pressure and an increase in heart rate, but when nicotine is consumed without smoke, blood pressure and heart rate dont increase. Nicorette also contains a harmless form of nicotine.

Its got nothing to do with saying your off cigarettes. I would love to give up nicotine and good grief, I've tried time and again. I've seen people on oxygen in hospital being wheeled outside for a smoke. Addiction is a horrible thing and not something anyone willingly wants. If I can give up the tar, at least that's something.

[Marsh.]

Its true that they didn't find out about the harm from tobacco tar for some time but then they weren't in modern times and didn't have the knowledge or facilities they have today. Yes, to an extent its a wait and see but from the massive amount of modern research done so far, things are looking positive.

What kills smokers is tar. Nicotine is addictive and when smoked it can cause a temporary increase in blood pressure and an increase in heart rate, but when nicotine is consumed without smoke, blood pressure and heart rate dont increase. Nicorette also contains a harmless form of nicotine.

Its got nothing to do with saying your off cigarettes. I would love to give up nicotine and good grief, I've tried time and again. I've seen people on oxygen in hospital being wheeled outside for a smoke. Addiction is a horrible thing and not something anyone willingly wants. If I can give up the tar, at least that's something.

For some it is. They feel that walking about with an e-cig hanging out of their mouths 24/7 and proudly exclaim "I haven't had a cig in three weeks". Well, good for you, but you've not beaten the craving or the addiction you've transferred it. :laugh: But that's my annoyance with a couple of people I know.

As for the harmful effects, it very much is a waiting game, you're right. There's all kinds of chemicals in both cigs and vape, time will tell us. :worry:

[Marsh.]

Look at it this way, those poor people who die in terrorist attacks have no chance of survival, life taken away in the blink of an eye. So if you're going to get ill at least you have more of a fighting chance than sudden death.

WTF!

:joker::joker::joker:

Can you re-word it because I'm sure I must've misunderstood what you're saying? :laugh:

[user104658]

For some it is. They feel that walking about with an e-cig hanging out of their mouths 24/7 and proudly exclaim "I haven't had a cig in three weeks". Well, good for you, but you've not beaten the craving or the addiction you've transferred it. :laugh: But that's my annoyance with a couple of people I know.

That's been my experience with people who have "switched"... and not only that, but like you said they seem to vape near constantly - far more than they smoked before. I'd say that's one of the main concerns, really... a lot of people, far from quitting, have actually massively INcreased their nicotine intake.

[user104658]

Look at it this way, those poor people who die in terrorist attacks have no chance of survival, life taken away in the blink of an eye. So if you're going to get ill at least you have more of a fighting chance than sudden death.

I would 10x... 1000x... rather die in a bomb blast than of lung cancer. Really really not a nice way to go out. My paternal grandfather died of it... I was only 5 so I don't really remember him... however, I do remember visiting him in the hospital. A living skeleton gasping for breath and covered in tubes is an image that sticks with you :umm2:...

[Marsh.]

Oh so she was making a random comparison between those methods of dying? :umm2:

I'd just say, there's no comparison. I'd rather die instantly in something I had no control over, than slowly from self inflicted damage.

[DemolitionRed]

That's been my experience with people who have "switched"... and not only that, but like you said they seem to vape near constantly - far more than they smoked before. I'd say that's one of the main concerns, really... a lot of people, far from quitting, have actually massively INcreased their nicotine intake.

But zeroed their tar intake... its tar that gives you lung cancer.

[DemolitionRed]

I know someone who's been chewing Nicorette gum for the last three years. He chews it all the time and I find that annoying.

[Kizzy]

But zeroed their tar intake... its tar that gives you lung cancer.

How about propylene glycol, could this be a carcinogen?

[Kizzy]

My issue with vaping has always been where does the oil go? You start off with a bottle full of poisonous viscous fluid that would kill you if you drank it and then you warm it and inhale the vapour .... I'm sorry but there is nobody on this earth that could convince me that is safe.
Yes you puff a lot of it out but some must remain and over time you will have a lovely oily lining in your lungs :/

[user104658]

But zeroed their tar intake... its tar that gives you lung cancer.

Maybe so but it's still not "safe" and is also largely untested in these increased volumes, and that's part of the problem. Nicotine is a drug, it has an effect on the body and mind, it MUST to be chemically addictive. People's nicotine intake for the mostpart has been limited by how much people can physically smoke, and not many people can stomach chain-smoking more than 60 to 80 in a day.

Nicotine intake from vaping is effectively unlimited, and people are back to "the old days" of sitting at their work desk inhaling all day, especially because they think there are no health effects. Yes the cancer risk is (probably) removed or at least seriously lessened but that doesn't mean there won't be other health implications.

The truth is there has been absolutely NO research at all done into the effects of very high nicotine intake daily over the long term. We simply won't know if there are any until 2040 and beyond when people have been vaping for 20+ years. Plus the only sources I've ever seen claiming that there are zero ill health effects originate from vape companies and pro-vape websites which are hardly unbiased sources...

Also as Kizzy has pointed out - there's more in "vape juice" than just the nicotine. It's not literally oil so the "oily lining" isn't likely to happen, I believe the viscosity is down to sugar-based substances, but still... you are inhaling various chemicals several times a day that are supposedly harmless but - again - I very much doubt when they were declared harmless, it was in the context of deliberately heating and inhaling them several times a day over several years...

[Kizzy]

Maybe so but it's still not "safe" and is also largely untested in these increased volumes, and that's part of the problem. Nicotine is a drug, it has an effect on the body and mind, it MUST to be chemically addictive. People's nicotine intake for the mostpart has been limited by how much people can physically smoke, and not many people can stomach chain-smoking more than 60 to 80 in a day.

Nicotine intake from vaping is effectively unlimited, and people are back to "the old days" of sitting at their work desk inhaling all day, especially because they think there are no health effects. Yes the cancer risk is (probably) removed or at least seriously lessened but that doesn't mean there won't be other health implications.

The truth is there has been absolutely NO research at all done into the effects of very high nicotine intake daily over the long term. We simply won't know if there are any until 2040 and beyond when people have been vaping for 20+ years. Plus the only sources I've ever seen claiming that there are zero ill health effects originate from vape companies and pro-vape websites which are hardly unbiased sources...

Also as Kizzy has pointed out - there's more in "vape juice" than just the nicotine. It's not literally oil so the "oily lining" isn't likely to happen, I believe the viscosity is down to sugar-based substances, but still... you are inhaling various chemicals several times a day that are supposedly harmless but - again - I very much doubt when they were declared harmless, it was in the context of deliberately heating and inhaling them several times a day over several years...

Why not? It's an oil isn't it... there's water and a thickening agent and an emulsifier, otherwise they would separate, that's an oil.

[Cherie]

We will look back on vaping the same way we look back at people smoking around children and at work and using it as a fashion accessory in the 50s. It is untested, my friends son vapes and he didn't even smoke cigarettes, so there is no need for him to be vaping apart from trying to look cool

[Kizzy]

I would love to know how many children have been tempted into trying vaping due to the sweetie 'flavours'...

How off putting is it walking past a group of burly good looking men and they all smell of dolly mixtures!... Too weird :/

[user104658]

Why not? It's an oil isn't it... there's water and a thickening agent and an emulsifier, otherwise they would separate, that's an oil.

Well no, oils by definition are hydrophobic (they don't mix with or dissolve in water), not all viscous fluids are oils. It's more of a "syrup", which does actually make a big difference, as the body SHOULD be able to eventually absorb anything that's water-soluble.

[Kizzy]

Well no, oils by definition are hydrophobic (they don't mix with or dissolve in water), not all viscous fluids are oils. It's more of a "syrup", which does actually make a big difference, as the body SHOULD be able to eventually absorb anything that's water-soluble.

Should that be the case that throws up more worrying potential health implications, if propylene glycol aids absorption what else could be absorbed along with it?

[user104658]

Should that be the case that throws up more worrying potential health implications, if propylene glycol aids absorption what else could be absorbed along with it?The only answer really is... Maybe nothing, maybe a heap of nasty crap, probably somewhere in between. But I guess that's the real issue... Massive lack of data.

[DemolitionRed]

Well I just went out and bought myself some rolling tobacco, some rizlers, filters and a lighter.

**** it.

[Kizzy]

Well I just went out and bought myself some rolling tobacco, some rizlers, filters and a lighter.

**** it.

What!? God I feel awful now!!

Throw them away immediately! :(

[user104658]

Well I just went out and bought myself some rolling tobacco, some rizlers, filters and a lighter.

**** it.

Jesus christ DR... first e-cigs, now rollies? I'm starting to think you're a 20 year old Uni student as a secret :suspect:. Next you'll be telling us you collect the butts out of ashtrays to reroll!

[DemolitionRed]

What!? God I feel awful now!!

Throw them away immediately! :(

Every time I vape outside the house, someone is trying to lecture me about the harm of vaping. People may not like it when you smoke but at least they accept that's what you do. Thing is, I love smoking. I wish I didn't but I do.

Don't feel awful, it feels amazing!

[user104658]

Hmm. See, I think that's the thing... when people want to kick it, they'll kick it in my experience. Plus it might be an evil ploy! Get everyone vaping, get them hooked on higher doses of nicotine, then ban them so people have to buy LOADS of cigarettes and the government creams off all of that lovely tobacco tax. Hunt probably invented them.

[DemolitionRed]

Jesus christ DR... first e-cigs, now rollies? I'm starting to think you're a 20 year old Uni student as a secret :suspect:. Next you'll be telling us you collect the butts out of ashtrays to reroll!

Apart from my pregnancies where I found tobacco repulsive, I've been addicted to tobacco for years TS. Smoking came before vaping and whilst vaping doesn't have that cutting edge for me it was better than nothing.

Have you ever smoked? When my husband gave up he just went cold turkey and has never (to my knowledge) touched one since. When I tried that I was climbing the walls. I became bad-tempered, unreasonable and burst into tears at the slightest thing. I couldn't concentrate on anything and all I wanted to do was eat mountains of sugary things.

I tried Nicorette patches but became addicted to them and ended up smoking and using patches at the same time which is dangerous. I've tried prescription meds and was told that after about two weeks I'd just go off tobacco but that didn't happen. I tried vaping and found that was something I could handle but even with vaping, there isn't a day goes by when I don't think about smoking a cigarette. When you vape you get continuously hounded by people wanting to tell you that its more dangerous than smoking. I hate being an addict and I'd love to find a cure but it is what it is.

Oh and research findings show that some people can easily quit smoking whilst others find it almost impossible. Its the same with heroine.

[Niamh.]

I feel your pain DR

[Marsh.]

We will look back on vaping the same way we look back at people smoking around children and at work and using it as a fashion accessory in the 50s. It is untested, my friends son vapes and he didn't even smoke cigarettes, so there is no need for him to be vaping apart from trying to look cool
This. And it's undoing all of the work that went into banning the advertisement of cigs, with all these child friendly colours and flavours.

[user104658]

Apart from my pregnancies where I found tobacco repulsive, I've been addicted to tobacco for years TS. Smoking came before vaping and whilst vaping doesn't have that cutting edge for me it was better than nothing.

Have you ever smoked? When my husband gave up he just went cold turkey and has never (to my knowledge) touched one since. When I tried that I was climbing the walls. I became bad-tempered, unreasonable and burst into tears at the slightest thing. I couldn't concentrate on anything and all I wanted to do was eat mountains of sugary things.

I tried Nicorette patches but became addicted to them and ended up smoking and using patches at the same time which is dangerous. I've tried prescription meds and was told that after about two weeks I'd just go off tobacco but that didn't happen. I tried vaping and found that was something I could handle but even with vaping, there isn't a day goes by when I don't think about smoking a cigarette. When you vape you get continuously hounded by people wanting to tell you that its more dangerous than smoking. I hate being an addict and I'd love to find a cure but it is what it is.

Oh and research findings show that some people can easily quit smoking whilst others find it almost impossible. Its the same with heroine.


I was a social smoker from 15 - 23, only ever while on a night out, the closest I came to being "a smoker" I guess would have been first year Uni when we were out a lot and I was getting through 60 - 80 a week (smoking ban only came in during my 2nd year). I've never been physically addicted, just enjoyed them, so I can see what you mean about it being different for different people. A flatmate of mine at the time got together with a smoker, she started casually smoking a couple because he smoked, and she was on 10 a day (and furious about it) inside 6 months.

My dad though, started smoking when he was a kid (as in... 8 or 9) and didn't quit until the year after my daughter was born - so about 6/7 years ago. At his peak he was chaining all evening and smoking easily 60 a day... that was when he was living alone and his flat was utterly caked in yellow gunk :umm2:. He had tried quitting several times when I was growing up, finally did it because wanted to retire and smoking was costing him nearly £8000 a year... truth is, those earlier times he tried giving it up, he was doing it for appearances / because other people wanted him to so it was never going to work. As soon as HE really wanted to quit, he just quit. Though I think he used some weird drug thing that apparently works for some people but is horrendous for others...

Also, funny you should say about the sugar... during the 6 months or so after quitting he gained about 2 stones because he was absolutely HAMMERING back Haribo Starmix. Like constantly :joker:. He drove the van when we moved from England to Scotland... a 4 hour drive and he had to stop 3 times for more ****ing jelly sweets :umm2:.

[user104658]

This. And it's undoing all of the work that went into banning the advertisement of cigs, with all these child friendly colours and flavours.

It gets worse... y'know when they moved most of the post offices into "other stores" as a counter? Well, the one we bank at (work) is right across the street... as of a couple of weeks ago, is a postoffice / vape store??? :facepalm: I tell you, in the good old days ... ... ...

We'll end up like France, where I was once sat in a bar... and suddenly realised that it was a bar, bookies, off-licence and tobacco store all in one :joker:. Ew.

Edited to add: They also sold breads and pastries :hee:

[Cherie]

Apart from my pregnancies where I found tobacco repulsive, I've been addicted to tobacco for years TS. Smoking came before vaping and whilst vaping doesn't have that cutting edge for me it was better than nothing.

Have you ever smoked? When my husband gave up he just went cold turkey and has never (to my knowledge) touched one since. When I tried that I was climbing the walls. I became bad-tempered, unreasonable and burst into tears at the slightest thing. I couldn't concentrate on anything and all I wanted to do was eat mountains of sugary things.

I tried Nicorette patches but became addicted to them and ended up smoking and using patches at the same time which is dangerous. I've tried prescription meds and was told that after about two weeks I'd just go off tobacco but that didn't happen. I tried vaping and found that was something I could handle but even with vaping, there isn't a day goes by when I don't think about smoking a cigarette. When you vape you get continuously hounded by people wanting to tell you that its more dangerous than smoking. I hate being an addict and I'd love to find a cure but it is what it is.

Oh and research findings show that some people can easily quit smoking whilst others find it almost impossible. Its the same with heroine.


Do you really? I think most people think vaping is completely innocuous which is why it has become so popular. You need to go cold turkey it is the only way, my sister in law was a 30 a day smoker, had one when she got out of bed, when cold turkey, she put on a bit of weight but got rid of that a year later. I used to social smoke, Mr C got me got give up as his mother died from lung cancer

[Marsh.]

It gets worse... y'know when they moved most of the post offices into "other stores" as a counter? Well, the one we bank at (work) is right across the street... as of a couple of weeks ago, is a postoffice / vape store??? :facepalm: I tell you, in the good old days ... ... ...

We'll end up like France, where I was once sat in a bar... and suddenly realised that it was a bar, bookies, off-licence and tobacco store all in one :joker:. Ew.

Edited to add: They also sold breads and pastries :hee:
:joker:

[Beso]

Nae bridies?

[user104658]

Do you really? I think most people think vaping is completely innocuous which is why it has become so popular. You need to go cold turkey it is the only way, my sister in law was a 30 a day smoker, had one when she got out of bed, when cold turkey, she put on a bit of weight but got rid of that a year later. I used to social smoke, Mr C got me got give up as his mother died from lung cancerPutting on weight is a common one I think, especially for heavy smokers because it kills your sense of taste as well as suppressing appetite. My dad smoked basically his entire life - when he finally quit he commented that he'd actually gone through life having no idea what most things really taste like. Makes everything that bit more tempting I guess!

[Vicky.]

I would love to know how many children have been tempted into trying vaping due to the sweetie 'flavours'...

How off putting is it walking past a group of burly good looking men and they all smell of dolly mixtures!... Too weird :/

I imagine a hell of a lot more than the amount of kids who started smoking due to pretty boxes, which we are apparently meant to believe happened a lot

I mix smoking and vaping now. And also my liquid is 'blue slush' which so many can;t get their heads round as they say how on earth can that help you stop craving cigs. Not sure how, but it does :laugh:

Our stop smoking clinic assures people that vaping is safe for those around you. Ie. Its fine to do around kids. But the same was said about smoking normally, so quite how they can be so 'sure' is beyond me and you would think they would have learnt about giving out false info