Anyone know if this is true or fake

[Oliver_W]

I've not chased this up for a source but I heard somewhere that now, children are more likely to abused in schools than they are churches...

[Kizzy]

Did you read that in the catholic herald? :hehe:

[user104658]

I've not chased this up for a source but I heard somewhere that now, children are more likely to abused in schools than they are churches...

That's because most people don't go to Chrurch any more, surely.

[Kizzy]

I've heard that more football supporters are punched at football matches than in tescos :/

[Vicky.]

Do you not think though (and I don't know enough about this case to say it with conviction) that some of the reason behind the news black out during the trial, is to protect the victims and him doing this could breach their right to anonymity? The courts will deal with the perpetrators, the victims have to live with it forever which is hard enough without the world knowing it was them.

Had I thought the messenger was doing this for the "right" reasons I would have sympathy but as it is, he is desperate for fame and inciting racial conflict and couldn't give a toss about the victims in this case

Yeah, agree with this tbh.

My husband was all up in arms with this story a few days back, about how poor Tommy was victimized. I knew it would not be the police randomly arresting him but never thought to look into it, then found this thread :rolleyes:

[Oliver_W]

That's because most people don't go to Chrurch any more, surely.

I'm pretty sure it's proportionate, but I'll need to find where I heard it, and then follow up their source too.

[Crimson Dynamo]

I've not chased this up for a source but I heard somewhere that now, children are more likely to abused in schools than they are churches...

the church still abuse every child who has the misfortune to enter its doors

by lying to them by paid liars in weird outfits

[Kizzy]

It still smacks as odd to me, there are always reporters at high profile cases seeing people coming and going, they're not bothered then about who sees the witnesses, victims or jury... it doesn't explain well enough the media blackout.

[Niamh.]

That's because most people don't go to Chrurch any more, surely.

They certainly don't leave their kids around priests like they used to, that's for sure

[Tom4784]

A simply brilliant and pertinent video which reiterates what a lot of us have been saying about 'Political Correctness and the cowardice of those in Authority in this Country in abandoning their duties to its people because of it.

I had said in a post - now removed - that when the message is true and important, then the motives of the messenger are secondary, and this is even truer when that messenger is virtually the only one delivering the message because COWARDS in authority have prohibited others from delivering it.

And any suggestions that Robinson by his actions was imperilling the trial or likely to prejudice its outcome are pure bollox - in my opinion.

He was arrested and imprisoned by the Authorities for DARING to challenge their cowardly 'News Blackout'.

People in today's world place too much weight on their opinions and feelings above the cold hard facts and this post is an excellent example of that.

Your opinion on the facts is utterly irrelevant because they can never override the cold hard facts that Johnny Robinson's livestream was in breach of the law, it was at risk of influencing the Jury and risking the justice for and anonymity of the victims.

Trying to twist it into an issue of freedom of speech is just misrepresenting it to suit your own agenda.

Juries can only be influenced by the facts of the case and cases involving minors and confidential victims are reported in a different fashion to normal cases, reports must just report the facts without bias or risking anonymity of the victims. Robinson's livestream was in breach of all of that.

This is not a political issue no matter how much his fans try to twist it into one. He ****ed up, had a history of criminal activity and now he's paying for it.

[Tom4784]

It still smacks as odd to me, there are always reporters at high profile cases seeing people coming and going, they're not bothered then about who sees the witnesses, victims or jury... it doesn't explain well enough the media blackout.

Again, that's only when the victims aren't children or confidential, look at high profile cases involving children and you'll see similar approaches, you won't get a lot of live footage or livestreams because they can't be edited before airing to protect the victims and such.

[Cherie]

They certainly don't leave their kids around priests like they used to, that's for sure

I don't know how that is an acceptable thing to say as you are tarring every priest with the same brush, we all know every muslim isn't a terrorist but every priest is a paedo? :think:

[Cherie]

That's because most people don't go to Chrurch any more, surely.

it is appropriate to call all teachers paedos?

[Kizzy]

Fair enough, if that's all it is having that explained in laymans terms would have prevented much of this public backlash at what on face value looks like a cover up.

[Oliver_W]

If the reporting of Robinson's arrest would have said "his livestream could have exposed the underage victims' identities" I doubt anyone would have complained. To spout BS like "breaching the peace" does just give fuel to conspiracy nuts.

[Kizzy]

it is appropriate to call all teachers paedos?

Nobody did that, it's a fact that more children go to school (in the UK for instance) than go to church.
Therefore statistically the potential for abuse is greater at school than in church... whether the stats are proportionately representative however is another matter.

[Tom4784]

Meh, the facts were there for anyone who bothered to look into it, it's just indicative of today's world that nobody bothered to fact check before they demanded things based on what they wanted to hear and not the facts.

Don't expect other people to do your fact checking for you. It's down to you to figure out the truth from the lie.

[Kizzy]

Meh, the facts were there for anyone who bothered to look into it, it's just indicative of today's world that nobody bothered to fact check and demanded things based on what they wanted to hear and not the facts.

Don't expect other people to do your fact checking for you. It's down to you to figure out the truth from the lie.

Maybe, but they made a martyr out of robinson by not highlighting the issue, having it appear a blackout is playing into the narrative that there is some establishment level subterfuge even if it is common practice.

[Cherie]

Nobody did that, it's a fact that more children go to school (in the UK for instance) than go to church.
Therefore statistically the potential for abuse is greater at school than in church... whether the stats are proportionately representative however is another matter.

and that is exactly my point, yes there are paedo priests just like there are paedo carers, politicians etc but no body at all finds it acceptable to blanket all those professions with the paedo tag like they do in with priests, you wouldn't accept it if (quite rightly) if I said all Asian males were paedos so why is is acceptable to blanket all priests with this term?

[Tom4784]

Maybe, but they made a martyr out of robinson by not highlighting the issue, having it appear a blackout is playing into the narrative that there is some establishment level subterfuge even if it is common practice.

People believe what they want to believe regardless of the facts. The facts were out there but why bother looking when we've got fake news and petitions based on fallacies to tell us what to think?

[bots]

If the reporting of Robinson's arrest would have said "his livestream could have exposed the underage victims' identities" I doubt anyone would have complained. To spout BS like "breaching the peace" does just give fuel to conspiracy nuts.

Breaching the peace is just an easy catchall to arrest someone initially. It's not unusual to arrest people for minor offenses and then upgrade the severity later

Contempt of court is a pretty serious offence

[Alf]

People believe what they want to believe regardless of the facts. The facts were out there but why bother looking when we've got fake news and petitions based on fallacies to tell us what to think?I'd like to see the facts, can you post them for us please?

[user104658]

EDIT: Somehow quoted completely the wrong post :think:

If the reporting of Robinson's arrest would have said "his livestream could have exposed the underage victims' identities" I doubt anyone would have complained. To spout BS like "breaching the peace" does just give fuel to conspiracy nuts.


Surely the likely series of events is this, though;

1) Someone (yes, someone who probably doesn't like him) called the police saying he was causing trouble.

2) Police turn up, ask him to go, he won't, and is arrested for Breach of the Peace with no intention of him being charged, just removed an then released.

3) After he is arrested, it THEN comes to light that he was also in contempt of court - the arresting officers wouldn't have known this at the time of arrest, and that's why it's not what he was initially arrested for.

4) He is then held and charged with contempt of court (he was NEVER going to be charged with Breach of the Peace, he was going to be taken to the station, slapped on the wrist and sent home, as I'm sure he has been many times)



It's all been twisted into some sort of tinfoil hat conspiracy scenario when really it's nothing of the sort. If it had just been BOTP he would have walked away without a charge. If he hadn't already been on probation the contempt of court charge would have come to nothing. It's the combination of the two that has lead to him being slapped with a sentence... nothing more dramatic than that.

#winsplained
#bulletpoints
#ts2019

[Tom4784]

I'd like to see the facts, can you post them for us please?

Sure, just click here (https://www.google.com/)

[Brillopad]

and that is exactly my point, yes there are paedo priests just like there are paedo carers, politicians etc but no body at all finds it acceptable to blanket all those professions with the paedo tag like they do in with priests, you wouldn't accept it if (quite rightly) if I said all Asian males were paedos so why is is acceptable to blanket all priests with this term?

Very true. one rule ...

[Niamh.]

I don't know how that is an acceptable thing to say as you are tarring every priest with the same brush, we all know every muslim isn't a terrorist but every priest is a paedo? :think:

Its a fact though, the last time I was at mass to do with a school event, the priest actually said something along the lines of new child protection laws to do with the kids making their communion meant that they weren't allowed to be in charge of kids. I never said every priest was a paedo btw

[bots]

Sure, just click here (https://www.google.com/)

i think this is a better link http://lmgtfy.com/?q=the+facts

[Brillopad]

Meh, the facts were there for anyone who bothered to look into it, it's just indicative of today's world that nobody bothered to fact check before they demanded things based on what they wanted to hear and not the facts.

Don't expect other people to do your fact checking for you. It's down to you to figure out the truth from the lie.

Oh how your stance has changed. You were always the one demanding proof and people had to tell you to go look for it yourself if you wanted proof. Now you are the one telling others to go look for it. Hilarious.

[Tom4784]

Oh how your stance has changed. You were always the one demanding proof and people had to tell you to go look for it yourself if you wanted proof. Now you are the one telling others to go look for it. Hilarious.

It's called development, try it some time.

[Niamh.]

I don't know how that is an acceptable thing to say as you are tarring every priest with the same brush, we all know every muslim isn't a terrorist but every priest is a paedo? :think:

Also, to add, comparing like with like would be saying "all Catholics are paedos" which no one is saying. The Church as an institution actively covered up and moved paedophile priests on, people have every right to be wary of them because no they're not all paedos but you can't rely on the non paedophile priests not to cover for them either. And tbh with all the disgusting **** that's comes out about what the church were responsible for in Ireland I'm pretty surprised you're so defensive of them

[The Slim Reaper]

all catholics are paedos.

[Cherie]

Its a fact though, the last time I was at mass to do with a school event, the priest actually said something along the lines of new child protection laws to do with the kids making their communion meant that they weren't allowed to be in charge of kids. I never said every priest was a paedo btw


Child protection laws apply to anyone coming into contact with childen

Football coaches
Scouts
Teaching staff etc

you might not have but it has been acceptable on this forum for quite a while to call all priests paedos..

I'm not even that much of a catholic but the double standards get right on my ..

[Niamh.]

Child protection laws apply to anyone coming into contact with childen

Football coaches
Scouts
Teaching staff etc

you might not have but it has been acceptable on this forum for quite a while to call all priests paedos..

I'm not even that much of a catholic but the double standards get right on my ..

Who said all priests are paedos though?

[Cherie]

Also, to add, comparing like with like would be saying "all Catholics are paedos" which no one is saying. The Church as an institution actively covered up and moved paedophile priests on, people have every right to be wary of them because no they're not all paedos but you can't rely on the non paedophile priests not to cover for them either. And tbh with all the disgusting **** that's comes out about what the church were responsible for in Ireland I'm pretty surprised you're so defensive of them

The same can be said for football clubs, Scout camps, boarding schools, lots of people knew dodgy things went on and are still going on and turned a blind eye, I'm defending all the decent priests and nuns as there were many who are now tarnished by awful things that happened, they are a soft target now as Christianity is on the wane, shame the same thing can't be said for Islam

[Niamh.]

The same can be said for football clubs, Scout camps, boarding schools, lots of people knew dodgy things went on and are still going on and turned a blind eye, I'm defending all the decent priests and nuns as there were many who are now tarnished by awful things that happened, they are a soft target now as Christianity is on the wane, shame the same thing can't be said for Islam

You're absolutely crazy if you're telling me that Football clubs and Scout clubs were responsible for anywhere near the levels of monstrosity that the catholic Church was in ireland and I don't just mean Pedophilia

[Cherie]

You're absolutely crazy if you're telling me that Football clubs and Scout clubs were responsible for anywhere near the levels of monstrosity that the catholic Church was in ireland and I don't just mean Pedophilia


oh okay so paedophile football coaches are fine because there weren't so may of them, I didn't realise you had to reach a percentage so they can all be tarred with the same brush

[Niamh.]

oh okay so paedophile football coaches are fine because there weren't so may of them, I didn't realise you had to reach a percentage so they can all be tarred with the same brush

Yeah that's what i just said there good quoting Cherie, paedophile football coaches are amazing :worry:

[Tom4784]

I think the difference between the muslim gangs and the peadophillia in the church was that the latter happened within the institution of the church itself and the priests abused their position and the teachings to commit their crimes. and there was a lot of coverups to protect them.

I think anybody that would focus on these gangs' religion as a reason to cover it up or emphasise their crimes are both wrong. It's two sides of the same coin. You're not gonna prevent gangs by just focusing on one demographic since it's not just muslims and you aren't going to change anything by ignoring the gangs because of the religion of it's members. At the end of the day, they are peadophiles and rapists and it's that element that should be focused on above all.

[Oliver_W]

The BBC can also be included in former "paedo institutions", according to some. These days they take steps to ensure it's almost impossible for another Saville to occur. tbh I wonder if other places which involve contact with children should have similar measures.
During the summer I work as a child protection chaperone for productions at the BBC, but they're used all year round. Children aren't allowed to be in contact with anyone -directors, presenters, other actors- without being in eyesight of a chaperone. The BBC nowdays hire more than the minimum ratios, and up to a higher age (if that makes sense?) .

[Parmy]

Sure, just click here (https://www.google.com/)

Full off the fake news you keep banging on about...any chance of the ones you found?

[Parmy]

I think the difference between the muslim gangs and the peadophillia in the church was that the latter happened within the institution of the church itself and the priests abused their position and the teachings to commit their crimes. and there was a lot of coverups to protect them.

I think anybody that would focus on these gangs' religion as a reason to cover it up or emphasise their crimes are both wrong. It's two sides of the same coin. You're not gonna prevent gangs by just focusing on one demographic since it's not just muslims and you aren't going to change anything by ignoring the gangs because of the religion of it's members. At the end of the day, they are peadophiles and rapists and it's that element that should be focused on above all.

Well thats true, but im calling them muslim rapists cause they single out white girls to abuse and brand with the letter m...

[Tom4784]

Full off the fake news you keep banging on about...any chance of the ones you found?

I made a whole point about being responsible for your own fact checking, Do you think I'm gonna do your fact checking for you because you want to believe the lies?

[Parmy]

Tommy has and will handle anything the prison can throw at him

[Withano]

Tommy has and will handle anything the prison can throw at him

What have you based this on?

He seems fragile and weak to me

[Parmy]

I made a whole point about being responsible for your own fact checking, Do you think I'm gonna do your fact checking for you because you want to believe the lies?

What lies? What point are you claiming to have proven?

Its obvious to me that he breached his suspended sentence so must then serve the sentence he originally got..does that make him the coward you describe??...no, it makes him brave enough to stand up for what he believes no matter the consequences to himself or his family....not cowardly at all, unless of course you have proof that you wont post to prove that he is a coward...

[Parmy]

What have you based this on?

He seems fragile and weak to me

Plenty videos showing him handle himself in prison....but its not my job to dig them up for you.

[The Slim Reaper]

What have you based this on?

He seems fragile and weak to me

He's a propa ard' geezer who don't take no messin from the mullahs.

[Withano]

Plenty videos showing him handle himself in prison....but its not my job to dig them up for you.

Just looked and the opposite is true. But its not my job to dig those up for you.

[Parmy]

The proof then is in the fact he has walked out of jail unscathed in the past.

[Withano]

The proof then is in the fact he has walked out of jail unscathed in the past.

Naa, he was super scathed

[Tom4784]

What lies? What point are you claiming to have proven?

Its obvious to me that he breached his suspended sentence so must then serve the sentence he originally got..does that make him the coward you describe??...no, it makes him brave enough to stand up for what he believes no matter the consequences to himself or his family....not cowardly at all, unless of course you have proof that you wont post to prove that he is a coward...

You seem to be arguing with an imaginary post instead of the one I wrote?

It isn't brave to try to ruin a trial and deprive the victims of their justice and anonymity through a stupid livestream in which he spouts nothing but platitudes and common knowledge.

As for your last sentence, why are you struggling so much with the idea of doing your own fact checking?

[AnnieK]

You seem to be arguing with an imaginary post instead of the one I wrote?

It isn't brave to try to ruin a trial and deprive the victims of their justice and anonymity through a stupid livestream in which he spouts nothing but platitudes and common knowledge.

As for your last sentence, why are you struggling so much with the idea of doing your own fact checking?

The bit in bold is the crux of it for me....no thoughts for the victims at all.

[Crimson Dynamo]

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/newpix/2018/05/31/09/4CC5F23900000578-5790283-Samantha_Markle_accused_the_UK_of_being_in_the_dar k_ages_and_sha-m-14_1527756597608.jpg

The German PM's sister now calling for justice for Tommy - support is building all over the world

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/newpix/2018/05/31/09/4CC5F23900000578-5790283-Samantha_Markle_accused_the_UK_of_being_in_the_dar k_ages_and_sha-m-14_1527756597608.jpg

[user104658]

The German PM's sister now calling for justice for Tommy - support is building all over the world



:think: ...

... Anyway LT, why do you want him freed? He is a violent criminal and a danger to society.

[Crimson Dynamo]

:think: ...

... Anyway LT, why do you want him freed? He is a violent criminal and a danger to society.

I am not Merkle's sister and have not said I want him freed?

[user104658]

I am not Merkle's sister and have not said I want him freed?

Neither is she :think: and you strongly implied it by stating that you found his arrest to be "disgraceful".

[Crimson Dynamo]

Neither is she :think: and you strongly implied it by stating that you found his arrest to be "disgraceful".

Support is growing from some big hitters

comedian Roseanne Barr retweeted a post invoking the Magna Carta to show “how far our cousins across the pond have fallen”.

Geert Wilders and his colleagues in the Dutch Party for Freedom, or PVV, called it a “violation of freedom of speech”, and comedian Roseanne Barr retweeted a post invoking the Magna Carta to show “how far our cousins across the pond have fallen”.

Even Donald Trump Jr, son of the US president, warned his 2.84m followers to not let anything similar happen in America, and called the arrest “reason #1776 for the original Brexit”.


https://www.ft.com/content/f8f2b174-6409-11e8-90c2-9563a0613e56

[user104658]

It's strange I guess because the people he's getting support from seem to have nothing in common.

[GiRTh]

Support is growing from some big hitters



Even Donald Trump Jr, son of the US president, .

[Crimson Dynamo]

grt-c5ka_1Y

[Kazanne]

grt-c5ka_1Y

I watched this yesterday,very interesting LT.:wavey:

[user104658]

"He was speaking his views when he was arrested and convicted immediately and sentenced to a year in prison... am I mischaracterising that?"

"You're not at all, that's exactly what happened..."



...err no Katie he had already been convicted of a crime and was on a suspended sentence for which he was on parole, which he violated, converting his suspended sentence into an active prison sentence.

It's just straight up lies at this point. I wonder if she knows that, or she's just ignorant of the facts?

[Crimson Dynamo]

"He was speaking his views when he was arrested and convicted immediately and sentenced to a year in prison... am I mischaracterising that?"

"You're not at all, that's exactly what happened..."



...err no Katie he had already been convicted of a crime and was on a suspended sentence for which he was on parole, which he violated, converting his suspended sentence into an active prison sentence.

It's just straight up lies at this point. I wonder if she knows that, or she's just ignorant of the facts?

what part of what she said is not true, bearing in mind she and the interviewer are familiar with his past?

[user104658]

what part of what she said is not true, bearing in mind she and the interviewer are familiar with his past?

The American reporter is clearly not aware that him going to prison is actually to serve a suspended sentence that he received for another incident. He asks Katie if he "has it right" that Tommy was arrested for what happened at the court and "sentenced to a year in prison" straight away. She replies that he is not wrong and that that is "exactly what happened".

It is not exactly what happened.

Like I said; I wonder if she's lying or just ignorant of the suspended sentence. I suspect the former, the interview is full of hyperbole about the "country being on a knife edge" and that "everyone feels like it's us against the government!" and the reason she goes on US news is because she knows they'll believe her because A) they like drama and B) they aren't in the UK to see that no one is "on a knife edge" and the vast majority of people don't even know that Tommy Robinson is in jail... let alone care :idc:.

[The Slim Reaper]

what part of what she said is not true, bearing in mind she and the interviewer are familiar with his past?

it's supposed to be a journalistic interview, and his American viewers are already the most mislead, and least informed viewers in the country. To not provide any context in this interview is a terrible, yet completely predictable fox news con job. It's actually made far worse by the fact that there is no way the audience can understand all the nuance involved in the case.

[Vicky.]

A lot of people seem to be purposely ignoring that he was on a suspended sentence. My ****ing husband signed some petition to free him last night, and also shared on facebook where many of my friends said they had signed, for ****s sake..it annoyed me much more than it should have but I cannot be arsed arguing with them all. Apparently its horrendous in this one case that the law was upheld.

[Parmy]

A lot of people seem to be purposely ignoring that he was on a suspended sentence. My ****ing husband signed some petition to free him last night, and also shared on facebook where many of my friends said they had signed, for ****s sake..it annoyed me much more than it should have but I cannot be arsed arguing with them all. Apparently its horrendous in this one case that the law was upheld.

Theres another march in london either this weekend or next...im going to champion free speech.

[Parmy]

You seem to be arguing with an imaginary post instead of the one I wrote?

It isn't brave to try to ruin a trial and deprive the victims of their justice and anonymity through a stupid livestream in which he spouts nothing but platitudes and common knowledge.

As for your last sentence, why are you struggling so much with the idea of doing your own fact checking?


Only he wasnt TRYING to ruin the trial, he was trying to highlight it after an unfair news blackout.

Whats to check? Nothing, even i know why he was jailed....

[user104658]

A lot of people seem to be purposely ignoring that he was on a suspended sentence. My ****ing husband signed some petition to free him last night, and also shared on facebook where many of my friends said they had signed, for ****s sake..it annoyed me much more than it should have but I cannot be arsed arguing with them all. Apparently its horrendous in this one case that the law was upheld.

TBQFH sometimes people just like having a bandwagon to jump on. Assuming he isn't released (which he now shouldn't be under any circumstances... the implications of social media / public pressure successfully altering a court decision would be absolutely massive and horrendous), give it a couple of weeks and people who are indignant about this today will have forgotten that they care.

[Crimson Dynamo]

TBQFH sometimes people just like having a bandwagon to jump on. Assuming he isn't released (which he now shouldn't be under any circumstances... the implications of social media / public pressure successfully altering a court decision would be absolutely massive and horrendous), give it a couple of weeks and people who are indignant about this today will have forgotten that they care.

Again TS you are fortune telling based on nothing more than your own prejudice

[user104658]

Again TS you are fortune telling based on nothing more than your own prejudice

I'm making a prediction, yes, and we'll see in a few weeks if it's accurate. I predict that - assuming he is still in jail - people will have forgotten about it and moved onto the next drama. Do you disagree? I mean, we can just wait and see I suppose.

[Withano]

Right wing protesters got violent :rolleyes:

https://metro.co.uk/2018/06/09/tommy-robinson-supporters-hurl-missiles-police-far-right-rally-turns-violent-7618875/

[arista]

https://metrouk2.files.wordpress.com/2018/06/sei_16207044-e1528567903138.jpg?w=768&h=504&crop=1
Yes Withano
its not good.

[Parmy]

How do you know they are right wing..?

For all you know they may not have any political leanings.

[user104658]

For all you know they may not have any political leanings.

Indeed. Bigoted chav anarchists, but I doubt they have any real economic ideology of any sort making them neither right nor left.

[Oliver_W]

Groups like BLM and AntiFa are also mindless violent thugs, would you object to them being called left wing?

I lean right politically but I probably have very few ideals in common with those Tommy protestors, and I imagine (hope!) that your average leftie has little in common with the violent "activists" from BLM or AntiFa. But in their own braindead way, they consider themselves right or left.

[Withano]

Groups like BLM and AntiFa are also mindless violent thugs, would you object to them being called left wing?

I lean right politically but I probably have very few ideals in common with those Tommy protestors, and I imagine (hope!) that your average leftie has little in common with the violent "activists" from BLM or AntiFa. But in their own braindead way, they consider themselves right or left.

Well, not all right wing people are the exact same and not all left wing people are the exact same.

These protesters are right wing and violent, whereas you're just right wing

I don't see the issue really.

[user104658]

I dunno. I still think they're mainly just stupid chavvy thugs. They'd go to war over half a snickers bar.