View Full Version : SNP Nicola Sturgeon To Resign
arista
15-02-2023, 09:56 AM
UTTER BLISS
After 8 years in Power
yep, she was probably told to go
arista
15-02-2023, 10:00 AM
[Nicola Sturgeon is to resign
as Scotland's first minister.
The Scottish National Party leader
is expected to make the announcement
at a hastily-arranged news conference in Edinburgh.
It is not clear exactly when she will leave office.]
BBC Scotland Reporter
Oliver_W
15-02-2023, 10:01 AM
Not surprising tbh
Crimson Dynamo
15-02-2023, 10:05 AM
Get her oot
arista
15-02-2023, 10:08 AM
11AM
She is Speaking...................................
it's pretty obvious she has been shown the door, she was going full steam ahead until all the gender stuff caught her out
arista
15-02-2023, 10:23 AM
She Told a Prison to take a Trans Criminal
The Prison then told her they will look
at what they were born as.
Loss of Control
user104658
15-02-2023, 10:28 AM
It's not even any of the policies that did it in the end - it's that she couldn't answer questions, flipped and flopped, and eventually basically resorted to saying "You're all just bigots is wot!".
T|hat might fly on TikTok or Discord or whatever but it has no place in politics whatsoever. I'm not saying you can't call out bigotry of course but you have to have an actual argument or reasoning behind it that goes beyond "I'm right cos you're bigots".
In the end she was flat out contradicting herself.
the same thing could easily happen to starmer
Crimson Dynamo
15-02-2023, 10:33 AM
People in Scotland did not like her lying to virtue signal on women can have penises crap
nor her lockdown bolloxio
arista
15-02-2023, 10:36 AM
the same thing could easily happen to starmer
Yes he will tread gently
on that Hot Topic
Niamh.
15-02-2023, 10:39 AM
It's not even any of the policies that did it in the end - it's that she couldn't answer questions, flipped and flopped, and eventually basically resorted to saying "You're all just bigots is wot!".
T|hat might fly on TikTok or Discord or whatever but it has no place in politics whatsoever. I'm not saying you can't call out bigotry of course but you have to have an actual argument or reasoning behind it that goes beyond "I'm right cos you're bigots".
In the end she was flat out contradicting herself.
Yeah 100% Not listening to women or what her voters actually wanted cost her too. Twitter is not real life (thankfully)
joeysteele
15-02-2023, 10:39 AM
I stil hold good admiration for her.
She will be a very hard act to follow even moreso than was Alex Salmond.
Good luck to her for the future from me.
user104658
15-02-2023, 10:43 AM
People in Scotland did not like her lying to virtue signal
I think that's it though - even with lockdown I think she at least somewhat thought she was doing the right thing genuinely (no matter what opinion may be, I think in HER mind it was the right path).
With the gender reform stuff I just was never convinced. I don't think she had looked into it properly, I don't think she knew what she was talking about (this was evident in the later interviews), I think she was talking herself in circles because people/groups were in her ear telling her to be "on the right side of history" and she got over-confident and thought "Yeah this sounds like some good anti-Tory type stuff!" and went with it. I think she thought it would be popular with a small group and not on other people's radar at all, and I can only put that down to her having believed the "gender reform doesn't affect anyone else" flat-out lie.
Again though her only really critical error for me, is that when presented with arguments that she herself CLEARLY could not logically refute and backed into a corner, she didn't say "OK I can now see that we may have jumped the gun on this and it needs a lot more thought about the best ways to go forward for everyone" ... she adopted the classic strawman tactic of accusing everyone else of not having valid or genuine concerns.
The flippant comments and angry, dismissive back-n-forth is to be expected in the general public arena but a good politician needs to be above that and staying professional has ALWAYS been what she's had over and above a lot of the Westminster bunch. Straight out the window on this. Utterly mental.
She didn't need to say "Yeah you're right, no more trans rights arrrrr!!! I have all the answers about where we go now!!!" she literally just had to say "I now appreciate that this is more complicated than I was led to believe, and it needs to go back to the drawing board to find the best solutions for all." Massive failure.
user104658
15-02-2023, 10:43 AM
the same thing could easily happen to starmer
I think Sturgeon will, in hushed meetings, be held up as a cautionary tale for decades to come.
i wonder how the BBC will wrestle with this :laugh:
Oliver_W
15-02-2023, 10:53 AM
Could this be an opportunity for Labour to make gains in Scotland? I'm unsure as to how much SNP's rule has had to do with her and Salmond, or the party in general? And if it's the latter, would the gender bollocks have affected Joe Public's view of the party itself, or just the current leadership?
Could this be an opportunity for Labour to make gains in Scotland? I'm unsure as to how much SNP's rule has had to do with her and Salmond, or the party in general? And if it's the latter, would the gender bollocks have affected Joe Public's view of the party itself, or just the current leadership?
i think the SNP mp's in general have the same gender views so it won't make much difference in that respect
user104658
15-02-2023, 11:02 AM
Could this be an opportunity for Labour to make gains in Scotland? I'm unsure as to how much SNP's rule has had to do with her and Salmond, or the party in general? And if it's the latter, would the gender bollocks have affected Joe Public's view of the party itself, or just the current leadership?
i think the SNP mp's in general have the same gender views so it won't make much difference in that respect
That's not really true, there's massive division on the issue internally they just tend to like to present a united front. Plenty of infighting in the SNP.
However yes it's done untold damage to both support for the SNP, and support for independence. It's an absolutely massive political blunder... it's not just nosedived something that was trundling along - it's stopped a surge of upwards momentum in its tracks and hammered it back decades.
It COULD be an opportunity for Labour to make gains, but my fear is that it'll split the vote between SNP and Labour with the result being the Tories pipping both at the post and gaining some seats.
Really it depends on how quickly they replace her, who it's with, and what noises they make.
arista
15-02-2023, 11:04 AM
All 3 News Channels
are waiting for her
She has to get up the stairs
Niamh.
15-02-2023, 11:04 AM
That's not really true, there's massive division on the issue internally they just tend to like to present a united front. Plenty of infighting in the SNP.
However yes it's done untold damage to both support for the SNP, and support for independence. It's an absolutely massive political blunder... it's not just nosedived something that was trundling along - it's stopped a surge of upwards momentum in its tracks and hammered it back decades.
It COULD be an opportunity for Labour to make gains, but my fear is that it'll split the vote between SNP and Labour with the result being the Tories pipping both at the post and gaining some seats.
Really it depends on how quickly they replace her, who it's with, and what noises they make.
Do you think it's made a lot of people who would have been pro Independence think, "thank god Westminster intervened"?
Liam-
15-02-2023, 11:07 AM
Bullied out by a vocal minority that don’t want to allow trans people dignity and respect, a horrible ending for a fantastic leader
there was also her intention to make the next election a de facto referendum on independence and the fact that she was trying to blame economic turmoil on the conservatives by doing nothing when she had the power to do something.
Niamh.
15-02-2023, 11:09 AM
Bullied out by a vocal minority that don’t want to allow trans people dignity and respect, a horrible ending for a fantastic leader
Keep telling yourself that......
Women aren't going to shut up Liam, sorry
arista
15-02-2023, 11:09 AM
Bullied out by a vocal minority that don’t want to allow trans people dignity and respect, a horrible ending for a fantastic leader
Bollocks
Massive Mess ups by her
LT Knows..................................
arista
15-02-2023, 11:10 AM
Live Now
She goes once they Elect a new leader
Liam-
15-02-2023, 11:13 AM
Keep telling yourself that......
Women aren't going to shut up Liam, sorry
I will keep telling myself that, because it’s the truth
Niamh.
15-02-2023, 11:14 AM
I will keep telling myself that, because it’s the truth
ha the "truth" interesting..
Oliver_W
15-02-2023, 11:15 AM
Do you think it's made a lot of people who would have been pro Independence think, "thank god Westminster intervened"?
That's a point - it's "rumoured" that she was hoping for the exact opposite, that Westminster's intervention would further strengthen their plight for independence.
she can keep saying that the gender debate wasn't the reason, but it's obvious that it is
arista
15-02-2023, 11:19 AM
she can keep saying that the gender debate wasn't the reason, but it's obvious that it is
Yes.
joeysteele
15-02-2023, 11:20 AM
she can keep saying that the gender debate wasn't the reason, but it's obvious that it is
Yes, I agree with you on that.
Niamh.
15-02-2023, 11:21 AM
That's a point - it's "rumoured" that she was hoping for the exact opposite, that Westminster's intervention would further strengthen their plight for independence.
Yeah, it was a spectacular backfire. According to Polls it was a hugely unpopular bill as well - quite a majority of Scottish people opposed it, 2/3's
https://www.scottishdailyexpress.co.uk/news/politics/jk-rowling-brands-gender-reforms-28740667
user104658
15-02-2023, 11:26 AM
Bullied out by a vocal minority that don’t want to allow trans people dignity and respect, a horrible ending for a fantastic leader
This is literally the opposite of what happened - she made policy decisions based on an illusion of popularity based on a vocal minority, and when all was said and done her approval ratings, approval ratings of the SNP, and support for independence all plummetted dramatically. There's no way to argue that this was "a vocal minority bullying her out" - it was polled widely, and the poll results are the reason she's resigning.
user104658
15-02-2023, 11:39 AM
she can keep saying that the gender debate wasn't the reason, but it's obvious that it is
In a sense I think it is and isn't. She talks about having gradually lacked energy to do the job properly... She's basically talking about burnout and I think that may be true - but it's what makes the other part also true. I think she's burnt out and dropped the ball... She didn't put the energy and diligent research into the gender reform issue that she should have... She let other people handle the intricacies of it and signed her name to it without taking the time to gain a proper understanding of what she was signing. She allowed herself to be backed into a corner that she never would have previously in her career, it's a misstep that's hugely out of character and her angry response to it was lazy as well.
I think on balance that shows she's telling the truth that she's simply run out of steam to do the job properly - and this has been a stark example of just that.
UserSince2005
15-02-2023, 12:29 PM
bye bitch.
Guess it has come to light about the scale of her involvement in the Alex Salmond framing.
Crimson Dynamo
15-02-2023, 12:34 PM
9Z4qahmnMC4
Livia
15-02-2023, 12:56 PM
Women aren't a vocal minority. You can't actively show 50% of the public that their rights are not important. Good she's gone...
https://ichef.bbci.co.uk/news/976/cpsprodpb/F913/production/_128636736_gettyimages-74111704.jpg.webp
Crimson Dynamo
15-02-2023, 01:31 PM
https://i.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/newsfeed/002/051/450/115.jpg
Crimson Dynamo
15-02-2023, 01:36 PM
'Wee Free Kirk' Kate Forbes, 32 - a member of evangelical church which
opposes gay marriage and abortion - tipped as favourite to become new SNP
leader
Nicola Sturgeon's shock resignation fires starting gun on race to replace her
Kate Forbes, Angus Robertson and Humza Yousaf all among leading contenders
https://i2-prod.dailyrecord.co.uk/incoming/article22100830.ece/ALTERNATES/s1200b/0_GettyImages-1206551640.jpg
I had some relatives that were in the wee free and they were always highly entertaining. She has the potential to be worse than our Liz
Crimson Dynamo
15-02-2023, 01:48 PM
I had some relatives that were in the wee free and they were always highly entertaining. She has the potential to be worse than our Liz
Most of my Mums older relatives were from Sutherland and all Wee Frees. Did not celebrate Christmas etc
Niamh.
15-02-2023, 02:00 PM
'Wee Free Kirk' Kate Forbes, 32 - a member of evangelical church which
opposes gay marriage and abortion - tipped as favourite to become new SNP
leader
Nicola Sturgeon's shock resignation fires starting gun on race to replace her
Kate Forbes, Angus Robertson and Humza Yousaf all among leading contenders
https://i2-prod.dailyrecord.co.uk/incoming/article22100830.ece/ALTERNATES/s1200b/0_GettyImages-1206551640.jpg
Bloody hell, another anti women woman?
Crimson Dynamo
15-02-2023, 02:09 PM
Bloody hell, another anti women woman?
and i would imagine not that fond of the English
:shocked:
user104658
15-02-2023, 02:53 PM
'Wee Free Kirk' Kate Forbes, 32 - a member of evangelical church which
opposes gay marriage and abortion - tipped as favourite to become new SNP
leader
Nicola Sturgeon's shock resignation fires starting gun on race to replace her
Kate Forbes, Angus Robertson and Humza Yousaf all among leading contenders
https://i2-prod.dailyrecord.co.uk/incoming/article22100830.ece/ALTERNATES/s1200b/0_GettyImages-1206551640.jpg
:shrug: Average Scottish voter isn't going to go for that either so if there's any weight to it, the party is imploding.
Most of my Mums older relatives were from Sutherland and all Wee Frees. Did not celebrate Christmas etc
one of my relatives didn't allow TV, magazines, papers etc as they corrupted the soul
Liam-
15-02-2023, 03:02 PM
Mhairi Black ftw
Cherie
15-02-2023, 03:31 PM
Bullied out by a vocal minority that don’t want to allow trans people dignity and respect, a horrible ending for a fantastic leader
So as a matter of interest where do you think the two time rapist should have seen out their sentence in a male or female jail?
So as a matter of interest where do you think the two time rapist should have seen out their sentence in a male or female jail?
In some countries, from what I can tell, given his backstory and disgusting offences he would not of even made it to court never mind jail
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
Crimson Dynamo
15-02-2023, 04:38 PM
Mhairi Black ftw
That weirdo thinks women can have a penis.
So nope
joeysteele
15-02-2023, 05:20 PM
I think the SNP now have a really hard task to fill their leader and First Minister post.
I can't think of anyone who'd impress like Nicola has since becoming leader.
Love or dislike her, she was formidable.
i think westminster will be breathing a large sigh of relief, and as it turns out, Liz Truss was absolutely right :joker:
Cherie
15-02-2023, 06:04 PM
In some countries, from what I can tell, given his backstory and disgusting offences he would not of even made it to court never mind jail
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
I am interested in Liams response as in his book it seems a man can slap on a bit of lippy, pick up a handbag and hey presto.....into womans spaces they can go
Cherie
15-02-2023, 06:05 PM
I think the SNP now have a really hard task to fill their leader and First Minister post.
I can't think of anyone who'd impress like Nicola has since becoming leader.
Love or dislike her, she was formidable.
she was, but men were her downfall
I try to stay out of the trans debate but I think this is great news for Unionism! Agree with Joey that she has been a formidable leader and I think any replacement would be unlikely to garner as much support for independence and the party is more likely to fracture now
hijaxers
15-02-2023, 07:01 PM
I try to stay out of the trans debate but I think this is great news for Unionism! Agree with Joey that she has been a formidable leader and I think any replacement would be unlikely to garner as much support for independence and the party is more likely to fracture now
Well like Alex Salmond said she has set them back years ! what aa bad finale for her over some lying bloke in a wig, it wouldn't have caused this furore had the rapist not taken the piss :fist:
Well like Alex Salmond said she has set them back years ! what aa bad finale for her over some lying bloke in a wig, it wouldn't have caused this furore had the rapist not taken the piss :fist:
Maybe true but Alex Salmond is also pretty loathed in a lot of the independence movement!
Shes left one hell of a mess..
That will never be forgotten.
arista
15-02-2023, 07:20 PM
She Owes The Conservative Scottish Leader
£50.
A bet she did.
arista
15-02-2023, 07:22 PM
https://i2-prod.dailyrecord.co.uk/incoming/article27238360.ece/ALTERNATES/s810/0_First-Minister-Appoints-New-Cabinet-After-Recent-Election.jpg
arista
15-02-2023, 07:22 PM
So far Angus is in the lead.
joeysteele
15-02-2023, 07:28 PM
So far Angus is in the lead.
If I was an SNP supporter he wouldn't inspire me.
That's just my feeling on him however.
Crimson Dynamo
15-02-2023, 09:35 PM
The Scottish Conservative Leader was running the line at the Piggery on Sat and the terrorist-supporting Celtic "fans" unfurled a disgusting banner (which the club has not condemned)
https://www.thenational.scot/resources/images/16451653.png?type=mds-article-620
https://twitter.com/RadioClydeNews/status/1625113245307600897?s=20
Life in Scotland
arista
15-02-2023, 11:18 PM
https://liveblog.digitalimages.sky/lc-images-sky/lcimg-ee69993a-7654-4622-8c5f-bf2c8aac89ee.jpeg
arista
15-02-2023, 11:19 PM
https://liveblog.digitalimages.sky/lc-images-sky/lcimg-d5cfdb24-02a0-40c7-86d1-e7687990c386.jpeg
arista
15-02-2023, 11:20 PM
https://liveblog.digitalimages.sky/lc-images-sky/lcimg-e11815eb-6a08-42e2-8c24-3fa925bac98e.png
arista
15-02-2023, 11:21 PM
https://liveblog.digitalimages.sky/lc-images-sky/lcimg-9b8ca0d1-7344-4f95-9246-d91f266925fb.jpeg
arista
15-02-2023, 11:22 PM
https://liveblog.digitalimages.sky/lc-images-sky/lcimg-ea70ec2b-57f6-4ec8-804c-b75d25ed9573.png
arista
15-02-2023, 11:23 PM
https://liveblog.digitalimages.sky/lc-images-sky/lcimg-bc14aef1-73c2-48c2-aaab-efc24ab65f42.jpeg
arista
15-02-2023, 11:24 PM
https://liveblog.digitalimages.sky/lc-images-sky/lcimg-e3b62999-5fd8-483a-b4e4-56d87d421bef.png
arista
15-02-2023, 11:27 PM
https://liveblog.digitalimages.sky/lc-images-sky/lcimg-dfaeaaea-d121-404f-bb1e-ebbef81e1957.jpeg
arista
15-02-2023, 11:29 PM
https://liveblog.digitalimages.sky/lc-images-sky/lcimg-abb36aca-2b65-4e91-bbde-bb315263d1a0.jpeg
GoldHeart
16-02-2023, 03:39 AM
Right decision imo
Cherie
16-02-2023, 09:45 AM
Whenever people accuse JK Rowling of transphobia, something always puzzles me. They never quote a single word she’s said.
This strikes me as very odd. After all, if what Ms Rowling has said about trans people is so shocking, so cruel, so mind-bogglingly hateful, then surely her critics should quote her exact words, so that the rest of the world can see the full horror for themselves. Mysteriously, however, these critics always seem completely unable to cite even one transphobic utterance. How can this be? Google is normally such a reliable resource. If someone as famous as Ms Rowling has said anything transphobic, it should be the work of moments to locate a record of it. Yet none of her critics have managed to do so. In fact, all that anyone seems able to find are quotes in which she merely defends the rights of women, without ever abusing or threatening trans people.
What a conundrum. I do hope that one day someone will solve it.
At any rate, no matter where they stand, one thing that everyone can agree on is that JK Rowling’s intervention in the gender debate has been seismic. And never more so than now. Because, had it not been for the creator of Harry Potter, Nicola Sturgeon wouldn’t have resigned as Scotland’s First Minister.
It sounds a grand claim. But I genuinely think it’s true. Whatever Ms Sturgeon may have claimed when announcing her decision, the main reason she had to go is her calamitous approach to gender self-ID. That one row shattered her reputation irreparably.
For the first time in her career, she looked desperately out of her depth. In the past, even her fiercest opponents were forced to concede that she was a formidable politician. An expert performer in debates. An unflappable interviewee. She possessed a rare ability to answer a question politely while giving the impression that, if the reporter dared to push it, she could reduce him or her to rubble with the merest glance.
n recent weeks, however, that ability has deserted her. When asked whether transgender rapists should be housed in women’s prisons or men’s, she looked alarmed, confused, all over the place, like a giraffe on ice skates. As far as I could make out, amid all the spluttering and stammering, her message seemed to be that trans women were definitely women – unless they’d committed certain crimes, in which case they immediately became men, although only until they’d completed their prison sentence, at which point they immediately became women again.
At any rate, whatever she was trying to say, one thing was clear: she couldn’t handle the pressure. And that pressure was on her in large part thanks to JK Rowling.
Before Ms Rowling made her first public comments on gender issues, back in 2019, I suspect that most people in Scotland, or for that matter the rest of Britain, had hardly given them a thought. Yet such is her fame – not to mention her apparent imperviousness to online abuse – that she was able to drag the debate into the public eye, and keep it there. It was no longer possible to avoid it. But for her, therefore, Ms Sturgeon simply wouldn’t have faced such intense scrutiny on this issue from the media.
Even then, the most intense scrutiny continued to come from Ms Rowling herself. “Never forget,” she told her 14 million followers on Twitter last month, as the uproar over biologically male rapists in women’s prisons reached its peak, “Sturgeon, her government and supporters have insisted that it is ludicrous to imagine anyone would dress in women’s clothes to get access to vulnerable women and girls. Wouldn’t happen. Everyone is who they say they are. To question this is hate. ‘The party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command.’ George Orwell, Nineteen Eighty-Four …”
Mere weeks later, Ms Sturgeon is on her way out. We don’t know who will succeed her as First Minister. But whoever it is will need to be tough, fearless, unflinching – and have a view on gender issues that reflects most voters’.
Unfortunately, however, the person who best matches that description is too busy writing books.I
https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/other/if-it-weren-t-for-jk-rowling-nicola-sturgeon-would-never-have-fallen/ar-AA17wXhl?ocid=msedgntp&cvid=bf20eda058584f9cb7b4e04d87d80070
Crimson Dynamo
16-02-2023, 12:19 PM
https://twitter.com/TrueBluesLoyal/status/1625870553121783808?s=20
GoldHeart
16-02-2023, 01:31 PM
Sturgeon was stuttering in the recent trans prisoner mess when questioned , she fell on her own sword ..... it's as simple as that . She's resigned before she was pushed, as she couldn't do the job anymore.
Crimson Dynamo
16-02-2023, 08:44 PM
https://twitter.com/ScotNational/status/1626136046185467906?s=20
arista
16-02-2023, 11:16 PM
https://liveblog.digitalimages.sky/lc-images-sky/lcimg-b19454fd-9810-418e-b036-5b5138808f97.jpeg
arista
16-02-2023, 11:27 PM
https://liveblog.digitalimages.sky/lc-images-sky/lcimg-984d80bc-9fa4-40c3-a2d0-56a4785420cd.jpeg
Crimson Dynamo
18-02-2023, 04:18 PM
https://twitter.com/jonnyrmcfarlane/status/1626977880507924481?s=20
Crimson Dynamo
18-02-2023, 10:08 PM
:facepalm: @ nicola
HKEzc0Kl4BU
arista
18-02-2023, 11:22 PM
https://liveblog.digitalimages.sky/lc-images-sky/lcimg-6f8e3e95-9c14-4324-8efa-8eabb8472274.jpeg
arista
20-02-2023, 03:28 PM
Kate Forbes
Ash Regan
Humza Yousaf
Today there is 3 of them,
https://kate-forbes.scot/about.html
The New One Today.
Closes this Friday
March 27th we get the Result
BBC Scotland News
Crimson Dynamo
20-02-2023, 03:53 PM
For those who don’t know Hamza "Useless" is the prime example of a terrible politician.
He has no life experience outside of politics, has a criminal record for driving with no
insurance, has failed in every single post he’s ever been in, plays the race card whenever he fails to get his own way.
https://media.tenor.com/EztToksXYxYAAAAC/humza-yousaf-snp.gif
they are all grim, let's be honest. Aren't the SNP being investigated by the police for 100's of thousands of pounds that have gone "missing" from the SNP
For those who don’t know Hamza "Useless" is the prime example of a terrible politician.
He has no life experience outside of politics, has a criminal record for driving with no
insurance, has failed in every single post he’s ever been in, plays the race card whenever he fails to get his own way.
https://media.tenor.com/EztToksXYxYAAAAC/humza-yousaf-snp.gifHe's the one that's not too keen on White people and even suggests he'd like to see less of them and for White people in certain roles to be replaced purely because of the colour of their skin.
The guy is a racist.
BQ28yh7F228
arista
20-02-2023, 04:13 PM
For those who don’t know Hamza "Useless" is the prime example of a terrible politician.
He has no life experience outside of politics, has a criminal record for driving with no
insurance, has failed in every single post he’s ever been in, plays the race card whenever he fails to get his own way.
https://media.tenor.com/EztToksXYxYAAAAC/humza-yousaf-snp.gif
Yes, he was rushing then.
joeysteele
20-02-2023, 07:03 PM
What a terrible choice so far to replace her.
It could easily be a sea change in Scottish politics. The snp could be all but wiped out
Oliver_W
20-02-2023, 07:58 PM
Who could have seen Nationalists only having dodgy potential leaders...
user104658
21-02-2023, 09:26 AM
There is no replacement that's anywhere near ready for the job. Despite everything, it can't be denied that Wee Nic has 99% been a fearless & very effective politician and despite what she says now, I don't think she expected to be going any time soon... so this is partially Nicola's fault... she's had such a firm grip on party leadership that no replacement has been prepped. It fell apart in record time so now we have this ... ... no real replacement options.
I honestly think they should be looking beyond the "usual faces" to SNP hopefuls/members who have real leadership experience in other fields.
Cherie
21-02-2023, 10:07 AM
For those who don’t know Hamza "Useless" is the prime example of a terrible politician.
He has no life experience outside of politics, has a criminal record for driving with no
insurance, has failed in every single post he’s ever been in, plays the race card whenever he fails to get his own way.
https://media.tenor.com/EztToksXYxYAAAAC/humza-yousaf-snp.gif
I guess he gets the job then
Oliver_W
21-02-2023, 10:11 AM
For a piece of legislation which was apparently in the works for years, how could Sturgeon and/or those close to her have such an inaccurate perception as to what the general public thinks? Echo chambers certainly exist (on all sides) but surely it's bordering impossible that she only had one side ringing in her ears, especially as that side is (an admittedly very vocal) minority, in the grand scheme.
For a piece of legislation which was apparently in the works for years, how could Sturgeon and/or those close to her have such an inaccurate perception as to what the general public thinks? Echo chambers certainly exist (on all sides) but surely it's bordering impossible that she only had one side ringing in her ears, especially as that side is (an admittedly very vocal) minority, in the grand scheme.
she is well aware of the other side, she just thinks they are all bigots
Niamh.
21-02-2023, 10:25 AM
For a piece of legislation which was apparently in the works for years, how could Sturgeon and/or those close to her have such an inaccurate perception as to what the general public thinks? Echo chambers certainly exist (on all sides) but surely it's bordering impossible that she only had one side ringing in her ears, especially as that side is (an admittedly very vocal) minority, in the grand scheme.
Didn't she have access to polls showing her the public were very much against it?
Crimson Dynamo
21-02-2023, 10:28 AM
I go past a small cottage on my dog walk 3 of their 4 front facing windows have posters in about "NO to self ID"
Didn't she have access to polls showing her the public were very much against it?
that's why she had to make laws to force her will on the majority
user104658
21-02-2023, 10:46 AM
Nicola would not have fallen on the sword of trans rights or (let's be honest) anything other than Indy... she was banking on it being slapped down by Westminster I think, and then using that "indicator of control" to further the case for independence which - all other things aside - it probably should. It does illustrate something.
So I don't think she thought it was particularly a popular policy - I think she just underestimated how hot a topic it would be at this point in time. Basically, she thought people wouldn't care all that much.
Where it fell apart was in her trying to justify it all on a very public stage after it all fell apart, and that's where she encountered the inherent contradictions and cognitive dissonance involved in trying to properly, openly, and level-headedly discuss the issue of trans rights in today's climate. It's obviouslly immeasurably complex but here's what it boils down to;
1) You can't (CAN NOT, it's logically impossible) introduce policy nuances without an admission that - on some level - there are some fundamental differences between trans women and biological females, and that those differences are relevant and important in some contexts.
2) Your choice is to do the above and be lumped in with people who are genuinely transphobic/homophobic etc., or double down. Inevitably this descends into arguments that tie themselves in knots, confusion, frustration, clear falsehoods based on nothing at all but a hope and a prayer ("What you're worried about doesn't/will never happen you're making it up") and resorting to ad hominem ("I'm right because you're clearly a bigot").
I think #1 was where Nic was destined to end up with this and she did. What surprised me was that she fell into the trappings of #2. A world-leading female politician standing up and calling women TERFs, transphobes and bigots for having genuine concerns surrounding women's safety is a ludicrous situation and could only rightly go one way. It's a terrible shame and a really sad way for her to have ended her political career.
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