Legalizing cannabis is the greatest mistake of all time

[Crimson Dynamo]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GejraueWkAAAa6M?format=jpg&name=small

“I maintain that it’s addictive,” he said in a new interview with Time, which
named him Icon of the Year. “It leads to other drugs. And when you’re stoned
— and I’ve been stoned — you don’t think normally. Legalizing marijuana in
America and Canada is one of the greatest mistakes of all time.”

https://www.rollingstone.com/music/music-news/elton-john-legalizing-marijuana-greatest-mistakes-time-interview-1235201020/

Get them telt Elton

[bots]

Anything that affects your mental state will be addictive. Legalising cannabis will improve it's safety and bring in loads for the tax man

[Niamh.]

Anything that affects your mental state will be addictive. Legalising cannabis will improve it's safety and bring in loads for the tax man

Exactly, it's no worse than cigarettes or Alcohol being legal.

[Beso]

Someone stick him back on his xmas tree.

[Livia]

What he means is, it led HIM to harder drugs.

[Redway]

And yet alcohol is a far more destructive drug, with zero medicinal, spiritual or introspective benefits to boot. How many direct fatalities have occurred from cannabis throughout history as-opposed to alcohol? 0 as-opposed to how-many billions?

[Redway]

Exactly, it's no worse than cigarettes or Alcohol being legal.

Even on the black market cannabis is capable of killing no-one, as-opposed to fully-regulated, legal alcohol, which addicts and kills millions per year. If you’re pro-alcohol but anti-weed, you’re a hypocrite. Period.

[bots]

i had my share of cannabis as a student and i never felt it was addictive certainly not compared to tobacco. Also, it's never occurred to me to try harder drugs so i don't see it as a gateway drug either. I think the gateway aspect comes from your social circle. Having a beer doesn't lead to drinking whisky. It doesn't make sense

[thesheriff443]

I know someone who gets medical grade cannabis at 200 pounds a pop uses it for pain relief after a moped accident but they were smoking cannabis long before their accident

[Redway]

i had my share of cannabis as a student and i never felt it was addictive certainly not compared to tobacco. Also, it's never occurred to me to try harder drugs so i don't see it as a gateway drug either. I think the gateway aspect comes from your social circle. Having a beer doesn't lead to drinking whisky. It doesn't make sense

That’s because alcohol and tobacco are far more addictive than cannabis. Society just likes to turn more of a blind eye to alcohol unless the destructive consequences of alcohol, talk-less alcoholism, are literally shoved in their faces.

[The Slim Reaper]

i had my share of cannabis as a student and i never felt it was addictive certainly not compared to tobacco. Also, it's never occurred to me to try harder drugs so i don't see it as a gateway drug either. I think the gateway aspect comes from your social circle. Having a beer doesn't lead to drinking whisky. It doesn't make sense

I agree with the general point you're making, but the weed on sale today is a different animal from the probable Thai sticks you were being served up during your college days.

[Oliver_W]

Even on the black market cannabis is capable of killing no-one, as-opposed to fully-regulated, legal alcohol, which addicts and kills millions per year. If you’re pro-alcohol but anti-weed, you’re a hypocrite. Period.

If weed were to be available to be through retail, I think it should have a minimum age of around 25, due the the negative effects it has on brain development.

But don't worry, alcohol should be 21+, and the age of consent should be 18.

[Ninastar]

The only bad thing about it being legal is how ****ing expensive it gets

[Redway]

If weed were to be available to be through retail, I think it should have a minimum age of around 25, due the the negative effects it has on brain development.

But don't worry, alcohol should be 21+, and the age of consent should be 18.

Filter in fluvoxamine and/or CBD (and maybe other ‘mellowing entourage cannabinoids’) and does THC have that much of a negative effect on the development of certain 16-24-year-olds? Part of the problem is that we don’t teach people how to optimise their experiences with cannabis. Some people have no business going near it without CBD and if they did they’d be fine but for some reason skeptics want the brain to get a unilaterally-sided kicking from THC alone. That’s not always the best way to use cannabis and as-per the science of cannabis we know this. Cannabinoids work better together than in isolation. CBD off-sets a lot of the negative effects of THC.

Should uni. students not be allowed to drink? Come on. 21+ is wild.

[Mystic Mock]

Exactly, it's no worse than cigarettes or Alcohol being legal.

I agree.

[Zizu]

K6vbTt9xnLw

[Crimson Dynamo]

K6vbTt9xnLw

Sadly George was right

[Redway]

For every anecdote of someone having bad experiences with cannabis there’s a trillion and one with alcohol, with numerous fatalities to boot. You just cannot make an honest argument that isn’t rooted in obvious bias, however subconscious, that cannabis is worse than alcohol of all drugs. It’s not possible.

[Quantum Boy]

Of course it's addictive and harmful and of course it can lead people to harder drugs. Of course it's not particularly good for you.

...it just isn't worse than alcohol, so anyone who bawls about it being legalised whilst happily sipping a glass of wine is nothing but a hypocrite.

[Quantum Boy]

People always like to say about class A drug users, that many (most) of them tried cannabis first... which is true I'm sure... but I guarantee that the first recreational drug every single one of them tried was alcohol, and I guarantee that the cycle of substance abuse ultimately began as soon as they felt a bit better about life after having a drink.

[Redway]

Of course it's addictive and harmful and of course it can lead people to harder drugs. Of course it's not particularly good for you.

...it just isn't worse than alcohol, so anyone who bawls about it being legalised whilst happily sipping a glass of wine is nothing but a hypocrite.

What about CBD, CBG, CBN, Delta-8 and the other million-and-one cannabinoids out there besides THC as we know it in its fully psychoactive form? Does THC itself not have major health benefits shrouded in anti- propaganda?

Come on, man. You’re cleverer than this.

[Crimson Dynamo]

For every anecdote of someone having bad experiences with cannabis there’s a trillion and one with alcohol, with numerous fatalities to boot. You just cannot make an honest argument that isn’t rooted in obvious bias, however subconscious, that cannabis is worse than alcohol of all drugs. It’s not possible.

No one bar you is making a comparison, this thread is about the evils of cannabis as it is an illegal drug purchased from drug dealers who also deal in other illegal drugs

[Redway]

No one bar you is making a comparison, this thread is about the evils of cannabis as it is an illegal drug purchased from drug dealers who also deal in other illegal drugs

Is cannabis illegal in Canada, Portugal, the Netherlands or half of the U.S.?

[Quantum Boy]

What about CBD, CBG, CBN, Delta-8 and the other million-and-one cannabinoids out there besides THC as we know it in its fully psychoactive form?

Come on, man. You’re cleverer than this.

Saying that a drug has a therapeutic use is different from saying that it's good for you in an ideal world. Would you recommend that someone who is already physically and mentally a well-balanced person with zero issues start dabbling in CBD? No, no more than you'd suggest that someone with no physical pain starts popping codeine, or even paracetamol.

On the same note - you obviously wouldn't say "oh no, don't take those painkillers!" to someone with a headache.

The analgesics will do them good in their situation, but that doesn't mean that they are inherently good for healthy people.

[Redway]

Saying that a drug has a therapeutic use is different from saying that it's good for you in an ideal world. Would you recommend that someone who is already physically and mentally a well-balanced person with zero issues start dabbling in CBD? No, no more than you'd suggest that someone with no physical pain starts popping codeine, or even paracetamol.

On the same note - you obviously wouldn't say "oh no, don't take those painkillers!" to someone with a headache.

The analgesics will do them good in their situation, but that doesn't mean that they are inherently good for healthy people.
Don’t presume. All our bodies have endocannabinoid systems and by that analogy are receptive to various cannabinoids with or without underlying medical conditions, if nothing else for enhancement of general bodily homeostasis. People are oft. better-off with than without CBD. Our bodies don’t have natural endo-paracetamol receptors. Talk less endo-alcoholoid ones but the two of us are obviously in agreement with that so that’s okay.

I know you’ll find another loop-hole to argue with, ever-the perpetual ENTP-giving debater, but I’ve said my own and laid my own foundations for the crux of my point. CBD is nothing like codeine or even paracetamol. Nothing like. So just do not tell me ‘no, no you wouldn’t advocate for CBD for someone with no health problems because it’s like doing such for tramadol’. Next time I won’t take that lying down, let me just tell you. I won’t take it from you.

You don’t have to have a health condition to enjoy the health benefits of plantain or spinach. Likewise for CBD. Like I said that’s my own. You being you you’ll probably still want to challenge or debate it further but compared to Crimson Dynamo you’re not the one I’m really disagreeing with on the whole so it’s not even worth another argument so let’s just leave it here. Hope yer well.

[Friendlykev92]

Only smoke it occasionally myself, But to me it's certainly safer or no more harmful than alcohol so I would like to see it legalized, But that's just my opinion

[joeysteele]

I haven't any problem with it if it were to be legalised.
I'd support that move myself.

Not that I'd use it though.

[Redway]

Anyone who seriously thinks cannabis is more harmful than alcohol should read this: https://www.brown.edu/Courses/BI_278/Other/Clerkship/Didactics/Readings/Alcoholism%20and%20Alcohol%20Abuse.pdf

People just don’t get hooked on pot like that. That’s the truth. You might want to think otherwise if you’re been conditioned to be hypocritically biased against weed in favour of alcohol but the truth is alcohol is a much, much, much more destructive and less beneficial drug than cannabis could ever be. Okay in moderation but causes too many issues to be ignored just-because the pub is an inherent part of your culture. You can’t Mary-Jane yourself to death but you can easily drink yourself to death, and that’s periodt. And that’s when alcohol’s legal and fully regulated.

[Livia]

Totally agree with Cranbred Goose. Plus, unlike alcohol, I've never heard of anyone smoking some cannabis and then starting a fight.

[Cherie]

They may as well, it is being smoked openly in parks and gardens, and on the street...

[Redway]

Totally agree with Cranbred Goose. Plus, unlike alcohol, I've never heard of anyone smoking some cannabis and then starting a fight.

Absolutely.

If someone, in an idealised scenario, wants to curate an idealised scenario of quail, breadfruit and blueberry toast with liver, proportioned CBD, essential oils, candles, sharp cleaning routines, harmonious cleaning routines with the people in their living spaces and in their lives in the more long-standing and top it off with a bit of weed and psilocybin (maybe off the back of ketamine therapy, for extra measure) for enhanced introspection and vibes while they kick back at the end of a long week watching Fiddler on the Roof, EastEnders or Emmerdale and tap into seminars with therapists who help them navigate past trauma that they’ve transformed themselves out of while their pallies are out smoking 20 cigarettes an hour, carrying knives to nightclubs and getting into drunken fights, I … you know. I don’t see why some people would be more desperate to antagonistically call the police on the first. As for the stereotype of habitual partakers of the green being permanently monged out losers who never accomplish anything for themselves, many find that cannabis enhances their day-to-day life (especially if they’re introspective or creative souls), or they vape instead of smoke (which tends to offer a cleaner, less stoney high), they use sativas in-and-around times they use it when they want to function (as-opposed to strong indicas) or they combine it with uplifting cannabinoids (like CBG, before we even get talking about CBD) that tend to cause an uplift in motivation if the strain of THC they’re using alone won’t do it. Everything ultimately points to the fact that ignorance, stereotypes and the lack of education the general public have in terms of how to optimise their cannabis experiences and do it in a healthy way (and, of course, in moderation) do more harm than the plant itself. And those reasons don’t justify continued illegality. Quite-the opposite. It’s not the fault of ganja itself that people use ignorance and stereotypes to make it seem worse than alcohol, despite the fact that the latter even in its fully legalised, regulated state causes more direct fatalities and legal/health-related woes (violence to boot) than cannabis ever could.

For every gutter-alkie with delirium tremens who fluctuates between prison and hospital, moreover, there's a sophisticated wine connoisseur and that’s how it is with weed as well. But some people have the impression that to even talk about the latter in a semi-favourable light you have to be a monged-out stoner who accomplishes nothing for yourself and just lies around getting stoned all day. The act of smoking weed, vaping weed, eating Delta-8 gummies, using the vaped extracts to make banana bread or latke board, etc., can be every bit as refined and appropriately moderate as high-end, classy drinking. It doesn’t have to be all or nothing. But unfortunately we live in a world where we like to criminalise peace. Couldn’t just leave the Middle East alone. Can’t just leave people who use weed sensibly and in moderation alone, while people have free rein to two of the most poisonous and harmful drugs out there (alcohol and nicotine). The hypocrisy really is terrible.

[GoldHeart]

It stinks,I still don't know how people can stand the smell. Plus what other sh1t are they mixing with it ... sometimes it isn't just 'weed' .

And people who constantly smoke it ( not the ones having an occasional blunt) usually act like they have serious brain damage :idc: ,I know not everyone will agree with me.

I'm all for cannabis being used for medical and herbal remedies,but there's other ways to take it ...other than smoking it to get stoned.

[Redway]

It stinks,I still don't know how people can stand the smell. Plus what other sh1t are they mixing with it ... sometimes it isn't just 'weed' .

And people who constantly smoke it ( not the ones having an occasional blunt) usually act like they have serious brain damage :idc: ,I know not everyone will agree with me.

I'm all for cannabis being used for medical and herbal remedies,but there's other ways to take it ...other than smoking it to get stoned.

And that’s why vapes exist. Just as they exist for nicotine now, so, too, do they exist for weed. The smell is far more discreet and contained (and it disappears after a matter of minutes in any case). You really don’t have to smoke or be that stereotypical 16-year-old having a stinky spliff in the supposedly secluded part of the park. Of course, if smoking’s still the one you wanna do, crack on, but there are other, more discreet, less stinky options out there. It’s just a matter of people upping their tobacco-and-flower literacy.

Some people liken the smell of vaped weed to burnt popcorn more than anything else. No-doubt it has an essence reminiscent of some sort of corny flower but it’s not necessarily even recognisable as weed.

There’s just no reason for weed to be illegal, recreationally or medicinally.

[GoldHeart]

And that’s why vapes exist. Just as they exist for nicotine now, so, too, do they exist for weed. The smell is far more discreet and contained (and it disappears after a matter of minutes in any case). You really don’t have to smoke.

Some people liken the smell of vaped weed to burnt popcorn more than anything else. No-doubt it has an essence reminiscent of some sort of corny flower but it’s not necessarily even recognisable as weed.

Well usually wherever I walk ...it seems people are still smoking it through cigarettes to stink up the air . Even when I was in a professional setting ,I could smell it lingering around. So people aren't bothered.

[Cherie]

Well usually wherever I walk ...it seems people are still smoking it through cigarettes to stink up the air . Even when I was in a professional setting ,I could smell it lingering around. So people aren't bothered.

its disgusting GH and their clothes must reek, plus its probably no better than tobacco for lungs, but they may as well legalise it and get the tax because its just normalised now

[Redway]

its disgusting GH and their clothes must reek, plus its probably no better than tobacco for lungs, but they may as well legalise it and get the tax because its just normalised now

If alcohol’s legal, weed should be. That’s just a fact.

More people should definitely vape, though.

[GoldHeart]

its disgusting GH and their clothes must reek, plus its probably no better than tobacco for lungs, but they may as well legalise it and get the tax because its just normalised now

Well it already feels like it's legalised... that's for sure :laugh: it seems to be everywhere,so I definitely see people's point there.

But yeah dreadful habit like tobacco :yuk: .

[Redway]

Well it already feels like it's legalised... that's for sure :laugh: it seems to be everywhere,so I definitely see people's point there.

But yeah dreadful habit like tobacco :yuk: .

Do you see drinking as a dreadful habit?

[GoldHeart]

Do you see drinking as a dreadful habit?

Excessive drinking yes

[Redway]

Excessive drinking yes

What about just-plain drinking vs. the just-plain weed vaper (not smoker)? A vaper doesn’t stink; they’re not stinking up the whole place. Their hair and clothes don’t reek. They’re just taking into the introspective, meditative, enhanced-sensorial benefits of cannabis, whatever they are for them (better quality of music-sound/taste of food, even-deeper intuition/creativity, or just a sense of calm, whatever it is for them), chilling, minding their own business and not doing anyone any harm (there might be some CBD in the vape, too). What’s honestly so wrong with that? What’s there?

Would they necessarily deserve to have the police called on them?

[Zizu]

What about just-plain drinking vs. the just-plain weed vaper (not smoker)? A vaper doesn’t stink; they’re not stinking up the whole place. Their hair and clothes don’t reek. They’re just taking into the introspective, meditative, enhanced-sensorial benefits of cannabis, whatever they are for them (better quality of music-sound/taste of food, even-deeper intuition/creativity, or just a sense of calm, whatever it is for them), chilling, minding their own business and not doing anyone any harm (there might be some CBD in the vape, too). What’s honestly so wrong with that? What’s there?


As regards vaping ( completely unregulated) I got the impression that you have no real idea what on earth you are inhaling ( chemical/substance wise) .. and that the major of profits went to organised crime

[Redway]

I’d … recommend people watch today’s EastEnders. It’s good to be reminded of the dangers of alcohol. Never mind Crimson Dynamo rambling in the other thread without fuller context.

BBC iPlayer’s free anyway. Fill your boots.

[Crimson Dynamo]

Watch EastEnders

:laugh2:

Brilliant

[Redway]

Watch EastEnders

:laugh2:

Brilliant

You can knock it all you want but until you’ve actually seen the theme of the episode it’s all predictable hollow bait from you. God knows when you’re gonna stop.

[Crimson Dynamo]

I'm not watching that sh1t

Come on, no one does

[Redway]

I'm not watching that sh1t

Come on, no one does

Yeah, okay. You’re obviously not going to stop. Have fun with yourself.

[Crimson Dynamo]

Yeah, okay. You’re obviously not going to stop. Have fun with yourself.

Be more than the 4 EastEnders fans will

[Redway]

Only smoke it occasionally myself, But to me it's certainly safer or no more harmful than alcohol so I would like to see it legalized, But that's just my opinion

It’s definitely safer than alcohol. Less destructive to society to boot.

[Zizu]

It’s definitely safer than alcohol. Less destructive to society to boot.


Though nothing would ever get done and the country would grind to a halt .. that said nobody would care

[Redway]

I haven't any problem with it if it were to be legalised.
I'd support that move myself.

Not that I'd use it though.

That’s absolutely fair, Joey. There’s a bit of a misconception that you have to use these substances yourself to approve of their legality and that ain’t it. You can be teetotal (or at the most a very occasional drinker) and still agree that alcohol should be legal.

Hope you’re well.

[Crimson Dynamo]

Though nothing would ever get done and the country would grind to a halt .. that said nobody would care

As warned by our own George Michael

he knew the dangers of this gateway drug back in the 80s

:shocked:

[Redway]

As warned by our own George Michael

he knew the dangers of this gateway drug back in the 80s

:shocked:

Very funny. As are all stereotypes fuelled by ignorance and additional stereotyping. But never funny-ha-ha. Ultimately, time-bound fear-mongering and hypocrisy never wins the race in the end, like it or not. It’s a losing side and I know that you know that deep down. But why approach these things with sense when we can just wreck our livers and get rowdy on Saturday nights, ey?

[Livia]

As warned by our own George Michael

he knew the dangers of this gateway drug back in the 80s

:shocked:

I think it's fair to say that both Elton and George Michael had addictive personalities and if it hadn't been drugs it would probably have been drink. I know people who've smoked weed for years and have never been prompted to try the stronger stuff because to do so would be stooopid. It all depends on the person.

[Quantum Boy]

I think it's fair to say that both Elton and George Michael had addictive personalities and if it hadn't been drugs it would probably have been drink. I know people who've smoked weed for years and have never been prompted to try the stronger stuff because to do so would be stooopid. It all depends on the person.

I agree with that mostly - I do think one risk factor is "availability of contacts" though, for some people, not all, but those who are inclined to use any substance for coping - if they have a regular dealer, that dealer often "stocks" harder drugs too, and may well "offer" those to a regular buyer in a time of crisis. Which, really, is an argument for legalising and regulating weed rather than anything else; a legitimate business selling it isn't going to offer someone a bag of opiates under-the-counter, a "friendly" local dealer might.

[Livia]

I agree with that mostly - I do think one risk factor is "availability of contacts" though, for some people, not all, but those who are inclined to use any substance for coping - if they have a regular dealer, that dealer often "stocks" harder drugs too, and may well "offer" those to a regular buyer in a time of crisis. Which, really, is an argument for legalising and regulating weed rather than anything else; a legitimate business selling it isn't going to offer someone a bag of opiates under-the-counter, a "friendly" local dealer might.

Yeah, whatever...

[Redway]

I think it's fair to say that both Elton and George Michael had addictive personalities and if it hadn't been drugs it would probably have been drink. I know people who've smoked weed for years and have never been prompted to try the stronger stuff because to do so would be stooopid. It all depends on the person.

He knows. I think he’s just trying to wind us up at this point. He knows in his heart that alcohol is a far more dangerous, destructive drug than cannabis could ever be.

[Crimson Dynamo]

He knows. I think he’s just trying to wind us up at this point. He knows in his heart that alcohol is a far more dangerous, destructive drug than cannabis could ever be.

please do not tell me or anyone on this forum what I think

how rude

:umm2:

[Redway]

please do not tell me or anyone on this forum what I think

how rude

:umm2:

It’s not like you’re going to tell them (sincerely), but, hey, that’s your prerogative.

[Maru]

It's not legal here technically but decriminalized. My neighbors smoke it in and the smell is horrible. Also kind of weird to be traveling in a car and smelling it from the next car over while in moving traffic. I don't remember the smell being so strong in the past...

I knew coworkers who smoked it and they were totally worthless while high.

[Redway]

It's not legal here technically but decriminalized. My neighbors smoke it in and the smell is horrible. Also kind of weird to be traveling in a car and smelling it from the next car over while in moving traffic. I don't remember the smell being so strong in the past...

I knew coworkers who smoked it and they were totally worthless while high.

Do you find that drunk workers bring a lot of value to the job, especially when they’re operating with machinery or driving?

[Crimson Dynamo]

It's not legal here technically but decriminalized. My neighbors smoke it in and the smell is horrible. Also kind of weird to be traveling in a car and smelling it from the next car over while in moving traffic. I don't remember the smell being so strong in the past...

I knew coworkers who smoked it and they were totally worthless while high.

Coming back from football I can smell the steak in the motorway.
Uncanny

[Redway]

It's not legal here technically but decriminalized. My neighbors smoke it in and the smell is horrible. Also kind of weird to be traveling in a car and smelling it from the next car over while in moving traffic. I don't remember the smell being so strong in the past...

I knew coworkers who smoked it and they were totally worthless while high.

I’m a proponent for people vaping their flower (including CBD and CBG) more than smoking it. Less smell, more discretion if discretion’s something that matters to you. Big fat stinky spliffs can naturally get on people’s nerves smell-wise. I get that.

And yes. CBD cigarettes are indeed a thing. But I’d wager that all cannabinoid extracts of the cannabis plant smell pretty-much the same. That’s definitely the case with CBD. As far as the general olfactory public are concerned it might as well be a joint/spliff.

[Redway]

https://youtu.be/DMhD9bakWUc?si=HWVnh7IapqWI4o1L