Sorry I posted, to be honest.

And I can totally understand why considering what was going on in Ireland at the time, that isn't an inconvenient truth, why would you think it was?

You know, I didn't come on this thread to argue about the IRA. I was agreeing with your points about the IRA not being the same as IS. And now I've got you on one side and Cherie on the other, picking at everything I write.

Half my family weren't even British in 1916.

Why don't you and Cherie have a nice little chat about it between you and leave me out of it.

I'm not upset I find it interesting, we can't whitewash history and it doesn't matter how long ago it was it is what shapes a country, I don't expect anyone would want to whitewash the holocaust in 300 years, 400 years, 1,000 years, history is important, good and bad.

Nice to see I'm off ignore :tongue:

That's fine Livia, I would have left it a few posts back when you said you didn't want to talk about it anymore but then you kept saying stuff, you can't say stuff that will provoke a reaction but then say "and that's that lets stop talking about it now"!

Regarding your original post quoting mine:
I'm glad you agree that they're not comparable but you also added to that original post so i responded to that and you responded to me again because you disagreed with something I said etc etc, I don't know why I'm being blamed when you were doing the same as what I was doing ie disagreeing with the parts of my posts that you didn't agree with :shrug:

The bible preaches that we should stone people for wearing two different fabrics. There's bat**** crazy stuff in all religious texts that no longer apply to today's world and is ignored by most followers and it's no different for Islam. Your Average christian isn't going to go around killing people for eating shellfish and your average Muslim wouldn't carry out the punishments listed on the Quran.

Double Denim came from Jesus? :o

I'm pretty sure Double Denim came from Satan in all honesty.

you cant really compare the OT with the Koran like that. The NT is the new covenant to Christians and its a lot harder to use to justify death, unlike the unreformed religion of Islam and its guide book of bollocks the Koran

I personally believe that Christianity nor Islam is peaceful (Mohammed molests a nine year old in the Koran) (and Christianity promotes slavery as if it's a good thing) so no the Religions I don't think are peaceful.

However I do feel that individuals that follow a Religion can be peaceful like in all walks of life.

I suspect monarchy is more responsible for war and death than anything else. Now we may say the dark days of torture , rape and pillage are behind us. But most wars are still fought to make obscene profits for the elite 0.1% Divide and conquer has been going on a thousand years and were still pointing the finger at each other instead of these at the very top of the pyramid.

ain't that the truth

Erm, ok sorry. IRA were the first 'terrorist' organization that came into my head when IO wrote that post, didn't mean to start all of this :S

That's an excellent point The Truth.

I can and I will, if the OT doesn't count then why is it still included in the Bible? It's as valid as the NT for this discussion.

All religions have violent passages, anyone can interpret them in ways to justify their own violent acts. This is not a Islamic thing, religious terrorism has existed for years before Islamic Terrorism rose to prominence and it'll exist for as long as there are people to use religion to justify their violent acts. Give it a decade or two and there will be another religion that's used to justify Terrorism.

Hell, the US suffers terrorist attacks from non-Muslims every few weeks but the media will never call the mass shootings terrorism because they don't wish to confuse the narrative that it's only Muslims that are a threat.

It's alright as I like discussions about the IRA as it's so morally gray, and that's coming from someone from England who probably shouldn't be understanding the IRA's point of view at all.

Where the IRA did go wrong was when they was deliberately blowing up kids, they lost the general public at that very moment.

What you have to ask is

Just who is the judge of what is the real Islam?

Because if the answer is a made up God then you know you are up sh1t creek without a paddle

and dont forget all the civil war that is going on within this great religion of peace

This could literally be said of any religion but okay...

LT hates all Religions tbf, I've seen his posts about others and his not very flattering towards them.:laugh:

It could but not every religion is creating terror and death like ISlam is at the moment

If you have a "god" that cant be questioned or wrong, a book that is the solution, is unalterable and is perfect and a religion that cannot be questioned then it will and does lead to violence and death when it is questioned or comes up against those who will not bend to its will.


to say its peaceful is fanciful

i dont hate the COE, no one can

its impossible

Look the reality is that things that tell you to believe in the impossible will always end up fckd up


walk around say Luton with a placard that says that the Koran is fake and wrong and see how peaceful things get


do the same in Norwich with one that says The Bible is fake and wrong and you may get the odd stare

its aint science but i bet i am right

Don't know about Islam but these Catholics are very evil indeed trying to reclaim our British Northern Ireland and hang the Tricolour outside Belfast, you can take that horrible Irish football team Celtic back to Ireland with you instead and make them play in your league and leave Northern Ireland to the Queen

It's the people that are using the religion to justify their terrorism that are violent but you know that already.

Every major Muslim organisation has denounced the actions of IS and Al Queda ETC and they do it every time there's an attack. IS is as representative of Islam as the IRA (I bring it up due to how all Irish people were treated in the UK in response to the IRA attacks) is to Ireland or these mass shooters to young white males.

Again, your last paragraph applies to any religion ever.

Of course its people as gods dont exist but i am afraid the religionists "think" they do.


Go back to the start of the last century and RC was the most dangerous religion


but now its Islam and its not likely to change

:ninja2:

take hibs too

:ninja2:

I would have to say no. But neither is Christianity or most other major religions, in my opinion.

A lot of people (I don't know whether it's a majority or a tiny minority) try to force their religious beliefs and values on others, so in that respect, I don't think religion as a whole is peaceful.

It's MEANT to be, but as is usual with any religion, the fruit and nut cases decipher it to suit themselves. In fact Buddism is probably the most peaceful religion out there.

Great post!

The part in bold leaves a pit in my stomach. It's just horrible.

Personally, I don't believe in telling other cultures how they should lead their lives as I'm very anti-ethnocentric... but I have an issue when one's spirituality starts to impinge on other people's rights to lead their own lives. Therefore, I don't follow a religion as I don't believe in indoctrinating others. My spiritual philosophy centers on the individual, not the group.

I don't feel religions should be politicized in the manner that they generally are now. Christianity is just as bad as Islam as the truth's post mentioned.

Still, I have a hard time judging Islam on the whole for this reason. It's like when the government raided the FLDS in Texas. I agreed with it only because it is a brainwashing splinter religion built around raping women against their will and gaming the tax and welfare system.

For every radical Muslim, there are many peaceful and non-politically motivated parishioners who can coexistence peacefully. When we blame an entire religion for most of the problems in the world we are encouraging it's radicalization via counter-coercive forces, if not by faith, then by culture.

A thousand times this in the bold. I don't necessarily agree with placing restrictions on religious conversion (it wouldn't be a religion anymore, it would be like the local HOA or a God fanclub :laugh:).

No religion can be the moniker of peace it often claims to be as long as a priority on expansionism is involved.

That was a different deity

http://i.imgur.com/zHVLdkh.png?1

Praise ha :worship:

The easy (and redundant) answer is to say that all religions aren't peaceful or that there are non peaceful people in other religions. But all other major religions have reformed and have been modernised. Christianity had a reformation which purged it of its most intolerant and violent aspects, hence the New Testament. Pointing to intolerant passages in the Old Testament which no one has acted on for hundreds of years is not an argument. Islam is the only major religion that hasn't reformed their doctrine to make it compatible with modern civilisation. It is in dire need of a reformation.

Radicalism is not representative of all Muslims, but illiberal ideals, violence and extremism are representative of Islam and, unfortunately, many Muslims do condone such things. At least 10 Muslim countries impose the death penalty for apostasy and for homosexuality - and stone women to death for allegedly committing adultery. Executing people for being gay or for not believing the same thing as you is violent and wrong. It's not peaceful. Polls have shown that the majority of Muslims of various countries support the death penalty for these supposed crimes.

Islam is an ideology. We are allowed to scrutinise, even ridicule other religions like Christianity and Scientology. But not Islam. Why should it be above criticism? No ideology should. It should be just as easily mocked as any other faith. It's far easier to act as if critics of Islam have a problem with Muslims as people than it is to accept the uncomfortable truth.

I somehow doubt Mohamed will return anytime soon to deliver the New Quran :laugh: Maybe someone should go into a mosque and ask Him for a copy...

If Islam were to become more modernized, it would have to be done in a manner that does not take away from what it is, i.e. not merely mimicking other religions. In many ways, Islam's identity is the direct antithesis to those major religions. The watered down version of Christianity we have in the US called 'non-denominational', the emergence of prosperity gospel and the general focus on personal happiness, good feelings and wealth would make most traditional Muslim's skin crawl.

I think that's the attractiveness of the religion for some. It's for those who believe in moralistic principles and older/traditional ways of looking at things.

There's nothing inherently wrong with that, but is there a Muslim Pope of sorts that can get everyone on the same page as to how to best interpret and communicate Muslim values to the rest of the world. I see it happening eventually actually... some sort of figurehead rising up and becoming the face of all Muslim's... hopefully it is not someone from the ashes of radicalism.

Edit: Very good post by the way.

:laugh::laugh::laugh: That FIRST spoiler is so hilarious, but that lowest Right Hand one. :fist:

Thousands of Muslims from around the world converged on the UK for a convention where they rejected extremism and violence of terror groups such as Isis.

More than 30,000 members of the Ahmadiyya Islamic movement met at Oakland Farm in Hampshire for a three-day convention, the 50th time the annual event has taken place.

On the final day, attendees were led by the global Caliph of the movement in a vow of peace and and a pledge of allegiance to their home countries "The only thing the terrorists are achieving is to completely violate the teachings of the Holy Quran and of the Holy Prophet Muhammad," His Holiness Hazrat Mirza Masroor Ahmad told attendees, according to the MailOnline.

"Let it be clear that they are not practising Islam, rather it seems as though they have invented their own hate-filled and poisonous religion."


http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk...-a7191306.html

They had a convention. Well... that'll show IS. 30,000 of them having a weekend away is probably not going to have much of an impact on the millions of radical Muslims in the world.

Have people not been bleating that Muslims are not doing anything to denounce extremist violence?... Then when they do it's not enough :/

I dont know how many people Muslim terrorists have murdered in the west but im willing to bet it isnt as many as the 4 million people the western terrorists have murdered in wars in the middle east since 1990.
You would have to be pretty stupid not to realise why some might view the west as an enemy and as terrorists.

http://www.middleeasteye.net/columns...-1990-39149394

Why is it so hard for some people to accept that we are just as guilty of being horrible murderous wankers as anyone else is? Maybe even more so.
Is it really that suprising that some people hate the west to the point that they want revenge?

Until we stop murdering,pillaging and trying to force our own ideals on the rest of the world then we have no right to complain.