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Mystic Mock 17-07-2017 03:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JTM45 (Post 9458189)
Sounds like Theresa May's Tory 'Government' you're talking about here.:shrug:

You're confusing 'Patriotism' with 'Nationalism', two very different things!
Nationalism is the blind flag-waving where people are willing to cut their nose off to spite their face with very little concern about the overall financial or social state of our country while true Patriots want what's best for our Country and those who live in it, regardless of ethnicity or political leaning.

Brexit was hijacked very early on by thinly veiled Nationalist xenophobes who put their personal agenda before what is really best in the long term for Britain and its citizens. Highly un-Patriotic.

The backbone of Brexit is and always has been badly informed and willfully ignorant people who whipped up insecurities, fears and phobias and spread mis-information to serve their selfish personal agenda.

I think what you're saying is one of the reasons why people voted for Brexit.

I also do think that the Media not printing the pro's of why we should Remain in the EU was another big issue. And another reason was people thinking that Muslims would stop coming to the country (which was a real fact as I've heard people say it) and alot of it is all hokum.

JTM45 17-07-2017 04:37 AM

Agreed Mock.

Because Cameron (in the same way May did with her recent botched General Election debacle) had people so convinced and complacent in their assumption that a 'Remain' result was a foregone conclusion the Press did indeed massively neglect to properly clarify the reasons why staying in the EU was soimportant for the UK and just how detrimental Leaving the EU would be for us.

If there is one sentence that explains the referendum result it’s this one (from the website of the Advertising Standards Agency). ''For reasons of freedom of speech, we do not have remit over non-broadcast ads where the purpose of the ad is to persuade voters in a local, national or international electoral referendum''. In other words, political advertising is exempt from the regulation that would otherwise bar false claims and outrageous promises. You can’t claim that a herbal diet drink will make customers thinner, but you can (falsely) claim that £350m a week will go to the NHS instead of the European Union with the knowledge that by the time this claim is exposed as an utter and total LIE it will have already served its purpose and that nobody can be held accountable for knowingly lying.

It was noticeable how quickly the twin planks of the Leave campaign – extra money for the health service, and the implicit promise to cut immigration by ''taking back control'' of our borders – fell apart. On Good Morning Britain just hours after the result was declared, Nigel Farage decried the NHS pledge as a ''mistake'' . Devastatingly, for our Country and its future, it's a ''mistake'' with almost unimaginably massive negative implications for the future of the UK.

I still believe that an issue as massively important as leaving or staying in the EU with Nation destroying implications should have had at least two seperate vote no less than 6 months apart (preferably a year apart)to get a better informed result and i cannot see why anyone who truly wanted the best for our Country would want it any other way.

The result was so relatively narrow that i believe that had even something as simple as the debunking of the 'facts/lies' that were spread by UKIP happened before the vote (which were clearly fraudulent in their use) we would have had a different result. Even if two votes had ended up with a 'Leave' result at least there wouldn't be any doubt then about the legitimacy of the result.

If this all goes ahead (as it appears it will) when the full damage starts to become glaringly apparent it'll be far too late to do anything about it. It'll be our oldest and most needy people who'll probably suffer first and all of those shouters who are so vocal about Leaving the EU now will become apparent by their sudden silence as they slope back off into the shadows shrugging their shoulders and looking for a new ''Left'' excuse to blame for their mess.

Brillopad 17-07-2017 04:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JTM45 (Post 9459605)
Agreed Mock.

Because Cameron (in the same way May did with her recent botched General Election debacle) had people so convinced and complacent in their assumption that a 'Remain' result was a foregone conclusion the Press did indeed massively neglect to properly clarify the reasons why staying in the EU was soimportant for the UK and just how detrimental Leaving the EU would be for us.

If there is one sentence that explains the referendum result it’s this one (from the website of the Advertising Standards Agency). ''For reasons of freedom of speech, we do not have remit over non-broadcast ads where the purpose of the ad is to persuade voters in a local, national or international electoral referendum''. In other words, political advertising is exempt from the regulation that would otherwise bar false claims and outrageous promises. You can’t claim that a herbal diet drink will make customers thinner, but you can (falsely) claim that £350m a week will go to the NHS instead of the European Union with the knowledge that by the time this claim is exposed as an utter and total LIE it will have already served its purpose and that nobody can be held accountable for knowingly lying.

It was noticeable how quickly the twin planks of the Leave campaign – extra money for the health service, and the implicit promise to cut immigration by ''taking back control'' of our borders – fell apart. On Good Morning Britain just hours after the result was declared, Nigel Farage decried the NHS pledge as a ''mistake'' . Devastatingly, for our Country and its future, it's a ''mistake'' with almost unimaginably massive negative implications for the future of the UK.

I still believe that an issue as massively important as leaving or staying in the EU with Nation destroying implications should have had at least two seperate vote no less than 6 months apart (preferably a year apart)to get a better informed result and i cannot see why anyone who truly wanted the best for our Country would want it any other way.

The result was so relatively narrow that i believe that had even something as simple as the debunking of the 'facts/lies' that were spread by UKIP happened before the vote (which were clearly fraudulent in their use) we would have had a different result. Even if two votes had ended up with a 'Leave' result at least there wouldn't be any doubt then about the legitimacy of the result.

If this all goes ahead (as it appears it will) when the full damage starts to become glaringly apparent it'll be far too late to do anything about it. It'll be our oldest and most needy people who'll probably suffer first and all of those shouters who are so vocal about Leaving the EU now will become apparent by their sudden silence as they slope back off into the shadows shrugging their shoulders and looking for a new ''Left'' excuse to blame for their mess.

And many rightly believe that the indigenous people of a country should have a substantial say in the large scale change of the demographics of their country and culture - the country is in a mess as a result. The damage done is irriversible and will change the future for everyone and long-term will do much more damage than Brexit ever could. People have a right to their say - they had a say and some didn't like it so shout about it as if their opinions are more important than the majority who voted.

Having multiple votes until you get the 'right' vote would be an abuse of democracy and a dictatorship. It would be downright corruption. That would be a catastrophic mess and an absolute disaster for democracy.

JTM45 17-07-2017 05:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brillopad (Post 9459607)
And many rightly believe that the indigenous people of a country should have a substantial say in the large scale change of the demographics of their country and culture - the country is in a mess as a result. The damage done is irriverisible and will change the future of everyone. People have a right to their say - they had a say and some didn't like it so shout about it as if their opinions are more important than the majority who voted.

Having multiple votes until you get the 'right' vote would be an abuse of democracy and a dictatorship. It would be downright corruption. That would be a catastrophic mess and an absolute disaster for democracy.

Not a CLUE!!!!!:bored:

So you think a single vote in which people have been influenced by massive Lies (which Farage and many others ADMITTED were not true withing hours of the result) is true Democracy while two votes taking place with a settling period in between which would clearly give a far more balanced, informed and transparent result equals a ''dictatorship'' ?

You'd probably be happier living in Russia under Putin. A dictatorship thinly disguised as a democracy. Clearly better suited to your 'values'.:laugh:

the truth 17-07-2017 12:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JTM45 (Post 9459587)
Says the person who said only yesterday that ''democracy'' means you have the right to have help from anyone in any country (whether they're classed as an enemy of your country or not) to win an election.:laugh:

I can't even come close to this level ignorance.

against someone as corrupt as warmonger killary you have to fight fire with fire...bernie sanders didnt and sadly he was destroyed

Tom4784 17-07-2017 12:42 PM

We shouldn't do another vote, people voted in ignorance, they believed obvious lies despite evidence saying otherwise because they valued the fiction of what Farage and others were saying because they were told what they wanted to hear.

Voting foolishly has consequences and people who voted foolishly need to feel the ramifications of their actions. they made their bed now they have to lie in it. **** giving these people a get out of jail free card via another vote, when things go to **** hopefully they'll learn to be smarter about voting in future.

the truth 17-07-2017 12:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dezzy (Post 9460115)
We shouldn't do another vote, people voted in ignorance, they believed obvious lies despite evidence saying otherwise because they valued the fiction of what Farage and others were saying because they were told what they wanted to hear.

Voting foolishly has consequences and people who voted foolishly need to feel the ramifications of their actions. they made their bed now they have to lie in it. **** giving these people a get out of jail free card via another vote, when things go to **** hopefully they'll learn to be smarter about voting in future.

The left voted in ignorance, the same way they bankrupted the country and killed a million iraqis too. Total ignorance.

arista 17-07-2017 12:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dezzy (Post 9460115)
We shouldn't do another vote, people voted in ignorance, they believed obvious lies despite evidence saying otherwise because they valued the fiction of what Farage and others were saying because they were told what they wanted to hear.

Voting foolishly has consequences and people who voted foolishly need to feel the ramifications of their actions. they made their bed now they have to lie in it. **** giving these people a get out of jail free card via another vote, when things go to **** hopefully they'll learn to be smarter about voting in future.


DEZZY please add SOME
PEOPLE VOTED IN IGNORANCE



I voted on Sovereign grounds
WE WON the VOTE

Democracy - Suck It UP

Tom4784 17-07-2017 12:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by the truth (Post 9460124)
The left voted in ignorance, the same way they bankrupted the country and killed a million iraqis too. Total ignorance.


the truth 17-07-2017 12:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by arista (Post 9460134)
DEZZY please add SOME
PEOPLE VOTED IN IGNORANCE



I voted on Sovereign grounds
WE WON the VOTE

Democracy - Suck It UP

Ahh a fellow fan of the truth, good man arista or as they say in Wales...Dda iawn

the truth 17-07-2017 12:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dezzy (Post 9460146)

Yes you do suffer delusions sadly

Withano 17-07-2017 01:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brillopad (Post 9459607)
And many rightly believe that the indigenous people of a country should have a substantial say in the large scale change of the demographics of their country and culture.

Can you expand on this? Most specifically the word 'indigenous'. Who does, and who doesnt have the right to a say in your opinion?

arista 17-07-2017 01:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by the truth (Post 9460150)
Ahh a fellow fan of the truth, good man arista or as they say in Wales...Dda iawn


Yes DEZZY is out of order
putting us all on one box


Fine if he edits & ADD's word "some"
into his post

JTM45 17-07-2017 02:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by the truth (Post 9460113)
against someone as corrupt as warmonger killary you have to fight fire with fire...bernie sanders didnt and sadly he was destroyed

Ahhh..........that old cry of the clueless ''But, but Hillary''. She is not in power and has nothing to do with current politics.
But i suppose when you have nothing else, and you don't even understand what 'democracy' is (CLUE; it's NOT meeting with Russians on behalf of a hostile Goverment to get dirt on your opponents. That's being a treasonous law breaking traitor!) then all you can do is clutch at straws and repeat lies and debunked 'facts'. Sad. :idc:

the truth 17-07-2017 04:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JTM45 (Post 9460269)
Ahhh..........that old cry of the clueless ''But, but Hillary''. She is not in power and has nothing to do with current politics.
But i suppose when you have nothing else, and you don't even understand what 'democracy' is (CLUE; it's NOT meeting with Russians on behalf of a hostile Goverment to get dirt on your opponents. That's being a treasonous law breaking traitor!) then all you can do is clutch at straws and repeat lies and debunked 'facts'. Sad. :idc:

Ahh more fake news from the bitter left.....killary leaking 33000 classified emails is ok with you as is her attempt to detroy evidence of supplying so called rebels who turned out to be ISIS amongst many other horros. Strange how you put no effort into that or any other horrors of the recent past from your left wing comrades.....lets blame the iraq 1 million dead on new labour not actual labour, many of whom are still there like nice guy andy burnham. ok Im waiting for the classic left play dumb, but what has that waste of tax payers money and lies got to do with the issue of open borders , terrorism, public sector spending etc well duh..its all from the same pot and its all inter connected. one action gets a chain reaction and so on..... over a billion has now been wasted on the trump russia nonsense...and after all that all theyve got his trump junior spoke to some russian in a vage chat about possible dirt she may have on killary...lol....Time for the left to lick their wounds accept killary and the feminazis lost in a democracy and show some actual support for the american government and follow some real news

Brillopad 17-07-2017 06:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JTM45 (Post 9459612)
Not a CLUE!!!!!:bored:

So you think a single vote in which people have been influenced by massive Lies (which Farage and many others ADMITTED were not true withing hours of the result) is true Democracy while two votes taking place with a settling period in between which would clearly give a far more balanced, informed and transparent result equals a ''dictatorship'' ?

You'd probably be happier living in Russia under Putin. A dictatorship thinly disguised as a democracy. Clearly better suited to your 'values'.:laugh:

It's the left that are the dictatorship here telling everyone how to feel and how to think - a definite case of a dictatorship thinly disguised as a democracy. You are a good case in point - anyone who expresses a different opinion is likened to Putin. Weak and sad. Basically playground namecalling. :bored:

the truth 17-07-2017 10:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brillopad (Post 9460836)
It's the left that are the dictatorship here telling everyone how to feel and how to think - a definite case of a dictatorship thinly disguised as a democracy. You are a good case in point - anyone who expresses a different opinion is likened to Putin. Weak and sad. Basically playground namecalling. :bored:

101% correct I see you are no stranger to the truth, take a bow sir,:cheer2:

Tom4784 18-07-2017 12:49 AM

Grr! Left! Grr! PC Grrr Jeremy Corbyn and Labour governments from ten years ago! Grr Hillary Clinton although she has no power or say in the current US government! Grr Students and young people for not being as bigoted as I am! GRRRRRRRRR I NEED MORE SCAPEGOATS TO BLAME **** ON.


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