Originally Posted by MTVN (Post 4885592)

Yes I agree, we should understand terrorists, it's certainly not just a black and white picture of America/Britain = good, Taleban = bad.

Originally Posted by lostalex (Post 4885602)

I think you understand it.

It's like when someone has something nasty to say about your family. Now they may be saying the same things you've said to your own family members, but if someone outside the family says it, you will be defensive. The point is, it's none of your business, you are not American, you are European, you have plenty of problems in Europe, how DARE you have anything to say about America.

You saying something about my family, is not the same as me saying something nasty about my family. Why do Europeans think they have the RIGHT to have a comment? it's none of you're business.

You will not find a single comment on this forum where i criticized Europe without them saying something about America first.

I have no interest in giving my 2 cents into European business. But once you talk about ME and MINE, then the flood gates open. You wanna talk about America, then i have every right to start talking about Europe.

That's fair, imo.

Originally Posted by MTVN (Post 4885628)

Well that's the crux of the matter, you consider your country a "family" who you should defend no matter what, rightly or wrongly. I don't see it that way, and that kind of thinking is why I'm don't really like patriotism in general, we shouldn't be reluctant to criticise our own country because our nationality is only decided by chance.

And I know you only talk about Europe when people talk about America but that's the problem, it means people can't criticise the US without things turning into some kind of a contest on here. I wouldn't mind if someone actually said something like "Europe is perfect while America is a hellhole" but nobody really does think like that.

Originally Posted by lostalex (Post 4885623)

the taliban arn't bad? The Taliban supported Al Queada, let them have training camps, gave Osama Bin Laden his platform to INVENT 9/11. The Taliban are just as Guilty of 9/11 as Al Queada.

Every single Taliban should be killed, just like they were trying to kill every American. the Taliban were perfectly happy to let OBL kill Americans, now they have the gall to complain that they are the victims? Give me a FOOKING BREAK.

Every death, torture and indignity done to the Taliban is fully justified.

Originally Posted by lostalex (Post 4885631)

So then why are you so offended when i give it back if you arn't defensive about your country and continent??

Originally Posted by MTVN (Post 4885647)

Again, this is too black and white a picture. It doesn't hurt to understand why people might join the Taliban, or have a different perspective on things. Do you think that if foreign invaders had entered your country and waged war on it for over a decade you wouldn't hold some animosity towards them as well? A lot of them have very legitimate grievances against NATO and the West

Originally Posted by MTVN (Post 4885651)

Because it derails threads and takes them off-topic, turning things into just plain mud slinging and Britain v America contests

Originally Posted by lostalex (Post 4885664)

So why arn't you giving tit to the people that try to use America as a scapegoat, instead you are focusing on me. You're making no sense. If someone brings America into the conversation, then i ave every right to respond to them. I'm not the one that brings America into the conversations. As an American though, i do have a responsibility to educate ignorant people about America, if they want to talk lies about my country.

Originally Posted by lostalex (Post 4885660)

foreign invaders? there were no US troops in Afghanistan before 9/11, so wtf are you talking about?? In fact, we actually gave them HELP when the RUSSIANS were invading them, and look what we got for helping them. No good deed goes unpunished.

Originally Posted by lostalex (Post 4885664)

So why arn't you giving tit to the people that try to use America as a scapegoat, instead you are focusing on me. You're making no sense. If someone brings America into the conversation, then i ave every right to respond to them. I'm not the one that brings America into the conversations. As an American though, i do have a responsibility to educate ignorant people about America, if they want to talk lies about my country.

Originally Posted by MTVN (Post 4885684)

Because every single Taliban fighter joined before 9/11 did they? Recruitment has never been so high since the war started



If someone randomly went into a thread and said "America's such a ****hole, Britain is amazing" then yeah but if someone says something about America when it's relevant to the thread or discussion then there's no need to jump in and turn it into a contest by trying to prove the UK/Europe is worse

Originally Posted by Salman! (Post 4885698)

when American troops potentially put the lives of normal civillians in danger, no wonder more people are signing up to the taliban. they see america as the west sees terrorists.

Originally Posted by lostalex (Post 4885703)

Don't try to use America as a scapegoat. I'm critical of America in plenty of threads as well, but if you try to use America as a scapegoat unfairly, then i'll educate you.

Originally Posted by lostalex (Post 4885696)

i have never attacked Britain, i've simply put things into perspective. If i hated Britain and British people then i would be trolling,. and i don't troll. I never start any conversation or post being negative about the UK, ever. If you can prove me wrong please quote any post i've made where i was negative about the UK without provocation.

Originally Posted by Jesus.H.Christ (Post 4885712)

Examples of American scapegoating, please?

Examples of the lies you claimed had been spoken in this thread?

Originally Posted by MTVN (Post 4885592)

Yes I agree, we should understand terrorists, it's certainly not just a black and white picture of America/Britain = good, Taleban = bad.

Originally Posted by jedward fever (Post 4885724)

I'm sorry MTVN but I have to disagree with you here,Al Qaeda was bad for causing 9/11 when the Americans hadn't even done anything to them at that point.

Originally Posted by MTVN (Post 4885715)

Well a post like this for example: http://www.thisisbigbrother.com/foru...t=#post4786617

It was completely uncalled for and irrelevant to the thread.

Originally Posted by jedward fever (Post 4885724)

I'm sorry MTVN but I have to disagree with you here,Al Qaeda was bad for causing 9/11 when the Americans hadn't even done anything to them at that point.

Originally Posted by lostalex (Post 4885718)

lol..
America causes racism, America causes obesity, America causes terrorism, America causes bad movies and destruction of "real culture". need i go on? You must be kidding.

We arn't talking about just THIS thread, obviously. i'm beiong accussed of some how being patriotic and nationalist in all threads, so don't try to make it just about this thread.

Originally Posted by MTVN (Post 4885740)

Even they had their motives though, the US had a military base in Saudi Arabia for example, Bin Laden thought that was a desecration of holy land. And there were the sanctions against Iraq which prevented necessities going into the country and caused huge poverty. And there's obviously the US support for Israel as well.

I'm definitely not saying these justified 9/11 but it's not really true that America hadn't done anything in the Middle East

Originally Posted by jedward fever (Post 4885759)

I thought the Iraq war was after the Afghan war? because I remember the Americans was claiming weapons of mass distruction.:joker:

The Americans are not perfect but they hadn't done anything to Afrghanistan which is the only country Bin Laden should be protecting really,so I don't see why he went for them really.

Originally Posted by jedward fever (Post 4885759)

I thought the Iraq war was after the Afghan war? because I remember the Americans was claiming weapons of mass destruction.:joker:

The Americans are not perfect but they hadn't done anything to Afrghanistan which is the only country Bin Laden should have been protecting really,so I don't see why he went for them really.

Originally Posted by Jesus.H.Christ (Post 4885770)

The first Iraq war in 1990 lead to sanctions against Iraq right up until the 2nd war commenced.

Your history is a little skewed there, too. When the internets is properly working again, you should research the history behind it all, it's really fascinating. But then again, I am a history geek.