[arista]

"Video posted anonymously on YouTube claims to show American troops in Afghanistan urinating on dead bodies"


When will they Ever Learn?


http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2012...sed-war-crimes

Video on the that link

[fruit_cake]

unpleasant

[arista]

Originally Posted by fruit_cake

unpleasant

Its more than that
it again shows US troops as Evil.


How do you think the Locals will feel about this?

[fruit_cake]

Originally Posted by arista

Its more than that
it again shows US troops as Evil.


How do you think the Locals will feel about this?

I don't know maybe the locals hated them too? I'm not aware the Taliban are loved by the locals more the other way round, but I really don't know much about it having never been there or paid much attention to it.

It seems a strange morality to me, that is it not evil to kill them but it is evil to urinate on them afterwards?

[Crimson Dynamo]

who cares as they are dead?

[Shaun]

US Defence Secretary Leon Panetta says a video which appears to show US Marines urinating on the corpses of Afghans is "utterly deplorable".

Those who had taken part in the incident would be held accountable "to the fullest extent", he said.

The video, which was posted online, purports to show four US Marines standing over the bodies of several Taliban fighters, at least one of whom is covered in blood.

The origin of the video is not known.

Mr Panetta has ordered the commander of US and Nato forces in Afghanistan, General John Allen, to investigate the incident.

In a statement, Mr Panetta said he had seen the footage, and the Pentagon confirmed that he had spoken by telephone with Afghan President Hamid Karzai.

With nothing to suggest the video is fake, the Obama administration is in full-on damage limitation mode. The Pentagon issued a swift and strongly worded condemnation of the apparent abuse, and has highlighted the defence secretary's apologetic phone call to President Karzai.

Clearly, this is an embarrassment for an administration which pledged to project a more sensitive image of US military power. The timing is also problematic, to say the least. The video surfaced as the Americans, the Taliban and the Karzai government had been shuffling towards peace talks.

Washington will be relieved to hear that, in spite of this incident, the Taliban seem to be leaving open the door to dialogue.

The best-case scenario for the administration is that an inquiry quickly roots out the wrongdoers. And, of course, that no other videos are out there waiting to be uploaded.

"I find the behaviour depicted in it utterly deplorable. This conduct is entirely inappropriate for members of the United States military."

The defence secretary's statement is the latest in a round of denunciations since the video emerged.

The Pentagon says it is checking the authenticity of the video, but there is nothing to indicate that the film is not genuine.

Mr Panetta did not dispute the authenticity.

In a separate news conference, Secretary of State Hillary Clinton expressed her "total dismay" at the video.

Mrs Clinton said she shared Mr Panetta's view that such behaviour was inconsistent with the standards the "that vast, vast majority of our personnel - particularly our marines - hold themselves to".

The video did not change the tone of US efforts to secure Afghanistan, she said, saying the US continued to support security and reconciliation efforts that were "Afghan-led and Afghan-owned".

Tentative moves are being made towards peace in the country, ahead of the planned withdrawal of international combat forces by the end of 2014.

Hillary Clinton joined a chorus of condemnation from Washington

The US has about 20,000 Marines deployed in Afghanistan, based mostly in Kandahar and Helmand provinces. In total, about 90,000 US troops are on the ground in Afghanistan.

The Taliban said last week that they were working to set up a political office, possibly in Qatar, that would help to facilitate negotiations with the Afghan government and Nato countries.

The video has not yet been circulated widely in Afghanistan, but there are fears that it could provoke further violence against international forces.

A statement from the International Security Assistance Force (Isaf) in Kabul said the behaviour "dishonours the sacrifices and core values of every service member representing the fifty nations of the coalition."

Earlier, Afghan President Karzai's office said: "The government of Afghanistan is deeply disturbed by a video that shows American soldiers desecrating dead bodies of three Afghans.

"This act by American soldiers is simply inhuman and condemnable in the strongest possible terms. We expressly ask the US government to urgently investigate the video and apply the most severe punishment to anyone found guilty in this crime."

Taliban spokesman Qari Yousuf Ahmadi told the BBC that this was not the first time Americans had carried out such a "wild action" and that Taliban attacks on the Americans would continue.

But a different Taliban spokesman, Zabihullah Mujahid, said the video "is not a political process, so the video will not harm our talks and prisoner exchange because they are at the preliminary stage".

Afghan Member of Parliament Fawzia Kofi said ordinary Afghans, no matter how they felt about the Taliban, would be upset by the video.

"It's a matter of a human being, respect to a human being," she told the BBC.

"I believe that the brutal acts that the Taliban did here during their government and even now is condemned by Afghans. So is watching a brutal act by international forces. We condemn that as well," she added.

The Taliban are known for applying a ruthless brand of Islamic Sharia law in areas they control and have carried out many suicide bombings and attacks which have killed civilians.

Video: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-16534289

[arista]

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet

who cares as they are dead?

America Cares

[GypsyGoth]

This is another reason to get cremated.

[Shasown]

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet

who cares as they are dead?

The local populace do, its not good to desecrate bodies in anyones eyes, but especially in the Muslim eyes. Especially if the bodies are muslims and the desecrators are infidels

after all they are the ones who the UN protection force are trying to win over

[nicole_burks]

Just saw it on the news.. they said that they've identified some of them, and that the Afghan president wants the worst possible punishment.

[_Seth]

Don't blame them after what the Taliban have done.

[Marc]

Absolutely disgusting, they are human beings. I might be seen as naive with my opinion but I don't believe anybody deserves to have their body treated like that once they've died, perhaps ignorant of me but I would like to think there is not one single person in th world who see this as acceptable and that not one person regards this as 'not a bad thing'.

It's awful

[Wildcat!]

I dont know why people act all surprised or outraged by this. I am muslim, I feel bad for the dead, but this is what war does. War is ugly, horrible, and brings out the worst in people. When you ser your comerades explode in front of you, you built up resentment and hatred. Soldiers turn into animals, thats why they need therapy afterwards. Afghans probably are just as bad with the dead of the enemy. I just dont understnd why these idiots keep filming and taking pictures of their atrocities. If you keep it, its bound to pop out somewhere. Who knows what they did to Osama Bin Ladin's body. Hopefully the morons didnt film that.

But these kind of things are what happens with war. War is always ugly. Not neat and tidy like they wanna let you believe. Especially for prisoners, or dead bodies.
Its quite amusing seeing the military leaders all outraged, when they all do it. Some are just stupid and deranged enough, to film it, and keep it, as a souvenir.
I am sure the taliban arent bothered.

[arista]

Originally Posted by Phlip

Don't blame them after what the Taliban have done.

The Americans Carpet Bombed Iraq
at the start of this mess. Murdering the General Public
That Stinks


Both Sides are Guilty

[lostalex]

Really horrible.

I don't know what's more disappointing, what they actually did, or the fact that they were stupid enough to record it and post it on youtube.

The fact is they are putting their fellow soldiers in more danger now because it's gonna be propaganda for the Taliban to recruit more members.

I heard that this particular group or regiment, whatever it's called was on their 6th tour of duty, 6 full tours would definitely be very stressful i think, so i'm not really that upset about what they actually did, and can understand it, even though it was disgusting.

I heard someone on the BBC WHYS make an interesting point, which was that when you have to kill people, you have to lose respect for them, and degrade them in your head, because if you actually had respect for them then you wouldn't have killled them in the first place. I think that makes sense, if you are going to be able to kill someone, you first have to dehumanize them in your head.

I can't imagine what it would be like to be a soldier in a war zone, so i'm trying not to be too judgemental, but this was definitely unacceptable, and there should be some type of disciplinary action against them.

[King Gizzard]

Was just about to say what lostalex said, just gives al-Qadda and the taliban more hate propaganda, stupid

[Marc]

Originally Posted by lostalex

Really horrible.

I don't know what's more disappointing, what they actually did, or the fact that they were stupid enough to record it and post it on youtube.

The fact is they are putting their fellow soldiers in more danger now because it's gonna be propaganda for the Taliban to recruit more members.

I heard that this particular group or regiment, whatever it's called was on their 6th tour of duty, 6 full tours would definitely be very stressful i think, so i'm not really that upset about what they actually did, and can understand it, even though it was disgusting.

I heard someone on the BBC WHYS make an interesting point, which was that when you have to kill people, you have to lose respect for them, and degrade them in your head, because if you actually had respect for them then you wouldn't have killled them in the first place. I think that makes sense, if you are going to be able to kill someone, you first have to dehumanize them in your head.

I can't imagine what it would be like to be a soldier in a war zone, so i'm trying not to be too judgemental, but this was definitely unacceptable, and there should be some type of disciplinary action against them.

Yes valid point but as a human being who doesn't think like a soilder you should be judgemental because it's disgusting.

[_Seth]

I had been brought up to believe the Taliban did all the wrong...

[Livia]

Originally Posted by Wildcat!

I dont know why people act all surprised or outraged by this. I am muslim, I feel bad for the dead, but this is what war does. War is ugly, horrible, and brings out the worst in people. When you ser your comerades explode in front of you, you built up resentment and hatred. Soldiers turn into animals, thats why they need therapy afterwards. Afghans probably are just as bad with the dead of the enemy. I just dont understnd why these idiots keep filming and taking pictures of their atrocities. If you keep it, its bound to pop out somewhere. Who knows what they did to Osama Bin Ladin's body. Hopefully the morons didnt film that.

But these kind of things are what happens with war. War is always ugly. Not neat and tidy like they wanna let you believe. Especially for prisoners, or dead bodies.
Its quite amusing seeing the military leaders all outraged, when they all do it. Some are just stupid and deranged enough, to film it, and keep it, as a souvenir.
I am sure the taliban arent bothered.

I agree with Wildat on this one. While I don't for one moment condone this, do we think that the Taliban treat their dead enemies' bodies with respect?

Putting stuff like this on Youtube will not help the cause, and I'm not referring just to the USA, but to all the allies serving out there, our own troops included. I'm sure many people will be outraged when they watch this. But you cannot train young men to be soldiers, send them to war, to witness the death and maiming of their friends and colleagues, then expect them to behave in an exemplary manner with the bodies of the enemy. Unless you're a soldier, unless you've served in these conditions, I'm not sure any of us can really understand the pressure they are under nor what would prompt them to do something like this.

[lostalex]

Originally Posted by Phlip

I had been brought up to believe the Taliban did all the wrong...

Well the Taliban have certainly done worse to the dead bodies of coalition troops, that is true.

[lostalex]

I wonder what the soldiers did to Osama Bin Ladens body before they threw him overboard in the middle of the Gulf. I think it's pretty certain they didn't have much respect for that madman's body eigther.

Let's be fair.

If someone was responsible for the deaths of your friends and families, is pissing on the graves of their killers really that wrong?

If someone killed my friends and family, i'd kill them and piss on their graves too. I wouldn't video tape it and put it on youtube though.

I'm more concerned about the propaganda factor than the actual act of pissing on them.

[Marc]

There's no fair and there's no getting back at people. It's disgusting whatever 'side' you're on.

[lostalex]

Originally Posted by Marc

There's no fair and there's no getting back at people. It's disgusting whatever 'side' you're on.

..but we're the "good guys"

you need to watch more hollywood movies...

[Tom4784]

There's no defending this, The whole 'oh but the Taliban wouldn't treat our dead with respect' point people have been saying is just repugnant. Just because the Taliban don't always fight fair doesn't mean it gives the right for the forces to commit acts like this. Two wrongs don't make a right.

Why should we lower ourselves to their standards? It'd just void everything we're trying to achieve in Afghanistan.

[lostalex]

Originally Posted by Dezzy

There's no defending this, The whole 'oh but the Taliban wouldn't treat our dead with respect' point people have been saying is just repugnant. Just because the Taliban don't always fight fair doesn't mean it gives the right for the forces to commit acts like this. Two wrongs don't make a right.

Why should we lower ourselves to their standards? It'd just void everything we're trying to achieve in Afghanistan.

Is pissing on a dead person really that bad though? I mean they are already dead. Whther they went to "paradise" to have sex with 72 virgins, or whether they are burning in hell for all eternity, eigther way they are long gone from this world. Every cell in their bodies will melt back into the earth, with or without being pissed on.