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Netherlands: Elections 22th November: Result - PVV of Geert Wilders biggest party

:o

omg

the migration crisis has caused our government to fall, and there'll new elections, Mark Rutte in talks with the King Willem-Alexander to offer his official resignation

https://nltimes.nl/2023/07/08/rutte-...-say-otherwise

https://nltimes.nl/2023/07/08/new-el...ctoral-council

new elections could be held around mid November

https://nltimes.nl/2023/07/07/dutch-...y-fall-cabinet

opposition parties very happy with fall of the cabinet

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-66139789

BBC source

Quote:

The Dutch government has collapsed because of a disagreement between coalition parties over asylum policies, Prime Minster Mark Rutte has said.

The four parties were unable to find agreement in crisis talks chaired by Mr Rutte on Friday.

The government was set up a year and a half ago but the parties have been opposed on migration for some time.

Local media reported fresh elections would likely be held in November.

Mr Rutte's conservative VVD party had been trying to limit the flow of asylum seekers, following a row last year about overcrowded migration centres. His plans were opposed by his junior coalition partners.

He confirmed the government collapse during a news conference on Friday evening, after holding an emergency cabinet meeting. He said he would hand his resignation to King Willem-Alexander on Saturday.

But the PM added that ministers would continue their work as a caretaker cabinet ahead of the new elections.

Asylum applications in the Netherlands jumped by over a third last year to over 47,000, and government figures said earlier this year that they expect roughly 70,000 applications in 2023.

This week Mr Rutte tried to force through a plan which included a cap on the number of relatives of war refugees allowed into the Netherlands at just 200 people per month.

But junior coalition partners the Christian Union, a pro-family party, and the socially liberal D66 were strongly opposed.

"The decision was very difficult for us", Mr Rutte told journalists as he announced his cabinet's resignation. The differences in views between the coalition partners were "irreconcilable", he added.

"All parties went to great lengths to find a solution, but the differences on migration are unfortunately impossible to bridge."

A compromise proposal, known as the "emergency brake", which would only trigger the restrictions in the event of an excessively high influx of migrants, was not enough to save the government.

"The four parties decided that they cannot reach an agreement on migration," the Christian Union's spokesman Tim Kuijsten said. "Therefore they decided to end this government."

Mr Rutte, 56, is the country's longest serving prime minister and has been in office since 2010. The current government - which took office in January 2022 - is his fourth coalition.

He has been under pressure on migration because of the rise of far-right parties such as Geert Wilders' PVV.

The Farmer-Citizen Movement (BBB), which became the biggest party in the upper house of parliament after a shock election win in March, said they will not serve in any future government led by Mr Rutte.

opposition parties also want to stop supporting Ukraine if one of them becomes the next PM

but to go defending Putin, and opting for a hard Nexit out of the corrupt EU

they also want Netherlands to withdraw from the Eurovision Song Contest as that festival is ''too gay'' for their liking

Mr Rutte's conservative VVD party had been trying to limit the flow of asylum seekers, following a row last year about overcrowded migration centres. His plans were opposed by his junior coalition partners.

utter madness

[Mr Rutte's conservative VVD party had been trying to limit the flow of asylum seekers, following a row last year about overcrowded migration centres. His plans were opposed by his junior coalition partners.

utter madness]

LT sounds Like Rishi Sunak

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nicky91 (Post 11307393)

Nicky
why is this not on any UK news Feed?

https://www.yenisafak.com/en/news/ge...shisis-3666087

Germany arrests 7 men from Central Asia suspected of having ties to Daesh/ISIS

“It was also closely coordinated with investigation authorities in the Netherlands where two more individuals,” the Federal Prosecutor's Office said, referring to the arrest of a 29-year-old Tajik man and his Kyrgyz wife (31) earlier in the day by Dutch authorities.

The Netherlands authorities said the couple has been in the country since 2022 and is suspected of committing preparatory acts for terrorism offenses, with the man also suspected of being a member of Daesh/ISIS.

November Hell in the Netherlands

[It's not just migration you bloody liars
It's theft of the farmers' land.
It's the whole centralizing globalist web of exploitative lies
Which you participate
In disseminating
With your government subsidized coverage]

Yes amazing LT
still not on UK news

Quote:

Originally Posted by arista (Post 11307739)

Youtube video

euronews

Youtube video

bbc news

Yes Nicky that is the Later BBC News
which now Worldwide.

They keep saying
all around the World.

But AM on BBC news - no time for the Dutch

Good Euro news to cover it.

oh well, not much to show anyway either

but Mark Rutte is permanently retiring from politics

change is gonna come in November, that is for sure

Rutte is retiring, so is Kaag, same goes for Wopke Hoekstra

we'll get a whole new government

frontrunner to lead VVD is Dilan Yesilgoz, current minister of justice and defence

frontrunner to possibly lead D66 is Rob Jetten

frontrunner to lead PVDA with GroenLinks is well known EU member Frans Timmermans

but in terms of the far right and centre right parties no big changes

PVV still with Geert Wilders

Forum still with Thierry Baudet (despite ongoing criticism towards his controversial actions in parliament)

Ja21 with Joost Eerdmans (which is a reform party, so Joost is like dutch nigel farage basically)

SP looking for a new representative, Liliane Marijnissen is also stepping down

i would love Timmermans as our prime minister, he is a good politician of ours, also his english is good either, great at speeches too, as we all see in the EU

Baudet is a no go for me, he's worse clown than Trump :fan: and that says a lot

i'd prefer Wilders or Eerdmans over him, whom are slightly more normal

https://nltimes.nl/2023/11/02/half-v...-2021-election

Quote:

A massive 51 percent of voters plan to vote for a different party in the parliamentary election on November 22 than they did in 2021, according to a poll by I&O Research. So many voters switching is unprecedented, poller Peter Kanne told AD.

Pieter Omtzigt and his NSC really disrupted the political landscape, according to Kanne. “17 percent of voters say they will vote for NSC, a party that did not participate last time.” The BBB also attracts voters from other parties. “Then it is logical that the number of people switching parties is higher this time.” In 2021, 45 percent voted for a different party than before.

Around 23 percent of voters don’t know yet who they will vote for. According to Kanne, this number has risen “fairly consistently” over the past 15 years. In 2021, 16 percent of voters didn’t know who they’d vote for, with around 20 days to go to the election.

Experience shows that voters quickly forget their doubts after deciding on a party, Kanne said. “Ask during election time whether someone has already made a choice, and until shortly before the day itself, they say they don’t know yet. Ask afterward, and they will say they decided a long time ago.”

Any major shifts in the polls will likely happen after this weekend, Kanne expects. “The elections are starting to come to life, also among the voters. The big voting aids are online, and this weekend, the big TV and radio debates really start. The thinking is now starting.”

Despite this, Kanne doesn’t expect any significant changes, “Parties that are currently low in the polls are clinging to the fact that a large proportion of voters have doubts and could still vote for them, but that is wishful thinking. Floating voters don’t hesitate between all parties, but between the parties that suit them.”

one thing is certain at least, we get a new parliament (without Rutte, Kaag)

but who will be most popular, that is more the question

Sadly, Nicky, anti-semitism has been on the rise in many countries for a few years now, and the Hamas/Israel conflict is only increasing it drastically. The whole situation is horrific and the consequences are seriously concerning, not just in the Middle East but within Europe too.

It dismays and saddens me greatly. Why does mankind never heed the warnings from history? Why do we never learn lessons from the past?

i myself am not voting but if i would, i am not sure who to vote for

they all seem crappy choices and also voting is pointless when most don't want to form a coalition with each other :fan:

Frans Timmermans - would be Netherlands becoming similar to USA with a too old leader

Dilan Yesilgoz - NO NO, as we ain't living in Turkiye but we are Netherlands, and she ain't dutch

Thierry Baudet - NO Thank You to Mini Adolf

Mona Keijzer & BBB - maybe, but not sure if they are getting enough votes

Pieter Omtzigt - umm LOL is he even getting one vote :laugh3:

Geert Wilders - hmm not a bad choice this one, also isn't as radical far right anymore compared to Baudet's Forum

Henri Bontenbal - CDA had its chance and they failed, Next

the newer parties

Volt - are Pro-EU, could be a smart choice if we want to strengthen EU relations

JA21 - would be a dumb choice if we wanna aim for a Nexit :facepalm: especially in times like these to also troll the EU like the UK did with their failed brexit

Forum are literal neo-nazi's tbh

they even want to create special schools to educate children to be 110% pro-nationalistic, and against every other country in the world

---------
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2023_D...neral_election

wikipedia page, with info of all parties in this years election

that Splinter party are literal homophobes

I-

how do we allow homophobes and fascists into running for elections

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nicky91 (Post 11386310)

When no-one else will address issues such as mass migration, it empowers the (apparent) undesirables tbh

Quote:

Originally Posted by Oliver_W (Post 11386338)

When no-one else will address issues such as mass migration, it empowers the (apparent) undesirables tbh

rather Geert Wilders than Adolf Baudet then

also Geert has a foreigner too as his wife, her name is Kataryna, she's hungarian, and she also wears a headscarf (something he had been against either on women, the irony of that)

but despite that, Geert is a bit like Trump in the US, good media sensation potential and at least he's a professional, unlike showman clown Baudet (whom always enters the stage as if he's playing Rocky Balboa or something)

mass migration is a serious issue here yes, also left parties such as BBB are talking about that in their campaign, Caroline van der Plas is a latest politics hype here, she also has couple of celebrities in her fanbase whom she knows for a long time like footballer and singer John de Bever, or millionaire reality star, tv presenter and actor Martien Meiland, from the hit series in my nation Chateau Meiland (watched by quite many millions of people)

but elections here do not work like in the US, which is a disadvantage for the far right parties, no one wants to form coalitions with them ;) even if they are most popular, not likely they get into power

https://nltimes.nl/sites/nltimes.nl/...peg?h=201f0052

yes wednesday big election day, with results in the evening

Quote:

Parties clash on dental care, Israel military aid, health insurance a week before election

One week before the parliamentary election, the leaders of the four largest parties in the polls - NSC, VVD, GroenLinks-PvdA, and PVV - debated migration, dental care, and healthcare in a debate on SBS6 on Wednesday. In a separate debate in The Hague, candidates of the VVD and CDA faced fire over the Netherlands still providing Israel with parts for their F-35 fighter jets used to bomb Gaza.

Dental and healthcare
Far-right PVV and left-wing GroenLinks-PvdA have little in common, but they did find agreement when it comes to free oral care. A visit to the dentist should be included in the basic health insurance package, both Geert Wilders (PVV) and Frans Timmermans (GroenLinks-PvdA) believe.

Including dental care in the basic insurance will make healthcare more expensive, but the measure also saves a lot of costs, Timmermans pointed out. Regular dental visits prevent worse ailments that often cost a lot of money to remedy. Wilders also wants to make oral care free so that people can visit the dentist more often.

The VVD does not want to make the dentist free but take other measures so that people “have more money in their pockets,” said VVD leader Dilan Yeşilgöz.

Wilders said that the VVD is partly responsible for the “collapse” of regional hospitals. “I am very sorry, Ms. Yeşilgöz,” he said to the leader of the party that’s been in power for 13 years. The PVV leader was talking about the location of the Zuyderland Hospital in Heerlen, which wants to move all emergency care to Sittard-Geleen due to staff shortages.

Yeşilgöz also said during the debate that she would prefer that Zuyderland Hospital not close any departments. “But, here too, we must tell the honest story.” By that, she meant that there is a staff shortage in healthcare, and the departments can only remain open if enough well-trained people can work there. She wants to achieve this, for example, with a bonus for employees who wish to work more hours.

Wilders proposed that “the four of us” agree that the hospital in Heerlen will remain open. The other attendees seemed to agree with this, but each interpreted what they meant in their own way. Timmermans, for example, wants to make childcare a government task and thus help the staff. Pieter Omtzigt (NSC) explained that “really complex” care cannot always be provided nearby. “Stop going on about it; you agree!” the debate leader Wilfred Genee eventually interrupted the politicians talking over each other.

Migration and staff shortages
On migration, Wilders’ PVV and Timmermans’ Groenlinks-PvdA are “two extremes,” Yeşilgöz said. According to the VVD leader, Timmermans denies problems caused by migration, and Wilders inflates them.

“Both extremes do not do justice to people’s problems,” said Yeşilgöz. Timmermans shot back: “That from someone from a party that’s been in power for 13 years.”

Earlier in the debate, Timmermans and Wilders had a fierce clash. The PVV leader critically said that more than half of large cities’ residents are “immigrants.” Timmermans felt Wilders was discriminating and ignoring people whose families have lived in the Netherlands for generations.

Omtzigt wanted to talk about migrant workers. “We should be ashamed of the poor working conditions of migrant workers,” he said. Omtzigt wants to significantly reduce labor migration. Among other things, he wants fewer distribution centers, where many migrant workers work. He also wants to make agreements in the European Union to limit labor migration.

Omtzigt found support from GroenLinks-PvdA and the VVD. Timmermans also wants to shape the Dutch economy differently so that fewer migrant workers are needed. He also wants migrant workers to no longer receive housing that is linked to their jobs. In that way, they won’t lose their home if they lose their job.

Yeşilgöz wants to invest in automation so that fewer migrant workers are needed. She also wants to provide extra money to help migrant workers who wish to return to their home country. “This really is a full-circle story; that’s why it works.”

Doubts about Wilders’ “milder” attitude
Wilders’ apparently milder attitude raised eyebrows among his opponents Yeşilgöz and Timmermans. The PVV leader promised to put his positions on Islam, for example, on hold in order to collaborate.

“The real Wilders has yet to stand up,” Yeşilgöz said in the TV debate. Timmermans is also not convinced that Wilders will really take less extreme positions. “It is the same Wilders who has been sowing division for 19 years.”

Wilders said he did not want to put refugees but the Dutch “first” when distributing social housing. “That is exactly why Wilders should not be in control in this country, because he discriminates,” Timmermans said.

Omtzigt won’t let his NSC govern with the PVV as long as the party’s election program states that there is no room for Islamic schools, mosques, or the Koran in the Netherlands, he said. “You cannot form a government with those positions,” Omtzigt said. He said he understands PVV voters’ concerns about migration. “But you have to abide by the constitution.”

The PVV can help a right-wing Cabinet gain a majority. A coalition of the VVD, NSC, PVV, and BBB have a large majority based on current polls.

Military aid to Israel
In a separate debate in The Hague, VVD and CDA candidates faced much criticism about the Netherlands supplying parts for F-35 fighter jets to Israel. Ruben Brekelmans (VVD) said these deliveries are part of an international program and that the Netherlands would be an unreliable partner if it stopped doing so. Jasper van Dijk (SP) accused the liberal party of “downplaying” the many civilian deaths on the Palestinian side. The Netherlands is partly to blame for this due to the supply of parts, he said.

Derk Boswijk (CDA) stressed that his party is not uncritical toward Israel and believes that the country should be held accountable if there are human rights violations. He got booed by the audience when he said it was “way too early” to say that.

Boswijk reacted indignantly to Doğukan Ergin's (DENK) question about whether he sleeps well at night. “We were the first to say: come up with those humanitarian corridors.”

Politicians from GroenLinks-PvdA, D66, PvdD, BIJ1, and DENK also condemned the delivery of fighter jet parts. Kati Piri (GL-PvdA) believes it is the Netherlands’ “duty” to ensure that deliveries do not lead to human rights violations. “No such requirements have been made for this delivery,” she said. That has happened with arms deliveries to Ukraine, she pointed out.

The candidate MPs spoke about the situation in Israel and Palestine during an election debate organized by Amnesty International Netherlands, Oxfam Novib, The Rights Forum, Save the Children, and PAX.

Pieter Omtzigt criticized for ''flip flopping'' wether or not he wants to be PM

https://nltimes.nl/2023/11/20/omtzig...ether-wants-pm

Quote:

NSC leader Pieter Omtzigt received criticism from his poll rivals Dilan Yeşilgöz (VVD) and Frans Timmermans (GroenLinks-PvdA) over his flip-flopping on whether or not he wants to be Prime Minister. Yeşilgöz said that endless hesitation isn’t a leadership quality, and Timmermans criticized the lack of clarity.

On Sunday, Omtzigt said on a broadcast of Buitenhof that he was prepared to lead a Cabinet of specialist Ministers if that were to be created and NSC became the largest party. But he still explicitly kept the option open to enter the Tweede Kamer, the lower house of the Dutch parliament.

Last week, Omtzigt seemed to indicate that he planned to be a parliamentarian. He also said he wouldn’t announce the NSC’s candidate for Prime Minister until after the election. That followed weeks of Omtzigt not addressing whether he wanted to lead the government or which candidate he had in store for the position if the NSC became the largest.

On X, Yeşilgöz said leadership means “making choices, making decisions. Not endless hesitation or coming up with vague magic formulas. Leading this country is an honor, not something you do reluctantly. If you don’t want to become Prime Minister, that’s fine, but just say so.”

Earlier this month, Yeşilgöz had already urged Omtzigt for clarity. She believes that the voter “has the right to know” whether Omtzigt had the ambition to become Prime Minister or not.

Timmermans also criticized the lack of clarity but did not want to waste too many words on Omtzigt’s change of tone. “He is now choosing a different line. At first, he didn’t want it, but now he does.” Timmermans joked that Omtzigt “varies in his clarity,” speaking to the assembled press, including ANP, in Haarlem after a campaign event.

Omtzigt’s idea for a Cabinet of only specialist Ministers can’t count on TImmermans’ immediate enthusiasm. “You can acquire knowledge through employees. You have to bring the character yourself,” he said, paraphrasing former Chancellor Helmut Kohl.

NSC has dropped slightly in the polls. After being the biggest party for weeks, the NSC has fallen below the VVD. The top three are still VVD, NSC, and GroenLinks-PvdA, with small margins. But on Saturday, Maurice de Hond predicted a significant win for the PVV, which could put Geert Wilders’ far-right party at the top with the VVD.

Wilders has said he was willing to step back his anti-Islam rhetoric to collaborate in a Cabinet, but the other party leaders are skeptical about his sudden change in tune.

https://nltimes.nl/sites/nltimes.nl/...jpg?h=d8488521

over half of left wing voters voting Groenlinks-PVDA to prevent right wing cabinet

https://nltimes.nl/2023/11/20/half-l...t-wing-cabinet

Quote:

Over half of the people who plan to vote for GroenLinks-PvdA on Wednesday are “tactical voters.” They’re not necessarily voting for the party closest to them but hope to use their vote to influence the coalition formation. With right-wing parties NSC, VVD, and PVV doing well in the polls, left-wing voters are voting strategically to try and prevent a right-wing Cabinet, EenVandaag reports after polling 30,000 members of its opinion panel.

“I would actually like to vote SP, but in the end, I choose GL-PvdA because this party can become the largest. The SP is nowhere near that,” one voter said.

[/QUThe same applies to many Volt and D66 voters. “Volt is closest to my preference, but I vote GL-PvdA. I hope they become the largest (and therefore not the VVD) and that this reduces the risk of a right-wing Cabinet.”

These votes obviously come at the expense of other parties on the left. According to Maurice de Hond’s latest poll from Saturday, the D66 stands at eight virtual seats in parliament, down from 24 gained in the 2021 election. SP drops four seats to five. PvdD is down one to five. Volt still managed to climb one seat to four.

The tactical votes haven’t yet gotten Frans Timmermans’ red-green combination to the top of the polls. GroenLinks-PvdA currently stands at 23 seats in the poll. The VVD and PVV are the largest, with 26 each. NSC also has 23 seats. With the BBB’s seven seats, they can achieve a right-wing majority in parliament.

But according to EenVandaag, there’s still hope. Many left-wing voters said they intend to vote for their party of preference but may go with GroenLinks-PvdA at the last minute. “I actually just want to vote for the SP, but I don’t rule out switching if right-wing parties seem to become really big in the coming days,” one voter told the program.

https://nltimes.nl/sites/nltimes.nl/...png?h=1f232042

Groenlinks-PVDA lead candidate (former EU commissioner) Frans Timmermans

election day is today, in the evening the results

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nicky91 (Post 11395284)

election day is today, in the evening the results

Who will Win

Lefties or Right Winger?

Or is it middle of the roader

Quote:

Originally Posted by arista (Post 11395291)

Who will Win

Lefties or Right Winger?

Or is it middle of the roader

so far the biggest parties in the polls are

PVV (Geert Wilders)

VVD (Dilan Yesilgoz)

GL-PVDA (Frans Timmermans)

NSC (Pieter Omtzigt) seems to be fading away from being the biggest

if PVV wins and Wilders is our PM, then VVD does not want to form a coalition with them

if VVD are the biggest and Yesilgoz is PM, they do want to work with PVV on a more centred government (both left and right)

Timmermans would be a good choice if we look at whats best for our climate

he also is highly respected within the EU parliament, has a super solid english so easy to communicate with other world leaders (is respected by Ukraine's Zelensky and Germany's Scholz for example)

PVV (Geert Wilders)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geert_Wilders

Alf will love him.

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...cropped%29.jpg

He got banned by the New Labour power
back in the day,

Not Complex Coalitions

by tomorrow

What a Freaking Mess the Netherlands is.

Quote:

Originally Posted by arista (Post 11395301)

PVV (Geert Wilders)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geert_Wilders

Alf will love him.

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...cropped%29.jpg

He got banned by the New Labour power
back in the day,

yes, but he still would be a lesser radical extreme choice than Forum for Democracy: Thierry Baudet

PVV are pro freedom of speech for everyone

while FFD are like against freedom of other opinions rather than those who agree with their views (Baudet's co-founder Theo Hiddema got kicked out by him few years back when Hiddema was also against Baudet's too radical views)

Quote:

Originally Posted by arista (Post 11395302)

Not Complex Coalitions

by tomorrow

What a Freaking Mess the Netherlands is.

basically more like, the one who is the most popular gets to decide who they want to form a coalition with to get a majority

as for the results tonight, even those with lesser votes, either some who gain a seat in parliament, or some who lose seats in parliament

CDA (christian democrats) once a popular party back in 70's 80's 90's and 00's decades, slowly losing a lot of popularity

while there are multiple new parties becoming more popular, like the Farmers (BBB) or pro-EU (Volt) or a pro-nationalism (Ja21)

Voter turnout rises to 28% but remains below figures of 2017 election

https://nltimes.nl/2023/11/22/voter-...figures-145-pm

Quote:

Voter turnout in the Netherlands rose to 28 percent at 1:45 p.m. on Wednesday, according to figures distributed by research firm Ipsos. That total doubled from 14 percent at 10:30 a.m., about three hours after most polling places opened up for the day.

Roughly 33 percent of those allowed to cast a ballot in the 2017 General Election took part in the process by 1:45 p.m. The 2017 election was the last General Election to primarily take place on a single day. The 2021 election happened over a three-day period during the coronavirus pandemic, with adjusted rules for mail-in ballots.

At about 1 p.m., roughly 23.3 percent of Amsterdam voters had showed up to the polls. That was down from 25.1 percent in 2017.

Amsterdam is the largest city in the country. The fourth largest city, Utrecht had the highest turnout of the five biggest municipalities at 2:55 p.m. The turnout rate there was 39.8 percent.

Roughly 31.2 percent of Rotterdam voters showed up to polling places by 2:55 p.m. The Den Haag turnout was at 33.6 percent, and the rate in Eindhoven was 35.7 percent.

Groningen also had a 38.4 percent voter turnout rate midway through the afternoon, the same as in Emmen. Nearly 40 percent of Nijmegen voters showed up to cast their ballot. Hilversum's total was even higher at 40.9 percent, and in Tynaarlo that figure swelled to 45.2 percent. Turnout in Tilburg rose above 31 percent

35.7% for my city

nice stats

i myself don't vote, if i would my vote would've probably gone to GL-PVDA, for the sake of our climate

but my parents would've voted for PVV, for their stricter views against refugees

i expect PVV to be getting many votes in Groningen too, their refugee crisis in Ter Apel, or the earthquakes from gas drilling in the north sea something the lacklustre VVD or D66 has ignored their pleas for help

many sympathy votes coming in for Forum for Democracy

after Thierry Baudet got assaulted in a bar in Groningen with a beer bottle

if Baudet is back in parliament then this will happen

- deportation of ukrainian refugees back to ukraine
- deportation of syrian refugees back to syria
- no longer accepting any refugees in this country
- no more usage of english language in this country, more dutch language lessons

Come on the right wingers. I was a big fan of Beckham. He was the best right winger this country produced since Stanley Matthews.

The Dutch have never had a great right winger since Ruud Gullit moved inside to play a more central role. He was dominant on the right hand side.